WMG: Professor Layton VS Ace Attorney
Let it begin!
Mahoney (since the European version's out, let's call her Espella, which is her British name, shall we?) is being accused of witchcraft because she can communicate with unknown creatures the others think to be spirits.There's a part in a Japanese trailer wherein Espella appeared to be "praying" to something while sitting with her back against a tree. She seems to be answering questions Wright is asking her, and she gets her answers from that whatever she's speaking to. And then the view was panned to Layton, who was facing away from the camera. I presume he is starting to get suspicious of Espella, and that is where the "Professor Layton VS Phoenix Wright" comes in. Wright defends Espella, Layton accuses her.
- Jossed: She's trailed twice, the first one, for being framed of killing two robbers in a fire with a spell she didn't cast, and the latter, she's been trialed for being the great witch Bezella, rumored to be the ruler of all witches.
Labyrinth City (or Labyrinthia in the British version) is a city isolated from the outside world, and thus, they have delayed technology. It's not a world in a book.I can't begin to theorize as to how they access the place by opening a book (or at least that's what one of the cutscenes featured in the trailers imply), but yeah, ye who have played Professor Layton know how mindblowing Layton style plot twists are.
- Confirmed, oh wise troper! With the twist of Labyrinthia formerly being an English city isolated from the outside world with delayed techonology and currently being owned by a huge pharmaceutical corporation in cahoots with the UK government to make it a secret test facility for a mind-altering drug, with the illusion of magic being kept through highly advanced technology!
Mahone is an alternate universe version of...Liane, from Level-5's Jeanne D'Arc. Labyrinth City is a heavily altered version of Rouen, and the storyteller is the Duke of Bedford. It should go without saying, then, that both Ace Attorney and Layton take place in this altered version of the real world where Jeanne d'Arc is what actually happened. Presumably, the demon from JDA is resurrected following Unwound Future, and Layton, having done his research, goes back in time to stop it at its source by trying to keep Liane from being burnt at the stake. Phoenix and Maya are here because, a, Layton needed an experienced lawyer, and b, Maya's magatama has power passed down from the armlets.
Maxwell is the Storyteller.Whatever he writes becomes reality. It fits so well it's almost scary.
- I was going to say the exact same thing about Drosselmeyer.
- He's the main antagonist (I think) because somebody summoned Cthulu a few too many times...
The Court scene is an example of Super DickeryThe heroes aren't against each other. They have to work together to prove her innocence, but they have to put on a show for the populace.
- Rather; Professor Layton is doing what a prosecuting attorney is supposed to do. Organize all the charges against the accused girl in a way that is falsible.. At the moment, Labyrinth City is ruled by mob mentality; and their accusations against her have contradictions; but rumor-mongering doesn't see that. He's not "pretending" to be a prosecutor; they aren't supposed to "want" to get the defendant guilty or non-guilty.
- I think this is very plausible: Layton's too smart to actually fall for the accusations. He's probably just pinch-hitting for Edgeworth, as Phoenix seems to do all his best detective work in the middle of court.
- Confirmed. In the final trial, Layton takes up the prosecutor's bench partially because there's nobody else who can (due to Darklaw taking the witness stand, and Barnham being arrested for treason prior to the trial), but mostly to aid Wright in his quest to find the truth, using new evidence found on his last minute investigation. Layton throws Nick the balls, so that Wright can knock 'em out of the park.
- In that regard, so too could the title itself.
Maya as a WitchAt some point in the game some character will remark, jokingly or not, that Maya might be a witch. Just look at how she's dressed. It's bound to come up.
- Just look at what she does.
- Chances are, she will be mistaken for a witch, and Phoenix will have to defend her.
- Confirmed. She gets accused of using witchcraft to murder and Phoenix indeed has to defend her.
This time the Court antics will make senseWe find our hero in a Kangaroo court. Just like all the others. However, this time it's a witch trial, and the marsupial-ness is justified.
- Confirmed, at least partly, by Word of God. Takumi stated in an Interview that the events of the trials in game where made to be specially chatoic, as they where back in the "Dark Ages", the setting for which the game is based.
In a plot twist, it will turn out to also be a crossover with Umineko no Naku Koro niWitches, fiendishly difficult puzzles, Mundane Made Awesome, finger-pointing, logic battles, Rewriting Reality... seriously, just add some gorn, narm, and Nightmare Fuel and you're covered.
- Do we really need the Third Member of the Epic Finger-Pointing and Truth-Telling Triumvirate I.e. Battler Ushiromiya? No not really, but if we can, it will be awesome.
- In a subtle way, both Layton and Phoenix Wright are Reality Warpers. Layton solves a puzzle, and this is the same thing as passing a Charisma Check, or a Spot Check. Phoenix Wright can argue, and this can result in challenging even gods. Subjected to a world of cruel Fantasy; they rejected it; and their love of Mystery together combined synergistically to tap into the power of Blue Text (and in the end, Gold Text) (neither they nor we can see the color) to change the very genre and setting to heal a mentally tortured woman of her mental demons. This effect rippled through time; and everything changed with the odd exception to the car in the tree with a hand print. They don't talk about that.
- Phoenix's thoughts are in blue parentheses. Phoenix can create Blue Text.
- Do we really need the Third Member of the Epic Finger-Pointing and Truth-Telling Triumvirate I.e. Battler Ushiromiya? No not really, but if we can, it will be awesome.
- This is what's known as a "just for fun" WMG, y'all can relax.
It will be a super extra special cross overFeaturing shoutouts and cameos to every series they can get the rights to! You'll solve morphball puzzles, figure out the shortest number of jumps for an Italian, find new creatures to summon to solve puzzles...
'Storyteller' is not the Big BadGiven the nature (read: complexity) of the games, it is highly unlikely they will name the series' villain as simply or straightforward as how the trailer did. This troper is pegging that there is another character or a King Incognito, whom will be The Chessmaster or The Man Behind the Man.
- Confirmed! There is no Big Bad at all, actually.
The upcoming crossover with Professor Layton is the result of Hobo Phoenix tripping on something else than grape juice...Come on, there's just no other possible way to fit something like this into canon, neither in terms of timeline, nor... in any other terms. Come on. You know it's true.
- OBJECTION! Not only does time travel exist in Layton canon, thus implying this is the source, but there's no reason it can't fit into Phoenix canon with all the spirit mediums and coffee summoning!
- HOLD IT! Time travel is not the same as dimension hopping. The world of PLVAA is in a different world! It's unconfirmed how exactly they wound up there, so this theory still holds viability!
- HANG ON! The entire setting of Labyrinthia is actually a research center under the guise of an artificial town, with the villagers completely in the dark regarding the truth behind their home. The research is actually regarding the plant spores spread throughout the area's very foundations, and the mind-altering effects they have on humans (mainly, heightened susceptibility and vulnerability to manipulation). Nick, Maya, Hersh and Luke fall into this pattern due to the spores being scattered within the book they read that supposedly "warps" them to the town in a flash of light. So, to put this in simple terms, the entire story is in fact fueled by Phoenix and co. being on drugs the entire time.
In the Layton crossover, Maya will, at some point, be Don Paolo in disguise.Because Don Paolo only disguises himself as major characters, has been known to imitate girls Maya's age (Flora), and Wright is a playable character. Otherwise, Don will probably impersonate another AA character; probably Gumshoe, Edgeworth, or The Judge, in order of likelihood of being impersonated/present. Also depends on what characters show up from each series.
- I'd love to see Gumshoe being told by Layton, "You are the culprit!", just for it to turn out no, it wasn't Don Paolo-it was actually Maggie.
Maya will be a defendant in the Witch Trials.
- A society so obsessed with the Witch Hunt wouldn't pass up a spirit medium. Of course Phoenix couldn't possibly get Maya off the hook without lying then. Or establishing that a spirit medium is much different than a witch.
- Plus not to mention the fact trouble always seem to find Maya.
At some point, Don Paolo will masquerade as Phoenix Wright or Professor Layton.Perhaps that's what the trailer is hinting at. He is a master of disguise, after all.
- Maybe that's not Layton in the trial scene in the trailer, then...
Everybody will be Don Paolo in disguise.At the same time. Even Don Paolo himself.
- Why limit it to people? Don Paolo is Everything!
Maya will channel ClaireBecause Maya summons a dead person in every Ace Attorney game she appears in. If crossed over with the Professor Layton series...
- Ouch. Poor Hershel if she does.
- Better yet, she'll try to channel Claire... and fail, because she's currently in a state between life and death due to Unwound Future. That is, though she died about eight years before this game, her soul is still technically in use as it's traveling to about two years after it. That having been said, I hope they at least try so maybe Claire can have her last name localized since NA missed it.
- That seems...certainly plausible.
- Jossed. However, late in the game, Maya offhandedly mentions that she's a spirit medium to Layton, and it seems to be one of the only things in the game that catches him off-guard, as he begins to stutter and attempt to regain his composure. So make of that what you will.
The puzzles will have an "Object" buttonThe trailer says that "this time, the puzzles are filled with contradictions". Clearly this means that some of the puzzles will have no solution, and you'll have to object to these. There was even a sort of preview of this in Unwound Future with the unsolvable puzzle that Layton presents to Future Luke.
- Unfortunately they only really used it once.
- Confirmed! The game opens with Phoenix and Maya travelling to London, and we see their plane flying over Layton's study.
- Though it turns out Labyrinthia is also part of the real world.
Gumshoe and Chelmey will have to work together
Chelmey: "These days, it seems like everyone and their mum thinks they can do my job."
Gumshoe: "You got that right, pal!"C'mon, you know it'd be awesome.
- OH YES.
The ending will be dual sided
- In the Laytonverse, Layton and Luke will be visiting a dying man who wrote the story after solving an unseen mystery; while in the Ace Attorney world, it'll be a similar situation with someone having just written the story. Basically, it's a Mind Screw Gainax Ending in which both universes are real, but seperate, and fictional to the other.
- That's actually pretty clever, and feels very Layton indeed. However, it's also quite depressing for a reason that I can't quite express... Given both games' overall tone, I would expect a somewhat more uplifting conclusion. Still, nice idea.
- I can see what you mean. It would be sad if the friendship Hershal and Pheonix develop never really existed. But you never know, given the way Laytonverse works, things could still hint at the crossover happeneing, just not in the way the game itself presents it.
- Adding to the idea, the Storyteller is an aging novelist in the Layton verse, while in the AA world he'll be the same, but implied to have psychic powers, thus suggesting that he was sharing ideas between his two selves.
- Jossed. It's a single universe.
Maya can't summon in the new universe
- The ability to summon ghosts is limited just to the PW universe. As soon as they switch dimensions she loses her ability to summon and Phoenix can't ask Mia for help.
- While it's never actually brought up in the game (because Maya never tries) Labrynthia is a part of the normal world, so there's no reason why it shouldn't work, unless exposure to mind-altering ink and whatever's in the water interferes with Maya's ability to focus.
There will be a NA Release.Come on! It will!!
The fact that the two franchises don't quite match up in style and tone will be an important plot point, possibly the key to the entire thing"The mystery is in the contradiction"...
Layton and Luke will get in on the ladder/step-ladder debatePossibly without Phoenix and Maya around to start it.
- Jossed, but at a certain point Maya does a reference to the gag while looking at a ladder.
Don Paolo WON'T be Maya in disguise.He'll be Pearl instead.
- He'll be Trucy! From the future! Cue bewildered and confused Phoenix!
Don Paolo will be somebody in disguise, but at least Layton will know itWhether he's a mildly helpful citizen, a judge or prosecutor, or even the storyteller himself he'll be working with the gang in order to get home/save the witch girl. Don Paolo's too prideful to come out and join with Layton on his own, so he'll do it as somebody else. When the Professor inevitably figures it out he will probably tell Luke and/or Phoenix.
Labyrinth City is a fake, and exists in both universes, which are sharedIn every Layton game, The Reveal flies in the face of everything known about the setting. I see no reason to believe this game shall be different.
- There's only one universe. But the "town is fake" part is right.
- Confirmed. Though his sense of morality is definitely skewed, due to his obvious lack of hang-ups regarding sending women to their "justified" fiery ends, he's portrayed as a noble, lawful and respectful opponent to Nick and Layton, ultimately culminating in him aiding in their escape from the courtroom following their busting out of Espella.
Mahoney will encounter a wolf in storyJust look at how she's dressed. Though admittedly it could be that witch were said to wear red cloaks and travel through the forest to meet their familiars... HOLD IT!
This game takes place between Layton's prequel series and the original seriesWhy would Luke change his clothes into his more modern one from his prequel series one unless he grows up too much.
This game is gonna be a giant Mind ScrewMore so than any other Layton or Ace Attorney game combined.
The plane Phoenix and Maya ride is actually a portal to Labyrinth CityFrom the pictures shown recently, it's been stated that Phoenix and Maya are taking a trip to London for some reason. Who's in London? The Professor, of course. This would be ok if both franchises weren't set in completely different time periods. This Troper's guess is that the plane is Phoenix and Maya's ticket to Labyrinth City.
- Jossed. There are events which take place in London, and translated updates reveal that a mysterious book in London takes them there.
This is the new mystery Luke was talking about in his letter at the end of Unwound/Lost Future.What else could it be? It would certainly make sense. Whatever happens, it will be a Mind Screw.
This will cross over with Ghost Trick at some pointBecause there is a black cat with a handkerchief tied around its neck on the official box art. And we all know who that cat is, and what he can do...
- Possibly jossed. There is a cat named Kuroone, which may be that cat on the box art.
- Definitely jossed. For starters, the cat is female, and her localized name is Eve, not Sissel.
Labyrinthia is actually The Neverending Story.
Arthur Cantabella was able to continue his relationship with the British government because of a precedent.Arthur had an alterior motive for his experiment. The government would have dumped him like yesterday's trash were it not for the fact that it already had a great ally in a brilliant man with unignorable eccentricities stemming from a traumatic experience. Guess who?
- If you're talking about who I think you're talking about, it should be noted that the developers originally planned to give Edgeworth a Labyrinthian outfit similar to Phoenix's, so it's possible he was going to have a much larger role than his cameo appearance at the end. Make of that what you will.
- I'll give you a hint. The eccentricities of the man I'm talking about never cause him to behave rudely. Ever.
Layton and Carmine are a Bad Future Phoenix split into two people.Seeing as Layton is according to Word of God actually an expy of Phoenix (largely his good points) and Carmine makes up for what Layton lacks in terms of what Phoenix is like, perhaps they both come from a post-apocalyptic future where the Dark Age of the Law was victorious, and Phoenix made to go back in time, but an accident caused him to split into two people: an Italian Born Lucky Made of Iron Weirdness Magnet with a penchant for trouble who Drives Like Crazy, and an Actual Pacifist Quintessential British Gentleman and a Scholar Adventurer Archaeologist in a Nice Hat who maintained Phoenix's habit of Giving Someone the Pointer Finger.
Espella and Darklaw would've have black psyche locks if Phoenix used the Magatama on them.Think about this: They both suffered tragic events that clouded their memories. Everyone who've played the main Phoenix Wright games would know that black psyche locks represent secrets hidden deep within the heart, even if one's not aware of them. Athena Cykes of Ace Attorney Dual Destinies hid similar tragic memories into her heart without realizing it, and Phoenix managed to discover her black psyche locks and break them. It's also speculated that Miles Edgeworth also had black psyche locks that were broken by Phoenix even before he got the Magatama, potentially turning this into a Crowning Moment of Awesome as well.
- Very likely, and good thinking.
Barnham and Rouge are brother and sister.It's just an impression I got from how they talked about one another. Barnham knew without hesitation that Rogue would take in Phoenix, Luke, and Espella without question, which implies that he knows Rogue very, very well. They also clearly seem to trust each other implicitly, despite being seemingly on opposite ends of the spectrum (as in, she's, well, a rogue and he's a high member of the legal society). This, despite the fact that he doesn't seem all that fond of the outcasts and people he sees beneath him, and that she doesn't seem to like the Inquisitors much. Rogue also complies with Barnham's request without too many questions, though that may have less to do with being Barnham's sister and more to do with being a good person. They also physically resemble one another, since they have the same skintone and same red hair, a combination that is unique to them. Rouge is also one of the... what, two? people who calls Barnham by his given name (her and the parasol lady with the crush), and talks about him in a casual, familiar way (as though she sees much of him).
- Seconded. Also note that we never discover Rouge's last name, either. It may or may not be confirmed in the Special Episodes.
- The special episodes do not support this. They do show how they met and why they would have such a good grasp on each other's personalities. You could argue that that was only the first time "Inquisitor Barnham" and "Rouge the bartender" met inside Labyrinthia, but they don't mention any shared history in their original lives.
- Yeah, but the special episodes cannot be canon- they contradict the timelines AND knock on the fourth wall too much to fit in with the games. Phoenix is still a lawyer one year after meeting Layton in the special episodes, but PLvsAA took place during or just after Trials and Tribulations, whose last case is in early February (7-10). He lost his badge just over two months later (19 April). Considering the state England's weather is in, implying it is spring, PLvsAA takes place approximately during the week before Phoenix lost his badge. While PLvsAA can be canon, as nothing shows it can't, the special episodes cannot be. Even if PLvsAA took place before T&T and after JFA for Phoenix and Maya (which I think their ages in the game state otherwise), Professor Layton renders the year gap impossible, because it definitely takes place before Unwound Future as Luke departs for presumably the USA after that game ends and after Diabolical/Pandora's Box (because they have met the real Chelmey).
- It's pretty likely that the special episodes are just canon in Broad Strokes; the framing device of the characters returning to Labyrinthia isn't possible, but things relating to the game's backstory, like how Barnham and Rouge met and how the statues worked, are still true, otherwise there'd be no point in mentioning them.
Both Layton and Ace Attorney take place in a post-apocalyptic, largely puzzle-less world.Long ago, before either game began, puzzles were how all problems were solved. There was no war, only puzzles. No feuds, only puzzles. No school, only puzzles. Puzzles calling the shots for anything and everything. Over time, people grew obsessed with puzzles. Puzzles tainted the minds and hearts of many like darkness. They became almost sentient. One day, a Great Puzzle was presented, and that was the start of the Great Puzzle War, as the many people of the world sought to be the first to solve the Great Puzzle. The Puzzle War was tragic, and many lives were tragically lost. It was the puzzle apocalypse. It was Puzzlegeddon. The leaders of the world joined together, desperate to save the citizens of the world, and it was agreed that puzzles, both the Great Puzzle and the everyday puzzles, held too great a force, and it was agreed that they would be sealed away in England. After all, they are the Stiff Upper Lip of the world; surely they could be saved from Puzzle Mania? And so it was for decades, the puzzles of the world buried somewhere deep in England, forgotten by the world. No record of this grand war was kept to prevent people from finding out about puzzles. Then, one day, the almighty power behind puzzles began to taint the minds of the English once more, making them obsessed, making them revive puzzles. The puzzles began to hide in their minds, making them think they, the people, created them, but in reality, the puzzles were written long, long ago. Puzzles are also why the people of the Professor Layton franchise are just so odd looking; the puzzles are behind that, too, like poison in the watermain. The craze only affects the English and those who stay in England for too long. It is also the puzzles who are truly behind each and every single plot of a Layton game, and all of it is one big plan to bring the world's most greatest logical minds, Phoenix Wright and Hershel Layton, together to solve the last, Great Puzzle. And that is why Nick and Maya had no idea what a puzzle was. Because of the Great Puzzle War. Where all puzzles were sealed away and trapped in England.
Barnham, before he came to Labyrinthia, was an old friend of Simon Blackquill'sSimon being from Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney - Dual Destinies . Mostly because they both make the same sword puns and Blackquill is evidently English. Barnham's sword puns are residual memories of he and Blackquill playing as kids and training to be prosecutors. If the WMG that Barnham and Rogue are brother and sister is true, it would also be where Rogue got a few of her own traits from (such as shouting SILENCE while pointing a blade).
- Simon managed a scholarship at a boarding school in Britain, which was the same one Barnham and Rouge went to. There he studied law and had Kendo as an extracurricular activity. While he was practicing Iaijutsu in the open courtyard, Rouge spotted him and developed a crush. Barnham, a member of the fencing team, got wind of this and, fueled by Big Brother instinct and declaring "My Sister Is Off-Limits!" challenged Blackquill to an East-meets-West sword fight. The result was a draw, and the two became good friends afterwards.
The placement of this game in the both series's respective timelinesFor Ace Attorney, this takes place in-between the final case of Trials and Tribulations, during and slightly after the two Edgeworth games, and right before Wright's final case as seen in Apollo Justice. For Professor Layton, this takes place in-between Diabolical Box and Unwound Future.
- That can't be right; not for Phoenix anyway (there's no debating on Layton's timeline). It's Spring in the UK at the end of the game, as evidenced by the flowers blooming in Labyrinthia. Phoenix was only gone for a week (he says as much; the exchange is a week long), so it can't take place during all three of those times, as that's 3 whole months. Considering that it must be Spring and the kind of weather we see, we can actually pinpoint a specific set of dates. It most likely falls the very week before Phoenix was disbarred (which was/will be Thursday, 19 April, 2018), placing the events of PLvsAA as being the week of Sunday 8 April- Saturday 14 April 2018, and they're in Labyrinthia for 9 April (when chapters 2-5 and the first two cases were), 10 April (Chapters 6-8), through the morning of 11 April (Chapters 9-Epilogue). Putting it in the second week of April would give favour to the warmer weather needed for the flowers to be in bloom like that and yet also cover for the rainstorm that hits London in the prologue.
Kira wasn't supposed to the Shade that Darkclaw used fake the Storyteller's death, it was supposed to be Jean.Jean seems so put together that it's spooky despite the death of her master. I had feeling that Jean is the one of Darkclaw's most experience Shades — and has no problem with be an actress of witch or helping the other Shades fake magic for another actress of witch. After the mess-up at the end of Golden Witch Trail, Darkclaw had to use another Shade — so she pick Kira to do so.
Darkclaw used a robotic suit instead of her usual witch costume in London.The robot suit was make out the same pure-black metal with neon-purple and neon-black lights all cover it as well as a jet-glider for the wings.
Bezella actually exists, and the silver bell is proof.After a series of successively weirder plot twists, we find out that the bell from the bell tower is made of pure silver, and that the people of Labrynthia have a condition that causes instant blackouts whenever the sound of pure silver is heard. All seems in order, right? The problem is, there's a big chunk of Fridge Logic sticking out - how was the bell forged? Forging a bell that size would involve striking the bell multiple times, not to mention the fact that actually engraving the bell with all its intricate carvings would result in even more strikes. There's simply no way that the silver bell could have been made. However, it's possible that the bell could have been created by more supernatural means, and considering the lore left behind from the original Great Fire, it's highly likely that Bezella would have created it.
- They could have melted the silver into a bell-shaped mold.
- For the actual bell itself, yes. What about the carvings, though? Even if those were part of the mold, you'd need to shave off some of the excess. And they would've had to test it in order to make sure the tone was right, too.
- Someone outside the town created it? Perhaps they shipped it in before they realized the water was tainted?