Soft split: Cats Are Mean

Based on this tangent in another thread, I think it might be an idea to soft split Cats Are Mean, between that which plays it straight and that which inverts or subverts it.

For one thing, the former examples list for Cats Are Good wouldn't go to waste, and for another, the examples playing it straight and the examples subverting or inverting it wouldn't be in the same list; they would be in distinct, separate lists, making it easier to look through a list of examples sharing a similar approach. (As opposed to looking through the current list and seeing played straight, subverted, played straight, inverted, etc... though so far I haven't looked into much other than the real life section.)

1. Most of the examples of Cats Are Good were not inversions, but Aversions. Aversions are not worth listing unless they are notable (which usually makes them subversions) or the trope is Omnipresent (which it is not). See Aversion.
2. Inversions are not more interesting to list, as inversions and aversions in this case are the exact same thing (Cat is not evil).
3. Only type of inversions that are specifically different from Aversions are those where a Cat is good and a dog is evil (as the article lists the cat/dog dichotomy). You'd need to show there's enough examples of that to warrant a soft split.
4. We don't generally soft split subversions unless there's a specific way of subverting the trope that is so common, it's become it's own mini trope.

Edit: Went and removed the aversions from the page. Alot were just natter, and as mentioned, these should generally not be listed.

edited 1st Apr '11 9:31:45 AM by Ghilz

What about Oliver And Company, then? See the YMMV section of that movie for why Oliver the cat might qualify as a notable inversion. (See Anti-Hero, Crowning Moment Of Awesome, Crowning Moment Of Heartwarming, and The Woobie in particular.)

edited 1st Apr '11 11:18:59 AM by neoYTPism

Doesn't make him a notable aversion, just makes him an aversion. Non-evil cats aren't rare, which is why we do not list aversions to begin with.

And Oliver And Company is a particularly bad example as one's species here is generally not an indication of their goodness/badness.

Except that, as pointed out on that page, most of the dogs in that movie are morally ambiguous in their own ways. Oliver has, at worst, the problem of associating with them, but other than that is probably one of the most innocent characters in the movie.

Doesn't matter. Cats Are Mean is only tropable because it has become a convention that making a character a cat is a visual cue that that character is evil, the same way you would slap a black cape on a character to indicate that that character is villainous. Characters do exist with black capes that are good, but it hasn't become a convention so much that placing a black cape on a character is an indicator of their goodness.

... Do we have a trope for villainous black cape?

If being a cat was a visual cue of evil, why isn't it on the Obviously Evil index?

I am guessing that is what Ominous Opera Cape is for, but perhaps there is another trope about it.

edited 1st Apr '11 6:50:01 PM by neoYTPism

^^ Black Cloak. Also the staple of the Dastardly Whiplash. Also discussed under Good Colors, Evil Colors.

Coz no one added it yet?

And yet, all those OTHER tropes got added to it.

In any case, the notion that cats are evil is one thing, but is it really so prevalent that being a cat is a sign the character is evil by default?

Right-Hand Cat

It's not "by default" but it's prevalent enough to be a trope.

Do you think that Good Cat is tropeable?

If not, is Cats Are Mean soft-splitable?

edited 6th Apr '11 12:42:59 AM by EdnaWalker

If by Good Cat, you mean Cats Are Good, but under a different name then probably not.

But what if I meant Good Cat differently from that, zerky? Like, if it were an atual characterization device trope rather than merely the aversions of Cats Are Mean that Cats Are Good was.

neoYTPism, how are we going to soft-split between played straight Cats Are Mean examples and Cats Are Mean inversions, subversions, and aversions?

edited 1st May '11 7:27:17 PM by EdnaWalker

If you mean something other than Cats Are Good, it would help if you elaborated on what that something is.

edited 1st May '11 9:29:08 PM by bluepenguin

There are obvious inversions like Oliver And Company, where Oliver the cat is much kinder than the dogs and most of the human characters; if anything, Oliver is probably the kindest character except maybe Jenny. Another would be Calvin And Hobbes, wherein of the two main characters the feline one is significantly morally better. (Hobbes calling Calvin out on misdeeds for instance.)

I was suggesting gathering examples like that and putting them in a section separate from the played-straight examples.

edited 2nd May '11 9:34:06 AM by neoYTPism

I'm going with your suggestion, neoYPTism.

Here are some more inversions:

Literature

• Inversion: In R.A. Salvatore's Drizzt books, the heroic magical panther Guenhyvar is often seen fighting large and nasty canine monsters.

Western Animation

• Subverted to Hell and back by Chuck Jones in "Fresh Airedale", where a duplicitous weasel of a dog is treated like a hero while the heroic cat gets no respect - and "Chow Hound", where an enslaved cat is used by a big hulking dog to get a steady supply of meat (in this one, revenge is brutal and sweet).
• An early exception to this comes from the Looney Tunes short "We, The Animals... Squeak!", where the mouser cat is the good guy, and the mice are scheming mobsters who blackmail her into letting them have the run of the house by holding her son captive.

edited 2nd May '11 1:42:48 AM by EdnaWalker

Do you approve of me soft splitting inverted, subverted, and averted examples and played straight examples?

I made a Subversions, Inversions, and Aversions category and moved a few subversions and inversions to there.

That's good enough. Sometimes which of the three an example is would be ambiguous anyway.

This way we also cut down on the number of Cats Are Kind type YKTTW pages that keep coming up every now and then. (Well, except among those who fail to notice the soft split on Cats Are Mean, but that is to be expected.)

EDIT: I also renamed the main example section to "played-straight or exaggerated examples" and am wondering if "justified" or "double-subverted" should be mentioned as well.

edited 4th May '11 2:32:27 PM by neoYTPism

Disapprove of listing aversions here. Aversions are not notable and we don't need to have them.

Subversions and inversions, then. And besides, they are in the same category anyway... well, for now at least.

Except that all of the listed examples are Not A Subversion. They're aversions mislabeled as subversions.