Comedic Super Troper
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Hmm, Batman Beyond and Spider-Girl?
Anyway, I only said that because it seems like the extent of this universe ties with comic canon. Plus, alternate timelines and future can get crazy. But you know never mind, I just want to see a story of an older and more mature Terry in 2099 serving as a mentor to new heroes like Miguel.
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See, the problem is that both the Infinity Gems and the Emotion Spectrum have already defined origins. Multiple ones, in the case of the later (*sigh* goddam Johns and his constant retcons.) First they were the collective emotional energies of living beings across the universe, ala The Force; OK. Then they were the Light of Creation split apart by the Primordial Darkness aka Nekron (I think, I didn't read Blackest Night.) And finally they were the energy of reality itself and a civilization from the previous universe caused its destruction when they tapped them as a a power source leaving only one survivor in what is totally not a rip off of Galactus' origin, oh nooo. Anyway I say let's go for the first origin as it makes the most sense. And I'm still opposed to the Lanterns using them, but not characters with emotion-based powers eg. maybe The Hulk is so powerful because he taps into the Red Light.
As for the Gems, they are the remnants of a being with infinite power named Nemesis who shattered after... getting depressed because it was alone? You'd think it could just create company for itself. I also heard somewhere it was because all life it created turned evil, which is somewhat more believable, but don't take my word for it. In any case, something that always bothered me is how convenient it was that each gem contained a specific element of its being eg. mind, soul, power etc. instead of each being a mixture. Unless someone made them that way... perhaps one or more of the Elders of the Universe? I also recall that there was a Crystal Tree eons ago that was used to hold Gems of Power from across the galaxy until they were needed, usually being given to selected champions; several of these ended up on Earth, like the Moonstone. The Infinity Gems were likely on it at one point.
Edit: After reading about the Elders on Wikipedia, I suggest it was The Caregiver who found Nemesis' fragments and, since it's her duty to heal cosmic beings, tried to reform it, but failed, but formed the gems in the process, then allowed her "brothers" to use them (perhaps convinced by more wily ones like Grandmaster or Trader.)
Speaking of The Elders, which DC Characters would qualify for them? They would have to be a) the last of their race b) billions of years old) and c) obsessed with something. Cosmic Powers are not strictly necessary. The only one I can think of is Agamemno, the main villain of the silver Age crossover, who is the son of the first living being in the universe and wants to conquer it.
edited 20th Apr '16 12:16:31 PM by Sijo
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It was an idea I had in the last run of this thread.
Terry and Mayday have their original origins more or less intact, the only difference is that Terry is a bit rougher and more violent, and he won't be dating Dana for most (or all) of the series, because she is just such a bland character.
Anyway, Terry starts to improve himself as a result of working for Bruce Wayne, and at some point starts going out with May. Meanwhile, Batman and Spider-Girl team up a few times, and feelings start to grow. Both become unsure as to how they should proceed.
Bruce, naturally enough, says that Terry should pick the girlfriend he can fight crime with. Peter and MJ think May should pick the guy whose face she's seen, and who isn't a violent vigilante. A date is arranged, where May plans to reaffirm her commitment to her strained relationship with Terry, while Terry intends to break up with May.
Before that can happen, a villain attacks. Batman and Spider-Girl team up to fight him. Then in an alley, this exchange happens.
Batman: Had to be tonight of all nights.
Spider-Girl: Bad timing?
Batman: I had a date tonight.
Spider-Girl: So did I. I doubt Terry will ever speak to me again.
Batman: Terry... Wait, are you talking about Terry McGinnis?
Spider-Girl: Yeah, you know him?
Batman: (pulls off mask) May, I am Terry.
Spider-Girl: (pulls off mask)
(Much awkward "So, uh..." and "I was, uh...").
Batman: So where do we go from here?
Spider-Girl: I know where I want to go. (pulls Batman close and kisses him deeply)
And after that, their two series are merged into one, Batman and Spider-Girl.
edited 20th Apr '16 11:11:53 PM by VampireBuddha
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I dislike contrived coincidences. And I'm not a shipper.
BUT.
I totally love Terry + May Day! 
No one's posted anything for a few days and i will not allow this to die.
Who else thinks a team-up with Red Hood and Winter Soldier could work?
Fuck you i do what i want! ~ Dr. Zadkiel
Not a fan of either... but I guess they would talk about the similarities in their lives. After trying to kick each other's asses, of course.
I don't have time to do it right now, but I made an (unofficial) Marvel/DC timeline that I'm willing to post here, for those interested. It could at the least serve as a starting point for a shared universe.
edited 27th Apr '16 11:09:19 AM by Sijo
Yeah sure
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And I'm going to take another stab at a unified cosmology! This is a complete overhaul, so disregard anything I said in previous posts.
The three greatest beings in the universe are Phoenix, the Source, and Galactus. They exist in a Trimurti-like arrangement, with Phoenix as creator, Source as sustainer, and Galactus as destroyer. These three wield the Power Cosmic, the primal energy used by the One Above All to form the universe; they may also grant this ability to servants, as Galactus does to his Heralds.
Due to the influence of some eldritch abominations in the very early universe, lesser beings than those three are unable to use the true Power Cosmic. However, the Power is divided into Orderly and Chaotic aspects, which lesser beings can use with proper training. Depending on one's perspective, this may be called magic, psionics, reality warping, or some other term when used directly by an organism. Manifestations of the Power Cosmic include the common fundamental forces of gravity, electromagnetism, the strong force, and the weak force, as well as Speed Force. Colour Corps Power Lanterns channel some manifestation of the Orderly aspect of the Power Cosmic to charge up their respective Power Rings.
(As an aside, while I like the Emotional Spectrum, I'm willing to drop it if everyone else hates it. I do think the Yellow and Violet Corps need to stick around, though, because Sinestro and Star Sapphire were already existing aspects of the Green Lantern franchise).
Speed Force is the manifestation of the Power Cosmic that imparts motion; it flows predominantly from the Chaotic aspect. Everything moving has at least a little of the Speed Force within it. Some special living beings can channel larger amounts of Speed Force to move faster than mundane beings. These include the various Flashes, Quicksilver, Whizzer, Max Mercury, Hermes, and Kryptonians powered by yellow sunlight. Different speedsters channel different amounts of Speed Force; Superman can channel just enough to move fast, while Flash has enough to do things like phase through matter and travel to other universes. Einstein's E=mc^2 implies that exploiting Speed Force can even change the mass of an object; this is the ultimate mechanism behind how Pym particles change an object's size.
(Yes, I'd still rather Superman have access to the Speed Force, but much less than Flash. Superman is very fast, but Flash is faster and can do more things. Plus Speed Force would explain most of what Superman did in the Silver Age).
The universe as a whole is divided into ten planes of existence, known as realms, which are arranged on Yggdrasil, the World Tree. Yggdrasil is not an actual tree, but like Galactus, mortal minds can't properly grasp it, so a tree is a comprehensible representation. (As an aside, I intended to incorporate the Qabbalistic Tree of Life here, but relevent information I could find, even allegedly aimed at newbs, tends to assume the reader is already familiar with the Qabbalah. So this is just Norse mythology, with other beliefs grafted on).
The Ten Realms are:
- Heaven: Home of the angels. Was separated from the other nine realms millennia ago by Odin.
- Realm of Heroes: Home of half the gods, and of afterlives for people who died fighting honourably and defending the weak. Other names include Asgard, Elysium, and Olympus. Asgard proper is ruled by Odin, Freja's husband.
- Realm of the Virtuous: Home of the other hanf of the gods, and of afterlives for people who lived virtuously but didn't dedicate themselves to physical combat. Other names include Vanaheim and Asphodel. Vanaheim proper is ruled by Freja, Odin's wife.
- Earth: The physical realm, home of humans (among others). Also called Midgard.
- Underworld: Location of demons, devils, Hellspawn, and some of the darker gods. This is where you find unpleasant afterlives, though some of them aren't so bad. Officially Satan rules this realm, but he hasn't been seen in millions of years. Also called Hell, Hel, Hades.
- Fairyland: Realm of fairies, pixies, bright elves, and all the nice folkloric entities (though Light Is Not Good does apply). Also called Alfheim, TÃr na nÓg, Djinnestan.
- Svartalfheim: Realm of dark fairies, dark elves, and malevolent folkloric entities (though Dark Is Not Evil does apply, especially in the case of the Dwarves). Also called Nidhavellir, Myrkheim.
- Jotunheim: Realm of ice monsters.
- Muspelhiem: Realm of fire monsters.
- Outer Darkness: Cold void encircling the other nine, separating the universe from the Outer Things (think Lovecraft). Other names include Niflheim and Tartarus. It is possible to dump souls here; if this is done, they cannot enter any afterlife or reincarnate, and will eventually dissipate altogether. However, this is difficult, and only the most truly horrendous and dangerous will ever be so much as considered for this fate.
Inhabitants of certain parts of the Ten Realms may apply the name of their own part to the Realm as a whole. For example, if this universe is designated Earth-8434134, then a human would refer to herself as being in Earth-8434134 even if she's standing on Mars. Likewise, while Asgard properly only refers to one part of the Realm of Heroes, the Norse gods (and Vikings) would also refer to the entire Realm as Asgard.
Gods are entities of massive power, associated with particular planets in Midgard, and often with specific locations on those planets. Their natures and emotions are similar to those of the planets they are associated with, but amplified and exaggerated, so that they become both embodiments of their people and paragons for their people to emulate. Gods gain power fromt the worship of mortals, and can hear prayers directed toward them, though they still have considerable power even if nobody worships them. Through faith, they can impart a measure of protection upon a mortal, giving limited defence from malicious spirits. This is most commonly seen when a human of faith is able to repel a vampire by using a symbol of their own religion.
However, for all their powers, even gods can die. The Norse gods have already died once, in a Ragnarok that gave rise to the New Gods of New Genesis and Apokolips. However, a few managed to escape that fate by instituting the Ragnarok Cycle, by which they are periodically killed and reborn. Additionally, several million alien pantheons have already been eaten by Galactus.
As for the Infinity Gems, they were made billions of years ago by Nemesis to contain his essence in the event of his own death. As such, they contain massive power over particular aspects of the universe. Then Nemesis died and the Gems were scattered across several galaxies.
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How does everyone feel about merging Mephisto and Trigon? Possibly Dormammu too.
Fuck you i do what i want! ~ Dr. Zadkiel
Deranged X-Mas Figure
I say keep them separate. Yes, they're all malevolent demonic entities, but they've all got their own distinct histories and shticks. Or are you saying that this new merged character is supposed to be an archenemy of both the Silver Surfer, Doctor Strange, and the Teen Titans? (As well as both the father of Raven and the uncle of Clea?)
edited 28th Apr '16 12:59:57 PM by kkhohoho
Doctor Who — Long Way Around: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/13536044/1/Doctor-Who-Long-Way-Around
It was just an idea that came to my head. Mephisto and Trigon are both Satan in their continuities after all and Dormammu is the Lord of Darkness.
Personally, I like to keep all characters' origin as close to canon as possible. Other than that, though, anything goes. Example: Superman should always be from Krypton, always be Clark Kent, and always be a hero; however, he doesn't need to work at the Daily Planet, doesn't have to be in a relationship with Lois Lane, Luthor doesn't have to be his Arch-Enemy, and he doesn't need to be in the Justice League. By that line of thinking, yes, the Demon Lords should be kept separate- though presumably, all were born from the evil magic left after the Elder Gods died (Marvel fact).
In some cases though, characters share an origin, which complicates things. Case in point: Hyppolyta. She exists in BOTH universes- but in DC she's rather noble, while in Marvel, she's a villain! Personally, I think she should be neutral in our universe as a result, not interfering in Man's World but not willing to help either (much to Diana's chagrin.)
Regarding Cosmic Entities: One thing we must remember is that each exists for a specific reason, of universal importance. Their Power Levels actually vary a lot; Galactus for instance, is comparable to "an average Celestial" in power. The Color Spectrum Entities are a result of the collected psychic energies of all living beings (think The Force) and while immensely powerful, are technically not necessary for the existence of the universe, so they aren't "true" Cosmic Entities.
edited 28th Apr '16 1:04:28 PM by Sijo
Speaking of Wonder Woman, here's a crazy idea I have: some of you may know that after the first Crisis, the Golden Age Diana was wiped from DC Continuity and replaced in the Justice Society by the heroine Miss America (who originally was a Quality Comics character, but DC now owns her.) Well, it turns out that Marvel also has a heroine named Miss America, active around the same time! My solution is this:
DC's Miss America was created by the secret Project M. We may assume the Super Soldier Project (which Created Captain America) was also part of the larger Project M, and that's why both heroes were given such Patriotic Ids. Except what they didn't know was that, at the same time, someone else had become a heroine by the same name! After a conversation with her DC equivalent, the Marvel MA agrees to let her have the name. In return, Miss America gives her a suggestion for a new name to use. The name?
Wonder Woman!
And of course, it's after this heroine that Diana names herself after coming to Man's World and learning of her exploits.
edited 28th Apr '16 1:27:28 PM by Sijo
Calendar enthusiast
I thought we were going with Hippolyta being the original Wonder Woman.
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Deranged X-Mas Figure
Okay, but what about Hippolyta as Wonder Woman? If we want Diana as Cap and Hippolyta's daughter, than her being Wonder Woman and going out into the world kind of has to be a thing
Ditto.![[nja]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/user_ninja_2074.png "[nja]"){kind=small}
edited 28th Apr '16 1:30:16 PM by kkhohoho
Doctor Who — Long Way Around: https://www.fanfiction.net/s/13536044/1/Doctor-Who-Long-Way-Around
And I thought we were just tossing ideas and writing independently and then letting things fall into place.
I'll give you that my Wonder Woman idea is just a thought (thought we cannot have two Miss Americas.) And to be honest, making Diana the daughter of Hyppolyta and Rogers just sounds to me like one of those "let's do this because it sounds cool!" ideas that I prefer to avoid. I go by logic. Doing that simply affects too many other characters (Steve Trevor, Peggy Carter etc.)
edited 28th Apr '16 3:08:25 PM by Sijo
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Let's talk about aliens and superheroes.
DC has metahuman. Marvel has mutants, Inhuman, Eternals, and Deviants.
It's a frequent observation that all the other planets seen in superhero comics seem to have a dearth of native superheroes compared with Earth. However, considering all the genetic experimentation that was carried out on Humans in the ancient past, perhaps this isn't so surprising.
We also wanted the Martians to be a relict Skrull population that evolved along a separate path.
So let's jam all that stuff together.
Canonically, Inhuman are the result of Kree experiments. They carry a gene that is activated by terrigen mist, which grants them random superpowers.
Mutants, Eternals, and Deviants are apparently the work of Celestials. Eternals and Deviants were designed to particular specifications; mutants carry the X-gene on chromosome 23, which grants a random superpower when the bearer experiences a particularly stressful fight or flight situation.
The metagene was planted by the White Martians. Under high-stress conditions, or when exposed to the right physical or chemical stimulus, it induces a rapid, drastic change of the genome or phenotype, granting superpowers that usually relate in some way to whatever activated the gene.
Proposal: In the distant past, a few Celestials came to Earth and started experimenting. Their first creations were the unpredictable mutants. After that, they came up with the Deviants, intending to use them as a food source.
While they did so, the Kree and the Skrulls both chose Earth to use as a beach head in their expansion into the Milky Way. The Kree set up a base on the dark side of the moon, and the Skrulls did so on Mars. Both started experimenting on Humans, hoping to make a subservient warrior race. This resulted in the Inhuman and metahuman.
The Celestials on Earth didn't like this, and created the Eternals to force the Kree and Skrulls out of the galaxy; a three-way war broke out. The Celestials managed to blow up the Skrulls' main facilities on Mars, wiping out the majority of the expeditionary crew. They had more trouble with the Kree due to the moon being in the way, and before they could attack properly, the Green Lanterns arrived and ordered both Celestials and Kree to leave Earth or be destroyed. They chose to leave. Hence, there are all sort of Humans running around with latent superpowers waiting to be activated. (I'd be in favour of, say, a full third of Humans having some form of latent supergene so that the various coincidences aren't quite so contrived).
Oh, and a few Skrulls survived the Celestial attack. Stranded on Mars with no way home, they eventually evolved into the Martians, who later split into the Green and White race. Mars suffered severe environmental devastation in the 17th and 18th centuries, which prompted the White Martians to desperately invade Earth in 1897, an event which was documented by H. G. Wells in a series of articles later collected as The War of the Worlds.
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Interesting theories, and they fit quite well overall. A few observations, however:
-The Celestial are known to have perform experiments with the same overall results (eg. Eternal, Deviant, and a 'Mutant' variations) on various races, including the Kree and Skrull. It's unknown why they do this. I have a theory that the Celestials are only partially sentient; they are more like cosmic robots who carry out their appointed tasks. Members of a race known as the Promethean Giants are known to be imprisoned near the Source Wall after failing to pass its test- but what happened to those who DID pass it? My guess is, The Source absorbed them and turned them into Celestials, charged with stimulating evolution across the universe.
-The Kree did indeed experiment on primitive humans based on the Celestials' work, and created the Inhumans, who are pretty much mutants, except they later found a stimulant (terrigen) that activates their genes. Similarly, when the Metagene Bomb was activated during the Dominator Invasion, it affected ALL heroes with gene-based powers, including mutants (yes DC has mutants, albeit only a few.) Seriously, let's not split hairs over this: the X-Factor and Meta-Gene are the same thing, but (in Marvel) they call people whose powers appear spontaneously mutants, and those who are activated by an outside factor, Mutates. So in our setting, let's call Mutates with the better-sounding name of Metahumans.
-Now, I like the idea of Martians being descended from Skrulls, because Marvel's counterpart of Martian Manhunter, Skrullian, is basically a good Super-Skrull. In his case, his race was destroyed by Galactus so he moved to Earth. I propose That Martians are Skrulls who moved to Mars, probably tired of the endless war with the Kree. They engaged in genetic experimentation giving themselves all kinds of powers and a new base form. But eventually a war between white and green martians left the planet empty; only J'onn Jonzz survived. Aliens from the planet Cygnus took over the planet to prepare an invasion of Earth. J'onn sabotaged it by altering their findings making them believe Earth's environment was safe for them, when in truth its bacteria was deadly to them. This is why the "Martian" invasion of "War of the Worlds" failed.
-Btw, the Celestials are far too powerful for the GL Corps to beat. Heck even the Guardians might not be able to do it.
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I was thinking there'd be like two or three Celestials against the entire GLC.
Mutants vs metahumans: OK, but for this universe, I'd like to make mutant a less restrictive term than it is used in Marvel. Rather than just referring to someone with the X-factor on the X and Y chromosomes, the term here properly refers to anyone with any sort of mutation. In common parlance, it will refer to individuals with a variety of inborn gene-derived superpowers, possibly rendered as Mutant to differentiate those with superpowers or really freaky appearances from those people with minor protein differences. The best-known of these is the X-factor, identified by Charles Xavier in 1963. Others include the Inhuman gene, which is triggered by terrigen mist, and the metagene from DC.
In fact, maybe as mutants become more visible, some of them start to consider mutant as a slur, and propose metahuman as a more PC alternative.
edited 2nd May '16 1:25:38 AM by VampireBuddha
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Hmm. Well yeah I guess what a "mutant" is, to the scientific community, versus the use the general public gives to the term, can be very different terms.
Btw, although I still believe we should write the stories first and decide which are canon to each later, we can also develop a specific shared universe here (by vote) if that's what you people want. So, since at least two (three?) people, not including me, want Wonder Woman to be Captain America's daughter, let's go with that. Anything else? How about my mutants/metahumans theory?
I had this thought for when we're developing characters. I thought of Edward Nashton being kinda similar to Moriarty in Sherlock in the first series. Never revealing himself but advising the criminals of Gotham, many even answering to him. He could be Batman's biggest threat, even worse than the Joker.
Fuck you i do what i want! ~ Dr. Zadkiel
I agree that many people -including many writers- don't "get" the true nature of Batman or his enemies. His mission isn't to punch out criminals; you can't win a war on crime that way. Even if you kill them, there will always be more. No, the only way is with information: find their secrets and give them to the right people- the authorities, or even each other (and let them destroy themselves.) Batman would certainly still deal with Villains, especially superpowered ones or serial killers, but they should not be his main objective. Characters like Riddler can still be important by being redefined within the Gotham underworld, in his case as an information broker.
In other matters: I just found the DC Wikia, and after some reading I've decided that the only beings who count as true cosmic beings are The Monitors and The Source. Tough the Lords of Order and Chaos would be minions of Marvel's Master Order and Lord Chaos. Mr. Nebula, while not a cosmic entity, would count as one of the Elders of the Universe- obsessed, in his case, with art (that sounds less dumb than "decoration.")
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I have some thoughts for the time between WWII and the emergence of modern superheroes, stemming from looking up what 'Winter Soldier' actually refers to. Also, I wasn't trying to do a *Watchmen* thing, the similarities just emerged organically. I was, however, definitely influenced by *Justice League: The New Frontier.*
Anyway, ideas! This is presented as a continuous thread of events, but feel free to pick and choose which bits, if any, are worth keeping.
The rise and fall of the Justice Society
If I may bring in something from the New 52, I'd like to make Green Lantern I gay. Obviously, he won't tell many people, and he might even marry an accepting woman, but he can't keep it hidden forever.
In 1946, the US Army's superhuman agents return home and are discharged; however, many find it difficult to readjust to civilian life. Alan Scott, the Green Lantern, is approached by Phantom Lady and Lamont Cranston, assistants of the recently-deceased Shadow, with the idea of forming a new, more open special team, which unlike the Shadow's network would operate openly, in the daylight. Alan likes the idea and reunites the survivors of the Invaders, All-Winners Squad, All-Star Squadron, Agents of Atlas, and whatever other Golden Age superteams we decide to use, and possibly some others to form the Justice Society (this should include Bucky). They are bankrolled primarily by Lamont Cranston, and work closely with the remnants of the Shadow's network of informants to tackle crime the normal law enforcement can't handle.
At least, that's the plan.
Almost from the beginning, criticism sets in from conservative groups, which by 1949 is severe enough that Bucky leaves the Justice Society and re-enlists in the Army. He goes to fight in the Korean War, and is apparently killed in action in 1952.
Opponents of the Justice Society, most prominently Fredric Wertham, accuse them of misleading the public, hiding their identities for no reason, causing injury and property damage, and indulging in deviant sexuality. Joe McCarthy accuses them of communism, citing the fact that their leader wears a bright red shirt as evidence. The witch-hunting come to a head in 1953, when Green Lantern is outed as a homosexual. Despite most of the other members defending him, Alan is hounded by a hysterical public, and resigns as leader, forsakes superheroism, and retires to a secluded life in an isolated rural cabin. Under threat of government censure, the Justice Society disbands altogether in 1954. A proposed bill that would have mandated superhumans to register with and work for the government, as well as breed together to improve America's genetic stock, dies in Congress in 1957 along with McCarthy, its main sponsor.
The point of all this is to establish why there isn't a superhero group already in existence when the modern stories start. Simply, there was a team in the 40s and 50s, but they broke up due to negative public reaction.
The Justice League and the Avengers
Personally I prefer having a single team to stand for both the Justice League and the Avengers, but I seem to be the minority in this thread. Still, it seems weird to me that two entirely separate teams of geographically disparate superheroes with no particular theme other than eclecticism would come together simultaneously, so here's my pitch.
Around the time superheroes emerge in the modern age, supervillainy increases in frequency and scale. A group of heroes unite under Superman to more effectively combat the increase in such things; thanks to a more favourable public, they do not face the same issues as the Justice Society did in the 50s. Calling themselves the Avengers of Justice, this group of superheroes is a private NGO, but has significant liaisons with the US government.
Later on, not that long after Captain America is revived, public scrutiny turns on the Avengers of Justice after a number of high-profile supervillain battles result in numerous serious injuries. Calls for regulation and oversight soon follow. Superman, while compassionate, fears that tying the groups hands might prevent them from intervening when needed, or could force them to act as pawns of a corrupt government. Opposing him, the more naive and conservative Captain America argues that the power they possess should ultimately be in the hands of the people, and it is not for them to decide when and where they must take action. Tempers run high, passionate debates are had, and the heroes ultimately... agree to disagree, ultimately splitting the group quite abicably on ideological lines.
The Avengers, led by Captain America, are the larger group. They become an official branch the US military, though operate with considerable autonomy, specialising in paranormal and exceptional circumstances.
Those who leave, led by Superman, call themselves the Justice League, and are a completely private, independent operation with no government ties. That said, there are numerous personal lines of communication between the Justice League and the Avengers, and the two collaborate frequently.
Since this is a merged universe, I would really hate for the Justice League to be an all-DC team and the Avengers to be just Marvel; moreover, some characters would definitely fit better in the other company's team. For example, Captain Atom, due to his military background, should be an Avenger. Thor seems like he'd be more comfortable with the Justice League, and the League is also where Spider-Man would go if he joins a team in order to keep his identity secret.
The Winter Soldier
So Bucky apparently died in the Korean War. Actually, he didn't; he was injured and returned to America is experimented on by semi-rogue elements in the US government using a combination of what they managed to recover from the Super Soldier Project and information gained from Nazi scientists and mystics who were granted pardon from execution in exchange for their knowledge. They successfully create a new super soldier, one who will obey without question. Knowing that someone like Bucky won't fly, he is kept as a secret weapon to perform black ops in the name of America's interests, remaining in cryogenic suspension when not fighitng.
Bucky is secretly sent to further America's interests in 1964 in the Congo Crisis, to assist in the overthrow of Sukarno in 1967, and to undermine North Vietnamese operations in 1969. (He may also have assassinated Kennedy).
In 1971, Bucky is sent to Detroit to silence the Vietnam Veterans Against the War. While scoping out the organisers, he hears William Crandell's opening remarks
, comparing VVAW to the winter soldiers of 1776. Upon later confronting Crandell, Bucky says "You call yourself a winter soldier? I'm the true winter soldier. I suffer to do what's right for this country, but I get no reward, and nobody ever wants *my* testimony. What right have you to criticise our government?" Crandell is quickly rescued, and the story spreads like wildfire. Conspriacy theories start popping up, implicating the Winter Soldier in every conflict going back to WWI, a couple of which are accurate. Bucky's controllers encourage these insane theories as a smokescreen from their true actions.
With the Winter Soldier now known and given a name, his controllers use him less frequently, though is is still depoloyed in the Gulf War and the Iraq War.
In the modern age, I'd like if we could still do the Lex Luthor Takes Over America storyline. When Luthor comes to power, he quickly implements the Superhuman Registration Act, requiring all superhumans to register with the government and be on call for military or police service. This essentially bans the Justice League, and many of the Avengers also go underground. Steve Rogers, more critical of the government since the Avengers/Justice League split, publicly abandons the Captain America identity, becoming Nomad.
President Luthor acts quickly, appointing John Walker as the new Captain America and leader of the Avengers. He also finds out about the Winter Soldier project. When Nomad begins organising the underground superheroes into a cohesive renegade group, Luthor revives Winter Soldier and sends him and the new Captain America to elminate Rogers. While doing so, Bucky's memories start to return, and he saves Steve from John at the last minute. Steve and Bucky go on the run, Bucky trying to keep down his psychologically programmed urge to kill Steve.
In a big final confrontation, John confronts Steve and Bucky, claiming to be truly worthy of the Captain America identity. They have a conversation about the nature of loyalty and patriotism over the course of the fistfight, and ultimately John stands down, realising that Steve is the true Captain America. Yeah, John may have been a loyal conservative, but he still wants to do what's best for America, and that means going against the president.
The rest of the storyline continues as before, with Steve taking back the role of Captain America, though this time John now becomes US Agent. Bucky is still Winter Soldier, but now he's a free man.
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I'm opposed to the "Alan Scott is gay" thing not on sexual terms but because it leaves his children, Jade and Obsidian, whom he conceived with a woman, the original Thorn, out of the picture.
Also, I still feel the Justice Society should be the first *American* superteam.
On the other hand, I do agree that most heroes retired in the postwar era due to either being convinced to do so by the government or open persecution. A few operated occasionally, like the Agents of Atlas.
And the difference between the Justice League and The Avengers is obvious: the first formed to deal with major global threats, after aliens attacked its founders' various cities and homelands; the second formed from a team-up of New York city heroes and grew from there. While eventually catching up in numbers and power to the League, the Avengers have ties to the US government, meaning if we do our own "Civil War" the two teams might end up fighting (and Cap would leave the Avengers for the League.) As I mentioned, while I like to preserve the origins of teams, their membership is another matter.
edited 7th May '16 6:25:35 PM by Sijo
Oh hey, speaking of the Infinity Gems... more cosmic stuff!
I had thought to link the Infinity Gem to the Emotional Spectrum somehow, but there are only six Gems, and they don't really have anything to do with emotion. Instead, I'm going to suggest using a variant of the movies' origin for them.
In early time, the Outer Things made war on the first inhabitants of the universe - Phoenix, Galactus, Source, and angels. This partially fractured the Power Cosmic, God's creative energy, into the metaphorical Rock of Eternity, Fog of Chaos, and Light of Emotion; these three aspects are, among other things, the sources of magic. The Light of Emotion is also what powers the Lantern Corps' power batteries. The Rock of Eternity and Fog of Chaos constantly work against each other, ultimately forming a shaky equilibrium. Chaos magic obviously comes from the Fog of Chaos, while other, more orderly forms come from the Rock of Eternity. Most magicians can make use of one or the other type, though particularly powerful ones, like the Sorcerors Supreme, can use both.
Anyway, in the first few million years, as the war was winding down, the Outer Things tried to break apart the Rock of Eternity, just as they had the Light of Emotion (the Fog of Chaos, being chaotic, cannot be split or damaged). Again, they partially succeeded, and the unified Orderly force was diffracted into six aspects - Soul, Power, Reality, Space, Time, and Mind. Orderly magic usually draws on one or two of these aspects to manifest its effect. Again, the divide is not perfect - particularly knowledgeable magicians can wield a form of unified Order magic rather than relying on specific aspects.
Part of the diffraction flung out six jewels, each of which embodies and acts as a conduit for the essence of one aspect of Order - the Infinity Gems. Thus, possessing an Infinity Gem allows the owner to wield almighty cosmic forces with abandon, with no risk of burning themselves out. The Gems reinforce each other, so if two or more are brought together, both get a power boost from the constructive interference. When all six are together, the wielder is mightier than most gods.
As for why I'm calling it the Rock of Eternity, that's an idea I had while writing this post. While the true Rock of Eternity is a metaphor for a sort of abstract field of Orderly energy and forces, there is also a literal rock at the exact centre of the universe, formed from the primal forces of Order. Portals to the Rock form naturally on planets with sentient life, which allow magicians to travel there. Due to the high amounts of Order magic around the Rock, Chaos magicians will feel uncomfortable while there. Order wizards may stay, study, and even live there, including Shazam, who turns Billy Batson into Captain Marvel.
Why would Terry McGinnis originating in a cartoon rule him out? He's a future character, and since we're doing a fanfic merged universe, there's no need to maintain perfect continuity with existing canon. Plus I totally want to ship him with Mayday Parker. Ukrainian Red Cross