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Bitcoin and Digital Currencies:

 501 Tuefel Hunden IV, Tue, 11th Mar '14 6:24:06 PM from Wandering. Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Watchmen of the Apocalypse
Ouch. That is pretty damning on both counts.
"Who watches the watchmen?"
 502 Joesolo, Tue, 11th Mar '14 6:26:45 PM Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
for awhile I was considering putting a little money in it to try and mess around with investing but never got around to it. Glad I didn't now.
I am going to shove the sunshine so far up where the sun don't shine that you will vomit nothing but warm summer days -Belkar
 503 Silasw, Tue, 11th Mar '14 6:40:37 PM from The UNITED Kingdom Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Globalist Bunny
Can I just express my shock at the fact that Texas has a regulator that can tell oil companies what to do?
"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael

"If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran
 504 Joesolo, Tue, 11th Mar '14 7:13:51 PM Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
Indiana Solo
[up] wrong thread?
I am going to shove the sunshine so far up where the sun don't shine that you will vomit nothing but warm summer days -Belkar
 505 Silasw, Tue, 11th Mar '14 7:20:23 PM from The UNITED Kingdom Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Globalist Bunny
Nope, I was responding to the last post on the previous page ("Texas regulator orders oil company to stop accepting bitcoins."), though I admit to being slightly off topic...
"And the Bunny nails it!" ~ Gabrael

"If the UN can get through a day without everyone strangling everyone else so can we." ~ Cyran
 506 Deviant Braeburn, Fri, 14th Mar '14 12:24:39 PM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
Goldman Sachs: Bitcoin Is Not A Currency.

Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

 507 optimusjamie, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:13:56 PM from Mega-City One Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I've heard some people say that Bitcoin is a scam. How accurate is that?
 508 Le Garcon, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:16:14 PM from Skadovsk Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
From the looks of it? Very.

Millions worth are being stolen from all the bitcoin online banks or whatever the proper term is.

Oh really, when?
 509 Septimus Heap, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:19:21 PM from Zurich, Switzerland Relationship Status: Mu
A Wizard boy
I think that banks have considered this possibility already, but beyond supposition there is no clear evidence.

 510 Le Garcon, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:20:47 PM from Skadovsk Relationship Status: Gay for Big Boss
Blowout soon fellow Stalker
Well maybe it's not quite a scam per se but it's apparently hilariously easy to lose your money
Oh really, when?
 511 Sixthhokage1, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:22:38 PM from Fort Worth, TX Relationship Status: Hugging my pillow
Bitcoin itself is not a scam. A lot of the "financial services" type of businesses using it are very dodgy though. And it's a very risky form of investment.

edited 14th Mar '14 1:22:47 PM by Sixthhokage1

 512 Fighteer, Fri, 14th Mar '14 1:40:07 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
While it is not a scam per se, the fact of it being driven up by people who are clearly profit-taking on it does render it into something of an unstable commodity — that and the outright fraud and theft. If you buy in, do so as you would with any other extremely risky investment — don't bet with money you can't afford to lose. Especially don't jump in if you are just doing it because "woo Libertarian money!"

edited 14th Mar '14 1:50:18 PM by Fighteer

Ironically, the pursuit of the definition of happiness does not appear to be a happiness-maximizing behavior.
 513 Deviant Braeburn, Fri, 14th Mar '14 2:53:07 PM from Dysfunctional California
 514 Fighteer, Fri, 14th Mar '14 2:53:47 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
Compensation from whom? No government regulates or backs bitcoin; that's the whole point! I want to Face Palm at the hypocrisy of the lawsuit. If you invest in the ultimate free market libertarian currency, don't expect any government or bank to bail you out.

edited 14th Mar '14 2:55:14 PM by Fighteer

Ironically, the pursuit of the definition of happiness does not appear to be a happiness-maximizing behavior.
 515 Deviant Braeburn, Fri, 14th Mar '14 2:56:54 PM from Dysfunctional California
Wandering Jew
Compensation from whom?

From the owners of Mt.Gox (Mark Karpeles and Jed Mc Caleb).

EDIT: [down][nja]

edited 14th Mar '14 2:58:03 PM by DeviantBraeburn

Everything is Possible.

But some things are more Probable than others.
JEBAGEDDON 2016

 516 Achaemenid, Fri, 14th Mar '14 2:57:20 PM from Mitakihara Town, Copenhagen Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
[up][up]

Read the article.

The lawsuit targets Mt. Gox and its two owners, Mark Karpeles and Jed Mc Caleb, as well as a one of the largest banks in Japan, according to a notice of action to Ontario Superior Court...The Canadian action also names Mizuho Bank on the grounds that the Japanese financial institution held an account with non-bitcoin currency that was transferred from the personal bank accounts of users to the Mt. Gox exchange.

They're suing the people they feel are responsible. I doubt they expect full restitution because I doubt Karpeles and Gox have the cash, but if you start your bargaining position high...

edited 14th Mar '14 2:57:31 PM by Achaemenid

Sie gönnen mir nicht Schleisien und die Grafschatz Glatz,

Und die hundert Millionen in meinem Schatz!
 517 Fighteer, Fri, 14th Mar '14 3:01:07 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
That makes slightly more sense, and I hope they win that case, but I doubt the cash exists to pay out more than a fraction of the claim.
Ironically, the pursuit of the definition of happiness does not appear to be a happiness-maximizing behavior.
 518 Kostya, Fri, 14th Mar '14 3:05:18 PM from Everywhere
The Razruchityel
Isn't Mt. Gox bankrupt? How do they expect the people to pay them the money?

 519 Achaemenid, Fri, 14th Mar '14 3:10:53 PM from Mitakihara Town, Copenhagen Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
[up]

Bankruptcy doesn't mean "I have no money at all", it means "my obligations exceed my assets". Let's say you lend me $1000 and I only have $700. I file for bankruptcy, and you get the $700. I didn't have no money to give you, I just didn't have enough to meet my obligation to repay your $1000.

What the Canadians are doing is calling in the obligation Mt Gox owes them in the most aggressive manner possible, probably hoping to grab their pile of Gox's cash before it's other creditors and also to get Karpeles' personal assets as well, rather than just Gox's company assets. I doubt they expect full restitution, and, to me, this looks a bit like throwing good money after bad, but they might just manage to get a few cents on the dollar, which, if it exceeds their legal costs, is at least something, even if it doesn't cover their loss.
Sie gönnen mir nicht Schleisien und die Grafschatz Glatz,

Und die hundert Millionen in meinem Schatz!
 520 Bonsai Forest, Fri, 14th Mar '14 3:53:27 PM from anywhere it rains
This tiny forest is where all the action is!
Now, is bankruptcy split up by percentage of money owed?

Like if I owe two people $10, 000, but $10, 000 is all I have, they get $5, 000 each?

If that's the case, could this mean that each Mt. Gox customer will get a certain percent of the money they put in there? Otherwise, will we each get a flat amount of money back?
 521 Fighteer, Fri, 14th Mar '14 3:57:17 PM from the Time Vortex Relationship Status: Dancing with Captain Jack Harkness
In most bankruptcies, claims are tallied and then assigned priorities. The total amount of funds available to pay out is then allocated according to those priorities. This means that some claimants may get 100% of their money while others get nothing, or a tiny fraction. It's all very complex and earns lots of money for lawyers. Who, of course, get first claim.

edited 14th Mar '14 4:44:58 PM by Fighteer

Ironically, the pursuit of the definition of happiness does not appear to be a happiness-maximizing behavior.
 522 Ira The Squire, Sat, 15th Mar '14 1:09:20 AM from No idea. Measuring speed
Phyrexian Dalek
I found this part interesting:

“We’re never going to find out what’s going on unless we start a lawsuit because it’s the only way we’re going to get access to the records, ” Charney said in an interview.

“It’s really the only way to get the thing going.”

I think a rat has been smelt.
 523 SKJAM, Sat, 15th Mar '14 8:31:04 AM from Minneapolis Relationship Status: Cast away
Great and Powerful
Government usually gets the first grab in bankruptcies, followed by secured debt, and then everyone else. (Secured debt is where you have put up collateral, like your house or car.) Student loans are non-dischargable, meaning you have to pay 100% regardless.
 524 Achaemenid, Sat, 15th Mar '14 10:55:03 AM from Mitakihara Town, Copenhagen Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
It's all very complex and earns lots of money for lawyers. Who, of course, get first claim.

Of course they do, otherwise no-one would practice insolvency law. Why act for someone with no money?
Sie gönnen mir nicht Schleisien und die Grafschatz Glatz,

Und die hundert Millionen in meinem Schatz!
 525 Ogodei, Sat, 15th Mar '14 3:52:29 PM from stalking Sakaki
go on, pet him
It's fair enough to an extent. The lawyers get a cut in exchange for making sure that the disbursement is orderly. If you go without lawyers (that is, never declare bankruptcy and deal with your creditors piecemeal), it's likely to be a lose-lose situation: the debtor will not pay as much, but go through the rest of their existence hounded by creditors. Meanwhile, what the creditors can get from the debtors, even in the long run, could be a giant runaround, a bunch of red-tape, and/or a tiny trickle of payments, less than if they had paid an attorney's office to get a bigger share quickly and relatively painlessly.

While this definitely encourages lawyers to exploit people in a bad situation to get them to come to the conclusion that they want, it's still better than the alternative.

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