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Kyon: Big Damn Hero
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Kyon: Big Damn Hero:

 13676 Marq FJA, Sat, 16th Feb '13 4:52:28 AM from Saudi Arabia Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
... I did not make any corrections to that quote, Jason. The bold highlight is to show where the typo is. I'm not saying that Durandall should rewrite "a Yoko-chan" to "an Yoko-chan"; I'm saying that Durandall wrote "an Yoko-chan" and should be writing it as "a Yoko-chan".

edited 16th Feb '13 4:53:32 AM by MarqFJA

Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
 13677 Filraen, Sat, 16th Feb '13 6:21:35 AM from Monstro Town
Random thoughts:

Tying Kuyou's love of cookies] and Hanyuu's sweet tooth caught me by a pleasant surprise (read: giggling/laughing like crazy). Bonus Points by having Kuyou unawarely blackmailing bribing Hanyuu.

KUYOU used PRESENT!
It's super effective!

The cousins must have been really tiring if Sasaki* could get to sleep so easily.

And I think we have an exclamation in the narration from Yuki's point of view.

I'll probably pull from the random bag again later.

edited 16th Feb '13 10:52:56 AM by Filraen

 13678 Marq FJA, Sat, 16th Feb '13 7:11:18 AM from Saudi Arabia Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
Yeah, I noticed that exclamation in Yuki's POV as well. She must've found the whole thing — especially Hanyuu's unexpected use of sailor-grade profanities — quite interesting by her standards.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
 13679 Filraen, Sat, 16th Feb '13 8:16:08 AM from Monstro Town
More than whatever Hanyuu said (thought that probably helped), I think it's the whole situation taken together: in my headcanon this is the closest Yuki has been to be outright laughing, she must have founf the whole thing hiliarous.
 13680 Marq FJA, Sat, 16th Feb '13 8:22:31 AM from Saudi Arabia Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
I really want to see Yuki's equivalent to a normal person laughing their ass off.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
 13681 Eamil, Sat, 16th Feb '13 10:27:48 AM from Somewhere over there. Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
[up][up][up][up]Bribery, not blackmail. tongue

I really wish I had any talent at art because now I want to draw Sasaki in Rena's casual outfit.

Edit: Also Marq, it seems Durandall fixed that typo really quick cause I checked not long after Jason's post and it had already been changed.

edited 16th Feb '13 10:29:54 AM by Eamil

 13682 Filraen, Sat, 16th Feb '13 10:55:46 AM from Monstro Town
[up] ok, corrected

...

Attention Big Damn Tropers! The timeline has been updated!

Oddly enough, this time most lines were shorter.

And as usual corrections are appreciated.

...

Bag of randomness:

Some of the villagers felt that Kyon-kun represented his mother's sin, which was difficult.

Let's. Move. On.

...

It isn't like it's wrong or bad, but I felt dissapointed on two accounts this chapter: Hanyuu not accepting the powerup (it's her choice after all) and Yuuto not teaching Kyon how to drive.

...

Again with Hanyuu and cookies: would Rika have felt Hanyuu eating cookies, much like the opposite it usually happens?

edited 16th Feb '13 11:25:36 AM by Filraen

 13683 Marq FJA, Sat, 16th Feb '13 11:03:44 AM from Saudi Arabia Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
Hey, Specular, could you perhaps ask Durandall if the conclusion of Yuki's POV section counts as her equivalent of genuinely laughing at what's happening before her? This the first time that she's been this expressive in her internal monologue, after all.

Again with Hanyuu and cookies: would Rika have felt Hanyuu eating cookies, much like the opposite it usually happens?
I think someone pointed out earlier that no, she wouldn't.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
Just for the record, this and this are the outfits used by Sasaki and Kyon in the chapter, respectively. Now I can see why she was worried about the cut in the skirt.

It was a shame that the situation didn't allow Kyon to appreciate Sasaki's outfit.

I'm curious about Mikuru's idea of taking a picture of Sasaki for Kyon. Probably it was just the habit but it could be that Mikuru is somewhat expecting a Relationship Upgrade between Sasaki and Kyon. Alternatively, maybe it would be good for Mikuru to make a few new acquaintances outside the Big Damn Harem, even if it goes against her orders about getting too involved with the people of this time plane.


Re. Hanyuu.

Interesting, it seems that the question about Hanyuu gaining a permanent corporeal form already has an answer. Following canon, Hanyuu already had the power to do it but in K:BDH she prefers to save her energy for an emergency, even if Kuyou is there to provide her with enough "spin".

Do you think Kuyou's modified spin-laced cookies counts as Power-Up Food?

The thing I'm wondering now is why Yuki, Ryouko and Kuyou are keeping Hanyuu as a secret from the rest of the Brigade.

"Teenagers will be teenagers, " the other entity agreed quickly, this time snatching the bag from Kuyou's hand in only the span of three rotations. "There's no sense in spoiling their fun, is there? Especially since Mion, Rika, Rena, and Satoko did the same thing all the time at that age! And still do, it is so."

Wait a minute, three rotations!!? That was freaking fast*! I suspect of abuse of Time Master powers. Also, why is it that the idea of the Higurashi girls sneaking around for "naughty" purposes don't strike me as OOC?


Re. Kanae.

I have just one big complain about the chapter, namely the fact that the conversation between Kanae and Rika happened offscreen. The potential interactions between Rika, Hanyuu and Kanae due to how similar their backstories are and how this would affect Kanae are two of the things I'm looking forward the most about the trip to Hinamizawa.

For that reason I liked a lot how Kyon connected the dots and arranged their meeting. Potentially, this could be the cue for the reveal of some of the things the Brigade is hiding from Kanae.


Re. Haruhi.

It's just me or Haruhi and Kyon are Speaking In Unison a lot lately? I wonder why it's that...

Funnily enough and with the exception of the matters related to CS!Haruhi, it's interesting to see how Haruhi and Kyon's roles are being kind of reversed. Currently, it seems that Haruhi knows more secrets about Kyon than the other way around.


Re. Akane and Yuuto.

I must be obvious now but the circumstances surrounding Kyon's birth was the source of my outburst in the last page of the thread.

IMHO, this reveal really put Akane's behavior about Kyon in perspective even if I do think her approach is wrong. It also explain Yuuto's slight overprotective tendencies about Nonoko.

I feel I'm missing a connection, though. How do you think Akane's backstory explains her attitude towards Kyon and Tsuruya's Arranged Marriage? It's like Akane is expecting the history will repeat itself with Kyon and she wants him married before that happens.

I also have a feeling that the death of Maebara Ichirou (Akane and Keiichi's father) is important somehow.

On a more lighter note and assuming a family resemblance strong enough between Akane and her daughter, it's kind of amusing to try to picture teen!Akane as a mid-nineties' teen rebel Nonoko with her mother's PO'd attitude. Also, if Yuuto was around sixteen when they met, then it's possible that he arrived to Hinamizawa in a motorcycle instead of a car because of Japan's age requirements for driver permits.

P.S.: The closest thing to what have in mind. Unrelated: for some reason fanart of "psycho Imouto with scissors" in kind of popular.

Imagine Spot: Akane finds a "box of individually packaged foil-wrapped 'protection'" in Kyon's room and gets very worried. Not so much because of its content but because it's still unopened.


Re. Rena.

I'm not too sure about what is going on here, I can't even tell whether Rena's bipolarity is being Played for Laughs or not. If it's not and considering how capable to deal with problems the Higurashi cast is, the only sure way that the Brigade will get a real chance to see what is happening to Rena is if Keiichi and the others actually fail to help her and things go out of control.

If the story takes this route, it would be difficult for something too bad to happen because there are several people who can stop Rene if she goes all "nata-onna"* mode on someone, even under Sasaki's Power Nullifier. For some reason I think that her most likely target would be Kyon (to a lesser extent Sasaki) because of his current outfit.

Although, I think it's more likely that events won't take such a turn but still something will happen that will bring the Brigade's attention, and particularly Yuki's, to the Hinamizawa Syndrome. It would be interesting to see how the Hate Plague fits within the inner mechanics of this verse. My personal theory is that the Hinamizawa Syndrome is pernicious side effect of a particular strain of a data lifeforms that use people as their host (basically the plot of Wandering Shadow with humans instead of dogs) and the current "Hanyuu" is in fact an enormous set of them that were imprinted with the mind of the original Hanyuu. Under this hypothesis, I chalk the lack of people going crazy in Matsuribayashi-hen up to Hanyuu taking a corporeal form, which attracted most of the data lifeforms in the environment to her because she constitutes a better host than any other person*.


Re. Koizumi & Kyouko.

It's amazing how the incipient romance between two ESPers who used to belong to opposite sides of a conspiracy centered around two so-called goddesses is the most normal one of the story, even if it started after one of them saved the other from Time Traveler who tried to kill the latter with a Morph Weapon stolen from a slider.

If they eventually tie the knot, I'm guessing the wedding speeches would be epic.

BTW, for some reason Mori×Kasai doesn't rank very high in my "normalcy-o-meter", probably because one of them is a very suspicious individual with close ties to shady business and the other is a yakuza bodyguard.

One thing that caught my attention about the last section of the chapter was the bit about Kyouko not being sure about what to think of Kyon due to the bias induced by her Psychic Link to Sasaki. Makes me wonder if Koizumi went through a similar dilemma in the past.


@Marq FJA:

It could work the other way around if Haruhi uses her TK as some sort of weighted clothing for resistance/weight training. IOW, using TK to create an opposing force to each of her body's movement (like water aerobics without water).

Kanae could have the same problem of not burning enough calories if she comes to depend on teleportation a little too much.


@Filraen:

Blackmail Is Such an Ugly Word... (sorry, I couldn't help myself)

The cousins must have been really tiring if Sasaki* could get to sleep so easily.

It sounds about right to me. If kids of that age are comfortable around you and you are not used to such numbers, you will get pretty tired and fast. It's more of a mental thing, though.

(...) and Yuuto not teaching Kyon how to drive.

Maybe he did, or will, or have been... You know what I mean.

I don't think it's too weird. After all, Yuki and Kuyou's narrations have become less and less technical/astronomic with each iteration.

edited 16th Feb '13 4:46:23 PM by Specular

K: I have an idea, but I'm not sure how safe it is.
S: I like it already!
 13685 Eamil, Sat, 16th Feb '13 3:36:25 PM from Somewhere over there. Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
[up]I've always preferred the PS2 sprite rendition of that outfit personally. The slit is still there but at least in the visible area looks like an actual slit and not like a huge triangle cut out of the front.

Re. Power-Up Food: Since there was no powerup involved, no. The alteration to the cookies was so Hanyuu could eat them while in spirit form, but I don't think that did anything else.

I felt the same way about Kanae's conversation with Rika being skipped over but it's possible the next chapter will rewind somewhat and show her POV.

Maebara Ichirou

He has a name? *clicks link*

..............HE HAS A FACE?!

I don't like your theory about Hanyuu because it undermines one of the biggest points of that ending, which is also important to this story because of the way Rika explained it: They didn't go crazy because they trusted in each other and didn't give into suspicion and paranoia. If memory serves Shion came very very close to slipping when she saw what Satoshi's situation was but she held it together.

Edit: I think your theory also conflicts with the Higurashi canon that Hinamizawa Syndrome is caused by an actual bacteria or virus (otherwise there couldn't be a vaccine for it).

edited 16th Feb '13 4:19:45 PM by Eamil

Re. Rena's outfit.

Yeah, we can say that Alchemist got creative.


Re. Power-Up Food.

IINM, Kuyou used her cookies to transfer "spin" to Hanyuu so she could have the energy to materialize herself if she wanted to. Probably it's not too obvious because the information is fragmented between Kuyou and Yuki's narration:

Still, just introducing that into her system uninvited would be impolite, from what Kuyou understood of things now. Instead, she imbued some spin into string she had kept idle in a shadow-song, giving it physical form.

Seeing as the others were all busy associating with Kyon's relatives, Yuki and Kuyou spent their time with Hanyuu. The not-quite-data-entity had gotten enough of a charge from Kuyou's 'cookie transmission' to manifest in real space, but had chosen not to.


Re. Data lifeforms theory.

About the vaccine, IIRC it's based on Rika's blood. Injecting a sample from Hanyuu's main host to an infected person maybe gets some of data lifeforms ferried along the ride and some of the strains are more capable of transferring its code and overwriting the faulty behavior of the variants that cause the Syndrome. I'm guessing the vaccine's research amounted to identify the most successful versions (in this sense) and determinate how facilitate their self-replication. Long Story Short, Irie's research was Right for the Wrong Reasons.

I don't like your theory about Hanyuu because it undermines one of the biggest points of that ending, (...)

I can't help but agree with that. One way to see it could be that things worked out because Hanyuu stepped into real space thanks to the fact "she believed in them who believed in themselves" (i.e. salvation only was possible because she believed it was) and that people can fight against the induced paranoia with the help of the Power of Trust (a Placebo Effect, under a cynical PoV), but it still feels cheap in comparison with original version.
K: I have an idea, but I'm not sure how safe it is.
S: I like it already!
 13687 Eamil, Sat, 16th Feb '13 5:39:32 PM from Somewhere over there. Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
I guess you're right about the Power-Up Food, I didn't catch that.

The vaccine was discovered at least partly from the research and testing done on Rika, but I don't think it's actually based on her blood. A synthetic approximation probably wouldn't have the effect you're suggesting, and if her blood was an actual component, they wouldn't have been able to keep making the vaccine after her parents pulled her out of the testing, and there were a number of people that had to be vaccinated regularly (including Miyo) so any supplies they had would've been used up eventually.

Edit: Kindle version updated, before I forget.

edited 16th Feb '13 5:58:39 PM by Eamil

 13688 Grahf, Sat, 16th Feb '13 9:19:57 PM from Nowhere in Particular Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Saint of Asakuraism
I'm also unsure what to make of Rena's breakdown near the end of the chapter. Whether or not it's being played seriously is something we really can't know unless we actually get some of that scene, or the fallout from it. I don't think that even in the mental state she's in now that she'd go after any of the gang, I think she just wants to vent ... note that this would be potentially the worst possible time to find out that Ryo got shipped to the village for Watanagashi and the SOS Dan just wasn't informed. Thankfully that seems very unlikely.

At any rate, I think that even if her friends don't manage to calm her down, that Rika wouldn't hesitate to send Hanyuu to warn everyone that Rena is on the warpath. Since she knows that at least someone from Kyon's group can communicate with Hanyuu it wouldn't be much of a problem to step away from the situation for a second to relate a message to her.
 13689 Jason Ulloa, Sat, 16th Feb '13 10:07:19 PM from Nowhere special Relationship Status: I know
Re: Kanae and Rika's offscreen discussion: There's always the possibility that the discussion itself could take place in the next chapter as part of "things that were going on during the previous chapter's POVs."

edited 16th Feb '13 10:08:20 PM by JasonUlloa

 13690 Unclouded TJ, Sat, 16th Feb '13 10:34:10 PM Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
[up] That's what I think we're all hoping.

On the Rena outburst. I was under the impression everyone was just using her desire to kill/beat up her nephew(?) to get together as Hanyuu claimed "There's no sense in spoiling their fun, is there? Especially since Mion, Rika, Rena, and Satoko did the same thing all the time at that age! And still do, it is so." (emphasis mine). I don't think anyone else was really in danger especially since there seemed to be only one target of her attack.
Unclouded TJ: Taking Bunny-Ears Lawyer too literally.
 13691 Grahf, Sat, 16th Feb '13 11:35:57 PM from Nowhere in Particular Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Saint of Asakuraism
I don't believe that's the case since Hanyuu, Yuki and Sasaki all noticed Rena's change in personality. I don't think that Hanyuu would fake freaking out just so that the group could get in some alone time together, considering that they can probably do that whenever in most cases, kids aside.

EDIT: It certainly might turn into that though, in the best case scenario ... or the awkward case scenario if Kyon happens to catch wind of just what's going on since he's still oblivious to the original harem.

edited 16th Feb '13 11:37:10 PM by Grahf

 13692 Filraen, Sun, 17th Feb '13 6:28:29 AM from Monstro Town
One thing that caught my attention about the last section of the chapter was the bit about Kyouko not being sure about what to think of Kyon due to the bias induced by her Psychic Link to Sasaki. Makes me wonder if Koizumi went through a similar dilemma in the past.

He did. After all part of his bro-bonding with Kyon had the base on trying to ignore Haruhi's emotions (specially notable when Haruhi learned about the Arranged Marriage for Kyon and Tsuruya)

... as Hanyuu claimed "There's no sense in spoiling their fun, is there? Especially since Mion, Rika, Rena, and Satoko did the same thing all the time at that age! And still do, it is so." (emphasis mine). I don't think anyone else was really in danger especially since there seemed to be only one target of her attack.

I thought Hanyuu was talking about sex in that quote.

... wait, does Hanyuu have Sex by Proxy from Rika?
 13693 Marq FJA, Sun, 17th Feb '13 6:47:20 AM from Saudi Arabia Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
O' Allah, save Egypt
... You know, I can't think of an argument for saying no to that question.
Ash-shaʻb yurīd isqāṭ ḥukm al-ʻaskar
Er... I won't say I completely forgot about the PDF version of the story. It's true, but I just won't say it:

PDF version of the current edition (as of Feb 16th, Chapter 59 a.k.a. Re-3) of the story (5.22 MB, 2003 pages, 587901 + 6798 words).

Trivia: According to Wikipedia, K:BDH is now officially a bigger doorstopper than War and Peace (587, 287 words).

A little survey. Should I include a timestamp in the PDF to denote the In-Universe date?



Unrelated topic.

There is a notable Absence of Evidence in the last chapter, or rather absentees: Miyuki and her parents.

IINM, they should be around Hinamizawa at this point of time. From the fact they weren't mentioned in Mion, Rika or Rena's houses, I'm guessing they are staying either with Satoko or in Okinomiya*. In the latter case, perhaps with Oishi. IIRC he and Mamoru became good friends after Himatsubushi-hen and they still were in the epilogue of Tsumihoroboshi-hen (set in 2007).

Fun fact: Koizumi and Mamoru were voiced by the same seiyu.



Re. Sex by Proxy.

Actually...

Fa-1: "Welcome to Hinamizawa", Hanyuu's PoV.

Keiichi really was adorable, and these days, people were constantly inventing intriguing new sweets to taste. Both were delectable, in their own ways.

I have this theory that Rika and Hanyuu lose their shared senses as long as Hanyuu is standing in real space, so it's possible that they were able to avert this trope if Hanyuu had the energy to materialize herself for such occasions. Of course, not because something is feasible means it actually took place.

BTW, this example of Sex by Proxy is already listed in main page.

edited 17th Feb '13 7:25:32 AM by Specular

K: I have an idea, but I'm not sure how safe it is.
S: I like it already!
@ Specular, "War and Peace": Next milestone - Romance of the Three Kingdoms!
Rather than smart, I'd prefer to be wise. It would let me be silly more often.
Why stop there? Let's shoot for Trial By Tenderness! (For those unfamiliar, it is probably the single longest fanfic, clocking in at more than 2 million words.)

 13697 Jbstormburst, Wed, 20th Feb '13 11:37:13 PM Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
...I'd feel REALLY bad if someone tried to get into this fic and it was the length of TBT. I tried, but I don't remember how far I actually got. And I think I'm gonna have to save it until spring break.

 13698 Grahf, Thu, 21st Feb '13 1:03:08 AM from Nowhere in Particular Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Saint of Asakuraism
It's not the length, it's how compelling it is to read. Can't speak for that other fic, but this certainly doesn't have a problem in that department.

Also, I'm sure Specular (among others) will get a kick out of this. Scroll down to some of the last images and you'll see what I mean.

edited 21st Feb '13 1:03:46 AM by Grahf

 13699 Eamil, Thu, 21st Feb '13 5:52:31 AM from Somewhere over there. Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Can't speak for that other fic, but this certainly doesn't have a problem in that department.

No kidding. I marathoned this fic in a few days when I found it. And then again on the next three or four rereads... That was why I did the Kindle version in the first place, so I could marathon longer without my monitor making my eyes burn. [lol]

@Grahf:

It's not the length, it's how compelling it is to read.

QFT. If a story is engaging enough, the things that start bothering you instead are the lack of free time to read it and other trivialities like tearing eyes, cramps and that funny mental state where you can see and recognize the words written in front of you but your brain is just too tired to make sense of the sentences.

Also, I'm sure Specular (among others) will get a kick out of this. Scroll down to some of the last images and you'll see what I mean.

CUTE! For me, Ku-nyon is totally canon from now on. Also, a bonus pic from the same mangaka.


Tropes question.

Regardless of the Brainwashed and Crazy thing, do you think that Yamane perhaps had good reasons to think bad of Kyon in an Entertainingly Wrong/Rear Window Witness kind of way?

Think about it from his PoV: The girl whom he had a huge crush on (Asakura) leaves a note in the shoe locker of another guy (Kyon). After class ended that day, the girl and the guy meet in an empty classroom. Later, an unrelated person (Taniguchi) walks in on them and quickly runs away after apparently seeing them in a compromising position. Finally, the very next day, their homeroom teacher informs them that the girl transfered out of the school and the said guy is not one bit surprised about it.

With such partial information, it wouldn't be too hard to come up with a scenario where Asakura confessed to Kyon, who took advantage of the girl's feelings and then just dumped her, which left Asakura too hurt and feeling too humiliated to attend to the same school as the jerk. Alternatively, if one is willing to ramp up the sordid implications and we could say she was too scared to return.

edited 21st Feb '13 10:25:02 AM by Specular

K: I have an idea, but I'm not sure how safe it is.
S: I like it already!
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