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* If Xehanort was trying to turn Organization members into vessels, why did Saix give Roxas the idea to keep a diary? That's the sort of self affirming and introspective thing that would help grow a heart, making him a poor host. Even if Saix didn't know this, wouldn't Xemnas have put a stop to it?
** Then again, what are the odds that Xemnas knew at all? Nobody micromanages THAT much, and he certaintly didn't spend much time with the rest of the Organization.
** At first, they didn't need Roxas to be a nice, empty host, they needed Roxas to be functional to kill heartless. The diary thing was probably a good way to help get Roxas's brain back online, and make him able to think and put together cause and effect in his mind. If he was blue-screening to hard to learn anything about fighting, he would have been killed pretty quickly, and that's the last thing Xemnas wanted.
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dewicking Cloning Blues, moved to Clone Angst


*** And the [[JustifiedTrope extremely justified]] CloningBlues wouldn't set her apart emotionally from Sora and Kairi?

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*** And the [[JustifiedTrope extremely justified]] CloningBlues CloneAngst wouldn't set her apart emotionally from Sora and Kairi?
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** If you recall, in Kingdom Hearts Final Mix, there was a BonusBoss fight added in Hollow Bastion against an Unknown (Xemnas) that you can trigger on your 2nd visit there. Right before the fight, Xemnas phases through Sora, and a bunch of random sentences flash on the screen, ones that Sora has heard throughout KHI. THAT is where the memories for Xion came from. That fight is shown to be canon as Sora has memories of it later on (I believe that Roxas see's flashes of it during his dreams at the beginning of KHII). This event is also what Xemnas is referencing to Roxas in the first scene in KHII.

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** If you recall, in Kingdom Hearts Final Mix, there was a BonusBoss {{Superboss}} fight added in Hollow Bastion against an Unknown (Xemnas) that you can trigger on your 2nd visit there. Right before the fight, Xemnas phases through Sora, and a bunch of random sentences flash on the screen, ones that Sora has heard throughout KHI. THAT is where the memories for Xion came from. That fight is shown to be canon as Sora has memories of it later on (I believe that Roxas see's flashes of it during his dreams at the beginning of KHII). This event is also what Xemnas is referencing to Roxas in the first scene in KHII.
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Doing an Incredibly Lame Pun cleanup of the Kingdom Hearts franchise.


*** [[spoiler: Well, really he just confirmed that title meant 358 days spent between two people. He left it up to the fans to decide which two.]]

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*** [[spoiler: Well, really really, he just confirmed that title meant 358 days spent between two people. He left it up to the fans to decide which two.]]



*** Really? I always thought that [[IncrediblyLamePun 358 people slashing 2]] would sound kinda nasty

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*** Really? I always thought that [[IncrediblyLamePun [[{{Pun}} 358 people slashing 2]] would sound kinda nasty



** Time, as it pertains to Luxord, seems to be purposefully limited, so the rewinding deal makes a bit of sense. Light I figured is a take on blinding you to your environment, a la Zexion in [=CoM=]. Moon refers to lunacy or insanity, i.e. babbling like a loon, which would cause unintelligibility, which would mess with spoken spells, which matches the RPG status effect of 'silence'. Space refers to space-time, which refers to gravity. The deal with water and draining is that water is commonly associated with healing, and the fact that it also damages enemies is a gameplay element.
*** Well, the moon has no atmosphere; no air, so no sound. Alternatively, I can at least say that there's a precedent for linking the moon with silence. "[[Franchise/TouhouProject Silent Selene]]", specifically.
*** Its probably a call back to the berserk status restricting your ability to use magic of course without the added attack boost.Since the moon supposedly causes this effect they used it.
*** I saw Water as [[IncrediblyLamePun draining]] your health, and Earth as being connected to Gravity in the original Kingdom Hearts (Which halved enemies health).

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** Time, as it pertains to Luxord, seems to be purposefully limited, so the rewinding deal makes a bit of sense. Light I figured is a take on blinding you to your environment, a la Zexion in [=CoM=]. Moon refers to lunacy or insanity, i.e. , babbling like a loon, which would cause unintelligibility, which would mess with spoken spells, which matches the RPG status effect of 'silence'. Space refers to space-time, which refers to gravity. The deal with water and draining is that water is commonly associated with healing, and the fact that it also damages enemies is a gameplay element.
*** Well, the moon has no atmosphere; atmosphere, no air, so no sound. Alternatively, I can at least say that there's a precedent for linking the moon with silence. "[[Franchise/TouhouProject Silent Selene]]", specifically.
*** Its It's probably a call back to the berserk status restricting your ability to use magic of course without the added attack boost.boost. Since the moon supposedly causes this effect effect, they used it.
*** I saw Water as [[IncrediblyLamePun [[{{Pun}} draining]] your health, and Earth as being connected to Gravity in the original Kingdom Hearts (Which halved enemies health).



* Why is it when Roxas is in Beast's Castle, he must sneak around Lumiere and Cogsworth? He's not following them, and they are little more then anthropomorphic furniture after all, why doesn't he either knock them out or just shove them in a closet somewhere?
** Because then they'd notice that there was a serial invader, and beef up defenses accordingly, making it harder to complete missions, and making Beast less likely to trust the TreacherousAdvisor the Organization planned on sending him.
*** Roxas really isn't that mean. At that point in time he wasn't exactly a good guy but he certainly didn't go around hitting people on the head. Also he had standing orders to avoid detection.
* Why is Luxord sent with Roxas on most of (if not all of) the Wonderland Missions? IIRC, Luxord shows up in Port Royal in ''KH:II'', so you'd think Luxord would be scouting the area out rather then wandering around Wonderland with Roxas, or that missions with Roxas would be sent with Lux to Port Royal such as he is with Xaldin to Beast's Castle and Demyx to Olympus.

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* Why is it when Roxas is in Beast's Castle, he must sneak around Lumiere and Cogsworth? He's not following them, and they are little more then than anthropomorphic furniture after all, why doesn't he either knock them out or just shove them in a closet somewhere?
** Because then they'd notice that there was a serial invader, and beef up defenses defenses, accordingly, making it harder to complete missions, and making Beast less likely to trust the TreacherousAdvisor the Organization planned on sending him.
*** Roxas really isn't that mean. At that point in time time, he wasn't exactly a good guy guy, but he certainly didn't go around hitting people on the head. Also Also, he had standing orders to avoid detection.
* Why is Luxord sent with Roxas on most of (if not all of) the Wonderland Missions? IIRC, Luxord shows up in Port Royal in ''KH:II'', so you'd think Luxord would be scouting the area out rather then than wandering around Wonderland with Roxas, or that missions with Roxas would be sent with Lux to Port Royal such as he is with Xaldin to Beast's Castle and Demyx to Olympus.



** One fanfic explained it as he, as a gambler, loved the sheer unpredicability of the place, so he asked to go there. Also, there are a lot of cards there. Gambler's paradise I guess.

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** One fanfic explained it as he, as a gambler, loved the sheer unpredicability of the place, so he asked to go there. Also, there are a lot of cards there. Gambler's paradise paradise, I guess.



*** Actually, I'm pretty sure they said that Xion looked like Namine to him, and since they have different faces, I'm sure it was more that an different hair style thing.
* Wait. Lea saw Ven in BBS but Roxas' appearance never surprise Axel in the least? How does that work?

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*** Actually, I'm pretty sure they said that Xion looked like Namine to him, and since they have different faces, I'm sure it was more that an than a different hair style thing.
* Wait. Lea saw Ven in BBS BBS, but Roxas' appearance never surprise surprises Axel in the least? How does that work?



** Lea and Ven met as teenagers. When Axel and Roxas met, Axel was well into his twenties. Axel does remember Ventus, he just doesn't really find it worth mentioning that Roxas looks like somebody he knew a decade ago. Especially considering he's probably figuring that Ven is also an adult, and would look different by now.

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** Lea and Ven met as teenagers. When Axel and Roxas met, Axel was well into his twenties. Axel does remember Ventus, he just doesn't really find it worth mentioning that Roxas looks like somebody he knew a decade ago. Especially considering he's probably figuring that Ven is also an adult, adult and would look different by now.



*** It isn't stated, but its very strongly implied, and is the only really logical conclusion- she is the only person Roxas meets that also met Ventus, she trusts him implicitly instantly, she isn't at all surprised about the Keyblade or fighting skill and in fact seems to know about it already, etc.

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*** It isn't stated, but its it's very strongly implied, and is the only really logical conclusion- she is the only person Roxas meets that also met Ventus, she trusts him implicitly instantly, she isn't at all surprised about the Keyblade or fighting skill and in fact seems to know about it already, etc.
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** From what I've seen, the Illusion element seems to be [[CastingAShadow darkness]]; not Kingdom Hearts-type darkness, but literal absence-of-photons darkness.

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** From what I've seen, the Illusion element seems to be [[CastingAShadow darkness]]; not Kingdom Hearts-type metaphysical moral darkness, but literal absence-of-photons darkness.darkness. As for Nothingness, I know you understand it, but my interpretation of it would be NonElemental, kind of like Normal in Pokémon, just taken to an extreme.
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** Mickey didn’t because he was kept out of the loop, DiZ didn’t because he hates Nobodies and Riku and Naminé didn’t because they’re was a very good chance he would be killed. Which would mean they’d never be able to wake Sora up and that was a risk Riku for one was unwilling to take.
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** From what I've seen, the Illusion element seems to be [[CastingAShadow darkness]]; not Kingdom Hearts-type darkness, but literal absence-of-photons darkness.
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** Roxas and Axel's memories get rewritten, with Xion out of it. During VideoGame/KingdomHeartsII, they're both too busy to stop and think about how little sense their recently rewritten lives make, and as ''coded'' showed us, Roxas is very much aware that he's forgotten something, he just doesn't know what.

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** Roxas and Axel's memories get rewritten, with Xion out of it. During VideoGame/KingdomHeartsII, ''VideoGame/KingdomHeartsII'', they're both too busy to stop and think about how little sense their recently rewritten lives make, and as ''coded'' showed us, Roxas is very much aware that he's forgotten something, he just doesn't know what.



*** Well, the moon has no atmosphere; no air, so no sound. Alternatively, I can at least say that there's a precedent for linking the moon with silence. "[[VideoGame/{{Touhou}} Silent Selene]]", specifically.

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*** Well, the moon has no atmosphere; no air, so no sound. Alternatively, I can at least say that there's a precedent for linking the moon with silence. "[[VideoGame/{{Touhou}} "[[Franchise/TouhouProject Silent Selene]]", specifically.



* Why is Luxord sent with Roxas on most of(if not all of) the Wonderland Missions? IIRC, Luxord shows up in Port Royal in KH:II, so you'd think Luxord would be scouting the area out rather then wandering around Wonderland with Roxas, or that missions with Roxas would be sent with Lux to Port Royal such as he is with Xaldin to Beast's Castle and Demyx to Olympus.
** Several possible explanations, some storywise, some development possibilities. It's possible that Luxord was either investigating Port Royal himeslf and didn't need or want Roxas there. Will and the others remark on not having seen Heartless before so if they weren't there, he'd have no reason to go there when there weere plenty in Wonderland. Hell, maybe they hadn't even discovered it yet.
** Development wise, maybe they couldn't get it to look right, the fans or they didn't like it enough to be included, they wanted to use older worlds more to give it more of a KH I feel as it takes place earlier in the series than KH II.

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* Why is Luxord sent with Roxas on most of(if of (if not all of) the Wonderland Missions? IIRC, Luxord shows up in Port Royal in KH:II, ''KH:II'', so you'd think Luxord would be scouting the area out rather then wandering around Wonderland with Roxas, or that missions with Roxas would be sent with Lux to Port Royal such as he is with Xaldin to Beast's Castle and Demyx to Olympus.
** Several possible explanations, some storywise, some development possibilities. It's possible that Luxord was either investigating Port Royal himeslf and didn't need or want Roxas there. Will and the others remark on not having seen Heartless before so if they weren't there, he'd have no reason to go there when there weere were plenty in Wonderland. Hell, maybe they hadn't even discovered it yet.
** Development wise, maybe they couldn't get it to look right, the fans or they didn't like it enough to be included, they wanted to use older worlds more to give it more of a KH I ''KH I'' feel as it takes place earlier in the series than KH II.



* Okay, it's made clear in-game that Xion only has a face if the beholder has had some contact with Sora in the past; which is why Axel only sees her as a black-haired Kairi after he met Sora at Castle Oblivion. However, Birth By Sleep shows that Ven's heart is currently inside Sora's; Braig had met Ven before, which is why Xigbar sees Xion as Ven briefly. Problem: Birth By Sleep also shows that Axel (as Lea) had also met Ven, so why doesn't Xion appear as Ven to him as well?
** Because he knew Sora, and Sora's memories, better, having been much more involved in the Castle Oblivion incident than he was in Birth By Sleep.

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* Okay, it's made clear in-game that Xion only has a face if the beholder has had some contact with Sora in the past; which is why Axel only sees her as a black-haired Kairi after he met Sora at Castle Oblivion. However, Birth By Sleep shows that Ven's heart is currently inside Sora's; Braig had met Ven before, which is why Xigbar sees Xion as Ven briefly. Problem: Birth ''Birth By Sleep Sleep'' also shows that Axel (as Lea) had also met Ven, so why doesn't Xion appear as Ven to him as well?
** Because he knew Sora, and Sora's memories, better, having been much more involved in the Castle Oblivion incident than he was in Birth ''Birth By Sleep.Sleep''.



** What is up with [[spoiler: [[StreetFighter evil villains and female dolls?]]]]

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** What is up with [[spoiler: [[StreetFighter [[Franchise/StreetFighter evil villains and female dolls?]]]]



*** I think he meant that he hated Ven's "You kicked my puppy" expression. As for why he said "Drowned your goldfish"...well...it's {{Jerkass Xigbar}}...so who knows.

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*** I think he meant that he hated Ven's "You kicked my puppy" expression. As for why he said "Drowned your goldfish"...well...it's {{Jerkass Xigbar}}...[[{{Jerkass}} Xigbar]]...so who knows.



** I'm amazed that on this wiki of Tropes nobody actually realised: Nobody or not, they are still affected by the Rule of Sexy and the Rule of Cool. Except because they have no emotions both rules are far more muted than usual. The latter is why the black coats have the unnecessary Silver trim on the beads and so forth. The former puts all the female members in heels as part of standard uniform. Xion's Default form is a blank doll Wearing the uniform, which took the standard female form once Xion started being "Her" and not "it". I think that explains it neatly. Alternatively, Xenmas made the heals part of the uniform because of his own memories of emotions, which probably tells us something about Xenahort's interests....

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** I'm amazed that on this wiki of Tropes nobody actually realised: Nobody or not, they are still affected by the Rule of Sexy and the Rule of Cool. Except because they have no emotions both rules are far more muted than usual. The latter is why the black coats have the unnecessary Silver trim on the beads and so forth. The former puts all the female members in heels as part of standard uniform. Xion's Default form is a blank doll Wearing the uniform, which took the standard female form once Xion started being "Her" and not "it". I think that explains it neatly. Alternatively, Xenmas made the heals heels part of the uniform because of his own memories of emotions, which probably tells us something about Xenahort's interests....
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** To put it simply: Her mind was going berserk from all the memories from different people that she had absorbed.
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Answered a couple questions, about Xion needing to be taken down by Roxas, and Di Z's groups memories of Sora, and who absorbed Xion.

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** According to the Secret Reports, she was faking her insanity, and her boss lines at the end allude to that. That in mind, Xion probably just wanted Roxas to take her out because she trusted and cared about him, wanted to see him one last time no matter how painful, and maybe to ensure she would be absorbed into Roxas rather than be totally returned to Sora, in order to give him her power and the power she took from him back, so that he would be safer. Kind of a bizarre mix of a MercyKill, SuicideByCop, and a form of TheAtoner TakeUpMySword perhaps?


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** I assumed a little of both really, memories and some less obvious parts of Xion's existence went back to Sora, as we see in the cutscene, and then stuff like her combat abilities, the power she stole from Roxas, and potentially her Keyblade, went to Roxas. She was connected to both of them, so they got different pieces of her and who she was.


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** Well, Namine and DiZ were a part of the process and heavily involved in this whole thing from the start, as were Riku and Mickey, so it might be more like Riku's line meant there ''detailed'' memories were returning, but they still could fully remember who Sora ''was and that he existed'' because they had constant interaction with his sleeping body, and their whole cause revolved around him. The others had no interaction with Sora after he left them in their worlds, so they wouldn't have anything reminding them about who he was at all. It reminds me a little of the struggle between remembering and forgetting Riku and Roxas had about Xion after she disappears, they eventually completely forget, as does everybody else who knew her, but initially they kept trying to keep hold of the memories, to the point Riku ''reminds'' Roxas what her name is.
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Grammar corrections.


*** Related to the above; that's probably also would have been why Tinkerbell was the only one to have met Roxas...and Ventus. She probably recognized him too and was saying "Hey Ventus! Peter Pan's looking for you!"

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*** Related to the above; that's probably also would have been why Tinkerbell Tinker Bell was the only one to have met Roxas...and Ventus. She probably recognized him too and was saying "Hey Ventus! Peter Pan's looking for you!"



* I do wonder one thing though...if Tinkerbell was trying to get Roxas to go back to the main island(s) and rejoin the lost boys because she thought he was really Ventus, why didn't she eventually try getting Peter Pan to meet him there?
** Because Tinkerbell isn't stupid, and knows that if he's hiding and skulking like he is, he probably has a reason, and she wants him to return on ''his'' terms; no point in forcing him back, which Peter probably would.
** I don't think it's stated anywhere that Tinkerbell thought Roxas was Ventus. She might have but we don't get any dialog or reports hinting at that.

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* I do wonder one thing though... if Tinkerbell Tinker Bell was trying to get Roxas to go back to the main island(s) and rejoin the lost boys because she thought he was really Ventus, why didn't she eventually try getting Peter Pan to meet him there?
** Because Tinkerbell Tinker Bell isn't stupid, and knows that if he's hiding and skulking like he is, he probably has a reason, and she wants him to return on ''his'' terms; no point in forcing him back, which Peter probably would.
** I don't think it's stated anywhere that Tinkerbell Tinker Bell thought Roxas was Ventus. She might have but we don't get any dialog or reports hinting at that.
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* Why does everyone still rememeber Sora in this game? The beginning of KHII made it clear that everyone lost his memories of him over the year gap, Riku even says the "the haze is clearing" during II's prologue, but this game shows that Riku, Mickey, Naminé, [=DiZ=], and Organization XIII have no problem remembering him.
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** He probably tells Saix and likely Xigbar things that they need to do, at the same time working on his plans. And as of ''VideoGame/KingdomHeartsDreamDropDistance'', it's revealed he was also [[spoiler: setting up the Organization to become Xehanort's vessels]].

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** He probably tells Saix and likely Xigbar things that they need to do, at the same time working on his plans. And as of ''VideoGame/KingdomHeartsDreamDropDistance'', ''VideoGame/KingdomHearts3DDreamDropDistance'', it's revealed he was also [[spoiler: setting up the Organization to become Xehanort's vessels]].
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*** I very much doubt he'd be "all for" it. He'd probably hate himself after going through with it. He might do but he'd very much regret it. As for why they didn't ''try'' to ally with Roxas, such as figuring out what side he's really on, the risk is far too great. Even if they got Roxas,(and maybe Axel) on their side, they'd still have six members and a legion of lesser nobodies to take on. If Roxas died, Sora'd never wake up, and they'd be screwed. ''If'' they somehow managed to win, Riku would feel like the mother of all UngratefulBastards. How would that even play out? "Roxas... Thanks for helping us save the universe. Now you get to be whole!" "What do you mean by 'whole'?" "Simple. We'll shove you back inside Sora and you'll get to spend the rest of your existence watching him live out his. Doesn't that sound nice?"

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*** I very much doubt he'd be "all for" it. He'd probably hate himself after going through with it. He might do but he'd very much regret it. As for why they didn't ''try'' to ally with Roxas, such as figuring out what side he's really on, the risk is far too great. Even if they got Roxas,(and maybe Axel) on their side, they'd still have six members and a legion of lesser nobodies to take on. If Roxas died, Sora'd never wake up, and they'd be screwed. ''If'' they somehow managed to win, Riku would feel like the mother of all UngratefulBastards.{{Ungrateful Bastard}}s. How would that even play out? "Roxas... Thanks for helping us save the universe. Now you get to be whole!" "What do you mean by 'whole'?" "Simple. We'll shove you back inside Sora and you'll get to spend the rest of your existence watching him live out his. Doesn't that sound nice?"

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