I know he was grateful to Obi-Wan and the Jedi Order for freeing him. But Anakin seems to hate every part of his Jedi training and his place in the order, resents the rules against love, and seems angry that they didn't also make any effort to free his mother from Watto's control. Did it never occur to him in anywhere in the EU or even during some of the events of the main films to even think about quitting the Jedi life?
It did. Matthew Stover's adaptation of Revenge of the Sith have both him and Padme musing over him leaving the Jedi Order. The main reason why Anakin doesn't go through with it is because he knows Padme would never forgive him for it, because she feels there's still far too much good he's capable of doing as a Jedi.
Ah I see, what about before it? I'm sure his unhappiness didn't start with AOTC. Like in the ten years when he never knew he would see Padme or his mom again and hated how much the other Jedi were holding him back even though he was advancing so fast. I mean even if he was no Jedi he could probably build a light-saber with his skills, and he could already use the force very well by the beginning of the movie.
You're exaggerating Anakin's feelings. At the start of AOTC, he's pretty clearly okay and enjoying his time as a Jedi. There's no indication of him "hating" the other Jedi holding him back. Just a little frustration, if that, which is normal for any talented youth. You're very much overstating how Anakin felt about his position in the Jedi order.
I don't see it the same way. At the very start of the movie he gets in Obi-Wan's face in front of Padme and her team for suggesting they do something different, and he seemed genuinely offended about Obi-Wan not acknowledging what actually happened in in the Gundark incident.
He also shows ridiculous arrogance about his betters, claiming to be more powerful than Obi Wan and Yoda in some respects. He seems to resent authority with a passion, best typified after his mother's death when he says he should be all-powerful.
After his mother's death is not at the start of the movie. At the start of the movie, he has some casual arrogance—the kind that, well, pretty much any teenager who finds themselves good at something is going to have—but that's about it.
I think Anakin's behaviour, although it can rub people the wrong way, makes a lot of sense when you look at it in the context of the film. He's nineteen, but he's never been on a mission by himself and it's clear he's saved Obi-Wan a few times. So, clearly, he's going to be a bit frustrated at the pace of his training. It's not uncommon, for example, for eighteen year olds to be dying to head off to college to be able to be on their own for once. This is made worse by the fact that Palpatine clearly feeds Anakin's ego as much as possible. Also consider that, as of the beginning of AOTC, Anakin is already having dreams of his mother and getting little sleep — which would be destabilizing. Add to that the fact that Padmé is in danger (and Anakin is seeing her again after a long separation) and we have someone who is not going to be making the best decisions with the greatest amount of tact. When he contradicts Obi-Wan in front of Padmé for example, I always got the impression that Anakin was so focused on Padmé that he didn't listen to a word Obi-Wan said, messed up, and then tried to save face. He's crushing pretty hard on Padmé so he's pretty embarrassed and defensive when he gets called on it. But I don't think he's intentionally trying to disrespect Obi-Wan. Rather, he's trying to impress Padmé and it blows up in his face. AOTC is all about Anakin getting knocked down a few pegs, really.
Anakin's also got a point. The mission is protect Padmé. Obi-Wan, thinking like a By-the-Book Cop, wants to just act as a bodyguard, while Anakin, being somewhat Genre Savvy akin to a Cowboy Cop, pissed off someone's threatening Padmé and trying to please and impress her, knows it really means "Waiting for someone to attack, capture them, find the truth and kill the bastard messing with my crush". That's what Jedi do, it's already implied, but Obi-Wan (who also acted as a bit of a dick) thinks the best way of keeping Anakin from doing something harsh is being a Stern Teacher and humiliating him, which is EXACTLYwhy Anakin acts the way he does, and is what allows Palpatine to manipulate Anakin. As for Anakin's frustration, I think the EU clarifies that while Anakin likes being a Jedi, the Council puts some pressure on him and he doesn't handle it well; the Jedi Training is meant to indoctrinate children since their toddler days(one of the reasons I don't like Jedi a whole lot either), not someone older, precocious and who already has a personality of their own outside the "accepted Jedi Code tenets". There's also a situation in EU that made Kenobi say some very nasty things to Anakin and widened the gap between them. Long story short: Obi-Wan is NOT the perfect teacher, and even though Anakin really likes the guy, he sometimes has problems with him, Obi-Wan's Jedi training prevents him from thinking in any other way then "Be stern, authoritarian and make him fall in line" and the person Anakin goes to talk to and unwind is Palpatine. You do the math.
Why didn't the Jedi or Separatist leaders question why Jango was fulfilling the contradictory functions of serving as a mercenary on Geonosis, the clone template on Kamino, and trying to assassinate Senator Amidala? For the CIS leaders the question for Dooku would be why is this mercenary working for us the source of this mysterious Clone Army that we never knew existed until it attacked us.
Why are you assuming that everyone knew all the sides of it? We have no indication that the Separatists ever found out that Jango was the template of the clone army. How would they have found out, and why would anyone have told them?
All it would take was one dead clone trooper having their helmet removed to see that they were clones of Jango. It is implausible that, during a war, the CIS never bothered to study the Republic's clone forces. Jango was well known by the CIS leaders since he hung around with them.
Dooku definitely knew about the Clone Army. He's the one who commissioned Jango to do it after the events of Star Wars: Bounty Hunter. Which just underlines how deeply compromised everything already was.
One thing that does have to be considered is that Jango is a mercenary who would work for anyone and presumably have complete discretion about his other numerous clients. In addition he was supposed to lead Obi-Wan to Geonosis so that the Clone Wars could begin.
Which should have been suspicious to Obi-Wan. That the template for the clone army supposedly ordered by Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas was also in the employ of the Separatists should have rang alarm bells about the fact that somebody was playing both sides of the fence.
There are some elements in EU that might explain this. Sifo-Dyas was a The Seer, and he predicted the coming of a war. He was also best friends with Dooku, who later killed him to become a Sith. The Jedi, knowing this, probably assumed Sifo-Dyas was manipulated by Dooku, and that his plan was to use the army AGAINST the Republic alongside the Droid Army. It would also be possible that Sifo-Dyas first hired Jango Fett, and Dooku paid him to become his ally, Jango is a bounty hunter after all.
Padme falls out of an aircraft that was travelling pretty fast. And yet she's completely uninjured?
Hey, she's not the one that hates sand. Apparently, sand appreciates that.
So let me get this straight: one Jedi Master supposedly had a big enough expense account that he was able to just go to Kamino and order up an entire clone army, complete with weapons and a fleet of warships?! Yoda should have been as worried about the Jedi Order's accounting practices as he was about the fact that he did not sense the army's creation through the Force!
This is explained in Darth Plagueis' novel. Sifo-Dyas was the one who placed the order, but Hego Damask (aka, Darth Plagueis), an extremely wealthy Muun (the guy in Episode II from the Banking clan is one) provided the funds.
That does not explain why the Jedi Council and the Senate were not questioning the source of the money! Seriously, an entire army and fleet of warships just conveniently pops up, allegedly ordered by a Jedi Master, who like all Jedi was not supposed to have private assets and the funding did not come from either the Jedi Order or the Senate (who funds the Jedi Order)? This should have been the most obvious clue that there was something very suspicious about the clone army (along with the fact that they were clones of an employee of the Separatist leader Count Dooku) and about the Clone Wars in general! This is not Force mysticism! Any halfway decent investigator or auditor would have caught this!
Kamino was not a part of the Republic, to the extent that its existence could be erased from the Jedi astronomical database with nobody even noticing! Thus, the name of the buyer was irrelevant information. Anyone could show up on Kamino claiming to be "Jedi Master So-And-So" without having to prove it. Thus the real question is who paid for the clone army, not who ordered it!
However, this leads to the next issue. Kamino is not part of the Republic. Much like Tatooine — and as we saw in The Phantom Menace not being a part of the Republic meant that Republic credits were worthless there. Likewise, a huge payment in Republic credits to a secretive world outside of the Republic would not work, because the Kaminoans could not spend the credits directly without becoming suddenly and glaringly visible on the galactic financial scene. This would mean that the money would have to be funneled through an intermediary, such as the Intergalactic Banking Clan (who just happened to be a signatory to the CIS charter!). Obi-Wan in particular should have caught this issue, since he had personal experience with it.
Since the identity of the actual buyer of the clone army was obviously hidden behind a front (because the money did not come from the government of the Republic or the Jedi Order), that means that some interested, concealed, third-party paid for it.
The Jedi were already suspicious of Palpatine's increasing political power. But they never questioned the convenient way that an army and fleet were already built and ready to placed at his disposal literally at the exact time of him being granted emergency powers that allowed him to assemble such a military force? This despite the fact that nobody knew who really paid for their creation?
After trading taunts with Dooku in the balcony, why the heck did Windu just allow him leave calmly with his courtiers? He should have stuck his lightsaber up through Dooku's rectum at the very moment. Windu is the kind of Jedi who does not mind using direct fighting approaches, and it would have ended the Clone Wars conflict before its beginning.
It's been a while since I've seen the movie, but I recall reading the EU book Shatterpoints, which stars Mace Windu. Long story short, Windu has the power to see how people and events are connected to each other through the Force. He saw Dooku connected to incoming war, and knew killing him could stop the war before it starts. However, once the "calvary" Jedi join the fight, it constitutes hostilities against the Separatists by the Republic. So war cannot no longer be prevented, it's inevitable. So Windu sees through the Force now that killing Dooku won't stop the Clone Wars. Instead it would just create a martyr for the enemy's cause. Plus, didn't he have to jump off the balcony because super battle droids and Jango Fett's flamethrower?
Windu was the living embodiment of his own assertion that the Jedi are "keepers of the peace, not soldiers". His tactics at Geonosis were a solid example of General Failure. He used his only weapon, his lightsaber, to keep Jango Fett at bay. Now, even though it was not common knowledge that Count Dooku was a Sith Lord, he was still known to be a very powerful Jedi Master. Had he chosen to attack Windu, either by drawing his own lightsaber or using the Force, then Windu would have had no choice but to pull his lightsaber away from Jango's throat. Had he tried to go straight for Dooku, Jango would have just shot him in the back! So even without the battle droids showing up, Windu never stood any chance of taking down Dooku. It was an idiotic gambit that could never have accomplished anything other than what did (get a lot of Jedi killed)!
It's been years since I've seen the movie, but is it ever explained why the Separatists are leaving the Republic? It just seems too much like a 'lol, we're leaving just cuz, kthxbai" scenario. Did they have legit grievances against the Republic?
The leaders we hear about are the trade federation, some kind of big banking conglomerate, and other business-types. Presumably they're trying to secede because they don't like the Republic's trade laws.
You also have 10,000 member-worlds seceding too. They have legitimate issues with how they're represented in the Republic, how corrupt some of it's functions are, the vast distances they might be located at from the Core, etc. It's all gone to in great detail in contemporary EU works.
Why is Kamino not a major galactic power? They have the ability to build a clone army massive enough to serve as the primary military force of the most powerful organized entity in the galaxy, and yet the Kaminoans themselves have no presence beyond their home planet. Their location at the very edge of the outer rim is actually an advantage in this regard, as similar to how the Mandalorians conquered worlds in KOTOR, it would be relatively easy for the Kaminoans with their cloning technology to set up at least a small empire on a number of rim worlds without the Republic or any other entity getting in the way. It's not like they don't have any motivation to expand either, what with their home planet experiencing a cataclysm and most of its surface being uninhabitable to their population.
Kamino is more or less OUTSIDE the Star Wars Galaxy; if you read Star Wars Wiki, you'll see Kamino is basically shoved between the Star Wars Galaxy and a dwarf galaxy called Rishi Maze. They only developed a military program due to Jango Fett calling in a few contacts to train his clones. It's very likely that, like the Separatists leaders, they have little grasp on military strategy. They are, however, politically savy. They know the Republic is made of hundreds of systems and are defended by the Jedi, so they're being Genre Savvy on their chances of defying a galaxy-spanning govermnent that is defended by Warrior Monks with supernatural powers, especially from a flooded planet with just a few cities. Kaminoans are also isolationist, so they don't want much to do with the rest of the universe, just profit. They're both minimalists and perfectionists. Considering the Vicious Cycle of war in the main galaxy, they're being very smart (Especially since, once Order 66 came through, Sidious conquered Kamino).
After some thought, why didn't the gunship carrying Anakin and crew just shoot Dooku? While I do understand they mention running out of missiles, this is still an armed gunship with laser cannons. Unless that carries a ammo count too, I really don't see them having trouble just because they ran out of missiles.
I choose to believe that the lasers aren't designed to be aimed at a small, rapidly moving target like a speeder bike (in the initial Big Damn Gunship moment, they're used to strafe across the massed battle droids). The clones could have tried it anyway, but being in their first battle fresh from training, aren't accustomed to using their equipment in ways it isn't designed for yet.
Sorry if someone has brought this up already, but when Palpatine assumes emergency power, he says that his first action will be to use his powers to create a standing army, thus legitimizing the Clones. Fair enough. The trouble is, how does he explain the fact that the army is ready and mobilized, complete with accompanying armor, logistics and a whole Navy from Kuat Drive Yards, to the Senate? All he can really say is "I now authorize an army, and conveniently, we've been building one without your permission or oversight for years! Ta-da!" Yes, it was ordered under a Jedi's name, but surely people would question and investigate how and why the Jedi made this enormous decision, costing billions if not trillions of credits, without telling anyone and when, ostensibly, there was no need for it (the order was placed well before the events of The Phantom Menace). How does Palps explain away the highly suspicious fact that he has a fully-completed military ready to pull out his back pocket the second the Senate gives him emergency power?
Actually the order for the clone army was made in 32 BBY, the same year in which the events of "The Phantom Menace" takes place.
Desperation, manipulation, and possibly good old fashion mind control?
But what kind of manipulation? The number one rule of a con artist is never make a con that is bigger than you - always be able to explain away any discrepancies, and always have an escape plan (ask Bernie Madoff). What is Palpatine's? And surely the Jedi would notice mind control - we're talking the entire investigative media of a galaxy here?
He used mind tricks to fool the lesser-minded, and strong armed (threats, etc) the stronger-minded to shut up and sit down if they decided to speak out about this. That's my guess. Oh, and desperation. The Republic was being torn in two, people were panicking, 'cause they had never dealt with a war of that magnitude for likely hundreds of years. They were likely willing to let it slide that Palpy (who was like their great messiah here) just so happened to have an army and a navy already built for such an occasion.
He didn't have to, because no one was going to ask, because no one wanted to know the answer. All they cared about was that they had an army to defend themselves against separatist aggression, and were more than happy to look the other way.
Simple. The clones aren't our army, they're some army Palpy found and got to work for the Republic. Everyone who knows better is on the other side anyway and those who don't know better are perfectly willing to let the matter slide at least until they don't need the clones to protect them anymore.
Specifically, they were an army ordered by a dead Jedi. Either Dooku used his access to the Archives to steal the guy's identity and order the Clone Army in his name, or the guy defected when Dooku did (possibly as Dooku's apprentice). Presumably this was all set up so that Palpatine could go "I have recently learned of a clone army on Kamino. While I do not know the original reason for their commissioning, the one who filed the order is long dead, and I have thus offered to buy this army from the Kaminoans."
Lets just say he threatened to withhold highway money from anyone who questioned it and be done with it until Wordof God says something.
The senators and general public don't have much knowledge about the Force, so saying that it was ordered by a Jedi would be enough as long as the Order was trusted. People would just assume that they had sensed the need for an army. This could give Palpatine cover not just for the clone army's existence, but the entire war! Who ordered the army? A Jedi. Who assembled the Separatists? An ex-Jedi. Who tried to assassinate the Chancellor? The Jedi. He has the perfect scapegoat, enough to mislead enyone suspecting a conspiracy.
There's one aspect of the Mace Windu/Jango Fett fight that has always bothered me. Windu decapitates Fett after cutting his blaster in half. Sharp eyed viewers will notice that Jango lost his other blaster on Kamino during his fight with Obi-Wan. This means that Mace Windu killed an UNARMED man. Does the Jedi Code allow this?
Jango's armor was loaded with weapons and gadgets. It had already been clearly established that the Jedi are Not So Omniscient After All. So Windu had no way of really being sure that Jango was now safely "disarmed", or if he might have other weapons at his disposal.
Mace loses his lightsaber while being chased by the Reek and Jango jumps on the ground knowing full well that Jedi can retrieve objects using the Force. Why? Lying flat on your stomach in a combat zone is one of the WORST tactical positions you could possibly be in so why would a renowned badass bount hunter do something so foolish? Why didn't Jango just shoot Mace before he picked up his lightsaber? He would have won since Windu wouldn't have been able to block the blaster bolt. The entire fight between Windu and Fett seems to be a huge case of What an Idiot on Jango's part.
The entire battle of Geonosis was an example of What an Idiot on almost everybody's part! Jango was just one of a multitude of idiots. General Failure Mace Windu deployed his Jedi into an enclosed arena, where the majority of the crowd was capable of exiting at-will because they could fly, leaving the Jedi vulnerable to being surrounded and trapped by enemy forces! Count Dooku was the only one present with anything resembling a clue.
Another issue: when Obi-Wan fought Jango Fett why in the name of the Force did he not just yoink Jango out of the sky with the Force?! It would've taken two seconds and he'd have been able to capture and question him! Instead, he goes running round trying to fight him.
Perhaps he wasn't strong enough to stop Jango's motion, which might have let to Obi-wan struggling to hold Jango, who could have just shot him.
Because in the time it took him to go "Oh, Crap" he missed his chance to do that, and afterwards was more concerned with the fact that he was dangling over an ocean at the mercy of a murderer with more firepower than Alabama.
Why did Mace Windu, after hearing from Obi-Wan's transmission from Geonosis that the Trade Federation & several other entities of the CIS were to pick up a DROID ARMY, why did he still go ahead with sending over 200 jedi?
All he knew was Yoda was going to the place. He didn't know he'd succeed in getting the army, or getting them there in enough time to save Obi Wan, Anakin, and Padme and stop the Separatists.
Even worse, he deployed his Jedi inside of an enclosed area (the arena), filled with a race which could fly (the Geonosians) which would have left them vulnerable to attacks from the air even if there hadn't been an army of battle droids ready to slaughter them! Windu comes across as a General Failure. But then again, he is the one who said that the Jedi were "keepers of the peace, not soldiers". Foreshadowing, the sign of a quality flick.
Before the introduction of purposely organised Spec Ops divisions in the Clone Army, the Jedi had to serve as the advance-recon force, space police or soldiers it matters not. If Mace hadn't deployed the majority of the Jedi inside the arena, the Geneosians could have easily just swarmed the hostages and ripped them limb from limb. He needed an equaliser to buy time until the real army showed up.
So whatever happened to all that Jedi talk about not forming deep attachments or mourning those who have died? How does it make rational sense to sacrifice roughly 200 Jedi to save just 3 people? The Jedi sent just one Master and one Padawan to deal with the entire invasion of Naboo!
That was Chancellor Valorum, not the Jedi Order, who sent Qui-Gon and Obi-Wan to Naboo to handle the Trade Federation blockade, which didn't even became an invasion till later on. The tradition of not forming deep attachment or mourning does not mean the Jedi should not rescue senators and Jedi in a hostage situation. After all, Obi-Wan, Padme, and Anakin are quite important figures for the Galactic Republic and the Jedi Order; at the very least Padme is a fairly influential politician and Anakin is considered to be the Chosen One. Not to mention it's not simply to rescue the hostages, but also to stop the Seperatists from launching the Clone Wars.
They didn't send 200 Jedi to rescue three people - they sent 200 Jedi because they had a chance to take out/capture a large portion of the entire Separatist leadership, including Dooku himself. If they'd succeeded there wouldn't have been a war at all. But they were just about genre savvy enough to know high brass would have LOTS of security and wouldn't surrender easily. The actual fight was not their finest hour but despite the title 'Knight' most of them weren't soldiers and didn't have military training, at that point.
At the end of "Attack of the Clones", Dooku meets Sidious at his secret hideout in Coruscant. Dooku is standing very close to the parading clones. Um, why is standing in full view of hundreds of Republic soldiers? Also, why don't the Clones notice him standing there?
What? What are you talking about? There wasn't a clone trooper within miles of Count Dooku. Sidious's hideout is in the middle of an almost completely abandoned industrial area. The clones were marching at some kind of airfield. Dooku is nowhere to be seen.
Those two scenes aren't even occuring at the same time or place...
Agreed. The Dooku/Sidious scene happened at least two-three scenes before the clone march thing.
Why did Jango Fett want to have a mini version of himself? I understand the Kaminoans paid him for him to clone himself but why did he want Boba. He clearly didn't want to settle down and start a family because he continued to be a bounty hunter after they created Boba. He could have easily settled down; he probably had millions of credits in his bank account. So why did he want Boba?
What I'm asking is why he'd have a kid at all. I know it's another annoying "Why didn't Character X do this?" Headscratcher but it just raises so many questions as to why a hardened bounty hunter like Fett, showing no signs of settling down, would ask to have a clone kid?
Like I said: his biological clock was ticking. He wanted an heir and legacy to leave behind when he inevitably died on some mission or other, and felt the biological imperative to have an offspring supporting and magnifying that desire.
Indeed. Despite what this wiki would have you believe at times, some people genuinely want children. Besides, at this point in time the Mandalorians were well on their way to dying out as both a race and culture. (Before Karen Traviss went "Naaaah, they were just napping slightly offscreen.") Jango wanted Boba not just to have a son not just for his personal legacy, but because he wanted to have someone carry on the ever-fading Mandalorian legacy.
Jango wanted to continue his genepool, but was narcisistic enough to want an exact copy, no other woman's genes to dirty the pool. Besides, it's not like Jango was settling down and teaching his son T-ball or something; he was making his son to be as badass as he is, something very in character for a Mandalorian.
What did the Kaminoans get in exchange for them creating the clone army? Sifo-Dyas couldn't pay them because Jedi don't really have any money.
According to the wiki they got a seat on the Galactic Senate that they didn't previously have. That would greatly improve negotiations they could have with neighboring worlds, protect them from war (since neutral states can be fair game), and now have a say in the biggest political body in the galaxy. How they could afford to make the clones in secret for a decade is another matter...
Why didn't the Jedi Council investigate Darth Maul beyond the level of 'not at all?' Here is a Sith Lord working in tandem with the Trade Federation to advance an unknown agenda. I find it impossible to believe that Nut Gunray and his circle of advisors wouldn't have cracked if questioned by Jedi Masters. Why didn't the Council know ten years later that a Sith Lord had manipulated the entire Naboo crisis? Why didn't they obtain Gunray's computer records? Why wouldn't they have obtained records of Sidious and Gunray in holoconference?
It was implied that Nut Gunray didn't even know who Sidious was or why he's helping them. All he knows is that Sidious would provide them profits and rewards if they do whatever he says. And Sidious, as Chancellor Palpatine as well as the Senator of Naboo, would have ensure that any evidences tracing to him would have been wiped out entirely. After all, who says that the holoconferences were even recorded in the first place. And then there's the fact that Sidious's reasons for the Naboo's crisis is unclear without incorporating Senator Palpatine's rise to power. For all the Jedi know, Sidious wants to either conquer Naboo for himself or just cause chaos For the Evulz.