Needs Help: Defector From Decadence

Deadlock Clock: 1st Dec 2013 11:59:00 PM
Total posts: [51]
1 2 3
^ I'm definitely on board with 2 and 4, with the latter maybe being a supertrope of the former. I'm fine with 3 as well, so long as we clearly distinguish it from Screw This, I'm Outta Here!. Maybe we need a Defection Index.

EDIT: Although I'm not new to the site, this is the first time I've taken a trope to TRS, so I must ask a newbie question: what does 'clocked' mean? The answer doesn't seem to be in the "welcome" thread.

edited 30th Nov '13 9:08:22 AM by MonaNaito

Screw This, I'm Outta Here! is barely even a defection trope. It's about "Nope, sorry, I was fine with the zombies and the vampires and the werewolves, but the kaiju is too much, I'm going home."
29 Willbyr1st Dec 2013 06:27:05 PM from North Little Rock, AR , Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Anime-ted
Crowner's hooked.
From the page description of Screw This, I'm Outta Here!
Henchman Bob is beginning to have second thoughts about his career with the Evil Overlord. Maybe he's dissatisfied with the lack of advancement opportunities, what with the Big Bad's tendency to kill subordinates for no reason. Maybe he's smart enough to realize that the next visit from the good guys won't end well for Team Evil. Or maybe Bob's just sick and tired of kicking puppies for a living. Whatever the reason, Henchman Bob's had it up to here with Team Evil, so he washes his hands of the conflict and walks away.

Regardless of whether it's supposed to be a defection trope, the definition of Screw This, I'm Outta Here! is one of the main ways people have been misusing Defector from Decadence (that is, in the case where it's a bad guy defecting).
Could we just... not have Death anymore?
  • create a new trope is at 7:0
  • redefine this trope is at 6:2
Doesn't making a new trope with the current definition go hand in hand with redefining Defector from Decadence? Unless people want to just delete Defector From Decadence entirely, which seems like a waste of a perfectly valid trope about people abandoning hedonistic lifestyles.
Could we just... not have Death anymore?
Edit: misread.

edited 3rd Dec '13 11:13:39 AM by crazysamaritan

Cleric of Banjo
I'm kind of late to the game here, but here's how I understand the trope and the idea of joining the heroes not so much out of a Heel–Face Turn but more out of disgust with one's own side.

I see it as sort of similar to Reformed, but Not Tamed with a slice of My Species Doth Protest Too Much in that the character thinks their side is "doing it wrong" as opposed to being inherently bad.

So, for example, I'd expect a Defector from Decadence in the Star Wars verse to be someone who supported the Empire as well as the principle that it should crush rebellions, but then ended up disgusted by its cruelty, corruption, etc. That might lead them to aiding the rebels, but they would do so because they are against the Empire, not because they support the rebellion.

edited 9th Dec '13 7:32:11 PM by Hodor

Edit, edit, edit, edit the wiki
35 SeptimusHeap10th Jan 2014 01:37:07 AM from Laniakea , Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
Votes bump!
  • "Make new trope with the current definition - switching groups because of philosophical or moral differences with the old group" is at 10 yea/1 nay.
  • "Redefine Defector from Decadence to someone leaving a life of luxury (like the Siddharta Gautama example)" is at 9 yea/2 nay.
  • "Make general trope about defectors and defections (note: defection does not imply treason in and of itself, even if some like to claim so) - this will have some overlap with Screw This, I'm Outta Here" is at 4 yea/1 nay.

All else in red.
Why not simply change the trope's name so it better fits the description? Wouldn't that be easier?

edited 25th Feb '14 4:35:42 AM by immortalfrieza

Could we just... not have Death anymore?
That's what the "make new trope with current definition" option is.
38 Willbyr25th Mar 2014 04:05:39 AM from North Little Rock, AR , Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Anime-ted
Calling this one for the three leading options since they're all independent of each other:

  • Make new trope with the current definition - switching groups because of philosophical or moral differences with the old group
  • Redefine Defector from Decadence to someone leaving a life of luxury (like the Siddharta Gautama example)
  • Make general trope about defectors and defections (note: defection does not imply treason in and of itself, even if some like to claim so) - this will have some overlap with Screw This, I'm Outta Here!

decadence (countable and uncountable, plural decadences)

A state of moral or artistic decline or deterioration; decay

What's the issue?
I'm just.. a guy....
40 DAN00429th Dec 2014 12:53:22 PM from The 0th Dimension
Chair Man
Bump, perhaps
MAX POWER KILL JEEEEEEEEWWWWW
41 CleverCorvid18th Feb 2015 11:24:23 AM from Behind and Below , Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
The One Who Fights Monsters
I was always confused by this trope's title so I'd reccomend either changing the title to cover just defection, or making a new trope about more general defections, maybe a Super Trope to this one? I'm not entirely sure, but yeah, either the title and likely page image should go, or the currently inaccurate description and examples should.
Never forget before you've forgiven.
Could we just... not have Death anymore?
~Clever Corvid: Actions for this trope have been determined. See [up][up][up][up] (the red moderator post) for the tasks needed to finish this thread.
Meklord
Did any of these thing ever get done?
mtndrew24: spoiler ansem isnt ansem but is actually pretending to be ansem as riku inside ansem pretending to be ansem
44 NoirGrimoir17th Dec 2015 07:42:49 PM from San Diego, CA , Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
Rabid Fujoshi
If we want to get this rolling again, I'm willing to Sandbox the new description for Defector from Decadence.
SPATULA, Supporters of Page Altering To Urgently Lead to Amelioration (supports not going through TRS for tweaks and minor improvements.)
Sounds good. I think I'll write a draft for the general defection trope myself.
46 hamza6783rd Mar 2016 07:26:04 PM from Gravity Falls , Relationship Status: Sinking with my ship
An average, unremarkable boy
Bump. What needs to be done?
Mabel's brainy brother
New tropes need to be drafted and launched. I've begun work on The Defector and Moral Defector. Defector from Decadence also needs a rewrite to focus on actual decadence.
49 DAN00429th Mar 2016 04:40:07 AM from The 0th Dimension
Chair Man
So what exactly are we gonna do with the DFD page now?

P.s as someone noted, luxury, high social status etc is NOT "decadence". You Keep Using That Word.
MAX POWER KILL JEEEEEEEEWWWWW
It turns out the Super Trope for "Defectors" already exists; it's listed as Turncoat.

Page Action: Defector From Decadence
1st Dec '13 6:06:29 PM
What would be the best way to fix the page?
At issue:


Total posts: 51
1 2 3
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=1382899554069361500&page=2