Line #102 YMMV/TalesOfTheAbyss


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2	%%MODERATOR NOTICE
3	%%Mohs does not qualify as a CompleteMonster per the cleanup effort.
4	%%Do not add him here.
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6	!![[center: [- [[AlternativeCharacterInterpretation/TalesSeries Alternative Character Interpretation]] \| [[AndTheFandomRejoiced/TalesSeries And The Fandom Rejoiced]] \| [[AwesomeBosses/TalesSeries Awesome Bosses]] \| [[BrokenBase/TalesSeries Broken Base]] \| [[Monster/TalesSeries Complete Monster]] \| [[DieForOurShip/TalesSeries Die For Our Ship]] \| [[GameBreaker/TalesSeries Game Breaker]] \| [[MoralEventHorizon/TalesSeries Moral Event Horizon]] \| [[Narm/TalesSeries Narm]] \| [[PlayerPunch/TalesSeries Player Punch]] \| [[RescuedFromTheScrappyHeap/TalesSeries Rescued From The Scrappy Heap]] \| [[ScrappyMechanic/TalesSeries Scrappy Mechanic]] \| [[ThatOneAchievement/TalesSeries That One Achievement]] \| [[ThatOneAttack/TalesSeries That One Attack]] \| [[ThatOneBoss/TalesSeries That One Boss]] \| [[ThatOneLevel/TalesSeries That One Level]] \| [[ThatOneSidequest/TalesSeries That One Sidequest]] \| [[TheScrappy/TalesSeries The Scrappy]] \| [[Woobie/TalesSeries The Woobie]]]]-]
7	----
8
9	* AccidentalInnuendo: In the English version. Luke learns [[DoesThisRemindYouOfAnything Sonic Thrust]] from Guy. [[HoYay At night]].
10	** [[spoiler: ''"Professor Nebilim]]... I'm coming!"''
11	** "Day in and day out, SCORE! SCORE! SCORE!"[[note]]Largo is talking about the rock, but 'score' has been used as a euphemism for getting laid [[/note]]
12	* AntiClimaxBoss:
13	** The HopelessBossFight with Asch actually isn't all that tough to beat if you have enough healing items and know how to use the free-run mechanic to perform hit-and-run tactics.
14	** The final boss isn't particularly challenging in any of his forms, and in his final form you have infinite HP and TP. Note: the infinite HP and TP phase only occurs when you have Luke and Tear in the party, and besides...what could be more satisfying than whaling on the BigBad with impunity?
15	* SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic: One of the strongest contenders for the Best Soundtrack in the VideoGame/TalesSeries title. And that's saying something.
16	** ''[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-SHM-7qMiDs Meaning of Birth]]'' and ''[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSdY8rrwafU Finish the Promise]]'', hands down.
17	** ''[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXkoICMFfYc Karma]]''. Even the [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3gaMKbv-xHU stripped-of-vocals English version]] kicks enough ass to compel you to watch the entire opening every time you boot up the game.
18	** ''[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ro3jaEeI2Tc Happiness in My Hand]]'' plays right before you head off to [[spoiler: Eldrant]]. And it's beautiful.
19	** ''[[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0hL3rgkGAtc Crimson Pride]]''. Sets perfectly the tone for the GrandFinale.
20	* BaseBreakingCharacter: Luke, big time. For some people, he's a mess of [[TheScrappy an unlikable and obnoxious character]], either because of his {{Jerkass}} attitude in the whole first act or for his {{Wangst}} during a big chunk of the third... or both. For others, he's one of the [[CharacterDevelopment best developed]], [[HiddenDepths most deep]] and (eventually) [[IronWoobie sympathetic]] main characters in video game and anime history.
21	** One moment in particular stands out that really breaks the base on Luke and his character: the WhamEpisode. [[spoiler:To what extent Akzeriuth's destruction was Luke's fault is the subject of a lot of debate. On the one hand, some people think the disaster was caused by Luke's selfishness (wanting to save the people only so he could become a hero), arrogance (believing he could save the city by himself despite having no training), failure to tell the others about the plan, and blind faith in Van, since Van's justification for kidnapping Luke was pretty transparent and contained a contradiction. After all, if Van was saving Luke from painful and horrific experiments regarding his hyperresonance, why didn't these experiments resume once Luke returned? On the other hand, some people shift the blame elsewhere, since Luke was only seven years old when all this happened. Van was a father figure to Luke for his entire life -- Luke comments that Van was the only one to praise him, scold him, and take him seriously. Van was also in a position of trust and authority, being the Commandant of the Order of Lorelei, which shows that he was well respected in the world at large (including by some of Luke's traveling companions). Plus, the fact that [[DesignatedVillain Luke was hypnotized into carrying out the final, fatal act]] means he's not entirely to blame; some of the fault must go to Van, regardless of Luke's actions. Still, the debate continues to rage among ''Tales'' fans as to how much of Akzeriuth's destruction was Luke's fault and how much others are to blame.]]
22	* BreatherBoss: Fyr Bronc, the dragon in Mount Zaleho, especially considering that the previous boss was [[spoiler:the first fight with the BigBad]] and ThatOneBoss.
23	* CreepyAwesome: Jade Curtiss can be this when he wants to be. In addition to his snark, he comes off with a rather large dose of BlackComedy, mentioning his age quite often and even joking about death and the end of the world. That said, he's still one of the most popular characters in the whole ''Tales'' fandom, regularly placing in the top 10 in character polls.
24	* CrossesTheLineTwice: Luke's abuse of Meiu is consistently PlayedForLaughs, but hits a particular zenith in one scene in which Meiu worries because the ship they're on appears to be sinking and Meiu doesn't know how to swim. Luke responds by punting Meiu offscreen and giving this line:
25	--> ''Luke: Shut up and drown!''
26	* DesignatedHero:
27	** ''The entire party'' (minus Ion) post [[spoiler:Akzeriuth]] as explained [[UnintentionallyUnsympathetic below]]. Their treatment of Luke falls flat [[spoiler: when it turns out a good chunk of them ''knew'' something in regards to the entire incident (Guy knew about Van's plans, Tear had all the reason to see Van as the BigBad, Jade had figured out key information, and Anise was [[TheMole working for Mohs]] plus Natalia heard enough of Luke's conversation with Van pre mission to be ''somewhat'' suspicious) and most of them also know at this point that Luke is actually seven years old.]]
28	** Asch is even worse. Before the reveal that Luke [[spoiler:is his replica]], he spends most of his appearances hurling abuse at people, tries to kill Luke and would have done so if not for Van and tries to make Luke kill Tear once the channel between them is open. After the reveal, [[EasilyForgiven none of this is ever brought up again]]. To top if off he constantly hurls abuse at Luke and the party outside of [[MoralityPet Natalia]], and they just accept it.
29	* DieForOurShip: Shares a page with the rest of the franchise [[DieForOurShip/TalesSeries here]].
30	* EnjoyTheStorySkipTheGame: Abyss' story is still considered one of the best, if not ''the'' best, in the series, with official polls about the series regularly having the story, characters, and setting ranked highly, and the main protagonist, Luke, is regularly discussed among players as an example of the strengths of video game story telling. Its gameplay is standard ''Tales'' fare, with its most unique aspect, the [=FoF=]/Altered Artes mechanic, being too unreliable and gimmicky to affect the strategy of battles much, so it doesn't offer anything new to those who played ''Symphonia'' or later entries.
31	* EnsembleDarkhorse: Asch in the anime, which leaves out his KickTheDog moments in the game, including his participation in the ''Tartarus'' slaughter[[note]]He arrived afterwards.[[/note]] and his attacking Tear, making him much more sympathetic.
32	** His game incarnation is one for some too if not solely for his notorious {{Narm}} moment.
33	* EvilIsCool: [[spoiler:Sync is Ion's EvilTwin, and is an antagonist. Guess which one is blessed with... martial arts skills, [[AnimeHair a slick hairstyle]] and [[MaskPower a snazzy mask]]]].
34	* FanNickname:
35	** Luke's FanNickname is Ambassador Asshat, for when he cranks up his {{Jerkass}} nature up to eleven as an ambassador to Akzeriuth. That's what happens when you give a spoiled rich kid authority and tell him that his freedom and the opportunity to work alongside his beloved father figure ride entirely on him doing an impressive job.
36	** Mr.Ending! [[spoiler:The red haired man, that could be Luke or Asch depending on viewer interpretation, who comes back at the end.]]
37	** Master Badtouch for Van due to a certain scene on the ferry to Chesedonia between him and Luke.
38	* FanPreferredCouple: [[TheWisePrince Peony]]'s canonically still pining after [[ChildhoodFriend Nephry]] even after she broke up with him to marry someone else, but it's much more common to pair him with Nephry's brother, [[MadScientist Jade]], since the two were also childhood friends themselves and [[HeterosexualLifePartners remained quite close and trusting in adulthood]].
39	* GeniusBonus: Jade's sister's name is Nephry. The minerals Jadeite and Nephrite are collectively called Jade. Also counts as FamilyThemeNaming.
40	** Jade at one point rattles off Lorelei's fonon frequency, which sounds suspiciously similar to the first dozen or so digits of pi.
41	** The ReligiousAndMythologicalThemeNaming doubles as this - Many locations that are held up by the sephiroth are actually named after the Hebrew Kabbalah.
42	** Musical terms are everywhere in the game, from the shop names, to the C. Core names, to the assumed names of the God-Generals before Asch joined up (Cantabile being who he replaced), to the positions of power within Daath.
43	* GoodBadBugs: One of the cutscenes regarding [[spoiler:Nebilim]] involves the entire party talking to Peony. It can be triggered [[spoiler:when you regain control after the DiscOneFinalDungeon & the supposed end of the game]], when Luke's your only party member. Apparently, he was [[PartyInMyPocket carrying the entire party around in his pocket]] just in case he needed them for a cutscene. Talk about CrazyPrepared.
44	** In the [=PS2=] version, it was possible to remove the disk from the system while the game continued to run. This allowed you to go literally anywhere on the world map, and by replacing the disk, visit any location early to get powerful weapons that you weren't supposed to be able to access yet, most commonly the Keterburg Casino {{Lethal Joke Weapon}}s and the Vorpal Sword.
45	* HarsherInHindsight:
46	** Guy's gynophobia becomes much less funny when you realize that it was because [[spoiler:he was buried under the corpses of many women of his house who died to protect him]].
47	** Similarly, the part when you realize that Anise's attempts to get a rich husband are not out of greed, but to free her family from their debt, [[spoiler:as well as how far she's willing to go for their sake]].
48	** Luke's bratty, entitled behavior in the first arc and how everyone [[TheFriendNobodyLikes treats him]] take on a darker edge when [[spoiler: it's revealed he's ''actually a seven year old'' forced into acting at least twice his age his whole life.]]
49	* HilariousInHindsight: Luke's blond tips to his hair (before he [[ImportantHaircut chops them off]]) is now this with the release of ''[[VideoGame/TalesOfZestiria Zestiria]]'' and ''[[VideoGame/TalesOfBerseria Berseria]]'' as in those such traits are used to signify Seraphim/Malakim with a touch of ElementalHairColors. Makes you wonder if [[spoiler:they count as foreshadowing the reveal he's [[GodInHumanForm another Lorelei]].]]
50	* HoYay:
51	** Guy's gynophobia plus his close friendship with Luke.
52	** Jade plus Dist or Peony, both of whom earn innuendo-laden comments from Guy.
53	** Luke's worshipful relationship with his "Master" Van. Luke's even got ''a giant portrait of him'' hanging up in his room[[note]]Slightly lessened if you consider that he calls Van "sensei" in the Japanese version (translates literally to "teacher", although can still be translated to "master" since Van's specifically teaching Luke combat), but the portrait's still there and so is the rest of their relationship[[/note]].
54	* ItWasHisSled:
55	** The fact that the haircut Luke gets during the game is [[ImportantHaircut his way of symbolizing that he's going to]] [[CharacterDevelopment try and change himself for the better]]. Bamco [[SpoilerOpening makes no effort to hide the fact that his hair gets cut at least sometime during the game]].
56	** Good luck playing the game beforehand without realizing that Luke gets the haircut in the first place in direct response to [[spoiler:''accidentally destroying Akzeriuth'' [[NiceJobBreakingItHero while trying to save it]] in thanks, in part, to his jackassery whilst handling the situation.]]
57	** [[spoiler:"Luke" actually being a fon replica on the original Luke fon Fabre, aka Asch, is pretty common knowledge even among people who haven't played the game.]]
58	* JerkassWoobie
59	** Anise. Her family was the victim of a con and wound up in debt. Mohs paid off the debt, but had her parents become indentured servants, leading Anise to want to earn the money to free them. Unfortunately, she does some morally dubious things to reach this goal, including wanting to marry into wealth, performing occasional scams and [[spoiler:serving as a spy for Mohs, leading to Ion's death]]. How much you sympathize with her depends on how willing you are to forgive her for the latter, spoilered act.
60	** Asch is [[spoiler: the original Luke fon Fabre who was kidnapped by Van as a child and made his way home and discovered the replica Luke and is SecretlyDying because of how Luke was born.]] However, his many KickTheDog moments throughout the game, aka attempting to murder Luke, controlling Luke to try and make him kill Tear ForTheEvulz and hurls endless emotional and verbal abuse at Luke throughout the entire game until they finally settle their differences in the final dungeon make it hard to like or pity him.
61	** Sync is not only allied with the villains but does some exceptionally cruel things [[KickTheDog for no good reason]], such as making fun of [[spoiler:Akzeriuth's destruction]] and [[spoiler:mimicking Ion's voice to guilt-trip Anise]]. However, it's difficult not to feel a drop of pity for him when you realize that he [[spoiler:was cast away along with the other unused Ion replicas and only kept around as a tool by Van]].
62	** The replicas of [[spoiler:Frings, Iemon and Mary]], among others, openly say that they don't care whether the originals live or die, a sentiment Tear says will come back to haunt them someday. Of course, they also are thrust into the world without any ability to care for themselves or people willing to care for them, and end up being persecuted, exploited and [[spoiler:used to destroy the miasma]]. Learning that the villains are not coming for them drives them over the DespairEventHorizon, and prompts them to [[spoiler:sacrifice themselves to neutralize the miasma]] in the hopes of finding a place where the surviving replicas can live.
63	** Dist is shown to be a lonely man emotionally stunted and lost from childhood trauma who desperately wants things to be back to when he was happy. Despite this, the way he goes about it is far from okay, making it understandable why Jade refuses to acknowledge him until he finally gets over it.
64	** Luke pre ImportantHaircut. He's a spoiled ShelteredAristocrat who can be a massive Jerkass. At the same time, he's woefully unequipped to deal with various things, has the life experiences of a seven year old [[spoiler:and later turns out to actually be one]], and is utterly [[HeroicBSOD horrified]] when he kills [[WhatMeasureIsAMook a person]]. He also has no experience with normal relationships (or friends for that matter) and is desperate to prove himself while also dealing with ''everyone'' basically wanting him to remember everything before his kidnapping ie they basically are all saying they '''hate''' this Luke and don't see him as the "real" one.
65	* LauncherOfAThousandShips: Luke. From how the fandom handles it, he ''really'' gets around from [[ScrewYourself Asch]] to Anise.
66	* LowTierLetdown: Natalia is often seen as the worst of the playable cast. The main reason is she is a CombatMedic who focuses on single target support artes and healing, which is very useful yes, but lacks the very useful healing and buffing Tear has at higher levels, and is outdone combat wise by Luke, Guy, and Anise. At later levels, Tear's healing is more important because of Mystic Artes, and other powerful spells that hit most of the arena, while Natalia will be stuck having to heal one person at a time and risking a party member being killed during the process. She still is useful, and is flexible in what she can do for optional content, but Tear is more useful compared to her.
67	* MagnificentBastard: When [[EvilMentor Van Grants]] learned that the Score predicted that the world would end, he decided to avoid this fate by destroying the world, [[OmnicidalManiac killing all of its inhabitants]], and creating a replica world in its stead. To accomplish this, Van pretended to be a loyal adherent to the Score, fooling nearly everyone in the Order of Lorelei so he could advance in rank to command the Order's military. When one of Van's plans hinged on Luke surviving his death that was foretold in the Score, Van kidnapped Luke and [[CaptureAndReplicate replaced him with a replica]], [[FrameUp framing the deed]] on the rival empire of Malkuth. Van is incredibly charismatic, capable of making his enemies into his loyal followers and is always one step ahead of the heroes. In the end, all of the heroes [[WorthyOpponent can't help but respect him]] despite his crimes.
68	* MemeticMutation: In Japan, Luke's line, "It's not my fault!" has become memetic enough that anytime his [[Creator/ChihiroSuzuki Japanese seiyuu]] shows up in the Tales of Festivals, this line will always show up.
69	* MemeticTroll: Jade Curtiss has had this reputation cemented by the fandom for his ''many'' contributions to the comedic parts of the game and the thing most will remember about him first is his constant tendency to screw with virtually everybody in the game.
70	* MoralEventHorizon: Go [[MoralEventHorizon/TalesSeries here]].
71	* {{Narm}}: The scene just before the final showdown between Luke and Asch. It's fine for the most part, and then it gets to the very end...
72	-->'''Asch''' ''(with a deadpan expression on his face)'': Well said. I will make those words your last, [[spoiler:'''''[[ChewingTheScenery REPLICAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!]]''''']]
73	** Thanks to an unfortunate choice of dramatic arm movement, Tear's breasts briefly bounce during a cutscene that takes place ''in the middle of fighting the final boss''. It lasts for less than a second and they only bounce a slight distance rather than going over the top, so it's perfectly possible not to notice it. But if you DO notice, it's incredibly out of place.
74	** The whole game is riddled with this in general due to the technology limitations of the time. DullSurprise and some LargeHam bits that don't mesh with the rest can make what are meant to be dramatic or heartrending situations rather jarring instead.
75	** Special mention goes to the cutscene where [[spoiler: Malkuth and Kimlasca go to war]]. The moment is supposed to be horrifying, but [[SpecialEffectsFailure the animation is...]] [[OffModel questionable at best]], looking like blobs of triangles crashing into eachother.
76	** [[spoiler: Mohs']] mind degenerating from their OneWingedAngel form is supposed to be horrifying. The scene where the process almost completes features them ''flying all over the screen like a deflating balloon'' while repeating "Score" over and over. It's... a little hard to take seriously.
77	* NoYay: In two parts of the game, during the Absorption Gate and night before the assault on Eldrant, the main group breaks up into pairs, with ShipTease at least between the first two pairings. Luke and Tear are, of course, the OfficialCouple and get the most ShipTease. Concerning Guy and Natalia, they are only three years apart, since she is eighteen and he is twenty-one. So far, so good. However, the final pairing is Jade/Anise, a thirty-four-year-old man and a thirteen-year-old girl.
78	** Tear/Luke can be this in general depending on how you view Luke's [[YoungerThanTheyLook age]] when put together with his CharacterDevelopment. [[spoiler: Since Luke is, in fact, only seven years old and it's known well that by the whole party, Tear can come off unintentionally creepy and give the impression of someone who takes advantage of a child's PrecociousCrush.]] This leads into ''any'' pairing with Luke in it being {{Squick}} to some extent.
79	* OneTruePairing: Luke and Tear. One of the few examples in the entire ''Tales'' series where the FanPreferredCouple (HoYay pairings notwithstanding) is completely supported by the canon.
80	* PlayerPunch:
81	** [[spoiler:Mohs killing Ion (he dies)]].
82	** Tear [[spoiler:finding out she's dying (she doesn't, thanks to one of Ion's final acts)]].
83	** Luke [[spoiler:finding out ''he's'' dying (whether he does is debatable)... take your pick.]]
84	** [[spoiler: Seeing that little boy drown in miasma at Akzeriuth.]]
85	** Later on, [[spoiler:meeting a woman whose husband and son were in Akzeriuth, the latter having come to visit the former]].
86	** [[spoiler: Asch's death. Not only an antagonist, but one ''we'' just had a final duel with five minutes ago... But it still hurts.]]
87	** The death of [[spoiler: General Frings...''especially'' if you did his adorable romance sidequest...''for nothing''...]]
88	* RewatchBonus: Luke's rude and dickish behavior as well as his somewhat childlike dialogue for much of the game becomes more understandable and more obvious once the player knows that [[spoiler: Luke is actually only 7.]]
89	* ShipsThatPassInTheNight: Arietta x Sync is pretty popular shipping, despite the fact that the two characters never interact in the game nor in the anime and Arietta is clearly in love with Ion. [[spoiler:The fact that Sync is Ion's replica helps though.]]
90	* {{Squick}}: Luke is the MrFanservice of the game, what with his belly baring outfit that shows off his impressive abs and various other costumes that even do away with shirts all together. Why is this under squick? [[spoiler: Because despite looking like a teenager, he's actually ''[[YoungerThanTheyLook seven years old]]'' due to being a replica.]] This also makes the Tear/Luke pairing cringeworthy as well.
91	* UnintentionallySympathetic: Though Luke is an incredible ass about it, he's not exactly wrong when he says "[[NeverMyFault It's not my fault!]]" in regards to [[spoiler: Akzeriuth.]] One can blame him for being an arrogant ass about things [[spoiler: but as Van tricked him and then forced him into destroying Akzeriuth, there's only so much a [[YoungerThanTheyLook seven year old]] can do in regards to his ParentalSubstitute turning out to be the BigBad. While plenty of the rest of the party (Tear, Guy, and Jade in particular) possessed information that would have had a good chance of adverting events if they had brought it up. Luke, on the other hand, was handicapped from the start and that's without bringing in the fact he was sent ''knowing'' he would, according to the Score, destroy Akzeriuth and himself so they could kick off a war. The BrokenAesop on the main page also points out no one gave Luke a ''good'' reason to distrust Van aside from saying he should think more critically.]]
92	* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic:
93	** Mohs [[spoiler:devolves into a mindless OneWingedAngel, and after the party finally fights and kills him, they "feel kind of bad", noting that he was obsessed with the Score to the very end, and [[DeliberateValuesDissonance there was a time when his actions would have been seen as justified]]. Considering what kind of person he was, holding Anise's parents hostage and forcing her to be TheMole and then killing Fon Master Ion (who was chronologically ''two'') it's virtually impossible to feel that he didn't deserve it.]]
94	** Anise. [[spoiler: She betrays the party, almost gets them killed, flat-out DOES get Ion killed, and kills Arietta rather than talking things out with her when she has the chance]]. It doesn't help that, compared to Luke, Anise looks like she gets away with this (a case of ValuesDissonance) despite being directly aware of her actions and not having the same excuses Luke has for being LockedOutOfTheLoop.
95	** Asch can be this, considering that before the reveal that Luke [[spoiler:is his replica]], he spends most of his appearances hurling abuse at people, tries to kill Luke and would have done so if not for Van and tries to make Luke kill Tear once the channel between them is open. After the reveal, he constantly hurls abuse at Luke and the party outside of [[MoralityPet Natalia]] up until he and Luke finally accept one another at Eldrant [[spoiler: and dies shortly after.]]
96	** For that matter ''the entire party'' falls under this and/or DesignatedHero in regards to how they treat Luke. Many players felt like the party members blaming Luke for [[spoiler: the destruction of Akzeriuth]] is hypocritical as the major reason that Luke ended up trusting Van was because, despite being shown he's ''extremely'' sheltered and has no idea how the world works (including having to be taught the concept of shopping) while being functionally ''seven'' due to his amnesia [[spoiler: and is eventually revealed to ''[[YoungerThanTheyLook actually be seven]]'']], they regularly ignored him, berated him for understandably not knowing things, told him to shut up when he demanded to know things, and '''refused''' to explain why he ''shouldn't'' do the thing that led to [[spoiler: Akzeriuth]] or why not trust Van. With Van thus being the ReasonableAuthorityFigure ''and'' a ParentalSubstitute to Luke, why wouldn't Luke trust him over the so-called "friends" of his? And they don't get better even after Luke's ImportantHaircut! Though Guy genuinely means well and admits to his own part to play in the disaster, he's very wishy-washy about defending Luke against the others' comments and actions. [[DisproportionateRetribution Tear flat out says he's to blame]] and ''encourages'' Luke's GuiltComplex, while Jade and Anise continue to berate him and, in Anise's case, ''[[DisproportionateRetribution encourage him to die]]''. By the time they actually start treating Luke better, he's a massive mess mentally speaking and it's way too late for him to be able to take their advice.
97	** The BigBad. His status as a WoobieDestroyerOfWorlds gets hard to swallow when you take into account his hypocrisy, the sheer amount of people he's killed, and his treatment of ''both'' Asch and Luke. It's hard to consider him well intentioned when he spends so much time doing ''incredibly'' wrong things for the sake of his goals.
98	* ValuesDissonance:
99	** Luke [[spoiler: (Well, Asch... ItMakesSenseInContext)]] and Natalia's betrothal, as first cousins. Due to their status as nobles, no one even so much as bats an eye. This is because Auldrant seems to use a world-wide [[FantasyCounterpartCulture medieval-like setting.]] In Medieval times as well as other periods, nobles were anything but unknown for marrying within the close family. [[spoiler:It later turns out that Natalia is not biologically related to Luke]].
100	** Near the end, Jade offers Luke his left hand in a handshake. In Japan, this is seen as respectful (as it's done with the shield arm, showing that one is willing to let their guard down in front of someone else). Westerners might find this odd, as it's not as respectful in Western territories (since, in Medieval times, people apparently wiped their butts with their left hands).
101	** The fallout of Akzeriuth, and the party seemingly blaming Luke for it, can come across as strange to a Western player compared to someone from Japan. The party all seem to call out Luke for how he isn't taking responsibility for the events that unfolded, making it seem like they are saying Luke is solely at fault for it, but in truth the party are upset Luke is claiming he isn't at fault for any part of it, and get fed up with how he is avoiding accepting any role he played in it. This is because Japan takes responsibility very seriously, and Luke refusing to accept he had a role in it at all is a sign of immaturity on his part. In the West though, while Luke played a part in it, it was the BigBad who manipulated him and made him do it, so Luke would be seen by many Westerns are being a victim of a manipulator who, while tragically made a mistake, shouldn't be treated as being responsible for the event. Jade later makes it clear that the issue wasn't that Luke played a role in Akzeriuth, it was that he refused to improve at first and denied his involvement in it, but this explanation comes later, so it makes the immediate aftermath look like everyone is blaming him over being angry he is being immature about it. The fact Luke is actually ''[[YoungerThanTheyLook seven years old]]'' doesn't help with how Western audiences see it, for the same reasons mentioned.
102	** On a related note; Anise being seemingly EasilyForgiven for betraying the party and helping Mohs. In Japan, because Anise is younger than Luke(at least, was believed so before him being a replica is revealed), the fact that Anise owns up to her mistake, apologizes, and feels guilty for it right away is supposed to be a sign of how mature she is for her age, making her situation sympathetic and why the party don't hold it against her. On top of that, because it was for her family, something taken seriously in Japan, her circumstances make sense to a Japanese player and show how mature she is. In the West though, where individual choices are weighed slightly more heavily, Anise comes across as being EasilyForgiven despite her situation, since she willingly helped Mohs and never seemed to regret it until is costed her Ion. Furthermore, compared to Luke, Western players felt she was let off the hook significantly easier; while both were not fully at fault for the situations, Luke comes across as being scapegoated by the others despite it being a mistake he made without knowing better and was forced against his will to do, while Anise knew what she was doing and still went along with it and only seemed remorseful because Ion died.
103	* ViewerGenderConfusion:
104	** Ion. He looks ''incredibly'' effeminate and has female voice actors.
105	** Jade deserves an honorable mention: GenderBlenderName, feminine pose, long hair. . . and if you can believe it, some of his concept art made him feel even more like a woman, even with short hair!
106	** Then there's Din, who runs the trade shop in Chesedonia. Din has short blonde hair and wears thick, unisex clothing. Din also doesn't get any voiced dialogue, so you have to see a specific scene where Jade inspects Din's shop to actually know Din is, in fact, a girl. Generally it's assumed she's a he.
107	* VindicatedByHistory:
108	** When it was released, it was considered... well, not ''bad'', but just sort of a ho-hum entry. Likely not helped by it following on the heels of ToughActToFollow ''VideoGame/TalesOfSymphonia''. Give or take ten years and its status has grown to be one of the most respected titles by the fanbase for its intriguing and realized ConstructedWorld, a complex plot and especially deep characterizations, its stellar soundtrack, and for improving on ''Symphonia'''s gameplay by introducing free-run, which set the standard for later 3D titles in the series. It's now regarded as having aged the best of all the 2000s-era ''Tales'' games, with various Japan only polls consistently having it among the highest rated in every category it appears in.
109	** To a similar degree, Luke as the main character. Although [[VideoGame/TalesOfVesperia Yuri Lowell]] is still the most beloved protagonist in the franchise, Luke is now widely considered as the best constructed one. Even though his {{Jerkass}} attitude at the beginning of the game can be off-putting (and the reason why he had a bum rap for some years), his ''massive'' CharacterDevelopment (by far, the biggest one in the entire franchise) makes it worth it.
110	* {{Wangst}}: Luke goes through quite a bit of this during a big part of the third act. Also, [[spoiler:if you defeat [[HopelessBossFight Asch in Yulia City]], the resulting cutscene shows Asch doing a bit of wangsting of his own after being defeated by a mere replica.]]
111	* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids: If you insert the game into your 3DS, the first thing you'll see is a RidiculouslyCuteCritter running around a ball, saying "Let's Play! Mieu! Mieu! Mieu!" Anyone unfamiliar with the series would suspect this game is for kids, when its plot includes mass-murder, some suggestive dialogue (including discussions of a party member's bust size and references to prostitution), and mild swearing (damn and hell is about as strong as it gets).
112	** It goes back farther — as a rule, there's a reason the Tales series typically has T-ratings.
113	* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotSymbolic: If you're familiar with Friedrich Nietzsche, then you may think that the title has something to do with Nietzsche's famous quote about [[HeWhoFightsMonsters The Abyss]], but it never really has any bearing on the game itself. Except with [[spoiler:Van, who started to oppose the Score after being used to destroy Hod as an innocent child, and then does the exact same thing to Luke in order to advance his plans.]]

Context YMMV / TalesOfTheAbyss