{{Nerdorama}}: Am I the only one who finds it odd that no women actually '''from''' NeonGenesisEvangelion wear socks like this? Or am I just being overly literal for the sake of a joke?

{{Sikon}}: Okay.... this is ridiculously obscure even by TVTW standards.

BigT: Well, apparently this is a preexisting term in describing anime. PT trumps SPOON any time.

{{Jisu}}: Well, it lost with PettingZooPeople (preexisting term: Kemonomimi), but yes, it's supposed to.

SomeSortOfTroper: When it's a generally recognised term that has managed to catch on and spread as a trope moniker beyond the constraints of genre or fanboyism, that's what's supposed to triumph... no, wait, it's not meant to triumph- it's meant to be taken as a highly beneficial argument in favours that still needs to be discussed.
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{{Koveras}}: About that latest ''The Daughter Of Twenty Faces'' entry... I dunno, can you really subvert something as material as ZettaiRyouiki? :-/

SpaceDrake: Well, I dunno. I include it primarily because the show is a larger subversion of MoeMoe in general; especially when you see the show in motion and you realize to what lengths the animators are going to avoid showing thighs (which, of course, in the modern anime environment is a ''rare'' sentiment), you can't help but think that this phenomenon is being addressed directly.

{{Koveras}}: Ah, I see, that's what you meant. ^^ Actually, the entry was a bit confusing to me so I didn't really get it... Are you OK with the way I've rewritten it?

SpaceDrake: Met you halfway. :V Yes, it's fine as it is now.

{{Koveras}}: It's settled, then. :)

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{{Nornagest}}: This article has been bugging me for a while, and I finally figured out why: the way I'm interpreting it, it doesn't actually seem to be a trope. It has no storytelling significance, and doesn't imply anything about the character -- or, if it does, it's not mentioned in the article. It hasn't even got much of the "why" material that most of the UsefulNotes pages do. It's just a reasonably common (and frankly pretty vague) character-design element, apparently based on an aesthetic that Japanese fandom finds attractive. I'll leave it up to consensus to decide whether that's significant enough to warrant an article, but if I were supreme overlord of the wiki I'd leave it out.

{{Koveras}}: Isn't there [[ThereIsNoSuchThingAsNotability No Such Thing As Notability]]?.. Besides, what harm can come from such an article? ^^

{{Nornagest}}: It's not harmful, it's just... creepy.

{{Narvi}}: You realize we have several ''other'' visual aesthetic pages?

{{Koveras}}: I take that creepy part is because it's somewhat of a SubjectiveTrope. ^^;

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Ninjacrat: Pulling this again:
* Deliberately avoided in ''TheDaughterOfTwentyFaces'': although the series seems like perfect fodder for this and every other MoeMoe archetype out there, outside of a tutu for half an episode the animators go a long way to avoid showing thighs (which, of course, is a ''rare'' sentiment in the modern anime environment) even when characters are performing complex acrobatics.
because if something isn't an example, then it doesn't go under the heading 'examples'.

LargeBluntObject: That one was called a subversion (which, going by SpaceDrake's explanation above, [[NotASubversion it plainly isn't]]), so I changed it to "deliberately avoided". Eh.

Ninjacrat: Turns out it's already been exampled under MagicSkirt. A page where it actually fits. So that's doubleplus no reason for it to be here.

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{{SpiriTsunami}}: A tragedy...our outbound link to the Anime Deshou Deshou article is now dead. Can someone track down a new link?

{{Koveras}}: Seems like the site is down, and the Google can't find where it was moved to (if at all)...

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{{Clevomon}}: How high do socks have to go before they're considered knee socks? A few characters I'm debating adding who have socks that cut off just below the knee.

michaelfeb16: The [[http://animedesho.animeblogger.net/?p=2585 link]] on the page explains the idea very well. Below the knee is Grade C - not true Zettai Ryouiki.

{{SpiriTsunami}}: Ah, you found it! Yeah, about that...Here's how you know you've been influenced too much: When you see a drawing on DeviantArt, initially rate it a Grade B, then realize that the artist put the knees in the wrong place on the legs and start debating whether or not the lack of knee coverage automatically makes it a C grade or lower or if exceptions can be made for oddly proportioned characters.

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{{Koveras}}: Wait, someone besides Tohsaka achieved Grade S?? This is blasphemy! This is madness!

{{SpiriTsunami}}: [[MemeticMutation Madness?]] [[ThisIsSparta THIS! IS! SPARTA!]] But seriously, it's hardly surprising. Once word got out that this combination was a holy trinity of {{moe}}, there were bound to be [[FollowTheLeader others]].

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Sparkykandy: Does anyone what grade sock Utau Hoshina from ''ShugoChara'' has, especially in the outfit that resembles a school uniform (aka. the first outfit we see her in. She wears it again in Volume 4 too, I believe.)? I'm asking because she already has the pigtails and the sort of tsunderish personality needed for the S grade rank. Now, I just to know if she has the needed Zettai Ryouiki too. They look either they can be either an A or B but I can't tell which grade they really are.

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{{SpiriTsunami}}: Ah, yes, the obvious question: [[NoPronunciationGuide How the hell do you]] ''[[NoPronunciationGuide pronounce]]'' "ZettaiRyouiki"? Because that cluster of vowels keeps messing me up.

{{Koveras}}: I pronounce it as it's written. :-/ "Ai" as "eye", and "iki" as "ee-ki".
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LEXicon712: Imma be the first to say: If we change the title of the article, im changing the picture as well.

{{Morven}}: Why?

LEXicon712: Wow, somebody actually heard me. Since the current picture is affiliated with the name "Zettai Ryouiki" i feel like if the title changes, so does the picture. I'll probably put a higher grade of zettai ryouiki (or a chart).
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'''[=DoKnowButchie=]''': ''" 'Absolute Territory' (zettai ryouiki in Japanese) describes the area of uncovered thigh between the skirt and the knee sock."'' Shouldn't it actually be "thigh" sock? The common definition of "knee socks" [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knee_high is "socks that stop below the knee"]], which doesn't seem to fit the tropes'
purpose.

Meems: Agreed. Zettai Ryouiki need over-the-knee socks or thigh highs. On an unrelated note, that Anime Deshou Deshou article is kind of creepy, if informative.