Could we at least tweak this?: Take A Bite Out Of Crime

Total posts: [21]
1 DragonQuestZ12th Mar 2011 02:54:26 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
The name makes it seem as though it's specifically about bad guys (whether it's figurative or literal biting), but it's about biting as an attack, which is not what the old PSA Catch Phrase was about.

Heck, the trope even implies this is limited to humans, or at least species where biting is not a typical attack, and the name comes from a dog (albeit an anthropomorphic one), a species that bite as their primary attack.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
"Strangely, despite the savage nature of the attack, there are far more heroic examples than villainous, hence the trope name."

There's only two bad-guy examples on the whole list (so far). You really do see it more with heroes.

The name is just a pun. I doubt anyone would really think the trope was about Mac Gruff.
3 DragonQuestZ12th Mar 2011 03:32:51 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
You doubt anyone would? Those that even get the reference would think of those PSAs more than literal biting.

Plus just because there are currently more heroes as examples doesn't make the name fit.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
Dragon Writer
I also complained that the title is in no way related to the old PSA Catch Phrase.
[up][up] Yes...yes, it does. It's mostly bad guys, like criminals, getting bitten, so take a bite out of crime. Because they're criminals. Getting bites taken out of them.

It's not that complicated.
6 Camacan12th Mar 2011 05:07:58 PM from Australiatown
This one's plucky police dogs like Inspector Rex? Nope. Huh.

There's no reason to limit the bitee to criminals. Not all bad guys are criminals in the police show style. Not all bitees are bad guys, good guys get bit too. The trope is more useful if it is just someone chomping on the enemy in desperation or craziness. And that's how the page is currently written. I'd add cold-blooded utility, too: it's just the kind of thing a Combat Pragmatist would do to win.

Only 7 wicks I notice.

edited 12th Mar '11 5:12:19 PM by Camacan

I don't think the Trope Namer ever used the trope. And the trope doesn't apply to races like dogs (or vampires, etc.) that would normally use biting as an attack, so that's another strike against it. And the Trope Namer is closely associated with completely different tropes, so there's strike three. And the name sounds like the trope has to do with crime-fighting, which is yet another big strike against the title.

Whoever thought this was a good title did not understand why puns are clever. This is just horrible.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
Am I the only person here who actually read the trope description? It doesn't say anything about being limited to good guys, only that there are more examples of heroic biting than villainous biting, which there are. And it does include a link to The Combat Pragmatist.

edited 12th Mar '11 5:22:27 PM by SleetWintergreen

9 DragonQuestZ12th Mar 2011 05:27:24 PM from Somewhere in California
The Other Troper
[up]Descriptions are not defenses for names. Years of bad names causing misuse, despite clearly written pages, show that.
I'm on the internet. My arguments are invalid.
10 MousaThe1412th Mar 2011 05:41:24 PM from Northern Virginia , Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
Oh hey, I saw this in YKTTW not to long ago, I was hoping it'd be launched.

I mean gotta love that na-

What was that? Whaddaya mean the name is no good? It's frikkin' hilarious!

Fine... Perhaps we can make a redirect or something, this is too pleasant to change.


There was a PSA that used that phrase? I thought it was just a generic statement!

Dear god, I'm young...
11 Camacan12th Mar 2011 06:19:32 PM from Australiatown
[up][up][up] Is anyone is proposing to limit the trope to good guys? I don't see that. The current title strongly implies the trope is limited to the biting of a specific bad guy sub-type: criminals. This is not accurate to the trope as written and changing the trope to match the title seems to be an unhelpful idea. The trope is inclusive and this is good. The title is not and that isn't so good.

[up] Tropey the Wonder Dog is also a funny title. But that's not a good argument for using it as the title for Cool Boat. Titles need to fit with the trope in question. This one does not.

edited 12th Mar '11 6:27:16 PM by Camacan

Dragon Writer
The Trope Namer's mascot is a dog, which is why the name worked ... for the Trope Namer.

edited 12th Mar '11 6:36:59 PM by Stratadrake

Tropey The Wonder Dog is also a funny title. But that's not a good argument for using it as the title for Cool Boat. Titles need to fit with the trope in question. This one does not.

Mousa 14's experience suggests it only doesn't work if you do get the reference. If you don't get the reference, it works perfectly, because you don't have the connotations the reference provides.

Which still isn't a good defense for the name, I know, but still.
[up] I don't think so, because there's still a misleading reference to crime in there.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
15 Camacan15th Mar 2011 10:08:09 PM from Australiatown
That's right — it's not just that it requires a non-universal reference to make sense, it's misleading without the reference.

Here's a crowner.

edited 15th Mar '11 10:17:37 PM by Camacan

16 Camacan2nd Apr 2011 07:26:54 PM from Australiatown
Crowner isn't getting more votes but we've got 7 to 2 for a rename. It bothers me that we've got votes against the rename when it is misleading — and we've got nothing to dispute that.

Some rename suggestions:

EDIT — I see we have a work stub at the last one.

edited 2nd Apr '11 7:53:17 PM by Camacan

Bumping for name suggestions.
Rhymes with "Protracted."
18 shimaspawn25th Jul 2011 06:23:35 PM from Here and Now , Relationship Status: In your bunk
Rename won at a 3:1 ratio. Hooking alt names crowner.
Reality is that, which when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away.

-Philip K. Dick
19 Camacan31st Jul 2011 11:25:47 PM from Australiatown
Alt-crowner has been running for a week and stabilized at +5 for Man Bites Man fairly early on. The next one is a +2. Propose to rename to Man Bites Man in a day baring objections.

edited 31st Jul '11 11:26:09 PM by Camacan

20 Madrugada1st Aug 2011 07:14:22 AM , Relationship Status: In season
no objection here.
...if you don’t love you’re dead, and if you do, they’ll kill you for it.
21 Camacan1st Aug 2011 10:15:24 PM from Australiatown
Renamed to Man Bites Man. No sub-pages, no pre-existing discussion. Wicks fixed. I figured we can do with just the one real-world mutilation news story. Also reworked the main text, moving some material to a Useful Note: distracting real-world info-nibbles such as infection risks are typically absent from fiction and a bite can be as powerful as it needs to be for the plot.

Didn't end up using the phrase "Om, nom nom nom" even once.
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Alternative Titles: Take A Bite Out Of Crime
25th Jul '11 6:22:40 PM
Vote up names you like, vote down names you don't. Whether or not the title will actually be changed is determined with a different kind of crowner (the Single Proposition crowner). This one just collects and ranks alternative titles.
At issue:

Total posts: 21