Follow TV Tropes

Following

Context YMMV / LordOfTheFlies

Go To

1%% Absolutely no Complete Monster entries are allowed here unless you come to the Special Efforts thread to justify it, and be COMPLETELY SURE it meets the criteria on the trope page and the forum's FAQ first: https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/posts.php?discussion=6vic3f9h1cy5qivsenw8llok.
2%%
3----
4* AccidentalAesop: Teach your sheltered kid survival skills. It may come in handy in the future. Being an honor student means nothing in the wild if they don't have these skills. The other big reason why everything fell apart aside from the lack of adult supervision was because the cast are all {{city mouse}}s that have no clue how to survive in the remote island, only getting by with a badly made smoke signal and rampant hunting.
5* AlternateAesopInterpretation:
6** The book was written just to say HumansAreBastards and HobbesWasRight, a TakeThat to all the RousseauWasRight works of the time. Some have read it as a [[FairForItsDay slightly friendlier]] {{a|nAesop}}esop against the racial stereotypes of the era, showing that under the wrong circumstances even British schoolboys can fall into savagery just as easily as any "inferior" cultures. Granted, said "savagery" has decidedly [[https://aspiringwarriorlibrarian.tumblr.com/post/675130071334404096/it-is-but-its-also-super-obvious-that-goldings racist overtones]] through modern eyes, but even then sends the message that [[FairForItsDay such "savagery" isn't inherent to "lesser" races but is arguably inherent to the human condition]]. And notably, Golding himself [[https://mbird.com/literature/william-golding-explains-lord-of-the-flies/ went on record]] that even the adults that rescue the kids at the end aren't as far out of "savagery" as they appear.
7** Another popular interpretation is that it is an attack on colonialism, using what happened with boys as a way of showing what really happens when all pretenses are stripped away.
8** Another interpretation is the danger of war and paranoia. The boys deteriorate partly due to their fear of the imagined "beastie", this fear grows when a soldier's corpse appears on the island, and the arrival of the naval officer and his massive warship also shows how the supposedly mature adult world isn't much better than how the boys behaved on the island.
9** [[https://storygirl000.tumblr.com/post/618313225282453504/the-real-lord-of-the-flies-what-happened-when-six Yet another interpretation]] is that it wasn't meant to be commentary on any of the above -- that the intended message was simply [[KidsAreCruel "English schoolboys are assholes"]], based on Golding's own experiences with them.
10* AngelDevilShipping:
11** Ralph and Jack. While Ralph is no saint himself, he definitely is one of the more innocent boys on the island, especially when compared to Jack. Ralph turns from an immature kid into a kind and considerate boy, plus he is completely broken in the end, while Jack starts the same as Ralph, but he goes into the opposite direction, as he becomes even more malicious, abusive and sadistic in the end. Ralph also represents the civil, moral part of the human mind, while Jack represents the primal instincts, the darkest, most savage part. Then there is the whole blonde hair-red hair contrast which strengthens this implication, as older beliefs considered fair hair to be of good will, while red hair was supposed to suggest evil.
12** Also, Simon/Roger, with Simon being one of the most innocent children on the island, while Roger is one of the most savage ones.
13* {{Anvilicious}}: The book goes about preaching its message with the subtlety of a rhino in heat.
14* SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic: Usually considered the best part about the 1990s film adaptation.
15* BigLippedAlligatorMoment: After they arrive on the island and first meet up, Ralph and Piggy play around by stripping naked and Ralph goes SkinnyDipping in a pond. This is a rather odd thing to do considering it comes after the traumatic experience of a shipwreck and during the alarming situation of realizing that they're stranded on a deserted island. Perhaps it was done as a way to calm down and clear their heads, but that's not explicitly stated.
16* BrokenBase:
17** The whole message of the book, and whether it is a bone-chillingly accurate allegory of society, or an overtly cynical examination of society that ignores man's good deeds.
18** Any mention of a genderbent version of the film will result in a... less than pretty debate.
19* CargoShip:
20** Piggy and the conch.
21** Roger and his rocks. Alternatively, Roger and his sharped-at-both-sides spear.
22** Ralph and the conch too. Also, Jack and pork.
23** Simon and the sow's head.
24* EnsembleDarkhorse: You'd be hard-pressed to find a reader who didn't like Simon. Roger as well -- at least it's nice to see one character who has no charade about what he wants out of the island.
25* FanficFuel: None of the boys' have their pasts revealed in the book (except for some details about Ralph and Piggy), we also never get to see their fates after the island.
26* FoeYayShipping: Quite a lot, between Jack and Ralph. One particular quote: ''Now it was Ralph's turn to flush but he spoke despairingly [...] "Why do you hate me?" The boys stirred uneasily, as though something indecent had been said. The silence lengthened.''
27* FridgeHorror: What will the boys, particularly Roger and Jack, be like when they become older? Could Roger, having killed Piggy and coming close to killing Ralph, be capable of much worse?
28* GeniusBonus: Jack boasts that he should be leader because he can sing C Sharp. Stupid, right? It's actually a capability of Lucifer. [[SatanicArchetype Let that sink in.]]
29* HilariousInHindsight:
30** [[WesternAnimation/SpongeBobSquarepants Using a conch shell to represent authority.]] Though that episode was likely a reference to ''Lord of the Flies.''
31** There's a number of stories about schoolteachers attempting to replicate the anarchy by leaving students alone and subtly (or blatantly) encouraging them to cause chaos, only for the students to not cause any trouble whatsoever.
32** "[[https://www.theguardian.com/books/2020/may/09/the-real-lord-of-the-flies-what-happened-when-six-boys-were-shipwrecked-for-15-months The real Lord of the Flies]]" involved six schoolboys in 1965 who stole a boat and were shipwrecked on the rocky island of 'Ata for 15 months. Unlike the novel published a decade earlier, the boys cooperated well, began each day with song and prayer, let a boy who broke his leg rest until he made a full recovery, and remained in excellent physical condition until they were rescued. The boys even kept a perpetual fire going throughout their entire shipwreck, unlike the boys in the novel who came to blows when they couldn't. After they were rescued, the man who owned the stolen boat pressed charges and they were arrested, but one of the boys had the brilliant idea to raise bail money by calling a TV station in Sydney and convincing them to create a documentary about their adventure.
33* InferredHolocaust: The navy [[spoiler:shows up at the end to rescue the boys]]. It seems like a happy ending... until you remember that a nuclear war had been going on at the start of the book, which means that Britain (and the rest of the world) is most likely in a sorry state. Not exactly the best thing to come home to after struggling for survival on a remote island.
34* MemeticMutation:
35** "I can sing C sharp."[[labelnote:Explanation]]Part of Jack's reasoning on why he should be chief.[[/labelnote]]
36** "Sucks to your ass-mar."[[labelnote:Explanation]]Ralph's CatchPhrase every time Piggy brings up his asthma.[[/labelnote]]
37** Creator/MarkTwain's [[http://imgur.com/NdPA9 Lord of the Flies]].
38** The HoYay (FoeYayShipping, too) between Jack and Ralph has become this in itself. There are some specific things that serve as sub-memes under this category:
39*** That part where Jack and Ralph get extremely embarrassed because they need to make a fire by...[[HomoeroticSubtext rubbing two sticks together.]]
40*** "Jack and Ralph smiled at each other in shy liking."
41*** When Ralph apparently stares at Jack's shorts admiringly because they're sticking to him with sweat.
42* MisaimedFandom: A recurrent idea that emerges from time to time is how a similar story would have played out with a mixed cast of boys and girls. This was addressed by Golding himself, who gave an explanation of why he went for an all-male crew (although one could still think his reasons are debatable themselves and don't take all the interest away from the idea - see TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot below).
43-->"The other thing is - why aren't they little boys AND little girls? Well, if they'd been little boys and little girls, we being who we are, sex would have raised its lovely head, and I didn't want this to be about sex. Sex is too trivial a thing to get in with a story like this, which was about the problem of evil and the problem of how people are to live together in a society, not just as lovers or man and wife."
44* MoralEventHorizon:
45** The frenzied, hysterical killing of [[spoiler:Simon]] by Jack and the other boys comes dangerously close to it. It's finally crossed (and in a very symbolic way) when Roger pushes a massive boulder down on [[spoiler:Piggy]], sending him flying off the cliff and to his death.
46** Oddly enough, [[spoiler: the killing of a sow, with metaphors to make it sound like gang rape, is supposed to be the first indication the horizon has been crossed, or, at the very least, about to be crossed]].
47* {{Narm}}:
48** [[spoiler: Piggy's death]] in the 1963 film.
49** Same moment in the 90s film as well. Especially the way Ralph screams [[BigNo "NOOOOO!"]] [[spoiler:before Piggy gets killed, and the deadpan pause after his head gets crushed]].
50** The tribal dance around the fire in the second movie. The unnecessary slow motion didn't help either.
51** Let's not forget that, with no dialog, the Lord's big scene in the 1963 movie becomes, essentially, Simon having a StaringContest with the head.
52* OneSceneWonder: The titular Lord of the Flies only appears at the end of chapter eight. However, it has an amazing impact and is probably one of the best scenes in the book.
53* OneTruePairing: Depending on the preference: Jack/Ralph is for those who like a love/hate romance, Ralph/Simon for those who love a cute, wholesome romance, Roger/Simon has the psycho bad boy get with the islands angel and finally Jack/Roger for those who are into a very dark romance between two psychos.
54* ParodyDisplacement: Far fewer people remember the works (such as Creator/JulesVerne's ''Literature/TwoYearsVacation'' and R. M. Ballantyne's ''Literature/TheCoralIsland'') that ''Lord of the Flies'' was parodying than they do ''Lord of the Flies'' itself. The fact that it ''was'' a DeconstructiveParody in the first place is also not well-known.
55* RealismInducedHorror: What makes the book chilling is that the great evil of the book is not anything supernatural or mythological, but man's depravity and inner cruelty. While the book's message is challenged, people like Jack and Roger ''do'' exist in RealLife. There is one supernatural element in the book, [[spoiler: the titular Lord of the Flies, but he insists that he's only a representation of evil, not the source of it, and may only exist as a hallucination of Simon]].
56* RetroactiveRecognition:
57** The Marine officer who rescues the boys in the 1990 film is played by the late Bob Peck, who would later go on to portray Robert Muldoon in ''Film/JurassicPark''.
58** A young Creator/JamesBadgeDale portrays Simon in the same film.
59** One of the choir boys in the 1963 film would go on to be [[Series/TheAmazingSpiderMan1978 Spider-Man]].
60* SignatureLine: Ralph's CatchPhrase "Sucks to your ass-mar" is easily the most quoted line of the book.
61* SoundtrackDissonance: A heroic triumphant reprise of "Kyrie" plays when the Naval Officer rescues the children. However, Ralph is crying for the loss of his innocence, so the music could have sounded more tragic.
62* SpecialEffectsFailure: [[spoiler:Piggy's death by boulder to the head]] is meant to be a swift and shocking moment, as well as particularly brutal. But in the 90s film, [[spoiler:the impact just has it [[StyrofoamRocks bounce off]] of his chest almost weightlessly, a cartoonishly loud "THWACK" sound, and you get a solid second of seeing an unharmed Piggy falling backwards and blatantly tossing his things to the side before the camera cuts to blood suddenly spread across his ''head''.]] Surprisingly, this is only ''half'' of the reason the scene jumps straight into {{Narm}}.
63* SuspiciouslySimilarSong: The background music piece "Bacchanalia" from the 1990 movie sounds exactly like Stravinsky's ''Rite of Spring'' with the addition of a boys' choir.
64* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: One of the main complaints about the 1990 film was how different it was from the novel and 1963 film, such as it being given a SettingUpdate to the late 80s/early 90s and [[AdaptationalNationality changing the boys from British to American.]]
65* TheyWastedAPerfectlyGoodPlot: As said above, Golding went for an all-male school because he believed that, had the book included both boys and girls, a realistic story would have inevitably focused on their budding sexuality. However, it's easy to argue that his intended topics, those of collectivity, morality and politics, would have only strengthened from including it, if anything because even non-Freudian psychology and anthropology regard sex as another ubiquitous factor in human society. (It deters from using this idea that, with all the realistic implications and [[RapeTropes possible outcomes]], doing so could have potentially turned an already dark story into something even darker.)
66* ToyShip: All of the named characters in the book are, at most, just ''barely'' pubescent. Although, this doesn't seem to stop the fandom shipping every possible ship.
67* ValuesDissonance:
68** The boys who reject order are described as "savages," paint themselves in tribal colours, hunt with spears and make ritual dances and bloody offerings to an inherently evil pagan deity, making them seen like the sort of racist caricature of polynesians that was popular amongst British empire apologists. The fact that Piggy refers to them by the n-word at one point does not help.
69*** This brings further dissonance in that their direct foil, Ralph and his group, explicitly wish to channel the "proper British spirit," framing Britishness as the upstanding moral standard to be followed. Nowadays, with the horrors of the British empire and colonialism coming to light, it is generally accepted that the British were rather more morally dubious than the indigenous people they were supposedly "civilising." Hence, it comes off less as a critique of British morals but more as one of people who decide to reject the "infallible" British ideal in favor of "inferior" ethnic ideals.
70** The '63 film had prepubescent nudity. It was completely non-sexual and realistic, but because of the PaedoHunt, modern audiences are met with shock and disgust at the film showing young boys' private parts.
71** Upon [[http://www.rogerebert.com/reviews/lord-of-the-flies-1990 reviewing]] the 1990 film version, Creator/RogerEbert argued that thanks to real-life violence amongst gang members, particularly in Chicago, where Ebert resided, the idea of kids killing each other is [[NotSoCrazyAnymore not as shocking as it was in 1954]], when the book was first published, or 1963, when the original film was released. He also wrote that when the novel was first published, readers would have most likely sided with Ralph because of his humanist leanings, yet by 1990, world politics had changed to the extent that some readers might find themselves siding with capitalist Jack.
72** When news of an all female remake was announced, there was quite a bit of backlash with the (mostly female) detractors arguing that the book was about male power and that women "[[WomenAreWiser aren't going to act like that]]" when stranded on an island. The detractors point to Golding's intent and statements about [[MenAreStrongWomenArePretty aggressive boys and more fragile girls]] as proof of his themes. However, Golding's viewpoint comes across as outdated since more critical looks on gender, its roles and even the nature of the binary would question his simple and essentialist worldview, especially given that women are now more integrated into male professions and roles, while men who espouse survival of the fittest are viewed as "[[TheSocialDarwinist toxic]]". In essence, the modern day perception is that men and women are more likely to be the product of the environment that raises them, which could also fit the theme of the story. While the biological aspects of wherever this would work or not, or if social integration is enough to override binary pre-dispositions are up for debate, no one really has a definitive answer yet.
73* WhatDoYouMeanItsForKids: The book deconstructs a contemporary genre that was popular with boys. It's a story about a group of boys surviving on their own after being stranded on an island, but it's not a fun adventure story. Things get dark and violent quickly. The book has been included in some children's reading programs, notably ones that were created by and for people who speak English as a second language, and is also a common required reading book in schools.
74* WhatDoYouMeanItsNotForKids: This book may be the UrExample of "just because it's about children doesn't mean it's for children." This mistake isn't usually made by native English speakers because of its cultural impact, but there have been cases of the book being included in English as a foreign language reading programmes for kids, presumably because the curriculum developers heard "literary classic" and "kids on a desert island" and stopped paying attention.
75* TheWoobie: Piggy. He actually hates that nickname, but even Ralph insists on calling him that. ''We never learn his actual name.'' Plus he's asthmatic, nearsighted, and almost only valued because his glasses help create the fire. While he may be a NonActionGuy, he (unlike Ralph) actually does DareToBeBadass and confronts Jack and his vicious tribe. [[spoiler:A pity it didn't save his life...]]

Top