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Headscratchers: Pokémon Black 2 and White 2
  • What's wrong with her hair??
  • Will we see anything from Cheren or Bianca? Hilda and Hilbert as Previous Player Character Cameos are almost a given, but they're not the only ones with fans.
    • Almost assuredly. We already know 3 gyms are toast and there are only 2 new Gym Leaders as of what we know. Speculation is running rampant that Cheren might be running the third gym.
      • The latest Coro scans confirm that both of them, along with N, will be returning.
      • Cheren is the first Gym Leader, replacing Lenora. Bianca will give you your first Pokémon.
  • Gameplay wise Pokémon such as Azurill or Absol being now "native" to Unova seems a good tactic... but in-universe wise... HOW DID THEY GET THERE? And nope, rather not imported since Azurill was seen in something that looks more like Route.
    • Yes, imported. There was that transporter accident that started releasing foreign Pokemon in small numbers in the postgame, particularly in the postgame parts of the map, in Black and White. Like most invasive species, they evidently bred in large numbers due to lack of predators/parasites.
    • Also some Pokemon like Eevee and Riolu have never been "native" anywhere, only appearing under wild under very limited conditions and usually being received as gifts, suggesting they could actually be native to Unova in the first place.
  • All the characters from pre-G5 games don't appear to have aged at all for the tournament. Non-canon?
    • They were probably just using the old artwork for another reason.
    • They might also have simply used the old art to keep from spoiling new art before the release; Kingdom Hearts 3D: Dream Drop Distance used old models for Sora and Riku in their early trailers, for instance. Cynthia's already getting new art for the anime, so she might as well receive the same in the games themselves. As always, we just need to wait and see.
    • Considering the large amount of new art for the game, it was probably just a cost and time cutting measure. That said, Red recieves a brand new overworld sprite despite everyone else using their Gen IV ones. It shows too because Red is about a head taller (which makes sense since these games have to be at least 5 years after HGSS). The Gen III RSE characters get a complete revamp with brand new battle and overworld sprites, though they were not redesigned like the Gen I & II characters were. It seems less like a They Just Didn't Care and more of a "Let's focus on the stuff that's more vital to the game" such as all the new art assets seen everywhere else. There's alot of high quality art done by sugimori through out the game. Deadlines are a bitch. That's all.
      • Actually, Gen IV people got new OD sprites. From Kanto, through Johto and Sinnoh... The change might not be that noticable, but there is. Oh, and Red is at least 16 by that time (11 + 3 + x + 2 = B2W2)
  • Can someone explain to me how Giovanni is back for the tournament? Last time we saw him, he threw himself off of a waterfall.
    • It wasn't a particularly large waterfall, and he probably knows how to swim. As for why he's back, it's because he used to be the Viridian City Gym Leader, and the tournament appears to be open to all previous leaders and champions.
    • Also, back in Gold and Silver, the option to trade between those games and the first generation was called the Time Capsule. Thus, time travel has been accessible to humans in a rudimentary form since Generation 2, and likely has only been improved since then. In this way, an enterprising division of the Pokemon League would be able to access Giovanni for battle before he went blue-screen.
    • Either that, or he never jumped off that waterfall to begin with, and that noise after he left really was just the radio.
      • Exactly, we didn't follow him outside of the small cave into the larger one and watch him jump, nor can we be certain he can't swim, which as a grown man he probably can. Seriously people, stop mixing together fanon and canon.
      • This troper has always presumed that noise was really just radio static as well, and was absolutely baffled to see everyone claiming Giovanni was Driven to Suicide. Him showing up for the tournament makes perfect sense to me, but of course YMMV.
      • I think the bigger question is how did he get into the tournament if it is well-known that he's a mafia boss.
      • Maybe he's retired from being a Rocket leader, and wants no more of helping them.
      • That's canon. After his defeat during the interim between R/G/B/Y and G/S/C, he said he's done with crime.
  • So any reason for why Bianca participates in the Leaders tournaments, despite not being a Gym Leader herself?
    • Maybe she got some kind of special permission from Cheren. As for an out-of-universe explanation, they probably just thought that would be the simplest way to throw in a battle with her.
  • Why are the games called "Black 2 and White 2"? Shouldn't it be "Black and White 2"?
    • There are two versions, therefore, each gets its own name.
      • This troperette calls them "BW2" to save time. Plus, B2W2 doesn't sound as cool to her.
      • It does to me.
  • Who leads The White Plasmas since Team Plasma is split to two faction and we only know that Ghetsis leads the blacks but who leads the whites?
    • Well, no one necessarily *has* to lead the White Plasmas. They might all just be ex-members who make individualized efforts to atone/improve the relationship between people and Pokemon. It is likely, however, that if the Sages still have some presence among them, that they would be the "leaders"; we can pretty much rule out N as the leader though, because he has been absent this whole time and only returned because his dragon alerted him to Kyurem's suffering, and because Sage Rood (who looks to have brought together at least some of the old "White" Plasma members, including Anthea and Concordia) tells the player that nobody has seen N since the castle incident.
    • Ghetsis leads the Neo Plasmas, but mentions that he made Colress the leader of Plasma's scientific plans. Zinzolin is The Dragon to both. For the Old Plasmas, N is the official leader, but since he is gone Rood is doing most of the coordinating.
  • Why Koga didn't appear, yet Giovanni did? (inb4 Elite Four comments)
    • Because, like you said, he's an Elite Four member now, and Elite Four members do not appear. Giovanni, however, is not an Elite Four member, so his capacity to show up is measured under different standards than that of Koga's. If you wanted a different answer, then I'm afraid I'm going to have to let you know that there isn't one. This is why he didn't show up, and you can't just rule out the actual reason in hoping that reality will bend itself around to give you a different one.
      • It's still kind of weird though, especially when you take into account that Koga was not yet an Elite Four member back when Giovanni was a gym leader. So it would've made more sense for the games to include either Giovanni and Koga, or Blue and Janine, depending on where BW2 are in the timeline compared to RBY.
  • Alder's grandson. Granted, his past left a lot of room for expansion but you'd think the first game might've given us some indication that he was married and old enough to have grown kids of his own. (Then again, the Giovanni-Silver connection wasn't even a thing until after both characters had existed for several years...)
    • Well, Alder is pretty clearly the oldest Champion we've had, so I guess it's fairly believable that he at least could have kids of his own... Though I do agree that it seems kind of forced to pull a relative out of nowhere; Giovanni and Silver were at least established characters already.
      • Yeah, pretty much this. If Banjirou was his son I could buy that. ...there's no chance of this 'grandson' thing being a mistranslation from the fans, is it?
      • Nope, Benga walks run up to Alder and calls him gramps.
  • Why Dunspare is suddenly so common? Johto had only Dark Cave, Sevii had Three Isle Port, Orre has Shadow Dunsparce in Colo, Sinnoh had swarm on Route 208, Old Unova has Route 12, but New Unova has: Routes 1, 2, 6, 12, 18 and 20; plus Sangi Ranch, Dreamyard, Village Bridge and the (new) Victory Road. HOW IT SUDDENLY GOT SO COMMON?
    • A Day in the Limelight. Also, it's a decently strong Normal type and probably a designer was simply a fan of the Pokemon. It was never based around being a super rare Pokemon though, not since the GSC era.
    • It's actually found in the same way Audino is. That is, in shaking grass.
    • Perhaps Unova's predators aren't as interested in Dunsparce as those of the other regions, so it's had time to flourish in the time between BW and BW 2.

  • Did Ghetsis Get away from the police again? This troper is asking because people are declaring that the Shadow Triad being the Striation Trio theory was jossed, but if they the Shadow Triad got away with Ghetsis, then that means the theory still stands.
    • The theory is Jossed for another reason. Cilan, Chili, and Cress run a hugely successful restaurant every day. To have them be carrying on a criminal career at the same time would require them being in two places at once. Besides, they physically don't resemble the Trio at all (not only their skin color, but eye color, hair color, body structure, etc), and they use completely different Pokemon. Game Freak hasn't made any Gym Leader a villain since Gen 1. If they were the Trio, it would be immediately evident. However, Ghetsis apparently did escape, but this time is completely disgraced and even the Shadow Triad no longer follows him.
      • It's worse than "completely disgraced": Ghetsis' Villainous Breakdown has made him unable to properly function anymore. He's gone into a complete Villainous BSOD. So it's likely he did get locked up in a padded cell. It was just by the Triad rather than the police.
    • So that's the reason? It makes since but Given that you can't go to the Striation gym because of Kyurem (I assume), I assume that the restaurant would be closed down due to that section being covered in ice and that would give them the opportunity to be a double agent. Plus, if the Shadow Triad no longer follow them and you meet Cilan, Chili and Cress after the events of that game, that could simply mean they discarded their life as a Team Plasma member and focus on just their restaurant. Concerning their Pokémon, Cilan in the anime doesn't even use an entire grass team, so by saying they don't use the same Pokémon would be considered moot given that you can use an entirely different team of Pokemon for your double life so people don't put two and two together. And a lot of people use evidence from the manga concerning the physical resemblance. Game sprites aren't going to give you accurate descriptions of them given how small they are, and going by the Pokémon Special manga (which is not anyway related to the game I know), one could argue that the Striation Trio could put a white wig and grey contacts on so they all look the same. The Striation Trio and Shadow Triad in the manga have shown similar body built when drawn as Chili is muscular and one of the members is also muscular. So overall I would think the theory could not be jossed but at the same can't be confirmed if you put this into retrospect similar to how people had to wait until Heart Gold/Soul Silver for the series to confirm that Silver is Giovanni's son when that started all the way back in the original Generation I remake and the only evidence to back that up was one Rocket member saying his son had red hair which doesn't say much.
      • This troper found something interesting on the WMG page. Apparently Cilan is the one that tells the player that they met the Shadow Triad. However, given how the Shadow Triad are being secretive and the fact that anime Cilan cannot be trusted given Burgundy might be telling the truth about his personality. This means he is either telling the truth or he's lying and being the Unreliable Narrator making the theory still stand.
      • As this troper understands it Eastern Unova wasn't literally frozen during the climax, only the very Northeast areas. The map showing ice everywhere was used like clouds in previous games to avoid showing spoilers about the map before the game's release. They need never have shut down their restaurant at all. And doubting the scene just because "Cilan might be lying" is fuel enough to keep any WMG afloat in the face of any evidence.
    • The theory is jossed because during their Memory Link scene, the Striation Trio and the Shadow Triad are shown in the same room, together. The player is not present, so there is no reason for the scene to be a trick or a lie. Special's continuity may turn out differently, but as far as the games are concerned, they are not the same.
      • Special's continuity is very familiar with making Gym Leaders villains, such as Pryce and half of the Kanto Gym Leaders. That still doesn't mean the theory isn't Jossed for the games without getting into Epileptic Tree territory. Besides, what was the basis for the theory in the first place? Oh here are two pairs of triplets in one game they must be the same!!!.
      • It's more so the fact that during the Big Damn Heroes moment at N's Castle in Black and White, all the Gym Leaders were there except the Striaton Trio. Conveniently, the Shadow Triad were there to lead you to N.
      • And there's a much simpler explanation for that one: There are 7 sages but 10 Gym Leaders. They couldn't think of what to do with the Striaton Trio so they simply couldn't make it in time. Not all that unbelievable either, given Striaton City is literally an entire region away.
      • That's still hard to believe given that Nacrene City and Striation City are right next to each other that Bianca wouldn't be able to make it on time yet Lenora was able to make it.
    • Theory is now definitively Jossed beyond a shadow of doubt: The Shadow Triad remains battleable every day in the Post-game outside Icirrus City, while the Striaton Triplets remain battleable every day in their former Gym. They can't really be in two places at once every single day!
      • It may be jossed but you can't deny that the Shadow Triad are ninjas that can jump from one place to another as they are shown doing in the previous game. After all, it's very ninja like to appear in two locations at once.
      • On top of that, the Shadow Triad can only be battled once a month / season in Icirrus City.
      • Still, you can literally run out of the former Gym, fly to Icirrus, and battle them in under a minute after seeing the Striaton Triplets, and provided you don't actually battle them, they'll still be there for the entire month. Pretty conclusive. Jumping across half a region (none of them have a Pokemon that can use Fly) and putting on disguises in the middle of their main job to hold up the charade they shouldn't care about anymore as they don't follow Ghetis stretches disbelief too much.
      • That's one way to disprove the theory, but really, would the protagonist in the game actually try to fight the Striation Trio one battle and then go straight to the Shadow Triad the next? The Shadow Triad don't need fly. They're ninjas and ninja's usually "teleport" from one location to another at fast speed like the first game in Icirrus City where they disappeared after speaking to the player and Brycen (and they didn't have a Pokemon with fly then). Also, they may not serve Ghetsis anymore, but that doesn't mean they wouldn't get in trouble by authority for allowing Ghetsis to escape custody during the original Black/White game and given they helped him achieve the events of this game means that if they were ever found out, they would still be screwed over.
      • Again, there will always be Epileptic Trees that can be "What if Cilan is lying" etc, but they don't make any logical sense: Ninjas aren't really associated with teleportation (only a few individuals from Naruto are the only examples I can think of, and those guys are pretty much Ninjas in name only) except short range, which is more like running quickly, and the authorities clearly don't care about Colress, so they probably don't have anything to fear either. Besides, to avoid getting found out it would make more logical sense to simply stop being the evil ninjas.
    • Theory is thoroughly jossed. This really shouldn't have gone as long as it has. Using anime Cilan and the Special Shadow Triad as evidence is a big stretch as all tropers here must know these are separate continuities which should no be used to predict the events and details of the others. The Memory Link and their positions in the postgame exist to quash this theory since really there was no need to go to these lengths (specifically the Memory Link) to show what has happened to these characters in the past two years and in recent times. And the whole "flying and teleporting ninjas argument" was ridiculous. Seriously, people just have to learn to let go of their fanon.
  • When I was battling rival at Pokémon World Tournament, something was not okay with his Servine. It knew Leaf Blade at Lv. 25, while the earliest possible is Lv. 28 as a Snivy. But, seeing next, a Fridge Logic hit me. In next tag battle against Team Plasma, which was just moments later from his one, his Servine was at Lv. 33, Tranquill and Simisear at Lv. 31. Notice how his team was all 25s in Pokémon World Tournament, and how everyone else who you battled (Cheren and Colress) also had their Pokémon at Lv. 25 (Cheren's Pokémon also got a power-up in next (tag) battle against Team Plasma. At Lv. 33, it is legal to have it a Leaf Blade, it learns it at Lv. 31 (28 as Snivy). His Servine's level was just changed to 25, like Battle Subway changes it to eg. 50... but that brings us to another point. Why player's team wasn't affected by that?
    • This was probably done to prevent the PWT area from becoming an unintentional Beef Gate. Many players may not be skilled enough to handle the battles purely on the basis of moveset and skills, and deleveling the player might cause the area to be more difficult.
  • How they are going to get the fact that Ghetsis tried to IMPALE the player character with Kyurem's icicles? That's the part of plot, so it can't be cut. This is the first time someone tries to murder player character. No villain (probably except Orre, this person doesn't have great knowledge about Orre games) went there before. Not Giovanni, who also wanted to conquer the world (or maybe save it from Mewtwo), not Archie and Maxie, who wanted to increase the sea or land mass, respectively. Not even Cyrus, who wanted to create a new universe from a scratch, not even him went that far. Ghetsis doesn't even try to fight you with Kyurem, he tries to kill you outright with its help.
    • They did much worse in Pokemon Mystery Dungeon Explorers of Time/Darkness/Sky. Outright murder is nothing compared to Darkrai disguised as Cresselia trying to convince the player to commit suicide.
    • Not to mention in the first Mystery Dungeon games, there was Gengar attempting to con the townspeople into thinking that you were the cause of the natural disasters that would lead to the world's destruction.
    • I can vouch for the fact that nothing of the sort happened in Orre. I think. It's been a while.
      • A Grunt used Sleep Powder directly on the player in XD, and if I remember correctly, the Big Bad of XD also made physical threats against the player at the end of the game after his defeat, but nobody else has ever directly attempted murder. (although it's indicated that several sailors DID die when Cipher had XD 001/Shadow Lugia pick the SS Libra up out of the water. However, they weren't specifically trying to kill anyone, it was just collateral damage.) Moreover, they don't need to worry. While the Pokemon franchise has never gone there, the E label has tons of games with violence on that level in it. ESRB ratings do have a little bit of wiggle room on them: for instance, a quick scan of some games I own confirm the loaded with Parental Bonus humor, Bowsers Inside Story, is only an E, while even games with a lot of focus on conflict and death, like Golden Sun: Dark Dawn and Star Fox 3DS have gotten E10s. Even the extremely bleak Advance Wars: Days Of Ruin only got an E10. One scene probably won't be enough to raise the rating from an E, especially in light of the Mystery Dungeon series, as well as the player being able to die in timed missions in two of the Ranger games.
      • It's heavily implied that the Shadow Pokemon were created to attack everything, Pokemon or human. Also, in XD, it's one of the Dragons that threatens to blow up the island with you on it after Greevil's defeat.
      • Mystery Dungeon is totally different, so I do not count for that. I was going to include that in the original point, but I didn't.
    • Oh yeah, the Black 2/White 2 trailer came out in English and it says rated E for everyone.
      • Well, that way... they're probably change the stuff so Ghetsis won't want to kill you, only to disarm you or something. I dunno, any ideas what would they do?
      • Should it even really matter? Wouldn't N's Big Damn Heroes moment relieve any fear? Either way, it's a mere... few seconds? Just a few seconds of the thought of the possibility that the protagonist getting murdered. It's just a few seconds, and it's not even that graphic. It's a possibility, but hardly graphic. It looked like a regular Ice attack you see in battle, just aimed at the player.
      • Even the most stringent Moral Guardians would probably not throw a fit at this. Never Say "Die" might be in effect but yeah, it is only a few seconds. Not necessarily going to be subject to censorship.
      • Agreed with the former troper. What Do You Mean, It's for Kids? might have something to do, as everything in Pokemon looks so cuddly and cute that Moral Guardians wouldn't care about giant icicles floating around a cute, big-headed boy/girl about to kill him/her. They'll just say "it's just Pokemon", and remember all those horrors previously mentioned and yet we never hear complains about them.
    • Turns out they have Ghetesis try to freeze the player alive, which allows the younger players see it as a status affect and the older ones to see it as a And I Must Scream situation
    • The issue has become moot. The line where Ghetsis states he will kill the player character was a mistranslation by a fan. The line reads that Ghetsis commands Kyurem to freeze the player which with its wording in the Japanese version can be misinterpreted to read that he wished it to impale the player character. The animation of the act can also lead to confusion since it looks like the ice is about to fall onto the player character.
      • The original wording had Ghetsis say he would leave the protagonist "frozen here." I think that still gives off the sense of a murderous intent, as opposed to "I will freeze you solid!"
  • How come we only get to fight two sages? Where the hell are they, anyway? If Rood and Zinzolin are out of jail after two years, shouldn't the other sages be to (Zinzolin might have broken out, but Rood's new characterization would suggest that he probably wouldn't do that)?
    • Rood may have gotten out on parole for being extremely cooperative, as he seems to be. Zinzolin probably broke out. The rest might still be in jail, moved on to other regions or professions, or dead. The Sages did look pretty old in the original after all.
    • Also, although he doesn't battle you, Gorm at least shows up later.
    • Furthermore, you seem to have forgotten that Ghetsis was one of the Sages, so technically, you battle 3 of them.
  • In Challenge Mode, Hue has a Level 45 Starter when you encounter him in Undella Town. One route over in Lacunosa Town, when he teams up with you against Sage Zinzolin, his Starter is now Level 43. Uh... what gives?
    • Oversight? Most people probably won't have access to Challenge Mode until the post-game anyways.
      • Okay, I can see that it could be an oversight, although I don't understand what you mean by the second part.
      • See the Headscratcher directly below. Challenge Mode isn't unlocked until you defeat the Champion.
      • You can get Challenge or Easy Mode by getting the Key from a person who already has it.
    • The higher levels thing technically only applies to trainers you fight, not ones you team up with. Also, whether or not it was intended, having Hugh at a higher level when he helps you in Lacunosa Town would be making it easier, not harder, so... it sort of makes sense?

  • Why is there a doctor on the Plasma Frigate? Why would they want to help heal a teenager who's clearly trying to take down the organization you work for? Granted, I can't read Japanese, so I don't know what the doctor says about this when you challenge them.
    • The rest of the people on the Frigate later made a Heel-Face Turn, so.... Also it's virtually impossible to comment on the plot if you don't even understand the language! The doctor could have been kidnapped, or forced to work there, or any of a number of reasons.
      • That is true... I am still curious though, if anyone could clarify for me, and can read Japanese and is at that point, what does the doctor say?
      • I've read it. According to the script, the doctor sides with Team Plasma because he thinks once they conquer the world there will be less injured/wounded Pokémon around (and that there will be no more conflict/strife as a result). Once he's defeated though, he says he doesn't care if an injured Pokémon belongs to a foe or an ally, which explains why he heals you after battle. So he's definitely working for Team Plasma, it's just that he cares enough about hurt Pokémon to help even someone who is actively working to take down the organization.
      • The translated version of his dialogue is pretty much this exact thing, too.
    • Or maybe he's been following in your footsteps knowing you've been on Team Plasma's trail and wants to help you take them out.
    • Or maybe, you know, being a doctor, he is sworn to heal anyone in need (if he has the capabilities). Hippocratic Oath, or whatever they have in Unova.
  • Why are there no restrictions in the Unova Leaders tournament (I was able to curbstomp my way through using Black Kyurem, and I'd presume that all other legendary are free to roam), but the moment I tried to enter Black Kyurem in any of the other tournaments, it gave the usual "No Eggs, mascot Legendaries, event Legendaries, etcetera." message. Is Unova just exempt from that?
  • So, it read on the YMMV page that N is in fact not Ghetsis' real son, nor was N a normal person taken from his parents' custody or anything like that. It also says on Bulbapedia that he's Ghetsis' foster son, but I don't really know what that means. And that Anthea and Concordia are his foster daughters. I won't ask where N might have came from, but at what point in the game is this proven? I don't know since I can't read Japanese.
    • A foster child is essentially just an adopted child, meaning that they are unrelated by blood to their current guardian/"parent". I believe it is revealed during one of the Memory Link scenes.
      • As far as I know, it's actually revealed by Anthea and Concordia themselves, in the Driftveil City, the same building where you get the Zorua.
    • During post-game, N also reveals where he came from and how he met Ghetsis at his castle.
    • Ghetsis himself also said, in a completely hypocritical moment chewing N out for selfishness, "But I still haven't forgotten that even though I was kind enough to find you when you were living in the forest with Pokémon, and take you in, and care for you, in the end you were selfish and disrupted my plans. I was supposed to use your abilities to rule Unova!" So the story is that Ghetsis found N when he was at least a toddler, living in a forest with Pokemon, and adopted him as his son that he'd use for his master plan. But given the resemblance between N and Ghetsis, it's possible that N does at least come from the same bloodline as Ghetsis. One could theorize that maybe N is Ghetsis' bastard son. If that were true, then Ghetsis really should have called him A BASTARD FROM A BASKET!!! during his Villainous Breakdown.
  • If Marshal is just standing at the entrance of Twist Mountain, keeping you from going there until you beat the Elite Four and the Champion, then how is it realistically possible for him to also be at the Elite Four at the same time? Granted, it's a video game, but it's still kind of weird.
    • That guy was Marshal? Oh man. Well, it's also similar to a case with Bill in FRLG, where it is possible for him to be at both Cinnabar Island and his cottage at one point of the game.
    • He just uses one of his Pokémon to instantly fly wherever he needs to be. After all you can do the exact same thing.
  • In first games you get the creation trio orbs from Shadow Triad. In these games, they're at Dragonspiral Tower. They aren't "there is only of that thing", something happened or perhaps it was made uncanon (like Kyurem's capture because how else Ghetsis could almost-murder you) if Hilda/Hilbert gets it?
    • It's probably just treated as non-canon now.
      • Or perhaps Hilbert/Hilda left the orbs there.
    • There probably are more than one of them, since HGSS features Arceus making an extra legendary dragon for you. It's not too much of a stretch to assume that it could make more of the orbs, too. Though it's still very convenient that another set of them happened to show up in Unova...
  • How come the movie logos at Pokéstar Studios still keep the language from Japan?
    • I'm more worried about how one series is called Brycen-man, yet the logo clearly deciphers as HACHIKU-man. Gratuitous Foreign Language is one thing, but Inconsistent Dub...
      • One person at the Studios said that directors came from other regions, hence the logos being in different languages. Pay attention to their accents.
  • So it turns out that Ghetsis' "murder" scene is indeed censored, and he indeed decides to freeze the protagonist instead of killing them. But not only that, he also says "so you can watch my glorious ascent". It's almost as if someone's making an ostentatious POINT that he isn't killing you (just saying "I'll freeze you solid right here and let you be" would have been way better IMO). Someone at TPCi really hates the PeripheryDemographic, considering that they can get away with stuff like "kill" and "die" in stuff like friggin' MADAGASCAR. Why would they not only censor the scene (as expected) but play Never Say "Die" as straight as possible, to the extent that they drive it into your head that Ghetsis is absolutely not murdering you?
    • 1) How do you even know that they actually censored it? Is anyone here who speaks Japanese able to confirm that the original version really does say "kill"? 2) Ghetsis was a psychopath. By saying that you can "watch his ascent" while frozen, he's probably just gloating over the fact that you'll be frozen and dead and unable to stop him. 3) As the other comment on the video points out, you should be able to assume that it's lethal anyway. I mean, it's not like getting impaled by giant icicles from every direction is an easy thing to survive.
      • (OP) It's possible that either they were going for the Fridge Horror of being frozen alive (thus allowing them to do the censorship equivalent of a Woolseyism), or they were just implying that you'd be frozen in the same (relatively minor) way that Pokémon are frozen during battle. Maybe a bit of both (so little kids assume you'll be frozen like a Pokémon, while older fans can deal with the Fridge Horror).
    • Yeah, I didn't think censorship - I thought "...they made him worse."
    • According to a Japanese speaking troper on the forums, there was no censorship in the first place. Ghetsis always said that he was going to freeze you. The fandom was just making assumptions based on what they saw, and didn't couldn't take the dialogue into account.
      • Technically, he originally said "you will BE frozen", not "I will freeze you!". It's pretty clear the attack was meant to freeze the PC to death.
    • That begs the question of how he plans to freeze you with sharp icicle spears...
      • Maybe he intended to freeze them... dead in their tracks.
      • Maybe the icicles just REPRESENTED the icy weather.
      • Ghetsis ordered Kyurem to use its signature move, Glaciate. Watch the in-battle animation for Glaciate: it has the same spinning chunks of ice, but they don't actually impact the target.
      • But they also don't retract and rush toward the target, nor are they shaped like sharp, pointed icicles in the battle animation.
      • Rule of Scary?
      • Is that a Trope?
      • No, but there should be. Or just plain Nightmare Fuel.
      • Well, if we're pointing out how the animation for the attack is different in the overworld, Hyper Beam doesn't have the user run forward and bump into the target. Chalk it up to different people handling the animations between overworld and in-battle.
  • I know that every game follows the "your rival has the starter that yours is weak against" rule, but if Hugh hatched his starter from an Eggnote , then how is it determined after you pick yours?
    • He just happened to have already hatched whatever Pokemon is strong against yours.
      • I always had this theory that the rival named his starter after a pokemon he thought it was going to be, just because he wanted it to be that pokemon.
    Nate: You've always talked about your Tepig, Hugh, but, now that I have my Oshawott, we'll battle and I'll finally see your pokemon!
    Hugh: Go, Tepig! *Sends out a Snivy*
    Nate: ಠ_ಠ
  • So how old is Iris, anyways? She doesn't look like she's aged a day since version one.
    • What picture are you looking at? I think she looks pretty different.
      • The picture of her in the Pimped-Out Dress. She looks really young. (the shortness doesn't help...I mean, I assumed May and Brendan were mid-teens but they're apparently Ten.)
    • She seems to have gone from 10-12 to 12-14. 2 years isn't a huge difference at those ages anyways
      • Wow, youngest champion ever... at least, until the player characters come around. (They actually haven't really given us a concrete figure on how old the trainers are outside of Generation I, have they?)
      • Blue was 11 when he became champ. Iris isn't the youngest champion, but very close to it.
  • The fact that Throh can be found on Victory Road's cliffside (with a pretty reasonable chance of encounter, I should add), even in Black 2, but in White 2, Sawk can still only be found in rustling grass. Not sure why they would do that.
  • How the fuck someone can be frozen by pointy icicles?note I know it's Pokémon and real life logic may not apply, but if it did - then WHAT THE HECK?
    • Well, N does rescue you, so I don't see how this would be a problem.
    • It's entirely possible that Ghetsis was - wait for it - being metaphorical. *gasp*
    • This Troper's personal interpretation is that Kyurem's ice would be used to trap the player in a cage of ice, (if the ice spikes tilted up as they flew in they would form a cone enclosing the player) which is almost worse than impalement. This way the player would be trapped by unmeltable ice in Unova's coldest spot and s/he would freeze not in the Pokemon battle status affect sense but in the die of hypothermia sense.
    • I think when the icicles make impact on a human's body, they not only do damage, but they freeze the body points that they hit from the angles they came. The ice would likely never melt and be hard to break. And then Ghetsis would just leave the trainer there to succumb to frostbite, starvation, and hypothermia. In the original version, his line can be translated to "You will be frozen here and see the end of Unova!" Which could very well mean "your body will be frozen here!" Forever.
  • Why is accessing the Day Care in Black 2/White 2 impossible until you beat the Elite Four?
    • The Daycare is north of Striation City, and you can't access the Skyarrow Bridge (which takes you through to the path that leads to southern Unova) until after you've beaten the Elite Four and Champion. I guess I could to some extent imagine a Daycare being between Floccesy Town and Virbank City, but still.
      • Let me make this more clear: why am I not allowed to do any Pokemon breeding until after I beat the game?
      • Because the Day-Care just happened to be in a location that they chose to cut off. Could have been an oversight, could have been deliberate. We'll never know.
      • Until an official reason is given, I think it's a "Take That" from Game Freak over abusing the Day Care for EXP gaining...even though that's supposed to be that way (especially as far back as Gen I)
      • While it was initially designed to gain EXP, with Lucky Eggs, EXP Shares, Join Avenue dojos, and the new EXP scaling system, using the daycare to farm EXP is pretty inefficient. As to why you can't breed before beating the game, it might be to prevent nature farming or one of the other metagamey uses that would make the game too easy.
      • It's not as if there's no precedent for this either, as the same restriction happened in FireRed and LeafGreen. (Though in that case it was a bit more justified by the fact that they want you to beat the Elite Four using mostly just what was possible to have in Red and Blue.)
  • How does Magnezone in P2 Laboratory came to be? For Magneton to evolve, it needs to be in a special magnetic field, and it's far away in Charge Stone Cave.
    • It is a lab... they could've artificially generated a similar magnetic field.
  • In the downloadable "Legendary World Tournament", Fantina's legendary is Giratina, which is in its Origin forme from Platinum. However, it's holding a Ghost Gem instead of the Griseous Orb, how is it maintaining its alternate forme?
  • So I know there's this one little subquest with that fat guy on Skyarrow Bridge who, if you give him Fresh Water, he dashes to Driftveil Drawbridge, then you can give him Fresh Water there and he'll dash to Tubeline Bridge, and so on, until you meet him at Skyarrow Bridge again and he gives you a dozen Moomoo Milks for free. When I flew to Humilau City to find him in the Marine Tube, I noticed that couple right near the Pokemon Center, who were playing and chasing each other around-the girl there was gone, then I talked to the guy and he gave me a Funfest Mission. And when I was watching Marriland's video on Skyarrow Bridge yesterday, it was the same thing-the girl wasn't there. Does the girl leaving and you getting that mission have any relation to helping the bridge-runner by giving him water?
    • Nope. Right after you beat the Elite Four for the first time, the Lady leaves. The bridge maniac also separately unlocks after you beat the Elite Four.
      • Well, that same day, I remember having saved at Humilau City the previous day before stopping, and still seeing the two chasing each other. Maybe I was just seeing things. I don't know.
  • So okay. At Giant Chasm, if you talk to Ghetsis after Kyurem fuses with N's dragon, but before defeating it, he will say "Come now! I want to see your face at the moment you lose all hope! Battle to protect Unova! I've prepared the finest stage, and it's wasted on a bit player like you! Lose and go down in flames!" in White 2. It's the same in Black 2. Why it's the same? For White 2 it fits, as White Kyurem has power over fire, which flames are. But Black Kyurem? Unless Fusion Flare can be carried over from White Kyurem (which is very unlikely) it can't get any Fire-type move aside from Sunny Day, which isn't even offensive. For comparison, Black 2 has Ghetsis saying "with you, can shatter ice" (N's Zekrom) while White 2 has "with you, can melt ice" (N's Reshiram)
    • Well, it is an often use metaphor for losing/failing badly. Perhaps the writers just used it without considering that it might have unintended connections to the given the Elemental Baggage involved?
  • Just how old is Hugh's sister supposed to be, anyway? Given how she apparently remembers her Purrloin being stolen seven years ago, she was probably around four or five when that happened, which would make her eleven or twelve, maybe ten at the youngest, now. So why does she have one of those "small child" sprites that are about the same size as the Preschooler Trainers? Why not a School Kid or Lass?
    • Maybe as a subtle hint that just like Hilbert and Hilda in the original BW, Nate, Rosa and Hugh are older than most playable trainers from the previous games?
      • Okay, but that still doesn't explain why Hugh's sister's sprite makes her look like she's supposed to be five.
    • If it helps, the actual number of years ago, at least in the American version, is five. Perhaps she's just a young looking 7-8 year old?
  • So anyway, you get the Waterfall HM from N at Victory Road after the Team Plasma plot is wrapped up. By this point, your Pokemon will be in the mid fifties range. However, the Abundant Shrine, which is only accessible after getting Waterfall, has wild Pokemon and trainers with Pokemon in the 35-40 range, the same as the surrounding Route 14. What.
    • Possibly in case you by some chance get traded a Pokemon with Waterfall. However, there is a Black Belt right before it with three Level 52s, which I also question.
  • Couldn't Hugh just capture another Purrloin for his sister? Those things are ridiculously common.
    • That one was special. Not only had Hugh's late grandfather caught it for her, but that was her Purrloin. Giving her a Replacement Goldfish wouldn't magically make things all better. You wouldn't just give someone whose beloved pet had just died/run away/been stolen another one of the same breed and expect them to suddenly stop missing the old one, would you?
      • Basically. This very exact question is lampshaded after you and Hugh beat Zinzolin and the grunt in the Plasma Frigate on Route 21 (the part after deactivating the switches in Black 2 or entering the password in White 2):
    Zinzolin: Why can't you understand? There are other Purrloin. Why are you so fixated on this one?
    Hugh: That's the ONLY Purrloin in the world that my late grandpa caught for my little sister!
    • OP: Oh...well, I hadn't gotten that far quite yet (only on my sixth badge now, the trainers at the Opelucid gym are too tough)...
  • The nostalgiaish guy at Icirrus City is very nice, as it gives Route 10 music (which is no more), but I question one thing - why he is in house that's winter-only? That makes no sense.
    • So everything in the game can't be accomplished without at least playing for a while.
  • Anyone have an explanation for why, in the middle of chasing down Team Plasma, Hugh suddenly stops and refuses to continue until after you defeat Marlon and get your eighth Gym Badge? I could see him not wanting to force you to neglect your own goals for his sake, but why doesn't he go on ahead like he's done so many other times? Besides, the Gym would still be there later, while Team Plasma could have been long gone within an hour.
    • Well, after the whole frozen Opelucid City thing, Cheren says that he knows where Team Plasma is (near Humilau City) and that he and Hugh plan to investigate. So my guess is because Cheren is already on their trail and can keep in touch with you and Hugh for that. True, if you talk to Hugh before defeating Marlon, he doesn't say anything about Cheren, but still.
  • So... why exactly do the Elite Four members have the exact same teams in the initial battles as they did in Black and White? They could've easily swapped some around and given them some Pokemon who were on the new Unova Pokedex, but they didn't.
    • Shauntal did; she replaced her Jellicent with Drifblim.
      • Yes, but Drifblim is vastly inferior to Jellicent. As for the original question, they do all get a New Unova Dex Pokemon in Challenge Mode (except Iris). That might not justify much, but still. Speaking of...
      • I don't get why they switched it, either. Probably for the people who play Easy Mode. I'm pretty sure she gets Jellicent back on Hard Mode, though. Anyways, it's probably for nostalgia value...One year old nostalgia...
      • Shauntal replacing Jellicent makes sense since Marlon already has one, and they probably didn't want to give the same Pokémon to two different major battles.
      • At the same time, Ghetsis has Cofagrigus and Hydreigon (also used by Shauntal and Iris respectively), though they swapped Bouffalant and Bisharp from his previous team (used by Hugh and Grimsley respectively) for Drapion and Toxicroak (the former of which can't be seen at all elsewhere prior to post-game).
      • Not to mention both Alder and N have a Vanilluxe, and both Alder and Ghetsis have a Bouffalant; and in BW 2 Alder trades 4 of his team for something to represent his Elite Four members in the PWT, using Chandelure and Conkeldurr, both of which are signatures. Plus, Grimsley and Clay both have members of the Sandile family in their team. I just think it's dumb to replace an amazing Water/Ghost wall with a simple Drifblim that only has Aftermath as something different than Jellicent.
  • Is it just me, or does Iris' Haxorus in the initial battle ALWAYS use Earthquake and not Dual Chop, unless you have out something that resists it or is weak to Dual Chop or X-Scissor?
    • I think that that thing may be on an A.I. Roulette, like a lot of trainer Pokemon are occasionally. At any rate, Haxorus is still plenty strong enough as it is, and Earthquake is likely to strike more fear into metagamers than the attack that's both stronger by 20 points of STAB and able to bypass Sturdy.
      • Well, my guess at first was the fact that Dual Chop is technically weaker than Earthquake, not counting STAB or both hits, being only 60 power with one hit of it and STAB, but that is a possibility as well.
  • Since Brycen uses a Vullaby when you remake the first Brycenman movie, how does that not count it in the Pokedex? Same goes for all other Pokemon that costars use in Pokestar movies. In the original Black and White, you couldn't see Rufflet or Vullaby without trading, or Mandibuzz in White (but Cynthia had a Braviary for Black owners). At least you can see both Braviary and Mandibuzz from the two Veterans in Victory Road, but what i'm trying to get to is that I don't get why the Pokemon your costars use aren't added to your Pokedex afterwards.
    • The same reason it doesn't work in battle facilities?
    • I'm pretty sure that Game Freak bans the Pokedex from recording stuff in any battles where you can't use items because then it'd be too simple to abuse the Global Trade Center until you have all 649 Pokemon recorded. After all, the games are supposed to encourage people to find a way to trade from other games, whether it's through making friends, or spending 300 bones on a new DS and more Pokemon games.

  • What's up with Giovanni's characterization in the PWT? In RBYFRLG, he seemed to treat the protagonist as a Worthy Opponent. Here? He's so openly hostile, he may as well be a Card-Carrying Villain. I'm guessing, if the HGSS Celebi event is canon, that his mental state must not be in the best of shape after having all of his plans foiled by young trainers, but it's almost like he's a completely different character, spewing out lines that make him sound like a whiney child when he loses.
    • In all honesty, you should probably not consider anything that happens in the PWT as canon or sensible. I mean, FTLOG, Blue is representative of Champion instead of being Gym Leader in Giovanni's place, and there's no Koga to be found anywhere. Plus, there's freaking RED running around, too.
      • Why shouldn't it be canon? It could just be that, in the time between HGSS and BW 2, Giovanni changed his mind and returned to his Gym, thus restoring Blue's Champion status. Koga doesn't appear simply because he's part of the Kanto Elite Four and no trainer from the Elite Four battles in the PWT. As for Red, well, he's there because he's the freaking Champion of Kanto along with Blue. If that sounds weird remember that Hoenn, too, has two Champions, Wallace and Steven.
      • Interestingly, if you lose to Giovanni in PWT, he's rather respectful. He'll compliment the intense battle he just had and will state that he wishes to meet the player again.
      • To add on to that, if you beat him then win said PWT, and talk to him in the lobby, all he really says is that "you'll lose someday", not to anyone in particular, but that it'll happen. And let's face it, that might not happen outside of the battle facilities, but in them, it's bound to.
  • Does the Red Card activate even against non-contact moves? Because I watched Marriland's video of Areas 8-10 of the White Treehollow, and against the Thundurus that the boss in Area 8 had, his Camerupt used Stone Edge (which is definitely not a contact move) and it triggered the Thundurus' Red Card. So is its in-game description incorrect?
    • It activates on any attack move, not just contact.
      • Well, I read on Bulbapedia and Serebii, both of which say that it activates on contact, but nothing on non-contact moves, so I thought only those were included.
      • Maybe it's a screw-up with BW 2's code. I mean, Cursed Body works on all attack moves randomly, even though it's only supposed to be on Direct Attacks with a 100% success rate like Rough Skin, unless another move is disabled at that time.
  • Where is Hilbert/Hilda? Did Kyurem kill them?
    • Postgame content reveals that they're perfectly fine. They've left Unova to search for N. The rates for long-distance calls on the Xtransceiver must be hideously expensive or something, though, considering how apparently nobody tried to get in touch with them during the game...
      • Or better yet, N doesn't know their Xtranciever number, and it's not like he could exactly fly in on top of Zekrom/Reshiram into Nuvema Town, walk up to Hilbert/Hilda's mom, and ask for their number. Anyways, I thought it was supposed to be N that left, according to Looker...
      • N did leave. He came back to Unova because Zekrom/Reshiram sensed that Kyurem was in pain, and he wanted to do what he could to help it. It's just that at some point after him leaving in B/W and before he returned, Hilbert/Hilda left Unova to go looking for him.
      • And now, N has left once again in order to go track them down.
      • No he hasn't. He's still in the ruins of his castle, waiting there to do nothing but challenge you to seasonal battles with Dream World Pokemon. The only time he leaves is to go on the Ferris Wheel with you on Fridays.
      • For gameplay purposes, yes; he sticks around. But after you defeat him in a seasonal battle, he says "I will set off on another journey. There are still many Pokémon in the world I should talk to. And there is also a Trainer I want to tell how I feel..."
      • I assume N is doing that because he knows Hilbert/Hilda will be informed sooner or later and return back to Unova. I assume he talked to Looker or the mother of Hilbert/Hilda offscreen or something.
      • How could they possibly be informed? They could be anywhere by now, maybe even in Orre! Oh, wait, Arizona's not as far as everywhere else, so...yeah, I haven't a clue what could be defined as far away.
  • If Yancy/Curtis is in love with Nate/Rosa, then why don't they admit that they're basically this world's equivalent to Hannah Montana?
    • Because, if Hannah Montana exists in the PokeUniverse, then Nancy/Christoph would be afraid of their relationship becoming Jake and Miley all over again. As in, breaking up and getting back together again. Not the cheating and leaving to do a movie and helicopters and having Nan Nancy/Christoph dress up like a goose and have fake armpit hair... Never mind.
      • Pffffft...But in all seriousness, Nate/Rosa can potentially become famous themselves. Maybe they could've made an expansive sideplot with them through unlocking a movie series after a certain rank along with getting call #51 from Yancy/Curtis and trading at least once, and beating Iris the first time, of course. But then again, that would require a non-mute protagonist. Actually, why shouldn't the next game have a talking protagonist? Or the next spinoff have sequences like Megaman ZX Advent?
    • I figured it was just at first them not wanting the player character's opinion and relationship with them to be influenced by their fame so they purposely avoided it, and once they accidentally answer your call in their work clothes they just assumed you'd figured it out—and since you're still acting normal to them, it doesn't matter to you—and so nothing more needed to be said about it.
      • Although they try to play it off as their "coworker" answering (and they dont do a good job at being convincing), so since thats the last thing that happens, everything else is left to imagination. Since we all realize they're really a popstar/reporter that means technically the player themselves realizes it, so any kind of talk between them about it after that is for fanfics.
  • Nosepass will evolve upon leveling up while in Chargestone Cave. Nosepass now live in Chargestone Cave, How are they not all evolved?
    • Do wild Pokemon even fight enough to level up very often? In any case, blablabla Gameplay and Story Segregation.
    • Same thing happened in Platinum, with Nosepass living in Mt. Coronet. Maybe wild Pokémon have some kind of B-Button-type evolution cancelling that trainers do? You can often find Pokémon over the level they evolve at, so I'm guessing the same thing applies to area-evolutions like Nosepass.
  • Is there some kind of Fridge Brilliance attached to N's OT number being 00002? Or is it completely random? I mean, according to the latest Tajiri interview, the man clearly didn't seem to have thought the meaning of anything his developers put in, so perhaps all of the series' Fridge Brilliance is sheer coincidence. Or maybe Tajiri never played the games his company develops...
    • Just because Tajiri didn't know it doesn't mean it was totally random. That said, I haven't heard anything official about it either, though I like to think that the 00002 symbolizes how N was "second" to Ghetsis in his real plan.
      • Tajiri hasn't been intimately involved in the series in years, mostly serving in a loose advising role and sticking to himself. Masuda is the mastermind behind every game since Gen 3.
  • The final battle against Colress (the one in which he gives you Master Ball)... It's 72/72/72/72/72/74 on Normal Mode, and 76/76/76/76/76/78 on CM... only that in CM rematches, all Pokémon delevel up, having team of 75/75/75/75/75/77. ColressOKAY.png
  • The last Giant Woman movie. I know that if you're playing as a girl, Monica is your sister, but those playing as a boy (like me) have her as your girlfriend instead. Here's the good ending for that movie if you're playing as a boy: Monica remains big, but slowly returns to her normal size. Very slowly. So you live with her at this size. And you and her aren't equal footing again until you're both old. And if you're playing as a girl: Monica returns to normal size and you and her are happily reunited. Am I the only one who was seriously bothered by that? If the girl has The Power of Love return Monica to her normal size, then why is that not the same for the boy? It might just be me, but I found that quite Squick-worthy.
    • Well, the boy and the woman have a different relationship then the girl and the woman. Clearly, the boy could have left her and find another girlfriend. There are always more fish in the sea. But the boy stuck by her side, even when she was freakishly huge. Because he loved her more then any other woman. So it's more romantic. The other story is less so a romance and more so a friendship tale or something. That, or maybe the story writers for the movies just had a giantess fetish.
  • Do the Pokemon you can get in the Dream Radar have an equal chance of being male or female like most others? Because i've gotten an unusually high amount of female Justified Riolu and Super Luck Togepi (especially the former) from it, and both those two have a 7 male/1 female ratio normally.
    • I think they're all female.
    • No, for the most part, it's just random.
    • Why are you even complaining?
  • So when I was in Pinwheel Forest investigating with Cheren, I ran into a patch of shaking grass that had two Audino-one Level 64, and one Level 54. I know the same thing happened with Marriland in the Japanese version, but is that a glitch or something?
    • Wait, what? Pinwheel Forest is a post-game area. Also, which version were you playing, because if it was Black 2, then it's fine, but if it's White 2, then it shouldn't happen.
  • In the original Black/White, N's final team at the Team Plasma castle is made up of the opposite legendary dragon, Zoroark, Archeops, Carracosta, Klinklang and Vanilluxe. Why are these Pokemon not available to find in the wild like the other Pokemon N used?
    • Because he cares for them and could not part with them.
    • Also, most of those (especially the fossils) don't really have a lot of logical places they could show up. Though I suppose arguments could be made for Klinklang in Chargestone Cave and Vanilluxe in Giant Chasm, the others would kinda require some handwaving to show up in the wild somewhere.
  • On looking at it, the fact that the Gym Leaders are holding an International Tournament, and the Elite Four are not. The former are implied to be pillars of their respective communities, among other things. The latter just sit around all day (along with the champions when there's no Evil Team to threaten the world) waiting for some punk kid to beat up on the former. Which group do you think would actually have the time to devote to such (relative) trivialities? Conversely, what's going on with the Regional Leagues during this tournament when all the Gym Leaders from Poke-Japan are in Unova? Who's teaching the HM skills? Is there a Pokethon Olympiad or a Quad-Trainer Tournament on the other side of the ocean?
  • Apparently after you defeat Lance, he says ""But it's an odd feeling. I'm not angry that I lost. In fact, I feel happy. Happy that I witnessed the rise of a great new Champion!". Wait, Lance, what? What Champion? It's not Johto League. Did you had a visit in Corneria, or what?
    • Perhaps he's talking about your becoming the Unova Champion. Or maybe hoping that you'll become the Champion of the Champions Tournament.
  • When Ghetsis orders Kyurem to freeze you, why does your character just stand there and not engage in a battle?
    • A teenager (pre-teen?) going into shock and panic, the attack happening too fast, the PC not wanting to put their Pokemon in harm's way... pick one.
      • Perhaps the first is most logical. The attack took time to charge and sending a Pokemon against the much stronger White/Black Kyurem was an option.
    • Because it's a cutscene.
    • Type charts. My lead the first time I played this section was a Flygon. Sure, the second time I fought it, I led with a Weavile, but if the game really implemented this, there would be Pokemon we'd honestly question using as options. And there would be over 649 models to pick from, if they weren't already made.
  • What N says to you before he leaves always bothered me, because I don’t know if this is just N’s opinion or if it’s Game Freak speaking through N, but how are Poke Balls in anyway “oppressive”? In hindsights, they’re just fancy versions of collars for real-life pets. They don’t brainwash them or make them into victims of Stockholm-Syndrome, nor does it force them to fight against their wills, because the series has already made it clear that Pokemon enjoy fighting as much as people do, regardless if they’re wild or have been caught. There’s even the fact that Pokemon, especially Legendaries who are far more sentient than most Pokemon, actively want you to capture them with a Poke Ball. If anything, Poke Balls are kinda necessary; they serve as an easy-to-carry method for your Pokemon, it can protect them in moments when they’re unable to fend for themselves, they help marked the Pokemon to let other trainers know they’re your partners so that you won’t have to worry about anyone unintentionally stealing them, and info about the Poke Balls shows that they’re designed to make them as comfortable for Pokemon as possible when they’re inside them, and allows them to go into places where they’re can not normally fit in with their normal-sized bodies. Also, they react to events which makes it clear that they know what’s going on outside of their Poke Balls, and it’s even clear that they can come out by themselves if they want to; so again, the point is that they do not suffer from And I Must Scream. Now, whatever possible negative implications you can make with them, I think Poke Balls overall do more good than any possible harm. Now granted, it is possible to have Pokemon be your friends without Poke Balls, but such events only happen under certain circumstances. If N still has a problem with Poke Balls, then why does he still keep his Pokemon inside of them? Again, I don’t know if this is simply N’s opinion, or it’s what Game Freak is trying to say through N, but if it’s the latter, then wouldn’t that mean that N and Team Plasma were right all along, and wouldn’t that mean end of the franchise? Again, I don’t know, so I’m looking for some clarification.
    • I think there's overwhelming support in-universe for "just N's opinion". We've had five generations of apricorns and luxury balls and walking Pokemon in Amity Park and fighting over the Master Ball—it's come to be one of those rules of the universe that requires a willing suspension of disbelief, alongside "Pokemon like fighting" and "battling with them strengthens your friendship". Don't forget that N is still shaking off years and years of abuse and mental conditioning that human contact with Pokemon is bad—he can't even go into his room at the end of the game, it's that painful for him. But Game Freak definitely wants us to think hard about it and come up with ways to explore the idea: if fans hadn't, who would've come up with the Nuzlocke challenge?
      • It's definitely N's opinion on the matter. Him holding that opinion is why he has white knight uniform Team Plasma still up and running: they want to improve human-Pokemon relationships to a point where one day there'll be no need for Pokeballs since Pokemon and humans could naturally trust one another enough. That's something I find so great about the character: they allow him to have an opinion that doesn't agree with the majority of in-universe characters and might not agree with players, but still treat it like a valid view. Having the belief that Poke Balls are oppressive and restrictive towards Pokemon itself was never a bad thing: what was portrayed as wrong was N and Team Plasma's actions of trying to force their way of thinking on to everyone else, which is not how the world should work. The sequel shows the result of Character Development from N and the remaining Plasma members. N says "I still don't like the idea of Pokemon being cooped up in those balls, but I'll let you do it if that's what you prefer", and Team Plasma ditch their extremist ways and are now fighting for Pokemon's rights in a more civilized, negotiable way. After all, acceptance, not rejection, of differing beliefs is what creates a chemical reaction and formula for changing the world.
  • Why is it that people think the AI in this game has gotten better than the original Black and White? If you ask me, it really doesn't feel very good. I've had foes use moves that aren't very effective repeatedly, even when i'm at full health, and on rare occasion they've used moves that don't affect me. For instance, I was just battling a Preschooler in Pinwheel Forest, and his Ferrothorn used Selfdestruct on my Golurk which was six levels lower and probably could have killed me with Power Whip. And this was on Challenge Mode, no less. (Interestingly, though, the Nursery Aide right near him switched out her Chansey against said Golurk.) Maybe it's something i'm not seeing, but the AI doesn't feel improved at all. (To be fair, I didn't find it that great in the original BW either, and in DP they weren't that smart either.) Platinum is the only game i've played where I can say the AI is actually decent.
    • It's a Preschooler. What are the chances it's a battling prodigy? As far as I know, at least in B 2 W 2 Trainer have difficulty value, ranging from 0 (picks everything by random, it could as well kill its ally if it happened to be a Double Battle) to 15. Somewhere there I also found more:
      +1: not choose moves have no effect at the time
      +2: remember moves that the opponent's pokémon used
      +4: if AI's pokémon has a move that can beat the opponent in this turn, choose it
      +8: if AI's pokémon has a status move, choose it on the first turn
      • Admittedly, I guess I can understand why a Preschooler wouldn't be very knowledgable compared to, say, Ace Trainers or Veterans (for what it's worth, I can say that those trainers actually try). But have you found anything like that in previous games (like Platinum or BW)? Also, having played through Platinum again recently, I can say the trainers there aren't as smart as I recall them being. I guess i'm more used to thinking it's the Champions and such that have more advanced AI than normal trainers. However, i've had even important battles like Cynthia and Nishino use moves that don't affect me. I hardly ever see that in any other games, so I don't get how people claim the AI here is better.
  • Any idea why Cheren is a normal type trainer now instead of a dark type trainer? He had the right name (Cheren means black, and black is the Dark type's color) his primary pokemon other than his starter and elemental monkey is Purrloin/Liepard, which takes the same damage from Fire/Water/Grass, and is still weak to fighting like normal is. Other than the fact that Grimsly is still a E4 member I can't think of a reason why Cheren couldn't be the Dark Type Gym Leader. And really that's never stopped them before.
    • Someone theorized on the Fridge page that it's supposed to symbolize him "going back to the basics." Plus, his last "main" Pokémon was the Pidove family, Normal/Flying (and he even has a Pidove on Challenge Mode).
    • He can't use his old Pokemon as a Gym Leader. As a teacher, he needs to set an easy, generic standard for his students to base their skills on; i.e. Normals.
  • I know that on Challenge Mode, the movesets of the trainers are the same as in Normal Mode (except against Gym Leaders and Iris), regardless of if they would learn a new move by level-up, but are the stats as well? Because in Marriland's White 2 Adventure when he battled Iris, his Mienshao was slower than both her Hydreigon and Haxorus, and Ghetsis' Hydreigon as well (which killed him in one hit without a crit). But on Challenge Mode, i've watched a few videos where the Hydreigon gets outsped by things like Leavanny and even Garbodor (which isn't even that fast). So are the stats the same as in the latter?
  • So, in one of the Time Gate Traveler movies in Pokestar Studios, the main character can be captured by a Human Ball and become a willing slave to Queen Ledian. Does this mean that Poke Balls forcibly override Pokemon to be willing slaves?
    • It's just a movie, and it's not even a Pokéball, so there's no reason to believe a Pokéball and a "Human Ball" work the same way.
  • Does Cheren have a personal vendetta against Pansear or something? I grinded for Pansage, Pansear and Panpour in the Pinwheel Forest while I had Cheren, and he was nice enough to take out the Audino for Pansage and Panpour. I think I only got the Pansear because I found two of them at once: he kept killing the Pansear when the Audino/Pansear combination showed up...
  • Was anyone else annoyed we weren't told how these new towns had suddenly appeared out of nowhere? I expected people to mention how Lentimas Town had only been recently established, or how there had been a landslide on Victory Road, but it just wasn't brought up. Or am I just overly picky about backstory?
  • How can the musician on Route 5 refuse to battle you? The player doesn't have a choice but to accept challenges, why on earth does the player just allow this douche to say "no".
    • Well, he's a musician and wants to see you with the Electric Guitar prop, so that might explain.
      • That's the explanation he gives, in a rather snobby and dismissive manner. It's impossible for the player to say "look. My pokemon are either fainted or low on health, so would you kindly allow me to heal up before this battle?" The player is forced to take any challenge no matter the situation, and it's explicitly stated in every game I've played (that is all gen I-V games) that eye contact between trainers -> battle. I'm wondering why the player allows this douche to act in that manner, when the rules are eye contact -> battle.

Pokémon Black and WhiteHeadscratchers/GamesPokémon Colosseum

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