How come so little about Earth 16 history is unknown?
I assume you mean how little is known and the answer would be that the show is still only in its first season.
Artemis is The Mole, really? I don't think so. We're talking about Greg Weisman here; it would be too obvious. The villain in the "Infiltrator" episode threatened to reveal Artemis' identity. If she was working for the Light, why would she threaten her?.
Remember that Superboy's purpose is to replace Superman if he perishes or if he turns from the LIGHT?. Nothing wrong with that right? Until you realize the villain's group name is The Light.
For me The Mole will be Miss Martian. In the comics, she's a White Martian with implented memories and was a villain in the future (not that she hadn't to fight her darkside in the present all the time). Besides she uses that amazing adult voice in "Welcome to Happy Harbor" and it would be really a waste to not hear it more often.
Regarding the original entry, do keep in mind that the target audience isn't familiar with the comics. Besides with Artemis, since her comic counterpart actually is a villain, DC would have the least problems with her. If it see Superboy or Miss Martian, then it'll probably end up like Superboy's counterpart in the comics during the "Insiders" arc or Hawkgirl in Justice League and thus resist/betray the Light in the end. Otherwise DC would probably pull rank like they have before and say "You can't use this character in this way."
Could be Red Tornado. But anyway if it's Miss Martian, why does the Martian Manhunter back her story?
It's Red Tornado.
"Humanity" says otherwise. Try Fake Defector instead. Red Tornado wanted to protect the team and find his creator.
Artemis? Too obvious. I still believe that it's Superboy albeit unknowingly. Considering how Crazy-Prepared the Light are, they probably have a Trigger Phrase or something that makes Superboy turn against his friends and the League; wait until he's wormed his way into the superhero community before getting him to destroy it from the inside out (lucky that his girlfriend is a telepath which combined with The Power of Love is probably how they'll break him out of the mind control).
Artemis does look like a red herring after the most recent episodes. With the new conference between Red Tornado, Aqualad, Robin, Red Arrow and Batman, I'd place my bets on either Megan or Superboy but I'm leaning towards Miss Martian since she freaked out when Black Canary said that she had turned white during the shrink session with Black Canary.
Given that both Robin and the entire Justice League appear to know exactly who Artemis really is, it would be quite a shock indeed if she turned out to be The Mole as it means outplayed every single one of them. It is far more likely to be Superboy, especially since The Light hinted that the mole was planted in their very first appearance, which was before either Artemis or Miss Martian showed up (though its possible they just meant they had set up their inclusions to the team in the then-near future).
For that matter, who says there even is a mole? It could easily be misinformation to divide the team.
Jossed, Jossed, all of it's Jossed. It's actually Red Arrow. Nice work, writers! Not a single Headscratcher about it.
Why does everyone think that Robin is somehow destined to lead the group? Yes he has more experience but he's by far the youngest and a big smartass.
Because he's the partner to Batman. He's got the most skill, the most brains and the most experience and training. Also Genre Savvy regarding the comics?
In other words, the rest of the team seems to place a lot of value on his experience. This makes more sense depending on how little experience they have; if it's next to none (possibly the case for Miss Martian and certainly for Superboy), or at most very little, then Robin's experience should be that important. Unfortunately we haven't really seen that kind of discrepancy.
This doesn't make a lot of sense since he has experience but it's not the most useful experience for the situations he has to deal with. He doesn't have experience being on a team for one thing and there's no saying that by the time Robin is "ready to lead" his other teammates won't have a comprable level of experience and training. It could be argued that all Robin actually has is a head start when it comes to super-heroing but that any of the team members could catch up to him.
It's worth noting that Robin is the most ambitious and tends to set their goals whereas the rest of the team defaults to "this looks suspicious; let's go back". He also tends to see the bigger picture. These qualities don't really stand out much though given they're currently only a recon team and are tasked with simple objectives.
Aqualad makes more sense as a leader. I'm a bit annoyed with Robin's apparent destiny of leadership when Aqualad clearly has things in hand.
Just because you're good at something doesn't mean you want it. To me, it seems Aqualad is just fine not being leader. He doesn't really have any drive to be a leader. Robin does. Robin has ambition and experience.
The Dick Grayson and Tim Drake versions of Robin both led the Teen Titans and Tim led the comic book version of Young Justice. (Although personally I thought it was obvious they were setting Aqualad up to be the leader from the pilot).
I figured that it was more about Aqualad being modest about his ability to lead as he didn't volunteer like Kid Flash or assume he'd be like Robin.
Can we say that Dick Grayson is highly known for his natural leadership skills? He might still need to learn how to control impulses and lose some immaturity (which is justified since he's only thirteen here) but it's been present. Heck; the pilot itself has him act first and think quickly while the rest look on with dumbfounded faces.
Yeah; it's kind of ironic that Dick Grayson (who's been doing the leader thing for nearly 60 years and currently heads the Justice League in the comics) of all people has to be second-guessed on his leadership skills because there had to be a reason for Aqualad to be written in as the leader...at least for now. Granted Aqualad is more qualified at the moment but the whole thing was handled less than optimally.
The episode when they finally establish the leader also is a huge display on his part. He gets the information they needed and then confronts the boss only to be called back by his team but not before he takes the enemy's transport out of commission. He just seems a step ahead of everybody else and only needs to learn how to slow down and explain the plan to the team. Under Aqualad's leadership, he still saves the day as shown in Artemis' debut. Superboy gets taken out and it is up to him to stop the destruction of his adoptive father's company. He saves the day.
In "Bereft", with Aqualad KO'd, Robin takes over almost automatically. He might not have experience dealing with this sort of team but he's learning fast.
Then again in "Homefront," he orchestrates a rescue and seems to be again two steps ahead of everyone. But this time he calms Artemis down from a panic while remaining completely unfazed by the chaos.
Once again in "Failsafe," As soon as Aqualad "dies", Robin takes charge and no one questions him. They all trust in his experience and knowledge so it's not that weird to assume he'll eventually lead the team one day.
While Robin does seem to be a jerkass often in this show, he was almost just as annoying in the main DCU in the beginning too and (As Nightwing) is considered to be the heart of the DCU and the only hero anyone would follow bravely into any unknown. He'll probably grow into this in the this canon also.
Is it racist of me to wonder why there's a black gilled humanoid? What good is melanin deep underwater where sunlight barely penetrates? Shouldn't he (and Aquaman for that matter) be really pale?
I don't think it's racist. Maybe there is an artificial sun in Atlantis?
In the comics, the character is only half-Atlantean. His father is classic Aquaman villain Black Manta. We'll see if it pans out the same way in the cartoon.
However Greg has said that Kaldur lives in a different city than Aquaman.
Atlanteans in Young Justice are really, really diverse, some have fins, tails, green and blue skintones and tons of other differences. Kaldur being black probably doesn't even register.
Maybe Atlanteans have some sort of increased proclivity for genetic mutation or something.
The League's handling of Amazo made no sense:
Why not just destroy the darn thing? I can only assume they wanted it analyzed in case they needed a countermeasure if there were more Amazos.
Why have it studied in normal laboratories as opposed to the League Headquarters? Wouldn't it be safer there (and have better equipment?)
Finally why the truck convoys; why couldn't Superman or The Flash drop the parts by themselves (in seconds too.)
You have a good point but bringing Amazo to the League Headquarters would've ended badly, as he was being tracked.
Not to mention that as indicated by the end of the episode, they were far more concerned with finding Ivo, the man that could build MORE and stronger Amazos than to deliver the pieces of a single prototype.
I think the reason why Amazo was sent to Stars Labs might had to do with the fact that in this reality. The league is out in the public more and are virtually celebrities and so to maintain good public relations. I'm assuming they send their super villains tech to private/public companies instead of the Watchtower among many other things.
I think they sent it via truck convoy to be less conspicuous. If Superman and the Flash went on this mission it would be all over the news. If Young Justice does it, no one knows about it and there's less chance someone might try to steal the android ('course, they didn't know Ivo could track the parts, but still).
Is Miss Martian a White Martian still? I know J'onn calls her his niece but that could just a nickname/cover up sort of thing. I always kinda felt her rejection of her heritage was a big part of her character and it bugs me to think they might have gotten rid of such a cool factoid.
It was a major reveal at the time in the comics if you'll recall...not part of her introduction. Give it time.
The official site also says that she uses her shapeshifting to conceal her true appearance which can easily be interpreted as a point in favor of the idea that they're going with this.
Or that she simply has a more alien real appearance. Green Martians in their true forms don't look like humans with green skin, after all.
We already have a character posing as a Leaguer's niece. Why can't we have another?
After seeing episode 06, I totally agree with you guys now. The hiding her true form thing plus the fact Artemis is posing as Arrow's niece too coupled with her distaste of her Martian family (notice how she reacted when she mentioned her Martian sisters when talking to Artemis?) leads me to believe they left it in! Yay!
I don't know...In "Bereft," she has no memory of coming to Earth yet still refers to the Martian Manhunter as "Uncle J'onn." Unless she's a very quick thinker who instantaniously decided to pretend to be his niece, I don't find that too likely.
Uncle is a term of affection as much as one of relation and if she'd known J'onn since at least before March, it could merely be that she refers to him as such is all.
This was heavily hinted at in "Targets" with Megan's "...of course I'm Green".
Before Megan says that, she mentions that the White Martians are treated as second-class citizens by the Green Martians. I'm not a comic book expert but aren't White Martians portrayed as being vicious bloodthirsty warriors in the comics? Either the portrayals of Green Martians and White Martians have been reversed in the show or Megan was lying.
They're not mutually exclusive. They could be treated as second-class citizens because they're bloodthirsty warriors.
As of "Disordered", I'm calling it Confirmed. The way she freaks out at the idea of turning White...
For me, until it's directly stated in the show, "M'gann is a White Martian," she'll assume that M'gann is supposed to be a Green Martian in this continuity. M'gann's minor freakout in "Disordered" over Black Canary's "You've turned white" comment can easily be explained by her being worried that she's losing control of her shapeshifting just as she lost control of her mental powers during the telepathic simulation in "Failsafe."
There's one minor problem with explaining M'gann's freakout over the "You've turned white" comment as her being worried about losing control of her shapeshifting: she calms down very quickly when she sees Black Canary meant Caucasian but turning Caucasian wouldn't be that much less of an indicator of losing control of her shapeshifting than turning literally white. Well...unless her natural colour was white but that would indicate that she is a White Martian.
As of "Image", Confirmed. She's a White Martian. It was hinted that she might be fighting her darker nature, but she mostly seems afraid of showing her rather hideous form.
I think she's a White Martian adopted into a Green Martian family. It would explain her lonely childhood and self-image as a Green Martian, and make her Martian Manhunter's literal, but not biological, niece.
I suspect that she is both at the same time: Her biological parents are Black Sheep Malefic and a White Martian mother, and she was adopted by a couple that includes one of J'onn's other siblings.
Word of Greg Weisman is that M'gann is J'onn's biological niece- she was born to a Green Martian mother (J'onn's sister) and a White Martian father. And most of her siblings are Green Martians- except M'gann herself and 1 brother.
In Infiltrator, why Wally has to go to school but Dick doesn't?
They live in different cities and I'm pretty sure in different states. Wally's school year could easily have started earlier than Dick's.
What's more; this was Wally's first day of class. Makes this explanation much more likely.
The School Year starts at different times in the United States? For real? I didn't know that; I actually kinda thought it might have something to do with Wally being in High School and Dick in Middle School.
Actually, Dick is a freshman in high school, as stated by Weisman. According to Word of God, he hasn't skipped any grades. Seems like he's one of those kids who start school almost a year younger than nearly everyone else in the same grade.
The United States is a really big place with many different school districts who make their own policy. Plus there's the difference between private and public school: each private school can set their own vastly different dates for the first day of school.
American school districts generally start and end within a certain window but that window is fairly wide. For example, my cousins in the Midwest tend to start school in early to mid August and get out in early to mid May. My old school on the east coast always starts the Tuesday after Labor Day (which is sometimes in the second week of September) and gets out in mid to late June. This even continues in college: I've had friends start school as early as July or as late as September.
Maybe Dick has a GED as part of all his training under Bruce? Can't be an awesome detective without a basic education after all...
Nope; he specifically says in the Amazo episode that the final fight scene takes place at his school after which we cut to a picture of him winning some kind of trophy before it gets destroyed in the fight.
Plus Dick goes to the Gotham Academy which seems to be quite a prestigious private school (Artemis needed a scholarship to go there) and they tend to set their own schedules.
What color as Artemis' eyes? They look blue sometimes and black at others. The series doesn't look like one of those series where the characters have black eyes in replacement for their actual eye colors like basically every cartoon until recently. Also she's human and she has black eyes? Everyone else has remotely normal eye colors.
There are such things as contact lenses that change your eye color.
Why would she be wearing contacts? Maybe the blue eyes were a beta-idea.
They look to me like the normal kind of Asian eyes that look black but are really dark brown. Though Bruce Wayne on the other hand seems to have black eyes here too...
According to Greg, she was never supposed to have blue eyes and officially they're a very dark gray...almost black. Unfortunately both the production artwork and the tie-in comic gave her blue eyes on accident.
Greg also confirmed Bruce Wayne has brown eyes in Young Justice.
Why does the team so rarely wear their costumes? Even if they're supposed to be covert, it doesn't make sense for them to wear civilian clothing on missions like the AMAZO escort in "Schooled" or the Dr. Fate check-up in "Denial." They aren't even trying to hide their identities. It's less of an issue for Miss Martian, Superboy and Aqualad and Robin at least has his sunglasses. But Kid Flash doesn't hide any of his face and in "Denial," he ran into Abra Kadabra, a Flash Rogue. There's no way that shouldn't come back to bite him.
They only wear their costumes when they are dealing with their own. Plus Wally isn't exactly a well-known public figure so it won't bite him as much as Dick Grayson, the adopted son of well known billionaire, Bruce Wayne.
Seems like The Worf Effect is setting in on Superboy awfully early. Mister Twister and Blockbuster I can understand giving him some trouble but Clayface? In a training simulator?
It wasn't a simulation; the flash of light was the teleporter bringing the team back to base. As for the Clayface fight, it happened offscreen so it's up to your imagination how he beat Superboy (though I recall that DCAU Clayface was all but indestructible unless he got hit with enough water...)
It's actually explained later in the series. Superboy is only half-Kryptonian, so he lacks the ability to use most of Superman's powers and can't match his physical strength.
For that matter, how did Clayface managed to defeat Robin? Robin probably has fought against Clayface plenty of times with Batman and knows his weak spots.
Yeah; I was a little puzzled by that too since Batman beat him with a taser that looked exactly like the one Robin used against Superboy in the pilot.
Why would Batman allow any training to be that easy and have the same weak spots that Robin already knows about?
Training? I got the impression it was an actual mission. After all if it was a training stimulation, why would Batman need to jump in to help? Why couldn't he just stop/pause the stimulation?
Rewatched the episode. The sudden shift of location in that sequence made me think that it was a simulation. I was wrong. Regardless Clayface may have just been on point that battle.
Also possible that Batman's element of surprise from his Dynamic Entry was a factor. Thus far the team has done a God-awful job of keeping hidden until they attack. Clayface could have dodged and taken out Robin's taser.
Judging by the Tie-In comic covers, we'll get an answer in issue 12
Easily explained all around then. There have been multiple villains taking the name Clayface, generally with a power-set consistent to Clayface II. Some have been more adept or vulnerable concerning these powers.
The entire battle leading up to the beginning of "Downtime" is portrayed in issue 13 of the comics - the Team were unaware of Clayface's shapeshifting abilities, so he took them out one by one by pretending to be different members of the Team. He took out Robin by becoming two KFs, and Robin assumed that one was an imposter and therefore the other was real, allowing Clayface to trick him and take him by surprise.
When did Megan start liking Conner? I started shipping the pairing as a Crack Pairing in the second episode; it seemed like they'd be friends and nothing more. Come the next episode and she's crushing.
I've always thought that Megan started liking Superboy in the second episode, what with her commenting shyly about liking his T-shirt.
This is obviously more of an issue with the comic universe but what's an Atlantean doing with a human name like Garth?
I could chalk that up to two cultures have coincidental similarities. "Yuri" is a male name in Russian and female in Japanese for example. And Superman's Kryptonian name is Hewbrew for "right hand of God".
Culturally, yes; it could be a coincidence, but, linguistically- it makes no sense. With names like Orin, Orm, Tula, Kaldur'ahm, Sha'lain'a, Mera and Topo, Garth is really jarring. Doesn't match with what I assume are the standard phonemes of the naming system, or Greek for that matter. Furthermore their language is based off of ancient Greek yet their names are so un-Greek sounding it comes across as Narm. Is there some ancient Atlantean language that got replaced by Greek where their naming system derives from? Are their dialects or different languages throughout the kindgom? It'd be nice if Word of God could expound upon this.
Well, from a Doylist perspective, it's a continuity nod to the comics - Garth was Aqualad in the original Teen Titans comics in 1964, with a line up that also included Dick Grayson, Wally West, and Roy Harper.
Batman has to know who Aqualad's dad is and what Artemis's history is. Why else would he insist that Robin keep his identity secret? He is Batman, people. What I don't get is why is he hiding this from Robin or Kid Flash?
Because he's Batman. He likely has good logical reasons for divulging such information since he's likely got it covered. Heck; he might not even think it really matters who is whose daddy or how checkered one's past is as long as they're fighting the good fight.
Also anyone aware of Robin's identity also means they'd know Batman's. And while this version of Bruce is for the most part a reasonable human being, he's still shifty enough for one to believe that he doesn't fully trust metahumans as per his counterpart in the comics.
As of "Secrets", it's apparent he does know all about Artemis' identity, but nothing is said on Kaldur. So that means that Batman does tell him some things. Then again, He'sBatman, so we all know he knows that Wally knows who Robin is. So he would probably withhold some things, out of a fear that Robin would blab to his Bestie.
It's more likely that Robin figured out who Artemis was on his own than that Batman told him.
Robin's explanation is "I'm a detective." And if you watch "Infiltrator" again, his reaction to Artemis' introduction is a snarky "Another niece, huh?" and he goes on to realize out that the arrow they attributed to Speedy in "Schooled" was actually shot by Artemis. In Gotham City. So he's known that Artemis hangs around Gotham since episode 7 and the tone he uses for his "Another niece?" line seems to suggest that he finds it a bit too coincidental, given that M'gann is already J'onn's niece and Wally is Barry's nephew. It probably wasn't too difficult for him to take the information he had (archer girl who lives in Gotham) and remember that Sportsmaster also lives in Gotham, and archery is a sport...
I thought it was a bit reckless for Megan to just leave the unconscious Aqualad who was in serious condition and the others (two members were either low on energy or almost out of ammunition) on their own while she went off to save Superboy. Yes; Superboy was in danger and being tortured but would it have hurt to at least communicate with the others and come up with some sort of plan as a team?
I completely agree with the above statement. Robin was the only one who was capable of fending them in a fight whereas Artemis was crippled by her lack of arrows and Kid Flash by his low energy. None of them knew Aqualad's condition (he's been passed out for at least 24 hours) and how seriously it could have changed for him; also he's their LEADER. Megan decides to forgo all logic and reasoning so she could pursue someone without the support of her team (or even supporting them) or without knowing what took their memories away before. She rushed into the heart of a military operation to save someone who was far away rather than supporting the person right in front of her because she was fueled by selfishness and emotion. Almost reminds me of what Kakashi said to Sakura during the bell test.
Absolutely nothing in the episode indicates it was her crush. She saw a teammate being tortured and screaming with nobody to help and decided to go help. Meanwhile 'just' Robin is still someone for Aqualad to have. Acting like risking herself to save a teammate is selfish is completely ridiculous.
I was bugged over the idea that she wasn't called out on it. What she did was incredibly irresponsible but it was perfectly okay because she saved the day. Now maybe they're saving this up for a future episode where her teammates will refer to her past actions but for now I'm just bugged that pulled a stunt like that without any consequences.
It should also be noted that other people justify her actions because Superboy was in a "more dire" situation.
How is it values dissonance to prioritise being tortured (when he's not indestructible) over being ill however severely so? Torture is pretty freaking dire.
He's freakin' indestructible; he'd have been fine if they had waited a little longer to rescue him.
He was also being freaking tortured.
With no idea who he was or what was happening to him. A problem that only Megan could solve unlike Aqualad.
Yeah; she was the only one who could fight the memory loss making the security of her head top priority for the team. The way she ran off without back up could have easily ended with her losing her memory again and leaving the team down the only superpowered member who was functioning. Superboy may be able to feel pain but he has yet to have been physically hurt over the long term. He was being tortured but unless they had Kryptonite, he wasn't in any danger of permanent damage or death like Aqualad at the time. The most responsible thing to have done would've been to regroup and think out a plan to save Superboy with the team instead of charging in.
Decision making is a lot easier when you're sitting in your home as opposed to in the desert having just recovered from six months of memory loss and hearing your crush tortured in your mind.
Not to mention a fairly large part of this show is their comparative inexperience. The team in general doesn't make perfect decisions 100% of the time; we can't expect to see every single example held up as reprehensible or that would basically be the whole show.
My guess why this particular instance rubbed people the wrong way was because Megan's emotional decision put the mission and the rest of the team at risk instead of just herself. Her choice could have lead to disaster for everyone and I think she should have at least been called out on it to show it was the wrong decision to make.
But it wasn't. If she hadn't done what she'd done, Superboy could have been kidnapped by evil scientists. He could have been tortured to death. He could have escaped and killed someone in a way that might have been traumatising to realise when she restored his mind. Compared to leaving Aqualad in one completely functioning and two semi-functioning heroes' hands when he had a less pressing issue to worry about...when Superboy had nobody at all? How is that the wrong decision? As to all this emotional/crush/etc. stuff, the show doesn't support that particularly; there's nothing to say she wouldn't have done the same for anyone...especially any teammate...being brutally tortured. Also Kid Flash did the same thing for much less reason in Drop Zone when he revealed everyone after going to look for Robin, jepordizing the mission by preventing stealth. I don't see a long Just Bugs Me for that.
It was the wrong decision because they still had no idea how they had lost their memories. For all Megan knew, she was walking right into another memory lose situation where she'd have been useless to both Superboy and the team (something Robin yelled after her when she bolted). Superboy is a clone of Superman; he's indestructible so he wasn't going to die anytime soon. The best way to have saved him without putting the mission and the team at risk (because if they lost Megan, they probably wouldn't have a way to retreat) would have been to consult with the team and come up with a strategy. Kid Flash's screw up in Drop Zone (Sorry they both had D's in the title) was less serious IMO because the team was intact and not in crisis like it was in Bereft. Everyone was at a hundred percent and they had a means of retreat if they had too, not so in this situation.
Except...judging from the end results, it really wasn't the wrong decision. People can write paragraphs on why it wasn't but they can't deny that the actual results of the decision she made weren't the most ideal outcome.
Except that actually since Superboy is way less powerful than Superman and can be hurt easily by random robotic monkeys, that...doesn't really apply. And again it may not have been the best plan in the history of the universe but as a quickfire decision when every second counted, it doesn't deserve to get vilified; certainly no more than the many mistakes most everyone on the team has at some point made and gotten away with. Also in Drop Zone (...Downtime, what?), Wally revealed their position in a stealth mission for no reason at all when he knew Robin regularly did the whole 'disappearing act' thing and was likely fine. He nearly got them all killed and threw the entire thing. It's hard for non-speedsters to be confident they can retreat from unprepared for gunfire.
Aqualad's survival is debatable; it's only "Okay" since we know the outcome but at that point in time, there was no way for other to tell whether he would have survived any longer. Kid Flash was faulty for reckless acting in his pursuit of Robin but he wasn't overly consumed by his emotions towards another team member (or anyone else really) to let it override his reasoning. A huge problem is that Megan could have helped Aqualad first and could have ensured he was stabilized rather than leaving him with her other teammates who may have been capable of handling him somewhat but not when they're depowered and have a milita on their tails. I'm not saying what Megan did should not have happened but it really should have been pointed out to her that her behavior was completely inappropriate for their mission. If the bioship was too far out of range for her to call it back, what would have ensured that the team had found it soon thus avoiding the Biyalian milita and Aqualad suffering from severe dehydration and the risk of heatstroke? Most likely it's invisible since the Biyalians are ont hr prowl so why did Megan think leaving her other three teammates to fend for themselves and waltzing into a dangerous situation to save one teammate was such a good idea? The argument of Superboy's suffering is only justified if her other teammates could avoid a similar fate: Aqualad was suffering too and there's no way you should be able to say "oh; he wasn't in the same type of pain as Superboy!" because he's an Atlantean...who has been in the desert...for around 24 hours. Who knows what else could have happened had she failed and lost to Psimon like she did the first time? Who knows what would have happened had the Biyalians found the other three?
Aqualad's survival was no more debatable than Superboy's. If Megan hadn't rushed off, who knows what would have happened to him? Even if his captors hadn't killed him, they could have reprogrammed him or just up and left and took him out of Megan's range in the meantime. And Superboy had zero other people to help him to Aqualad's three.
A lot has been said about Superboy not being in physical danger from the torture due to his indestructibility. But this seems to miss the point that most torture isn't meant to cause physical, but mental and emotional damage. Two things Superboy is quite vulnerable to.
There were three people with Aqualad who did in fact manage to get him back just fine. Superboy was on his own, kidnapped. By the time she got back to him, they might have taken him away and then what do they do? Bearing in mind he's not indestructable and has shown to be hurt, was being tortured had lost his mind (literally) and was a danger to others around him if he got out...which is more important: preventing his immediate kidnapping and torture or *helping with* Aqualad's less immediate health problems when three other people were there? To say it's fine to leave Superboy with nobody but that leaving Aqualad with three people is wrong...makes no sense. She wasn't prioritising Superboy; she was avoiding prioritising Aqualad. 'Sides it's not the first time; Wally did the same thing in Drop Zone.
Wow; this thread just bugs me. I mean let's look shall we? Megan is "overemotional", incapable of caring about anything but her crush, needs to be punished for making a decision that saved the day and made sense with the information she had to hand since all she really knew was that Supes was being tortured and had no mind and that Aqualad had Rob/Art/KF to look after him. Bearing in mind that without a leader and as the only one with access to all the information she had to basically make her own splitsecond decision. Meanwhile like said above, Wally gets excused for making the exact same mistake without the justification. Unfortunate Implications much, guys? Think about it. Maybe the fandom's made me jaded but geez. Yeah. Those overemotional girls with their girly crushes saving people from...Er...being tortured and kidnapped.
I think the trope you're looking for is Double Standard. Wonder if the Fan Dumb would criticize Megan for going to save Superboy if she was a guy?
I would then feel that the action was completely random and uncoordinated...at least lacking the same type of justification that love/crushing could provide.
It atleast calls for What the Hell, Hero? on the main page after all the rest of YJ DID call her out on it. But it's a really tough decision. On the one hand you have Aqualad who is dying of dehydration and has no memories but has 3 friends to help him; on the other hand, we have Superboy who is litterly a mindless animal, being tortured, and screaming out in pain. Who do you save: the starving teammate with 3 friends or the dying teamamte who had his mind erased and cant even think?
The difference between Kid Flash and Miss Martian is that Kid Flash was called out for his crap immediately afterwards. Miss Martian never was so the situation is looked at a lot worse.
And how do you know Megan didn't get chewed out by Batman once they got back to base?
Different case. Artemis was fully armed and not in danger of dying when Megan went to save Kid Flash. Aqualad was dying and was protected by one out of energy Fragile Speedster, one Badass Normal without her equipment and one Badass Normal who is not going to be able to stand up to tanks without some serious firepower. Additionally it's still debatable about whether or not Superboy would have died if she hadn't shown up.
Just to summarize: It bugs some people that Megan makes emotional decisions when it comes to rescuing people and that's okay. The Unfortunate Implications and Double Standards associated with this bug other tropers and that's okay. We're only what...ten?...episodes into this series so let's not rip ourselves apart so soon, okay? =)
This thread is a waste of space. Yes; Megan leaving on her own to go rescue Superboy was reckless. That was pointed out in the episode itself. I got the impression that she was just reacting to feeling someone who was in pain in her head. She should have at least waited to get a bit of a plan together but she reacted on instincts to save someone who was being tortured. I also got the impression that Megan would have reacted the same way if any of the other people on the team were the one(s) being hurt. It's just a part of Megan's characterization that she will act without thinking clearly when it comes to trying to help someone.
I'm just a little bit shocked that this was worth arguing about. Jesus Christ.
Something that bears noting: M'gann was the only member of the team with the skills necessary to successfully rescue Conner. Any of the others would have been unable to combat Psimon's powers. If she had brought backup when she went to save Conner, who knows what Psimon could have made them do? Regardless of her motivations or the objective recklessness of her actions, in hindsight it was the best decision to produce the best result.
I have a few questions
Why did they take Kaldur to the desert if he's so easily crippled by it? If you must take him, why weren't he and the rest of them carrying extra water? They'd only been there 24 hours...not 24 days. Why not paracute a large amount of water in? They also paracuted in that huge communications thing so a few liters of water should have been no problem.
I assume the issue wasn't solely being in the dessert. They were originally there for minor recon at night but after the mindwipe, he was most likely disoriented and wandering for hours until daytime in which he was baking in the sun. I don't think it was simply the dessert but a series of bad situations that lead to his predicament.
Why is Megan's alleged screw up worse than all the others? Dick and Wally rush off. Conner rushes in. Artemis (My fave by the way) lets Chessire, a professional killer go rather than face an awkward explanation to her friends. Kaldur has lead the team into some serious smackdowns (And forgot to bring his own damn water).
Why wasn't the bio-ship stealth parked next to that black thing that paracuted in? In fact, why didn't they leave the black thing in there? If they were going to be in the desert for more than a day Kaldur would have appreciated having somewhere to rest out of the sun.
Finally why do people think Superboy is totally invulnerable? In the comics, he, Superman and Supergirl have all been killed at some point. We know they're vulnerable to psychic attacks and hey, there's a psychic villain just there. Plus they have him tied up and could stuff him in a military helicopter and fly him to some secret brain-washing facility where he'd never be seen again until he was loyal to The Light.
Okay; what is wrong with Dr. Fate? Possessing a teenage boy who just saved the world and him? I like the guy but...what's his logic here?
Did you actually watch the episode? It was very clearly explained why Nabu possessed Kid Flash.
Yes; of course I did. I think you misunderstood me. I mean at the end when he was planning to possess him permanently until Kent Nelson convinced Fate otherwise.
Nabu needed a new host. Wally was available. Morality didn't really seem to figure in it at all unless you count Nabu's need to fulfil his role as a Lord of Order. However as you mention, Nelson agrees with you that it was wrong and calls him out on it, convincing him to relent.
Blue and Orange Morality, plain and simple. Nabu only cares about his fight with Chaos. Mortals are just pawns for him to use. Arguably the only reason he agreed to releasing Wally was that Wally was so against the idea of magic that he was arguably the worst person to possess if Nabu wanted to use his full powers.
It's because Nelson had refusd to put the helmet on for several decades by that point; Nabu considered that criminal negligence, since at point there might have been a numer of crises' Dr Fate should have dealt with, or a major threat like Mordru or some such could have popped up randomly and wrecked shit while Kent Nelson was busy worrying about his private life. He doesn't regard humans as "pawns"; he just doesn't see why they should value their independance more than the fate of the world/ universe, and if Kent Nelson is going to shirk his responsibilities then he'll have to take a more direct approach, regardless of the host or if he has to force them, because Nelson forced him. He very much cares about humans- thats why he does that job, but he thinks they should take his role more seriously.
Look at it from Fates Point of view, he was stuck in a And I Must Scream scenario for decades alone inside that helmet, he was desperate for something else than just sitting there.
OK; so just what the hell was that ball thing in "Bereft"? I've been digging through wikis and such for information about it and it's clear it came from Apokolips but I can't find any info on it.
Could be an original concept by Weisman or one of the others behind the show. Or something so old and obscure that information about is buried deep has become forgotten. Wwooooooo-oooo-oooo!
Granted, it doesn't bear any resemblance to...any of them but it could be this world's version of the Super-Cycle. Young Justice had one in the comics so it'd make sense.
I have seen it speculated that it's the Earth-16 version of a Mother Box...
Is it actually a thing? I thought it was just a way to stress-test the new transport system.
It's a New Genisphere... also the Supercycle... and Superboy's pet...
As regards the day at the beach scene: Why exactly were they having a day at the beach there? Are they not supposed to be a covert operation? Hidden in Plain Sight is one thing...one thing that involves some actual hiding. When you go prancing along the beach with a green skinned redhead in a brightly colored swimsuit and blond and blue/gray-eyed black guywith some pretty rockin' and very prominent tattoos, you're no longer hiding. Did they commute? Kid Flash's entrance seems to indicate it was a planned thing and his direct transit to the base loaded down with beach gear seems to indicate the beach day was local. Or was this simply an excuse to put the green girl in a swimsuit and show how much more fun they were having than Kid Flash?
I just assumed Bruce bought the beach to hide the base better.
I'd just like to point out how many little issues can be solved by saying "Bruce bought X." I had assumed it was a private beach as well.
I could be wrong but to me, it looked like the beach they were at sat literally right at the base of Mt. Justice which might help to explain its privacy.
How come Red Arrow didn't destroy the fog machine earlier in the Artemis episode?
Because he never asked what it was or if she finished and was kinda busy trying to get her to safety with the entire castle bearing down on him.
Couldn't he just shoot an arrow at the machine in a few seconds and then go about recusing the doctor?
The doctor tells him that they need to bring it with them. She doesn't tell him why. For all Roy knew, destroying it might have just made things worse.
In "Denial" how does Aqualad know exactly where the keyhole is when they first open the tower?
I got the impression a keyhole (And by extension, a door) appears on the tower wherever someone just holds the key out. Magic/Advanced science is fun like that.
What was this◊ in Megan's memory? It looks exactly like a White Martian but is it something else?
Well...in the comics, M'gann is a White Martian in disguise to atone for her race so it's probably a memory of hers.
That's what I guessed and it appears the same here but maybe it's something else?
If it's something else and important, I imagine it will be revealed. Until then, I think it's pretty safe to say it's a White Martian.
It could be a G-nome.
No horns = not a G-nome.
Apparently someone let it slide that White Martians look similar to the clover field monster (see here now compair it to the above image◊. I belive we've found a White Martian everyone!
In 'Bereft', when M'gann first attempts to jog her memory, the two scenes she remembers are herself baking cookies for the team and the voice of Aqualad telling her to go do some infiltrating while Superboy tells her to be careful. Since she never saw Aqualad in those memories, she doesn't remember that he's a member of the team.....But she heard his voice in that brief memory so why doesn't she think that there must simply be a sixth member she doesn't know?
She may have assumed it was someone not on the team that helped advise them (someone like Batman) or she may have barely noticed the voice.
Okay; so supposedly superheroes...or at least the "Silver Age"...are a "recent" thing in the universe of this series. But then, Greg Weisman said Superman's been active for 10 years and Batman 9. Even barring according to in the comics canon (as a whole), Tim Drake became Robin at this point, Wally's the Flash and Dick's Nightwing; how the hell can the Silver Age superheroes count as a "recent event" at this point in the universe of this series?
This is Earth 16 Dude.
I'm sorry but that doesn't work. Saying it's "Earth 16" doesn't change the fact that by 9-10 years, things aren't considering recent anymore; ergo despite what Weisman said, the Silver Age heroes shouldn't really be considered a "very recent phenomenon" anymore in this universe.
If Superman/Batman have been active 9-10 years then it stands to reason the other superheroes started later. So your probably looking at closer to 5-6 years for your average hero. (And in the case of Batman people probably don't have a real "Start date" for him since he generally does the whole myth or not a myth thing at least at the start.) So the only one that the public is probably aware the first appearance of would be Superman, making superheroes a rarity for at least 4 years or so.
Saying it's Earth 16 makes perfect sense; nothing says that anything that happened on Earth 0 (current DC Earth) has to happen on Earth 16. Also 10 years is not a long time.
I think Weisman was reffering to the League which has only been known to the public for only four years if anything else.
It could have worked...calling something recent depends on what one is comparing it to...but the Justice Society scuppers any explanation that relies upon there not being any superheroes at all before twenty or so years ago (other DC universes tend to have at least customed heroes and often superpowered heroes active during World War II and 70 years is enough to call 9/10 years 'recent' in comparison).
10 years is not that long. You realize that when you're old enough to notice there are people you've know for 10 years or that you haven't seen in 10 years.
Batman's has been active nine years but Robin has only been around for four. While five years may be a bit longer than usual for Bruce to patrol Gotham solo, taken out of context of the larger DC multiverse, it doesn't strike me as that odd. I think they made Dick so young here so they could really show him growing into a leadership role which stands a chance of making a nice subtle story arc. With his age-down comes the age-down of other characters like Wally.
Also remember that Young Justice is working with a *much* more rigid timeline than most superhero universes. While comics will often claim that 30+ years of stories have happened in the span of "about ten years." The show seems to be working with a more realistic idea of how much action and change usually happens in a year.
I agree. Nolan made the time lapse between Batman Begins, and 'The Dark Knight'' only a year, and look at all he accomplished. Multiply that by nine years, and I'm shocked Gotham isn't a utopia by now. A decade is pretty long. Look at it this way... do you remember 2002 very well? I don't, not really. I think you mostly just have to step back and really ask yourself, or tell yourself, whichever which, the span of a decade... and it's longer than you think. Maybe it's the connotation with a pretty low number, but when applied to something like a year, I think that isn't as good an excuse. But it all boils down to your own subjective definition of what is long... and how old you are of course.
So M'gann gets a lot of her tendencies from a TV show character who looks like her. Plausible enough. But since she morphs her skin color (the only thing differentiating her from Megan in the Show Within a Show) to go to school in "Targets", wouldn't her classmates notice her similarities in looks, personality and name to the titular Hello Megan?
First of all we don't know if the Show Within a Show was shot in black and white (and if it was if there were any color pictures released)so M'gan might not look terribly similar Hello Megan. All we've seen of Hello Megan is a girl saying Hello Megan! so M'gann's personality could be very different from Hello Megan's. Also "Megan" is a fairly common name.
From what I've heard, Hello Megan! is supposed to be a show from the 70's. I doubt too many school kids would have watched an old 70's show.
Also if anyone noticed the similarities, they'd probably just assume she was a huge fan of the show. When people get really, really into a show, sometimes they try to be just like their favorite character. They probably just figure she's doing that.
Everything's explained in Image. Though M'gann does look exactly like the titular character, Hello Megan was an old show that aired before any of them were born, only ran for one season, and was given a very limited VHS release.
Why wasn't Superboy angry at Mr. Carr in Targets?
Why would he be? If you mean because of the events from the tie in comic then not only does Superboy have no reason to be angry at Mr. Carr, but most likely he didn't recognize him.
Is it me or is Megan's human skin tone orange? It seems like an unnatural color in-series but I think I saw one girl with the same tone in a classroom scene.
It's weird but since she's a teenager, people probably just assume she used spray tan or something.
In "Targets" when Superboy falls out of the bleachers and head-first onto cement, how come no one seems to worry about whether or not he's okay? Megan knows he's invulnerable so it's understandable that she wouldn't worry but the other cheerleaders didn't.
The fact that he's not screaming in pain might of been a hint. Also they probably weren't looking at him so they might have assumed it was a smaller fall than it was.
Not everyone screams out in pain when they fall and either way most people at least ask if they're alright. And when he hits the ground, he makes a grunt that could be interpreted as pain to someone who didn't know him. Also they were looking right at him when he fell, and he falls about ten feet. Maybe they're just really apathetic?
The above troper actually makes sense. In 'Bereft', Superboy punches Wally into a rocky cliff, and KF more or less shrugs it off. In the pilot, the entire above-ground Cadmus facility crumbles on top of our heroes and not a single bone seems to be broken. And it's not just Young Justice either; just watch the fight between Batman and Jason Todd in Under the Red Hood and count how many times Jason's face should have crumbled. People in any DCU are probably just used to everyone being able to take a certain amount of damage and be fine.
Actually in rewatching the pilot, I notice that there's a slight possibility that Robin and Kid Flash both broke one of their hands. After the whole collapsing building thing, they high-five and then both wince in pain. That might indicate that the hands they used were broken to some degree. Of course they could just have been badly bruised but that seems less than likely considering the high pain tolerance both boys show in later episodes. There is some question regarding exactly what happened there.
I don't know; the Kid Flash being punched thing could have been caused by the required secondary powers of super speed while the Cadmus facility could have been explained as Robin's high training along with everyone else's durability.
Let's see then. Robin isn't the type of team member that takes fatal and lethal blows too much, if at all. In fact, him and Artemis are practically the least to have this happen to them. With good reason. Wally has been shown to have durability, probably because of his meta-human status of secondary powers. We don't know to what extent, but we can surmise it's to a lesser degree than let's say, Aqualad, and of course, Superboy. Those three are the pegged likely candidates to be enemy punching bags. Also, when the Cadmus building did fall down, Superboy and Aqualad both covered Kid Flash and Robin from the debris. It could be said the cheerleaders might have been too shocked to really react to the more experienced M'gann, and Conner turned out to be alright rather quickly anyway.
Why is everyone assuming that the name of the show we saw in "Downtime" was called "Hello, Megan"? Sure; it's M'gann's catchphrase and it's a bit suspicious but if you're watching with the subtitles on, it actually says "Hello. Neigh..." It looks like the word is 'neighbor'...not 'Megan.'
Arguably a joke unless we're supposed to assume that in another universe she's Tim "the tool man" Taylor's neighbor, Wilson. We never saw his true face.
While it's true that we don't yet know for sure what the name of the sitcom she got her catchphrase from is, closed captioning means diddly-squat as evidence either way; it's just one person's interpretation of what was said for the benefit of the hearing-impaired, not based on the original script or anything. We'll know for sure once "Downtime" comes to DVD (as the subtitles on those are official) but for now, the fact that Greg Weisman called the "Hello, Megan!" shirt he was wearing to SDCC "in fact a spoiler" makes me think that it's a sample of in-show merchandise which lends credence to the notion that that is indeed the name of the sitcom in question.
Why was Batman so pissed at Aqualad for beating Clayface? It seems like an Informed Flaw.
He was angry at Aqualad for not leading well during that fight; the team was losing badly until Bats bailed them out.
Why does everyone call Megan by her real name instead of her Earth name? She told them to call her "Megan".
"M'gann" sounds cooler.
Aqualad actually has an excuse that makes sense: he's the sidekick of a king (Ever notice how he never calls his mentor "Aquaman" or "sir" and always calls him "my king" which is Aquaman's rank in Atlantis) and therefore puts high priority on formality and decorum. Calling M'gann "Megan" would likely feel too informal to sit right with him.
Why did Artemis not pick Dr. Fate's Helmet and grab her arrow? Relying on her oh-so-perfect archery skills when she has one single chance and if she screws it up everyone dies instead of the veteran superpowered flying magical being is kinda stupid. She doesn't even think about it!
She didn't actually see what the helmet could do, so she probably thought it was just a regular helmet.
She knew what it could do; thats probably a reason to not put it on, since from Wally she'd know that it might never come off again.
Artemis was also freaking out at the time. Using a weapon she's more familiar with would help her calm down enough to do what had to be done.
What is Artemis wearing for her school uniform? The top doesn't seem to be the same as the other girls; it looks like the male uniform. Does the school have variations?
It looks like students have the option of wearing a blazer or a sweatervest. In the background you can see a guy wearing a vest like the ones Bette and Barbara are wearing and a girl wearing a blazer like Artemis and Dick. The girl is only seen from behind as far as I can tell so she may be wearing both a jacket and the vest but it doesn't strike me as likely.
What did happen to Amanda Waller in "Terrors"? The last we see of her, she's fine after having stood up to Icicle, Sr. and Mr. Freeze. Suddenly at the end of the episode, Hugo Strange is warden (and officially so since he has his own nameplate).
Pretty sure she was fired for almost letting the breakout happen.
Okay, "Terrors". It is established early on that each collar is custom designed to prohibit the use of its wearer's abilities. "No strength, no ice", says Ms. Waller. Later Mr. Freeze allows himself to be taken to Waller. Once in front of her, he...freezes the guard. With his collar on. What?
The collar was off.
No; that's not it; Waller shocks him with the collar right afterward but he fights through the pain and rips it off. The impression I got was that the collars had only a certain threshold of metahuman powers they could inhibit i.e. they could bring down Superboy's strength to that of a normal human but not necessarily Superman's. Freeze was essential to the breakout because he just barely exceeds that threshold unlike the other "ice-villains" (probably because of his origin) and so could muster up the short burst of adrenaline necessary to remove the collar and take over the warden's office.
Collars affect only metapowers (biological; maybe of magical orgins too). Mr Freeze doesn't have metahuman superpowers (aside from dying in non-cold environment). He uses technology to create ice; he just built small freeze-gun from parts that Hugo Strange smuggle inside.
So if Artemis and Cheshire are sisters in this show, does that mean that Jade's last name is Crock instead of Nguyen?
No; the credits for "Homefront" clearly give her name as "Jade Nguyen." Presumably she was born with the surname Crock but changed it upon leaving the family to distance herself from her father.
They could be half-sisters with different dads maybe?
That would explain why Jade looks full Vietnamese while Artemis is obviously half. And why Cheshire and Sportsmaster get along so poorly.
Or possibly, Jade has her mother's surname while Artemis has her father's. It's an uncommon practice but it does happen. (Though I actually think it's the first explanation of her changing her name.)
Unlikely; the credits from "Homefront" also give her name as Paula Brooks which would indicate that that was her maiden name. Again it's probably more likely that Jade just picked very common Vietnamese surname "Nguyen" to distance herself from her Caucasian father.
According to Ask Greg, Paula's maiden name is Nguyen. So the "Brooks" was a mistake. Although, are you sure about it saying Brooks? 'Cause the Young Justice Wiki article doesn't mention that, and neither do the credits for the episode on Greg Weisman's site. Could you have misread it?
I did misread it. Her maiden name is indeed "Paula Nguyen."
Does Wally dislike Captain Marvel for some reason?
Maybe a little but probably for no particular reason. He's childish, immature and in charge of them which is enough for any teenager to resent. He's new to the group and the team is despite its faults fairly tight-knit. They also had to save him on the first mission he accompanied them on; all and all, it's just a bunch of little things that will probably wear off as the team warms up to him.
I think the team doesn't realize that Captain Marvel is a ten-year-old kid in the body of an adult with godlike powers so his immaturity really throws them off.
As of Humanity, it seems like Wally likes Captain Marvel because he does stuff for him but doesn't really respect him.
Don't forget; Wally in this universe seems to have some sort of trust issues; see how he really hates it when Artemis replaces Roy for instance and now here is Captain Marvel "replacing" RT...
I...can't see how Red Tornado came to care for the team. This is terrible of me; I know but he's only spoken in 4 out of 15 aired episodes. And these conversations were short and to the point in all cases. I thought the story we got with him and Morrow and the Reds was great; don't get me wrong but I wish there'd been more time to set up individual relationships between him and the team members. This basically goes for all the Leaguers who aren't Batman though. It's getting kind of frustrating to have half the League in a scene and the only ones who speak are Batman and somebody voiced by Nolan North. Same goes for Canary actually. There's been a ten episode gap between her speaking roles and it's making me wonder why they have so many characters if they can't afford all of their actors. Hopefully the tie-in comic will start correcting some of this like it has been with Captain Atom.
Why wouldn't Red Tornado deliberately leave to protect them? He's a hero and he knows they're no match for the other Reds. The same logic applies to him caring for them. He wants to be human and it only makes sense to care for the next generation.
Why would Red Inferno seem to melt so easily in the lava? Wouldn't being a fire-based robot mean having at least a little heat resistance?
Magma and fire are two very different things. You get burned by fire. Magma is liquified rock, extremely hot and completely solid (in the sense that it isn't gas anyway).
Magma can get much hotter than fire.
The fact that the entire fight takes next to MAGMA and the thing that bothers you most is the Robot melting in said magma amuses me to no end. That being said there is no real science at all in that episode. So the robot melts as the plot demands
Why didn't Robin have EMP devices in Episode 15? I mean he didn't use them earlier since he said he was fresh out but now that they actually planned to go after the Reds, wouldn't it be prudent to have had some in the first place? I doubt Robin wouldn't be smart enough to carry some on him from now on after the whole HQ fiasco.
Because they didn't work nearly as well as he had hoped and only took out the Reds for a short time and not nearly long enough to be a viable weapon in he field.
I assumed that he was joking when he said he was out of EMP devices; no way one with a good amount of power that could knock out a frickin' robot would be able to fit into his belt.
In the first night ops mission Superboy overhears Bane speak in Spanish and suddenly smiles; what the hell is he smiling for and pay attention to the smile; it's not a happy one; it's one of those sly smiles.
He's smiling because he has overheard the plan that Bane is concocting with his subordinate; the Team knew he was planning to betray them so they kept on their guard and took him down pretty quickly when he did. Unfortunately for Bane, he hadn't anticipated a polylingual Kryptonian.
Okay; "Failsafe" bugs me. All Just a Dream? Really? Sure at the end of the episode they made a clever explanation; I'll give them that. But it comes out of freaking nowhere and it was never hinted that they were inside a dream; the bullcrap over them knowing that it was a dream before Megan had her freak out doesn't explain the fact that they kept their calm (y'know; the thing they're trained to do in that kind of situation). I'd just like it to make some sense.
"Comes out of freaking nowhere"? Really? Because I feel they dropped quite a few subtle and not-so-subtle hints throughout. Even ignoring the bloody obvious one: that the deaths of Robin's father, Kid Flash's uncle, Aqualad's king and mentor, Miss Martian's uncle and Superboy's aloof "father" alongside the entire rest of the Justice League elicits almost no reaction from the Team...there are quite a few others.
For example, you may notice a low "gong" sound when Miss Martian subconsciously takes over the dream and then again when J'onn enters it; the "death" of the Bio-Ship results in Miss Martian confusedly saying "That didn't feel like..." before being interrupted by more aliens; the lack of characterization given to the aliens in stark contrast to previous villains; J'onn having "realizations" every time a Team member dies and again since it can't possibly be emphasized enough, the fact that they killed off Superman and Batman within two minutes of the episode. Really; it wasn't a question of "Was it All Just a Dream?" but rather how and I think they selected a rather brilliant and satisfying justification for it which should lead to some great character stuff down the road.
Also there were no time and date stamps until they woke up in the cave.
Not to mention How after J'onn appears, M'gann starts making various absurd reasonings about how J'onn could be alive and that no one else was actually killed just transported akin to a bad fanfic writer trying to write themselves out of a hole which are immediately taken to be fact, hinting at how she is controlling the situation
And another one. there are only 48 stars on the American flag after M'gann takes over.
Yet another: Wally's arm is out of the cast. Next episode? It's back.
If Secret was indeed a ghost and also intangible, how was she able to remove Zatanna's gag?
While I know very little about the comics' version of Secret, ghosts often have at least some ability to affect the physical world.
Maybe it's one of her abilities in Earth-16- to make herself tangible whenever necessary.
In "Secrets", we clearly hear Zatanna say the spell under her gag. Then why didn't it work; I thought the rule was that as long as she can talk backwards she's a spellcaster?
Probably because she wasn't able to enunciate the syllables properly. In most magical settings, how you say a spell is vitally important to enacting that spell properly (i.e. "It's Levi-OOO-sar, not Levio-SAR.").
Another one from "Secrets"; Harm mentions that only those pure of heart can wield the sword. He's heart is not obviously pure good so what kind of purity did he aim for that required no emotional attachments?
Pure evil obviously enough. Without Greta, there was no love or compassion or anything like that in his heart, making it pure.
I considered this possibility but I'm not so sure this is it; I mean sure, he killed his little sister in cold blood, but... he seemed so nonchalant compared to other Ax-Crazy villains. Plus the things he did: if you're pure evil, then why play around with Artemis and Zatanna? Why didn't he just kill them and be done with that instead of chasing them around and keeping them as hostages which led to his eventual demise?
If anything, just killing them would be less evil. He wanted to screw with his victims.
He said something about testing their responses so he's know how to kill their mentors.
Another from "Secrets", why exactly was Artemis so angry over learning that Conner and Megan was dating. I remember her mentioning that she found him attractive when she was first introduced but since then, show has gone out of it's way to imply that Artemis has a crush on Wally...not Conner. So...?
I think it was a How-could-Megan-not-tell-me!? kind of thing. Cause really she didn't seem nearly as infatuated with Conner like Wally is with Megan, so as far as Conner is concerned, I think Artemis never went past the Well-would-you-look-at-that-stud phase. As for her feelings for Wally, the show has indeed gone to great lengths to imply that they might even end up together, but right now Artemis is kind of in denial of these feelings... perhaps only focusing on what she 'feels' for Conner. And now she suddenly discovers that her 'sister on Earth' didn't tell her she was dating Superboy, so she must've felt betrayed, aside from now being forced to deal with emotions she doesn't want to deal with because of this new couple. Well... that's my take on it anyway.
So in Misplaced, what happened to objects when the 2 worlds recombined? All cars crashed in the kid world, but supposedly some of them didn't in the adult world. Which world decides where objects are?
There was probably some logic to it- most likely, if there was a difference between the two versions, either the one that was intact was dominant, or the one that was most damaged, or something to that general effect. Of course, this is a spell of Klarion's we're talking about- he may well have set it up so it would be completely random.
Klarion started the spell, it stands to reason that his world is the dominant one.
Seeing as Dr. Fate's helmet wound up where it was in the kid world, this seems to be correct.
Klarion said Dr. Fate's helmet, and there for Nabu's power, was divided between the two worlds but it was always a vessel for Nabu. Since Nabu was summoned in the kid world when the two world's combined that helmet would be considered the "true" vessel by virtue of being active regardless of which world was considered the "original".
Expect for the fact that the piece of Starro was taken in the ADULT world and was still with Riddler and Sportsmaster after the crisis.
Oh snap, you're right. I guess "Klarion did it" is the best explanation there is.
Alternately, Starro may be on ice, but even that piece of it qualifies as a living thing, and it's ancient. Klarion's spell may well have interpreted it as an adult, and therefore there wouldn't have been a Starro in the kids' world.
Hold on, why would Starro have been identified as an adult, but Klarion, an eternal Lord of Chaos, have been identified as a child?
He's a Lord of Chaos; he's above making sense ;).
Word of God specifically describes Klarion as ageless. It's not an applicable attribute to him. He's simultaneously older than the Earth itself and a total newborn, so it was pretty much up to his own whim which world he decided to stick around in. He chose the child one.
But in that case, wouldn't the Starro chunk just appear where the case used to be, leaving the villains with an empty container?
Why would it have? I'm pretty sure living things stayed where they were when the reintegrating happened.
Whoops, got it backwards. The container (which never moved in the kid world) would end up back in the lab, and the Starro chunk would be with the villains (but flopping onto the ground).
The container remained with the Starro chunk for, presumably, the same reason why people's clothes remained with them when the worlds recombined. If it's actually attached to a living thing, the spell seems to "read" it as a part of that living thing.
Greg Weisman says: "It means that whatever was ACTED upon takes precedent over what was not acted upon. So the Helmet of Fate stayed in Roanoke. The piece of the creature stayed with Riddler. And Amber's plane crashed." [Response recorded April 16, 2012.]
In "Coldhearted," why didn't anyone tell Wally that the donor heart was meant for Queen Perdita? I definitely agree with the moral logic that she's just as important as any other kid, but even if the League somehow didn't know that Count Vertigo had Diplomatic Impunity, it's not hard to figure out that she would have been a target to some villain. If nothing else, knowing the consequences of the girl's death might provide some extra motivation.
Also, didn't anyone else think the message of "everyone is important" is kinda lost when it turns out the person actually is important.
I think that Batman should've done the "everyone is important" message and made Wally feel guilty (just to teach the lesson), but then spelled it out. "This heart is for Queen Perdita. If she dies Count Vertigo would become king and that would be a very bad thing. Don't stop for anything."
So if Queen Bee's powers are based on seduction (works on "most men and some women" suggests that the target has to be attracted to her), how did it work on an 8 year old boy?
We don't know how it works specifically. It could be psychic and the person just needs to potentially find her attractive in order to get a foothold, or she could be able to control people who aren't attracted to her with much greater difficulty, or she could have just hit Gar with a tranquilizer and was lying about him being in her control at all (since the point of that was to manipulate M'gann, not make Gar himself actually do anything). Or there could be other factors I didn't think of. Until/unless we get a detailed rundown of Queen Bee's powers, we just can't say.
Alternatively she may have used her normal abilities and... well, lets just say she outdid Slade on the creepy factor. The way she was splayed out on the bed next to Gar certainly didn't help "Shudder".
Odds are she uses pheromones to affect anyone who could potentially find her attractive.
Given her name the pheromones are the best fit. Not to mention the one requiring the least amount of Brain Bleach
8 year olds can realise that people are attractive
If it works on some kind of "love", she could effect children of any gender by manipulating "maternal love". But that is a bit WMG...
Always bugged me that in Welcome to Happy Harbor, Miss Martian demonstrates her shape shifting abilities and explicitly states that she can only handle female forms, yet the very same episode's conclusion involves her imitating the male form of Red Tornado. After 20 episodes from that point the "Female Only" shape shifting thing has not come up as plot relevant, so why bother introducing the concept at all?
There's probably a difference between shape-shifting into an organic male and shapeshifting into a robot with a masculine body structure.
Word of God says that a. shapeshifting into males is harder, not impossible, and b. Red Tornado is more like a Ken doll than a biological male anyway.
It might also be M'gaan exaggerating her 'human' femininity as a way to downplay any hint of her decidedly non-feminine White Martian form. Because if she can impersonate anyone of either gender with ease, it might beg the question of how much of her Miss Martian form is a fabrication.
Considering what her true form looks like, it's pretty obvious that she was lying through her teeth.
Greg Weisman confirmed on Ask Greg that Miss Martian initially studied human female anatomy; which is why she could only shapeshift into female or gender neutral forms in Season 1. Even though her true form doesn't look very feminine, she still has lady parts and probably found it easier to turn into something that also has lady parts.
Why was Intergang and/or Parasite so hell bent on creating a blackhole above Geneva? Particularly Parasite since he appears to have no escape plan once the blackhole starts to grow.
It was part of their cunning scheme:
Step One: Destroy Geneva with a blackhole.
Step Two: ???
Step Three: Profit!
Considering Intergang's supplier, possibly to generate a Boom Tube.
OP. So is this a case of blackhole = wormhole misconception?
I was confused for a similar reason. Was Parasite trying to build his own black hole generator or trying to activate the one in Geneva? Because if its the second, it makes even less sense. He can't hold the world hostage from (what i am assuming to be) a largely unprotected lab, so unless he just wanted to kill everyone, his plan didn't seem to make sense. Knowing Mr. Wisemen, i'm inclined to believe Inter-Gang has/had a larger plan in the works that may have included the use of a black hole, but i can't imagine what that would be or how Parasites actions would factor into his plans.
Parasite built his own black hole generator, the particle accelerator in Geneva was the final pieces of the puzzle. As for holding the world hostage, he can destroy Geneva, and then threaten to destroy another more easily secureable location if he doesn't get paid,
Why didn't Superboy tell anyone about the patches?
Because he doesn't want anyone asking about where he got them- you know, from Lex Luthor.
Ok, this is going to be really spoilered, but I just saw Usual Suspects, and as interesting as it is, I still have one main beef with the episode. Why? Why did The Light decide to call in their debts so soon? And not just for Superboy who might have gotten too impatient to wait for more Shields, but for Artemis and M'gann as well. The Light way overplayed their hand with that move, so why did they do it? The Team had already beaten Riddler, Mammoth and Shimmer, gotten the package to the watchtower for their mole to then use. So why play their hand now and try to get 3/8 of the team to join them right there? I mean, did they seriously not think that by taking these many people that the rest of the team might not get suspicious and follow them? Did they not consider it could be a reverse trap to get back at them? Did they seriously decide to risk their second bruiser and their lives just to get 3 more allies? It just seems kinda silly for people who are both Manipulative Bastard types to not realize that they were overstepping on this one.
Simple: when you have one team of heavy-hitters under control, you don't want to leave the B-team unmonitored. Grabbing the muscle of the team (and the archer) neutralizes a lot of their potential.
The kissing at the end of "Auld Acquaintance". Wally has spent the bulk of his time with Artemis being annoyed with her. Robin has demonstrated he has a crush on Zatanna, while Zatanna has returned his flirting a little, but it's a long way from flirting to kissing. Granted, Rocket's peck on Aqualad's cheek is reasonable for one friend to give another, though Rocket is new to the team.
It's New Years. They celebrated. More seriously, Wally and Artemis dropped that attitude after it was clear to both that Superboy and M'Gann were dating, Zatanna and Robin isn't that much of a jump, and Rocket outright eyed Aqualad from the moment she joined the team.
Wally and Artemis have spent a total of two episodes out of twenty-six actually expressing respect for each other. Respect is not the same as friendship (though it is fairly close) and respect is definitely not the same as romance (and having a boy and a girl constantly snipe at one another is not an indicator of secret/repressed mutual attraction).
wait what about Wally's extreme reaction to her death? Her worrying more about Wally than anyone else knowing her secret?
Comforting someone for losing their parent, and accepting said comfort, is not the road to a healthy romance. I know this is something that Robin and Zatanna can bond over (to an extent; Robin and Zatanna are suffering from different situations), and that Robin had been supportive of (and attracted to) Zatanna even before she lost her father, but they've hardly achieved the level of intimacy needed for kisses on the lips (New Year's Eve tradition or no).
Rocket's peck on the cheek is the only kiss that doesn't seem inappropriate. (Well, aside from Conner and M'Gann, but they're already a couple.) Seriously, since when do friends give eachother kisses on the lips, even for New Year's customs?
Pack mentality. As odd as it is, each pair had either one or both people interested in the other. I'm sure standing next to a person you're interested in while everyone else makes out licky style in front of you on news years day gets incredibly awkward, especially when you're all teenagers.
Also adrenaline. They literally just finished defeating their own brainwashed mentors and winning the most comprehensive victory in their team's history. They're filling giddy, energized, and considerably less risk averse than usual.
But seriously. IT'S NEW YEARS. Some people kiss random strangers in the name of the tradition.
Also, THEY'RE TEENAGERS! Ones who might not have a lot of options about expressing any kind of romantic interest.
Also, one kiss isn't the culmination of a romance. It can be the point at which it starts.
I'm just bugged no one lampshaded that it was lucky the team had a 50/50 boy/girl ratio.
At this point I can't really say if I actually imagined the whole thing but, I was pretty certain Word of God had said that someone would die during the first season, yet the finale aired just yesterday and, well, what the hell.
Kent Nelson died.
Several people, named and otherwise, died onscreen.
Yeah, everyone assumed someone would die to mean someone on the team but Greg never said that.
He hardly explained the plan in detail. He told the truth in about the vaguest way possible, which sounds plausible but does not betray the means or method. Red Arrow had escaped, and it was important that they make sure to taint Red Arrow's reputation before he could turn the team against them. As for knocking the team out with gas, one of them is a barrier warrior, and two are aliens. That wouldn't have worked. Red Tornado tried to convert them, but they didn't expect him to overcome the mind control.
Then why not just send in League heavy-hitters immediately? With no counter for the starro-chips, no idea what's happening, and no anticipation of a fight, the Team would have been hardpressed to survive an attack, especially if Klarion prioritizes the most dangerous targets when he directs the raid.
And if that fight spills outside? Suddenly the heroes look crazy for attacking their students. They have a masquerade to maintain. Violence was a last resort.
He was trying to convert the entire team with the least amount of effort. He had Batman go down there, give a convincing story that would explain what had happened if Red Arrow had tried confronting them, and left Red Tornado to infect the team. When he realized Red Tornado wasn't doing it, he sent down Black Canary. Only when it became apparent that the gig was up did they send down three heavy hitters to take care of them through force rather than trickery.
Forgive me, but... how did every single Justice League member get infected so easily? Yes the Starro Tech rewrites minds, but the implication is that Red Arrow was the one that implanted the Starro tech in the justice league. So Red managed to sneak up on members that are better trained, more experienced, some of whom have superior senses in just about every way. Now yes, the team ended up doing the same thing to cure the justice league, but they've been training as a stealth team and where doing things in pairs, and when it came to a straight up fight against the most powerful members, it took desperate tactics... I'd just like some sense.
You have to remember that Roy is a part of the Justice League now. He could just casually walk up to all the members and they wouldn't find anything suspicious with that. Then when they aren't expecting it, he could use the Starro tech on them.
I am remembering that part. It still doesn't work. There is a telepath, two of the members are Green Lanterns who's Power Rings monitor them at all time. One posses the wisdom of Solomon. Red Arrow would have to go room to room in the Watch Tower to insert the tech.
Telepaths aren't scanning people constantly, power rings do no such thing, and wisdom doesn't make you omniscient. What Roy did to Batman is the only thing he'd have to do to everyone else. No one is going to react all crazy to a simple pat on the neck among allies. The reason it was so much harder for the team is because the League was being controlled and was on edge. The team couldn't just walk up to them.
This actually hung me up a bit too, until i realized that he only really needed to walk up to one of them. then the orders could be issued for the infectee to infect others. it would've been really interesting if we saw Red Arrow walk up to the flash, pat him on the back, and then .0005 seconds later the entire justice league was infected. We didn't see that because it probably didn't happen, but i still imagine something along those lines went down. We just saw Red Arrow infect Batman for brevity's sake.
How exactly did Wally find out that Dick is Robin? I was hoping the tie-in comics would clear up this issue, but so far they haven't.
According to Greg, Dick told him. Simple as that. The Free Comic Book Day issue from 2011 shows a single panel of Wally staring at Dick, who's holding his mask in his hand.
Why was Wally's arm broken for so long? I thought speedster's were suppose to have accelerated healing. But Wally's arm was broken for at least a couple of weeks. I'm not sure how long regular humans have broken arms for. 6 weeks maybe? How long was Wally's arm broken? Did the creators forget about his accelerated healing? Or did it heal faster than normal, just not at a Wolverine rate of healing? I know he's not as powerful as the Flash so his healing may not be up to par so that could be it too but I'm just trying to figure out if it's a power level thing or a Fridge Logic thing
Wally's arm did heal faster than a normal human's. He broke it on October 1, and the cast came off shortly before November 11. That's about five and a half weeks. Depending on how bad the break was, most people take six to eight to weeks for a broken bone to heal. The thing is, Wally is 1) not as fast as the Flash and 2) the Flash is not at god-tier levels of power.
Okay, I agree with everyone that "Misplaced" is a little... difficult to understand. But my question is, why did Red Arrow disappear along with the adults in the 'children world' when in fact he is really a 3 year old clone? As it was stated anyone who is 18 and above is sent to 'adult world' Actually... why DIDN'T Miss martian disappear? We only know in "Agendas" that she is actually 48 earth years old so I still don't get it...
Because it doesn't work on such exact principles. Klarion must be inconceivably old, far more than his four companions, but they went to adult world and he did not. Captain Marvel is still a kid, just a transformed one, but he went to adult world while transformed. The spell is obviously meant to transport those who are adults to adult world, and kids to the kid world, and in cases with a rapid-aged clone, a magic-aged kid, and a dog-year-esque martian you get a gray area that just sends them to the most appropriate world.
Oh I get it... so it is more of a biological age rather than chronological. Thanks :)
My guess is that the spell works based on the targets' thoughts about their age, rather than a biological deal. The girl who was flying Billy disappears at midnight of her birthday, which is unlikely to be exactly when she was born, but would be when she starts considering herself 18.
Is it just me or does Miss Martian's Horrible Secret about her true, hideous form make no sense in hindsight? To elaborate, she hides her true form as a White Martian from Superboy and the team for fear of rejection. Fair enough, since her real form is pretty ugly to an Earthling, and she's used to facing discrimination because of it on her home planet. So, she tells everyone that she's a green martian like J'onn and assumes the form of one when asked to show what she really looks like? Well, no, because we later see that actual Green Martians look nothing like the "BaldMegan" she turns into when the team initially asks her to show what she really looks like. In fact, Green Martians look pretty much exactly the same as White ones except, well, green. Now, I'm willing to buy that due to cultural differences, M'gann really would think that her Earth friends were likely to find a white Martian more ugly than a green one, except the fact that the fake form she chooses does not look like an actual Green Martian, which strongly suggests that she's well aware that they'd find her true form revolting even if she was really green. So ultimately, the secret she's concealing isn't even the fact that she's actually a White Martian, it's just that Martians in general look really ugly to humans, something that the Justice League almost certainly knows already unless J'onn has also been hiding his true form from them, which I doubt. So the question remains: Why the emphasis on colour if M'gann's real concern was that she doesn't look human?
Her homeworld's culture is going through something not unlike the Jim Crow laws period of US history, where White is Inferior. She's kept that emotional response, though intellectually she knows Earthlings aren't bigoted against White Martians (we have our own, even stupider ones). And logic aside, it's a bit of a parable for every teenage girl who thinks her friends only like her because she conforms/looks good/stays popular: if you want to claim that those mindsets are themselves illogical, I won't debate it!
How is it a "dumb" to think Ivo keeps tabs on Morrow because he sees him as a competitor? Not only is it supervillain psychology 101, but this is a guy who built a robot with the ability to duplicate any superpower specifically to prove he could. Ivo's a bigger egomaniac than Luthor and Joker combined. HOW is that DUMB?!
Wait, when did Rocket join the team? I know it's because there wasn't enough time to introduce her properly at the end of the season like they introduced Zatanna, but they just kind of shoe horned her in there without any real purpose. Besides holding Wonder Woman in a containment field, they don't actually DO anything with her. Every other character on the team at this point has had something. Aqualand had the episode Downtime. Robin had Performances. Wally had Coldhearted. Superboy and Red Arrow had the Cadmus arc. Miss Martian had her subplot with being a white martian. Artemis had the arc with her own personal history. Heck, even Zatanna had her stuff, being the hero with her magic in several episodes. Every other character had some kind of story or character development, she was just tacked on at the end without any kind of purpose. They could have at least turned her into a proper supporting character in season two, but they didn't take advantage of having her at all. They wasted a perfectly good character that could have been great or left as one of season 2's countless background heroes. It's like the executives looked at the outline for the season when the animation in most of the episodes had already been started and told the staff, "You need to add another character to the main roster that is female and nonwhite, we don't want to look sexist or racist!" and they had no choice but to oblige.
Green Arrow obviously knows who Artemis is from the moment he takes her in. Is there a reason why he allowed her and her wheel chair bound mother to continue living in what seems to be a fairly bad part of town? I understand that not everybody or even most people share their money but so much with their family but most people for starters aren't multibillionaires nor are they taking people in presumably trying to keep them from joining the family business. This apparently goes so far that it seems that Bruce is the one who got her into private school. There doesn't appear to be any fall out to this but it might have taken Robin an extra twenty minutes to figure things out if he'd followed Artemis back to a house in the good part of town living in a house that was signed to a Queen.
In Image, how did Garfield get to the barn so quickly without the others noticing? Only seventeen seconds passed from when Robin told him to stay put, and yet he somehow got all to the way to the barn by most likely going through a back or side entrance and get the animals out.
I'm not sure where exactly to put this, since this is more of a question about Earth-16, but since it was brought up in season 1: somebody please help me figure out how racism exists in a society of shapeshifters? M'gann pretty much defaults to a green Martian, so I assume it's not too difficult to assume that other white Martians could do the same thing, and when changing pretty much everything about your body is something you can do with just a thought how exactly do you go around making one race "inferior"?
You forget, it's a race of shapeshifters AND telepaths, and since all Martians can read each other's mind and would therefore know exactly what color they were born as, regardless of their current appearance. As to why it exists, humans have had racial prejudices against each other for centuries, so it's not that surprising that another species may have similar prejudices towards their own kind.
Where the hell is Artemis? There is no sign of her in any of the Invasion preview stuff. I tell you if she is off the team to be replaced by the fifty zillionth version of Babs as Batgirl I'm going to rage quit.
Wait a week, then you'll have an answer. I doubt she'll get cut.
Turns out she had... other obligations.
Okay, so what happened to Artemis during the timeskip? The rest of the original team (even Miss Martian, Aqualad, and a now Nightwing Dick Grayson) are still there, but Artemis isn't.
Where were Aqualad and Kid Flash?
In the comics Wally quit being a superhero until he was done with college. Since there was a five year time skip it's also possible Barry died and he is now Flash III. Artemis could be a number of things. Maybe she stopped being a hero while she's attending college or stopped being a hero outright. She could have gone to "the side of evil" or is still Green Arrow's partner. We don't have much to go on about Kal though.
Something sad that could have happened to Wally, he may have become paralyzed from the waist down. Which isn't to farfetched since this happened in an alternate timeline comic.
You know there's no way this won't eventually be revealed, of course. Aqualad at least has been seen in a trailer, wearing Black Manta armor.
I asume, that there will be a huge Flash Back at some point, which will reveal what happened to the old team.
Apparently Artemis and Wally are living together and are going to college, and have quit the superhero job. Aqualad now serves his father, Black Manta, and goes by the name Black Manta II (creative right?)
When was Aqualad called Black Manta II? If I recall, he went by the name Manta.
What I want to know is how did Supey not age at all. Seriously when you look at Mal, Bumblebee, Night Wing and Zatanna and then look at him you have to wonder if something prolonged his aging or something. Did he get put into some sort of stasis between season one and two? Megan not aging is understandable since they live longer and mentally age slower than humans so it's natural she wouldn't change her appearance but just why hasn't Supey aged.
This was in the original YJ comics, being a clone meant that he couldn't age and he was happy (on the outside) and he managed to age after the "World without Grownups" event.
In "Earthlings", Superboy expressly confirms that he doesn't physically age.
It's more that he doesn't age externally—that is, he shows no superficial signs of aging. "On the inside" he is still growing older.
Why would it take the League founders five years to figure out what happened during those sixteen hours they went missing while under mind control?
It would kind of depend on what exactly happened. Let's say the Leaguers went and blew up a planet, and left a big glowing letter saying that they did it. In which case, the Green Lanterns could find out what ahppened easily, and the whole situation would be rather ridiculous. Now, let's say that they blew up a planet, but left very miniscule evidence of who was responsible. The galactic community is up in arms over it, and spend five years tracking down leads until they finally put the pieces together. My point is, we don't know precisely what the League did while under Vandal's influence, so there could be many possible explanations that we don't know of yet.
John: *goes to Oa* Hey, Salaak, where was I during those missing 16 hours?
So is this universe skipping Jason Todd as well? Dick did tell Tim not to die, which shocked him a little... but there's really no evidence that it's more then him just being scolded. Also. Sudden time skip, why exactly?
I'd guess the Time Skip is a device to squeeze in new team members and Character Development off screen. Jason Todd might or might not exist in this universe. Maybe he was Robin only for a very short period of time. Since we don't know when Dick became Nightwing nor for how long Tim's been Robin we can't tell for sure.
The new designations go up to B22 (Blue Beetle). With nine original team members and eight new members, that's five unaccounted for. The odds that one of the five people who joined the team in the in-between years was Jason Todd are pretty good. I'd also lay odds on Aquagirl and Tempest.
Aha. Aquagirl confirmed.
Jossed. Aquagirl was killed on a mission. The new members are Bumble Bee, Blue Beetle, Beast Boy, Bat Girl, Mal Duncan, Robin II, Wonder Girl, Impulse, and Lagoon Boy
Right, but the designations seem to be permanent (I.E. B08 is still Zatanna even though she's in the League now), so just because Aquagirl was killed doesn't mean her number is gone—we can all but guarantee she is one of the missing five numbers, somewhere between B10 and B15 and I'd agree Tempest is a safe bet for another one. Jason Todd seems a reasonable guess for a third, especially in light of Dick's warning to Tim. The other two (at least, possibly up to four if those gueses are wrong) are anyone's guess.
Although it is possible that Aquagirl was killed on a mission without her (or Tempest) actually officially joining the team. Though that seems unlikely if she was actually calling herself "Aquagirl".
Jason Todd exists as a memorial, alongside Aquagirl and blue beetle.No wonder Tim Drake was shocked by Nighthawks "Don't die"-line
Here's something that down right confuses me. Why wouldn't the space cop think to check his space sector? Maybe ask the Green Lantern Corps if they new of any incidents involving heroes from his world? What, did the rest of the heroes brush John Stewart off or something? This is a big deal, because, again, the space cop didn't bother to check space.
You're assuming Rann is a) in sector 2814 (when it's actually in 2682 according to DC Comics Database) and b) that whatever the League did there was reported to the universe as a whole. Space is very big. They couldn't conceivably check everywhere.
It was suggested in that Rann was outside of Guardian space in this universe. It's possible they're still building or worlds exist in other areas like in the Green Lantern cartoon. John Stewart seemed to know nothing about Rann as he didn't speak up, and Strange stated that in that area the League are hated, not everywhere in space.
It's also not really logical for the League to assume they were in space. If you look at the members of the Light, they're mostly Earth-bound — Klarion, being a concept and not a person, is the only exception. Plus, Vandal Savage's stated goal was to jumpstart human evolution. That's a decidedly earthy goal.
But it's outright stated that they didn't even consider it. Again. Space Cop. Sense. NONE THIS MAKES.
But they pretty well know that League members who were unaccounted for during the 16 hours weren't on Earth. Had they been on Earth, they would've been able to account for their activities just like they did all the other League members. And to make it even more obvious, they returned to the Watchtower via Boom Tube, an explicitly interplanetary form of transportation.
His vocation has little to do with motive. What apparent logic is there behind sending them into space for a group whose goals are Earthly in nature?
A group whose members are almost entirely unknown to the Justice League (They know Klarion and Vandal Savage, and they can reasonably assume Lex and Queen Bee, but they can't rule out somebody like Kanjar Ro or Sinestro). They have no idea how big the Light is, but they've seen their reach and know it's really big. And they should know from Superboy's adventure with the Forever People that it does, indeed, extend to space.
The League had five years to investigate things. There may not be any aliens on the Light, but there's nothing precluding space as a possibility and there's certainly no reason for the League to not think of it.
Suppose they did think of it. Where would they check? "Space is big. You just won't believe how vastly, hugely, mind- bogglingly big it is. I mean, you may think it's a long way down the road to the chemist's, but that's just peanuts to space." Rann isn't even in John's sector of space, and his sector encompasses 1/3600 of the known universe. That's a lot of space. Seriously, the next time "space cop" comes to mind, remember how big space is.
Yes, space is big. Which is why instead of trying to search all of space, you just ask the Guardians of the Universe. Something that should've occurred to John immediately.
You also have to consider that there are a bunch of Space Police in the DCAU there is no excuse for not calling up HQ and asking if the Green Lanterns or their buddies happened to show up on any wanted posters lately. Heck the GL version of internal affairs would logically be keeping tabs on that kind of stuff anyway and showing up for a round or two of What the Hell Hero when it does occur.
Which, again, assumes that Rann reported this incident to the rest of the universe. If they never did, the local GL would never investigate and it would never be reported to Oa.
There's another reason. Rann's government is apparently very xenophobic and as a result condemns any contact with aliens.
This is not about the League not finding anything in Space, either, it's the fact that no one thought to even try and see if anything was going on outside of earth.
But why would they think to? The Light is a decidedly Earth-based organization. As has been said over and over, you can't just up and decide to "check space". Where would they begin? Without a place to start, why bother looking at all? There's no reason to.
When you can't find something in one location, don't you go check another place? They checked Earth, they found nothing, so they should check outside of Earth. As pointed out earlier, space is really, really big, making not checking space like looking for your contacts by staring at the same exact spot on the floor for hours. As for "how," well checking with the Guardians (who two of their members work for) or Thanagar (where, again, two of their members are from) would be two very good places to start. Not to mention they're limited by places they can get to and back from in under 16 hours.
That analogy fails horribly in so many ways. It's more like checking your entire contact list, then deciding to call every number in the phone book. The sheer scope of it is unfathomable. Your how also fails to consider several factors. The Guardians only deal with indiscretions reported to them. If John had committed a crime in his or another sector, they'd have called him. Contacting Thanagar would be singularly pointless as well. You've eliminated a single planet. As for distance, they came back by Boom Tube. That makes the 16 hour window encompass the known universe.
Your comparison fails to understand the unfathomable scope of space. Compared to that, your contact list isn't comparable to the size of the phone book, not even a single number on your contact list is that big. It's like dialing one digit of the first person in your contact list, and then giving up because there's no possible way you could call everyone in the phone book. You asked where to start, the Guardians are as good a place to start as ever. If anyone could track a Green Lantern ring, the Guardians would know how. And there's a way to look beyond the obvious range without "calling every number in the phone book." It's called 'detective work,' and the League happens to have someone in there who's pretty good at it. So, again, just because space is unfathomably big is no excuse for just giving up without even considering it.
Space in the DC Universe is not unfathomably large. While it's really "as big as the plot demands" the reality is there are what, a dozen or so inhabited planets? As someone below mentions comparing Rand to Iran I wouldn't trust anything that came back from Apocalypse either but I might have taken five seconds to find out if Granny Goodness had just staged a coup with the help of the Justice League! Also the known universe is split in DC proper into 3600 quadrants and the Justice League is a big deal. You send out a global message to all Lanterns "Have you seen me?" and wait. When they all respond back "nope" you call it a day. As is repeated over and over again the issue here isn't that nothing was found. I wouldn't expect them to find a rock that was tossed in the ocean, I would however expect them to ask all the coast guards if they'd seen someone sailing with a rock.
Just because they may be able to track rings doesn't mean they record all movement all the time. If Green Lantern's little incident never got out, they'd never know. Detective work isn't a solve-all method, either. They already used that to determine the gap. They never figured out the gap because they have nothing to go on. Seriously, what hints exactly did they have to go on? The six popped out of a Boom Tube. They could have gone anywhere on or off the planet. To find out where they went they'd have to find out where they weren't, and there's an impossibly large amount of area to eliminate to make that deduction.
You've made a very, very good argument for why they probably wouldn't have been able to find the answer. You've made a very, very poor argument for why they wouldn't even have looked for them. There are perfectly logical places to start looking in space, considering that one of the missing members was part of a group that makes it their duty to protect the entirety of it, and it makes no sense to give up before you even try to use them. Again, that's like dialing one digit on your phone and giving up when no one answers the call. Yes, space is really, really big. But that's no excuse for giving up without even trying. Especially when you're dealing with superheroes, who live to defy the odds. Also, as you pointed out above, the Light is largely Earthbound, meaning the chances of them picking a planetary region that the Justice League had not heard of before is pretty darn remote.
There's a difference between making a poor argument and not accepting the reasoning given.
The entire group flew beneath the radar for more than three years. Having them work somewhere remote is not beyond comprehension.
Again. This is not about what they might of found or what they might not have. This is about the fact that in a group at least 1/4th of them are from other planets or work in space regularly. They did not even think to check outside Earths atmosphere. The comparisons regarding the Phone Books don't work, because it's more like going to a store, not finding the product your looking for, and never considering to look somewhere else. I wouldn't have such a big problem with this if it had been given a mention, especially seeing as Intergang, one of the Lights pawns, had been using technology from ANOTHER FUCKING PLANET.
I like this store analogy. But it sounds more like they have been looking in all the local stores. Wal-mart? Checked it. Target? Checked it. K-Mart? Checked it? And everyone is asking why they didn't look for that book in a train station two towns over because their friend is part of the state police. Sure, it can work, but it doesn't make as much sense as checking all the local bookstores first. Everyone's assuming that in five years, they've turned over every stone on Earth, much less starting with their off planet contacts. Oh, and they don't have off time to just go looking. Finding out where this book is is secondary to Saving Lives.
More like after you check all of the local stores, you don't even think of checking Amazon.com. After all, if it's not there, you'll never find it, but that's no reason not to check.
Except this Amazon.com has no search feature, forcing you to go page by page.
Wrong. In this metaphor, Amazon.com is the Green Lantern Corps, making the search engine the guy most continuities know as Salaak. Space is the internet itself. When you need to find out about a crime in space, you should talk to the massive army that has made it a point to police as much of it as possible. Just because it's not guaranteed to work doesn't mean you shouldn't make some effort. Which, again, is the crux of the argument. The Light used the Justice League for some nefarious, obviously criminal purpose, and the Justice League did not do everything within its power to try and find it out. And the very planet Earth is paying for it.
I was more surprised that Batman didn't seem to have considered the possibility.
It's actually a little worse than that. Those six members caused an INTERGALATIC CONFLICT. It's so big that Superboy is specifically told not to wear the 'S' shirt when he goes to that planet. Forget never having specifically searched off world (which I assume they did, they just only hit the usual haunts like Thanagar and Tamaria) but there was no warrant or anything else simply broadcast out? The Rannian authority didn't hire Lobo or inform the Green Lanterns or anything?
I assume the Rannian authority is far too xenophobic to ask for the help of foreigners.
After a few years passed with nothing following from the missing sixteen hours, they likely started to think that whatever the plan had been it hadn't worked. It became a bit of a puzzle, but not an urgent investigation. They had no real reason to even think that they'd be sent into space anyway.
Was it ever stated that they never looked into space at all? I would think the usage of boom tube as opposed to zeta beam would suggest that they weren't on Earth. Then again, if they know boom tubes were involved, then the logical thing to do would be to try and contact the Forever People. New Genesis and Apokolips would be the first two potential locations on my list (though I guess they can't just go ask Darkseid "hey, did you see these guys here?"). Then I'd contact the Guardians and check on planets Earth has relations with, such as Mars and Thanagar. After that, well, I'll admit, Rann wouldn't be the next target on my list.
It was explicitly stated that space was a possibility that they hadn't even considered.
He dodges the question entirely, addressing it with Weasel Words. Regardless of whether the local government is corrupt, if I were Salaak and/or the Guardians and one of my Green Lanterns was Brainwashed and Crazy I'd damn sure want to know about it. Strongest weapon in the universe FTWTF. If I were John Stewart and I just found out I'd lost 16(?) hours of my life, I most certainly would not say:
"Well, even though I'm missing hours of my life and even though my ring could easily tell me what happened during that time, I think I'll just bugger on over to the nearest ale house and get plastered instead of asking it/Salaak. Besides we'll find out what will happen in five years anyway, so why bother?"
No, he rather directly addresses what you are talking about:
Space is big and is not necessarily as interconnected as you assume. Apparently galactic communication is more limited in the YJ Universe.
Rimbor is corrupt to the point that them saying something bad about a Green Lantern is to be expected. It would be like Iran or North Korea making claims about the US. Sure, some of them are likely true, but it's flooded with so much crap that everyone has stopped paying attention.
Along with that, bringing up an incident like this into the open invites an investigation into Rimbor's own activities. "Oh, a Green Lantern with a sterling record decided to wreck your shit? Well, he'd have to have a motive. Let's just start gathering evidence..." Even if Stewart said he was mindcontrolled, the Guardians would still use it as an excuse to bring the hammer down on them. Rimbor in DC is supposed to be a planet run by crime; it's pretty obvious that they would want to use back channels to get their revenge.
You also make about a bunch of assumptions which aren't necessarily facts. For example:
Just because you can't find someone on Earth doesn't mean they weren't doing things on Earth. The entirety of the Earth is not monitored around the clock. The other members were likely accounted for via eyewitnesses, recordings, and other verifiable sources, not some magic monitoring system. If the Justice League went to a secret base in the middle of the Sahara, there would be no one to say anything about it. Thus, there is no reason to believe that they would need to look off Earth; they were likely on Earth somewhere, but there was nothing to see them. There's simply no reason to ever think they were not in space.
There's no proof that YJ Power Rings record everything around them at any given time. This is true in the comics, but there's no indication that this is true in YJ. Considering most superheroes in YJ tend to have fewer powers and in general less fantastic, it probably doesn't recording setting unless the Lantern specifically activates it. Alternatively, Savage could have had them turn it off just in case a GL DID come by investigating things.
Salaak is not God. There's no indication that checking with Salaak would do anything, and in fact if Salaak knew, they would have likely passed it on. There's no indication that the Corps knew anything and there's no reason for them to be told in the first place.
As to the bit about directly addressing it. No. He just says "Why would they know?" and then goes off on a tangent that completely fails to justify their lack of knowledge. Even if Rimbor didn't say anything, that does not preclude the possibility to John saying "Hey Ganthet, over on Earth chillin with some brooskies and some fine women. By the way where was I in the last 16 hours? Kthxbai."
For the first of the above points: Not really sure what you're attempting to address here, but maybe something like "There's no reason to assume that they were sent into space" or something? Idunno. It doesn't matter if they were sent to Kryton (or the remains thereof) or the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame. 16 missing hours. A device that almost certainly would record a GL's whereabouts during that time. Failure to address this possibility in any way. This could have been preempted by a throwaway line about not even Oa knowing what happened. It would take two extra seconds to rectify the problem.
For the second point: Slanderous slander of slanderosity and slanderness. This is sort of an application of Like Reality Unless Noted. Unless indicated otherwise, GL rings in YJ are identical to those in comics. It has not been indicated that Sal and the blue man group are incapable of keeping tabs on their lanterns in YJ, so it must be assumed that they can.
Point tres: No, Salaak is not God, but he works for a bunch of guys that are alot closer than anyone else on the planet (except maybe Nabu and Klarion...) No, there's no guarantee that they would know, but it's more probable that they would than that they would not. As to there being no reason to be told, there are two very big reasons that Salaak and/or the Guardians should be contacted. 1: Brain Washed And Crazy. 2: Strongest weapon ever. If there was even a chance that the guardians and Sal knew what happened and they failed to pursue this information, then that's...yeah...so to summarize, given the choice between sitting around with their thumbs up their butts for five years and asking the people that are more likely to know what happened than anyone on earth, they chose the former.
The very fact that the Guardians didn't contact them about what they were doing on Rimbor is good reason to believe that power rings don't monitor their wearers in Young Justice.
They have between 3600 and 7200 Green Lanterns to worry about. Having the data doesn't mean you're going to analyze all of it unless a red flag is raised or someone requests to see the data.
So, the answer is still that the League never thought they might have been sent off-planet. That's it.
Except for the part where we're discussing why the G Ls in the League failed to ask the Guardians, not why the Guardians didn't just call up out of the blue and say "What the hell, bitch. What were you doing on Rimbor?"
OR, John did ask the Guardians of the Universe for help, explaining everything they knew. The end result could have been 'We Do Not Know'. Also remember during this time he was brainwashed and under control of some very smart people who may have deactivated the Ring's tracking functions for the duration of said brainwashing.
Maybe John did ask the Guardians, and maybe they didn't know. But neither the series, nor Weissman when asked about it, addresses the possibility, leaving the implication that he didn't. As was said earlier, it would have taken two seconds to say "Even Oa doesn't know." or whatever. Ditto for the disabling the tracking. Maybe that's what did happen, but the key problem is that no one comments on this at all, leaving us to assume that they didn't and the League is ust mind blowingly incompetent.
Given that it was five years after the incident, and they may have checked all those options, why would they bother mentioning it years after they exhausted all their options. Why would they say that "Even Oa doesn't know." to people who already know their attempts to find out what happened? And even if they hadn't considered space to be an option as to where they went (i don't remember them actually saying they never considered space as a possibility, but maybe you're right), they likely considered that the best way to solve that mystery would be to find the Light and ask them where they were sent.
One aspect to consider: They have no relevant extraterrestrial enemies by this point, but do have a couple extradimensional enemies. Maybe they hadn't gotten to space yet because they were poking through pocket dimensions to see if Klarion had sent them to one of those.
I am not familiar with the comics. So when the league was considering new members, and they suggested a 3rd green lantern, why did the other 2 green lanterns refuse so adamantly?
I'll expand on this. Guy doesn't work well with others, is easily angered and very eager for a fight no matter what the choice was and was a back up to the back up Green Lantern in the comics... So there's an explanation.
How exactly was Superboy expected to take down Superman or replace him in case of emergency? He doesn't naturally have the same powers. For a while I thought it was training him as a "human" would make him a better Superman but it wouldn't. He wouldn't be aware of how to best utilize his other powers and flying fundamentally changes how a fight works. Sweeping me off my feet loses a lot of it's effectiveness if hovering is an option I have open to me. Same goes for most submission holds if getting my feet over my head is easy and safe and not potentialy neck breaking. So training him to think like the Hulk and then giving him a slapper that upgrades him to Supes would have all of the hilarous effects of taking the Hulk to the moon to fight Superman.
Conner wasn't their first attempt at a Superman clone. And we don't know the full details of their plans. Perhaps they just wanted to closest thing to Superman that they could control. Match wasn't controllable but Conner was a step in the right direction. He's not as powerful but if the other sidekicks never found him he at least would've been under the Light's control.
In the mental simulations that Conner was run through at Cadmus of taking down Superman, he could fly and everything (see the comic book). It suggests that they didn't know about his limitations because they hadn't let him out yet. That, or they planned on using the shields.
Using the shields seems likely. After all they did come from Lex Luthor, a card-carrying member of The Light.
I get that the everyone-thinks-Blue Beetle-is-talking-to-himself-when-he's-really-talking-to-the-suit thing is meant as comic-relief, but how difficult would it be to tell everyone "my suit talks to me sometimes and I talk back to it"? It's not like everyone would think he's crazy, because A- it's the (well, a) DC universe- crazy stuff happens all the time, B- they already accept that he's got an alien power-suit bonded to his spine, its not like the fact that the thing talks to him is any more incredible and finally C- they have multiple telepaths (Miss Martian or J'onn) who can confirm "no, he's not nuts, the suit does in fact talk to him".
They know he's not nuts but it's still kind of weird. For one, most people would expect him to talk to it with his mind rather than out loud where you only hear half the conversation.3
And now he's explained it, and we can hear the Scarab talk. problem solved.
As he pointed out, he hadn't shared that he can talk to the scarab. May very well have been "I don't want them to think I'm crazy and say I can't be a hero."
He might not have wanted to reveal the true nature of the Scarab since it would mean admitting that there's an amoral artificial intelligence bonded to him. The others might think he's a security risk. Which he kind of is, given the true nature of the Scarab as an alien weapon of infiltration and destruction which even Jaime doesn't seem to know (He and Captain Atom think it's Ted Kord's last invention).
Which is pretty odd if you think about it, why would an AI created by a hero be that amoral ?
Well, while he's probably mistaken about the origin of the scarab, since all signs point to it being of the same alien origin as it is in the comics, but even if he isn't, A.I. Is a Crapshoot.
Either Jaime found the scarab in Kord's lab and just assumed Kord had invented it without bothering to ask, or the scarab is deliberately misleading him. The Reach are confirmed to exist in the Young Justice universe, so it's unlikely that it really is Kord's invention.
The way he talks to Superboy in "Salvage" makes me think he's very new and hasn't had the chance to explain to the others
So did anyone not see that early bird cameo of Static Shock in the Justice Hall?
Are you talking about Black Lightning in the Watchtower or was there an actual shot of Static in the Hall of Justice that I missed?
There was a guy who looked like him in civilian form in the museum as a tourist. Probably a meaningless cameo, like how half the girls at Robin's school were Batgirl at one time or another in the comics.
Vergil Hawkins did come into the series but as one of the abducted runaways. Well technically he isnt, but it doesnt change that he gets his powers along with some other kidsHe eventually joins the group
So Cadmus clones don't age. How did the Roy clone age convincingly for three years then? He also looks visibly older after the Time Skip, though that could simply be him getting out of shape (relatively speaking) and not getting enough sleep. Was the non-aging thing something Cadmus intentionally added to Superboy?
It probably has something to do with the fact that they were also cloning Kryptonian DNA. Which they couldn't actually do properly. Keep in mind, Superboy was the only the second test subject.
Makes sense. Cloning Kryptonians perfectly doesn't seem to be possible in most continuities. Might also be a side-effect of Superboy having a mix of human and Kryptonian DNA.
Also, Conner wasn't finished yet when he was busted out. So if they'd waited some more, he might be capable of aging.
At that point, the cloning process had already been completed, they were just programming him.
Superboy doesn't age. Normal, human clones do. Roy clone has matter-of-factly aged from when he was cloned, as is plainly obvious from comparison pics shown in the finale. It is merely a quirk of Superboy's genetics which have halted his physical age.
It should be pointed out that in most continuities, Superman ages at a significantly slower rate with each year, if he's aging at all after a certain point. It is possible that Kryptonians change very minimally physically as they get older. In fact, Superboy specifically says that he is aging internally, he's just not changing physically.
Word Of Greg: (1) Superboy doesn't age externally because of his problematic DNA mix, and (2) normal Kryptonians like Superman age only slightly slower than humans. If Superboy was a normal Kryptonian, he'd have aged visibly by now.
"Coldhearted" was overall an awesome episode, but this detail's bugged me ever since I first saw it: why was Queen Perdita being treated in a US hospital? You'd think the queen of a sovereign nation would have access to said nation's finest hospital, instead of having to travel overseas (at least it seems like Vlatava's a european country, let me know if I'm wrong).
It's not uncommon for rich citizens to travel to other countries if they have a better expert at a given medical procedure. If the world's best heart surgeon happened to be an American, the Vlatavan government and royal family would want Perdita to be treated by that person, not just the best one in Vlatava.
Except the surgeon (or at least I assume the guy who was waiting for KF was the (or one of the) surgeon(s)) sounded like a vlatavan too. And even if that was indeed the case, wouldn't it make more sense to have the surgeon come to Vlatava rather than the opposite? I can't imagine a 20+ hours long flight would improve her condition.
But the heart would have an even harder time traveling. You gotta go where the hearts are.
Perhaps she was visiting America when she took ill and they didn't want to risk her condition worsening by sending her back.
It happens all the time - she may well have access to Vlatava's finest hospital, but the finest hospital of a small sovereign nation isn't going to be as good as the finest hospital in America. America's combination of size and wealth means that it has the finest high-end medical care available (at least for those for whom money is no object).
In the episode "Bloodlines" Roy and Chesire have finally been able to track down the original Roy in Tibet. This mission is obviously very dangerous and there is a high chance of one them will get hurt. So then, why in the world do the two of them think its a good idea to bring their own baby along? It's child endangerment to the extreme. There is no way that bringing a baby along on a mission like that is a good idea. Even ignoring the danger their baby is in, it simply isn't practical to bring a baby along on a stealth mission. The baby even ends up bringing more guards with its cries so why would either parent even think to bring their child along?
Roy objected, and says as much. Cheshire obviously disagreed, and frankly she's the one wearing the pants at the time.
Apparently the kid was having fun. She might be used to seeing Mommy and Daddy kick ass. Besides, shes going to at some point in time learn how to protect herself from enemies being that her mom is a world class assassin, and father is a hero. Best way is to learn first hand I guess. I don't know I'm not a parent.
Jade may still have trust issues after being raised by Sportsmaster, and therefore may not have been very keen on leaving her own daughter with anyone else - even if it was her sister like Roy suggested. Alternately, Jade simply knew about the fort's defenses and determined that it would be very easy even if they did bring Lian with them. After all, Roy wasn't in particularly good shape, one of Jade's hands were busy holding Lian, and they got held at spearpoint by by every guard in the area - and they still kicked everybody's asses, apparently with little effort. Ultimtely though, I think it's just Rule of Funny - a way for the writer to insert a bit of humor during Roy's parts of the episode.
She may be playing up the part of the "bad parent" to give Roy extra motivation to get his act together. The whole mission seemed like it was sending Roy the message of "she could turn out like me if you aren't around".
Why did Impulse feel the need to lie about why he came to the past? Wouldn't it have been much easier if he simply told the truth ("Hey, I'm from the future to keep Flash - my grandfather - from dying against an insanely powerful supervillain!"). As it is, his pretending to be a tourist and his chipper demeanor meant that no one took him seriously and thus ignored him when he did try to help. Also, instead of just returning to the past and stopping neutron, he let himself get caught in a pointless chase with Robin, BB and Nightwing, waste several minutes talking to his grandpa and other relatives, try to tell said grandpa to just ignore the supervillain destroying the entire city, and then finally nearly got Barry killed by tripping him while in Neutron's proximity. Just saying, his job would be a lot easier if he just spoke up instead of putting up a silly act that means nobody will take him seriously.
He didn't want to risk revealing too much info about the future. He wasted the time with the team because he knew he had time to spare
Why? What could've happened? Besides, he was apparently fine with revealing that Barry would have twins and at least one grandson, so he didn't show much regard for the timestream (and let's not even mention how much more extensive the effects on the timestream would be by him staying in the past than him coming clean about why he came back). And even if if that was the case, why couldn't he just say: "Hey Flash, I know this Neutron guy, and I have something that can stop him before he does any more damage, so why don't you leave this to me, eh?" That way, he's not revealing details about the future, but still preventing Flash's death with little effort.
As far as telling Barry about the twins, Bart had good reason for that. By giving him that information, Barry goes into the fight with Neutron knowing that, if he doesn't come out of that fight alive, he is leaving behind a pregnant wife and, not one, but two children will grow up without a father. Bart may have hoped that that knowledge alone would have been enough to keep Barry from taking a fatal risk. If it had worked, Bart would have achieved his goal of keeping Barry alive through that fight with minimal other intervention in the time stream.
Could go with the Booster Gold explanation. As a time traveler, he acts silly so that none of his enemies who may also have access to time travel or even just nip his parents before they can have him realize how important he is.
He probably doesn't want anyone asking questions He may also be trying to keep off the villains radar. Flash defeating a new enemy? Not suspicious. New teen hero using the same slang as the aliens AND having advanced tech? Weird
It could be devastating for the heroes to hear about Flash's death and, moreover, the ruined future, and erode their hopes of being able to fight the good fight.
It is stated by Wally I think that if they knew too much it would mess up the time stream I think. Impulse said he didn't want to crash the mode.
Nono, crashing the mode is good; the mode is bad.
Heroes always seem to take personal responsibility in keeping the space-time continuum straight. He didn't want to chance that Barry would decide it was his duty to die in the fight.
At the end of Depths, Artemis is given a glamour charm to hide her identity. That's all well and good, but wouldn't a telepath or someone else with magical abilities be able to pick apart her secret possibly without even trying? At the very least, Zatanna would definitely recognize the necklace she enchanted herself!
It's a good thing she's infiltrating the organization which is entirely human-staffed, which in turn works for the one which employs only one telepath as a minion of a different member. Klarion would have to meet her in person to notice.
Zatanna probably won't be around Artemis, being she is an official Leaguer. However the mindreaders might be tipped off.
What I want to know is How did they fake her death that good, pretending to stab her and putting fake blood is one thing. But how did they keep her heartbeat hidden from Superboy and her mind hidden from a telapath as strong as Miss Martian?
Did you miss the part where she bites down on that pill or whatever? It's one of those handy fake death medicines.
I did miss that, thank you for pointing that out. That makes more sense now.
Why did Wally and Artemis quit being superheroes? In Wally's backstory it states he was a huge fan of the Flash and went through great pains to recreate the accident that gave Barry Allen his powers. Artemis I don't really care about to be honest. Wally in particular just bugs me something fierce. If he wants to be normal so bad then I say his powers are wasted on him and I don't understand why anyone would want to give up being a crime fighting vigilante in the first place.
Because they're going to college and their relationship would change priorities. Depending on when they left, maybe the death of Tula convinced them it was better not to take the risk.
I understand Nightwing's thinking of limiting who has knowledge of those in deep cover, but why wasn't Miss Martian in that group. You know the one team mate who can read minds and has scary powerful psychic abilities that she completely lost control of the last time she thought her best friend Artemis was dead?
She's the most emotional of all of them. I wouldn't trust her with a secret that requires acting completely contrary to her held opinion of a person, and neither does Nightwing for likely the same reason.
M'Gann is probably the best actor out of the entire Team; she played the role of "Megan" to a tee after all.
That's because the real Megan is as vapid and shallow as the character. There wasn't a need to do much acting.
M'gann has already had multiple secrets revealed to villains during her mental fights with Psimon. The last thing they need is for her to accidentally blow Artemis' cover during another confrontation.
The only people who knew about the plan were the people who needed to know (3 were playing an active part and Artemis refused to go along unless Wally knew). Telling M'gann was simply unnecessary.
Does military procedure not exist in this world? Prison wardens bring inmates into their offices to administer discipline. No more than a single guard goes along with said inmate. The inhibitor collars for every prisoner in the best jail in the country can be simultaneously disengaged at the push of a single button; there isn't even an access code required. When the country is launching a communication satellite that a lot of people would happily smash, there will be no military personnel standing by to help the superheroes in protecting the launch. There will also be no checks of the launch site or the spacecraft for bombs or sabotage.
It would make a pretty bland and boring story if the regular humans were actually smart. Keep in mind they are used to being pacified by superpowered beings so they are probably inept at most defensive procedures. They know the league and the team will save them.
...What does half of that half to do with military procedure? At least as regards the last part, military personnel would most likely just get in the way of a superpowered threat, and we don't know that they didn't check for sabotage. Just because Black Manta successfully planted a bomb doesn't mean they never tried to look, only that Black Manta was cunning enough to successfully conceal it.
Navy submarines would have been a huge help fighting Black Manta's forces, for example. Radar would have picked up the hostile cruisers before Lagoon Boy caught sight of them, and friendly torpedo fire would have greatly aided the Team in protecting the Launch site. Infantry would have bolstered the defense of the shoreline. Artillery fire, missile fire, and anti-metahuman weaponry if available, would have put a dent in anything below krypton-class. As for sweeping the shuttle and satellite for sabotage, multiple security teams would have gone through every inch of both spacebound objects. There's only so many places a bomb can be hidden, and a couple hundred trained people will be looking for anything that doesn't belong. It's possible the bomb was cloaked and intangible, but no security is even shown.
To be fair, Hugo Strange had a hand in setting everything up at the prison and maybe a couple of corrupt guards. As for the communications satellite the military may have thought the only threat was rowdy crowd goers. And as for the bomb it might have been placed somewhere very hard to find or inside a section of the craft that's difficult at best to check.
Why is Nightwing performing CPR to treat a stab wound? That's going to make blood leave the body even faster.
It's almost like he's not actually trying to save her.
As a Marine I was taught that in order you start the breathing, then stop the bleeding. Brain damage sets in rather quick without oxygen.
Check the Fridge page; he wasn't trying to save her since she wasn't actually dead. He was just keeping up appearances to a bunch of people who would never need to know what CPR is for.
M'Gann used CPR to save Wally back in "Infiltrator". That, and just because they have powers doesn't mean they have no use for things like first aid or survival training.
Here's something. In "Performance", the Parasite guy steals powers. That's all well and good. M'gann is a white martian pretending to be a green martian using her shapeshifting ability. So why, when Parasite takes her powers, does she not turn into a white martian?
Parasite clearly doesn't steal all of a person's powers and abilities; he copies the agility of Robin and a few other circus performers, after all, and they don't suddenly lose the ability to run or jump (they just feel like they have a really debilitating cold). So while he absorbed M'gann's shapeshifting, he didn't necessarily remove it. She just was probably locked in the Dawn Danger form for the most part until she "recharged."
And remember that M'gann doesn't revert to her true form when she's unconscious either. Her body stays a certain way until she tells it to change. It's not like shapeshifters in some other works where they have to expend energy actively maintaining their forms. If her shapeshifting power was actually removed, she would indeed have been in Mode Lock, since it would require more shapeshifting to make her look like a White Martian again. Her shapeshifting has Ontological Inertia.
How exactly can a simple piece of clothe stop Black Canary's Canary Cry in "Auld Aquintances"?
Depends on how tight it was wrapped around her mouth. She would still need to open her mouth and produce plenty of noise, which couldn't be possible if her mouth was impossible to open.
But we see it wrapped on top of her moth! She could have still been able to open it?
She was unconscious. Maybe the cloth wouldn't have stopped her from using it, but it was better than leaving her mouth uncovered. The cloth might give her a few seconds pause before she thinks to use it, and that's a few seconds the team can use to knock her out again.
Who says it isn't enchanted or made of Kryptonian fabric?
Why is it that Megan can translate Rannian but not Spanish?
Bane was reciting soccer scores in Spanish, not information they needed. She even identifies that his information is in that language.
Exactly, the issue wasn't that Bane was speaking Spanish, it's that he was reciting nonsense to fill his mind with noise.
Did Speedy age when he was on ice? because he and Red Arrow seemed to be the same age, but logically Speedy should be the same age now as he was when he was frozen. I can't tell if this is intentional (because seriously, losing eight years of your life on top of everything that had happened would suck), or part of the limitations of the art style.
Greg Weisman has confirmed that he didn't age.
Unless it's just perspective, Speedy is shorter than Red Arrow, and he isn't as well-built (one could blame that on cryo). There is a difference between them.
Other than plot what reason could the Light have for trying to discredit the JL instead of just wiping them out on the spot? It's not like the general public know any of this is happening. As far as they know the JL would just have disappeared never to be seen again. After the JL is out of the way, they can do damage control unobstructed.
They didn't want to discredit the JL. They didn't do anything to tar them except on Rimbor, and the purpose of that attack was to draw attention to Earth by demonstrating how powerful the planet was. Under the Light's Plan A, they would have retained control of the JL permanently. But Savage said that the League's continued existence is necessary for their larger plan even if it's not under their control.
Here's what I don't get which finally caught up with me. In Darkest, we hear that Kaldur was still putting the "terror twins" back in Belle Reve 2 years ago. However, what I don't get is HOW? How is it that villains that were confirmed belle reve inmates such as Mammoth and Icicle Jr escaped in the 5 year time skip? The Team had already outed Hugo Strange as a corrupt warden, so one would only assume he got canned, so HOW DID THE SUPERVILLAINS ESCAPE!!!!!????????
One of the leaders of the Light is a pseudo-omnipotent magical being that can split the entire planet into two separate realities. Somehow I doubt breaking a pair of inbred rednecks out of prison is going to be difficult.
Why is Stephanie Brown among the Light/Reach's captives? They're only interested in the metagene and she has no powers in her original incarnation, and I can't see any reason why they should give her any now...pointless fanservice +1
They're experimenting on normal humans, remember? Stephanie is freed before she can be mutated.
The point of the meta-gene is that anyone who has it can have superpowers, not that they automatically do. Being powerless doesn't preclude her from having the gene, it just means (at best) she simply hasn't been exposed to a situation where it would become active.
So, Tim as Robin wears sunglasses to hide his face like Dick, yet it's ok for Barbara not to? "Satisfaction" makes it pretty clear that the rest of the superheroines know Barbara is Batgirl. I guess knowing that wouldn't necessarily lead someone to deduce Batman's civilian identity, but I was under the impression Bats is pretty strict with the whole secret identity thing.
Both Tim and Dick were adopted by / lived with Bruce Wayne. Their identity being revealed makes Batman's relatively obvious. Barbara on the other hand has no direct connection to Bruce Wayne, so it's less important for her.
Bit of a nitpick here. Miss Martian transformed her blood into AB- (I think that was it) to give a transfusion to Garfield. She evidently didn't get it right though, because it turned his skin green and gave him superpowers. I'm not up on the whole blood type thing, but wouldn't getting the blood type wrong kill him? Come to that, why would a transfusion from a Martian give him the power to turn into Earth animals...
I'm assuming that there's some quality of Martian blood which remains no matter how it's transformed and would cause similar effects in anyone else who got a transfusion (or alternately, Gar could be a freak accident- he's a sample size of one, so statistically he tells us nothing). But his transformations aren't just limited to Earth animals- he took on the form of a Rannian bird-thing in "Earthlings" if I remember correctly. Word of God indicates he can turn into any animal he's had direct contact with.
You're assuming it was from her blood and not from the monkey that was biting him in his debut episode as per his comics origin story?
Considering that there was nothing in the show to insinuate that there was anything out of the ordinary about that monkey, while a Martian blood-transfusion is certainly out of the ordinary, well...
Sorry to be a nit pick but it was the extremely rare O negative blood type (O negative blood can be donated to everyone, but give those people anything but O negative and they die - that's why Garfield's mum said she normally has some for emergencies). As to the powers, maybe the donated blood enhanced the meta-gene the series goes on about? The show says the meta-gene can be activated by traumatic experiences, i.e. Miss Martian's blood donation brought it to the forefront, then seeing his mother's death activated it?
Something like that. On Ask Greg, Greg said that most species would not gain shapeshifting powers from a Martian blood transfusion, the metagene is involved.
Regardless of the blood type, I'd like to know why, if M'gann was a white martian why Garfield's skin turned green! I am assuming that this is his origin story for the current Earth version, but the green skin change makes no sense given M'gann's real identity. Any ideas?
Simple. While her true identity is that she's a white Martian, she was green when she gave the blood, just like how she was Gar's blood type when she gave the blood.
Why did Nightwing say that the 'Beetle connection' was unclear at the end of Before the Dawn? I thought that the episode made it abundantly clear that the Reach made the scarab, and it was discussed in front of Jaime. On that matter, Was is Jaime or someone else in the suit in Bart's bad future?
It did not make it abundantly clear. It can be inferred yes, but we don't know how much of the discussion Jamie overheard, or how much he relayed to Nightwing.
Most likely someone else, given that rebooting the scarab would have killed Jamie.
So the team discovers the Reach, and as a plan B if there were ever discovered, the Reach decide to present themselves are friendly visitors so that nobody would believe the heroes. Not a bad plan, but, why save that for a plan B and not do it immediately?
It's much more risky, and they needed time for G.G.G. to poison the public perception of the heroes.
Actually, this was Plan A in the comics, and how the Reach operated in general.
G.G.G. has been poisoning the public mind against the heroes for a while. There have been snippets such as a couple of kids talking about how they thought the Justice League was actually responsible for the Apalaxian invasion while they were taking a tour of the hall.
Leaving aside the fact that the League have forty-odd rescued kidnap victims to back whatever claim they make to the government, there's no indication that the world's leaders are so influenced by Godfrey's hatemogering that they would ignore the League's warning about the Reach.
This point came up. The Reach ambassador is just that good.
Actually, "Cornered" ducked the issue. The episode very carefully avoids having Captain Atom's accusation reach the world's governmental and military leaders, and paints the issue as the Ambassador winning over Secretary-General Tseng. It's Tseng's prerogative to be so taken in by the Reach's promises that he ignores the fact that he's known the Reach for half a day and that the Justice League has been protecting the world for over a decade, but it beggars belief that all or even most of Earth's leaders would be comfortable with the Reach staying on Earth if the League accused the Reach of kidnapping. It comes down to a matter of ethos—credibility—and the widely-known and long-active heroes have far more of it than the aliens who just introduced themselves.
Except that the Reach can undermine the League's credibility by revealing they've been keeping things secret, like the Team and the Watchtower. But it does seem odd that Earth's leaders would be quick to dismiss the claims of the kidnapped teenagers as distortions invented by the Justice League. Certainly it can be proven that they were missing and that the ones who didn't survive are nowhere to be found. I guess the Reach would claim that the kids were taken by the Kroloteans, or just ran away, and that the League are making them say it was the Reach for their own purposes.
Actually, the Reach claiming that it was the Kroloteans who abducted the teens would make a lot of sense. The League has no hard evidence that it was the Reach specifically, and the Kroloteans already had a habit of abducting people. They're actually a really convenient alibi, especially since the League is not exactly in favor at the moment.
The Reach's plan hinges on the premise that if the League accused complete strangers who appeared on Earth 12 hours ago of kidnapping and unethical experimentation, no one would be inclined to listen to the League without proof even though the League has been heroing officially for over a decade. Now, the League's word may or may not be too authoritative with world governments as a general rule, but no one knows anything about the Reach, (the Reach's claims of friendship do not consitute knowledge) and no one has any reason to dismiss accusations made against the Reach by a reputable source. (Unless the League have made a habit of falsely accusing innocent newcomers to Earth of having hostile agendas, then the League count as a reputable source.) The Justice League could have announced the truth well before the Reach begins their campaign against the League. (notice, by the way, that the plot says the League won't be believed without proof but the Reach suffer no such obstacle.)
Yes, the League may have deduced that Bee and Luthor are members of the Light and that the Light were pulling the strings behind the Injustice League, but how exactly do they expect to prove such a thing? They gain nothing by publically accusing a head of state and multinational billionaire of terrorism without being able to make the connection stick, and the evidence required to do so is dubious at best.
This is less of a nitpick and more hope that it is Foreshadowing, but why hasn't the Scarab taken complete control of Jaime's body? It's capable of doing that, we know that from "Darkest", and it seemed to treat it as a last resort. It's fully sapient, but it seems content to stay in its role of advisor despite the fact that it constantly complains about Jaime's tactics.
It can take control, but it was rather insistent in that instance and Jaime reasserted control not long after. A normal Scarab can just usurp its host. Jaime's Scarab is damaged and can't exert such influence. It needs to work with Jaime.
Is there any reason to believe that the Blue Beetle in Impulse's Bad Future is Jaime? I mean, different body type could be easily handwaved, but I just find it weird that no one has mentioned this once, even when Impulse was trying to comfort Jaime about his supposed "future." Or did I miss something somewhere?
There's reason to believe it, but there is no reason to assume it for sure, and that has been bugging me as well. Presumably, Impulse has actually seen the person inside, or at the very least, knew Blue Beetle as a hero and saw him go bad.
Additionally, there's also the fact that Impulse's historical knowledge is faulty and not complete. He could have assumed, or heard from someone who assumed, that Jaime became the evil Blue Beetle. In a post apocalyptic world, it's unlikely that Bart would know different. Plus, remember the line in 'Satisfaction' where Jaime mentions how people think he's the same Blue Beetle as the previous guy when they see him? Bart most likely made a faulty assumption, especially since the Reach said they would have to remove the scarab to put it on mode.
It's possible it's a publically known fact that this Blue Beetle is Jaime Reyes (in the future). Anyway, it is the same voice actor. It's more likely that the Reach find a way around it in the future, and their current belief that they'd have to kill Jaime to get the Scarab working properly is meant (by the writers) to create a false sense of security.
It's just been such a glaring oversight for no one to even mention it. I'm hoping that's their point and it's a bait-and-switch, but if the big reveal winds up being "Aha! That Blue Beetle isn't even Jaime!" then I will be the sadface.
So, in "Satisfaction," when Blue Beetle, Impulse and the others are in the grotto and Impulse asks about the monuments, Jaime mentions that "no one will know his [Ted Kord/Blue Beetle I] sacrifice," and he also mentions he never met Kord. Later, in Jaime's "Before the Dawn" flashback, we see him get the Scarab at Kord Industries when the building explodes and it flies out. However, the mainstream Ted Kord died during the Infinite Crisis - since that likely hasn't happened in this world, the question remains, how did Ted Kord die?
Probably in that explosion, which is highly unlikely to be an accident.
Ok, so Phase 1 of The Light's big long plan was to take control of the justice league and put them in the global spotlight. I get that. Phase 2 seems to be partnering with The Reach. I assume that this means them allowing them to take control of most of the earth in order to contribute to the rise of a metagene population. The "Glorious Evolution" that Vandal Savage talked about. HOWEVER, there's one big flaw in their plan: How do they intend to keep earth on top when The Reach is already enacting their invasion plan? They want Earth to be at the center of the cosmos, but how do they intend to do that when they're collaborating in turning the earth into reach zombies? It just...seems a little shortsighted of The Light to do that, not to mention how someone like Lex Luthor might object in concept to these happenings.
Maybe they just plan on ruling over the normal people with the Light and the Reach being the only ones with power.....or maybe the Light is planning on betraying the Reach
Seems likely. The Light intentionally let the Team know about the Reach's additive, and there's no indication that the Reach also wanted that to happen.
And now it's clearer that the Light and the Reach are working at cross-purposes re:"the Runaways".
And as of "War" it's quite clear that the Light and the Reach are at cross-purposes, seeing as the Light's unnofficial leader Vandal Savage prodded Mongul into attacking Earth to take a major bite out of the Reach's on-planet forces.
Since it looks like Aresnal will be joining the team, how exactly is the computer going to differentiate between him and Red Arrow since it's been shown that both Arsenal and Red Arrow register the same? Which means the cloning process must have been pretty good given that even identical twins don't have the same iris scan. They also don't have identical fingerprints so they will either have to use that on the one hand Arsenal still has left or the Light has some pretty impressive tech to make sure Red Arrow had identical fingerprints too.
Now that Red Arrow is off the team it really doesn't matter. Maybe it'll go by their different looks
It shows that a retinal scan that was the entry to one of Green Arrow's hideouts registers them as the same. It showed nothing about the (likely more complex) Zeta Tubes the league uses registering them as the same. Keep in mind, if it was a problem, Guardian being a clone would have been discovered pretty quickly.
Green Arrow's hideout had a zeta tube, so the security used is probably the same as the League's. I can't see Batman allowing otherwise. You also see retinal scans for when Billy tried to use a zeta tube as himself rather than as Captain Marvel. It didn't work. Guardian wasn't a member of the Justice League and thus didn't have an ID for the computer. They probably figured out he was a clone when the League tried to give him an ID. Also, while Red Arrow might not be on the team, he will probably continue using League and the Team's hideouts and zeta tubes, thus this would be a problem.
The tube has it's own separate security. Check out the phonebooth tubes and the tube at the dump. They clearly don't have any security around the tube, so the tube would need its own security.
Facial recognition? They may look similar, but they definitely have enough differences to tell them apart. If they can set up something as complex as the zeta tubes I'm sure they have a way to tell the difference between two people based on their looks.
Doubtful. Facial recognition (much like fingerprints which I know a Fingerprint Technician and retinal scans though the latter is an assumption I'm making) work by finding a a number of things they find that are the same between the stored information and the new scan. Arsenal and Red Arrow shave enough traits it's unlikely they wouldn't both have enough similar points to fool the computer. If Arsenal can fool a retinal scan (which should be impossible, as an earlier Troper pointed out twins don't have identical fingerprints or retinal scans and without going into a boring amount of detail it's basically the same reason why two shirts won't get the same wrinkles. Being a clone and thus born of a tube not a woman should be more than enough to change fingerprints and retinal scans but this cloning process is apparently closer to photo copying than cloning should be. As a final note if the computer was sufficiently advanced to tell the difference between Red Arrow and Arsenal they would have a different problem entirely. It might very well reject one (or both) of them after a fight since the two might not be identical but a black eye, bloody nose and busted lip could easily make either one of them different enough that a program that could tell Arsenal from Red Arrow might not accept beat half to death Arsenal or Red Arrow and I don't think any good comes from not being able to get to home base when you're half dead.
Then the answer is simple. It doesn't. It acts like they are one and the same. Headscratcher answered.
Actually it doesn't. I had asked how the computer would work now, not if it could differentiate between both original and clone. I asked because if the computer fritzes and locks down when both Red Arrow and Arsenal try to enter into the same base or any of the bases, this could be a big problem (such as them trying to take cover or stock up). The only way this headscratcher is answered from what I figured was if a) the system allows for two scans of that specific retina without turning on the alarms or b) they have a special key to use with their retina scans as a way of differentiating between them in the computer system. It makes a bit of a security loophole if someone ever got their hands on the key and the cloning process but for allowing two overly identical heroes to enter in and out without a hassle, it's a good temporary solution.
Or everyone could have a specific code to put in. Keep in mind that no security system is flawless, especially in a world of shapeshifters, mindreaders, and clones. Also you're over thinking this a little too much. Unless it ever comes up in the show it's probably irrelevant
I believe overthinking is the point of this section. There will always be a loophole in the security system but I could see the requirement of a code with biometric scan of some sort because just entering code is making the system less secure.
So, does being On-Mode mean that the scarab is in control, or is it Jaime, or a blend? It's kind of confusing as to how being on mode works.
I Think that it's a Split Personality Merge between The scarab and it's host (Jaime in this case) Mixed with a little Brainwashing.
With "Intervention", we now know it's the Scarab.
Why hasn't the Reach advanced their technology that much in the thousands of years between when the Scarabs were planted and when they finally arrived? A thousand years ago, humanity was stuck on wooden ships and largely illiterate. The wheel itself can't be more than six thousand years old. Moreover, our technological advancement increased exponentially when we all got connected and competing worldwide, and the Reach is, as far as we know, one big united species. And yet they haven't even improved their Scarab that much, as Blue Beetle was able to take on Black Beetle.
There probably comes a point where many things simply cannot be improved upon. This could be one of the reasons why they're trying to harness the Meta Gene, to advance themselves even further.
Also, the Industrial Revolution was kicked off by high wages and advanced enough tech. The Reach, having a slave economy, probably have less impetus to improve, especially since what they are doing seems to be working.
This was a minor plot point in Animorphs, that human brains are just wired in such a way that we're more ingenuitive. One of the aliens in that series noted that it took humans less than 80 years to go from atmospheric flight to spaceflight, but it took his species considerably longer. It could just be that humans are more imaginative that way. Or it's part of the metagene.
The wheel is 6000 years old, and no one has improved it in all of that time. Maybe they just got the scarab right the first time (or improved it to that point) before Blue Beetle's scarab was made?
If this article is anything to go by, they're still improving the wheel. The point is, they haven't improved their technology at all. Shouldn't Black have a much faster processor than Blue or be made of a stronger alloy so that his blades can't cut him? Although, seeing how they're trying to unlock the metagene and they stole War World, maybe they've got a clause in their treaty with the Guardians that says they can't advance their technology.
Maybe they're not allowed to advance their tech because of their treaty with the Green Lantern Corps.
You are (obviously) basing this on human history alone. As stated above, there may come a point where technology just cannot process any further.
Wow. Somehow, this is becoming one of the most stubborn arguments about how Sci-Fi Writers Have No Sense of Scale I've seen. It's no sillier than lightsabers staying unchanged for 10,000 years, or any of countless other identical cases, people.
After War World was obivous proven to be hostile, why didn't the world just use the Nuclear Option and blast the thing into pieces?
Because it wouldn't have worked. I'm not sure our missiles could reach it, and even if they could, they would either be destroyed by its defenses or just not harm it. Oh, not to mention that if it did work, the debris could be disastrous for the planet, making a surgical strike much smarter.
Why was Sportsmaster so eager to help out Artemis once he learned she was alive? Unlike Jade, he hasn't shown any morals before and he certainly hasn't shown to have any connection with his daughter. In fact, he didn't even seem too concerned with her death, just the effect it would have on his reputation.
Like he said, he liked the idea of playing the Light for chumps because he was on the outs with them.
Or he does care. He just thinks it a weakness, and doesn't want to show it.
Why did no one think to put Arsenal in therapy? In one of the shows that averts There Are No Therapists, it's kind of stupid for them to let him work on the Team and kick him off when he can't cope when he clearly needs psychiatric help. If a guy attempts suicide, you don't chew him out for risking his teammates, you ship him off to Black Canary until he gets a clean bill of mental health!
Fact is, Arsenal did almost get the team killed, and has done things like this before. Having a teen with PTSD and extreme mental health issues on a team that regularly is in high-risk situations (and situations that could prompt flashbacks) is probably not the best place for Arsenal's mental health. We do not know what Nightwing would have done with Arsenal once they would have gotten to base; all we know is what Nightwing said right then and there. For all we know, Arsenal could have been going to Black Canary therapy, or denied Black Canary therapy, or would have been sent to therapy. Nightwing is not completely in the right, but it is reasonable to see why he did what he did (as it is reasonable to see why Arsenal did what he did).
If they treated it like a genuine mental problem, then I could see that. But they don't, they treat it like Arsenal is just being whiny. The reason Nightwing kicks him off is, and I quote "Intentionally endangering the lives of teammates in order to further his own agenda or guard against his own demons. It's unacceptable, so until you prove yourself a team player, you have no place on this team.", while being fully aware that Arsenal was, at the time, attempting suicide. That doesn't sound like "We're putting you in therapy until you recover sufficiently.", it sounds like "Stop complaining about your problems, because your mental instability is endangering everyone else." Yes, he endangered the team. No, that was not the right way to handle it. At all.
I read his statement more as "You're off active duty until we're assured you can work with the team", but it was worded pretty poorly.
Arsenal intentionally endangered the lives of Alpha Squad in 'True Colors' to further his own agenda. As for the second part- it sounded to me like Nightwing was implying that Arsenal being on the team to fight his PTSD is a bad idea. No, Nightwing did not handle it well; he should have waited until they were on the ground, in private to tell Arsenal that he was off the team. But Nightwing does have a good point.
Chances are Arsenal probably did go to seek counseling on someone's (possibly Nightwing's, Black Canary, Red or Green Arrow's recommendation), but it's not going to cure his PTSD in a few months. Normally this takes years until there's at least a possibility the patient can adjust to normal life and even then there's always going to be long-term issues Arsenal will have to deal with for the rest of his life. Therapy isn't a magical cure-all pill. From the writer's perspective there's a limited time frame, you can only work so many stories into a 22 minute slot and I can see why they chopped out Arsenal speaking to Black Canary or someone else.
Why have Nightwing go through the process of finding clues of Blue Beetle's betrayal when it was revealed to him via TV interview anyway? It made his detective work pointless.
Because Nightwing was raised by Batman.
that doesn't address the pointless detective work. It was utterly unnecessary from a writing standpoint.
Because Blue's cooperation with the Reach only seals the deal. The detective work proves Blue attacked them, and that it wasn't a boom tube as he had claimed. Seeing Blue on TV would make pegging him as the kidnapper jumping to conclusions, and that isn't good detective work.
Also, Nightwing knew that Blue was working with the Reach, but had no clue as to what exactly happened. He needed clues to see if he could get a lead to find out where the team was, or at least what section of the gigantic construction that is War World.
Plus, as any lawyer will tell you, you can never have too much evidence.
Did we ever learn what the name and the powers of that one Reach abductee that decieded to stay with Star Labs. I think I remember him saying that he almost destroyed a part of hiis city so I'd have to imagin it's something pretty destructive, but other then that I don't think we got any other information.
That was Neutron.
We saw what happened in "Bloodlines".
This is just from rewatching earlier parts of season 2, but why didn't they ask Blue Beetle to translate any of the Krolatean intel, or take advantage of that ability? He showed the scarab could translate alien languages, specifically Krolatean, in 'Happy New Year', yet in 'Bloodlines' Nightwing says the computer just finished translating the intel from Melina Island. It's a month or so in universe between when Nightwing got the intel and the computer translated it. Wouldn't asking Blue Beetle to translate it have been faster?
When the heroes learnt that Mongul wants to destroy the Earth because it's occupied by the Reach, why didn't they offer him to take out only the Reach? Mongul being Mongul, it likely wouldn't work but it's strange they didn't at least try.
Because even without the Reach being on Earth, he would have come to take it over or destroy it eventually. He just pushed up his time table because the Reach were in the early stages of their invasion.
Yeah- when a Galactic Conqueror shows up, it's a good bet he's here to conquer, even if he also intends to wipe out the Scary Dogmatic Aliens that you're already having to deal with while he's at it. It was an Evil Versus Evil situation where either side winning would be bad for Earth (and Mongul was the greater threat at the moment), and the League and team were Genre Savvy enough to know it.
Also, imagine the G.Gordon headline: "Justice League teams up with Galactic Conqueror to destroy Earth, I TOLD YOU THEY WERE BAD."
In "Summit" Black Beetle insists that the Light take off their masks. Why won't he take off his?
Black Beetle views the Light as subservient to him. Why should he take off his mask for them? After all, they are lowly meat who do not deserve his respect.
Plus it was for security purposes to make sure everyone in the Light was who they said they were and it wasn't say...Superman who beat up and stole Black Manta's armor. Black Beetle can't be impersonated easily, and the Light were the ones who wanted to meet with them, so they'd have no reason to suspect he was a spy. Hilariously he's right to suspect because 3 of them were spies, but failed to look any deeper than masks, so he didn't catch that Deathstoke was a shape shifted martian, Tigress had a magical charm, and they thought Aqualad was allied with them.
If running experiments on the people of Earth is a violation of the Reach's treaty with the Guardians, then how is destroying the Earth altogether a better option? Is planetary genocide somehow allowed in this treaty?
If they could somehow make it look like it wasn't their doing? Although, the Guardians would have to be simple to accept that.
Simple. The doomsday devices were to be passed off as natural disasters.
If the Earth is intact then there is proof that the Reach has been overstepping its bounds. If Earth is destroyed then even if the Guardians know that the Reach has been breaking the treaty, they can't prove it.
Given that Klarion hadn't shown up for the entire second season, it seemed irrelevant, but in the end 'Summit' raises a question of Savage 'hiring' Klarion in the first place. For someone with Vandal's kind of schemes, it seems far too risky to take on a 'partner' who - by definition - could change his mind at any point and abandon the Light, or worse. Is there a deal? A threat? Does Savage know something Nabu (who seemed to consider Klarion a viable, if childishly annoying, threat) doesn't? Granted, we're not about to get an answer in the show and it's hardly needed at this point, but it is curious.
Considering that Savage is 50,000 years old and Klarion is ageless, it's entirely possible that they've known each other longer than anyone else on the Light and Vandal knows exactly what buttons to push to keep Klarion interested. Alternately, the Light didn't actively recruit Klarion- he found out about them via some unspecified means and just showed up one day, and everybody thought it was less of a pain to just give him a position (where they could keep an eye on him) than run him off (and then have a godlike being angry at them and frustrating their plans at every corner).
It's pretty small, but why hasn't there been any mention of Lagoon Boy's metagene? He was captured by the Reach and held for quite some time (not as long as the Runaways and Shimmer, but still a while).Of course, it could be that it just didn't activate in the timeslot given, but it could have been at least addressed in a throwaway line.
Because Lagoon Boy doesn't have the Metagene, and it was explicitly stated in the episode he was captured. His appearance is natural for his branch of the Atlantean Species, and his powers are magic based.
Can someone remind me what the "A" designation is for? I know pure numeric is the Justice League, "B" is the team, and "C" is pets, but what's A? Based on some of them, I'd assume it's Muggle personnel to the Justice League, but there are also a bunch who don't fit that trend. The characters designated "A" (source) are Snapper Carr, Catherine Cobert, Zatanna, John Smith (Red Tornado), Billy Batson (Captain Marvel), A06-09 (spoilers), Mal, Adam Strange, Blue Beetle (unstated which one—presumably Jaime), and Jay Garrick (Flash I).
The "A" designation is for "Authorized Guests." Basically any civilian that a member of the League wishes, for whatever reason, to authorize for entry into the Watchtower/Cave without setting off security alerts.
Zatanna got her A designation when she first appeared as just Zatarra's daughter, later got the regular team one of B08 and later the Justice League one of 25. Mal might be in a similar situation. Billy Batson probably got his A one tagged on after the events of Misplaced and the issue of him not being able to use a tube in his civilian identity showed up. B22 is clearly Jamie Blue Beetle and given that A13 is Jay Garrik (the old Flash) its likely that A12 is the old Blue Beetle after he retired but before he died. So yes, A is basically just "authorized guests"
I notice that our character page for the Light calls him "Vandal Savage A04". Adam Strange is called "Adam Strange A11", so does that mean Vandal Savage was A04 while the Justice League were under Light control, then they deleted his authorization after returning to normal? In any case, it seems silly to bother noting the A designation on the character page.
Thanks for pointing that out. Greg Weisman confirmed some time ago that Vandal's designation was deleted.
What is up with the League's Poor Communication Kills with the rest of the world? Even disregarding their poor public perception thanks to Gordon and not having evidence against the Reach, Luthor, or Queen Bee:
Eight members, including the Big Three of Superman, Batman and Wonderwoman and fourth founding member Martian Manhunter are gone for several months without anyone noticing. (Besides Toyman.) Sure there are so many Leaguers its probably easy to lose track, but these are some very public members. Wouldn't their Rouge's Galleries notice? Superman is widely known to be an alien, wouldn't a reporter seek out his opinion on the Reach? At one point they fake Martian Manhunter and Superman being at a press conference but that's a pres conference. Someone should notice they're not showing up to all the crises that happen, unless no one tapes them. Which leads us to . . .
The Reach repeatedly claimed Blue Beetle single handedly stopped the Warworld despite the Big battle the League had with it. Sure they were in space, but with the fate of Earth at stake someone surely would have been watching with a telescopic camera.
STAR Labs found mind controlling agents in the Reach drink, but instead of going to the FDA or having the goverment run tests to confirm it they have to get an Engineered Public Confession?
In Summit, Aqualad revealed that Luthor had been removing the control agents form Reach drinks before they were given out. Randomly tested ones might not have shown to have them.
Why did Weisman tease two new Leaguers when they're not even shown in the season 2 finale?!
He didn't he teased a new team member, which turned out to be Static
It wasn't a tease, he has stated repeatedly on ASKGREG that he doesn't tell stories in that format (answering questions) because a lot of how something turns out depends on execution.
Okay, seriously, why did the Leaguer's on Rimbor take forever to get back after M'gann and Superboy cleared them when M'gann and Superboy were back on Earth to find out about and help thwart the End Game? I mean, other than dramatic reasons, since for example Superman probably could have added to the kinetic energy to prevent Wally's death since he seems to have super-speed, but they only got back when, well, no one needed them. What took so long?
Superman is much slower than Kid Flash. M'gann and Superboy could have given their testimony and left, whereas the league could have had to go through additional processing.
Do we have any measure of how fast Superman is in Young Justice? There have been continuities where he's as fast as the Flash and we know Flash and Impulse are faster than KF. It's possible that Superman however wouldn't have been much help though, the Speed Force can be a fickle thing and just going super fast may not qualify.
That doesn't help: if Superman is slower, he'd have taken more of the energy. Plus, he's invulnerable, so it wouldn't have hurt him that much.
If the first Blue Beetle used the Blue Scarab compared to the second Blue Beetle who used his own gadgets, why didn't the former look identical to the third Blue Beetle?
In the comics, the difference between Dan and Jaime's costumes is because Dan activated the Scarab using magic, which damaged it, which is why the Scarab is offline when Jaime finds it. I'm guessing that hindrance from the Bialyan sealing magic resulted in Dan's different costume in this continuity.
Why did the Light need to round up a team of inexperienced runaways that they would have to manipulate into their anti-team, when they already had a bunch of more experienced and perfectly willing young supervillains at their disposal who had already proven themselves by blowing up Mount Justice?
You're assuming The Light is on the level with each other about everything. A very bad assumption given the one doing this is Lex Luthor.
Could you elaborate?
Luthor would like having his own team of superteens that the rest of the Light couldn't touch? This is Lex Luthor, schemer par excellence we're talking about. It's very in-character for him to gather some advantages over the rest of the Light in case he feels like playing them all for chumps later on.
Lex let Vandal in on his plan. It's more likely The Light was going to use the Runaways as a cat's paw against the Reach and to assist the Team against the Reach to further their own goals. If the Team sees Icicle Jr, the Terror Twins or other villains they'll deal with them. If The <I.Reach</I> sees them they know that The Light is hampering their efforts. By using the Runaways they disrupt the Reach without giving themselves away.
In the season finale Kid Flash didn't survive because he couldn't keep up with the Flash and Impulse. However they seem to be having an extended conversation before he dies - doesn't this suggest they're running at the same speed?
Close to the same speed but not close enough.
Or they're so much faster that they are lapping him multiple times per second and are able to say a word of the sentence each lap. They do slow down at one point to try to take a few of the energy bolts though.
Which brings up another point, why exactly is Kid Flash so much slower than both Flash and Impulse?
Wally replicated Barry's origin, but I'm pretty sure the Allens have some kind of genetic disposition toward superspeed. In the comics, Wally's slower speed turned out to be a mental block, but I guess we'll never see where that could have gone in this series.
Word of God states outright (and the tie-in comic strongly implies) that it's because Wally's replication of Barry's laboratory experiment was imperfect. Not surprising, given that Barry had access to professional chemicals and equipment, whereas Wally did it more-or-less with a high school chemistry set. In his garage.
Is it just me or is the Justice League in the show pretty useless? The YJ team essentially took down the Light by themselves, they stopped the War World invasion while the JL got their asses kicked in the end, the main JL team got arrested by galactic authority for crimes they did five years ago during mind control by the Light (It took them five years to figure out what they did), they didn't show any signs of looking for the original Roy Harper, show no signs of trying to get Zatanna's father out of Dr Fate's control and no one tries to get Superman to not be a dick to Superboy during season 1. Overall, I don't really find myself wanting to root for anyone on the League. Especially when the show chose to kill Wally West, the YJ vet instead of Barry Allen who died in the original comics for decades and really overall, the YJ team has given more up in the line of duty than any one on the League.
"no one tries to get Superman to not be a dick to Superboy during season 1" Uh, Bruce? And people getting mad over how Superman treated Superboy is getting annoying...really, how would you react if a clone of you just appeared out of nowhere, and all your friends and family just expected you to (1) trust him completely (that's just silly—Superman's been in the game a while and has already dealt with Bizarro, so why should he just trust another clone of himself), and (2) take full responsibility for him. It'd be like a woman showing up with a kid and claiming it's yours, here you go, also the kid might be out to kill you.
Really, you're watching a show called "Young Justice," what made you think it was going to focus on the adults? The Team gets a lot more done than the League against the Light because the League is so much more powerful than the Team that the Light doesn't even consider them a threat. The reason the Team was sent to shut down the War World is all the extraordinarily powerful Leaguers are doing things like shooting down several thousand missiles, or tanking an energy beam capable of destroying the planet.
It's worth remembering that while the Team does stuff like prowl around Cadmus, or stake out Bane's factory the League does stuff like stop Wotan from blotting out the SUN. The League does handle major threats on a daily basis, while the Team was most black ops stuff. The Injustice League pretty much beat the team, and only the League showing up ended their threat. As far as the original Roy goes. YJ Legacy mentions they did look for him for awhile but gave up after a year. They had no leads, and all the evidence suggested he was dead. Even the Team had given up, only Red Arrow kept looking. In Invasion, the Team basically is part the League, and the older members more or less are treated as League members, working with Leagers and getting free access to the Watchtower. They mostly did more that season because the League was undermanned while the Team had full efficency. It IS true the Team sacrificed more, as they had 3 deaths over the course of the show, to the League's 1 but that was mostly just conicidental. The League and the Team were both operating in the missions where Aquagirl and Kid Flash died, so it could have happened to any of them. Jason Todd's death is unknown but if it was anything like the comics he died not in the line of duty for the Team/League, but during a Joker caper with Batman.
So what was the point of all the drama with Kaldur growing apart from Garth and Tula thanks to his adventures on the surface to the point that he had to actively choose to either go back or stay with the team, if Garth and Tula later decided to come to the surface and adventure with him anyway? It seemed rather anticlimatic. Why couldn't they have just done that from the start? For that matter what was the point of Garth making the big choice not to have become a hero if he was gonna end doing so later? It seemed like the whole plot point of Kaldur not able to both lead the team and spend time with his Atlantis friends was invalidated by them joining the team.
The point was Kaldur's head wasn't in the game. It wasn't really about going back or staying with the team so much as it was you can't be on the team if your head isn't on straight and that was what Batman called him on. If Robin had been unable to focus because there was a girl in Gotham he wanted to be with Batman would likely have given him the same talking to, except Kaldur was the leader so the problem needed to be dealt with that much sooner.
Except his head wasn't in the game because he missed Tula and regreted his decision to stay on the surface. A decision that was rendered pointless a year later when Tula started living on the surface too. If that was a possibility why didn't they just do that from the start and save all the drama? Robin wouldn't have had the same problem because...well he COULD be with said girl in Gotham during his downtime. Heck by the time he's Nightwing he's established to have been a major player, with like 3 exes, so its not like there's some "you can be on the team or have a love interest, but not both" rule. They've even had dating within the team itself. In fact the majority of the team members have been in a relationship with another member at some point (Wallyx Artemis, M'gannxConner and M'gannxLagann, Garthx Tula, Dickx Zatanna and Cassiex Tim).
Are there comic book villains in the series that are not pawns/lackeys of a secret organization? The David Xanatos schemes and twists they pull on the show can get annoying sometimes. They do it way too much. Every time I see a comic book villain, he is a pawn of another baddie(or organization).
There are a few yes. Harm for example was probably the only villain not associated in anyway whatsoever with the Light. Also Brick, who although jailed with other Light lackey's doesn't seem to be on their payroll. Despero, who just showed up to fight strong guys on Earth (although he wasn't planned at all by the Light he ended up helping them inadvertently, but this was just a lucky break for them and not "all part of the plan") There are also a few Light pawns that have their own plans like T.O Morrow and the Reds that almost take the Earth for themselves. But yes it seems like 90 percent of the villains are all allied with each other. Granted it's probably a necessity to take on the League and it goes both ways, as nearly all the heroes in the show work in some fashion for the Justice League. But yes there's lots of David Xanatos style "I win regardless of what everybody else does" schemes here. That just seems to be how Weisman (who also created Gargoyles) writes.
Wait, why are boys harder for Miss Martian than girls. If her natural form was a lot like a female human, like Martian Manhunter is physically a lot like a human male, it would be one thing, but when we see her natural form, it's no closer to male than female. The rest of the gang doesn't know a thing about shapeshifting, they wouldn't know if changing gender would be too far advanced for someone M'gann's age.
I'm assuming that it's just that she hasn't practiced humanoid male forms as much as female, considering that she was seemingly quite used to her "Megan" form already by the time she arrived on Earth, and note that male forms are "harder" not "impossible". In any event, she's seemingly overcome this difficulty by the time skip.
It still makes no sense. Aside from minor variations in body shape, there are only two main areas where, superficially speaking, human males and human females differ. Since MM's entire knowledge of humanity seems to come from shows like "Hello, Megan", she's not going to have any knowledge about what goes on downstairs and might as well leave that area blank unless she were planning on showing it off to an admiring public. So flat chest vs breasts. Well, Martians don't have breasts, so it'd take more work to grow them than to leave them off.
Given that she shapeshifts into Red Tornado later in the same episode flawlessly, it could be more to solidify the idea that what form she chose is her real form. She doesn't want the team to find out what her innate form is, so a white lie helps solidify the idea in their heads.
Martian Manhunter is no closer physically to a human male than Miss Martian is and both are equal distance from a human female. The form he uses normally, like Miss Martian's green form, is a form that he chooses and is apparently semi-permanent. Permanent enough that even when he's knocked out he maintains it instead of shifting to his true form at any rate.
If Tula and Aqualad were so much in love, then why didn't they text, email, or use some form of communication? This is the 2000s. I know they have technology in the underwater city. I'm sure Aquaman talks to Batman through a communicator, so why not use it to talk to Tula? Even guys in the army call their love ones every now and then. And you wonder why she ends up with his best friend.
The most probable explanation is that Atlantaean teenagers aren't hormone addled monsters who spend every waking moment thinking about the opposite sex and how to make the beast with two backs therewith. And/or Atlantaean courtships are much different than human ones.
Is there any evidence that they don't communicate and somewhat frequently. As someone who's both joined the military (with a SO) and had one go off to college, long distance relationships are a bitch under the best of circumstances and it's not entirely uncommon to kinda keep the person who's away on a sorta need to know basis. Tula went a bit too far since they were clearly actually dating not "kinda hanging out a lot" but I can easily see why Tula may not have mentioned she was dating to a man she cared for deeply but was away risking his life in covert ops.
I just found out Megan got her name and human look from an old TV sitcom. Here's the problem...wouldn't that draw a lot of attention? A girl disguised as a fictional character/actress is walking around the town and no one takes notice? That's like taking the form of Angelina Jolie and going into a grocery store. You would think some civilians would be weirded out.
This is explicitly discussed; the TV series in question was very obscure, and most people wouldn't have recognized the character (or the actress, who wasn't a celebrity and went on to run a wildlife refuge). Apparently, nobody else on the team had even heard of the show before Gar showed them the clips, at which point they were fairly wierded out about what M'Gann was doing (especially Connor).