All Comments

All Comments
Survivors of the North Star: Let's Play Shin Megami Tensei Devil Survivor 2
"this time I can actually buy people thinking that he resembles a Persona Hero, namely the one of Persona 5."

I am the opposite, the De Su 1 hero is somewhat similar to the P3 hero, I feel, but I don't see much resemblance between Potter and the De Su 2 hero.
SaintDeltora
Is it Record Breaker or Break Record...? I AM CONFUSED.

Indeed, there is much difference in tone between De Su 1 and De Su 2. In fact, I personally think that it's more severe than the differences between P3 and P4.
megami-hime
Despite the crisis, he and his friends get caught up in it, seems to have a strong, irreverent sense of humor,http://www.euluxhouse.com/ like most of his dialogue options lead to playful and quirky.http://bcauto.com.ua/
Sergpro
Huh, didn't expect to see this one so quickly...
Hunter1
The reason I've been able to be so prolific with these liveblogs is because I've fallen into a routine of working on them for forty-five minutes to an hour each evening or every other evening. Originally it was something to do to unwind after a day of job searching or volunteering, and now it's something to do to unwind after coming home from work. The pick-up-and-play nature of the game's I've covered help out a lot too.
ComicX6
I'm sad that demons really don't talk as much as they did in De Su 1. But the soundtracks are definitely better.

Ah, De Su 2 on-screen deaths. Ranging from death due to demonic possession to repeatedly shot in close range by a frenemy, they sure are plentiful.
megami-hime
Makoto is something of a mixture of Izuna and Amane from the first Devil Survivor. Izune because of being the protagonist's initial point of contact with the Special Operative faction (among other reasons), and Amane for being a Crutch Character for the first boss (among other reasons). As I said before, she comes across much better than Izuna.

If you pay attention, you can pinpoint the likely moment when Io twists her ankle - the purple energy that releases Bai Suzhen tears up the ground right next to her (and the rest of the party for that matter, but even so).
Mysterion
Daichi's Worth tries to be an Establishing Character Moment for him. Sadly, he already had one of those back before the Death Clip.

Trying to get into the M Cs mind, I like to think this one tends towards Tranquil Fury. Kill or attempt to kill someone he likes, and he will concentrate on killing you with every winning strategy he has available. In this case, that would simplify to:

If(MP > 4): Blast Duhbe Else: Tear Duhbe apart with bare hands
Mysterion
He looks like he's going insane in the art of him for Break Record, so maybe you're on to something there.
ComicX6
The Septentriones are certainly otherworldly and tough, but the fact that every single one of them looks like some sort of food (Dubhe being ice cream), well...

"Hibiki must be feeling left out of the Fate party - no one cares about his issues, whatever they might be." Haha! It's funny because it's true!
megami-hime
If there was one thing the anime did right, it was making Keita somewhat more likeable. Still, I've dealt with worse characters than that little pipsqueak before, so I'm not complaining too hard.
dragonfire5000
This wiki at one point said that Keita is like Kaido without the negative traits. The trouble is that Keita doesn't have Kaido's REDEEMING traits either (And if you'll recall, I hated Kaido). The result is a simple Arrogant Kung Fu guy with nothing to endear him to the player.
Mysterion
Well I failed to save Keita in my first playthrough, so I have no idea what he's like.
megami-hime
Keita will currently be the best physical attacker you have at the moment, and probably keeps the #2 slot for both physical and agility based characters through the game. But he's such a pain to deal with, and there are other options.

In contrast, Hinako makes a good first impression with her personality, and can become a strong fighter too.

Currently, there are 6 usable characters, enough to start switching in people for specific situations. Daichi is probably the first to go, since Keita shares the same resistance but a more effective build. Hinako might have worse stats than Daichi now, but her Ice resistance can come in handy...
Mysterion
You know, I had a long post partly written up, then Safari crashed and ate it. So, short version, the Goddess in the franchise title is Izanami, the reincarnation is Yumiko Shirasagi, and the franchise title has qualified as an Artifact Title since, well, the second game, if not the first (heck, Megami Tensei was only the subtitle of the first novel).
Hunter1
Actually, all the evidence I've seen indicates that both De Su games take place in their own separate timelines, that are themselves seperate from the rest of the franchise.

As for a single cohesive timeline for the franchise... I'm pretty sure there isn't one. The best I can figure out is a split timeline (a la Zelda), with one path covering the main series (possibly plus Strange Journey), while the other half covers If... and the Persona and Devil Summoner subseries, with the Raidou Kuzunoha games taking place before the split. Why the split? Blame the time travel in Soulless Army. (Yeah, it's not perfect, but it is the most comprehensive, sensible, and canonically supported solution I can come up with.)
Hunter1
My headcannon's that all the other series' characters still exist/existed/will exist in each separate universe, though don't necessarily get up to the same adventures they would in their "home" universe. Like for example in the Devil Survivor 1 'verse Yu still moved to Inaba and met most of his new friends there, but never gained his Persona or had any serial killings to investigate. That could also explain the Soul Hackers and Devil Summoner auction easter eggs in these games.
ComicX6
Really? "Memory stick"? That... Argh!

Okay, quick version: since (at the latest) the early 80's, RAM has come in the form of the SIMM, or Single In-line Memory Module. A SIMM is simply a wide, short circuit board with RAM chips on one side, hence the name. For the last 10-15 years however, the SIMM has been superseded by the DIMM, or Dual In-line Memory Module; they look exactly the same as a SIMM, except the RAM chips cover both sides.

Now, the tricky part is that while laptops use SIM Ms and DIM Ms, they use special versions that are physically smaller (due to limited space) and use less power (due to batteries), and as such, they typically can't use RAM meant for desktop machines.

On the other hand, given when De Su 2 is supposedly taking place, most Japanese aren't really well versed in computers, so the ignorance is understandable. Doesn't mean I don't find it annoying, though.
Hunter1
Fumi's not actually using a laptop in this scene, though. She's sitting on top of a giant processor that has a giant flat-screen monitor sticking out of the side, typing with what looks like a wireless keyboard. She does have a laptop like Airi said, several even, but she doesn't use them for their intended purpose...
ComicX6
Ah, yes, Jungo and Airi. Two of my favorite characters from this game. Jungo is simply so lovable as for Airi, I just really like her style (I love Tsunderes, don't judge me!)

But Ronaldo's coming up, and he's my favorite character — at least, in the male side — in this game. I hope you don't hate him as much as most of the fanbase does...

Damn, you beat Botis. In my first playthrough I completely failed both Ghost Q and Botis.
megami-hime
Jungo seems to be considered the best physical character in the game in most discussions I've seen. And it's worth noting that if you don't learn how to deal with Death Clips early, then you're stuck with Daichi and Hinako for the early game, and good substitutes don't show up for a while.

Fumi takes Io's place as the most Mag-focused character available. The fact that she can't die before you recruit her helps quite a bit too.

Airi has similar stats to Joe. Sometimes he's better, sometimes she's better. Using one of them over Fumi or Io means that you're prioritizing hitting first over hitting hard.
Mysterion
Eh I prefer a certain Hot Nurse when it comes to Magic, but Jungo's your best bet for Physicals until Multi-Strike comes along.
megami-hime
Personally, I prefer Ronaldo as someone unrelated to JPs. It gives the message that ignorance is the real enemy: Ronaldo is ignorant of the cosmic level struggles JPs is involved in, the party is largely ignorant of how the other civilians are handling things (or not, as the case may be), plus there's Ronaldo's history and motives to consider... and it webs out from there.
Mysterion
Yay Ronaldo! That is all. Apparently, if you keep off the demons from attacking him, Ronaldo can take down Phecda by himself. I need to try that someday...

And yeah, I do like the idea of Ronaldo being a former member of J Ps. It certainly does help him seem more legit and understandable.
megami-hime
Yeah, I'm planning to pick up ORAS (that Target card discount is so useful), and I have the PQ premium version on preorder at Hastings so I know how you feel. Who knows, maybe after De Su 2, you can do a liveblog of one of those games...

But, back on a topic actually directly relating to De Su 2, is it possible to do a Maxed Fate Run, similar to how you can do a Maxed S.Link Run in Persona 3 and 4? (And if you can, is there any point in doing so instead of a All L4 Run for subsequent playthroughs?)
Hunter1
I'm actually toying with the idea of doing a liveblog for a run of Persona Q since it would be both my first Persona game and my first Etrian Odyssey game. It's in the pool along with a few other candidates for my next liveblog.

As for your other question yes, it is possible to do a maxed Fate run and it results in a minor, yet still significant change to one of the endings. Like a max Social Link run you pretty much have to have a FAQ open every step of the way, so I'm saving it for last. I want this first, main playthrough to be as organic as possible.
ComicX6 (edited by: ComicX6)
Heh, this will be my first Persona game (okay, I played a bit of 4, but even then, I never got to the part where you could make an actual choice, so I'm not counting it), but my first EO game was the demo for 4, and the full version a week or two later (which was a month or so before Untold's demo came out). With Untold, I got the demo and full versions the days they came out. I doubt there will be a demo for PQ, and I intend to pick up my copy as soon as I can after I get the call form Hastings. (I also intend to get 2 Untold when it comes out stateside, as well.)
Hunter1
Personally I think Otome's the best magic-user in the game due to her Mag/Vit build, meaning she can deal epic damage while taking epic damage. She's the game's ultimate magic tank, only beaten by a Magic/Vit MC.
megami-hime
Hmm...
Hunter1
I really do like the chemistry between Ronaldo and Joe. One is serious, has a strong sense of justice, and fights for the people, while the other is carefree, shamelessly takes advantage of people sometimes, but is ultimately a great guy. They're both awesome.
megami-hime
There's a very real possibility, considering Fumi's explanation, that the demons do not in any real sense exist when they aren't summoned. In this case, they are essentially the Anguished One's concept of what demons are supposed to be like being brought to life.
Mysterion
You know, Airi being Ronaldo's mentor's daughter may be one of the reasons she joins him in endgame (besides having similar ideals of course — she was barred from achieving her dreams due people not helping her out, so a world where people work together and help each other out probably syncs with her — at least that's my interpretation of it.)
megami-hime
"I can say that the cardinal weakness of this gameís writing is that itís far more episodic than Devil Survivor 1ís, with a lot of character development being confined to the bubble of the Fate events and not bleeding over to the main plot when it reasonably should"

Ooooh yeah, definitely. The worst example is probably with my husbando Ronaldo — his entire Fate route is about him learning to NOT be a Knight Templar and truly fight for the people. And what happens at the end of Day 6 again?
megami-hime
And so, even though there is less and less that can be saved every day, another Septentrione has been defeated and the protagonists can be happy about a battle well fought. I must say, I'm certainly enjoying this Liveblog, and I wish you luck with the battles that have yet to come.
EndarkCuli
'adore' Hibiki? Pfft, by endgame he's more than willing to MURDER people if Hibiki didn't side with him.
megami-hime
You know, the fact that Yamato just revealed that JP's has no less than three gods belonging to other cultures under lock and key as a "just in case" measure reminds me of a NGE / mass-SMT crossover I read a while ago, where this information causes some problems for JP's when SEELE reveals it to the world at large (yeah, as it turned out, a few countries wanted their god(s) back).
Hunter1
https://www.fanfiction.net/s/8325633/1/Indistinguishable-From-Religion

This one? It's pretty interesting, but there are a lot of plot threads to keep track of. There are a lot of things going for it, though, including Gendo's [Oh, Crap reaction] to seeing Comp-users in action against NGE angels.
Mysterion
Yep, that's the one. And as for the multiple plot threads, I did say it was a mass-SMT cross. Outside of SMT 4 and anything released after it was finished, I think the only games it doesn't touch on are Jack Bros and Devil Children.
Hunter1
Ah yes, the fateful battle nears...too bad the game doesn't take account of Fate events other then Io-Lugh, because if so that battle could have been completely avoided considering their Fate routes.
megami-hime
Ronaldo Rises is really a terrible sequence. Not only does it go against both Ronaldo and Makoto's subplots, but it doesn't change anything. Ronaldo declares war on Yamato? He did that days ago, we don't need a repeat.

Obviously, they needed a third death clip on the female side, but was this the best they could do?

Although, I have to wonder: did they come up with this scene and then start developing the two characters involved, or was this slapped on later because they thought they had run out of other Causes of Death to use?
Mysterion
Ugggh I hate Ronaldo Rises. It makes you feel like all that time you spent on their Fate routes completely worthless.

Also, is it really true that siding with Ronaldo would kill of Makoto? Because I remember siding with Ronaldo and Makoto NOT dying. Maybe it's because I maxed out both of their fate routes (I wuv them okay)?
megami-hime
Ah yes, Python and Evil Wave. I feel that this Racial Skill is utterly superb — I used this, paired with Kishin, for ALL the Tamer bosses during endgame, because the feeling of TRASHING such powerful bosses (I'm looking at you Io and Yamato!) without them even touching us is AWESOME.
megami-hime
...Well that sucks.
Hunter1
I suppose the usual party at this point would be

Jungo/Hinako/Ronaldo, Otome, Io/Airi/Joe

The game does a pretty good job of giving every faction some good characters.
Mysterion
Pretty much. Right now I'm rolling with Ronaldo/Io/Otome, and I'll likely switch Io out for Fumi once she rejoins. Normally I prefer to use Hinako in place of Ronaldo for Multi-Strike slaughter, but as I said in Devil Survivor 1 I like using route-relevant characters, and there's still not quite enough room for two Physical attackers with Pierce + still being a long ways off.
ComicX6
...Fumi's a badass.
Hunter1
On one hand I like Fumi's badassness. On the other hand my favorite Fiend was defeated by Unlimited Laptop Works. Hmm.
megami-hime
Alcor...well he was definitely better developed than Kaworu! I'm salty that you can't crack skill off him though — Anti-Almighty is pretty useful for endgame and NG+ bossess.
megami-hime
And so ends the first main play through of the game. It's certainly been an entertaining adventure. Should we assume that you'll go for the complete opposite next time, clearing the way for Yamato's dream and saving any hope of balance for the run after that? Regardless, best of luck with whatever extra challenges New Game+ throws in, and have a good day!
EndarkCuli
This doesn't look like that bad of an ending. Really, the two sticking points are that the fundamental nature of mankind is changed, and that Polaris never answers for starting the invasion.
Mysterion
None of the endings in this game are truly "bad", unlike the previous game which had a blatant bad route.

As for me, I really liked Egalitarian end. I guess stuff about equality just gets me hyped. And you handled the final boss pretty well; all I did was charge straight into Polaris A. Almost everyone got killed, but somehow I won.
megami-hime
Oh boy, you got really lucky there.

As for Alice's plot events and setup in SMT 1... She was just a girl's spirit given physical form. Her "uncles" gave her a bunch of playmates in the form of... Can't find the actual name, but it was the murdered inhabitants of the area with their souls stuffed into artifical bodies and mostly lacking free will. A barrier was then set up to keep the area "safe".

When you get inside the barrier, none of this is really apparent until you meet up with one of the embodied souls that's been isolated and locked up. Turns out it's your old neighbor who shares a name with the Heroine, and she has managed to keep her free will. She fills you in on enough to point you in the direction of the Counts and Alice, and then asks for a specific item that she can use to commit suicide and let her soul go free (it's a skippable sidequest).

From there, you fights the Counts and Alice, drop the barrier, and I don't know what happens to the embodied souls in the aftermath. The SMT wiki is kinda lousy on details for games that didn't come out recently or in English.
Hunter1
A shame that Yamato once again misses out on fighting against Polaris, but I suppose that he's certain to get a chance in the next run. Best of luck finishing things up here, once you and Daichi figure out what to actually do!
EndarkCuli
So, Yamamoto finally gets his chance to truly shine. An abundance of power can lead to bad things, but at least a world where each can excel at their own talents sounds better than one simply dominated by chaos. Not that you'll need it with so much force on your side, but good luck!
EndarkCuli
Yeah. As I understand this ending, Yamato never understood that there was more to merit than battle prowess. As a result, he would up erasing empathy from the human mind.

Before we understood what Record Breaker would be about, I tried to think about what Desu 2's eighth day routs would look like. The best I could think of for this involved:

Rerecruited party members being immune to the mass brainwashing,

The remains of the Tokyo and Nagoya factions banding together to figure something out.

Everyone getting a chance to talk with you, showing how they regret helping create this/how they've been warped by by Polaris' rewrite (but not to the point of being unrecognizable. sociopath!Daichi still reminisces over your old bff days, for instance.) Eventually, the subject changes to how they shouldn't have trusted someone who didn't try to understand the world as it was with the responsibility of changing it.

The climax would involve the heroic faction, led by Makoto/Otome/Io/Hinako/Daichi, (depending on who is still alive and sane) trying to take down Yamato, with the protagonist given the option of who to support. However, there's a time limit. Since Yamato did remember to put the rest of earth back, there's now a bunch of superpowers with itchy trigger fingers out to conquer the globe - starting with the one place that seems conspicuously wrecked for no apparent reason...

In contrast, Ronaldo's eighth day would revolve around Keita being the one criminal mind left on Earth, until another outside context villain showed up.
Mysterion
I think that the ruins of Tokyo are just offscreen. But yes, this is basically a new Pangaea that the remnants of Japan will need to tame from square 1. And there's no telling what Al Saiduq pulled from the Record to populate it. Even so, the odds are in their favor.

That's almost certainly what Yamato was referring to in his final speech. By forcing a new beginning, Hibiki gave up the possibility of getting the erased Earth and everyone's old lives back. (Yamato and Ronaldo almost certainly had the continents and cities put back the way they were, just with the people brainwashed.)
Mysterion
Didn't Amane also revive teams outside of battle when you fight her in Yuzu's route?
megami-hime
I don't think so - I've never once seen her do so.
ComicX6
She does. Unless you can run her out of MP without dying to Magic Yang Almighty attacks, she'll keep the battle going indefinitely.
Mysterion
After poking around Youtube I stand corrected. I must've always attacked that mission's enemies in an order that prevented her from reviving them.
ComicX6 (edited by: ComicX6)
...So, should we expect any last routes on DS 2, or are you going to wait the week or for Record Breaker to come out?
Hunter1
There's just 1.5 more endings to go through. I'm sure we'll see it here first.
Mysterion
Since there's only one ending left (technically there are two, but they're nigh-identical save for a small-but-important addition) my plan is to cover that one and then when Record Breaker comes out my plan is to do another playthrough of the Septentrione arc on my own to see what, if anything is changed from the original game aside from Polaris's gender, play a little bit of the Triangulum arc to familiarize myself with it somewhat, come up with things to talk about, etc., then pick this liveblog right back up with the new content if I don't go insane from playing the original story a sixth time first.

Expect the final Septentrione arc update to come on or around Record Breaker's release date. (also I swear I didn't plan for it and the previous game's liveblog to have the exact same number of updates)
ComicX6 (edited by: ComicX6)
Thanks for taking the time to properly cover the Devil Survivor series; it's been wonderful to read your coverage of content, and thoughts about games that clearly meant a lot to you. Best of luck with the re-release; let's survive it together!
EndarkCuli
Interesting.
Hunter1
With my build, I found it easier to snipe Zozma first with a Vile or Dragon, then unload with magic on the remaining parts.
Mysterion
I've always been very reluctant to use Dragons and Viles thanks to the latter's movement speed penalty and the lack of extra turns. The part at the start where you're forced to use a Bai Suzhen didn't help my impression either. I was also afraid that Nemean Howl would absolutely murder an Orcus.
ComicX6
...Yeah, the Skytree is a rather recent thing, isn't it?

Also, where's the option to tell Io to consider casual clothes? Seriously, those three options leave a lot to be desired...
Hunter1
My reading of the situation is that the fifth Bud was defeated by Jps using a method which doesn't map to a usable element. Of course, that still leaves the main body...

Meanwhile, something else doesn't add up. Miyako recruited the party for help fighting the Triangulum. Why don't we have the option to remind her of this, or ask why she's changed her mind?
Mysterion
...Interesting.
Hunter1
And so the plot thickens. Yamato may have had quite a bit of knowledge about demons, but only time will tell how Miyako's version of J Ps managed to successfully apprehend that thing. Best of luck with your future battles!
EndarkCuli
Well, we did see her use the Dragon Stream to bind Denebola after we beat in into unconsciousness/the Triangulum equivalent of. I'll bet that the lab uses stuff like the Metropolitan Government Building's magic circle to keep it in an inactive state.
ComicX6
Is it just me, or is this one of the few liveblogs that updates with any regularity these days, apart from mine? I'm not sure whether it's always been this way, or whether there's been a decline in interest in liveblogging.
Valiona
If this wasn't a SMT game the betrayal would actually be somewhat surprising, but combine that fact with the reveal of what Miyako's been hiding and it was only a matter of time. I just didn't expect it to be so soon.
Hunter1
When I played, Ronaldo got a bit suspicious that Hibiki knew about Dera Deka already, but deliberately did not press the issue.
Mysterion
Oh yeah he said that too, I just glossed over it in my summary. For those who haven't played the game, he says that it's odd that someone from Tokyo would know who Dera-Deka is (in all of Ronaldo's events in the Septentrione Arc he's never once referred to by name or nickname) and decides not to delve any further as Mysterion said.
ComicX6
Well, I've just read through quite a few installments tonight, as the last time I checked out this Liveblog was the last time I commented. But I must say, you've certainly accomplished a great deal in that time! This Arc has certainly provided you with many decent challenges, as well as a fascinating story. I certainly look forward to the exciting conclusion! And as for what that conclusion is...well, I suppose we'll find out next time, though I am a tad concerned about Ronaldo's plan. This isn't Gurren Lagann, after all...
EndarkCuli
Though this wasn't the best possible outcome, this does feel like a satisfactory conclusion. I have indeed enjoyed reading all about what Record Breaker offers, and it certainly sounds like you've had fun recording things in this Liveblog. Best of luck as you put your points to use, and try your best to cover more of what the game offers!
EndarkCuli
It's certainly been quite enjoyable to follow your adventures in these games. At last, all the Records have been Broken, and it's time to log out of Nicaea for good. I look forward to your future Liveblogs, and wish you luck when the time comes!
EndarkCuli
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/lb_comments.php?lb_id=14128851600B18992800