Man of Steel. Nolan Superman Reboot.:

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Respect the Red Right Hand
"Well if Myx can do pretty much anything why doesn't he just kill Superman?"
Psychological fixations can handwave that. That's why Joker couldn't keep Batman dead, and Beyonder!Doom couldn't permanently kill the Marvel Heroes.
477 kalel948th Dec 2012 03:14:31 PM from Dragonstone
Rascal King
[up] Ignoring all other problems, the reason he wouldn't work is because general audiences want more serious superhero films, not action-comedies with imps from the fifth dimension who can't say their own names backwards.
The last hurrah? Nah, I'd do it again.
Raven Wilder
Y'know, historically, children have been the target audience for Superman comics, so why does the idea of a Superman movie targetted at children seem so anathema to people?
"It takes an idiot to do cool things, that's why it's cool" - Haruhara Haruko
[up] Because Hollywood has found a great deal of success in trying to market their superheroes to a more adult audience. Even if children make up a good portion of the audience (as the prevalence of toylines can attest) I can't think of any superhero film in recent memory I'd qualify as a "kid's movie".

In fact I know there was an interview where they said the thing that killed WB's planned Shazam movie was the success of stuff like Iron Man and The Dark Knight in the wake of Speed Racer's failure.

edited 8th Dec '12 5:12:55 PM by comicwriter

I need a drink
Which is ludicrous when you think about it. The two aren't even related. Had they gone through with it they very well could've rejuvenated to character.

Theres sex and death and human grime in monochrome for one thin dime and at least the trains all run on time but they dont go anywhere.
[up] Oh I certainly agree with you. I don't necessarily agree with the studio explanation behind the apparent need to make every superhero movie "mature", but that was at least the popular reasoning used.
They were planning a Shazam movie?! sad

It's actually a good point (about making a kids' movie). Most years, kids' movies are among the highest-grossing films made, because kids like going to movies. (Also, adults can go to movies on their own, but kids generally go with parents, so you're increasing ticket sales just by that.) Some kids' superhero movies wouldn't be a bad idea, and it would remove some of the requirements around 'realism' and explaining everything.

edited 8th Dec '12 7:00:23 PM by WarriorEowyn

[up][up] They had a script commissioned (it might even be online), a director lined up, and Dwayne Johnson was in talks to play the villain, I think. And then it all just fell apart after Iron Man and The Dark Knight came out. Which is probably why you saw Green Lantern try (and fail) so hard to ape Iron Man's formula.
485 maxwellelvis8th Dec 2012 07:32:53 PM from undisclosed location , Relationship Status: In my bunk
Mad Scientist Wannabe
[up]That's the problem with the Big Red Cheese, he's unabashedly kid-friendly; heck, he inhabits the body of a ten-year-old boy, for Pete's sake. You just can't make "Holy Moly" into a trailer tagline.

Conversely, I think that's why all the stuff DC does with the Marvels is so universally hated, because we like that kid-friendly quality about them, and DC keeps killing it, squeezing the life and fun out of it.
Of course, don't you know anything about ALCHEMY?!- Twin clones of Ivan the Great
486 TechPowah8th Dec 2012 09:45:46 PM from the room down the hall , Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
Just a simple hero
A Shazam movie would rock so much! However, I can't think of anyone to play Billy or Captain Marvel. Still, though, we could've had a Shazam movie!
The New Age of Awesome is here! Not even the sky is the limit!
Regarding Mxyzptlk—wouldn't his portrayal in Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow? fit a "more serious" film setting? He could even start off misleadingly comical, then get pissed at the Man of Steel and shed his humanoid form and turn the movie into a surreal mind screw.
I need a drink
Or you could have him be a little more "off" from the outset. Same could be done with Bizarro. I mean, imagine someone as powerful with the same conviction but lacking the mental faculties. If anything it would make him something of a tragic anti villain because all he wants to do is help, he just doesn't understand how to do so.
Theres sex and death and human grime in monochrome for one thin dime and at least the trains all run on time but they dont go anywhere.
Part of the problem with Mxy is that, like plots using Luther, you are making a movie about Superman that makes Superman's powers basically irrelevant. Sure, there's more to a good Superman movie than actions sequences and battle scenes, but its nice if you can have *some* of them.

There's also that Mxy has no actual connection to Superman besides simple history. Sure, he's a long time Superman rogue, but there's no reason he *should* be a Superman rogue. In many ways he's the rogues gallery equivalent of a Giant Space Flea from Nowhere. Whereas Luther is the "evil king" of Superman's home city and ideological opposite; Zod is an evil survivor from his home planet; Bizarro is a clone of Superman; Metallo is a weapon created to kill Superman using Superman's specific weakness. Ties don't have to be literal, they can be thematic, granted. However, the only possible such tie here would be "godlike being, except using his powers for irresponsible whim rather than the benefit of others." And given Mxy is so completely different in both type and scale of power than Superman, this just doesn't produce much resonance.
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490 Nightwire9th Dec 2012 09:18:24 AM , Relationship Status: I'm just a poor boy, nobody loves me
Humans inferior. Ultron superior.
It still looks stupid, but I can understand ditching the red undies. But why the S curl too? What are they thinking?
Bite my shiny Vibranium ass, Avengers.
491 TobiasDrake9th Dec 2012 09:39:07 AM from Colorado, USA , Relationship Status: She's holding a very large knife
Always watching, never seen
There's a fundamental difference between "kid's movie" and "family-friendly". Spy Kids is a kids' movie. The Incredibles is family-friendly.

Shazam probably can't ever be a gritty, serious, hardcore film ala the Dark Knight...but it really shouldn't be. That doesn't mean it has to be a kids' movie either; by shooting for that family-friendly line, where it's well-written enough for the adults while still being a lot of exciting fun for the kids, it could be a very successful film.

For Superman, Mxy is just too...silly. He really is. It's hard to even do family-friendly with a character like Mxy, because he's just so ridiculous, and ridiculously silly doesn't sell well with superheroes anymore. Batman and Robin learned that the hard way.
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492 johnnyfog9th Dec 2012 10:29:31 AM from the Zocalo , Relationship Status: They can't hide forever. We've got satellites.
Actual Wrestling Legend
The s-curl I can live without. I'm supposed to believe that Clark wears hammerspace boots and a cape beneath his business wear, and he also goes to the trouble of sculpting an "s" in his hair when he transforms.
I'm a skeptical squirrel
You could do Mxyzptlk as some sort of D'jinn, which isn't that far out when you consider, in post Crisis DC, D'jinns are actually supposed to be 5D Imps. Think of a Wishmaster with larger than life Joker tendencies. The real problem is you can't do him in a movie after you have established Superman enough in a line of movies to make people accepting of all kinds of enemies, even supernatural ones.

You really don't need the name backwards thing, although you could throw a fanservice bone for geeks by making him jokingly mention it at some point, just to add "Nahhhh! Who would ever buy something like that?" a la 'Yellow spandex' gag in the first X-Men.

edited 9th Dec '12 12:48:02 PM by NapoleonDeCheese

Raven Wilder
[up][up][up] Rise of the Guardians is a family-friendly film, and it's got Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy, and the Easter Bunny teaming up to fight the Boogeyman. If audiences can handle that, they can handle Mxy.

Though I do agree that Mxy is not a villain you should start off with. The basic idea behind him is that he's as unimaginably superior to Superman as Superman is to everyone else, putting Supes in the position Lex Luthor usually is. That's good for some fun stuff, but only after Superman has been firmly established in his role, otherwise the reversal of fortune doesn't carry the proper impact.
"It takes an idiot to do cool things, that's why it's cool" - Haruhara Haruko
495 Prowler9th Dec 2012 01:13:20 PM , Relationship Status: On the prowl
Caw! Caw!
[up] Apparently, they can't, since that film was something of a dud at the box office.

And comparing that to a Superman film is apples and oranges.

edited 9th Dec '12 1:14:05 PM by Prowler

496 Canid1179th Dec 2012 01:46:32 PM , Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
So back to the Giant Spider I personally want them to save it for the Justice League movie so that when the doors start opening Batman can walk over to a terminal by said doors, push a button and halfway through the doors close back up.
"War without fire is like sausages without mustard." - Jean Juvénal des Ursins
I didn't mind them ditching the spitcurl. It's a minor cosmetic thing that serves to make the character look less like a relic, so I really can't say I'm too broken up about it.

For the life of me, I can never understand why Wonder Woman and Superman fans are so adamant that no changes be made to their designs. It happens for literally every other superhero property who gets brought into live-action so the controversy genuinely baffles me.
Respect the Red Right Hand
[up] Well, most of them have had minor to major changes in the past- Hell, Batman's costume tended to change from artist to artist for a while- whereas Superman and Wonder Woman have had the same costumes since the 30's/40's respectively, barring the 90's.
It wouldn't be too hard to portray Mxy as a malevolent trickster with otherworldly abilities while not making him too off-the-wall - it's all in the characterization. You wouldn't even have to make him darker or edgier, or maybe not even necessarily less humorous. Just don't make him or his presence quite as zany in terms of the way he works - if you want to keep a more "serious". Play him as a superpowerful being testing Supes for his own amusement, who then turns nasty when Superman starts beating him. Have his joking behavior be quite clearly a form of mocking and condescension.

It's always bothered me how people equate unorthodox to "silly," and then go from "silly" to "unworkable."

It would, however, require writing a movie where the villain is pretty much totally separate from the rest of continuity - Mxy would be really hard to introduce while tying to the universe as it exists, even if you weren't going by a film continuity or not (This is actually the biggest thing going against him for being a main villain): Mxy by nature comes out of nowhere and goes back just as suddenly, often without far reaching consequences after he's gone. He has no inherent ties to Superman's mythos, and is from a realm totally separate from Supes or his aspirations. It kind of works against him terms of "film Big Bad" status, because it comes with a lot of Fridge Logic.

Also, being tricked back to his realm by saying his own name backwards isn't really a bad trigger for defeat, but for a feature length film it feels a bit to... simple. Like it would make the end of the climax far too abrupt. It definitely works better for something shorter, where Mxy can reappear in short order, but a film would require something a bit different. Then again, he's had several other triggers in his long existence (IIRC saying his own name backwards was a rule he decided to adopt after being prompted, the main reason he kept with it so long was because he didn't like lying (or something), and he could change it if he was really inclined to do so).

edited 9th Dec '12 3:05:19 PM by KnownUnknown

"The difference between reality and fiction is that fiction has to make sense."
- Tom Clancy, paraphrasing Mark Twain.
Respect the Red Right Hand
The key to making Mxy work, would be to take a cue, if you will, from Star Trek The Next Generation. Specifically, take THE Q.tongue But seriously, TNG pretty much had a character much like Mxy that worked in a serious dramatic setting. If they took a few pointers from how TNG handled Q, they'd pretty much be golden.

edited 9th Dec '12 3:38:48 PM by Ronnie

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