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** The phrase "The Arms and The Man" (the [[LiteraryAllusionTitle title of a Shaw play]]) is from the first sentence of the epic and the memorable line translated as something like "going to hell is easy; it's getting back which is the hard part" might be considered the origin of the phrase ToHellAndBack.

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** The phrase "The Arms "Arms and The Man" (the [[LiteraryAllusionTitle title of a Shaw play]]) is from the first sentence of the epic and the memorable line translated as something like "going to hell is easy; it's getting back which is the hard part" might be considered the origin of the phrase ToHellAndBack.



** Aeneas in the Underworld, where he meets the ghosts of the past, is often cited by alter authors for its WorldBuilding (i.e. exit either via Gates of Horn and Ivory) and the moment where Jupiter comes and promises Aeneas that he, and the Trojans would become the Romans and finally inherit an empire without end.

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** Aeneas in the Underworld, where he meets the ghosts of the past, is often cited by alter later authors for its WorldBuilding (i.e. (e.g. the exit either via Gates of Horn and Ivory) and the moment where Jupiter comes and promises Aeneas that he, he and the Trojans would become the Romans and finally inherit an empire without end.
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** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning (mainly because they were doing so well immediately before Juno convinced Aeolus to whistle up that storm). Of his massive family, 95% are either dead or enslaved; his home is gone; every place he tried to settle turned out to be totally unsuitable; he finds love, but a divine messenger orders him to dump Dido; yet more hardships of travel ensue; his new friend dies... Yeah, he's having a bad time.
** Dido is also portrayed quite sympathetically. She was betrayed by her own brother, who murdered her husband, and when she thought she had found happiness again, the gods literally decreed she wasn't allowed to keep it. (It helps that Aeneas's arguments during their final scenes together are not as good as he's usually able to muster, which suggests that ''he'', and by extension Vergil, knows he screwed up.)

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** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning (mainly because they were doing so well immediately before Juno convinced Aeolus to whistle up that storm). Of his massive family, 95% are either dead or enslaved; his home is gone; every place he tried to settle turned out to be totally unsuitable; he finds love, gets caught up in a liaison with Dido and eventually gets comfortable, but a divine messenger orders him to dump Dido; yet more hardships of travel ensue; his new friend dies... Yeah, he's having a bad time.
** Dido is also portrayed quite sympathetically. She was betrayed by her own brother, who murdered her husband, and when she thought she had found happiness again, the gods literally decreed she wasn't allowed to keep it. (It It helps that Aeneas's arguments during Cupid personally caused Dido to be lovesick for Aeneas, thus making their final scenes together are not as good as he's usually able to muster, which suggests eventual liaison an encounter that ''he'', and by extension Vergil, knows he screwed up.)came to be because of circumstances beyond their control.
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** In the 19th century the book was commonly interpreted as being about the glories and costs of imperialism, with Aeneas considered as a model empire-builder who continually suppresses his own personal desires for the greater glory of founding the Roman empire. But in the 20th century, which was marked by massive population displacement, it's been reinterpreted by a critic such as George Steiner as being about homelessness, with the Trojans considered as refugees displaced by the Greek sacking of Troy.

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** In the 19th century century, the book was commonly interpreted as being about the glories and costs of imperialism, with Aeneas considered as a model empire-builder who continually suppresses his own personal desires for the greater glory of founding the Roman empire. But in the 20th century, which was marked by massive population displacement, it's been reinterpreted by a critic such as George Steiner as being about homelessness, with the Trojans considered as refugees displaced by the Greek sacking of Troy.



* MemeticMutation: "[T]imeō Danaōs et dōna ferentīs." ("I fear the Greeks even bearing gifts.") Often rendered as "Beware Greeks bearing gifts."

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* MemeticMutation: "[T]imeō Danaōs et dōna ferentīs." ("I (literally "I fear the Greeks even bearing gifts.") Often rendered as "Beware Greeks bearing gifts."
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
Minor grammatical corrections.


** The difference makes sense as by Virgil's time, Greeks are targets of vilification (for example the infamous line "timeo Danaos et dona ferentis" - I fear Greeks even bearing gifts). Demonizing the famous Greek leaders also makes the Trojans look better. Though interestingly enough, Diomedes, the guy who kicked Aeneas as in the ''Literature/{{Iliad}}'' is portrayed in a positive light.

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** The difference makes sense as by Virgil's time, Greeks are targets of vilification (for example the infamous line "timeo Danaos et dona ferentis" - I fear Greeks even bearing gifts). Demonizing the famous Greek leaders also makes the Trojans look better. Though interestingly enough, Diomedes, the guy who kicked Aeneas as Aeneas' ass in the ''Literature/{{Iliad}}'' ''Literature/{{Iliad}}'', is portrayed in a positive light.
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Index wick


** The difference makes sense as by Virgil's time, Greeks are AcceptableTargets (for example the infamous line "timeo Danaos et dona ferentis" - I fear Greeks even bearing gifts). Demonizing the famous Greek leaders also makes the Trojans look better. Though interestingly enough, Diomedes, the guy who kicked Aeneas as in the ''Literature/{{Iliad}}'' is portrayed in a positive light.

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** The difference makes sense as by Virgil's time, Greeks are AcceptableTargets targets of vilification (for example the infamous line "timeo Danaos et dona ferentis" - I fear Greeks even bearing gifts). Demonizing the famous Greek leaders also makes the Trojans look better. Though interestingly enough, Diomedes, the guy who kicked Aeneas as in the ''Literature/{{Iliad}}'' is portrayed in a positive light.
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Dido isn't an antagonist.


* EvilIsCool: Later Italian authors and readers tend to admit that they find the antagonists or the bad guys more interesting -- Camilla of the Vosci, Mezentius, Dido of Carthage and Turnus.

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* EvilIsCool: Later Italian authors and readers tend to admit that they find the antagonists or the bad guys more interesting -- Camilla of the Vosci, Mezentius, Dido of Carthage Mezentius and Turnus.
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** The most difficult one is Helen. In one scene, she's suffering a [[BreakTheCutie total breakdown]]. In another, she's gleefully killing Trojans. It's possible to reconcile the two, but there's such a disparity that it may be one of the incomplete pats.

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** The most difficult one is Helen. In one scene, she's suffering a [[BreakTheCutie total breakdown]]. In another, she's gleefully killing Trojans. It's possible to reconcile the two, but there's such a disparity that it may be one of the incomplete pats.parts.
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Requires Word Of God confirmation


* AuthorsSavingThrow: Virgil justifies the Trojans falling for the Trojan Horse so that they wouldn't go into the story looking like moronic losers, complete with the Trojan who vociferously argues against it, to the point of ''attacking the horse'' but whom the gods then strike down (along with his two children).[[note]]Elements of this go as far back as the lost ''[[Literature/TheTrojanCycle Sack of Ilion]]'', though there the death of Laocoon occurred ''after'' the Trojans decided to bring the TrojanHorse into the city, and his death was the portent that caused Aeneas to leave Troy with his companions.[[/note]] Virgil also stresses the fact that they kept Troy safe for over a decade and only lost by underhanded trickery.
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** In the 19th century the book was commonly interpreted as being about the glories and costs of imperialism, with Aeneas considered as a model empire-builder who continually suppresses his own personal desires for the greater glory of founding the Roman empire. But in the 20th century, which was marked by massive population displacement, it's been reinterpreted by a critic such as George Steiner as being about homelessness, with the Trojans considered as refugees displaced by the Greek sacking of Troy.
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None


** The same goes for Odysseus, who is presented in the ''Aeneid'' as more of a slimy trickster than a hero. In ''Literature/TheOdyssey'', Odysseus is a hero precisely because he is a slimy trickster but that attitude did not fly to a Roman audience.
** The most difficult one is Helen. In one scene, she's suffering a [[BreakTheCutie total breakdown]]. In another, she's gleefully killing Trojans. It's possible to reconcile the two, but there's such a disparity that it may be one of the [[AuthorExistenceFailure incomplete]] parts (see below).

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** The same goes for Odysseus, who is presented in the ''Aeneid'' as more of a slimy trickster than a hero. In ''Literature/TheOdyssey'', Odysseus is a hero precisely because he is a slimy trickster trickster, but that attitude did not fly to a Roman audience.
** The most difficult one is Helen. In one scene, she's suffering a [[BreakTheCutie total breakdown]]. In another, she's gleefully killing Trojans. It's possible to reconcile the two, but there's such a disparity that it may be one of the [[AuthorExistenceFailure incomplete]] parts (see below).incomplete pats.



** Mezentius's [[NayTheist refusal to worship the gods]] is supposed to make him look like a monster. Instead it makes him look like a badass.
** As a result of AuthorExistenceFailure, the finale where Aeneas kills Turnus and the story abruptly stops is regarded by some as a HeWhoFightsMonsters moment. Where Aeneas despite being noble and driven by Gods finally proves himself to be as brutish as common soldiers and his enemies.

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** Mezentius's [[NayTheist refusal to worship the gods]] is supposed to make him look like a monster. Instead Instead, it makes him look like a badass.
** As a result of AuthorExistenceFailure, Since Virgil DiedDuringProduction, the finale where Aeneas kills Turnus and the story abruptly stops is regarded by some as a HeWhoFightsMonsters moment. Where Aeneas despite being noble and driven by Gods finally proves himself to be as brutish as common soldiers and his enemies.
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These are not 'common opinions' about the poem.


* SeasonalRot: The epic contains twelve books, and a common opinion is that the quality declines sharply after Book VI. Whereas the escape from Troy, the episode in Carthage, and the trip to the underworld are classic and well-remembered, everything inbetween the underworld and Turnus is often thought to be filler. It's not surprising that the AP exam on Virgil usually favors the scenes from the first six books. See also VanillaProtagonist below.



* VanillaProtagonist: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.
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Propaganda Piece is no longer YMMV, but non-propaganda examples are being removed


* PropagandaPiece: The poem was more or less state propaganda promoted by UsefulNotes/{{Augustus}} to link the emerging and brand-new UsefulNotes/TheRomanEmpire with antique origins. It deliberately aimed to displace Remus and Romulus (the popular founders of Rome) with Aeneas. The Julio-Claudian family of which Augustus was a descendant claimed descent from the Trojans and the Goddess Venus, both origins linked Augustus and Caesar to Aeneas, thereby creating a continuity of the ruling family with their ancestors, and insisting that the foundations of Rome were imperial rather than republican. Aeneas likewise embodies virtues more amenable to Augustan Roman: piety, family honor, stoicism, differing from the more capricious and earthy nature of the Homeric attitude.
--> '''Jupiter''': His ego nec metas rerum nec tempora pono;\\
Imperium sine fine dedi.\\
["For these I set no limits, world or time,\\
But make the gift of empire without end"].\\
Lines 278–279 (tr. Robert Fitzgerald)
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None

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* MemeticMutation: "[T]imeō Danaōs et dōna ferentīs." ("I fear the Greeks even bearing gifts.") Often rendered as "Beware Greeks bearing gifts."
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None


* DracoInLeatherPants: Later Italian authors and readers tend to admit that they find the antagonists or the bad guys more interesting -- Camilla of the Vosci, Mezentius, Dido of Carthage and Turnus.

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* DracoInLeatherPants: EvilIsCool: Later Italian authors and readers tend to admit that they find the antagonists or the bad guys more interesting -- Camilla of the Vosci, Mezentius, Dido of Carthage and Turnus.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* PropagandaPiece: The poem was more or less state propaganda promoted by UsefulNotes/{{Augustus}} to link the emerging and brand-new UsefulNotes/TheRomanEmpire with antique origins. It deliberately aimed to displace Remus and Romulus (the popular founders of Rome) with Aeneas. The Julio-Claudian family of which Augustus was a descendant claimed descent from the Trojans and the Goddess Venus, both origins linked Augustus and Caesar to Aeneas, thereby creating a continuity of the ruling family with their ancestors, and insisting that the foundations of Rome were imperial rather than republican. Aeneas likewise embodies virtues more amenable to Augustan Roman: piety, family honor, stoicism, differing from the more capricious and earthy nature of the Homeric attitude.
--> '''Jupiter''': His ego nec metas rerum nec tempora pono;\\
Imperium sine fine dedi.\\
["For these I set no limits, world or time,\\
But make the gift of empire without end"].\\
Lines 278–279 (tr. Robert Fitzgerald)
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None

Added DiffLines:

* SeasonalRot: The epic contains twelve books, and a common opinion is that the quality declines sharply after Book VI. Whereas the escape from Troy, the episode in Carthage, and the trip to the underworld are classic and well-remembered, everything inbetween the underworld and Turnus is often thought to be filler. It's not surprising that the AP exam on Virgil usually favors the scenes from the first six books. See also VanillaProtagonist below.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** There's also Vergil's description of Dido re-discovering love as re-kindling "an old flame." (Though the 'flame' is her sexual feelings more generally rather than a passion for a specific former lover, as it is usually used in English.)

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** There's also Vergil's Virgil's description of Dido re-discovering love as re-kindling "an old flame." (Though the 'flame' is her sexual feelings more generally rather than a passion for a specific former lover, as it is usually used in English.)



** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning (mainly because they were doing so well immediately before Juno convinced Aeolus to whistle up that storm). Of his massive family, 95% are either dead or enslaved; his home is gone; every place he tried to settle turned out to be totally unsuitable; he finds love, but a divine messenger orders him to dump Dido; yet more hardships of travel ensue; his new friend dies...Yeah, he's having a bad time.

to:

** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning (mainly because they were doing so well immediately before Juno convinced Aeolus to whistle up that storm). Of his massive family, 95% are either dead or enslaved; his home is gone; every place he tried to settle turned out to be totally unsuitable; he finds love, but a divine messenger orders him to dump Dido; yet more hardships of travel ensue; his new friend dies... Yeah, he's having a bad time.
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None


** The scene where Aeneas sees the mural of the Trojan War in Carthage and states, "sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt" ("The world is a world of tears, and the burdens of mortality touch the heart" -- Translated by Robert Fagles) more often shortened as "Lacrimae Rerum" and colloquially paraphrased as "these are the tears of things". This scene comes very early in the poem, in Book 1 around lines 400 and it is generally considered one of the most emotional an touching moments in antiquity, since it has Aeneas mourning about his Trojan people are gone forever with only a mural left to commemorate them.

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** The scene where Aeneas sees the mural of the Trojan War in Carthage and states, "sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt" ("The world is a world of tears, and the burdens of mortality touch the heart" -- Translated by Robert Fagles) more often shortened as "Lacrimae Rerum" and colloquially paraphrased as "these are the tears of things". This scene comes very early in the poem, in Book 1 around lines 400 line 400, and it is generally considered one of the most emotional an and touching moments in antiquity, since it has Aeneas mourning about how his Trojan people are gone forever with only a mural left to commemorate them.
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Not YMMV


* NintendoHard: Translating it, especially for students that have just come off prose. Vergil's poetic endings, word order (or lack thereof), and figurative language can be quite annoying. AuthorExistenceFailure also leads to some incomplete lines, making translation even more difficult.

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Corrected example indentation.


* AlternativeCharacterInterpretation: An inter-book example. Aeolus is seen in both ''Literature/TheOdyssey'' and ''Literature/TheAeneid''. In ''Literature/TheOdyssey'', he is seen as a splendid guy with a fertile kingdom -- in the ''Aeneid'' he is seen as a jerk in a hollow barren cave, who screws over Aeneas for an arranged marriage with one of Juno's nymphs.

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* AlternativeCharacterInterpretation: AlternativeCharacterInterpretation:
**
An inter-book example. Aeolus is seen in both ''Literature/TheOdyssey'' and ''Literature/TheAeneid''. In ''Literature/TheOdyssey'', he is seen as a splendid guy with a fertile kingdom -- in the ''Aeneid'' he is seen as a jerk in a hollow barren cave, who screws over Aeneas for an arranged marriage with one of Juno's nymphs.

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fits better i think


* FlatCharacter: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.


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* VanillaProtagonist: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning. He gets more pathetic from there, possibly changing once he gets to Italy.
** Dido is also portrayed quite sympathetically. Turnus skirts this during the parts when Virgil describes how he is doomed to die, and when one remembers that he didn't initially want the war at all and only got involved because of Juno and Allecto's manipulations.

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** Aeneas. When he's introduced, he's ''bawling his eyes out'' over the threat of immediate death by drowning. He gets drowning (mainly because they were doing so well immediately before Juno convinced Aeolus to whistle up that storm). Of his massive family, 95% are either dead or enslaved; his home is gone; every place he tried to settle turned out to be totally unsuitable; he finds love, but a divine messenger orders him to dump Dido; yet more pathetic from there, possibly changing once he gets to Italy.
hardships of travel ensue; his new friend dies...Yeah, he's having a bad time.
** Dido is also portrayed quite sympathetically. She was betrayed by her own brother, who murdered her husband, and when she thought she had found happiness again, the gods literally decreed she wasn't allowed to keep it. (It helps that Aeneas's arguments during their final scenes together are not as good as he's usually able to muster, which suggests that ''he'', and by extension Vergil, knows he screwed up.)
**
Turnus skirts this during the parts when Virgil describes how he is doomed to die, and when one remembers that he didn't initially want the war at all and only got involved because of Juno and Allecto's manipulations.
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None

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* SignatureScene:
** The scene where Aeneas sees the mural of the Trojan War in Carthage and states, "sunt lacrimae rerum et mentem mortalia tangunt" ("The world is a world of tears, and the burdens of mortality touch the heart" -- Translated by Robert Fagles) more often shortened as "Lacrimae Rerum" and colloquially paraphrased as "these are the tears of things". This scene comes very early in the poem, in Book 1 around lines 400 and it is generally considered one of the most emotional an touching moments in antiquity, since it has Aeneas mourning about his Trojan people are gone forever with only a mural left to commemorate them.
** The flashback to the Trojan War and actually depicting the Trojan Horse is the earliest surviving instance in antiquity of the Trojan horse scene actually being represented. In the earlier poems and cycles, the horse was never actually represented on-screen, but stated in passing. Thanks to PopCulturalOsmosis, many think ''Literature/TheIliad'' and/or ''Literature/TheOdyssey'' begins and/or ends respectively with the Trojan Horse not knowing that ''The Aeneid'' is where it really starts.
** Aeneas exiting Troy carrying his father on his shoulders with his household gods is [[https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/f7/Aeneas%27_Flight_from_Troy_by_Federico_Barocci.jpg one of the most well-known moments]] in Western Literature. Frequently cited for its incredible dramatic emotion and often considered one of the key images of exile.
** Aeneas in the Underworld, where he meets the ghosts of the past, is often cited by alter authors for its WorldBuilding (i.e. exit either via Gates of Horn and Ivory) and the moment where Jupiter comes and promises Aeneas that he, and the Trojans would become the Romans and finally inherit an empire without end.
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** One reading of the text is that Aeneas is actually a NominalHero; not only does he frequently screw up, but the events of his life strongly parallel those of Odysseus and Achilles - indeed, his last actions of the story are burning down a city over a woman and executing a surrendering enemy over a friend's armor. This one tends to go hand-in-hand with the interpretation that Aeneas is meant to resemble Augustus, who commissioned the story and whom Virgil reportedly wasn't fond of.
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* FlatCharacter: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics, even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.

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* FlatCharacter: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics, critics even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.
Is there an issue? Send a MessageReason:
None


** The same goes for Odysseus, who is presented in the ''Aeneid'' as more of a slimy trickster than a hero.

to:

** The same goes for Odysseus, who is presented in the ''Aeneid'' as more of a slimy trickster than a hero. In ''Literature/TheOdyssey'', Odysseus is a hero precisely because he is a slimy trickster but that attitude did not fly to a Roman audience.
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Removed per TRS.


** Mezentius's [[NayTheist refusal to worship the gods]] is supposed to make him look like a monster. Instead it makes him look like a {{Badass}}.

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** Mezentius's [[NayTheist refusal to worship the gods]] is supposed to make him look like a monster. Instead it makes him look like a {{Badass}}.badass.

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Oops deleted wrong entry there...


* DesignatedHero: One of the reasons why the book sells less well than the ''Literature/TheIliad'' or ''Literature/TheOdyssey'' is that modern readers often consider Aeneas to be this.


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* FlatCharacter: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics, even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.
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Not sure how Aeneas is "Designated Hero"...he's a nicer person than Odysseus, he's just boring. He's an embodiment of Roman virtues of stoicism, and nationality, and devotion to family...what with the "household gods"...


* FlatCharacter: Critics note that Aeneas' characterization kind of dies after the visit to the underworld, and that the final part dealing with the arrival of the Trojans to Italy is more a series of vignettes about other characters who are more colourful than Aeneas. Some critics, even feel that this is one reason why Virgil never finished the Aeneid and why he, according to myth, said that it should be burnt. He struggled to make Aeneas interesting and so strung together vignettes to fill space for his epic.

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