Split into Children's Literature and Young Adult Literature: Young Adult And Childrens Literature

We have two indexes that seem redundant: Young Adult And Childrens Literature and Young Adult. Anyone oppose a merge? Preferences for title?

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I suport a merge.

Young Adult And Childrens Literature works just fine as the name.

I would suggest creating seperate Young Adult Literature and Children's Literature pages, but the dividing line between the two is not always so clear.

I am not sure there is really a problem with having two indexes when one (Young Adult And Childrens Literature) seems like a "super index" to the other (Young Adult). I feel like works that do not clearly fit one category or the other can just go on the first index while works that are definitely for a young adult audience can be included on both indexes.

I might be reading too much into this, but I think the description for Young Adult is fleshed out and unique enough to warrant keeping that index as it is, especially since it has more wicks (75) than Young Adult And Childrens Literature (44) does.

Of course, I could be completely wrong about this*

, so I would be glad to hear reasons why other people might support a merge.

edited 9th Feb '12 9:39:31 PM by LouieW

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These actually tend to be completely separate sections in both bookstores and libraries. I dislike the idea of merging them. Children's literature is aimed at about 0-12. Young Adult is aimed more at 13-17. They're very different age categories. While children tends to be more towards basic concepts and simple morals. Young Adult is aimed more at teens and tends to have more complex narrative and starts asking harder questions.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

The problem is that currently one index, Young Adult And Childrens Literature, covers both of these groups and the other, Young Adult, covers only one. So we should either merge Young Adult into Young Adult And Childrens Literature OR make a new index for (only) Children's Literature, and split up the works that are currently on Young Adult And Childrens Literature accordingly.

Leaving it as it is would mean we would have to index every work of young adult literature twice, on Young Adult And Childrens Literature and Young Adult. I think that's redundant and confusing.

edited 10th Feb '12 2:40:19 AM by LordGro

Let's just say and leave it at that.

I think the two indices were created by people who were unaware that the other existed. Or Young Adult was created specifically to define the term, but got expanded and became an index.

While sometimes the line is blurred between Children's Literature and Young Adult Literature, I too would like to see a distinction. For example, no one will claim that Ramona Quimby is for teens, or even that My Teacher Is An Alien really is (the main characters age into their early teens in the later books).

There does seem to be crossover between books for upper elementary school kids, and young teens. Young teens are not considered Young Adults, I'm pretty sure, so the split could be along "not for Young Adults / older teens" and "for Young Adults / older teens", rather than simply 0-12 vs 13-17, which would result in problems when it comes to stories aimed at middle schoolers.

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I just used ages as a general idea. But yes, I think instead of merging, the young adult stuff should but cut from the one index and it should be cleaned up and given a proper description of children's literature.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

Sounds like we have a plan. Anyone against having Young Adult as the index page for YA fiction, making Children's Literature (currently a redirect) into an index for CL, and axing Young Adult And Childrens Literature?

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Hm, maybe we should decide whether the Young Adult index should contain only literature, or all kinds of fiction?

Let's just say and leave it at that.

Huh. Is Young Adult used in the real world to cover other kinds of media? I've personally never seen, say, "YA television" as a descriptor. We already have Teen Drama.

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OK, you're right. I'd personally prefer Young Adult Literature as the index main title, and Young Adult as a redirect.

Let's just say and leave it at that.

I can go for that swap.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

OK, revised plan. Anyone against having Young Adult Literature (currently a redirect) as the index page for YA fiction, making Children's Literature (currently a redirect) into an index for CL, and axing Young Adult And Childrens Literature?

edited 10th Feb '12 12:03:01 PM by lebrel

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No, but I think it's a good idea for a single proposition. I'm going to change the title to be more topical.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

After considerable poking and prodding, I figured out how to make a crowner, and it is here: [1]

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Crowner hooked.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

I am so glad to see this split. There's a massive difference between Fear Street and Nothings Fair In Fifth Grade, and grouping the two together doesn't make much sense.

The one question is, what do we do with stories aimed at middle schoolers? Do we consider them Children's Literature?

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Books aimed at middle schoolers are sort of split. I'm not sure there really is a genre aimed at them. It's the age when some of them make the jump to more mature books, but I don't think there's much aimed specifically at them.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

Bump. So far this is unanimous, how many votes do we need to make it a done thing?

Calling someone a pedant is an automatic Insult Backfire. Real pedants will be flattered.

It's been three days, and I'm fairly certain we have a consensus. I say go for it.

Young Adult And Childrens Literature found in: 45 articles, excluding discussions.

Since January 1, 2011 this article has brought 45 people to the wiki from non-search engine links.

Given that it has inbounds, I'm not too keen on cutting it. Might we make in a disambiguation page explaining briefly the difference betwee the two and then linking Children's Literature and Young Adult Literature?

Making it a disambig is fine.

I really prefer not to call crowners before 15 votes.

Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away. -Philip K. Dick

Agree on the disambig - 45 inbounds are way too much.

Also, according to which criterion is a given work going to be split between pages?

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My understanding is that we are splitting it between Young Adult for teenagers and Children for younger children.

There are some works I'm familiar enough with that I can make decide. For example, CHERUB Series is marketed as Young Adult, with teenage protagonists and a fair amount of sexual content, profanity, violence, drinking and and such. Some of the books even have a "not for younger readers" disclaimer on it. The Roman Mysteries is explictity marketed for children 8-12 and has protagonists all in that age range. Others might be able to provide input on some of the other works that they may have read.

But if no one knows firsthand about a given work, it might be wise to search online at wiki, a publisher website, or a library catalogue and see how they classify things. Sometimes a book cover will even have the recommended age range on it.

edited 13th Feb '12 5:50:23 PM by Catbert

and Sorting out which is which should be relatively straightforward for most of them; publishers tend to provide info for librarians and such that clearly categorizes them one way or another. Just waiting on more votes.

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