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Smoking Bans:

There's no anti-smoking ads in Ontario. We didn't use those as far as I know, and what does exist is very polite like "Smoking causes cancer." And then that's it. Likely, those ads target areas with a high number of smokers.

America has the most obnoxious commercials ever like showing some guy who is brain damaged and going "don't text and drive". Really? Did you have to show that? Jeez.

Tobacco ads are just banned and you're not even allowed to display them in stores. They are behind concealed cabinets. For any store making less than a certain amount of profit, the government subsidized the cost of those cabinets. They're not sure if we want to roll out a label-ban on packaging like Australia, I personally don't think it'd make a difference at this point. Half the box is already "SMOKING CAUSES CANCER!".

 127 Barkey, Sat, 18th Aug '12 1:10:37 PM from Bunker 051 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
War Profiteer
If everything is in a big ass cabinet that is covered, how am I supposed to know if they have my smokes or not? Or if a new flavor comes out?
The AR-15 is responsible for 95% of all deaths each year. The rest of the deaths are from obesity and drone strikes.
 128 Deviant Braeburn, Sat, 18th Aug '12 1:13:13 PM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
How sad is it, that if this were a real Ad, it would probably be the most effective anti-smoking Ad ever created?

[up] Use your Jedi mind powers.

edited 18th Aug '12 1:14:24 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

@ Barkey

You can use the internet.

The idea is to phase out smoking so only existing smokers know what to get.

 130 Greenmantle, Sat, 18th Aug '12 2:19:38 PM from Thornycroft-land Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Dodge-ing The Water
@ Breadloaf:

Tobacco ads are just banned and you're not even allowed to display them in stores. They are behind concealed cabinets. For any store making less than a certain amount of profit, the government subsidized the cost of those cabinets. They're not sure if we want to roll out a label-ban on packaging like Australia, I personally don't think it'd make a difference at this point. Half the box is already "SMOKING CAUSES CANCER!".

Unsurprisingly, that's exactly what it's like in Britain*. The display ban has recently come in the last year or so, and they're already starting to move on alcohol — Scotland has introduced minimum pricing for alcohol per "Unit".
"To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield" — Alfred, Lord Tennyson
 131 0dd 1, Sat, 18th Aug '12 2:25:50 PM from Nowhere Land
Just awesome like that
@Deviant: I believe I actually posted that in this thread several pages ago, but it's still worth discussing. There's a whole lot that would be wrong with ads like that, though, and I think that the video shows it pretty well (what with the outright homophobia that it would actively encourage).

I wasn't reading the past few pages as closely as I probably should've so I must ask, has anyone mentioned that (if I recall correctly) tobacco companies are required by law to run anti-smoking ads?
Insert witty and clever quip here.

My page, as the database hates my handle.

My music.
 132 Greenmantle, Sat, 18th Aug '12 2:28:48 PM from Thornycroft-land Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Dodge-ing The Water
[up]

Depends on where you are — in some places they're not allowed to run any ads at all.

EDIT: I'll shut up now...

edited 18th Aug '12 2:44:39 PM by Greenmantle

"To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield" — Alfred, Lord Tennyson
 133 Barkey, Sat, 18th Aug '12 2:43:41 PM from Bunker 051 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
War Profiteer
....
The AR-15 is responsible for 95% of all deaths each year. The rest of the deaths are from obesity and drone strikes.
 134 Deviant Braeburn, Sat, 18th Aug '12 3:16:13 PM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
[up][up][up]

Here's something I just found out, as part of a $206 billion dollar settlement that took place in 1998, major tobacco companies like Philip Morris agreed to pay for advertising campaigns to educate consumers about the dangers of tobacco. Not only were they barred from advertising their own products or sponsoring events geared towards teenagers, they also had to contribute millions annually to support these anti-smoking ads in every state.

However the settlement mandates that these anti-smoking ads cannot personally vilify or attack the tobacco companies. Under the terms of the settlement, violating the clause can pose big problems for any anti-tobacco group. Just ask the American Legacy Foundation.

[up]

Dammit man, I'm a Troper not a Mind Reader.

edited 18th Aug '12 3:22:48 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

 135 Barkey, Sat, 18th Aug '12 3:39:55 PM from Bunker 051 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
War Profiteer
I don't agree with anything that doesn't let both sides participate equally, and all these measures that make being an existing regular smoker who is polite with his habit a huge pain in the ass piss me off.

.... could have been "Fuck You." not to any particular individual or group, but just to the stance in general.
The AR-15 is responsible for 95% of all deaths each year. The rest of the deaths are from obesity and drone strikes.
 136 0dd 1, Sat, 18th Aug '12 10:09:06 PM from Nowhere Land
Just awesome like that
The idea behind it (well, one of the ideas behind it) is that said inconvenience will be further incentive for current smokers to try to kick the habit. Granted, it probably doesn't take into account how hard it is and how much sheer willpower is needed to do so, but the intention is still one that is ultimately noble, in a twisted sort of way.

Barkey, I'm just a little curious, why do you smoke, and have you ever tried to quit?
Insert witty and clever quip here.

My page, as the database hates my handle.

My music.
 137 Barkey, Sat, 18th Aug '12 10:25:06 PM from Bunker 051 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
War Profiteer
I've tried to quit before, merely because of the ridiculous tax hikes they've been giving smokes.(No product that also has applicable sales tax should have over 40 percent of the pre-sales cost be in taxes.. That's straight bullshit.)

Then I just realized that I can buy them tax free at the Base Exchange at the nearby Navy base, which eases the wallet-pains a good bit.

I smoke because I enjoy it, and because it gives me time to think about things. I do all my deep thinking while I'm smoking on my porch while reading a book and drinking something or another. It's just sort of a part of my ritual for relaxation, as well as being a quick shot of that ritual throughout my actual day.

As far as health ramifications or anything of that nature, I'm completely informed, since my mother is a nurse and thus there isn't really anything out there I haven't seen or heard from her on the issue, thus she just accepts it as something I do.

Here's how I look at a lot of these anti-smoking measures.. You're in a movie theater, and some people are being rude and kicking the chair in front of them or hogging the arm-rests bigtime(smokers who aren't courteous) and the people next to them(non-smokers) are being obnoxious back in an effort to make them leave, which isn't necessarily bad, because they are being obnoxious.

But when those same people sit down next to me, when half the theater is empty, and I'm minding my own business and not kicking any seats or hogging any armrests, and start to try and push me forcibly out of my comfy chair, it only makes sense to get pissed off and push back. Smoking is my comfy chair, and regardless of what other people do or don't do, I get really pissed off when people try to either push me out of that chair(intrusive government regulation) or try to make the movie tickets so expensive that I just stop watching movies in theatres altogether(massive tax hikes on smokes)

Fuck off and let me have my nice little isolated chair in the corner of the theatre, and stop trying to essentially give me the options of either my chair or my wallet. "We'll just make cigarettes so expensive that you can't afford them! Hahaha!" is not a sound tactic against a subset of people who already think you're an asshole for trying to tell them how to live, but on top of that it's a really big mistake to try and use the purse strings to negotiate with people addicted to a substance that makes heroine look like childs play. Even in the cusp of unemployment I was still smoking, I went down to one meal a day before I dropped smokes, and it was my fucking decision to do so, and I don't want anybody trying to tell me how to live when it isn't effecting others.

Honestly, I think a good portion of what makes me not try to quit again is just an act of spite towards all the people who want to use intrusive legislation to bully smokers into quitting instead of making the choice themselves. Fuck those people, they can all die in a fire.

edited 18th Aug '12 10:26:22 PM by Barkey

The AR-15 is responsible for 95% of all deaths each year. The rest of the deaths are from obesity and drone strikes.
 138 Greenmantle, Sun, 19th Aug '12 4:08:47 AM from Thornycroft-land Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Dodge-ing The Water
[up]

No product that also has applicable sales tax should have over 40 percent of the pre-sales cost be in taxes.. That's straight bullshit.

Then you won't like fuel prices in Britain — it's taxed, and has VAT placed on top of that — which means over 70% of the retail price of fuel is Tax*. It's the same approach they use with tabacco and alcohol.

...and yes, there are complaints about fuel prices from Haulage firms and Public Transport operators, and the Government has backed down from raising fuel taxes more than once, including this year.
"To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield" — Alfred, Lord Tennyson
 139 Deviant Braeburn, Sun, 19th Aug '12 4:15:03 AM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
[up]

High Taxes? Just do what we did, dress up like Native Americans and throw massive amounts of Tea into your local harbor.

Surely something positive must happen as a result.
Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

 140 Ira The Squire, Sun, 19th Aug '12 4:25:05 AM from No idea. Measuring speed
Phyrexian Dalek
I think, in context, the Tea needs to be changed to oil... tongue
Part of the reason for so many anti-smoking laws (particuarly in regard to advertising) is because the tobacco industry conspired for years to hide the health effects of their products, such as by funding research to "prove" smoking had negligible health risks. They basically did everything they could to hide the facts from people so they'd keep smoking, ignorant of the damage that was being done.

As for smoking bans, I'm happy so long as I don't have to inhale someone elses cigarette smoke.

 142 The Bat Pencil, Sun, 19th Aug '12 11:29:32 AM from Glasgow, Scotland Relationship Status: I'm just a hunk-a, hunk-a burnin' love
The best way to cut down on the damage done by smoking is to prevent young people from getting hooked in the first place (and that's who tobacco companies want to get hooked; lifelong customers and all that). Making it difficult to get access to the things in the first place is a pretty sound plan.

If that inconveniences current smokers then, well, tough titties. That's, like, of secondary significance at best. In terms of what's more important, limiting the opportunities for people to become addicted to smoking win out. I'd love to be able to sit outside on a warm day with a cold pint, but I know why I can't.

edited 19th Aug '12 12:13:49 PM by TheBatPencil

I couldn't possibly comment.
The lawsuits against tobacco companies only succeeded because of the decades of lying they did. I would also have liked the people in charge to have gone to jail for what they did but oh well. I'll take what I can get.

Also sin taxes are mostly just the same idea as "polluter pays". If the demographic of smokers costs the government money, levy a tax against the habit. In the ideal world, we'd only be smoking raw tobacco for peace treaties.

 144 Ira The Squire, Sun, 19th Aug '12 5:04:06 PM from No idea. Measuring speed
Phyrexian Dalek
I do wonder why governments do not legislate about what is placed in tobacco chews and cigarettes and other related products. It is, after all, something that gets ingested into the body. We have laws for food and drinks and medicine and even dietary supplements (the laws may be different, but they exist), so why not tobacco?
Mostly because proving things in science means little in politics.

 146 Ira The Squire, Mon, 20th Aug '12 2:05:39 AM from No idea. Measuring speed
Phyrexian Dalek
Well, the same can be said for food, drinks and medicines including supplements.
 147 Yuanchosaan, Mon, 20th Aug '12 2:10:32 AM from Australia Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, she is imaginary
antic disposition
@breadloaf: Some of the studies I mentioned suggest that plain packaging with a warning has a greater effect than simply making the warning larger. These are from clinical trials, though, as we don't have any real world evidence yet (Australia being the first country to implement this strategy).
"Doctor Who means never having to say you're kidding." - Bocaj
 148 Loni Jay, Mon, 20th Aug '12 4:05:50 AM from Australia Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
I'm generally in favour of the gruesome ads showing the health effects. I'd rather that a large group of people got grossed out every now and then, rather than a small group of people actually having to suffer through the disease in question.
Be not afraid...
 149 joeyjojo, Mon, 20th Aug '12 4:49:38 AM from The Magic Land Of Oz Relationship Status: Get out of here, STALKER
Storm the bastille!
Do they actually discourage smokers but?
Mn Hovercraft st plen de nguills

 150 Deviant Braeburn, Mon, 20th Aug '12 4:54:44 AM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
[up]

According to the CDC (Centers for Disease Control and Prevention) they do indeed. And more ads are on the way.

edited 20th Aug '12 4:55:08 AM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

Total posts: 431
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