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Male responsibility in teenage pregnancy:

 101 MRDA 1981, Sat, 17th Dec '11 6:12:32 AM from Hell (London), UK.
Tyrannicidal Maniac
Quite frankly, I think this woman's an argument against mandatory child support, all by herself...

I knew it was wrong, but I would accidentally-on-purpose skip days of my birth control, eventually ceasing to take the pills at all. I knew that if we had a child, my husband would grow to love it.

edited 17th Dec '11 6:56:57 PM by MRDA1981

 102 joeyjojo, Sat, 17th Dec '11 8:55:49 AM from South Sydney: go the bunnies! Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Happy Oktoberfest!
[up]My god what bad people.
Beer is proof God loves us and wants us to be happy -Gandolf In Harry Potter
 103 Gabrael, Sat, 17th Dec '11 6:49:33 PM from My musings Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
Zombie Polar Bears!
[up][up] That's not much difference to me than rape.

The key to this is the word, "Husband". In this case, he could ask for a divorce and sign over his rights if he knew that it was done on purpose.
"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read." -Groucho Marx
 104 L Mage, Sun, 18th Dec '11 10:40:37 PM from Miss Robichaux's Academy Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Evil Trickster
[up][up][up]

To be fair the man lied about a vasectomy to his wife, nothing about this relationship screams healthy on either end.

edited 18th Dec '11 10:41:26 PM by LMage

"You are never taller then when standing up for yourself"
 105 Or Kuun Ar Qen Byundis, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 9:59:37 PM from Under the Sun Relationship Status: In love with love
A Grey Sun Veiled By Dark Clouds on a Cold Wind
My solution to this problem would be getting to its roots, putting sex back into the "sacred" position it used to hold in the majority of America, and raising kids with standards... like how risking pregnancy before your ready is incredibly stupid, and, in the event it happens, a guy who walks out on the girl and his kid without helping in any way is the scum of the earth and deserves a swift kick where the sun don't shine.

edited 23rd Dec '11 10:00:18 PM by OrKuunArQenByundis

Borne By Storms
 106 L Mage, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 10:06:19 PM from Miss Robichaux's Academy Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Evil Trickster
[up] Point of order! Please present evdiecne that "morals" and "sex being sacred" ever, at any point, made this situation any diffrent.
"You are never taller then when standing up for yourself"
[up] Sexual puritanism and abstinence only education have been shown time and time again to not work. Giving people proper sexual education and access to birth control is the best way to lessen teenage pregnancy. Teens aren't going to suddenly stop fucking if we make it seem like a bad thing or if we make it seem like a sacred thing only for marriage, they are just more likely to do it secretively and to avoid buying and using condoms and other birth control because of the difficulty of obtaining them. The 1950's had more teenage pregnancy than we have now, and you are proposing that we go back to the standards of those times, which is frankly bizarre.
 
 108 USAF713, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 10:10:16 PM from the United States
I changed accounts.
...didn't the Puritans have a ridiculous rate of sex-before-marriage?

Sexual repression works like every other kind of suppression: the harder you clamp down, the more it all comes out from under your thumb.
I am now known as Flyboy.
[up] Yeah, all it successfully does is create a culture of slut shaming where women are made to feel bad about having a sexuality. You still have people shagging, it just results in them being made to feel worse about themselves.
 
 110 Or Kuun Ar Qen Byundis, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 10:29:55 PM from Under the Sun Relationship Status: In love with love
A Grey Sun Veiled By Dark Clouds on a Cold Wind
[up][up][up][up] Mmmmm, okay, scratch the "used to hold". Let me rephrase some stuff. I think that we should combine the approaches: don't make sex a taboo, because that'll make it more desirable. Don't try to repress it. However, make it the "norm" that only people who are really ready engage in it. In my opinion, until marriage, because otherwise "really ready" is too ambiguous (I know that sounds "old-timey", but really, I think it would be the best option). I'm not foolish enough to believe that it will stop the problem, but people are influenced by what surrounds them when they grow; and growing in a society like that would obviously make a difference.

[up] I agree. I also think the idea of "everyone makes mistakes, and I'm no different" should be emphasized, the lack of which leads to such horrendous behavior.

edited 23rd Dec '11 11:44:28 PM by OrKuunArQenByundis

Borne By Storms
 111 USAF713, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 10:31:34 PM from the United States
I changed accounts.
Humanity is too inclined towards philosophical utilitarianism for that.

That is to say, we are sexual beings by nature, and won't bother to heed the advice.
I am now known as Flyboy.
 112 Or Kuun Ar Qen Byundis, Fri, 23rd Dec '11 10:35:17 PM from Under the Sun Relationship Status: In love with love
A Grey Sun Veiled By Dark Clouds on a Cold Wind
[up] Like I said, I'm not foolish enough to think it'll solve the whole problem. But a step forward is still a step.

And I reiterate that the whole "teach them running away from something you caused is shameful behavior" would, more directly, solve the "taking responsibility" problem. Kids these days (geez, I sound old) see taking responsibility as an undesirable, almost punishment, instead of, say, a desirable step towards adulthood and maturity that allows them to grow into stronger, better people.

edited 23rd Dec '11 10:47:09 PM by OrKuunArQenByundis

Borne By Storms
Taking responsibility for one's actions is the most important thing to teach the young (and most people who aren't young) and it really covers pretty much everything. Making sex seen prohibited until marriage is not going to work because people want to fuck. What you have to do is teach the consequences of unprotected sex and then provide plenty of resources to help people have responsible and safe sexual practices. To put it bluntly: making sex "pure" or "intimate" won't do jack shit, education and teaching people to accept responsibility for their fuck-ups will change shit.
 
 114 Or Kuun Ar Qen Byundis, Sat, 24th Dec '11 1:20:58 AM from Under the Sun Relationship Status: In love with love
A Grey Sun Veiled By Dark Clouds on a Cold Wind
[up] I didn't say "prohibited", I said "the norm". Do you deny that what one grows up around will influence his behavior? Even if humans are all about sex, if they grow up in a culture where the vast majority of people are abstaining, than it will have a major influence on most of the kids (and even if it's only some of the kids, like I said, a step is still a step). Besides, I only brought up "until marriage" because it's safe to say that a couple at that point is as ready for that level of intimacy as they will ever be, and a consistent view of what "ready" is is better than simply guessing.

Anyway, back to the "responsibility" thing, my worry is that, as a culture, we're at a point where teaching "take responsibility" is actually a huge change in how we do things; and people would rather conform with what they find familiar than deal with that king of hassle.

edited 24th Dec '11 8:08:11 AM by OrKuunArQenByundis

Borne By Storms
[up] But I already explained that's not how it works because people will fuck regardless if it is a social norm or not. Look at the 1950's, they had a veneer of being upright and pure, while having high heroin/opium usage (Can't remember which one) and high pre-marital pregnancy. Having a culture that puts on an airs of being pure just leads to slut shaming which I have already talked about. Having backwards-ass notions about fucking will harm more than it will help.

Take responsibility has always been a hard thing to teach people, that doesn't mean it is not the right course of action. You see large banks needing bailouts due to greed, you see people starving on the streets due to an oligarchical government and there are people dying because no one wants to take responsibility and spread wealth. The upper layers of society are built on passing the buck onto those below them. I am not saying this is an easy task, or even one that can be done by a handful of people, I am saying that taking responsibility is what every person needs to do and the fact we don't is why shit goes wrong.
 
@ Or Kuun Statistically, places with the kind of social conservatism you encourage have higher levels of teen pregnancy than places without. This applies to the US as well. If we inform people that it is, in fact, acceptable to want sex and that there are measures you can take to prevent unwanted side-effects like pregnancies, instead of teaching them that if they don't abstain outside of marriage, they'll go to hell, we'll probably see a downturn in teen pregnancies.

Actually, teen pregnancies are going down, according to cracked anyways, so clearly a more socially open society does have a good effect on teen pregnancy.

[up][awesome]

edited 26th Dec '11 4:33:11 PM by stripesthezebra

To be fair the man lied about a vasectomy to his wife
He lied as a means of catching her in a lie.

nothing about this relationship screams healthy on either end.
Well, yeah. But we need to take into account that a lot of relationships are like that.

edited 27th Dec '11 10:43:28 AM by HiddenFacedMatt

"I even like the idea of a nice man who sees me when I'm sleeping and knows when I'm awake. And that man is Barack Obama." - Bill Maher
 118 L Mage, Tue, 27th Dec '11 11:07:53 AM from Miss Robichaux's Academy Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Evil Trickster
According to the article he lied to her about it when they first started datting.
"You are never taller then when standing up for yourself"
 119 Gabrael, Tue, 27th Dec '11 12:11:37 PM from My musings Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
Zombie Polar Bears!
Okay, bad example for the original topic, perfect example for daytime television...
"Outside of a dog, a book is a man's best friend. Inside of a dog it's too dark to read." -Groucho Marx
The guy didn't technically lie, but it was wrong not to tell her. But I'd say she was slightly more in the wrong.

The guy didn't technically lie, but it was wrong not to tell her.
Not necessarily. That he didn't tell her is part of how he caught her in said lie.
"I even like the idea of a nice man who sees me when I'm sleeping and knows when I'm awake. And that man is Barack Obama." - Bill Maher
 122 Wulf, Wed, 28th Dec '11 5:36:41 PM from Louisiana
Gotta trope, dood!
Re: Vasectomy Guy- I'm not entirely sure he did lie, though. She says he told her when they met "I could never have kids, " which some could interpret as "No. I literally can never have kids." Likely, he considered telling her that the same thing as telling her about vasectomy. At worst, he's guilty of lying by omission. About something that, considering she was supposed to be taking birth control, they seem to have agreed they didn't want when they first got together. It should never have come up, because she should never have been trying to get pregnant without telling him.

By contrast, she actively tried to force him into something he wanted no part of, and is by far, the worst of the two for it.
They lost me. Forgot me. Made you from parts of me. If you're the One, my father's son, what am I supposed to be?
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Total posts: 122
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