TV Tropes Org

Forums

search forum titles
google site search
Wiki Headlines
We've switched servers and will be updating the old code over the next couple months, meaning that several things might break. Please report issues here.
Total posts: [44]
1
2

Should we have a namespace for real life people?:

 1 Dragon Quest Z, Tue, 4th Oct '11 12:25:35 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
Not sure if we have this thread already, but if not, we should consider this, since it would help make it clear on the links to them.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
 2 Fighteer, Tue, 4th Oct '11 1:20:51 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
Interestingly, we've been discussing this in the mod forum. We're considering taking Real People And Things and transferring them to the namespaces People and Organization. We looked at splitting them further along Creators lines, but it would be too much trouble.

 3 Dragon Quest Z, Tue, 4th Oct '11 1:29:53 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
I would say that we just need one namespace for people. Anything else can be covered by the indexes.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
 4 Fighteer, Tue, 4th Oct '11 1:30:55 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
We want everything that isn't a trope or index off of Main, and people and organizations are different things.

Options are basically as follows:

  • Creators/ for all actors, artists, producers, companies, networks, and the like. Problem: lumps in Real Life people who are not "creators", like our listing of U.S. presidents.
  • People/ for all people and Organization/ for all companies, networks, and related organizations.

edited 4th Oct '11 1:33:30 PM by Fighteer

 5 Dragon Quest Z, Tue, 4th Oct '11 1:57:17 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
I was thinking of something like RealPerson/ for any individual person, whether it be a creator, singer, producer, or Historical-Domain Character.

Then something like RealLifeOrganization/ for groups.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Cure Candy
[up] IMO the name spaces should be specific to the actual reason why the page was created.

Like namespace

If we just label it general Real Life thats just asking for it.

edited 4th Oct '11 2:04:58 PM by Raso

 7 Fighteer, Tue, 4th Oct '11 2:12:19 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
We're not talking about characters here, we're talking about real people — that's kind of implicit to the thread.

The problem with splitting the namespaces out into things like Voice Actor, Actor, Producer, Director, etc., is that many people cross over those roles, and it doesn't stop with just those few things — next we'll have Dictator, President, Janitor, Bellhop...

There is no need to be any more precise than is required to make sure that we don't have collisions between names. People would be reserved exclusively for Real Life people. The Joker could go under Characters or Comic Book or possibly the new Franchise namespace we're discussing elsewhere.

Cure Candy
Sorry I was just thinking a long the lines of all single person pages.
 9 Dragon Quest Z, Tue, 4th Oct '11 2:34:09 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
This is why I specifically wrote "real life people" in the OP.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Should we have a namespace for Stand Up Comedians? Many of them have their own pages with a list of tropes they use in their acts. I guess the namespace would be "Comedian/".

 11 Madrugada, Tue, 4th Oct '11 10:33:14 PM Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
We really aren't looking to make as many different namespaces as possible. We want namespaces that work as well as possible. Making a separate one for every type of performer would be incredibly confusing: Are Bill Cosby, Bob Newhart and Don Rickles Actors or Standup Comedians? Is Allan Sherman a Standup Comedian or a Musician? What about Bobcat Goldthwaite?

edited 4th Oct '11 10:34:08 PM by Madrugada

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
 12 Dragon Quest Z, Tue, 4th Oct '11 10:59:08 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
Just make a Stand Up Comics index for listing them. But as for the people, they would fall under this namespace.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
 13 Madrugada, Tue, 4th Oct '11 11:11:38 PM Relationship Status: In season
Zzzzzzzzzz
We already have an index for Recorded And Standup Comedy. It covers both the people and works.

edited 4th Oct '11 11:12:44 PM by Madrugada

...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
I like having Creators/ as the namespace, and treating Historical Domain Characters as tropes.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
 15 Dragon Quest Z, Wed, 5th Oct '11 12:30:28 AM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
1. Not every real person is a creator. That is why I'm suggesting something broader.

2. Specific people and characters are not tropes. They can be used as character types, but they are not tropes themselves.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
I think Historical-Domain Character is a trope, and specific Historical Domain Characters are subtropes of it.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
 17 Dragon Quest Z, Wed, 5th Oct '11 12:50:07 AM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
It doesn't matter if you think it. It doesn't work that way. A person cannot be a trope. Adolph Hitler is not a trope. Being a genocidal maniac would be a trope. A super racist would be a trope. A brutal dictator can be a trope. But Hitler himself is not a trope.

edited 5th Oct '11 12:51:11 AM by DragonQuestZ

I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
 18 Nohbody, Wed, 5th Oct '11 6:42:40 AM from Somewhere in Dixie Relationship Status: Mu
Just zis guy
I think just "People" and "Organization" namespaces would suffice. Breaking it down more finely than that is just asking for problems, as noted above. Besides, if Tropes Are Flexible it'd be a bit silly to say namespaces have to be very narrowly defined to a certain type of person/thing, I'd think. tongue

edited 5th Oct '11 6:44:09 AM by Nohbody

 19 Micah, Wed, 5th Oct '11 8:19:34 AM from the Midwest
I say people should be either creators or useful notes. That's the way page types work, and we might as well be consistent.
132 is the rudest number.
I'd support namespacing them to Creator/ and UsefulNote/.

 21 Dragon Quest Z, Wed, 5th Oct '11 10:52:37 AM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
People are more than creators of works. This is to set off all real life people.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Why would we want articles on people who aren't creators? I mean, we barely want articles about people who are creators.
Goal: Clear, Concise and Witty
 23 Fighteer, Wed, 5th Oct '11 11:30:47 AM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Geronimo!
As the ur-Lumper, Eddie, I expect you'd appreciate the value of a category that is sufficiently broad to encompass all possibilities. grin Just because we don't list all people everywhere doesn't mean we need to make the namespace overly restrictive.

I suppose there's a valid concern that a new troper, seeing a "People" namespace, would assume that any person goes in there, no matter their relevance to TV Tropes.

 24 Dragon Quest Z, Wed, 5th Oct '11 11:51:07 AM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
[up][up] We have pages for plenty of people involved in fiction in some form, whether in making them, or featured in them. The latter is at least relevant in that works directly show those people. Even the former can show up in works thanks to tropes like As Himself and Actor Allusion.

[up]Which is why I think RealPerson/ or RealPeople/ would be better, to make it clear this is not for characters (which is what Characters/ covers anyway).
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
 25 Vampire Buddha, Wed, 5th Oct '11 1:10:13 PM from Right behind you Relationship Status: Having tea with Cthulhu
Butterscotch Dinosaur Pussy
I think People/ and Organisation/ are perfectly fine and no more is needed.

Also, historical domain characters are indeed tropes. They are elements of storytelling and plot that a writer can use in a story. For example, Wolfenstein 3D has BJ assassinating Hitler. Therefore, the game contains an example of Adolf Hitler. Therefore, Adolf Hitler is indeed a trope.
Total posts: 44
1
2


TV Tropes by TV Tropes Foundation, LLC is licensed under a Creative Commons Attribution-NonCommercial-ShareAlike 3.0 Unported License.
Permissions beyond the scope of this license may be available from thestaff@tvtropes.org.
Privacy Policy