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Headscratchers: American Horror Story: Coven
  • Why did Madison accept a drink from a random college guy? Party frequenters should know better, right? From the way she spoke to Zoe, it seemed obvious that she was a fan of parties.
    • It's possible that, like many teenagers, she talks a good game but is still relatively inexperienced.
    • Also, as a celebrity she might be used to living in a bubble, with others looking out for her.
  • Could Zoe simply have non-vaginal intercourse if she wanted to have sex without killing her lover?
    • It's possible that she sees it as a more intimate event (though I wasn't paying too much attention due to noise so if she says otherwise, sorry!) so the thought of not having regular sex is really upsetting. That or the fact that she killed the first guy she was with right in front of her on accident freaked her out too much and possibly hasn't realized that there might be other options (Considering she had to be on the jock for a while before he died.)
    • It's possible, but I imagine she wouldn't want to find out through trial and error what kinds of sexual contact are off-limits, and other witches may not know about her powers' limits or make that information widely available, especially to a newcomer to the witch community.
  • On the party note, why didn't Kyle just call the police and tell them what went down, instead of chasing the frat brothers onto the bus?? I know it was in the heat of the moment, but it still bothers me.
    • He was trying to control the situation.
    • He is a victim of sexual abuse himself and knows that the victim might not want everyone to find out. He wanted Madison herself to decide what to do about it.
  • So did Fiona intend to kill Madison or was it really an accident that Fiona just accepted after the damage was done? If it was intentional, why the whole charade of asking Madison to kill her, if she clearly could have slit her throat just as easily as she did to the last Supreme?
    • I'm inclined to go with the latter. She puts her hands on Madison's throat to stop the bleeding and looks genuinely shocked for a few seconds afterward.
    • Yeah, but remember what Fiona said: "I've led a disreputable life, but I've done it in style and I'll die likewise." Having her throat slit by Madison doesn't exactly come off as "in style" to me. And if she didn't want to kill herself, why else would she have had the knife except to kill Madison? And the parallels between this murder and that of the last supreme was clearly intended, or they wouldn't have opened with the scene of Fiona killing the last supreme.I'm inclined to think it was a mix of the two; she wanted to kill Madison but maybe wasn't committed to it completely. And then it just happened. She may also have known that Madison's death would draw a council of witches; maybe Fiona set it up so that she could cause Madison's death and still honestly say it was an accident.
    • I took it as Fiona genuinely believing that Madison was the next Supreme, and asked Madison to kill her to test her strength/ability to be (excuse the pun) cutthroat (something she clearly values as a strength in herself.) When Madison failed her test, she killed her because she wasn't worth her time or because she didn't want Madison telling everyone she killed the previous Supreme.
      • It also raises a further pondering that this type of ruthlessness IS part of Supreme, and Fiona is testing the other to see if they're worthy. Queenie almost gleefully helped Fiona frame Myrtle for Acid-Gate, Misty has no problem killing those who she thinks do wrong (like the poachers), and Zoe is showing all kinds of ruthless badassery (raping Madison's rapist to death, kicking zombie ass, etc)
  • Why didn't the council have Nan read Spaulding's mind?
    • Oh, snap! Yeah... But then again, would they even trust her? No one can confirm what Nan hears so she could just as easily lie. We know she wouldn't, but the council can't exactly convict and kill Fiona over something Nan claims to hear in people's heads.
    • They could enchant her tongue so she only spoke the truth.
      • Then why didn't the council just do that to Fiona and ask her if she killed Madison?
      • She's the Supreme. She could have some kind of power that prevents her from saying anything she doesn't want to say, or perhaps a power that keeps any such enchantments from working on her.
    • Spaulding could have lied if Nan read his mind. When Zoe did have Nan read his mind, he was messing with her.
  • Did Zoey just ditch Kyle and return to the Academy? I mean, Kyle's running around bloody and delirious and possibly dangerous. Not to mention, if the police pick him up they'll notice he's a dead guy who's body went missing. I know she was dealing with the zombies, but what about before and after that? You'd think he'd be more of a priority for her.
    • It never stated how much time passed between the beginning and end of the episode, it could be one day or two. Despite how terrible unguarded the academy is, Zoe does have to come back to it occasionally to avoid suspicion, there wasn't anything that she could sensibly do to improve the Kyle situation that didn't involve stay away for even longer. Then Night of the living dead happened and afterwards Myrtle trial.
  • Why wasn't Myrtle screaming or showing any signs of agony while Queenie used her powers on her? Every living thing Queenie has used her powers on has shown signs of pain.
    • Maybe some sort of witchy protection spell? Sloppy writing?
    • She did scream. If you listen carefully, Fiona grabs Myrtle's hand right before Queenie sticks her hand in the acid and Myrtle screams that Fiona is hurting her. It was all just careful timing to cover up Queenie's powers.
    • It still doesn't explains why Myrtle didn't at least try to explain that the chemical burn wasn't there before.
      • Probably related to her big speech, where she resigned herself to always get screwed over by Fiona, and there was no way to finally catch her.
      • As we learn in Head, the other members of the Council had it out for her position of power, so they probably wouldn't have listened anyway.
  • Why hasn't Zoe brought Misty to the school? You'd figure that finding a powerful witch everyone thought was dead would get you a lot of credit in their community, especially now that she's all about banding the coven together.
    • She eventually does, but Misty doesn't want to be there and bails almost immediately. Part of it has to do with the Axeman, but the girls don't exactly put on a very good display for her. She only decides to stay after Hank finds her in the swamp and tries to kill her.
  • What exactly was Cordelia's power? Now that she has the Sight, we may have seen her use telekinesis (I'm still not sure if it's her or Fiona who did it), but we still don't know her basic power. Do we?
    • Judging from the first episode, she's good with plants and potions and such; maybe that's her power?
      • In my opinion, Delia's ability with plants might simply mean she's well versed in magical botanics, which seems to be part Ritual Magic, not an innate power.
      • To me, when Fiona was bitching Cordelia out, she implied that her daughter either didn't know her power, or it was really weak for its potential.
  • Why did Fiona insist on bringing Joan Ramsey back to life? There wasn't really any reason to do so, and not that she could have predicted this, but it leads to Luke's death.
    • She wanted to see Misty's resurgence power for herself, and Joan just happened to be dead at the time.
      • Indeed. She knew the others were looking at Misty as a potential Supreme and wanted to scope out the competition.
  • Marie is extremely shortsighted for a 219-year-old priestess. Why would she hire a witchhunter to take down the Coven without ever stopping to think that he might not be the biggest fan of Voodoo either? Considering Hank was already deep undercover as the headmistress's husband, all she had to do was wait and watch the plans already in motion. Instead, she alerted him (and, by extension, his organization) that the most famous Voodoo priestess in history is alive and well in New Orleans' Ninth Ward and blew his cover regarding the coven, getting her own workers killed in the process. Why in the world did she force Hank to make a move against the witches on her timetable instead of staying out of it and letting the hunters go about their plans?
    • I wouldn't be surprised if the witchhunters already knew about her, considering how old and powerful they seem. She thinks that the witchhunters are "white women's worry," and probably thought that aligning with the witchhunters would grant her amnesty while they eliminated her enemies. As for why she thought this would work and why she thought she could get away with bullying the boss's son, I'm guessing she either lost some brain cells and/or suffers from a form of senility due to her old age, or she's just a bitch.
    • Possibly she was also just overconfident, and thought that even if Hank turned on her, she and her teammates could handle him.
      • She did seem pretty nonchalant about Fiona telling her they were coming after her. Though I don't get why she thought her and her minions could handle them, considering the witchhunters had a clear advantage of surprise, more means to corner them, and had sheer numbers on their side. Unless she knew who all the higher ups were and knew how to hurt them like she did Hank, she'd have to be really overconfident in order to overlook everything.
  • So it was the hunters rather than Myrtle who blinded Cordelia. What were they hoping to gain from this? At least with Myrtle it made sense considering the powers Cordelia developed while blind.
    • As they said, they were hoping to drive Cordelia even closer to Hank by making her dependent on him. They don't even know quite how spectacularly that backfired on them because Hank didn't tell them about Delia's second sight at that meeting, presumably because he didn't want them to go straight to eliminating her.
  • It's entirely possible this will be addressed in the next episode, but why was Luke's mother stupid enough to murder her son in a hospital? He was hooked up to machines monitoring his vital signs, all of which would have gone off very loudly once his mother started smothering him. Not to mention the fact that a hospital would be full of cameras and people. Unless she's a witch herself, there is no possible way she could get out of it without being caught. Not that that would surprise me at this point.
    • I'd say at this point, she's off the deep end. In her mind, she's the innocent one. I wouldn't be surprised if she justified it as "doing God's work," or believing God would help her out. On the other hand, she could have just been knocking him out for a while so she could say that he was just dreaming. The only evidence would be the cameras, assuming there were some.
    • When this sort of thing happens on TV, the murderer usually just claims that the victim simply died suddenly.
  • Why are we supposed to root for the witches? Most of them are unrepentant murderesses (Fiona, Zoe, Madison, Marie, Misty, now Myrtle), and one can't really fault the witch hunters for wanting to eradicate them.
    • Misty killed crocodile poachers (indirectly, by bringing the crocodiles back to life). Why would you want to kill her for that?
      • She still killed people without a second thought.
      • They were going to shoot her, so it's self defense.
    • While they mean well, the witch hunters are killing witches regardless if they felt guilty or not (Kaylee, although Hank messed up the plan with her), and would kill out of Fantastic Racism even if they didn't do anything. As opposed to the Coven witches, Zoe is more of a Pay Evil unto Evil Anti-Hero but she just wants to protect her friends. Most of the witches were fine living in peace and trying to stay together, even if they did have several bad eggs. (And to be fair, most of them only struck when provoked in some way, and they all (sans Myrtle, so far) have had to face consequences for their actions.) If you want to root for the hunters, fine. But they're just as unrepentant as the witches, if not moreso. It's Gray and Gray Morality, since both sides mean well but are all sort of dicks.
  • Do we have to consider warlocks extinct, since the only one we have seen so far, Quentin, is dead and he's never coming back?
  • The show has set a clear Double Standard with this 'witches vs. witch hunters' thing. The witches are all female, while the witch hunters are all male, and we are supposed to side with the witches. Not to mention that every single male character has been a villain, unimportant or both; 'Coven' is basically stating that masculinity is evil and femininity is good. Am I the only one seeing something deeply wrong with that? Can't a show ever be 'feminist' without demonizing the male gender?
    • That's kind of reaching for it, imo. When you have a show that focuses on so many a lot of females, there's not a lot of room for men to stand out. And the major ones have been portrayed in a sympathetic light. Plus, while Marie meant well, she was shown in a negative light at times and was an antagonist for most of the series. AND a lot of the female characters are shown to be pretty awful. One side is male and one is female, one side has the protagonists and the other antagonists, but both have had good and bad parts. They're probably not even going for a message about gender, especially considering a man worked on this show.
      • Yeah, but that man's Ryan Murphy. He's gay, yet he promotes a blatantly emotionally abusive homosexual relationship on his other show, Glee, and has treated all gay characters not conforming to the Camp Gay sterotype like shit and even one gay character that does (Kurt Hummel). And since this season is already the product of a very stereotypical gay man's mind, with bitchy witches and divas (I don't think it's a coincidence that the most powerful witch is called the Supreme, not to mention, Madison, Fiona, Marie. All divas, all insufferable, all INESCAPABLE), I can't help but think the worst (with Ryan Murphy, you're hardly wrong).
    • I think your biggest logical fallacy is assuming that any show with a predominantly female cast is automatically trying to sell a feminist message. Yes the witches commit plenty of morally-questionable and flat-out evil acts, but at no point are they ever presented as 100% morally in the right.
      • By Ryan Murphy's own admission, the theme this season is 'oppression', so yes, Coven IS trying to sell a feminist message. And failing miserably, might I add.
      • Fair enough. Ryan Murphy is many things, but subtle is not one of them.
    • Plenty of the witches are seen as negative or even evil, e.x Madison, Fiona, Marie, even Myrtle to some. And plenty of the guys are seen as good, e.x. Kyle, Papa Legba, (even Hank got a sorta redemption). The Witch Hunters being male is more likely an attempt to even out some the gender casting.
      • The Witch Hunters represent men who are threatened by the idea of powerful women and cloak it in blather about a "noble shadow war". You see their type throughout history and, unfortunately, today as well, more blatantly in some other countries but also here in the US.
      • Pardon me, but the Witch Hunters are RIGHT in their belief that witches are evil. Only ONE of the witches on the show (Cordelia) has never murdered anyone, and only Misty's can be excused as self-defense. Not to mention, they're the most important male characters on the show, what with Luke and Kyle being the Shallow Love Interest stereotype, Spalding being unimportant as hell and the warlocks apparently existing but never EVER shown on screen... and they're wasted on a pathetic 'the eeevil men so bad that want to kill the poor magical wimmen' sterotypical storyline that is sexist in so many ways heads can SPIN if you think about it.
  • anyone going to do anything about that baby?
    • It seems like no one else knows about it. If anyone did, they probably just assumed Marie took it with her when she "left". Why no one cares about her disappearance or ever seems to visit the attic is a whole other mystery.
    • Queenie could have informed the others that Marie and Delphine are dead. As for the attic, did anyone even notice Spalding's disappearance?
    • I think only Marie, Fiona and Nan knew the baby existed.
    • You'd think they would hear the baby cry, though. The attic can't be soundproof, can it?
  • Who are those two men in suits who keep appearing? They're with Myrtle when she whisks away Zoe and they appear both times Myrtle is burned at the stake, but I don't think an explanation is ever given to who they are.
    • They seem to be hired muscle for the coven.
  • Why didn't Cordelia try bringing back Zoey before doing the other Wonders? Seems like something that's of higher importance.
    • Maybe she needed the confidence of knowing she was Supreme before she felt she could really do it.
    • Alternatively, she wanted to create enough competition/reasonable doubt to get Madison to do it. But once she had six of the Seven Wonders down pat, she just decided she would do it herself.
    • I don't think there was a hurry to bring her back, in a time sense. It took Misty a little more work to bring Madison back after she had been gone for 3 weeks, but she could do it. So they probably weren't racing against the clock with Zoe.
  • Is the Supreme responsible for both witches and warlocks? And if she is, why did Cordelia utterly disregard warlocks and only open a refuge to witches?
    • Maybe warlocks have their own territory, and taking them in would be stepping on their toes. Quentin was probably an ambassador in the Council to make sure the witches didn't do something stupid, or because he was in good with Fiona.
    • There just seems to be a lower number of warlocks (which means someone will still probably claim misandry). Mostly it's just probably bad writing.
      • Yes, one can, but more importantly, one can claim it's just stupid not to preserve half of your species if you're a dying breed.
      • It's clearly not half their species, more like a handful. They simply weren't mentioned, no one talked about excluding them.
      • That half wasn't literal; sorry if I misled you, but I meant half as in 'one half of the magical world' the other being witches. Not to mention, the witches are time and again mentioned to be a handful themselves.
  • Queenie displayed Vitalum Vitalis in episode 12. Why couldn't she repeat it under similar circumstances, and why was she out of the competition when Cordelia knew she could do it? I could understand if Zoe's wounds were too severe, but the latter shouldn't have happened.
    • You can't be the Supreme if you can't do the full extent of one of the Seven Wonders. Like how Misty couldn't pull off a whole Descensum. If Queenie could do Vitalum Vitalis well enough to revive an oxygen-starved Misty (assuming it wasn't actually Cordelia who did it), but not an impaled Zoe, she clearly wasn't the Supreme.
      • But Madison just brought back a fly (and she just closed her hands, there isn't a guarantee that she wasn't just pulling a slight of hand and kept it alive), and it was good enough for Cordelia and Myrtle.
  • Would resurgence count as Vitalum Vitalis for the Seven Wonders? It's not the exact same thing, but it's basically the same thing but without the drawbacks.
  • Why did the supreme necessarily have to be one of the witches currently at Ms. Rochibaux's Academy? Wouldn't any youngish witch currently alive have just as much of a chance?
    • Those were the only girls they knew about for certain before going public, so perhaps out of practicality they were only considering the ones they actually had access to, and hoping it was one of them. Or perhaps it's something you only find in the tribe of Salem descendants and not all of the hundreds of girls we see at the end were part of that tribe.
      • During the season it was said that all Supremes have hailed from the Salem coven. This might also be a reference to Salem's popularity being indissolubly linked to witches and the witch trials.
  • Is it possible that Madison actually did succeed at divination? Because as she's storming out she takes a cigarette out of a cigarette holder that was similar to Anna Leigh's. Perhaps that wasn't the case so I could be wrong.
    • No. She couldn't find the hidden item through divination. This is even consistent with the show since it's one power that we never see her use.
  • Why is there no system in place to remove a Supreme from her position if she cannot or will not perform her responsibilities? I know the real answer is "Because then there'd be no show," but since Fiona was described by everyone as an awful Supreme who cared more about her own endeavors than leading her coven, I'm surprised there was no way for the council to give her the boot.
    • "Either you are Supreme, or you aren't." Considering they can't actively control who becomes the Supreme (as it's a magical force), they wouldn't be able to stop the Supreme except by erasing her via death. As for why Fiona was chosen to be the Supreme when she was terrible on a whole - she did (by the end) eventually unite the Voodoo witches with her coven (even if it was just Marie) and wiped out the witch hunters, who would have won had she not interfered. So in the end, her becoming the Supreme helped the witches.
    • Didn't Myrtle propose doing just that in "Burn, Witch. Burn!", before Fiona turned the tables on her? Remove Fiona and delegate the authority of the Supreme to the Council until the new Supreme was found?
  • If Supremes are supposed to have perfect health, why was Cordelia sterile?
    • I think that Cordelia was subconsciously repressing her abilities to the point it affected her health, maybe she even got fertile after her ascension.
    • And for all we know, Hank could have been the infertile one all along.
    • Didn't she visit a doctor who told her that artificial insemination wouldn't work for her?
    • She wasn't the Supreme while she was infertile. The current Supreme doesn't die the instant the old Supreme is born, they weaken leading up to their ascension. Even if you're the nascent Supreme you don't get the Supreme's perfect health and magical powers until you ascend and become the Supreme for real. Delias eyes were fixed after her ascension, presumably her lady bits were as well.
  • Returning from Hell was the first thing Misty Day did on the show. She resurrected herself after the witch hunters burned her in the first episode. Why was she so unprepared for it that she utterly failed the second time?
    • There was no implication that she went to hell the first time he died, and it seems unlikely that she would.
    • When Cordelia relates Misty's backstory, she states that Misty was left for dead, so she never died before.
  • From a distance, how does Cordelia pick out which of the witch candidates are real, and which are teenage girls who just believe they're special? Imagine the hundreds of thousands of little girls calling the coven day in and day out begging to be a part of the coven. Wasn't airing a "COME ALL WITCHES" message on national television a very foolish thing to do?
    • Well, very easily, they just need to prove that they have powers. It is a lot of people, but they do need to find a lot of witches to secure the future of the coven and after a while the craze would surely calm down and ony mostly the real witches would call.
  • Why doesn't Fiona have a soul? Papa Darkie informs her of this and it comes as a surprise to Fiona.
    • It could be to show that Fiona is so evil that she have lost her soul. But mostly it's just bad writing.
  • When Madison is at first resurrected, she is played as "zombie"-like, telling the audience she couldn't feel pain and was in a sort of emotional limbo. The show seemed to be leaning in a "resurrected, but changed" kind of vibe. This is never touched on again, and anyone else resurrected after Madison is simply brought back to life with no consequence (more like revival than resurrection).
    • Madison spent a longer time dead (and being... abused) than most of the other characters who died on the show. It's possible that Misty and the other witches got better at it as they learned from the others' mistakes.
  • How the hell did Delphine know how to cook, let alone cook in a modern kitchen?
  • Why the hell didn't they save going to Hell for last, since it was easily the most dangerous of the Wonders, if they could have disqualified anyone ahead of time it would have been a good thing. I mean, the ideal would be that three candidates already be eliminated, and the Supreme does the final Wonder as a formality.
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