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Troubles with writing an ambiguously gendered character

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TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#1: Sep 11th 2013 at 1:51:47 PM

So one of the characters in my main cast was originally envisioned to have an Ambiguous Gender. This wouldn't be seen as particularly odd in the setting itself, so the fact that the character isn't clearly identified as male, female, or simply a-gendered isn't a huge deal and isn't a huge part of the plot.

  • The thing I've found though, is that occasionally I'll unconsciously refer to them as male while thinking. This might be because of the fact that the character happens to be traditionally masculine or the ingrained assumption that every character with an unspecified gender is male.
  • I've also realized that maybe I'm forcing the whole 'gender ambiguity' thing a little too hard on the character and it's not working out.
  • Your thoughts?

Majormarks What should I put here? from Britland Since: Jul, 2013
What should I put here?
#2: Sep 11th 2013 at 2:02:56 PM

Personally, I'd just drop the notion, but obviously YMMV.

Rewrite a few scenes with them as a concrete guy; then as a concrete girl. If they all turn out roughly the same, there's no point to forcing a gender ambiguous character on the audience. They'll be harder to empathise with, the pronouns will likely make the text hard to both read and write...

But then, I'm somewhat old fashioned. I wince when I see people talk about writing characters to tackle transgender issues, not because I don't support LGBTQ rights (you don't know the half of it), but because I feel like most people aren't going to be able to pull it off without coming across as anvilicious.

I write stuff sometimes. I also sometimes make youtube videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/majormarks
greedling Since: Feb, 2010
#3: Sep 11th 2013 at 2:46:07 PM

Ambiguous in the sense of "the gender is hidden" is different from being genderqueer though. Agender people can deal with pronouns by preferring a gender-neutral one or switching or various other things, and if that character being agender is meant to be canon rather than you just want to hide a "real" gender, that might be helpful. If that also gives you a pronoun to stick to in your head, it might help reinforce the notion of their genderqueerness. Even if you're not going to come out and say it, choosing a gender-neutral pronoun or switching pronouns every time could help you.

If you don't want to make it canon that the character is genderqueer though... I mean, I don't think that a character having a nonbinary gender identity has to be justified by the story to be written (and while I too have my doubts of any specific individual doing it well, they're not going to improve if they don't try, and the situation won't improve if writers are scared of trying, especially considering they don't have to publish), but for a writer, there should be a benefit that outweighs the difficulties and drawbacks of everything you implement. Including gender ambiguity or any such trope. Other than fulfilling a whim, what are you getting out of it?

It certainly would make things easier if you dropped the trope, but that isn't necessarily what you want. So to figure out what it is you want, figure out what you're accomplishing by using it.

You will not go to space today.
MrAHR Ahr river from ಠ_ಠ Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
#4: Sep 11th 2013 at 4:11:19 PM

As someone who wrote a character in a roleplay that was of ambiguous sex (and agendered) for about two years if not more, I say, do it.

The fact of the matter is, society sees male as a default. I got around this by using different pronouns, and "they" can be a life send. One thing I did to get me in the mindset was to write an entire scene from the character (who could not see gender) and define everyone completely ambiguously.

It's a good exercise and can really make you make that separate "category" in your head.

Read my stories!
TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#5: Sep 11th 2013 at 4:28:26 PM

Yeah, I was planning on maybe going the agender route, which would probably be my best bet. But should I stick mostly to the (somewhat gramatically incorrect) 'they' to refer to them or try using a constructed gender neutral pronoun (something that already exists like Ze or such) using she and he interchanably, or perhaps creating one for this universe?. The only problem with that is it could get a little distracting when it really isn't supposed to be.

edited 11th Sep '13 4:29:51 PM by TheMuse

MrAHR Ahr river from ಠ_ಠ Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: A cockroach, nothing can kill it.
Ahr river
#6: Sep 11th 2013 at 4:30:09 PM

People...actually tend to not notice. I roleplayed a character of mine, in one of the character threads here, and avoided not using any gendered pronouns at all. People either assumed they were male by default, or didn't even notice that something was up until they went to check to reply.

Read my stories!
TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#7: Sep 11th 2013 at 5:07:15 PM

In that case, should I at least have a character or something casually note that the particular character isn't a 'man or woman' at some point? Not enough to be distracting, but just enough that the readers actually notice it.

edited 11th Sep '13 5:07:45 PM by TheMuse

greedling Since: Feb, 2010
#8: Sep 11th 2013 at 6:14:47 PM

If people get annoyed with you for using singular they, there are lots of links you can throw at them. This is the second google entry. You might find others you like better.

Singular they has had a long history of use, and wouldn't confuse or possibly even be noticed by most people who aren't looking for it, I think, or even if they do notice, they can probably get used to it. Style guides are inconsistent on the issue, but they're also inconsistent on things like dashes, and also you're probably not writing some formal paper so deliberate deviations from them would be acceptable anyway. A neologism would be more noticeable, but people can also get used to it. I think the question you should consider is, what pronoun would your character prefer?

How you have the world react to them (including pronouns) will reflect your worldbuilding somewhat though, so you can also take that into consideration. If everyone's using a neologism, then that means the neologism was created and popularised, or if it's not that popular, your character probably chose that pronoun.

Depending on what language your characters are speaking, it may not make sense that people who don't know this character well will know what pronouns to use, so they can ask or be told or have a usage corrected (depending on societal expectations and the other character's personality), which would solve both that question and make obvious what you're going for, if you want to make sure everyone notices. If everyone's reasonably polite about it, that also helps enforce the idea that it's not a big deal to people of your world. Or if the conceit is that your characters are speaking some conlang you have the freedom to set a linguistic convention of your choosing, such as making the whole language gender-neutral and claiming the translation convention is that you translate to what each character would prefer. You can have another character bring it up as an observation, but that typically brings to attention the idea that not being male or female is at least a little unusual and noteworthy unless you're careful about the wording or context, which you might not want.

edited 11th Sep '13 6:24:05 PM by greedling

You will not go to space today.
TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#9: Sep 13th 2013 at 5:39:43 AM

In this universe, non-cis characters aren't exactly uncommon (but a lot of those situation are temporary and caused by improperly done magical transformations, there is at least one true trans* character in universe though) So people may have to correct someone on their pronouns, but they'll use the right ones without a hitch if told them.

  • I've been thinking of a way to bring it up by maybe using a situation like:
    • Stranger: Thank you very much Sir- I mean Miss- Wait, are you-?
    • Character: I'm [name], but you're very welcome
And then they would continue casually talking
That doesn't sound like 'otherising,' right?

edited 13th Sep '13 5:40:20 AM by TheMuse

Majormarks What should I put here? from Britland Since: Jul, 2013
What should I put here?
#10: Sep 13th 2013 at 5:45:57 AM

I think you're drawing a little too much attention to the issue. A simple;

"Sir?"

would probably be better.

I write stuff sometimes. I also sometimes make youtube videos: http://www.youtube.com/user/majormarks
greedling Since: Feb, 2010
#11: Sep 13th 2013 at 7:50:16 AM

Well there is something to be said for being explicit about any differences a character has from the usual default.

That phrasing does imply most people are expected to fall within the binary - which may be realistic if the usual thing with gender is that magic changes their bodies temporarily - but you can lessen the highlighting of that expectation just by reducing it (to something like "Thank you... sir? ...miss?" perhaps. Removing the implication of a double-take (meaning surprise) and leaving just polite confusion because, I don't know, the character didn't think about gender until they had to use a gendered form of address) depending on just what kind of impression you want to give of the world's treatment of gender.

You will not go to space today.
TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#12: Sep 13th 2013 at 12:53:05 PM

In this society, it's considered at least somewhat unusual for someone to identify outside of the binary. They react to it better than the average person would in real life, but yeah, it's mostly because it's not as common (as in real life)

TheMuse Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Browsing the selection
#13: Sep 15th 2013 at 6:09:37 PM

But what exactly should the response to the 'polite confusion' be? The character themself wouldn't react badly at all to them unless they were being rude about it. Should I work to develop a gender neutral pronoun or title of some sort for the universe, although it will be infrequently used?

greedling Since: Feb, 2010
#14: Sep 15th 2013 at 6:48:42 PM

Your character is your character, not some stand-in for agender people. It would be normal to be a little uncomfortable or something but that depends on their personality and experiences. The bit of dialogue you posted made your character out to be able to play it off easily, which is fine.

If it makes sense for your world, you can make a gender-neutral honorific, probably indicating stuff like widespread acknowledgement of genderqueer people. There are a few that people have tried to push for. I think they sound awkward (like "mixter") and they obviously haven't gotten widespread recognition, but they exist. Downplaying the use of gendered honorifics could be easier if that doesn't change much of your story; implications of that could either be less formality or widespread gender neutrality depending on how you play it. If I went through the trouble of inventing one I'd personally make it universal because there's widespread temporary physical sex changes and all that, but that's not necessary.

You will not go to space today.
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