Line #154 Headscratchers/TheElderscrollsIVOblivion


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14	!!WARNING: For reasons of avoiding large blocks of spoilered-out text, this page contains unmarked spoilers. Administrivia/YouHaveBeenWarned.
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17	* The quest, A Lonely Wanderer, doesn't make sense. So what if Faelian is killed with no witnesses? Eventually, someone will discover his corpse and might suspect that the Dark Brotherhood was involved.
18	** He's a skooma addict who you can kill inside his personal drug den. Drug overdose won't raise any eyebrows, especially when he's a commoner and guards won't have reason to suspect anything more.
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21	* Why doesn't Lucien tag along with you to Anvil after he confronts you in Bravil? Since you are both looking for the real traitor at this point, it seems to be a safe bet to travel together. On that note, how does the Black Hand find Lucien at Applewatch? Like, how did they know that he was going to be there?
22	** Remember, Dark Brotherhood agents often act alone so him tagging along with you to Anvil would be against the norm. He's likely been raised and indoctrinated into this group long enough that this makes ''more'' sense. Also, he's trying to hide while you're out in the open doing all the things you do. Even if they knew you weren't the traitor, they still think Lucien is, so all they have to do is follow you to intercept him.
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25	* Where the hell was Peryite? You'd think that if he was concerned with some random worshipers in his own realm he'd be worried about '' the very walls between Oblivion and Nirn being breached ''.
26	** Peryite is considered one of the weakest Daedric princes. Molag Bal would have eaten him up, spit him out, and made another Malacath.
27	** Who says he's ''not'' influencing the events of Oblivion? He's a ''Daedra'' just because you don't ''see'' him doesn't mean he's not involved.
28	** Peryite is the Daedric Lord of pestilence and plague, which war naturally spreads. He might actually be welcoming the whole event, seing it as a way to support his realm and possibly further his influence.
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31	* If Sheogorath can instantly kill anyone who lays hands on him, why doesn't Jyggalag do the same? They're the same guy.
32	** Because ultimately it's ''Sheogorath's'' realm. If he could do that, it would be the same as someone walking into another persons house and legally throwing them out.
33	** Mentally, Jyggalag is basically a computer (explicitly stated to have zero creativity and even less willingness to deviate from a task), so it makes sense he literally would've never thought of anything other than the most blunt (or, since he uses a sword, Bladed) possible manner to defend himself.
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36	* Your demotion after the Troll quest in the Fighters Guild. Understandable the guildmaster being upset since she just found out her son is dead, but she seems to consider it ''your'' fault despite the fact that her son was long dead by the time you found him.
37	** It was partially that she found out that you and whatshisname had been taking him on quests to get him ready to take over the guild. She didn't want him to go ANYWHERE and blamed you for getting him started.
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40	* If you become Sheogorath via the SI questline, when you needed the blood of a daedra lord couldn't you have just told Martin "Blood of a daedra lord? Sure, no problem, just let me open a vein. I'm Sheogorath you know."
41	** You are still a mortal for a while after taking over the Shivering Isles, as shown by Sheogorath's appearance in Skyrim and the fact that you need the ability to transport back to the castle when near death, true death explicitly stated in game to not affect even Dremora. It takes quite a while for the whole Lord of the Shivering Isles thing to make you a Daedric Prince.\
42	Even if you did attempt to give him your blood with the "I'm a Daedric Lord!" excuse, he'd think you were a nutjob.
43	** Consider also requisite cost. Note that any Daedric artifact you give Martin is GONE. Completely and utterly. Maybe you could offer your blood as Sheogorath, but that could possibly end up with you being incapacitated with a terminal case of not having any blood. Keeping the most powerful piece in the game is a big factor to consider.
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46	* Why is there only one bookstore in the whole Imperial City? Given how big the Imperial City supposedly is, and given that it's the Empire's center of learning, and that First Edition doesn't seem like a huge megacorporation driving out all the competition, this seems really improbable.
47	** All of the stores in the Market District seem to be monitored by a committee (the Society of Concerned Merchants) of some kind, to ensure that there is little competition - it may be that there is an enforced monopoly on bookstores. Bear in mind that while it may not be enormous, the First Edition has its proximity to the Arcane University in its favour, and it apparently has the capacity to procure rarer books like the Mythic Dawn Commentaries for its clients. Thie ability might have led to it, unintentionally or not, driving out the competition.
48	** Also, it'a game set in Medieval times. Maybe a lot of people are illiterate so there's no need for that many stores?
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51	* If nobody knows who the Grey Fox is, how can his list of crimes include tax evasion? You can't tax somebody when you don't know who they are.
52	** Honestly, would you be surprised if they tried regardless? The IRS does have a contingency plan in the event of nuclear war, after all.
53	** Knowing him he's probably boasted about it at some point. Besides He's the damn Grey Fox. If you hit him with something other than murder chances are he or one of his predecessors has done it.
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56	* Sheogorath's Quest: when you cook the supernaturally-pungent cheese to bring in the "plague of rats", why didn't any of the Khajiit in Border Watch smell it?
57	** Since Sheogorath was running the show, maybe he used his powers to pull the wool over their eyes (noses?) and keep them from detecting. Or maybe cheese cooking is a regular occurrence in Border Watch and they didn't think anything of an especially strong smelling example. Or maybe they did smell it, but they were too concerned with the rats and the prophecy to think about the ramifications...
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60	* Why has no one has bothered to clean up abandoned forts that are in plain sight of the Imperial City? You would think the Empire would try to clean up the countryside in its capital province.
61	** The Imperial Guard are stretched thin even before the emperor got killed and a bunch of daedra tried to invade. Most of the forts are not particularly ugly and off the beaten trail, so there's hardly any huge incentive to tidy them up. They simply have more important crap to worry about.
62	** Fridge Brilliance: What are forts mainly for? Defence. Where is defence needed? Certainly not the heartland of your nation. The forts that dot Cyrodiil are relics from bygone eras; the Imperial Guard is more focused maintaining the ones in fringe territories.
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65	* How is Mankar Camoran wearing the Amulet of Kings?
66	** The Camoran line shares descent with the Septims, going back to the first half of the Third Era. It's AllThereInTheManual.
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69	* The Gray Prince is the son of an orc and a human vampire. However, vampirism is a disease in this world, so there is no reason why he should even have the pale skin inherited from his father.
70	** Maybe vampirism is also partially inheritable.
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73	* Why is the Gray Prince so upset learning his heritage, anyway? Yes, to everyone else, vampires are evil, but he's proven himself to be the greatest fighter ever. Surely if they learnt that HE was part-vampire, they wouldn't do a HeelFaceTurn and order his immediate death. They'd probably go "Well, as long as he's not killing folks and/or sucking their blood, he's ok in our book."
74	** Bigotry runs wild in Cyrodiil - the general population won't care whether he was a good man, he was a vampire and that's as much as they care to know. Think of it how, years ago, any esteemed member of the aristocracy may have found themselves shunned and stripped of their power if they were discovered to be an illegitimate child - there's no logical reason behind it, but that prejudice runs deep.
75	* There's also the fact that Orks are very proud. Vampires are naturally stronger than ordinary people so he might think that he made Grand Champion because of who he was related having inherited said strength to instead of through hard work. Also, Orks worship Malacath who supports outcasts. While vampires could fall under Malacath's domain, the ordinary vampire was made from Molag Bal raping a mortal woman. Malacath, himself, was made from being eaten and tortured by another daedra, a fate as bad as the original vampire arguably. Malacath used to be a shining and honorable warrior Aedra. This would be like thinking you came from Jesus and instead came from Satan to these people.
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78	* Also, why did it take a complete stranger handing over his father's journal to learn that he was part-vampire? He never had any desire to suck blood out of people?
79	** He hadn't inherited much from his vampire dad other than the paleness. As was stated above, vampirism is a disease in the Elder Scrolls-verse, but the Grey Prince was conceived sexually. So he probably is less than half a vampire. It's unlikely he ever even had the urge to drink blood or suffered under the sun.
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82	* Why do we not get more credit solving the Oblivion Crisis? We busted our ass from ''literal'' hell and back trying to save the world and all we get is a statue in a city and a lousy set of armor. Martin, on the other hand, has done nothing up to the Battle of Bruma but sit in Cloud Ruler Temple reading a book.
83	** To be frank, Martin did the heavy lifting. Yes, we're an insanely capable knight, but that's our main trait. If not for Martin we wouldn't have been able to figure out how to solve the issue in the first place.
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86	* A later quest in the main storyline, Blood of the Divines. Jauffree says to get blood that's on the armor of Tiber Septim, who became the god Talos. Question is, how long could blood last on armor? It makes no sense for blood to still be on the armor CENTURIES after the owner died!
87	** A case of RealityisUnrealistic. Blood residue has been recovered from 100,000 year-old stone tools in real life, and that's just plain ol' mortal blood. Tiber Septim was magical divine blood.
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90	* If you complete the Arena and become Grand Champion, then go talk to the Blue Team Gladiator, he'll be very sad/disappointed that the Grey Prince is dead and bitterly tells you "Congratulations, Grand Champion. Hope it was worth it!" Um, excuse me? He should've known that sooner or later, someone was going to kill his friend in battle, and if he progressed far enough, he'd have to end up killing his buddy himself.
91	** Sure he almost certainly knew someone would eventually kill his friend, but that doesn't mean he has to be happy about it...
92	** He might have gotten into his head that, after being unbeatable for so long, the Gray Prince would just retire safe and sound.
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95	* The assassination of Uriel Septim: you, the player, are the ''sole survivor'' of said assassination - barring one Blade who ''does not leave the scene'' - but once you leave the sewers, you can travel anywhere in Tamriel, including right there in the Imperial City, and discover that the news of the Emperor's death has preceded you. How did they know?
96	** There's most certainly some enchantment. Some of the material around ''Arena'' state that one of the main reasons why Tharn put Uriel in a realm of oblivion instead of killing him was that the Elder Council would know immediately.
97	** That'd be the answer. Specifically, the dragonfires are stated to have gone out when the emperor died. Assuming it went out the instant Uriel died, anyone present would be aware something's gone down.
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100	* Why is there only Martin as a heir? None of the three sons (who were in their 50s) of Uriel VII had sons or daughters of their own? Even in the rare event that happens, any cousins of the emperor would still be heirs, just distantly. For example, the UK has 52 listed successors to the Queen. That would be a lot of heirs for the Mythic Dawn to kill off.
101	** Population of the UK in the 2013 census: 64.1 million. Population of Cyrodiil in Oblivion: 855. In terms of heir density Cyrodil's 3 legitimate and 1 illegitimate heirs is more than the UK.
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104	* Why is there a giant sized chair, club, hourglass and crystal ball in the basement of the imperial palace? They're at least 20x normal size and under guard by the imperial watch in a restricted area, which would lead one to think they're some kind of special artifacts.
105	** Some possibilities:
106	# They're leftovers from some old statues built by the previous occupants that the Septims never got around to throwing out.
107	# They're trophies from when a Septim went out slaying a giant.
108	# Given one of them is called the Glass of Time, some weird effect from one of the other artifacts caused the furniture to warp in size.
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111	* It is revealed in a very late TG quest that anyone who reads the Elder Scrolls start to progressively go blind. So when your character sees this scroll, reads it (as you do before you take it, like with any book/scroll), why is s/he not stricken with blindness?
112	** ''Seeing'' an Elder Scroll and ''reading'' an Elder Scroll are two different things. Your character most likely saw the scroll and had the same reaction you probably did: "WTF is this squiggly writing?"]]
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115	* Why do Peryite and Boethiah's planes of Oblivion look identical to Mehrunes Dagon's? Also, why can't Peryite kick the souls of his followers out of his own plane? Can't he control his plane?
116	** Boethiah apparently has influence over several planes of Oblivion; he says in his quest dialogue that "I shall open a portal for you to '''one''' of my realms," implying that he controls more than one.
117	** Peryite never says his followers are in his plane of oblivion, and makes a point of saying "I will transport you to the plane of oblivion where their souls are trapped". It's possible that because they did the ritual during Dagon's invasion, the Deadlands were simply "closer" to Tamriel than the Quagmire, so that's where their souls landed. Either that, or it's a perception thing: you are going to a deadric prince's realm so you expect to see a hellscape (One NPC in a Deadric hell realm thought it looked like a beautiful landscape).
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120	* How is it possible to poison your weapon when you're ''underwater''?
121	** WildMassGuessing: It's a non-washable paste that only reacts with blood. If the alchemy is anything to go by, most of them are just combinations of solids, anyway.
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124	* How was Lord Lovidicus locked away for so long? The only thing trapping him for those several decades was a locked wooden door. A thick wooden door sure, but he had 200 years!
125	** It is somewhat strange that he didn't break through the door as he did have items inside he could have broken apart and used to chisel his way through, but in all likelihood after so long without blood he was too feral to even register that the door was his way out, instead just blindly wandering around searching for blood.
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128	* How exactly does the Fighter's Guild operate? You pick up contracts in Cheydinhal that take me down south of Bravil, and even towards Leyawin. Then you get called to go down to Bravil from Chorral to fix up Maglir's mess. Wouldn't it make sense for the contracts to be picked up at the closest branch of the guild?
129	** The way it appears is that somebody with a contract brings it to a guildhall. If everybody there passes on the contract for whatever reason, then it gets sent along to another city. Repeat until the contract is withdrawn or somebody does the job.
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132	* Was Reynald Jemane the only resident of Chorrol that wasn't in Cheydenhal last week? Moreover, it wasn't exactly secret that Papa Jemane had twins and one was believed dead. Seems somewhat odd no one thought the town drunk supposedly randomly being in another town for no apparent reason might actually be the long lost kid.
133	*** Well, everybody else from Chorrol had apparently visited Cheydinhal, no reason for them to think Reynald wasn't there too. And, given the two were separated by an ogre attack, it's not too ridiculous to think there was no way the other could have survived.
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136	* Was your character just recently tossed in the IC jail? In the beginning of the game, Valen Dreth's dialogue implies that this is the first time he's seen you in his eleven years of being in jail. If you play as a male Dumner, he implies it when he says he hasn't seen "another Dunmer in here in I don't know how long".
137	** Your character might have just been transferred to the Imperial City's specific dungeon from another dungeon-there's one in every major city in Cyrodiil, after all. When Captain Renault questions why there's a prisoner in the cell, Glenroy says that it was probably due to a "usual mixup at the watch." Uriel Septim implies that you might have ended up in this specific cell due to direct intervention from the Nine Divines.
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140	* The Stone of Saint Alessia contract. What exactly where the ogres doing with the stone? It's mentioned they steal it because they like shiny things...then they place it carefully on a pedestal, behind a carefully locked gate, with carefully placed traps, and general behavior that seems very un-ogre like. Were they worshiping the stone?
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143	* Maglir. Why was he such a flaker? The first job, ok, that was fairly dangerous. Zombies were involved, can't fault anyone for not wanting to get involved with zombies. The second one however was as bare simple a job as a member of the fighter's guild can get...and he runs to Blackwood Company, citing more work and more pay...but if his problem was danger, cowardice, and what not, wouldn't the idea of more serious, dangerous work be a turn-off for him?
144	** Maglir was probably too much of a coward to do them, but used the "I don't get paid enough to do this" excuse. His greed probably lead him to join Blackwood, ignoring the likely danger (assuming they don't just abandon all their dangerous missions like they did with Azani Blackheart). It's likely Blackwood would've also scrapped him (or worse) before long,assuming the Hist-sap wasn't actually making him useful.
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147	* Why doesn't finishing the Fighter's Guild quest provide you with a follower? Both the Dark Brotherhood and the Mage's Guild have followers available after completion. In the Allies For Bruma/Defense of Bruma quests you should be able to go and order all the Guild Halls to reinforce Bruma.
148	** Presumably there's an assumption that if you can deal with the issues the Fighter's Guild had you don't need a follower. As for the inability to send members to Bruma, most Fighter's Guild members are not there out of loyalty to the Guild; they're mercenaries, they fight for gold. Sure, you could in theory just pay them to do so, but given some contracts pay up to 600 gold per job it's going to quickly make a dent in your wallet, and it's arguable you might be better off spending that money elsewhere.
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151	* One major plot point for Oblivion is that the Dragonfires are unlit, which allows for daedric invasion. According to pretty much every NPC in the game, this is the first time this has happened. Except...During the rule of the Akaviri potentates there was no Emperor, and during the Interregnum, the Amulet of Kings was in Sancre Tor.
152	** A few things to note:\
153	Even within the Third Era there were periods of several weeks between the death of an emperor and the coronation of an heir. The Dragonfires aren't ''too'' literal in the sense that Nirn isn't in danger the instant the flames go out, they're a representation of an agreement between the humans and Akatosh.\
154	The White-Gold Tower and the Amulet of Kings were not the only things keeping the Daedra out. There was also the Red Mountain (destroyed in ''Morrowind'') and the Numidium (destroyed in ''Daggerfall''), to name two.\
155	In ''Online'' Molag Bal did try to invade during the Interregnum. Dagon likely decided to choose to stay out of the way to avoid cosmic all-out war.
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158	* You start off in the berginning of the game in prison for some unknown crime. Why is it that this crime seems to be absolved once you escape, given how strict the justice system of Cyrodiil is?
159	** Uriel could have been right about the gods placing you in that cell (it was supposed to stay empty, after all). Him allowing you to follow along likely also carries an implicit pardon for whatever you did.
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162	* Why, when Lucien comes to recruit you for the Dark Brotherhood and you slay him (since that's the only way to refuse the questline) does the DB not send anyone after you for revenge?
163	** Getting murdered by potential recruits is likely an occupational hazard for Speakers. They're sent after sociopaths all the time, it's probable they're attacked as often as not. Besides, why would they keep messing with someone who was so insulted by an invitation to join them that they slaughtered a Speaker, one of their most elite members, in response?
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166	* During "Breaking the Siege of Kvatch", the Kvatch guards you see are the only ones remaining after the initial attack. So...where does Mattius manage to get two extra guards to send to Bruma later in the game when you're gathering up troops for its defense?
167	** Perhaps he recruited them. He may also have found survivors holed up in a burned out house or something. We only see a small bit of Kvatch, so it's possible that a few other guards got away, hunkered down somewhere, and held the line until aid arrived.
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170	* On what Martin tells you about the quest "Blood of the Divines":
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172	--> Martin: ...Unlike Daedric lords, the gods don't manifest themselves into our world. How then, to obtain the blood of the gods? But Jauffre solved it. The blood of Tiber Septim himself, who became one of the Divines. This is a secret passed down only by the blades from one Grandmaster to the next.
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174	:Martin is a priest. He obviously worshipped the Nine. So how could he not have figured it out for himself?
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176	** The ''intended'' implication was probably that the secret passed down was that Tiber Septim's armor is still around, and they know exactly where it is, so Jauffre's solution is providing the second part of your proposed reasoning - Martin doesn't have ''that'' much of a reason to think Tiber's armor is still around and still has his blood on it.
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179	* How does the Mages' Guild get away with having the protagonist hunt down all the necromancers? Their rules forbid necromancy, yes, but they explicitly mention that Imperial Law doesn't.
180	** Possibly due to some iffy gray area - note that most necromancers you kill are people in caves and dungeons and/or part of the Order of the Black Worm, so presumably the Imperial Province is okay with you going after people who most likely are immoral anyway.
181	** As one NPC tasked with it, studying Necromancy is different to practicing it. Even if Necromancy isn't outlawed directly, things like grave-robbing, desecration of corpses and murder are all outlawed. For a necromancer to actually practice necromancy, they either have to break one of those laws or have a corpse donated for some reason, which seems unlikely to happen outside of the guild itself.
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183	* During the main Quest, Martin tells you that the last item he needs is a Great Sigil Stone, which would anchor a Great Gate. In his words, "The kind of gate the Mythic Dawn opened at Kvatch". Except you CLOSED the gate at Kvatch, and presumably took THAT great sigil stone with you. Assuming you hadn't used, sold, or misplaced it, can't you just say "Actually I have one here in my back pocket."?
184	** The Kvatch gate you closed WASN'T a Great Gate. The survivors at the Kvatch camp will mention that a much larger gate was opened first (the Great Gate mentioned by Martin), but later closed by the daedra themselves. The one you close when you arrive was opened later (probably to block access to the city) and is simply a normal Oblivion gate]]. You can even see the remnants of the actual [[spoiler: Kvatch Great Gate]] if you look closely enough near the city's entrance, and they are very similar to the remains left after you close the one at [[spoiler: Bruma]].
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187	* During Martin's speech just before the Battle for Bruma, he helpfully says, "The Empire will stand or fall by what we do here today." How would the entire Empire fall if Bruma fell? The Septim Empire is pretty big, so one more smoking ruin of a city isn't exactly going to kill the Empire.
188	** It's not that destroying a random city in Cyrodiil is going to bring about the downfall of the Empire, it's that allowing the Mythic Dawn to kill Martin would.
189	** It also could be that Martin reasons if a combined alliance of every city-state, plus his champion (who may or may not be a god/reincarnated legend/head of an NGO superpower/etc), plus his elite guard made up of the best of the best of the best can't stop the enemy there, then they're handily doomed regardless.
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192	* At the end of the Thieves' Guild questline, Countess Carona of Anvil yells out to The Grey Fox, who is actually her husband that: ‘I'll deny it to the Emperor if I have to!’ with regards to the Grey Fox's true identity. She ''is'' aware the Emperor's dead, right?
193	** Force of habit. The Emperor wasn't dead for too long, and usually people will continue referring to folk they knew as if they were still alive for a while after their passing. Plus, consider even atheists will say things like "Oh my god!" in RealLife. Mentioning things by the Emperor might just be an idiomatic thing.
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196	* Why is Umaril the Unfeathered called that? What do feathers have to do with anything?
197	** Because of his unfeathered wings he had in the past, before Pelinal Whitestrake cut those off. It's mentioned in passing in "The Song of Pelinal, Book VII".
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200	* Why can't characters smuggle in more than one lockpick when they go to jail ([[AssShove you can probably figure out why]]?
201	** Antoinetta Marie implies that the imperial guard sexually assaulted her when she was their prisoner. It's not much of a stretch to assume that they're only too eager to give female convicts a very "thorough" search, but are too disgusted to check the back door.
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204	* The quest, The Elven Maiden, doesn't make sense.
205	# How did the Thieves Guild find out Myvryna was the infiltrator?
206	# Since Myvryna knows you were the one hired to do the theft, why aren't the guards trying to arrest you instead of Armand Christophe?
207	# Why, when you tell Lex the bust is in her cupboard, he doesn't suspect the least that you were the one who planted it there?
208	** Dialog seems to indicate that the Guild suspected Myvryna for a while; one can't expect to be omniscient to ''every''thing that happens. Lex's ultimate goal is to disband the Guild, which he can do by arresting the higher ups; he doesn't gain much from capturing a subordinate (you). Dialog also indicates Armand ''is'' suspicious of the cupboard thing, but consider if you accidentally pick something up that doesn't belong to you the Guards are all out for your head, it seems that Imperial law values empirical evidence more than conjecture.
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Context Headscratchers / TheElderscrollsIVOblivion