Created By: HeartBurnKid on April 3, 2008
Nuked

You're not allowed to like that!

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Trope
I've been seeing a few examples of this pop up on “Stop Having Fun” Guys, and I'm wondering if it's splittable. Basically, it's when fans of something are told that they shouldn't like that something, because it's somehow inferior.

Examples:
  • "Real Musicians" vs. Guitar Hero and Rock Band players. Most of you have probably seen this somewhere already; when amateur musicians tell players of the games that their hobby is stupid and they should learn to play a real guitar.
  • Stage Magic fans and Professional Wrestling fans have a common foe: the people who insist on telling you that "It's fake!". Thank you, Captain Obvious, now let us enjoy it.
  • As well, anybody who has ever watched anything animated is sure to be told at some point that they're too old to watch that, and it's for kids and therefore valueless.
Community Feedback Replies: 80
  • April 3, 2008
    BobbyG
    Fans of lonelygirl15 are probably pretty sick of being told that the series is fake, too. Yes, we know it's not real; neither is EastEnders, and people still watch that.

    Speaking of which, soap operas. And mainstream pop music. In fact, just about everything listed under Dead Horse Genre.

    On the other end of the spectrum you have "geek" interests, like science fiction, fantasy, classic literature, etc.
  • April 3, 2008
    Pteryx
    I'd say this is definitely different from Stop Having Fun Guys. That trope is about people who insist that the One True Way to enjoy something is the way they're best at. This is more about the Party Pooper who insists that an activity shouldn't be fun in any way.
  • April 3, 2008
    JethroQWalrustitty
    Aw man, as a rap fan, I get a lot of this.

    But is it a trope? Off course, there' Animation Age Ghetto and the likes...
  • April 3, 2008
    BobbyG
    I think this should be the supertrope of Animation Age Ghetto and Dead Horse Genre.
  • April 3, 2008
    FalconPain
    I always thought Stop Having Fun Guys was basically criticizing people for not treating something as Serious Business.

    For a quick list of examples of this trope, you could always go to Dis Continuity and click the "related to" link.
  • April 3, 2008
    Withad
    Happens a lot with Video Games. Anything without photo-realistic graphics and guns tends to get called kiddy, regardless of how it plays. Goes double for any retro games (or even games that just aren't current gen). Similar to the Rock Band / Guitar Hero one is the old and annoying question of "Why are you playing Sport Game 2008 when you could be outside playing actual Sport?"
  • April 3, 2008
    MrOnimusha
    Somebody find the XKCD comic that perfectly illustrates the first, Rock Band example. That's just short of made made for the trope.
  • April 3, 2008
    Withad
  • April 3, 2008
    LordTNK
    Movie critics say most audiences must be schmucks for liking big budget blockbusters, particularly Michael Bay movies.
  • April 3, 2008
    Scooter007
    Anime vs western animation, anyone?
  • April 3, 2008
    Masami Phoenix
    It needs to launch with this picture: http://xkcd.com/359/

    Looks like it was already found while I was searching for it.
  • April 3, 2008
    Mads
    I'm both a victim and a perpetrator of this. All the time. I feel terrible.
  • April 3, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    My love for '80s music gets criticized from both the "trendies" who think that one should listen to only new music and the "elitists" who think that '80s music is inferior to '60s and '70s music.

    There also the attitude that if you Led Zeppelin, then you can't also like Linkin Park - or else you're not a "true fan", or something like that.
  • April 3, 2008
    Sir Psycho Sexy
    Also see Guilty Pleasure in addition to the other tropes people have already named so far.
  • April 3, 2008
    ShayGuy
    I've never met anybody who actually said stuff like "You do know it's fake, right?" But then, I don't watch lonelygirl15, Professional Wrestling, or (regularly) stage magic.

    Hell, LG 15 says what it is right on the page.
  • April 3, 2008
    BobbyG
    @ Shay Guy: You'd be surprised how often people leave comments on YouTube along the lines of "FAKE!!!" on every LG 15 video.

    I think there are different levels. Claim to like My Chemical Romance, and the chances are you're liable to be called an emo. Say that you like Pendulum, and odds are somebody will call you a chav. But say that you like a progressive band like Camel, and people will just stare at you in total disgust. That's my experience, anyway.
  • April 3, 2008
    EponymousKid
    Pteryx: "That trope is about people who insist that the One True Way to enjoy something is the way they're best at"

    ...The Scrub? Or, I guess that sounds like Stop Having Fun Guys, too.
  • April 3, 2008
    SonTenks
    God this annoys me. Yes, I know playing Guitar Hero isn't the same as the real guitar. I play the PIANO. Hero is my chance to rock out, and I like to do it spectacularly. If I wanted to waste my time learning another instrument, I would.
  • April 3, 2008
    Octal
    Ctrl Alt Del has a somewhat more violent take on this.
  • April 3, 2008
    Radioactive Zombie
    Encyclopedia Dramtica and Your Webcomic is Bad and you Should Feel Bad are rather extreme examples.

    IDM gets you weird-ass looks.

    And since when is Pendulum chavvy?
  • April 3, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Happens with Halo, which fans of "real" FP Ses love to bash.

    Fans of JRP Gs and WRP Gs do this to each other.
  • April 3, 2008
    joeyjojo
    By the way letting the guitar is less difficult than it looks and well worth the effort. I should know my sister became a throw to my guitar after i discovered World Of Warcraft. okay i'll wasted my life haven't I?
  • April 3, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Man, my dad was telling me about the cartoon thing just a couple hours ago, before I saw this entry... when he was in the military, he and a couple of other guys were watching like Saturday morning cartoons... I think he said they were on an aircraft carrier, can't recall... and some higher-up walked by and read them the riot act for being immature enough to enjoy children's cartoons.

    I'm so glad that the Japanese have this straight. If Japanese salarymen can read manga on the subway to work every morning, at least I have a culture to point out as an example of how comic art and animation don't have to be childish, or surrendered when you get to be a certain age.

    As C. S. Lewis said (paraphrase): "When I became a man, I put away childish things... like the fear of looking childish and the desire to be All Grown Up."
  • April 4, 2008
    HeartBurnKid
    @Shay Guy: As a wrestling fan, I get it all the time. Most recent I can remember was from my mom's now-ex-boyfriend at Christmas last year. Heck, at one point, it even happened on this very wiki (on the Serious Business page, somebody made an example bashing pro-wrestling fandom for taking a fake sport seriously; fortunately, it got axed within a few minutes for being too flame-y, and then got Lost Forever in The Great Crash).
  • April 4, 2008
    GracieLizzie
    Or the Fourth Doctor: "There's no point being grown-up if you can't be childish sometimes."

    Oh and I'd like to point out that the "Japanese treat anime like art" is a misconception. Yes manga is acceptable for all ages, but anime (aside from some things like Miyazaki movies) still is seen as the reserve of children or Otaku, generally speaking.
  • April 4, 2008
    VioletStrange
    Fans of musical theatre get this all the time, usually in the form of "You do realize that no one ever bursts into a song and dance in real life, right?" I've heard the 'unrealistic' claim from people who refuse to watch anything without aliens half the time.
  • April 4, 2008
    BobbyG
    @ Radioactive Zombie: Beats me. But try admitting to liking Pendulum around here, and someone will almost certainly accuse you of being a chav. Trust me, it's happened to me more than once, and I'm as nerdy as they come.

    Edit: That's "around here" as in Gloucestershire, England, not as in this website.
  • April 4, 2008
    JRandomUser
    From what I've read, lonelygirl15 doesn't sound like a remotely realistic series in the first place.

    One could argue that those who dismiss 300 because of historical inaccuracy are falling into this trope.
  • April 4, 2008
    Roland
    As one of those 300-dismissers, what irritates me is less the historical inaccuracies per se- I mean, most historical drama requires some major rewriting to fit modern expectations and simplify events- and more the fact that their use of quotes shows they did the research on Sparta, then completely ignored about half of how it actually worked so as to portray a pseudo-badass macho-man master race. :-) (And I liked the phalanx scene! Why'd they have to stop that and go back to generic Awesome Swording?)

    That, and calling the acting "wooden" is being charitable.

    Definitely split-worthy though.
  • April 4, 2008
    BobbyG
    @ Roland: I'm pretty sure Delios is meant to be an Unreliable Narrator.

    Edit: And sure enough, the page says as much, though only by Word Of God.
  • April 4, 2008
    Roland
    Delios would have still known about how the Spartan government actually worked. Like how the ephors were essentially elected representatives, or how they didn't have a Senate, just an asembly where voting was only done by acclimation of yes or no. Or how there were two kings who only served as military leaders.

    Or how he replaced the Athenian fleet with a convenient thunderstorm.

    Yes, all minutiae, I know, but it just paints an utterly different picture of what happened.
  • April 4, 2008
    Radioactive Zombie
    Strange. I listen to Pendulum and get labeled a techno-guy, which... isn't bad.
  • April 4, 2008
    Tanto
    It would be nice if Pendulum had a more precise genre besides "electronica", but they don't.
  • April 5, 2008
    BobbyG
    @ Tanto: Well, they do incorporate elements of rock and D&B. It's not always wise to shoehorn musicians into genres.
  • April 5, 2008
    Otempora
    @ Violet Strange -- Definitely. If you like musical thatre, people automatically assume that you're a sterotypically dippy actor type.

    Also, since I don't watch Greys Anatomy or Gossip Girl, most of my classmates assume that I don't watch TV. At all.
  • April 5, 2008
    WilliamWideWeb
    "Anything without photo-realistic graphics and guns tends to get called kiddy, regardless of how it plays." I've seen the opposite--dare to state that you like a modern FPS on Slashdot and you get called out for *gasp* liking games that have good graphics!

    This seems to have two sides:
    • The elitists hating anything "commoner"
    • The anti-elitists hating anything "elitist"

  • April 5, 2008
    Pteryx
    Back on topic, what do we call this? Party Pooper seems straightforward enough...
  • April 6, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Morgan Wick: Heck, at one point, it even happened on this very wiki (on the Serious Business page, somebody made an example bashing pro-wrestling fandom for taking a fake sport seriously; fortunately, it got axed within a few minutes for being too flame-y, and then got Lost Forever in The Great Crash).

    Objection. I believe I may have been the one to add that, and my point was not supposed to be that wrestling fans think it's real, it's that wrestling fans tend to fixate on it more than some people do real sports. Read up about the whole subculture (heck, maybe even out-and-out culture) surrounding it and tell me pro wrestling fans don't need a reality check. There are several entire websites devoted to nothing but wrestling news, and even a print publication devoted to the wrestling news of the day. For you non-wrestling fans, I Am Not Making This Up.
  • April 6, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Morgan Wick continued due to IE 7 error: I'm a wrestling watcher myself but an objective assessment of wrestling would see it as basically just another TV show, and you'd never see this much coverage just for Lost. (Then again, it's also described as a "male soap opera" and I've seen print publications on grocery store magazine racks devoted to the plot twists of soap operas - not even getting into insider news, at least as far as I can tell, like the wrestling rags - and soaps aren't even nearly as popular!)

    Back on topic: I was shocked to find out anyone still treats LG 15 as though they need to remind anyone it's fake, but while you'd need to be a complete idiot to think stage magic is real if you're over 12 or so, I can't imagine why anyone would be into stage magic regardless. I mean, isn't a lot of it repetitive after a while? It's not telling any real story, as far as I know. I better not find out there's a Stage Magic Observer floating around out there.

    (Flaming not intended.)
  • April 6, 2008
    BobbyG
    @ Morgan Wick: Stage magic is a laugh. And occassionally you do see something more unusual, and it's fun to try working out how they did it. The better the trick, the more difficult this is. I'm not really a massive fan of it, but that's the appeal.
  • April 6, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Son Tenks: I'm sure there is a Stage Observer Monthly. The appeal of stage magic is seeing a good trick done well, regardless of if you've seen it before or know how it's done.
  • April 6, 2008
    Octal
    @Morgan Wick: What they said. Besides, you could say the same thing (repetitive, no story) about pretty much every sport ever(...except maybe pro wrestling, judging from what I've seen on this wiki), but people still watch those. Or shows like The Price Is Right.
  • April 6, 2008
    TheAffableParanoiac
    Here's a list of things that I like that could fit here

    • Chick Flicks
    • Prog Rock
    • Showtunes
    • Comedy music would probably fit here if everyone I associate with didn't like it too
    • Heavy Metal

    there's probably more stuff... meh

  • April 6, 2008
    ilikejawbreaker
    My dad used to say that comics were childish and inherently stupid, so I pointed out that sequential art goes back as far as the Bayeux Tapestry.

    But, um. Yeah. My guiltiest pleasure is that I like Fall Out Boy. And Safety Dance. And the movie of Interview With The Vampire. I should definitely stop now...
  • April 6, 2008
    LordTNK
    Well at the very least, we know this is a trope, even if in Real Life, rather than fiction.
  • April 7, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    bump
  • April 7, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Morgan Wick: What they said. Besides, you could say the same thing (repetitive, no story) about pretty much every sport ever Well, in SM there's no real competitive aspect; in sports you often root for one side or the other, and the outcome is completely unknown.
  • April 8, 2008
    VioletStrange
    @ Otempora: Heh. When in reality, I'm actually a stereotypically surly techie type. Leads to unpleasant confusion.

    I know this is a fiction trope as well, but it's one of those invisibly pervasive ones that I'm having trouble pinning down exact references for. The only one I can think of specifically is an episode Friends implied that anyone who'd read LOTR was a geek. (Pre-movies. Has this one died, then?)
  • April 8, 2008
    ilikejawbreaker
    I thought that episode of Friends was making fun of Joey for not recognising the character of Gandalf because he doesn't read books? I don't know, I mean he is kind of a well known literary figure, like Mr Darcy or Fagin or Huck Finn or Jane Eyre or Heathcliff or something...

    J.D.'s music taste in Scrubs? (based around a lot of 80s Power Ballads) and the "horse with a sword" he draws on his diary?

    I think this happens a lot in sitcoms, actually, where the rest of the cast will tease an individual for liking something silly.
  • April 8, 2008
    VioletStrange
    I didn't get that impression-- given that Joey's comeback to "You never read LOTR?" was "No, I had sex" and neither Chandler nor Ross were given a comeback, good or sad, it certainly seemed like the writer was invoking the Reading= Sexless Geek trope. And I have now officially put too much thought into that exchange.

    JD's diary is another instance of the 'JD's a girl' theme, since the horse with a sword is actually a unicorn if I recall correctly, so I'm not sure that fits here. Music might be a case, since I can recall other instances of someone liking music of the wrong age-- usually anything that doesn't date from their teen years-- being considered sad for various reasons. Supernaturals pilot had Sam mocking Dean for listening to "The greatest hits of mullet rock" as he put it and implying that needed to be corrected immediately.
  • April 8, 2008
    Sikon
    Why is sex treated like the most important/desirable thing in life, anyway?
  • April 8, 2008
    VioletStrange
    Because an existential quest for personal fulfillment and happiness doesn't make for snappy one liners to segue into commercials. Much easier just to go for the sex/money/food/power; leaves more room for blandly attractive guest stars and product placement deals.
  • April 24, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Bumping this because it it trope-worthy. Also, I think Party Pooper is a good name.
  • April 24, 2008
    HeartBurnKid
    Let's make this Up For Grabs -- once again, I have a good idea, but don't really know where to begin.

    And to Morgan Wick: You know, I could say some very unflattering things about certain people on this wiki's fixation with shows like Buffy The Vampire Slayer or Avatar The Last Airbender -- but I don't, because we're all obsessive fans of something, and I don't feel like stepping on anybody's toes before they step on mine first. If we weren't, we wouldn't be here. Heavens forfend anybody should like a different form of entertainment than you.

    Hell, I don't see you calling out soap opera fans (who also have their own magazine) or comic book fans (Wizard ring a bell?). And there are Star Wars magazines, Star Trek magazines, etc -- and those are professionally-produced, sold-in-bookstores magazines to boot, not the pile of cheap newsprint put together by fans that the Wrestling Observer is. Frankly, your comment on the Serious Business page and your comment in this YKTTW is a prime example of this very thing -- you apply a double standard to another fandom because what they like is "lamer" than what you like.
  • April 24, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Tzintzuntzan: Feels like a variant on Dead Horse Genre and Guilty Pleasures. Things that are considered socially unacceptable in public. I think Guilty Pleasures covers this already, unless (like the Dead Horse Genre page) it covers primarily the critics' reactions.
  • April 24, 2008
    concatenated
    • Many, illiterate morons still consider readers and guys with any knowledge of science to be pathetic losers.
    • Communism: Anyone who supports it in America will be ostracized and probably lose his citizenship.
    • Computers in general are often associated with losers.
    • Foreigners, Blacks, Jews, Gypsys, Albinos, Polish, Frenchmen, etc: Most men are still racists and may kill those who encourage racial diversity.
  • April 24, 2008
    concatenated
    Music from the 1980s. Grand Theft Auto: Vice City had a great soundtrack but most players probably considered it repetitive and annoying.
  • April 24, 2008
    LordTNK
    "I think Guilty Pleasures covers this already, unless (like the Dead Horse Genre page) it covers primarily the critics' reactions."

    That is the difference.
  • April 24, 2008
    ilikejawbreaker
    concatenated: that game had Danzig on the soundtrack, how could it fail?
  • April 24, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Two camps of extremists:
    • 1. the trendies who think you're only supposed to like things that are popular.
    • 2. the anti-trendies who think you're only supposed to like things that are not popular.

    A prime example of something that gets rejected by both groups: '80s music!
  • April 25, 2008
    Doug S. Machina
    @Violet Strange: "Because an existential quest for personal fulfillment and happiness doesn't make for snappy one liners to segue into commercials."

    This comment is Made Of Win. I like Youre Not Supposed To Like That as the title.

    Once, the scoring on a quiz in Focus, a popular science magazine, told you that you were a sad nerd and needed to get out more if scored high, and cheered you as well-adjusted if you flunked it.

    Does the Margaret Atwood quote, that Oryx & Crake (a novel about cloning), can't be science fiction because SF is "talking squid in space" count here?
  • April 25, 2008
    FalconPain
    The Focus example reminds me of far too many examples of secret messages placed into works of entertainment that, when discovered, inform the discoverers that they are losers for taking the time to find them. (This is common in backward masking.)
  • April 25, 2008
    Doug S. Machina
    That reminds me of the fake copyright warning in Fight Club which only appears for a second. If you freeze it, it tell you to go out, do things, prove you're not just a statistic. And stop wasting your life freeze-framing DVDs.

    I found the anti-knowledge message in Focus magazine quite surprising.
  • April 25, 2008
    LordTNK
    Now mocking Moral Guardians for wasting time looking for subliminal messages in rock, is a different matter.
  • April 25, 2008
    Doug S. Machina
    "Do it." But we digress.

    Oh, no we don't. I thought this was another ykttw, Cant Beat Them Then Join Them.

    But really, it's "you shouldn't listen to that it's evil" where the other suggestions are "you shouldn't like that, it's rubbish/sad/childish."
  • April 25, 2008
    LordTNK
    Since this is apparenly Up For Grabs, I'd like to launch this, but aside from Party Pooper, what name should this have? The OP title is too long.
  • April 25, 2008
    Dioschorium
  • April 25, 2008
    LordTNK
    Dead Horse Entertainment, as this is closely related to Dead Horse Genre?
  • April 25, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    "Happens a lot with Video Games. Anything without photo-realistic graphics and guns tends to get called kiddy, regardless of how it plays. Goes double for any retro games (or even games that just aren't current gen)."

    Combine that with Ratings Are The Gospel and you have people unhappy with the fact that people are buying low-rated games. Talk of this seems to be worse lately with Nintendo's push into the casual market, creating fears that third-partys won't have the incentive to make anything hardcore, much less push the Wii's hardware.
  • April 26, 2008
    UnknownTroper
    Dane Cook and Carlos Mencia are two examples of stand-up comedians you're not supposed to laugh at.
  • April 26, 2008
    Mr Initial Man
    The bit about animation especially goes if it features Talking Animals.
  • April 26, 2008
    WilliamWideWeb
    I'm going to hate 80s music as long as it gets played on "classic rock" stations and 90s rock doesn't.
  • April 26, 2008
    GracieLizzie
    Give it a few years and '90s rock will methinks.
  • April 26, 2008
    HeartBurnKid
    My local classic rock station (KLOS) plays '90s music. Well, up till about '95, anyway.

    It's kinda fun to hear Led Zeppelin followed immediately by Nirvana.
  • April 26, 2008
    Tanto
    Communism: Anyone who supports it in America will be ostracized and probably lose his citizenship.

    ...Eh? There's a socialist Congressman, as I recall. Someone's living in the fifties, although how they found their way to the Internet I'll never know.
  • April 26, 2008
    Doug S. Machina
    @Tanto: I'm imagining a sprawling, patched-together computer like something from Fallout.or Twelve Monkeys.

    Soon 90s music will be on radio Gold stations, if it isn't already.
  • April 26, 2008
    LordTNK
    Is anyone going to launch this? Or have we not decided on a name?
  • April 28, 2008
    LordTNK
    If no one objects, I will launch this in a few hours as Fan Haters, since that it basically what these people do.
  • April 28, 2008
    FalconPain
    I remember the first time I heard an oldies station play "U Can't Touch This"...
  • April 28, 2008
    movie007
    No objection! In fact, I'm completely in favour! :)
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/discussion.php?id=ifag5d2i&trope=FanHaters