Line #39 YMMV/Warhammer


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3	* AlternativeCharacterInterpretation: The motivations behind every faction and race can be read in many different ways:
4	** Depending on your point of view ([[DependingOnTheWriter or that of the writer]]) TheEmpire is either [[HighFantasy an enlightened, civilized, and honorable nation]], [[LowFantasy a corrupt wreck that's about to fall apart at any moment]], [[DarkFantasy or a brutally powerful dictatorship which holds effective control over the civilized world]].
5	** Likewise, Bretonnia is either the hallmark of feudal chivalry with brave knights and steadfast peasant archers, a bucolic alternative to Empire or a haughty feudal state with snobbish, foolhardy and clueless aristocracy and DungAges downtrodden peasants no better than slaves.
6	** The forces of Chaos, in stark contrast to their ''40k'' counterparts, can actually be considered to be in a gray area, as they have their own deep warrior culture and aren't actually doing anything worse than their counterparts (for a measure), since their raiding and pillaging is completely in-line with their culture's morality. They still worship Daemons and their gods want to destroy the world though.
7	** An entirely humorous interpretation of Archaon the Everchosen among Warhammer players is that he went insane upon realizing that he was the designated villain/antichrist character in the background lore of a tabletop figurines game [[SelfDeprecatingHumor played by man-children]]. His MediumAwareness powers both his knowingly ironic assumption of his role and his desire to destroy everything.
8	** Are the Dwarfs being bitter sticks in mud because they desperately feel the need to save what's left of their kingdoms from the many incursions of Greenskins and Skaven and betrayals they got over the centuries and thus have sympathetic motives, or are they just LawfulStupid grudge-obsessed and self-righteous maniacs who would turn against their human allies and go into self-destructive wars [[DisproportionateRetribution just to avenge minor and petty offenses?]]
9	* AluminumChristmasTrees: Helblaster Volley Gun looks like a product of pure imagination, but it is based on an obscure [[http://www.feuerwaffen.ch/index_htm_files/Draw_18_Organ.pdf Swiss organ gun]] designed in early 17th century by Bendicht Halbysen. Repeating pistols and rifles are also close to [[http://www.vikingsword.com/vb/showthread.php?p=141167 real-world]] [[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Matchlock#/media/File:Drehling_GNM_W1984_ca_1580.jpg counterparts]] of a corresponding era.
10	* AwesomeEgo: In other cases, a person who refuses to ever, under any circumstance, consider themselves even vaguely subordinate to someone else would be an an unlikable, impossibly arrogant individual. Settra the Imperishable however, does this while rejecting an offer from the Chaos Gods themselves to be able to conquer everything in reality under their banner which is of course, awesome.
11	* BrokenBase:
12	** Pretty much every new Army Book set off the base in some manner, with certain "exploits" coming to the fore immediately, and some taking a good deal of time to get revealed. 8th Edition completely altered the previous tactics ("Multiple Small Units" or MSU, which featured tiny units, a super-Lord and War Machines to make unrealistic (and unintended by the game designers) but highly-competitive armies) -- instead, large units then became a mainstay.
13	** Generally, every new army book would simultaneously break ''two'' bases -- players of the opposing armies would complain about how many great things the new army got, or how their features were better than the features of the other players' armies; the players of the new army book would complain about all of the flaws springing from the new army book, or how they couldn't play the way they used to. A perfect example is the 8th edition High Elves book: rival players immediately broke into an uproar over how powerful the Frost Phoenix and Book of Hoeth were. Many High Elf players immediately complained when the Dark Elf book came out with some tricks that were noticeably better than their High Elf versions.
14	** Much like in the ''40k'' fandom, any time Matt Ward indulged his habit of retconning previously established lore was met with negative reactions. The same goes with Robin Cruddace.
15	** [[TabletopGame/WarhammerTheEndTimes The End Times]]. On the one hand, many fans love it for being [[{{Gotterdammerung}} the epic, final culmination of the great struggles wracking the universe]], putting an end to the [[StatusQuoIsGod long stasis and stagnant nature of the setting]] and [[AnyoneCanDie making character death a real possibility]]. On the other, many fans hate it for introducing [[AssPull questionable]] {{Retcon}}s, [[DeusExMachina not always handling its storylines gracefully]], and [[TorchTheFranchiseAndRun almost literally destroying the setting altogether]]. That said, pretty much all of the fandom agrees that the ending of the story was not good, and very few people think it ended up being as good as they were hoping.
16	** The 6th edition version of Bretonnia is considered either a great DeconstructiveParody of medieval society or just painfully and needlessly dark.
17	* CompleteMonster: See [[Monster/{{Warhammer}} here]].
18	* CreatorsPet:
19	** Grimgor Ironhide. Many fans disliked him for replacing a better thought-out Black Orc character, but the writers loved him, having him stop Archaon at the last minute rather than any of the characters set up as Archaon's ACTUAL enemies (though this was due to the results of the White Dwarf campaign, not authorial fiat).
20	** Talking about Archaon, he would have gotten nowhere in the Storm of Chaos campaign, had the organizers not opted to [[TheGMIsACheatingBastard make it more "dramatic"]]. Needless to say, some on the side of Order complained about the blatant favoritism.
21	* EnsembleDarkhorse:
22	** Many were found, given the game's long existence. To name a few; the Night Goblin warlord Skarsnik, the Chaos champion Wulfrik the Wanderer, the archmage Balthazar Gelt and the Tomb Queen Khalida. They are special characters who are not the main leaders of their factions, yet feature in their own stories outside the army books.
23	** Scyla Anfinngrim, the only one of the original Champions of Chaos to return in the latest army book, despite being basically a slightly tougher Chaos Spawn with magic resistance.
24	** [[https://1d4chan.org/wiki/Slambo Slambo]], a generic axe-wielding Chaos Warrior model from an early edition. Thanks to his old-school design and unique "viking halo" helmet, he’s been adopted as something of a mascot by the portions of the community still flying the old colors in the wake of the [[TabletopGame/WarhammerAgeOfSigmar changes]] wrought by the End Times. This surge of popularity even earned him a new official resin model in 2017.
25	** When it comes to factions, despite them [[OutOfFocus not getting their own army books for many years]] the Chaos Dwarfs maintain a dedicated fanbase.
26	** Cathay is surprisingly popular despite not even being a playable faction, with a dedicated fanbase who wants to see it become playable. Fans got their wish with ''VideoGame/TotalWarWarhammerIII'' announcing Cathay as a playable faction, and a starting one, not as DLC like they were expecting.
27	* EvilIsCool: The Forces of Chaos, Dark Elves and the Skaven have some lovely little toys.
28	* FandomRivalry:
29	** With fans of ''VideoGame/WarCraft'', mostly caused by the PopCultureUrbanLegends about the first ''Warcraft'' game, ''Orcs & Humans'', being originally intended to be a ''Warhammer'' game before Games Workshop stopped Blizzard to protect their IP.
30	** With fans of ''TabletopGame/Warhammer40000'' for [[MorePopularSpinOff taking most of the spotlights from Warhammer Fantasy]], and ''TabletopGame/WarhammerAgeOfSigmar'' for outright replacing ''Warhammer Fantasy''.
31	%%** Also with ''TabletopGame/KingsOfWar''.
32	* FanNickname:
33	** Slann Mage-Priests, are, of course, [[{{WesternAnimation/Futurama}} the Hypnotoad]].
34	** The Skaven Hellpit Abomination is sometimes known as the A-Bomb.
35	** The Warriors of Chaos are often known as some variation of "Heavy-Metal Vikings".
36	** The Dark Elves have a monster called the Kharibdyss -- the ludicrously-difficult spelling all but ensured that, within a week, players were calling it "the K-Beast" instead.
37	** Alarielle the Everqueen is also known as the "Everwaifu".
38	** The Chaos Dwarfs are sometimes called by the shorthand nickname of "Chorfs".
39	** High Elves are sometimes called "Helfs" and Dark Elves are sometimes called "Delfs".
40	** The Chaos Daemons factions that belong to their specific Chaos Gods are known as "Monogods".
41	** Lord Kroak is called something to the effect of "Prime Pepe" or "Grand Pepe Supreme".
42	* FanonDiscontinuity: A large portion of the ''Warhammer'' fandom hate everything related to ''The End Times'' and the ''Age of Sigmar'' with a passion, to the point that they consider ''VideoGame/TotalWarWarhammer''[[note]] ''Total War: Warhammer'' entirely ignores everything about the End Times and keeps the ''Warhammer'' world as it was before that event occurred[[/note]] the real continuation of the setting. The fan-made ''[[TabletopGame/TheNinthAge Fantasy Battles: The Ninth Age]]'' and ''Warhammer Armies Project'' were created purely so players could effectively ignore anything regarding The End Times or the Age of Sigmar and continue playing Warhammer.
43	* FetishRetardant: Slaanesh has so much Nightmare Fuel about him that, even though he is a god of desire, it's hard to actually be aroused by anything about him or his followers.
44	* GameBreaker:
45	** Daemons of Chaos are probably the most infamous example in 7th edition. They're essentially a [[ACommanderIsYou Brute force/Elitist]] type army, so one would think that balancing out their powerful units would be done by their cost. WRONG! Not only was the whole army REALLY strong, but everything had a Ward save (a saving throw against attacks that's usually rare because you can't have it be altered or ignored by anything -- most armies would usually have them on really expensive units, not ''everything''), everything caused Fear or Terror, and the army's magic was not only powerful, but incredibly under-priced for what it did. All of this basically meant most enemy armies would be running scared or dead before they had much chance to actually fight back, and even the Vampire Counts and Dark Elves that were considered the best armies after it struggled against them. Current rules Nerfed them, however, with limits place on magic and fear and terror effects getting being nowhere nearly as deadly as they used to be.
46	** Immediately post 8th edition, the Lizardmen became this way mainly due to changes in magic (Slann were allowed an extra dice for ''each spell roll''). Ironic given that the book was strong but balanced in 7th edition. The 8th edition Lizardmen book fixed several of the issues, while creating new issues.
47	** The High Elf book in 7th and 8th Edition features a big one in The Banner of the World Dragon. It effectively neuters many enemy Characters attempting to fight the unit with the Banner (outright immunity against Magical Attacks in 7th Edition, and a 2+ Ward Save against Magical Attacks in 8th, and most Characters would naturally have magical weapons), and basically renders that unit unkillable to Daemon Armies. Even their Frostheart Phoenix is extremely dangerous, packing a -1 to Hit De-Buff on the enemy unit.
48	* GenreTurningPoint: In the mid-1980s, the game popularised fantasy in {{Wargaming}}, which had until then been dominated by historical games, and along with ''TabletopGame/{{Battletech}}'', which did the same for science fiction, brought a new generation into the hobby.
49	* GermansLoveDavidHasselhoff: Americans Love Lizardmen and Skaven. The two armies aren't that popular in Britain, but over the Atlantic, they're both very commonly collected.
50	* HighTierScrappy:
51	** The seventh edition Daemons of Chaos are a strong contender for the single most unbalanced faction Games Workshop has ever released in ''any'' of their games. The entire army had ward saves, every single unit caused Fear or Terror, their magic was insane, and half the army was undercosted for what it did. The book was so imbalanced and caused such a huge disparity in the power levels of the game that after its release, virtually every high-level tournament consisted almost entirely of Daemon armies and a small number of armies specifically tailored to fight daemons. To give an idea of how reviled the daemons of this era were, it is widely believed by the fanbase that the imbalance created by the daemons was part of what caused GW to rush out eighth edition - probably the single-most controversial edition of the game, from a rules perspective - which ultimately wound up being the last edition of the game altogether. When a healthy chunk of the fans blame an army book for killing off the entire setting, you know it's pretty bad.
52	** From the same era, Dark Elves were pretty much the most reviled army other than Daemons, due to having army-wide Hatred, some of the best characters in the game both for combat lords and spellcasting, and generally undercosted units.
53	** On a unit level, High Elf Phoenix Guard in eighth edition were easily one of the best units in the entire game. For 15 points-per-model, you got a unit that hit most things on a 3+ at S4, had Always Strikes First and Fight in Extra Rank, and had pretty solid protection with Heavy Armour and a 4+(!!) ward save. And for the icing on the cake, they were a Special choice, meaning they didn't use up any of your hotly contested Rare point allocations. If you were facing High Elves, you could count on seeing at least one large unit of these things, and quite often two, and there were few good ways of dealing with them thanks to their great saves. This could be made even worse if they had the presence to take...
54	** The Banner of the World Dragon is a High Elf magic banner that makes a solid bid for the most hated piece of wargear in the game. On the surface, it doesn't seem too bad - it gives every model in the unit carrying it a 2+ ward save against Magic Spells and Magical Attacks... but the problem is that any character with a Magic Weapon (i.e. pretty much any of them geared up to be a menace in combat) always gets Magical Attacks, meaning this banner could completely neuter even the scariest close combat meat-grinder. From Chaos Lords to Dark Elf Dreadlords to Vampire Lords, all of them were rendered impotent by this one banner. Notably, this was one of the few things that could cause serious headaches for the otherwise nigh-unstoppable Daemons of Chaos, as every single model in that army had magical attacks.
55	*** Ironic, as the Banner received an incredible nerf over its previous incarnation.
56	* HilariousInHindsight: The Great Taurus, a giant red bull with wings used by the Chaos Dwarfs as a monstrous mount, becomes quite funny if you remember the slogan of a [[Creator/RedBull certain energy drink.]]
57	* LoveToHate:
58	** Nagash is quite possibly [[CompleteMonster the evilest character in the entire setting]], discounting the Forces of Chaos, but he manages to make up for it by being a memorable character with an interesting depth and lore surrounding him as well as being a powerful badass and maintaining a sense of genuine threat throughout stories that feature him as a major player.
59	** The Skaven are a cowardly, backstabbing bunch of man-rats with [[AlwaysChaoticEvil any redeeming character traits nowhere in sight]], but their over-the-top and hammy nature, interesting use of weaponry, and a good amount of memorable characters like Queek Headtaker and Deathmaster Snikch have made them quite endearing to much in the fandom.
60	* LowTierScrappy:
61	** Beastmen have been one of, if not ''the'' lowest-tiered army in the game pretty much since they were spun off as their own army in seventh edition. A complete lack of armour, overpriced units, low leadership almost across the board, generally lacklustre magic gear, and an army special ability (Beastmen Ambush) that was far too reliant on luck to be useful all combined to make one of the least viable armies in the game. Basically the only way to play them and have a reasonable chance of victory was to spam chariots, and even then it was a band-aid fix at best.
62	** Bretonnia's last ever army book was released in ''2003'', two editions and 11 years before the game was axed. As a result, by the time eighth edition rolled around, the army rules were woefully out of date and painfully underpowered. Most tournaments included house rules that loosened up some of their restrictions to give them a bit more of a fighting chance.
63	** The Tomb Kings weren't quite as underpowered as the other two above, and could still readily win games if played competently, but they were widely seen as the most difficult army to play well thanks to their quixotic rules, the fact that nothing in the army could march, their lack of decent armour, and their WeaksauceWeakness in the Hierophant (getting one specific character [almost always a SquishyWizard] in your army sniped by a cannonball or snapped in half by a close combat lord would cause your entire army to start crumbling to dust, taking automatic wounds each turn as the magic animating them dissipated).
64	** Eighth edition Daemons of Chaos were an interesting case. After their controversial seventh edition outing (see the HighTierScrappy entry for more on that), they got severe nerfing in their next book. While not hideously underpowered, they were incredibly inconsistent, as each turn they would get a random bonus or penalty that ranged from amazing (new units manifesting out of nowhere, stronger ward saves) to devastating (having your units poof out of existence, weaker ward saves). This made playing them heavily luck-based, which basically killed their ability to be played competitively.
65	* MagnificentBastard:
66	** [[GeniusBruiser Khazrak One-Eye]] is the most brilliant champion of the [[Characters/WarhammerBeastsOfChaos Beastmen]] who ever lived. Taking over by defeating his mentor, but sparing him and keeping one of his horns for respect, Khazrak organized a series of raids on the Drakwald villages, luring out human forces and eventually [[HandicappedBadass losing an eye]] to [[{{archenemy}} Count Boris Todbringer]]. Khazrak proceeded to return the favor by defeating Boris and taking his eye in turn, but let him live because [[WorthyOpponent he loved matching wits with the man]]. Khazrak was responsible for the brilliant Battle of Grimminhagen where he lured in a huge force of the Empire and completely wiped them out, before resuming his brilliant raids and tactics. Uncommonly intelligent and even possessing a sense of honor not often seen to his race, Khazrak meets his death in the End Times at the hands of Boris, but not before he lures out Boris's forces to leave his city undefended and ripe to plunder by the armies of Archaon.
67	** [[VampireMonarch Count Vlad von Carstein]] is a powerful [[Characters/WarhammerVampireCounts vampire]] and the progenitor of the von Carstein bloodline. After freeing himself from the control of Nagash, Vlad resurfaces centuries later to seize control of Sylvania and uses brilliant tactics and intimidation to keep his hold, constantly coming out on top via his brilliant military tactics and political machinations. Despite his evil, Vlad [[EvenEvilHasLovedOnes deeply loves his wife Isabella]], and is one of the few villains to drive the Empire to its knees. Even in the End Times, Vlad never loses his style or redeeming qualities and ultimately dies with Isabella in a MercyKill when she is corrupted by Nurgle.
68	** [[FounderOfTheKingdom Settra the Imperishable]] sacrificed his own sons to become the Gods' chosen, and successfully led a campaign throughout Khemri, reuniting his land and preserving his nearly-dead people. Creating a golden age through his tyranny, Settra conquered not only Khemri, but progressively led a campaign, nearly conquering the entire world with his power and strategic mastery. Disappointed that he could not live long enough to conquer all of the Old World, Settra created the Mortuary Cult to revive him. When, thanks to the workings of the sorcerer Nagash, he CameBackWrong as an undead [[Characters/WarhammerTombKings Tomb King]], Settra took his land back once more, and held it effortlessly, fending off and defeating even the most powerful of invaders, such as the Norscans who raided his treasury, with ease. Even when confronted by the Chaos Gods in the End Times, Settra never surrendered, choosing to be [[DefiantToTheEnd defiant in the face of the world's end]].
69	** [[ProfessionalKiller Kouran Darkhand]] is the [[TheDragon right-hand]] of Malekith the Witch-King. Having earned his position by brilliant campaigns and ruthlessly eliminating those in his way, Kouran [[UndyingLoyalty lives to see Malekith take his place as ruler of all elf-kind]], killing and outwitting any inferior foolish enough to seek his position. A genius tactician, Kouran once [[WeHaveReserves sacrificed half an army]] to secure victory and is known and feared by all enemies to the "[[Characters/WarhammerDarkElves Druchii]]."
70	** Alith Anar saw the schism of [[Characters/WarhammerHighElves the elves]] and Malekith's treachery annihilate his entire family and home of Nagarythe. Giving in to vengeance with his warriors, Alith became the Shadow King who harried, outplayed and destroyed countless Druchii forces, slaughtering any who surrendered or fled to sow fear through the Dark Elves' ranks. Even after the Sundering, Alith continued to lead his forces to kill as many Druchii as possible with brilliant strategies, once even infiltrating their court to dance with Queen Morathi and steal from her before tricking his pursuers into drinking poison. At the End Times, Alith places the fate of the elven kingdoms above personal revenge, killing Tyrion and wounding Malekith to make the latter king of the elves but with the reminder that the Shadow King would be waiting should he ever slip back to his dark habits.
71	** [[GeniusBruiser Gorbad Ironclaw]] is a brilliant [[Characters/WarhammerGreenskins Orc]] Warboss who stood out among his typically brutish people. First taking power by [[AsskickingLeadsToLeadership defeating his enemies]] in battle, he amassed a power base of countless Orcs, even using clever tactics such as assassination. Then, after handily defeating most of the Dwarfs, Gorbad used his power to wage war on the Empire. Combining his people's might with cunning and intelligence, Gorbad outplayed and defeated most Imperial forces that opposed him, even building a makeshift bridge from debris to sack the city of Nuln. Despite being [[WoundThatWillNotHeal permanently wounded]] by opposing general Count Adolphus as he destroyed the province of Solland, Gorbad defeated Adolphus and pressed on to the Imperial capital. Despite losing many troops due to initial overconfidence and the wound, Gorbad recovered and unleashed wyverns upon the city which [[HeroKiller slew the Emperor]], and was stopped only inches from victory. Even when without most of his army and cornered by the vengeful Dwarfs on his way back to his clan, Gorbad fought valiantly and became a legend to the Greenskin people.
72	* MemeticMutation:
73	** A lot from nicknames such as the Hypnotoad for Slann, Hulking Out for when Teclis drinks his strength potion, to things like Sigmar being the Patron God of Shouting and Hammers. Also expect your opponent to declare casting Lord Kroak's spell as "I'MA CHARGIN MAH LAY-ZER!"
74	** Previous editions of the game had Dwarf armies that were quite easy to make overpowered. This led to the term "Beardy" to refer to any army or rule that is overpowered/easily abused.
75	** The Empire's fluff of the elector counts trying to keep the Skaven's existence a secret to avoid mass panic has led to fans jokingly claiming that Skaven don't exist.
76	* NauseaFuel: Ogre eating habits, Chaos mutations, and pretty much everything about the Skaven, depending on one's tolerance for rats; one of the most disgusting aspects of the Skaven are Clan Moulder's "experiments".
77	* NeverLiveItDown:
78	** While removed from later editions, you can bet everyone is never going to forget that Malekith and Morathi used to be implied to be in an incestuous relationship.
79	** Archaon will always be remembered for getting a GroinAttack from Grimgor at the end of ''Storm of Chaos''.
80	* ScrappyMechanic:
81	** High Elves in sixth edition had the "Intrigue at the Court" special rule. Instead of picking your general normally, each game the general was randomly selected from all eligible character models. This could mean that your Ld 10 Star Dragon-riding Prince was left taking orders from the Ld 8 hero-level SquishyWizard you were originally planning to have hang out on the back lines while lobbing fireballs at the enemy. High Elf players hated this rule for its unpredictability and it was done away with in their next army book.
82	** The Hierophant rule for Tomb Kings. One wizard (your highest level one who must take the Lore Nehekhara) automatically becomes the army Hierophant, which gives nominal ward save bonuses to his unit; unfortunately, if he dies, every other unit in the army starts taking automatic casualties every turn as the magic sustaining them fades away and, unlike Vampire Counts, another model cannot take over as a new Hierophant if the old one dies. This rule did a lot to make the already difficult-to-play Tomb Kings one of the hardest armies to play well.
83	* {{Squick}}: All over the place, from Malekith having his eternally forge-hot armor riveted to his bones to the origins of the Tomb Kings.
84	* TheyChangedItNowItSucks:
85	** The [[http://old-hammer.blogspot.fi/ Oldhammer]] movement, which plays the 3rd edition rules and army lists, ignoring any changes afterwards.
86	** The Fantasy Battles: The Ninth Age movement, for those who hate The End Times and Age of Sigmar and want to keep playing Warhammer.
87	* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot:
88	** Many fans were disappointed with the "Storm of Chaos" campaign, for which Games Workshop was building up the lore years beforehand just for the occasion and potentially offered many opportunities to advance the Fantasy background. What happened at the end? That Games Workshop decided to leave everything just like as it was before the campaign.
89	** The whole business of Eltharion the Blind. At one point during the sixth edition, Malekith captured Eltharion. He tortured him and removed his eyes, and sent what remained of Eltharion back to Ulthuan to strike fear into the High Elves. He made a full recovery and, full of hate to his dark cousins, organized an invasion campaign to exterminate the Dark Elves. In later editions, like the Storm of Chaos, the entire Blind story was ignored, and Eltharion remained the same as his previous incarnation.
90	* UglyCute: [[https://villains.fandom.com/wiki/File:400px-ChaosDwarf.jpg The oldschool design]] of the Chaos Dwarves with those short, stubby bodies, huge silly hats and CuteLittleFangs made them look like adorable characters from a children's book rather than the ruthless demon worshippers, slavers and weapon dealers they are intended to be.

Context YMMV / Warhammer