You moved the argument from Saya no Uta to Martello. You are attacking his credibility rather than his arguments. You are also accusing him of having Western biases affect his views.

Listen, people under attack become defensive, hostile and stubborn. It is not even in your own best interests to take that kind of attitude.

That's what I said, Airha.

edited 2nd May '12 6:06:08 PM by RagnaTheSaviour

Another image of a real sixteen year old with a similar build.◊

edited 2nd May '12 6:08:00 PM by RhymeBeat

You are also accusing him of having Western biases affect his views.

I said that Western biases should not be applied to Japanese character design in trying to determine age of a drawn character. That is a fact, not a personal attack.

Can we just drop it here, Catbert? You've heard what I have to say and there's no point in continuing an argument. We're starting a derail.

To someone who has played the game: It was stated that there are only three scenes in total, which is not very many. How long is the VN? Unless it's quite short, by the suggested guidelines for H games it gets a pass as 'not porn.'

edited 2nd May '12 6:11:58 PM by Arha

Catbert, you're being a raging dick about it, but yeah, I can handle the disagreement. Just settle down a little. I mean, it's not like you wrote this thing, right?

Also, I'm not sure why you're so focused on the breasts alone, especially because I never said a thing about her bust size in particular. Don't misquote me. Her face looks extremely young too, and I'm not going to buy "Animes and mango design looks like that k?" because looks young, is young, is pedo when having sex with older dudes.

We'll see what the other two have to say, or other four if Catalogue is found and Triple Elation's replacement steps up. If we all vote to cut it, there can always be a trope page for ComicBook.Song Of Saya. It's not the end of the world.

Also, pro tip - a bad argument is not just an argument you disagree with.

edited 2nd May '12 6:13:40 PM by Martello

A middle-aged adult with a similar build. Trying to use the character's build is meaningless. Even if you take the character's look as a whole and deem it "young, " that's not definitive. People in their late teens look young.

edited 2nd May '12 6:22:56 PM by Terrie

Out of curiosity, how old is the main character?

edited 2nd May '12 6:14:25 PM by TheFoxsCloak

ANYWAYS ONTO ANSWERING THE MAIN POINTS.

Yes, I'm using the H-game defense thingy, but, considering that the argument over towards the loliness of the main female character will never go anywhere...

Guy's about 20, IIRC.

And sorta ninja'd, but lemme just have it here.

• When are the sex scenes located?-Past a certain point near the middle.
  • Are they spread out over the game?-Sequestered to two routes and fairly spread out.
    • How much gameplay is there between sex scenes? A lot. The sex itself is not even the point.
• Are they only at the endings?-None featured at the endings.
  • How hard do you have to work to get an ending?-It's a Visual Novel, there's only three endings, one gained fairly early on. Not very.
  • Are they in every ending? Every good ending?-Again, none.
• Are the sex scenes optional via a choice in the menu?-Option to censor them is available, yes.
• Would the story make sense without them with minimal or no rewriting?-Depending on the ending you're looking for, you'll either get nothing or one scene of consensual sex and two depictions of rape played for dramatic purposes. So, depends. A minimal rewriting of the scenes would very likely make sense.
• Are the scenes made up of stills, or are they animated?-Stills
• How explicit are the sex scenes?-Fairly. But it's been a while, so I can't say for the exact language.

edited 2nd May '12 6:26:40 PM by Raidouthe21st

@Terrie - And...more taking my use (or misuse maybe) of the word "build" out of context. And choosing to be personally offended, no less.

Okay, well, this isn't very constructive. I think this thread might need to go to being 5P only if everyone else is going to be so emotional and irrational about it.

edited 2nd May '12 6:15:24 PM by Martello

He's a med school student.

edited 2nd May '12 6:15:54 PM by ThatHuman

It should be pointed out that Japanese medical schools are undergraduate institutions, basically like the "BA plus masters in six years" programs some US universities offer.

@Martello, sorry, got ninja'd there. Will go back and change it to reflect your later comments. And as for "choosing to be offended", eh, feel free to offend me. I'm a big girl and can handle it. Just realize I will point out what I consider to be problems with the comments.

Let me be blunt: that's highly illogical. How old would you say this guy is?

He turned forty in 2011

edited 2nd May '12 6:23:54 PM by TheHandle

We're closing this down for commentary for just a little bit until the rest of P5 has a chance to post. Thank you.

Hm, going by Raidou's post, I'm kinda leaning towards bringing the page back now; it doesn't sound like a porno or a pro-pedo work. If anyone else can offer a second opinion, they can go ahead and PM me.

I'm voting to bring it back. Sex-wise, its clearly on the same level as Fate/stay night, and the girl definitely doesn't look prepubescent to me. I've met older Japanese girls who look younger. It's a quirk of the ethnicity, and by extension the art.

Please see The Rules . This is a warning that this post is the sort of thing that will get you suspended.

Having watched one of the routes for this game on Youtube (sans sex scenes, obviously) a while back, I can attest to this game having a coherent plot that stands on its own without explicit content.

I was never really sure just how much explicit stuff was cut out from what I watched, but if there are only three sex scenes in total, and players have the option to censor those, I don't have a problem with voting for this as "not porn".

I thought Saya looked more like an anime-stylized teenager with a small chest than a child, and the official art Shimaspawn linked reinforces that view for me. All in all I'm fine with this page being restored.

Thank you very much Meedle for restoring it.

Saya no Uta restored. Does it need something cleaned, or are we done?

edited 4th May '12 1:51:04 AM by lu127

Yeah, we're pretty much done here. I'm for its restoraion, at any rate.