This thread exists to discuss British politics.
Political issues related to Northern Ireland and the Crown Dependencies (the Channel Islands and the Isle of Man) are also considered on-topic here if there's no more appropriate OTC thread for them.
If you're new to OTC, it's worth reading the Introduction to On-Topic Conversations
and the On-Topic Conversations debate guidelines before posting here.
As with other OTC threads, off-topic posts may be thumped or edited by the moderators.
- There is a dedicated thread to discuss LGBTQ+ rights in the United Kingdom. That doesn't mean it's always off-topic here, but unless something's directly linked to political events, that's probably a better thread for it.
- There's also a separate thread to talk about your favourite British Prime Ministers.
Recent political stuff:
- The vote to see if Britain should adopt Alternative Voting has failed.
- Lib Dems lose lots of councils and councillors, whilst Labour make the majority of the gains in England.
- The Scottish National Party do really well in the elections.
A link to the BBC politics page containing relevant information.
Edited by Mrph1 on Nov 3rd 2023 at 11:15:30 AM
So that's what this does
![[up]](https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/smiles/arrow_up.png "[up]"){kind=icon}
But not as I do.
V
Quite, especially in later years* ...
edited 8th May '11 2:40:23 PM by Greenmantle
Keep Rolling On
So that's what this does
I am actually quite hopeful that the AV failure will save the NHS now. The Lib Dems have been a moderating influence on the Tories (I doubt paying apprentices real money as opposed to £10+dole was ever a Tory policy) but not nearly enough. Now they have something to prove so it's looking like they may step things up a notch.
House Lewis: Sanity is Relative
Ha ha, my mum - who worked at the time for an agency connected to the health service - accidentally left a laptop with public data in her hotel room! Thankfully, she was able to retrieve it before anyone found out....
My name is Addy. Please call me that instead of my username.
Pro-Freedom Fanatic
Fascist, but Inefficient is a very lame excuse. Nothing bars them from becoming more competent. And Gods help the poor sods who do get caught breaking the absurd restrictions authoritarian governments impose on the populace.
edited 8th May '11 3:55:39 PM by SavageHeathen
You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it.
The Paedofinder General
Being British prevents them from becoming more competent, it's built in like irony and self deprecation.
@Michael
They'll have to do something like be more visibly against Tory policies to distance themselves, especially after the council election losses.
edited 8th May '11 6:28:21 PM by IanExMachina
By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
I'm not really on good terms with Blair and his government being well-remembered if it weren't for Iraq, though I understand the (connotations of) progress re: Northern Ireland. When I said that Labour were Tory-lite post-John Smith (some... "hardliners" would place the barrier a little earlier though) I pretty much do mean it, echoing about a million others before me, granted. I mean, part of the reason that the Tories were plain bad opposition for most of the early 2000s was that they pretty much agreed, to certain degrees, with everything Labour had done. For what they supposedly planned, possibly a slightly different story.
What Blair personally did do for Labour was enhance their image through a string of measures, again siding with the self-aware stuck new middle-classers* ... and building the "who-cares-they're-both-the-same" thing we essentially have now. I mean, who even remembers "donkey jacket" Michael Foot or "crisis what crisis" James Callaghan anymore? Not counting Tories who seem to consider Foot in particular as a "closet commie". Not many in putting together a look at Labour. It was successful, no doubt in that, and they ran with it because it felt good.
Of course, what we do tend to remember are things like that segment Mandelson and Osborne did prior to the election where they "criticised" each other as if they were long-lost friends at a high school reunion.
Brown: I think a non-serious comment I read online sums it up - he could've been the perfect prime minister in 1910. It seemed destined to end with facepalmery combined with the above stuff.
FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!
Actually, I think all European peoples have both of those as very defining characteristics of their humour (and thus communication in a more general way, too).
Well, there's one exception: while the French do understand irony, I've never heard of French self-deprecation.
Quod gratis asseritur, gratis negatur.
The Paedofinder General
I agree, however I was playing up to the stereotype of British people acting this way.
I do feel that Europeans humour when it can be translated (not requiring specific cases or words) often gels slightly better than what I've seen of US humour.
By the powers invested in me by tabloid-reading imbeciles, I pronounce you guilty of paedophilia!
So that's what this does
Because if they'd formed a coalition with Labour it would be endorsing all the crap that got Labour kicked out.
As opposed to endorsing the far worse alternative policies Conservatives were proposing at that time? I fail to see the rationality here.
Pro-Freedom Fanatic
No. They might have endorsed labour on the condition that the authoritarian crap would get rolled back and there would be no more illegal wars and no more human rights violations (not at home, not abroad) in the name of fighting terrorism.
Labour economic policy is less evil than Tory economic policy. And the Lib Dems are only good on social issues. I'm sure most of the backing of the Lib Dems comes from socially liberal folks.
edited 9th May '11 5:57:52 AM by SavageHeathen
You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it.
If you're saying the LDs are rightward from Labor on the economy, I'd like to see proof dating from prior to this coalition.
Pro-Freedom Fanatic
I'm not sure which one is more rightward on the economy. On social issues, it doesn't get much more authoritarian than New Labor without being an actual fascist party with blackshirts'n'all.
edited 9th May '11 9:08:21 AM by SavageHeathen
You exist because we allow it and you will end because we demand it.
Sneering Imperialist
Labour, guys. You can't apply Yankee spellings to proper names. 
So that's what this does
If the Lib Dems had sided with Labour, first off they would still have needed another three parties to throw in with them to produce a coalition with a majority of 1. Secondly, promises to dial back the fascism wouldn't have been honoured. We would all be carrying ID cards, more and more of us every day would be required to be DNA fingerprinted for random reasons and the unaccountable body that decided to stop people working if they liked films they disapproved of would still be in place.
There will come a time when we need to roll back the Tories' damage too, but for now they're doing less damage than Labour would have done.
From The Other Wiki: Conservative Party (306,) Liberal Democrats (57,) Labour Party (258.) 258+57=315, 315>306.
Am I missing something here? The Tories are rightward of them both on basically every issue, I fail to see the proof in the proverbial pudding for this coalition.
Nemesis
@Eric DVH: from that very same page, you need to have 326 seats to have a majority. Labour would have had to get the support of smaller parties as well, many of whom were not willing to deal.
A brighter future for a darker age.
vigilantly taxonomish
Ooookay. If you say so.
Try telling the CIA that...
Welcome To TV Tropes | How To Write An Example | Text-Formatting Rules | List Of Shows That Need Summary | TV Tropes Forum | Know The Staff
Nemesis
"Fascist", these days, is an empty political slur best avoided for reasoned discourse.
A brighter future for a darker age.
V
As is, increasingly "left-wing" and "right-wing"...
...and on the subject of "Fascism" and the "Right", I read an interesting article in The Spectator about the BNP. In the end, in felt like to me that the BNP didn't want to get in power (probably because it's all too much hard work), and there is fractionalism within the BNP...
And anyway, us British are a moderate people and getting more moderate, on the whole.
Keep Rolling On
Factionalism, yes, but I think the fundamental reason the BNP has failed was because no matter how hard they try, their leadership can't avoid looking like a bunch of plank-thick retired skinheads, largely because most of them are. "Respectable" people, even rather racist ones, are scared off.
Plus FPTP, which is always a massive barrier for small parties (which can be a good thing, as in this case).
"Well, it's a lifestyle"
vigilantly taxonomish
Which surely raises the question of why Nick Griffin was so strongly opposed to AV...
Welcome To TV Tropes | How To Write An Example | Text-Formatting Rules | List Of Shows That Need Summary | TV Tropes Forum | Know The Staff
V
It's the BNP, they're the last to care if their policies actually make sense...
edited 9th May '11 12:20:19 PM by Greenmantle
Keep Rolling On