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Working on a new title: Foe Yay get usage counts

 51 johnnye, Wed, 21st Nov '12 2:44:22 AM from Brighton, UK Relationship Status: If it's you, it's okay
Questions regarding Foe Romance Subtext:
  • It doesn't have to be gay, does it? If Alice and Bob are devoted to annihilating each other, but everyone around them comments on how it sounds more like a different kind of obsession, that'd count as long as they never get into Dating Catwoman territory?
  • A lot of examples refer to "one-sided" Foe Yay, by which they usually seem to mean "the villain flirts with the hero". Isn't that just Depraved Homosexual? If the hero isn't reciprocating, it's hardly a "romantic subtext".

edited 21st Nov '12 2:44:38 AM by johnnye

Zaldrīzes buzdari iksos daor, so Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus.
 52 nrjxll, Wed, 21st Nov '12 2:46:40 AM Relationship Status: Not war
Correct on both points. This does not have to be same-sex (and I'm honestly baffled as to why it's used that way), but it does have to be mutual. There's a variety of things that "villain flirts with hero" goes under, but I wouldn't call it "romantic subtext" if it only involves one party.

edited 21st Nov '12 2:46:53 AM by nrjxll

 53 johnnye, Wed, 21st Nov '12 4:23:41 AM from Brighton, UK Relationship Status: If it's you, it's okay
[up]"I'm honestly baffled as to why it's used that way" — by association with Ho Yay, presumably. I don't know if it ever had that meaning, but it wouldn't surprise me.
Zaldrīzes buzdari iksos daor, so Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus.
Foe Yay is usually gay because straight foe-yay type set-ups in works are more likely to turn into Dating Catwoman. Also arch rivals are more often same-sex than opposite-sex.

 55 Trope Eater, Wed, 2nd Jan '13 1:16:26 PM from the depths of Hell
That One Troper
This is a bit off-topic, but there really isn't anywhere else to put this, so I'm going to say it here. See, I think trying to turn all the Yay tropes into YMMV items is ultimately counterproductive. Look at Ho Yay — it's supposed to be those moments that fans treat as Homoerotic Subtext or homosexual Shiptease when they actually aren't.

A) That phenomenon is already covered by Shipping Goggles

and more importantly

B) The item is still being used to mean Homoerotic Subtext or homosexual Shiptease. All that's happening is people moving examples from the main pages to the YMMV tabs.

Look at the HoYay/ namespace — here, look at the picture for HoYay.Anime That's not even subtext anymore, that's maintext. Whether or not the characters are actually gay, you see all the trappings of a Yaoi Guys relationship. Let's see — a a pitcher, a catcher, a feeling of tenseness, and, of course, glasses. And let's not even get into the Playing to the Fetishes.

Nobody needs to be wearing Shipping Goggles to see that.

You know, I think we outta start another family of tropes for "Fake Yay" (not to be confused with Faux Yay, that's about an In-Universe elaborate homosexuality ruse), where there is homoerotic subtext or tease between strait characters. Needs a Better Name, of course.

Take this from Awkward Zombie for an example — Marth has a Homoerotic Dream about Roy. This is obviously fake, since Mewtwo is messing with his dreams.

Should I go ahead and YKTTW that? Unfortunately, I Suck at YKKTW, so if so I'm going to need a lot of help with that.

edited 2nd Jan '13 1:17:57 PM by TropeEater

   Evil is my favorite color.   
Yeah, Ho Yay currently functions as a Gay Moments page.

 57 nrjxll, Tue, 12th Mar '13 3:01:25 PM Relationship Status: Not war
[up][up]That's a nice idea in theory. But I don't think the troper body is really capable of pulling it off: one person's subtext is another person's giant flaming text-text UST is another person's reading too much into it.

 58 johnnye, Tue, 12th Mar '13 3:36:00 PM from Brighton, UK Relationship Status: If it's you, it's okay
The phrase "anything implying explicit romance" in the crowner description has to win some kind of oxymoron award.

I suppose I can see what it means in context — the name shouldn't imply that the romance is explicit, so as not to confuse the meaning of the trope.

[down]It said "implying" when I wrote this. I know it did because the bit in quotes above was literally copy-pasted.

edited 12th Mar '13 5:41:41 PM by johnnye

Zaldrīzes buzdari iksos daor, so Draco dormiens nunquam titillandus.
Seeking for Light
[up] "denoting"=/="implying"; "denoting" means "indicating".

 60 Macron Notes, Wed, 3rd Apr '13 4:12:46 PM from Wilkes Barre Relationship Status: Mu
Formerly known as Oreochan
So, what else needs to be done here? Sorting examples and wicks?

Piffy
Come on, can we get this one done and off the table?
Because underscores break everything: Working link to my Troper page
 62 Septimus Heap, Mon, 1st Jul '13 5:30:28 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
I did transfer some examples from the Anime page, but otherwise I do not know them well enough to make a sure call in most cases.

edited 1st Jul '13 5:52:14 AM by SeptimusHeap

 63 Willbyr, Thu, 1st Aug '13 6:08:42 AM from North Little Rock, AR Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
With Mod Hat On
Clock is set.
 64 Willbyr, Mon, 5th Aug '13 6:09:02 AM from North Little Rock, AR Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
With Mod Hat On
The cursor's hovering over the lock button, is there anything else that needs to be done here?
 65 Septimus Heap, Fri, 6th Sep '13 9:18:27 AM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
OK, bumping this. There hasn't been any progress, and in retrospect, I am starting to wonder if this ehole change was unnecessary and just created hard and non-viable work.

 66 Willbyr, Fri, 25th Oct '13 10:12:28 AM from North Little Rock, AR Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
With Mod Hat On
Re-clocked to see if anything else needs to be done here. Foe Romance Subtext is up and appears to be in good shape.
 67 Willbyr, Mon, 25th Nov '13 6:20:41 AM from North Little Rock, AR Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
With Mod Hat On
Apparently not. Locking up.
The system doesn't know you right now, so no post button for you.
You need to Get Known to get one of those.

Alternative Titles: Foe Yay
11th Jun '12 11:26:27 AM
Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.
At issue:
Previous crowner here

Note: This trope is for romantic subtext. Anything denoting explicit romance is misleading and not recommended
Total posts: 67
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