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Code Geass:

Will kill you
@Ambar

I never tried to bait you into a debate. I'm merely pointing out things from Code Geass which I noticed had an akin story and elements which came across as attention grabbing. The romance and overarching number of love interests for the char and females made it seem very SEED'ish. Also my claim on Code Geass being not good?

Dude it won "best tv animation" award of 2009 in the twelfth anime kobe event in Japan. In August 2008 over 900, 000 discs of Code Geass were sold. By November Bandai has sold a million DVD+Blu-Ray of Code Geass. Also it was calculated to be the fourth best selling anime media product on Amazon.com. Not saying Code Geass is that good in spite of those sales in insane and not only are you bad for saying that but you should feel bad as well.

Also on Lelouch, he's a kind-hearted person it's just that his kindness is done through lies which he feels as beneficial to achieve things. He had power and it helped him somewhat garner choice results, however he couldn't allow himself to slip up (Euphie, Shirley's father, Shirley herself are a testament to not taking his position seriously enough. The non-action/political episodes are representations of Lelouch growing and working off that teenage innocence which is soothing considering the many burdens he bears in warring with his father to acquire the truth behind the events of 8 years ago.
"I don't give a rat's ass about going to hell. I guess it's because I feel like I'm already there." -Mugen
Revy Gonna Give It To Ya
On Akito (The Character): I think it's waaaay too early to draw conclusions about his character. And you know, there a plenty of soldiers who do their job just because they like fighting, as Shonen as that sounds. Leila is my favorite character so far.

[up]Eh, would respond but it's probably not worth getting worked up over. I'll just say I don't think popularity contests are good judges of quality, and that while Lulu might on some level 'care' about other people, that doesn't make him 'kind hearted'. More often than not he's very Machiavellian.

@Anbar: It's a bit slow, but if you like UC or SEED stuff and would like to see Geass Worldbuilding much better executed (which I do), I think it'd be up your alley. There's one or two scenes that were Geass-y in their over the top silliness but they were forgiveable. You can ask me over PM for more details if you're interested. It's a lot more like what I wanted the series to be.

Also, the more I watch the series, the more I cannot stand Suzaku. I dunno why I was so high on him before, probably his individual actions fadding as I just remembered the premise (or my idealized version of his premise). His whole "Zero's methods are wrong" Spiel is so full of shit, like Britannia's methods are any better. He comes across as saying "Whoever has power gets to define morality", which makes him sound like he would've been a good little Nazi hung at Nuremburg for only following orders. (Ironically enough though, the Charlemagne Regiment, a unit composed entirely of Vichy French collaborators, was one of the last units to surrender at the Battle of Berlin.)

These are the words that shall come from my mouth. I shall be known for speaking them.
 2253 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 12:53:39 PM from Location, Location, Loca
Lots of French folk on the Eastern Front, too, fighting with memorable bravery and zeal, Or So I Heard.
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
[up][up]I'd contend that Lelouch was quite capable of empathy, but ended up giving in to atrocity due to circumstances.

Also, this was basically the point where Suzaku was reaching the apex of his rationalizations. At least he would realize how full of crap he was when he fired off FLEIJA.
 
 2255 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 1:45:28 PM from Location, Location, Loca
He didn't do that one on purpose, man, that's Lelouch's fault!
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
Revy Gonna Give It To Ya
[up][up][up]Well that was the Eastern Front; there's also the fact that if they were captured by the Soviets, they were almost certain to be killed.

[up][up]Being capable of compassion and being kind-hearted are two different things. Cornelia was certainly capable of compassion but I wouldn't consider her kind-hearted.

edited 5th Oct '12 1:54:09 PM by Scherzo09

These are the words that shall come from my mouth. I shall be known for speaking them.
 2257 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 2:16:07 PM from Location, Location, Loca
[up]She's one though bastard.

Why isn't the term bastard used on illegitimate daughters anyway?
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
[up][up][up]Even though he chose not to retreat, which led to it happening in the first place?

[up][up]Cornelia simply fails on her own, though.

edited 5th Oct '12 2:17:12 PM by azul120

 
Revy Gonna Give It To Ya
[up]Lelouch is emotional, and personally that's more compelling than being Kind Hearted. Take like Yoh from Deadman Wonderland, he cares deeply about his sister, to the point of throwing his so-called 'friends' under the bus to get to her. His compassion for Minatsuki isn't supposed to make up for his assholishness towards Ganta and Shiro, and overall he isn't particularly likable, but because of the humanness of his thoughts and actions, he's interesting, imo at least and certaintly ymmv.
These are the words that shall come from my mouth. I shall be known for speaking them.
 2260 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 2:29:26 PM from Location, Location, Loca
Even Bad Men Love Their Mamas! Or little sister, as it were.

edited 5th Oct '12 2:30:20 PM by TheHandle

I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
 2261 Grand Prince Paul II, Fri, 5th Oct '12 2:37:45 PM from Western Eurasia
Imperial knight
[up]x13

Unstable? He seems to be a stable Death Seeker and is right to enjoy fighting and killing the evil soldiers of the evil empire.
Lazy and pathetic.
"Dude it won "best tv animation" award of 2009 in the twelfth anime kobe event in Japan. In August 2008 over 900, 000 discs of Code Geass were sold. By November Bandai has sold a million DVD+Blu-Ray of Code Geass. Also it was calculated to be the fourth best selling anime media product on Amazon.com. Not saying Code Geass is that good in spite of those sales in insane and not only are you bad for saying that but you should feel bad as well."

You would argue that SEED isn't good despite the fact that it sold really well in Japan. From some of your earlier comments, you'd say the same about Advent's Children, which also sold very well. Anyway, to go off of your logic, Twilight is a masterwork that will last throughout the ages. What Scherzo said about popularity being a poor judge of quality is definitely true.

@Scherzo

Thanks for the recommendation. I might check it out when I have some time. As I mentioned before, I like the concept of Code Geass, but can't stand the execution, so if this new thing fixes that it might be worth checking out. I'm also with you on Suzaku and Lelouch. I love the idea—two former friends, one seeking reform from the inside, the other a revolutionary, end up clashing—but in practise it quickly turns into "asshole revolutionary" versus "fascist enforcer of the status quo." Jumping Off the Slippery Slope happened way too quickly.

 2263 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 2:59:51 PM from Location, Location, Loca
[up][up]Yeah, way to Put the "Laughter" in "Slaughter"...
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
 2264 Grand Prince Paul II, Fri, 5th Oct '12 3:42:22 PM from Western Eurasia
Imperial knight
[up] Life is short, why not try to enjoy it to the fullest? grin
Lazy and pathetic.
 2265 probablyinsane, Fri, 5th Oct '12 5:35:50 PM Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
As long as they ain't laughing while slaughtering civilians, I think it's... ok for professional killers (aka assassins) to enjoy their line of work.

Mainly saying so cause I like Team Fortress 2 (a tad too much).

Btw, whether we think a media is good or bad mostly depends on personal preference. Generally, I think it's a waste of time to convince other people to like what they already dislike. Same with trying to make people dislike what they already like.

Lol, probably only (really) worth doing so if we get paid to make this or that more popular or less popular. evil grin

edited 5th Oct '12 5:36:11 PM by probablyinsane

Half of a social justice battle is simply convincing people that a problem is real or that a pattern exists. ~Nihonjinron Gakusei
 2266 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 5:39:02 PM from Location, Location, Loca
The only person who seems remotely sane in that game is the Sniper.
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
Will kill you
@Ambar

It's not just popularity it's also reviews. Most of Code Geass's reviews are exemplary while SEED's aren't. It's called a rehash of the original Gundam show albeit with a few minor changes. And it's true. SEED's criticism are that it uses ridiculous amounts of stock footage, poor pacing, filler'ish like eps and recap episodes.

@Scherzo09

What the heck kind of criticism is "some scenes in Code Geass are too Geass-y?"

Also I'd say that showing compassion is a sign that beneath your facade as a cold uncaring bastard you're kind-hearted. This indefinitely describes Lelouch. In his duty as a leader he can't afford to show too much weakness.

edited 5th Oct '12 5:56:31 PM by Couchpotato20

"I don't give a rat's ass about going to hell. I guess it's because I feel like I'm already there." -Mugen
 2268 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 6:12:36 PM from Location, Location, Loca
this indefinitely describes Lelouch

... Interesting turn of phrase. I'll be sure to use it, once I've figured out what it means.
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
Revy Gonna Give It To Ya
[up][up]Anyone besides Psychopaths can care about other people, that isn't some magical redeeming quality. That Lelouch is a human being doesn't make him special, but paradoxically the show seems to think it does, and I think that makes him feel less real. The way everything is executed just feels so... artificial, that more often than not it boils down to caricature. I think one of the best human scenes of Lelouch I've seen so far in my current rewatch had nothing to do with him caring about other people. It was in Cornelia Attacks when it was slowly dawning upon him that there was no way he could escape from the predicament he had placed himself in.

I mean, this is all YMMV of course; it's just how I see.

edited 5th Oct '12 6:16:55 PM by Scherzo09

These are the words that shall come from my mouth. I shall be known for speaking them.
 2270 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 6:19:26 PM from Location, Location, Loca
[up]Oh, yeah, that scene was beautiful, and CC's intervention out of the blue...
I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
Will kill you
@Scherzo09

Bzzt. No, try again Lelouch shows earlier he's indeed human despite how often he tries to adopt the same demonic nature of the Geass which he and others possess. He even shows some degree of sadness after killing Clovis and throwing up as result of it. Anyone who shows remorse for their action can be called a sympathetic character and not a total asshole. Also how is Lelouch's and for that the execution of the story superficial? Lelouch had every intention of spilling blood until Britannia's emperor Charles Di Britannia was brought to his knees. The only superficiality was in R2 which is actually Fridge Brilliance and apart of his Thanatos Gambit.

However, the part of part one and part two is actually hilarious in hindsight when the wham episode 21 premiered.

Also that episode in "Cornelia Attacks" Lelouch was still a greenhorn and had yet to fully capitalize on his resources.
"I don't give a rat's ass about going to hell. I guess it's because I feel like I'm already there." -Mugen
Revy Gonna Give It To Ya
[up]Okay, we're done here, because obviously we're not going to agree here. In my book, you're just wrong. There's no thematicism in CG, nothing as particularly strong or profound as you seem to think it is at any rate. It was a design-by-committee product made to pander as many demographics as possible. The themes it does have are either broad and banal as fuck ("Racism is bad" "The weak should be protected from the strong!") or poorly executed. I still enjoyed it! It can be fun at times! But there's just so much promise that's underdelivered, and I expect more out of these guys because they have shown they can be good writers; the writerdirector team did Planetes, and while by no means a perfect anime, it has a level of thoughtfulness Code Geass can only dream of. And you can like Code Geass all you want, I can't stop you. I enjoy the show too. But it just makes me sad for culture when something that, demonstrably, has poor writing and poor characterization, is held up to be something exemplary.

I think I've said my piece. I don't want to piss people off; that's just how I feel.
These are the words that shall come from my mouth. I shall be known for speaking them.
 2273 probablyinsane, Fri, 5th Oct '12 7:37:28 PM Relationship Status: I LOVE THIS DOCTOR!
Uh... it's wrong for a show to broadcast that "racism is bad" or that "the weak should be protected"?

(reviews the definition of "banal") - "So lacking in originality as to be obvious and boring."

Ya know, when it comes to stories, there's nothing new that's completely original - just saying.

I consider myself a casual yet very picky anime fan, but that level of nitpick is a tad too much. Shows that broadcast that "racism is bad" or that the "weak should be protected" shouldn't be considered as too broad or banal. IMHO.
Half of a social justice battle is simply convincing people that a problem is real or that a pattern exists. ~Nihonjinron Gakusei
 2274 The Handle, Fri, 5th Oct '12 8:02:13 PM from Location, Location, Loca
Yeah but in the case of Geass it's a bit of a Clueless Aesop

edited 5th Oct '12 8:02:27 PM by TheHandle

I stayed up all night, 'cause I wanted to see where the sun went—and then it dawned on me.
Aside from how him realizing how far he placed himself, he had been reflecting on the day he was disgraced by his father in the royal court, and how he would not accept the Social Darwinism of Britannia, even if he was still using Nunnally as an excuse at that time. Even beyond the former, he had felt trapped as far as avoiding discovery and being used again by Britannia went.
 
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