How sweet it is
Wick check looks good, so opening. We got our work cut out for us...
she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
Already discussed four years ago
.
After looking through the last TRS thread. I only see more reason to cut. Then, it had 5144 links, it now has nearly twice that many, and it is still subject to the same abuse and misuse. It was originally decided that it wasn't enough of a problem to warrant further action. since then, the problem has doubled and this wiki adopted tighter standard. It's time to re-review this trope.
We won't cut this. It's a legit trope. That it attracts meta-examples (which is what these potholes are, as well as potholes in the forum) is not a reason for cutting at all.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
A Trope transplant could be good, one for actual sarcasm used in a work. A not so potholey name though and make this a forum only pothole would be good.
Along with most of the rest of the Fora potholers like Sincerity Mode and Humor Mode.
"indicators of sarcasm"
Like what?
We don't need justice when we can forgive. We don't need tolerance when we can love.
For example, Pot Holes to Sarcasm Mode.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
I thought it was supposed to be used like this. How many meta-examples are there?
No, the other one.
Probably the vast majority is just used as troper tick. It's not something that should be used by tropers on the wiki. I generally avoid it (and the related ones) on the forums as well. On the wiki, you should never have to check a link, even just to see which pages it goes to, to understand the example. It can offer additional context, but never necessary context. Sarcasm means something doesn't mean what it says, so that context is required within the example in plain text.
Also, looked at the old thread, saw an old post I wrote, noticed an error, and immediately edited the post. In a four-year-old morgued thread.
edited 21st Nov '16 2:04:06 PM by AnotherDuck
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Looking on Oh Great, a Snark Index we do not seem to have a general supertrope for in-universe sarcasm, just various types of stereotypical sarcastic phrases and character types.
Having an in-universe sarcasm trope for quotes and general use would be good I think.
Interesting enough Sarcasm Mode is used on it as well, inappropriately but fitting with the tone of the page.
Although seeing how its impossible to get even approprate sarcasm across on the internet maybe sifting through the examples using the final rule on the page would be fitting.
People have a tendency to pothole to this page every single time they're being sarcastic. Our advice is that before you do this, you ask yourself if the sarcasm is visible without the pothole. If it is, ask yourself if there's any reason for you to pothole here.
edited 21st Nov '16 1:55:04 PM by Memers
I think we should keep this trope, but only limit it to examples of in-universe sarcasm, remove all uses of this trope as a Troper Tick, and give it a less sinkhole-y name.
Planeswalker
I suggest we just make a different trope for in-universe examples. I was under the impression Sarcasm Mode was exclusively for potholing in the forum.
Oissu!
Seconding that.
Thirding that Sarcasm Mode was for the forum.
Speaking of which, does Sincerity Mode have the same problems? It's pretty much the inverse of Sarcasm Mode.
The Unknown
From my experience, Sarcasm Mode is the only "Mode" that seems to be a pothole magnet since it lends itself to editorializing (or whatever it's called) more than its fellows. Sincerity Mode is assumed by default since this is a wiki, and I've only really seen it potholed in the forums.
edited 21st Nov '16 3:15:38 PM by Karxrida
If a tree falls in the forest and nobody remembers it, who else will you have ice cream with?
How sweet it is
I have seen Sincerity Mode potholed in the wiki, but it's rare. One use I can recall is in a drinking game. I doubt I had a problem with that case, although if it's too gratuitous, I can live without it.
she/her | TRS needs your help! | Contributor of Trope Report
If we want to keep Sarcasm Mode as a fun way to convey sarcasm, I suggest it be subject to a Trope Transplant, with its current definition (something that indicates sarcasm) be given a new name that better emphasis that, possibly as Useful Notes since such seems to general to be a proper trope.
Not sure why you think it should be an Useful Notes page. We don't put tropes there.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
I want to move "it" (the intended definition, not what is being used) since tone and punctuation, what this trope was meant to be about, seem like "! for emphasis", too general a use to be a trope.
I was thinking of moving the current definition to "Audible Sarcasm" which is about how tone (shown in text through "quotation marks", italics, or... other means) is used as a sign of sarcasm. Sarcasm Mode, we could give a new definition consistent with our current usage.
No, the other one.
It's not too general to be a proper trope. It has a meaning. That's enough.
Using "! for emphasis" is also a trope. Technically, grammatical rules are formalised tropes for language, but that's out of the scope for the wiki.
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Since this thread has stalled.
Since it looks like we want to keep Sarcasm Mode, we should do something about its definition since it is at odds with how we use it. I'd say transfer Sarcasm Modes current definition into a new, more clearly defined trope and redefine Sarcasm Mode to fit what we are using it for.
Any other thoughts?
Clock is set.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
Yup, Sarcasm Mode should be in line of Sincerity Mode and the like, and its current definition be put in some other trope.
Clock expired with no progress, so closing.
"For a successful technology, reality must take precedence over public relations, for Nature cannot be fooled." - Richard Feynman
This trope is supposed to be about indicators of sarcasm, but is potholed into any instance of sarcasm. Lets go through how it is used alphabetically:
A trope with only one out of fifty examples used correctly has serious problems. Here are some proposals to fix this:
Last I checked
, it has 9558 links and 12,021 inbounds.
Any other thoughts or ideas?
edited 20th Nov '16 7:14:34 PM by Ferot_Dreadnaught