This is one of those tropes that seems really badly misused and I think most people know it, so I think it's time to bring it up. This trope always seems to be used for actual dead little sisters. Or older ones, or brothers, or whatever. What it isn't used for is the event that turned a character to cynicism or villainy. Correct:
edited 7th Feb '13 9:12:10 PM by Arha
...I actually did not know any of this, and now that I do, I want to attack whoever originally named this trope, because it's got to be one of the most misleading trope names ever. Just... wow. I'm almost at a loss for words. Obviously, a Trope Transplant would be the order of the day here, but I think we might already have the original meaning somewhere else.
No, the other one.You forgot to WikiWord the title. Tsk. note The description seems clear enough. It clearly defines an event, and not a character. The character it mainly speaks of is the one who had her sister die, and not the actual dead sister. I think the name is to blame, so a rename would be in order. Transplant if a sister who dies is a proper trope of its own. There are roughly 2000 wicks and between a quarter and a third of that inbounds, though. Anything else? Well, other than cleaning it up and stuff.
edited 7th Feb '13 10:48:04 PM by AnotherDuck
Zero Context Examples. Bleh.
A worm for ChristmasTransplant. Quickly hopefully - I've seen that renames tend to stall out the longest when too much time passes until crowner calling. Is a dead sibling really a trope, though?
Crowner. Let's get this one done quickly. Alternate names?
No, the other one.Disillusioning Event, Cynicism Catalyst? Yes.
edited 8th Feb '13 6:28:14 AM by AnotherDuck
Anime-tedto Cynicism Catalyst, if is meant to be two separate suggestion. Also, this makes me realize that we completely misinterpreted the trope when we did the recent IP thread for it...
edited 8th Feb '13 5:50:14 AM by Willbyr
A worm for ChristmasCynicism Catalyst sounds the best to me. By the way, Arha, your crowner is a Single Proposition crowner for a rename. While I have to say that I don't feel that "dead sibling" is a trope, I just wanted to point that out.
Jade-Colored Glasses and where it falls on the scale.
A worm for ChristmasI am not sure if a Page Action crowner is a good idea. It would essentially be "is a dead sibling a trope" question, and that is probably better addressed by discussion than by crowner.
Anime-tedSeems to me that Jade-Colored Glasses is a process while this trope is one specific event...sort of the Cynicism Event Horizon, if you will.
No, the other one.Reading Jade-Colored Glasses makes me think it's basically just a character with those glasses on. That is, a character with a cynical outlook, often in contrast to everyone else. I'm not even sure if it needs to be justified, though if it's not it'd probably be closer to Grumpy Bear. Mainly unrelated, I think the pun on Jade-Colored Glasses is bad, since jade is generally thought of as a green, which has another association.
edited 8th Feb '13 6:33:09 AM by AnotherDuck
Well, after we get this renamed we can worry about whether dead siblings is a trope. You could use it as a source of angst, I guess. Right now I just don't think the examples really follow enough of a pattern beyond the basic 'dead relative' to really mean anything. I like Cynicism Catalyst.
edited 8th Feb '13 7:00:52 AM by Arha
A worm for ChristmasThe "are dead siblings a trope" discussion needs to happen before a rename. After all, it decides on what we make on the examples that are just dead siblings.
Okay. Then no, 'dead sibling' is not a trope. 'Dead siblings make you angsty' could be a trope, but that's not how it's being used. Page action crowner. Add any other options you feel should be on there.
edited 8th Feb '13 8:03:36 AM by Arha
No, the other one.I think Dead Siblings Make You Angsty would be too close to Cynicism Catalyst anyway. While it's technically about a person that creates an effect, it's functionally similar to an event, if you consider how the trope is used. I do think a lot of the Zero Context Examples can potentially be correct ones, but it's impossible to tell. Should they be removed or as per ZCE policy be commented out?
A worm for ChristmasOn the page? Commented out. In the wicks? Deleted.
Well, angst and cynicism aren't quite the same thing and a Cynicism Catalyst doesn't need to be the death of a sibling. Still, if that's not a trope is there anything we can salvage here?
No, the other one."Has a dead sister" is meaningless in itself. What it means for the person who had the sister is actually relevant, though, which is usually either this or provides motivation to not let it happen again. I don't have much confidence that your average troper will be able to sufficiently distinguish angst from cynicism. Point is moot in my opinion, though.
edited 8th Feb '13 10:21:11 AM by AnotherDuck
World's Toughest MilkmanDead sibling as a motivation would take it out of chairs territory. It's also what I would have assumed the trope meant from its name.
"Existential Despair" is an oxymoron.
A worm for ChristmasThat might be worth creating, but is any of these wicks about that?
There's The Lost Lenore that is about dead love interests as a motivating factor for a character. I suppose we could do a supertrope for a dead person being a motivating factor for a character.
No, the other one.Considering it would be pretty much a direct sister trope of The Lost Lenore, I don't see a problem with it. Reading the definition of The Lost Lenore, I'd assume pretty much the same for Dead Little Sister. They'd be very similar, but there's still a significant thematic difference depending on the protagonist's relationship to the dead character. There are several examples that fall under that definition as well. Like this one, which is a ZCE under that definition, but exactly claims to use the trope:
Is dead sibling different enough from dead love interest though?
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