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1* GT is perhaps one of the few shows with a '''Gainax Beginning'''. First and most important, why is Pilaf even alive? Considering all that happened in Z, he should have been killed by Buu and not revived later. No Pilaf, NO GT!
2** Because Pilaf and his gang aren't evil, the fact that they are also alive in the Battle of Gods film prove that. The only villains that wouldn't be revived were those who were pure evil and the Pilaf gang don't fall in that group.The Pilaf. Hell, the Dragon revived guys like Spike, the Devilman and Giran. Really, the only villain that was still alive when Buu killed everyone on earth and likely wasn't revived would be Mercenary Tao, because he never changed.
3** Movie script?
4*** Why is Pilaf so old when in Battle of Gods him and his gang are kids? That's probably Toriyama's "screw you" to GT, since it's confirmed that GT is non-canon.
5*** It has never been confirmed that GT is non-canon since there is no official DB canon. There are just different timelines.
6*** Of course there is no DB canon, but we don't need the creators to distinguish what does and what does not influence future products set in a said universe (which is what "canon" essentially is). GT stopped being possibly canon as soon as Hell was depicted the same as DBZ filler as a way to drive the plot, and fell even further away from the possibility of being canon when movie villains cameo'ed. From the Super 17 Saga onwards, it is obvious that no future animated product would consider GT as having really happened, and this is just what occurred from 2008 (the Tarble special) onwards.
7*** I am pretty sure the alternate timeline theory has been put to rest thanks to the existence of Time rings that indicate alternate timelines in Anime/DragonBallSuper.
8*** Battle of the Gods had Pilaf's gang wish for youth offscreen before the movie even started. They're considerably older than Bulma (who's over 40 in the movie), but got aged back to kids.
9*** Plus, GT explicity states that the Dragonballs had been used 7 times. Pilaf's gang using them makes it at least 8 and Goku summoning Shenlong to learn about the Super Saiyan God is one more. With Frieza's revival, it's now 10.
10*** With Shenron being summoned to cure Pan of her sickness, we better stop counting.
11* Why not wish the Black star Dragonballs back with the regular ones?
12** Shenron isn't omnipotent when it comes to making wishes. In fact, a similar wish was asked of him in Super (Tell us the location of the Super Dragon Balls) and he promptly failed to grant it, exclaiming in the dub that "space is so very vast! I'm afraid my powers are not so almighty that I can pick but one object in its boundless expanse..."
13*** That doesn't explain why they didn't at least ''try''. While we can excuse them for not trying to use the regular Dragon Balls to wish the Namekian balls back (since in all circumstances where they needed the Namekian balls, they were able to gather them on their own), they still could've at least ''tried''. For that matter, why not ask the Namekians to try with the Namekian Dragon Balls?
14*** Shenron is omnipotent because, for example, he know what Oolong means by "the Saiyans" (Vegeta and Nappa), and he later knows where Namek is and what constitutes a Namekian; he had no trouble reviving the populace millions of light years away back in Z. That said, a sufficient excuse for GT would be to say that even an individual Black Star Ball far exceeds his power to move, since that's an established limitation and the Black Star Balls are the normal Dragon Balls up to eleven. Same of course would apply to Porunga.
15*** Okay then, why not just have Goku teach 7 members of the gang Instant Transmission and then use Shenron to wish said seven to the locations of the Black Star Dragon Balls? ''That'' would surely be within Shenron's abilities, and it would take less than a month tops.
16* Goku's skin tone has completely changed to a very tanned complexion for no reason. Nobody else seems to have had any such issues.
17** Spending a long time in the sun tends to make you very, very tanned.
18** Then it should have happened a long time ago.
19*** It should've also happened to Vegeta and Gohan, for that matter.
20** There's also Trunk's hair going from whitish-purple in Z to a more overt (but still light) shade of purple in GT.
21** For the same reason Uub has tan skin. Goku spent time training him in his home land, which was a tropical island, so he got tanned too.
22* Why did Goku lose his instant transmission technique when he was turned into a child? Apart from being a convenient way of justifying the "Grand Tour", why could he only use it as a Super Saiyan 4?
23** I think it's because as a child the first time around, he didn't know instant transmission, so his child-body wasn't used to it.
24** He also couldn't fly, turn Super Saiyan, shoot out ki blasts, and sense energy as a child but yet he kept those abilities. It's actually pretty inconsistent, and it's clearly just for the sake of plot convenience. To justify the "Grand Tour", they couldn't have Goku simply teleporting to each planet with the Dragonballs and gathering them all up with in a week or so. If they did there would be no "Grand Tour" and the series would be over in less than 10 episode. Admittedly it is bad writing.
25** It was power based. He wasn't strong enough as a child to do it properly. He actually does IT at one point and it works.....but craps out after a few yards. His child body just couldn't properly manage the techniques he used as an adult. Same reason [=SS3=] gave out after a few seconds. [=SS4=] gave him his adult body back, and let him regulate his power properly.
26** There's absolutely nothing before GT the even suggest that IT requires anymore power than turning Super Saiyan, flying, sensing ki and firing powerful ki blasts, all those abilities he also didn't have as a child either, and yet all those powers where left (for the most part) well intact. Granted IT requires more concentration since the move requires a person to be good at sensing ki. But according what fans say, Goku's ki sensing ability has improved greatly (even as a child) to the point where he can now sense robot's energy which before was impossible before. so that's really no excuse.
27** Not necessarily. Instant Transmission has a bad habit of changing its rules for the sake of the plot, but it is usually pretty consistent on one thing: Goku can only go somewhere he can sense energy. If the Dragonballs landed on a dead planet, Goku would still need a ship to get it. Also, there's no telling how difficult it would be to coordinate "the Dragon Radar says that-a-way" and "I can sense energy in that general direction". IT has been used pretty much exclusively to travel between known allies and enemies, not for scavenger hunts. Goku losing it as a child may have been bad writing, but there would have been ample reason to go on a Grand Tour regardless.
28** Goku and friends would still need a space ship to travel and collect the balls anyway. The Dragon balls have no power levels or ways to be tracked without a dragon ball radar and Goku couldn't just keep teleporting between planets if he couldn't sense anybodies power levels their or has been their before
29* The start of GT. Goku and Uub emerge from the Hyperbolic Time Chamber after their training. Never mind what Goku said earlier on that a person can only enter it twice in a lifetime or only for two years. And for some reason the whole chamber has changed from a featureless white landscape to some sort of asteroid belt-esque environment. If Goku's power level has increased the way he claims while fighting Rildo, just how long were those two training in there?
30** Perhaps it's destruction by Buu and recreation by the Dragon Balls allows it to qualify as an entire new chamber? If you wanna complain I think it makes more sense to complain about it being a fairly major plot point that only two could enter at a time in the Cell Saga (and had they gone in with more people they would have gotten better results most likely) and by the next saga it's all "Look four people can fit in here no problem!"
31** And their fight is damaging the lookout on the outside, without the need to punch dimensional holes through it. Either Goku in base form and Uub are far stronger than Majin Buu fused with everyone, or something just doesn't add up.
32** The entire lookout contains a separate pocket dimension if Z's filler Garlic Jr. Saga is to be interpreted as canon - not a far stretch considering movie characters were attacking the planet when Super 17 started. It's possible Goku and Uub could've been training in that. Hard to explain the lookout's battle damage, though.
33* GT doesn't even make sense on the relative strengths of the characters. When Kaioshin wants to restore Goku's power, Old Kaioshin tells him there's no way he can replenish the energy supply of a Super Saiyan 4. But next episode we see 3 Super Saiyans and a normal Pan do precisely just that, all of whom shouldn't even add up to Super Saiyan 2! I mean it should reasonably take at least 10000 of them to match the power of a Super Saiyan 4.
34** It gets worse in the Shadow Dragon saga where just the 3 Super Saiyans alone have enough energy to ''overload Goku'' '''beyond his normal Super Saiyan 4 limits''', never mind that GT shows him to be far stronger than all of them in '''base form'''!!
35* This is another one on Power Levels. Kid Goku in '''base form''' beats Rildo's base and claims it was stronger than Buu!!?? That's an increase beyond Super Saiyan 3! And so Kid Goku being stronger than 2 Super Saiyan 2s? In DBZ, after seven years of afterlife training, Goku's real boost came from Super Saiyan 2 and 3. His Super Saiyan form was only marginally stronger in Buu Saga and the exponential power growth in any level more or less stopped once he mastered it.
36** Speaking of Rilldo, if he's stronger than Buu, then how do you reconcile that with what happened in Z. I mean are the Kais not even remotely worried about the fate of the universe?
37** Super Saiyan Goku seems to be absurdly stronger than what the Super Saiyan level itself ought to permit. On the other side we have Vegeta, who in spite of all his training is somehow far weaker at Super Saiyan 2 and goes out in one shot against Super 17!
38** And that's not very consistent either. Base Goku can defeat Cell with the audacity of riding Frieza's disks like a surfboard but can't resist when he's frozen in ice and relies on natural body heat to melt it. Yeah...now we've seen everything.
39** On the matter of General Rildo being stronger than Buu. We saw Buu take a lot of damage from characters who were supposedly weaker than him, only to regenerate his lost parts and pull himself back together. Buu's main strength seemed to be lacking exhaustion more than anything. Maybe Goku was talking about relative physical strength pertaining to how hard Rildo could punch?
40** For whatever its worth, Rilldo being stronger than Buu is strictly a dub addition. No such line is in the original.
41* Majuub is yet another mystery. He fares much better against Baby Vegeta than Super Saiyan 3 Goku. In Super 17 saga, he goes out in one hit, proving himself to be far weaker than Super Saiyan Goku, who puts up a decent fight. What just happened to him over a few weeks?
42** Speaking of Majuub, you wonder why being stronger than Gohan, Goten, Trunks and possibly even Vegeta, he isn't giving any energy to Goku. Despite absorbing Buu, he seems to lack the ability to regenerate. What to speak of injuries, he can't even replenish his power the way Kid Buu could.
43** Uub is a human and even after merging with Buu still mostly remained human, he was kid Buu turned into a human.
44* Majuub was turned into chocolate and eaten. He can reverse the transformation, but he waits till Baby Vegeta's become a full ape and then causes a significant amount of internal damage. What was he doing till then? If he had done that while Baby was still down to size, it would have been game over then and there, (though the implications would have been BodyHorror).
45** This likely takes time to do he has to reach a certain point gather his strength, it's not likely something that happens instantly.
46* Why was Majuub not able to beat Super 17 all by himself? Both halves of Super 17 are weaker than [=SSJ2=] and both half of Majuub are about [=SSJ3=] level. You do the math something doesn't add up. And yet Goku as [=SSJ1=] did better than him when fighting Super 17. Looks like only Goku benefited from all that training they did.
47** That's already covered.
48** Forget Majuub, Piccolo should be easily capable of killing an enemy who's only twice as strong as 17 in one hit. 17 was trash the moment the ROSAT was introduced, and everyone who went in is now dozens of times stronger than 17.
49** Well to be fair it is possible that the other 17 could be much stronger than the original 17 and they their fusion could have increase their strength much more than 2 times. Of course this doesn't explain why Majuub did worst fighting against him than [=SSJ1=] Goku.
50*** Perhaps 17 has been training just like everybody else over the last few years. We know from 18 giving birth to Marron that Androids 17 & 18 are not robots. They are humans with cybernetic enhancements and we don't even know what those enhancements actually do. Presumably Android Krillin or Yamcha would be absolute monsters compared to 17 & 18 which as far as we know were just regular old humans with a power level probably beneath 10.
51*** Nope, androids don't get stronger especially 17, 18 they power level will remain the same no matter what. So they can't tire no matter how long they fight or weaker even if don't train for years but that also mean they don't get stronger even if they do train.
52*** That is pure conjecture. They have cybernetic parts that gave them their initial power yes but saying they can't train is like saying a man with a gun can't learn martial arts or a man with a forklift can't lift weights. In their case they could easily learn martial arts. I know DBZ favors raw power over technique in everything after the middle of the Namek Saga but the androids are just that, raw power with zero training. There isn't even any indication that like Android 20 they were even given full combat schematics on their opponents.
53*** WordOfGod confirms that the Androids 17 and 18 can become stronger just like a regularly human.
54*** In fact, that's what happens in ''Anime/DragonBallSuper'' - and it's ''because'' Android 17 got stronger that Goku went to recruit him when the team for Universe 7 needed more members instead of having Baba revive Frieza, [[spoiler: at least, until Buu fell asleep and they needed someone to replace him]].
55* Isn't there any way to destroy the Dragonballs without killing their creator? Can't Piccolo just deactivate the Black Star Dragonballs, or at the very least modify them? How come he just forgot about them like that? In that case, the whole plot in DBZ of getting Dende to be Earth's guardian would be totally unnecessary, wouldn't it?
56** It's certainly possible. King Piccolo back in Dragon Ball was able to disable the dragon balls by ''blowing Shenron up,'' and in the Buu saga, Piccolo warned Gotenks against recklessly throwing energy blasts around, out of fear that a stray blast might end up destroying a dragon ball.
57*** At the time of Gotenk's fight with Buu, the dragon balls were in their recharge cycle after one wish was used to bring back the people killed during the martial arts tournament debacle. When they're not charged they're just ordinary carved stone, making them vulnerable to destruction.
58** Piccolo (or anybody) should've been able to just destroy the Black Star Dragonballs very easily rather than having to make a StupidSacrifice to get rid of them. It's probably fair to say RuleOfDrama is the only real explanation here.
59** Not entirely if the Black Star Dragon Balls were on Earth than possibly but they aren't they're scattered across the universe who knows where and who knows who might find them in that time. As for deactivating them no guardian ever has deactivated the DB before. Guru didn't deactivate the Namekian Dragon Balls despite Frieza being after them. There's nothing in any of the DB shows or movies that says or even supports their creator can deactivate them since it's never happened before. So Piccolo dying was the only way to ensure their end it wasn't a stupid sacrifice.
60*** You're ignoring the fact that the Black Star Dragon Balls are completely scattered across the universe making any attempts to collect it without any knowledge of them or a radar virtually impossible( the fact that Baby, The luud cult, and Parapara brother knew about them is just a plot hole since it's never explained how they knew). There's also no reason given why they couldn't just destroy the Black Star Dragonballs if they felt he were too dangerous to exist like what Zamasu did with the Super dragon balls. So this whole BS ball being used by evil again is pretty unlike if not virtually impossible so there was really no point of him dying to prevent it. All things consider it was a completely pointless sacrifice done for the sake of drama.
61* For some reason, characters in GT, while stronger in theory than Z in fact seem much weaker when you compare the intensity of the fights to DBZ.
62** I must say I disagree with this point completely - the fact they are more powerful is ''why'' the fights are less intense. They now do so much damage with each punch; cause so many injuries with one ki wave that the battles are over far quicker. Lets take a real life example: World War 1. Our lack of technology, tactical planning, foresight and abundance of manpower still led to the second most devastating war in history, stalemating into four years of trench warfare. ''Now,'' imagine if you will, what would would happen if UsefulNotes/WW1 was repeated in the 21st century? ''Nuclear warfare.'' I can guarantee the main battle wouldn't last four years just as I can guarantee if you put the ''Dragon Ball GT'' era Z Fighters against any of the ''Dragon Ball Z'' era enemies it wouldn't have been a Saga-spanning 30 episode battle.
63** That doesn't make any sense. Because they're stronger their battles are less intense? So why wasn't that the case when you compare ''Dragon Ball Z'' to dragon ball? By that logic the fight scenes in Dragon ball should be more intense the fights in ''Dragon Ball Z'' (which they are NOT). Seriously when [=SSJ3=] Goku fought Kid Buu the force they unleashed nearly destroy the planet. It caused earthquakes, fissures, massive craters, and it rocked the Kai's planet to its foundation, forcing them to evacuate. But in GT where [=SSJ4=] Goku and [=SSJ4=] Vegeta fought omega Shenron, they barely destroyed a city. Is that because they became stronger?
64** This problem can be placed more at the originals writers feet as it was reaching a point where the characters couldn't fight without leveling cities. Super Sayian 3 nearly tore the world apart by just transforming by this logic the next transformation should destroy the world. It was just getting too ridiculous Super has hit this problem hard Goku and Beerus nearly tore apart creation during their battle what's next? It just got too big Super Sayian 4 should've destroyed planet Vegeta by just powering up, Syn powering up should've torn the Earth in half. It's just ridiculous and you can't have anyone fight or power up without sinking a continent. Toning the scale down makes complete sense.
65*** The first transformation into [=SSJ4=] not destroying the Earth despite being a more powerful form than [=SSJ3=] has one possible explanation: Goku was a kid when he used it; maybe if he went into [=SSJ4=] as an adult, ''that'' would be what would destroy the planet. After all, Gotenks going [=SSJ3=] didn't have the same effect as Goku going [=SSJ3=] did, so maybe age determines how powerful the impact of the transformation is.
66* Piccolo was hurt by a Baby possessed Gohan way back in Baby Saga. He's thrown into a trench and is gone for the rest of the saga. Then just before Goku leaves the exploding Earth, Piccolo appears again, still injured, despite the fact that he should be able to regenerate. What, did he just get so frustrated by being DemotedToExtra that he gave up the will to live all together?
67* Just one major issue. Planet Plant/Vegeta's gravity is 10x that of earth as mentioned in ''Dragon Ball Z''. So how come Mr. Satan or for that matter any of the human beings who were transported to the planet never got crushed by the heavy gravity or for that matter didn't even notice it?
68** Speaking of which it's a headscratcher how a planet with more gravity that the earth could orbit it.
69** It has more gravity on the surface. The planet could be much denser than Earth but also much smaller, giving it a smaller mass. This would give it larger gravity on the surface but less of a pull at long distances.
70** This isn't remotely correct. Gravity follows the inverse square law. More Gravity = More Mass. I don't remember the specific dialogue on the subject, but the two bodies would have orbited a shared center of gravity. It's a minor distinction as the view from either planet would make it seem like the other was orbiting it.
71** That doesn't explain the immunity to 10x gravity though.
72** Mr. Satan is considerably more powerful than we think he is. Think about it, by the time we meet Mr. Satan it's safe to assume that even the weakest Z Fighter can handle 100x gravity. Consider back to Goku's arrival on Namek and the fight with Cell. Vegeta couldn't SEE Goku's movements after training at 100x gravity. By the end of the Cell saga everybody present seems if not easily keeping up with the battle able to catch most of it. Mr. Satan could easily be very strong by any standard that doesn't involve blowing up buildings.
73** We are not just talking about Satan. Almost all the humans on earth was able to withstand 10x earth gravity in GT like it was nothing. Which is stupid, back in early DBZ Goku with a power level of 300-1000 had a hard adjusting to 10x earth gravity, but now these ordinary humans with a power level of 5 are able to walk on Planet Vegeta perfectly fine!
74** Maybe King Kai meant that the 10x Earth's gravity existed on the Sayian's original home-world, not the Planet Vegeta that they came to inhabit, which just has normal gravity. That makes sense, because the Tuffles in flashbacks appear to be similar to normal humans.
75** Except for the fact King Kai explicitly stated that Vegeta and Nappa were used to ten times Earth's gravity as well as Vegeta stating that he didn't feel the gravity increase when fighting Pui Pui in the Buu Saga. You're literally ignoring canon to grasp at straws.
76* Mr. Buu turns Satan and Pan into candy and ''eats them to keep them safe''(!!??) inside him so they can get to planet Vegeta. But even more, Mr. Satan seems to be quite ok and even speaks as a piece of candy. Who was the only one powerful enough to do things like that before? '''Vegetto'''... What?
77** I'm going to guess the handwave here is that because Buu ''wants'' him to retain his free will as a candy; Hercule has no problem whatsoever in doing it. You could also say that seeing as Vegetto was transformed by Super Buu fused with Gohan/Piccolo/Trunks/Goten as opposed to the relatively weak fat Buu it's far easier to resist whatever magics are behind this technique. For the record I agree with you that it's another one of GT's notorious plot holes but if you stretch credibility to breaking point it ''is'' possible to explain this in-universe.
78** That, or it's FridgeHorror in that the same thing happened to Buu's victims in Z, but they were still powerless to resist being digested and could only scream in horror at being eaten.
79* The fight with Super 17 is grossly exaggerated in effects compared to all the other fights in the DB universe. One punch from Goku throws Super 17 to ''the other side of the planet'' and one from the android sends him into space and beyond. Ki blasts are now able to circumnavigate the globe. Compare this with the Shadow Dragon saga where Super Saiyan 4 Goku is trying to run for his life from Omega Shenron's blasts just powerful enough to blow up parts of the roller coaster in an amusement park.
80* Anyone noticed that once 4 Super Saiyans restore Goku's Super Saiyan 4 power, he has no injuries on him, despite the fact that he was badly hurt just moments before?
81* Goku can't properly sustain Super Saiyan 2 in his kid body? What about Gohan way back in Z?
82** Gohan reached Super Saiyan 2 naturally in terms of progression, and thus was more acclimated to the form. Goku, on the other hand, not only never attained that power as a kid, but had his body magically thrown back to his child self, sending his power into flux.
83** And yet, he can perfectly maintain Super Saiyan 4 which is an even more powerful transformation. Also, how is he able to maintain a normal Super Saiyan without any issue since he didn't have that as a child either?
84*** Goku has more experience using Super Saiyan than Super Saiyan 2, thus is able to adjust to using it in his kid body more easily and Super Saiyan 4 just circumvents the issue by aging Goku back up to adulthood.
85* Why was Piccolo in Paradise instead of with Grand Kai? Was it just for drama so he'd have to be trapped in Hell instead of just going down there like Pikkon and Goku have done?
86* And why does King Yemma refuse to send Piccolo down to hell, prompting Piccolo to wipe out a lot of the afterlife...that was not a problem in DBZ.
87* And why couldn't Goku turn [=SSJ4=] and escape hell with instant transmission? Seems like all of Piccolo's sacrifices were completely unnecessary and was simply done for pointless drama.
88* In DBZ, being killed in the afterlife means becoming DeaderThanDead. In GT, Goku kills Frieza and Cell, and they just regenerate because they're already dead. [[{{Retcon}} WHAAAAAT?]]
89** Well, consider the following. Before the deader than dead rule was established, it had actually been demonstrated that someone who was killed in the afterlife simply regenerated. It was established in anime only filler, I will grant you, but there's precedent for it, is the point. Secondly, the deader than dead rule is never actually proven. It's theorized and feared, but we never see it in action. Thirdly, it's easily handwaved by saying that if ''Buu'' kills you in the afterlife, you're deader than dead, because Buu breaks the rules of the universe, but that most anyone else killing a soul in the afterlife would have no real affect.
90** Yes it was demonstrated and flat out stated in the Grand Kai filler that the dead can't die again. The only problem with your point is that is filler! which pretty much negates your whole defense. [[AdaptationInducedPlotHole Fillers in general have a tendency to created plot holes with the main story.]]Which is why they're usually disregarded by fans and the author. You're suggesting that we should total disregard a rule established '''in canon''' (granted we never saw it in action) for a rule shown only in filler and nowhere else( which basically means it never happen). I mean GT was suppose to be canon right?
91*** THAT'S the problem with your argument. GT was never canon to begin with. It's also anime-only so it's not too much of a stretch that they used something from another filler arc.
92
93*** Where on earth did you get the idea that GT was never canon to begin with? GT was only officially declared non-canon recently upon the release of Battle of the Gods back in 2013. Nearly a decade after GT was release in the U.S and over 15 year after it ended in Japan . My point is if what you're saying is true and GT was never meant to be canon from the beginning then why didn't they stated that from the beginning and not wait over 15 years after the series was already over. Not to mention the fact that many people did considered and treated GT as if it was canon up until Battle of the Gods.
94*** This question has got a very simple, in-universe answer. The first half of GT, up to the end of the Baby Saga, may have been canon back then (even though now we can safely say even that has been [[CanonDiscontinuity discontinued]]). From the Super 17 saga onward, GT could not have been canon at any given point in time, [[DeathOfTheAuthor despite]] [[WordOfGod what Toei or even Akira Toriyama himself may have said in the past]]. That is because of two reasons: first off, the depiction of Hell in the Super 17 Saga spits in the face of everything that was ever said about Hell in the manga (where Hell is never shown) and is basically the same Hell as DBZ filler, which itself is non-canon. Second, and most important, movie villains appear in that saga. Those are short cameos, to be sure, but they appear nonetheless, and movies are firmly, completely, absolutely non-canonical and have never been in any sense, shape, or form before Battle of Gods (and questionably the 2008 Tarble movie). As such, if GT considers filler and movies to drive its plot, it cannot be canonical with DBZ, at least from the Super 17 saga onwards.
95*** GT was never based on any story or manga made by Toriyama, unlike the rest of DBZ. The only thing from GT made by Toriyama is Super Saiyan 4. GT is practically a filler series, but I digress.
96*** Canon means "approved by the author" not written by him. Otherwhise every Batman comic in the last 50 years would be noncanon.
97*** Actually, Toriyama didn't design Super Saiyan 4. It was design by Katsuyoshi Nakatsuru. What Toriyama did design is kid Goku, Pan, Trunks, and Vegeta with his infamous mustache. He also designed the space ship and Giru, as well as did some concept arts. He even came up with the name Grand Tour. He had nothing to do with the overall story, however.
98* Why did they even try to used the Earth dragon balls to revive Krillin anyway? He already been revived by them once. So they can't do it again! It wouldn't had worked even if the Earth Dragon balls had not been over used.
99** Also how the hell was Shenron able to bring Krillin back to life?! The Earth Dragon ball can't revive a person more than once. This was a major plot point in DBZ.
100** That goes double for many of the people on earth who had been Cell's victims in DBZ.
101** '''And''' as per the GT files, Android 17 was also brought back to life by the same wish, which shouldn't be possible either as he was already brought back after Cell's destruction.
102** Actually, when Dende was brought over to be the new guardian, they changed the rules for the balls when he recreated them so that they were more like Porunga's set. One of the things they did was remove the limit on how many times people can be revived, which is why the likes of Yamcha, Tien and even Krillin are still alive once everything is said and done at the end of the Buu saga and the start of GT.
103*** There so much wrong with what you just said that I almost don't even know where to start. First off when Dende change the Earth Dragon Balls he kept that rule intact to save energy that's why Goku couldn't brought back after he died in the cell game. Second, Yamcha, and Tien were never revived using the Earths Dragon Balls. They were revived with Porunga's set in the Frieza Saga (did you even watch DBZ or even TFS parody because even they got this right). So Yamcha and Tien can both STILL can be revived with earth ones. Third, the Z-figthers use Porunga's set to revive everyone at end of the Buu saga, not the Earth ones. They only used the Earth Dragon Balls to revive everyone Majin Vegeta killed, and to erase everyone's memory of Majin Buu. So yeah Krilin and 17 shouldn't have been brought back to life with Earth Dragon Balls.
104* Actually you're wrong, if you watch DBZ, Dende says he fixed the Earths Dragon Balls to two wishes and can make the same wish more than once. The only reason Goku didn't come back was because he denied their wish to bring him back he said the earth was better off with him dead go rewards that episode again.
105** Sorry but once again that is completely wrong . If you actually go back and watch [[https://youtu.be/b_0AJOc01kw?t=8m23s the episode]] Sheron clearly says that he can't revive Goku because he had already been revived once before not because he magically resisted being resurrected. and [[https://youtu.be/b_0AJOc01kw?t=9m1s Piccolo even says that Sheron can't revive someone more than once only Porunga can.]]
106* Why didn't they just kill Dende when the Shadow Dragons popped up? Or use the Namek balls to wish the negative energy away? If they killed Dende, it would deactivate the balls, killing the dragons. Then go to Namek, wish him back, with the stipulation that the Earth Dragon Balls don't reactivate. Then make new Dragon Balls, and bring everyone back with them.
107** Oh good idea. Ask a bunch of {{Blood Knight}}s who are also very sensitive about their friends and loved ones being hurt, to kill one of their friends so they can avoid fighting some really powerful opponents, and pray to God you won't get a boot to the head as an answer.
108** Killing Dende would have killed the '''Original''' Shenron effortlessly but it is pretty ridiculous to imagine that the Shadow Dragons weren't completely self-sustaining entities; realistically the last point you could have executed that plan was when the final crack appeared on the final Dragonball. Incidentally, if it ''was'' a viable tactic you wouldn't have needed to kill Dende at all but rather destroy the Shenron Toy that is kept upon the Lookout.
109* The whole fight between Goku and Super 17. How can Goku be such TheDitz not to confirm that Super 17 was absorbing all his energy after all his experiences with the Androids, until he spent almost all his power making Super 17 stronger than him?
110** The original Android 17 didn't have the ability to absorb energy - 19, 20, and Cell had it, but 16, 17, and 18 didn't. It would make sense that Goku wouldn't guess that Super 17 would have a power than the original did not. Presumably, it comes from Hell Fighter 17, so either Hell Fighter 17 had the ability, but never got a chance to use it prior to fusing with regular 17, or his design had it as a hidden ability that would trigger if he fused with regular 17.
111* Speaking of Super 17, Goku's so weak at the end he can barely stand. Then the next minute he senses Super 17 can't fight while absorbing and '''somehow summons enough energy in a thoroughly exhausted base form''' to put a Super Dragon Fist and multiple Kamehamehas through Super 17 and destroying the android who's supposed to be stronger than Super Saiyan 4!! GT Logic anyone?
112** Anyone who says GT logic should just be ignored they're clearly biased; this exact same scenario happened in Cell, Gohan was weak and helpless Goku urges him and Gohan all of sudden has power again. Goku was battered to the point that he had one arm against King Piccolo and he still found the power for that last attack once he had an opening. Stop being a biased hypocrite.
113*** Settle down, child. It isn't being a biased hypocrite to point out that it's a massive plot flaw. Also, nice No True Scotsman fallacy. On top of that, Gohan hadn't exhausted his energy against Cell. Gohan was hurt because Cell blasted his arm so he couldn't fire a full-powered Kamehameha. It's also well-established in canon at this point that Goku's spirit helped him fire the Kamehameha, thus the Father-Son Kamehameha. So unless you have an actual example which isn't a weak "no u," No True Scotsman fallacy and a false equivalent to boot, it's still a stupid plothole which is classic Dragonball GT. Same applies for your Piccolo example. Goku wasn't out of energy, he had 3 out of his 4 limbs crippled. Piccolo left one arm free with which Goku was able to launch a Kamehameha to boost himself up and through Piccolo so again, not the same thing.
114* How the hell is Trunks able to detect No. 17's Ki, and is even able to compare it with that of No. 18... despite the fact that a major plot point in the background of the two androids when they were first encountered back in ''Dragon Ball Z'' was that they didn't radiate Ki at all! This isn't even the first time this happen in this show. The same thing happens with General Rildo. Goku was able to detect Rildo's Ki and compare it with Majin Buu, in spite of the fact he is also a machine and shouldn't have Ki at all. Heck, they were even able to sense Dr. Gero's Ki! Which is silly because what made Dr. Gero so dangerous back in DBZ was the fact they could not detect him.
115** If you wanted to be generous and provide an in-universe explanation the Z Fighters just got better at sensing energy. The first time round the Androids batteries were completely unlike anything they had encountered before; by GT however they had all lived with 18 for over a decade giving them plenty of time to hone their techniques.
116** [[SarcasmMode So they hone their Ki sensing techniques to the point where they sense Ki from things that don't have it or use it like machines, rocks, and toasters.]] Also if that is the case, how are Pan and Uub able to sense them, when they were never exposed to android energy. Also Trunks seems to be main one with this ability and according to Vegeta Trunks hasn't been training or honing his techniques at all.
117*** Androids 17 and 18 are not machines. They are people with artificial parts. Remember 18 is sufficiently human that she was able to GIVE BIRTH to Marron, who as far as anybody can tell is 100% run of the mill standard human. She and 17 might have energy roughly on par with Turtle but just like fish, grass and algae they do have Ki.
118*** So why couldn't any of the Z-fighters or even Cell detect them? This not some fan theory, this was a major plot point in the Cell saga. Cell couldn't sense Android 17's and 18's ki which gave him a hard finding them. The only reason why Cell was able to find the two was because he was sensing Piccolo's ki and just assumed he was fighting 17 and 18. Also if their ki was detectable, then why did Cell need to check island by island order to flush them out, if he could have just followed their ki signature?
119*** Their ki (which was also confirmed in the Buu Saga when both of them can be seen giving energy for the Spirit Bomb) is probably roughly on par with Master Roshi's turtle. Nearly impossible to spot but it is there. Having spent more than a decade alongside her may have just allowed the Z-Fighters to figure out how to hone in on her. Prior to that her energy level was so low and so many things around her had equal or higher levels (Remember when Vegeta tracks down a FISH on Namek? The islands have deer and other animals, the ocean has fish and whales. Figuring out which tiny blip was 18 could be impossible. Or it could just be a Plot Hole. GT does that. A LOT.
120** Like I said ''if you wanted to be generous'' you could come up with an in-universe explanation. Real world its GT plot hole number 3476.
121** 16 did warn 18 against using energy attacks against Cell during the island bombardment because Cell could sense the attacks even though he couldn't sense her.
122** And what's your point?
123** The androids clearly use some sort of energy akin to ki to function, I always thought the problem was that the energy they used was artificial and separate from the Ki used by organic life, meaning they couldn't sense it at first. After years of living with the androids, they learned to pick up on the energy signature of androids and machines similar to how they can sense ki.
124** But once again other characters like Pan and Uub also had this ability in spite of the fact they were never exposed to that kind of energy. Also if Goku and his friends' ki sensing ability improved so much to the point where he can now sense ki from machines, then why couldn't he or anyone else sense Pilaf, Chu and Mai approaching the lookout? Which also raises the question if sensing ki from machines is possible, then why couldn't Future Trunks do it? He spent most of life fighting against machines.
125** In addition General Rildo isn't even android he is a machine mutant.
126** It bears repeating that Androids 17 and 18 aren't machines, but people with cybernetic parts, so they would have ki (WordOfGod even confirms that they could get stronger via training if they were motivated). Cell probably had a hard time sensing their ki because, considering they use a different power source, their natural ki was indistinguishable from an average human's.
127** And it bear repeat that Z-fighters and Cell could sense android 17 and 18 energy at all. Not to say they don't have Ki they just don't have detectable Ki much like lord Beers. And in addition General Rildo isn't even android he is a machine mutant ,and so was Luud and Goku was still able to sense their energy despite them being 100% machine!
128** I think it's yet another GT plot hole... BUT it is said that what the Z Fighters can detect is a "Ki signature". They can sense power level, intentions, etc, which gives them an idea of who it is, especially if it is someone they know well. Cell can't detect the androids but he doesn't detect Krillin's presence either, despite him being quite a bit stronger than the average human. Yet Krillin's friends can detect his Ki because they know what to look for. It's safe to assume that, knowing Android 18 for over a decade, they would know her Ki signature, which wouldn't consist only of her power level but also character, intentions, etc. 17 being her brother, it would not be surprising that they would share a similar human Ki. In GT, Trunks doesn't sense Android 17 before he attacks him after all. We only know that he senses his Ki once he is face-to-face with him. As far as Goku goes, sensing machines and all, PLOT HOLES.
129*** Except, Cell not being able to sense Krillin is likely because Krillin was suppressing his power levels to avoid detection like he did on namek to avoid being detected by Frieza's scouters and Vegeta. So theory don't hold much water. Since Cell wasn't able to sense Krillin, not because Krillin was weak, but because he was masking it.
130* So Goku can now sense ki from machines apparently (in spite of the fact machines don't have ki) yet he couldn't sense Pilaf, Chu and Mai approaching the lookout to steal the Black Star Dragon Balls. They are living life forms riding in machines and apparently Goku can sense ki from both living things and machines, so there is no excuse for him, Uub, Dende, and Mr. Popo for not sensing them coming from a mile away.
131* Where did all the movie villains come from in that saga? Of all things, please, please, don't tell me they actually [[RecycledScript recycled non-canon script?]]
132** They did.
133* Golden-ape Baby needs two full power Galic Guns to blow the earth? I mean Buu could do that with a small blast.
134** And when he's powering up his Galic Gun, Goku just stands there doing absolutely '''nothing''' except listening to the speech until Baby actually fires the blast, after which he seems to realize he has to stop it. And he instead gets hit before he can power up another blast. Was he thinking his own Kamehameha would kick in by then?
135* In the Shadow Dragon saga, the whole fight against Rage Shenron. Goku goes from base to Super Saiyan 4 and the power change isn't that convincing. Then Rage Shenron uses slime to absorb electricity from a puny source like the '''city's power grid''', which doesn't even generate sparks by Dragonball's energy standards and ''then'' becomes strong enough ''to stop a 10x Kamehameha dead in it's tracks'' and surpass Goku (who's long since passed the point where he should be able to blow up multiple planets in base form) and Pan. What happened to the Law of Conceivable Conservation of energy?
136** Speaking of that Kamehameha, it was at full power and was thrown right back at him. We expected at the very least that the whole solar system ought to be blown up. All we get instead is a ruined street, a few broken buildings and Goku back to his child form. Never mind that afterwards he has enough power to fight 4 more dragons at Super Saiyan 4 without so much as a healing or a senzu bean. Now how did he do that?
137** And they're only saved by DeusExMachina raining down and shorting him out.
138* When the Shadow Dragons are released, the rest of the cast goes home without so much as an offer to help and it's all up to Goku to go fight them? Were they happily taking a nap when he was fighting 6 out of 7 dragons all by himself?
139** Why wouldn't they? Goku is so much more powerful in this series than every other member of the cast that they're completely irrelevant. Goku even outright states that if his Super Saiyan 4 can't do it then nothing can at one point. It's definitely a result of pushing Goku so hard as the protagonist in GT, but the fact is aside from Vegeta when he ascends to [=SSJ4=] himself they might as well all take a nap.
140* Shadow Dragon Saga. [[NewPowersAsThePlotDemands How did Goku's eyesight just come back by itself all of a sudden?]]
141** And if he was fully healed when he absorbed everyone's energy and went Super Saiyan 4+, how come he didn't realize it?
142* Yamcha has said several times he wanted to get married more then anything else, got giddy at the thought of starting a family as late as the Android saga, and Future Trunks briefly mentions that Yamcha finds a new love in his timeline. With these things in mind why is Yamcha consistently shown to be single, even shown to be living alone in Diablo Desert with Puar back in ''Dragon Ball GT''? Are we to believe that Yamcha just gave up on his lifelong dream in addition to already giving up on Martial arts?
143** Dragon Ball is notorious for poor handling of characters who aren't Goku, and its GT.
144* The 10x Super Kamehameha isn't very consistent. It started out as two blue spheres combined into one (actually this makes it less powerful than charging an attack with two hands together). And while it does nothing to hurt Baby at first, after Baby's fired an equally powerful blast at Goku and knocked him flat, it suddenly kicks in and attacks him from inside out, trashing him. If the dub line is to be believed, Goku was expecting all this to happen. What in the world was that all about?
145** And then later in the series turns into this orange red beam.
146* The level of collateral damage just doesn't add up to the characters' power levels and the energy they ought to be putting into their attacks. In most cases, they're actually causing less damage on the Earth then most fights in Z. I can understand the SoLastSeason thing in ''Dragon Ball Z'', but this is going beyond all reason.
147** This has been true since back in the Namek Saga. Vegeta was capable of destroying the Earth with his Galick Gun way back in the Saiyan Saga, and he was literally hundreds of times stronger by the time the Frieza Saga ended. Nearly every fighter in the series at that point would be capable of destroying the Earth just by looking at it funny, and they've literally grown millions of times stronger since then in both continuities. Hell, Roshi destroyed the moon way back in Dragonball in his bulked up form. How the Earth doesn't get obliterated by a stray Ki blast is a riddle for the ages.
148* The BIGGEST headscratcher. Omega Shenron regenerates and proceeds on a FoeTossingCharge knocking out Goku and all his friends, '''including Mr. Satan, Videl and Chi chi!''' That's right. '''Mr. Satan survived a full power kick from Omega Shenron WITHOUT A SCRATCH!!!!'''. To put that in perspective, those punches completely brought down Gohan, Goten, Trunks and Pan, while Goku at Super Saiyan 4 was broken so bad he was struggling to stand afterwards! WHAAAAAAAAAAT???!!!
149** Mr. Satan has the strongest PlotArmor in the entire series (Heck, he hasn't died once ever since his first appearance). That and plenty of RuleOfFunny.
150* The more you look at GT, the worse it gets. In the last episode we see Yamcha in the desert and Tien and Chaoutzu training off near a waterfall. Oh yeah, they were totally not bothered by all that happened in the Baby Saga, being possessed, the earth exploding, Super 17 and the Dimensional Collapse and all the villains leaving hell, and least of all the Shadow Dragons and all that negative energy around the globe. Talk about throwing in the towel. GT just forgot they were even there!
151** Just what the hell were they supposed to do? They lost relevance in the middle in the Cell Games Saga and most of the MOOKS are stronger than Buu!
152** At the very least they could have been shown as victims of all the stuff that happened or they might have at least become mooks of Baby, but it's very strange that GT made it look like it was an AlternateUniverse in which they never existed at all. They didn't even contribute to defeating the villains that escaped from hell, most of whom would have been CannonFodder for them. How in the world could they completely remain unaffected by everything that happened around them, unless ''they never existed in the script'' till the last episode?
153* How the hell did Dr. Gero and Dr. Myu manage to make a perfect copy of 17? In hell?!?
154** [[ComicBook/IronMan With a box of scraps?!]]
155** Except Android 17 is technically a cyborg not an android so unless this "box of scraps"(which they somehow manage to pull out of nowhere or somehow purchased in hell of all places) comes with a human body that is identical to that of 17. or some of 17's DNA with a cloning machine attached. There is no way in hell they could have made the 17 copies.
156** [[{{Pun}} No way in hell?]] Obviously, they couldn't have made a cyborg, but it's much more likely the Hell 17 was a complete machine, built to look like and fuse with the original. Doesn't explain WHERE they got the parts from, but at least this is slightly more plausible.
157** Another thing, and correct me if I'm wrong. But wasn't it stated that the reason the portal to Hell opened was due to Android 17 and Hell Fighter 17 were able to synch up because they were perfectly identical, but wouldn't that mean that Dr. Gero had a sample of 17's DNA that lasted after all these years and he and Baby somehow used that several decade old sample to make a machine mutant? Also, if Hell Fighter 17 is machine mutant Android 17 is a cyborg, than how are they perfectly identical?
158** Maybe, maybe not since Piccolo and Dende where able to do it and they are not perfectly identical. Frankly GT can't even keep their exposition straight.
159** First off, Piccolo fused with Nail, not Dende. And second, that was using an ancient Namekian fusion technique, not just synchronizing because they're identical.
160** No one was taking about that! We're taking about how Piccolo and Dende were able to synchronize their energy to open up hell in GT. I suggest you watch it just to understand what we're talking about.
161* How did the creation of Hell 17 go completely unnoticed by King Yemma and all the guys running hell including all of the kai?
162* Why does hell look completely different from all the other times we seen it?
163* Why didn't Dr. Gero or Dr. Myu try to make a hell 18 as well. That would only double their attack power and they would have no problem beating Goku even at [=SSJ4=]. Did they run out of parts?
164** Probably because he had no way of contacting 18 to set up the portal, after all he would have had to contact Earth 17 to tell him to sync up with hell 17 so the portal would open.
165* How the hell did Dr. Gero or Dr. Myu know how to open the gates of hell. They're robotic scientist you would that kind of information would fall out of the realm of science and into black magic.
166** Gero spent a good deal longer in Hell than Dr. Myu did, perhaps through studying the way Hell worked, he came up with a theory based. Then shows Dr. Myu, who was able to collaborate with Gero.
167** What you should be asking is how did Gero even know about Myu and his research. Does Hell have Google or something?
168* If it was that easy to break out of hell that even Piccolo and Dende could do it. why didn't no one else tried it. you think if it was that easy someone would have done it earlier.
169** Just because it is a relatively simple matter didn't mean it was a very easy thing to do. If we account the fillers from Z, Grand Kai sends heroes into Hell to keep things in check should things go out of hand. Gero and Myu simply stayed under the radar for long enough to get things done.
170** Plus not everyone has someone on the other side to sync up with to punch a hole in the fabric of reality.
171* Why didn't everyone use the Blutz Wave Generator, shouldn't Bulma have given everyone a chance after seeing what it did to Vegeta? I don't get why she'd use it on Shenron when she could've covertly enhanced everyone with steroid waves.
172** At the very least she could have used it to restore Goku's and Vegeta's energies for another fusion. But no.
173** It was damaged beyond immediate repair after its first use.
174** No it wasn't, Bulma was even able to fire a few shots at Omega before he destroyed it in episode 60. so she could have easily done it.
175* Just what happened to Gohan's Mystic power-up when GT rolled around? Did he lose it when he got pulled out of Buu? It just faded away? He was just damn uninterested in fighting anymore when he grew up?
176** ''The writers forgot''. [[{{Beat}} Long Pause]]. That's the real reason.
177** The third one, methinks. He always was the more intellectual one in that family. Besides, he's married to Videl now, right? Anyway, GT wasn't written by Toriyama, so we can probably just drop this one in CanonDiscontinuity. They seemed more interested in turning Goku into a kid and inventing [=SSJ4=] than expanding on Gohan's abilities.
178** Or remembering that he couldn't turn Super Saiyan. (The old Kai told him to try and do 'that super-saiyan thing'. He turned Mystic, with a different hair style to normal, that of his [=SSJ2=] form, but not blonde.)
179** The unfortunate real world answer is that its both a plot hole and a willing part of the script writers to make Goku the ''hero'' of GT. However, to attempt to explain this in-universe it relies on working out what exactly the ''Mystic Form'' actually is. If its a power up similar to when Guru unlocked his Hidden Potential, then there is a simple answer because it happens to be rooted in previous canon. During ''Dragon Ball Z'' its noted that his Super Saiyan 2 form had considerably weakened because he was no longer training; its not that he lost the ''Mystic Form,'' he was always using it throughout GT - its just weakened to the point where Goku and Vegeta have surpassed him. If on the other hand its a Transformation similar to Super Saiyan or the Kaioken then it once again comes back to Gohan's lack of training. Like his weakened Super Saiyan 2 form, it may now be impossible for him to transform given the massive energies required - it does after all surpass Super Saiyan 3.
180** That explanation doesn't fly for a number of reasons. while it's true in the movies Wrath of the Dragon, Battle of Gods, and the Budokai games, the form is treated like a transformation, as Gohan accesses the form by powering up. there is NO massive energies requirement! old kai simple said power up like for the Super Saiyan transformation which clearly mean it doesn't require anymore energy that Super saiyan and he can still did that in GT. Also yes it's true that the reason why gohan [=SSJ4=] was weaken in the Buu saga was because of his lack of training. HOWEVER that only because SSJ amplify base form so weak base form = weak transformation. mystic is different it allow gohan to directly tap into his full potential regardless base form.
181** There's also the WMG (which, when you think about it, makes sense) that Pan accidentally took it. She's easily at the power level of Goku when he fought Androids 19 and 20 (proven by her easily beating Android 20). No matter how much training she did, and how many times she almost died, there's nothing that could have logically elevated her to that level. Mind you, that's a power level stronger than Freeza. From a 10 to 12 (about 2 years had passed by that point, so if she was 10 at the start, she would be 12 by then) year old girl.
182** That's not unnatural. Goten and Trunks' base power at the end of Z was more or less at Frieza's level. Though from what we've seen in Z, that much increase really comes from mastering the Super Saiyan form, which apart from making it ultra powerful and efficient, seems to boost the base form's power proportionately as well, as Goku demonstrates in the afterlife. Before any of them made Super Saiyan as efficient as their normal state, they absolutely couldn't get to Frieza's level and beyond without going Super Saiyan.
183** Here is the thing about that when someone inherit traits from there parents in this case mystic energy normally the parent would NOT lose their own. Besides Pan is nowhere near as strong as her father was at the end of z.
184** She's also grew up in peacetime and isn't fully grown. Before receiving the Mystic power-up, Gohan was already a veteran of the Saiyan Invasion, the war on Namek, the Cell Games, been through the grueling experience of the Hyperbolic Time Chamber, 17 years old, and put on death's door by Majin Buu. The zenki boosts and LevelGrinding he's been through, not to mention being almost an adult, easily explain him outclassing GT Pan.
185** Except that doesn't explain what happen to Gohan's mystic form. Saying that Pan took it would be like saying if son has your eyes you will lose your eyes. Also mystic form is suppose to unlock a person true power regardless of the strength of their base form. so unless she already at her maximum strength (and that's the strongest she'll ever get!)she clearly doesn't have it.
186*** Read: The writer's forgot about him. On purpose. There is NO in universe reason. The series isn't even canon.
187
188* The last episode. Ok, so Shenron can't grant any more wishes, so why not go Namek and take one wish from Porunga to restore everyone killed by the Shadow Dragons? What is even the need for the DealWithTheDevil that Goku makes at the end?
189** Porunga can't revive large scores of people. He can only bring back one person at a time.
190** No in the Buu saga they WERE able to bring back everyone to life with Porunga. the elder said he remodel him remember? So yeah that's no excuse.
191** The Shadow Dragons were created by the selfish wishes made by our heroes over the years, specifically they are supposed to go 100 Years between uses to allow the evil energy to vanish. Porunga is either supposed to be on a 300 year cycle (because three wishes), a 50 cycle (because apparently years on Old Namek are 6 months long and it's never explained if New Namek changed that detail) or possibly some odd combination - it's not like Dragon Balls exactly make sense. Porunga is however clearly Shenron's superior so I have a very good reason why our heroes might not want to overload Porunga.
192*** They outright said why they didn't go to Namek; Shenron was leaving to teach them to not rely on the dragon balls, a bookend in GT from the first episode of Dragon Ball, where the story started when the heroes first started to use them.
193* If overusing the Dragon Balls had such devastating effects, why was this not mentioned in any of the the literature? Or by Kami/Mr Popo/Piccolo/The Grand Elder/Moori/Dende? Why is it that only Old Kaio-shin mentions the negative effects of over-using the Dragon Balls. And if over-using them had such devastating effects, why did they reconstitute every year? Why not every hundred years?
194** For the first 3 questions, because the writers hadn't thought of it yet and out of everybody in the series only Old Kai could have even known about it, and he finds no reason to bring it up until it happens. For the last, because Kami and Dende would have increased the duration to 100 years instead of a year if they knew about that little drawback, and they didn't, therefore they saw no reason to.
195*** Old Kai saw no reason to bring it up? you mean beside preventing the destruction Earth Dragon Balls, the release of the evil dragons which cause a great deal of damage to the earth and it's people and had powers that made Majin Buu look like a chump which took everything z fighters had to stop them. as well as covering the earth in negative energy. you mean the old kai didn't see the prevention of all this chaos and destruction as reason enough to tell them? Also you mean to tell me that the namekians race as a whole all had literally no idea, no ancient literature or prophecy explaining this,not one words of advice passed down from the ancient elders giving them all a heads up. They had not one clue of the negative effects of their own magic they have invented? Wow, That's a lot to believe.
196*** It amazes me how dumb some people can be. You want an explanation to things that occur in an ANIME-ONLY, NON CANON series? This whole shadow dragon crap isn't even a thing within the confines of the actual canon story. It's GT none of this shit makes sense. There is NO in universe explanation.
197*** I too am amazed by how dumb some people are. GT was only officially declared non-canon recently upon the release of Battle of the Gods back in 2013. Stop acting like it was never mention to be canon from the start. Since if that really was the case they would have established that sooner like when series was ongoing or when it was first release and not over a decade after it already ended.
198*** This question has got a very simple, in-universe answer. The first half of GT, up to the end of the Baby Saga, may have been canon back then (even though now we can safely say even that has been [[CanonDiscontinuity discontinued]]). From the Super 17 saga onward, GT could not have been canon at any given point in time, [[DeathOfTheAuthor despite]] [[WordOfGod what Toei or even Akira Toriyama himself may have said in the past]]. That is because of two reasons: first off, the depiction of Hell in the Super 17 Saga spits in the face of everything that was ever said about Hell in the manga (where Hell is never shown) and is basically the same Hell as DBZ filler, which itself is non-canon. Second, and most important, movie villains appear in that saga. Those are short cameos, to be sure, but they appear nonetheless, and movies are firmly, completely, absolutely non-canonical and have never been in any sense, shape, or form before Battle of Gods (and questionably the 2008 Tarble movie). As such, if GT considers filler and movies to drive its plot, it cannot be canonical with DBZ, at least from the Super 17 saga onwards.
199*** Considering that it wasn't made by the original creator, yeah, it's not canon and never was.
200*** That's still not vaild excuse, If plot hole arises in a story you can't just shrug and say it's not canon as a justification for it.
201* Some of the GT endings (example: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=INND4rkd8Qw) include a sequence in which most of the good guys walk or fly past the screen. Quick question, what the hell is BABY doing there?! He's just evil, he doesn't redeem himself, he has no reason to be there. I don't get it.
202** That specific scene seems to be a homage of the illustration in the old DB volumes. They included both heroes and villains together. Speaking of GT endings, [[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ByYHoRkrn10 the second one]] is about couples: Goku and Chichi, Vegeta and Bulma, Gohan and Videl, Krillin and Number 18 and... [[HoYay Goten and Trunks?]] Are they appealing to the fangirls there or what?
203** No, they were showing scenes of character pairs doing everyday stuff. The only other characters who would fit with Goten or Trunks would be Pan or Goten's SatelliteLoveInterest, they were better just with each other.+
204** That's the most likely truth. Still, it's funny they're the only pair who isn't a couple.
205** They're a couple in the same way Scrubs' John Dorian and Christopher Turk are.
206** Indeed, it's just guy love... between two guys.
207* Another GT problem. How could the Black Star balls have been made before Kami separated from Piccolo? Kami separated from Piccolo so that he could become the resident god. Don't you need to be the resident Kami to make the Dragon Balls in the first place? When could he have possibly made the black star balls?
208** IIRC, the Black Star balls were Kami's Dragon Balls, beta version, with one giant drawback. Of course, how one could figure out that drawback without a planet (i.e. Earth) or three going "Boom"... [[BellisariosMaxim let's just not examine this too closely.]]
209*** And if that was the case, how did Kami bring the Dragon Balls back to the lookout if they were scattered all over the universe after each wish?
210** If ''I'' remember correctly, Pilaf said they were made before the split. Besides, if they were solo Kami's, then the balls would be inert, since by that time, Kami has long since fused with Piccolo.
211** Also, Pilaf's an idiot.
212** You don't need to be Kami to make the balls, you just need to be from the Dragon Clan. Guru wasn't Kami of anything, if you recall. That explains why the Black Star balls were active after Kami had fused with Piccolo, because that was his original state when he created the balls
213** The Black Star balls were made by the Nameless Namek; they became inert when he split into Kami and King Piccolo. Remember Piccolo Jr ceased to exist after the Cell saga from a biological point of view - as far as the balls are concerned he is the original creator. ''It's clearly said in the episode they appear''. Incidentally it actually makes perfect sense from a real world perspective; the Nameless Namek was as strong as Android 17 AKA a thousand times stronger than Guru or Kami. Makes sense his Dragon Balls would be stronger in every single way.
214** The Black Star Balls are too nonsensical to think about them. For instance, how come they were never detected after the Nameless Namek was reborn in the middle of Cell Saga? The original Dragon Balls have been collected at least thrice after that (after Cell's death, after Majin Vegeta's killing spree, and at the end of the Buu saga) and they never found out about the Black Balls via the radar. Also, how could Red Shenlong affect Goku's body (and power) since he's clearly far far stronger than the creator? Those are pretty big {{Plot Hole}}s.
215*** Just because the "Can't adversely affect beings more powerful than my creator" rule applies to Shenlong, it doesn't mean the same holds true for Ultimate Shenlong. And even if it did, it's highly arguably whether making someone younger counts as an adverse effect.
216** If Piccolo had created those Dragonballs before the split, then how come waaaay back in DB, King Piccolo didn't even know what a Dragonball was until he was informed of their powers by Pilaf?
217** If Guru could make Dragon Balls without planets having to go boom when they grant wishes, and the knowledge was passed on to Kami when he was in Namek, how did he end up creating Dragon Balls with such bizarre properties.
218** From what I remember, it was because the Black Stars Dragon Balls were corrupted by the Nameless Namek's evil. That's why they destroyed a planet once a wish is granted.
219* Even if Pilaf knew about the black star dragon balls how did he knew that piccolo and kami refused 22 years ago?
220** He didn't know about the Black Star Dragon Balls. He just showed up at the Look Out looking for the regular Dragon Balls and assumed the Black Star ones were the real ones.
221** Not the case in the dub - Mai remarks on the stars being black and Pilaf explicitly calls them the Black Star Dragon Balls, and knows about their history.
222* Why wasn't Piccolo at the lookout when Pilaf attacked it? when we last left him in dbz piccole lived at the lookout but when GT got started he was no where to be seen. Also why didn't mr.popo or dende try to help goku fight off Pilaf and get back the black star dragon balls.
223* How was it that Pilaf,Shu,and Mai was able to hold Goku off long enough to summon Black Star Shenlong? I know Goku was tired after fighting Uub, but he and Uub was able to heavily damage the lookout while in The Hyperbolic Time Chamber IN BASE FORM without the need to punch dimensional holes through it like Gotenks and Majin Buu, Yet couldn't beat Pilaf and his mooks in under 30 seconds? Mr. Popo alone could have handle them. As mention before, why Mr. Popo and Dende didn't try to get back the Black Star Dragonballs while Goku was fighting them? They just stood there!
224** Pilaf never really had any combat abilities - he had to use traps to imprison Goku and co in the original ''Dragon Ball'', and he's always relied on mechs for power. Pilaf himself says that he couldn't take on Adult Goku (not ExactWords, but still), so odds are that Goku either a), assumed that his presence would be enough to scare Pilaf off (and while Pilaf and co were intimidated, they weren't intimidated enough), or b), he didn't know of the Black Star Dragon Balls, and assumed that they were after him, letting his guard down.
225* How is it that Android 18, after lecturing Super 17 on his "cowardice" for allowing mad doctors to decide his actions, witnessing his clear look of turmoil over it, and seeing him finally snap and kill Dr. Myu after the latter runs his mouth, never actually thinks about trying to convince her brother to stand down? We could've seen a HeelFaceTurn which would produce a very valuable ally that could've come in handy for the final arc so that Goku didn't have to do 90% of everything. (Wait, maybe I just answered my own question�)
226** He just killed her husband. The only thing that we ever see 18 get really upset or distraught about is when someone harms Krillin or their daughter. In fact her bond with Krillin is so strong that it overpowers 17's attempt to hypnotize her and get her to join him. Just hearing Krillin's voice makes her snap out of it. So yes he's more important to her than her brother. So when her brother kills him, she just wants revenge.
227** That you did. Dragon Ball GT was designed to make Goku the hero and everyone else seem like losers. At the end of Z Gohan and Gotenks were the strongest fighters in existence. Come GT and instead of expanding their characters, the writers pull Super Saiyan 4 out of their ass which just happens to make everything and everyone before it look redundant. Even after other Super Saiyan 4's appeared he was ''still'' responsible for the killing blow against the most powerful enemy in history. And what was the final shot of the series? Goku the only Z Fighter alive. Basically the writers sought out anyone or anything as strong as Goku and ground it under their heels.
228** Wait... Wouldn't [=SSJ3=] Goku be just as strong as, if not stronger than, [=SSJ3=] Gotenks? Not just that, but Vegito was far outclassing Super Buu after it absorbed Gohan (who recently had his full potential unlocked), even before turning into a Super Saiyan. Plus, even without the Potara, Goku and Vegeta could still fuse into Gogeta via Fusion Dance, if Goku could convince Vegeta to...
229** SSJ Gotenks was roughly even/superior to [=SSJ3=] Goku. Goku was scared to fight Super Buu, and [=SSJ3=] Gotenks dominated him. [=SSJ3=] Goku is nowhere near [=SSJ3=] Gotenks. Base Vegetto beating Super Buu w/Gohan is filler, in the manga he turns Super Saiyan immediately.
230** I agree with the previous poster - Gohan and Gotenks ''were'' the strongest fighters at the end of Z. There is absolutely no evidence outside of the movies that Vegeta knew and/or could perform the fusion dance reliably before GT which takes Gogeta out of the equation, the Potara earrings were destroyed meaning that Vegetto was for all intents and purposes dead and Gohan, already as powerful as Super Buu, still had both his Full Power and Super Saiyan 2 transformations in reserve. Fact is, Goku got ''lucky'' against Kid Buu. If it wasn't for the Spirit Bomb and his health boost from Porunga Goku would have been annihilated.
231** Wasn't it stated that the Fusion Earrings lead to a stronger form than Fusion Dance did? So even if Gotenks reached [=SSJ3=], wouldn't Vegito still be classified as the strongest being in (canonical) DB lore?
232** Mystic Gohan doesn't have SSJ or [=SSJ2=] in reserve, Elder Kaioshin specifically told him to ''try'' to turn SSJ - this was what produced Mystic. Evidently, "Mystic" is his full potential brought out without clunky, energy draining transformations. And Goku's fear of Super Buu isn't the only piece of evidence; he was ''unsure'' if he could have defeated Fat Buu himself, but figured (not 100% reliable but it's the best indicator we have) that SSJ Gotenks would win the day with ease. And since we never see SSJ Gotenks fight Fat Buu, we can't really oppose Goku's word on it.
233*** Actually he does, which is confirmed by Daizenshuu 2 for the series. Not only does he still have the ability to use Super Saiyan 1, but Super Saiyan 2 as well. Which makes sense because Elder Kai never states that Gohan doesn't have access to those forms anymore. He simply tells Gohan to activate the power-up he's been giving by trying to first transform into a Super Saiyan, which he does. Afterwards, Gohan then doesn't ever bother powering up again, but just remains in that form. Kind of like when he and Goku mastered the Super Saiyan state during the Cell Saga. They were Super Saiyans, but still possessed the ability to increase their power even further. In regards to Goku, he states without a doubt that he could have beaten Majin (Fat) Buu, but that he wanted Goten and Trunks to do it so that Earth could have new heroes and wouldn't always rely on him. He then states, again with complete confidence, that he and Vegeta together would be unable to defeat Super Buu (Notably, this is after Super Buu has lost the power he gained from Gotenks, Piccolo, and Gohan respectively). He then states that he believes that at his full SS3 power that he could defeat Kid Buu. All of this gives you a general idea of everyone's power levels during this saga, and Goku's near the bottom, beneath Gohan, Gotenks, and Super Buu.
234** Thing is, Goku is really unreliable for power discussion from the Buu Saga since he lied at least twice about how powerful he was. He claimed to be only as strong as Vegeta and since Vegeta couldn't beat Buu, neither could he. Then he revealed Super Saiyan 3. When Piccolo asked him point blank if he could beat Buu if he went all out, Goku said probably not. Either he lied again or he overestimated Buu since Goku says before fighting Kid Buu that he could have beating Fat Buu, but chose not to. So the power different between Goku, Gohan, and Gotenks get really tricky. And you have to keep in mind that Goku kept training while Gohan, Trunks, and Goten slacks off, so by the time of ''GT'' it would be reasonable that Goku is much stronger than any of them. This is true in even the canon material where Gohan regress again.
235* The last part of our GainaxEnding. Goku has no tail if you observe. Only God knows why. Whether he's even alive or dead is also a big mystery.
236* Thinking about it now, why couldn't they use Earth's normal Dragon Balls to wish back the Black Star Dragon Balls? It would've made a lot more sense to try to attempt to find the regular balls scattered across the planet before time ran out than it would've to build a ship and travel in space to who knows where to find the other set. Even if they couldn't wish the balls back, they could've at least asked for some form of advanced teleportation that'd let them easily arrive at the places with the balls, especially since Bulma somehow designed a radar that was able to detect the balls throughout space. Granted, we all know what happened the first time they actually tried to use the things in the entire series (if I'm not mistaken; Didn't they use new Namek's Dragon Balls to wish Earth back after Baby Vegeta used the Black Star Dragon Balls again? Soon after Baby was defeated, they had to evacuate Earth and I doubt they took the regular Dragon Balls with them), but the main characters couldn't have possibly known that at the time.
237** Also, in regards to the Black Star Dragon Balls being used again, why didn't the time needed to gather them again reset?
238** At least in the dub, it did. The Baby thing lasted far longer than it seemed.
239*** Super had them make a similar wish using the Earth's Dragon Balls if I'm not mistaken, but the wish was beyond their power. Doesn't explain why a), they don't try, b), they don't try with the Namekian Dragon Balls, or c), they don't just have Goku teach some of the others Instant Transmission (which he can't use, but still knows how to) so they can retrieve the balls in a few days.
240* The Shadow Dragon Saga again. While fighting against Naturon Shenron, Goku ''has trouble pushing a building in base form''. And he's supporting the entire weight of it by pressing against ''window glass'', so yeah, it must be MadeOfUnobtanium, if not at least [[SarcasmMode very strong glass]]. Then he has to go to Super Saiyan 4 just to lift it, which he and Piccolo or anyone else could have done waaaaaaayyyy back in DBZ's ''Saiyan Saga''. Ahem, what did I just see?
241* Why did Goku age back to adulthood when in [=SSJ4=] form? Was it just RuleofCool, or did it have an in-universe justification?
242** If I recall correctly, it was because his Super Saiyan 4 form was stronger than the Red Shenron. That may just have been {{Fanon}}, though.
243** Which is itself a pretty bland {{Handwave}}. There's no way for the Nameless Namek to be stronger than Goku [=SSJ3=], or else Piccolo should have been able to fight with Fat Buu. I guess it's another PlotHole for ''Dragon Ball GT''.
244** Not really. Shenron can't affect anyone who's stronger than its creator, but was it ever stated that the Black Star Shenron had the same limitation? It could be that, as an unofficial (non-Kami/Guru/Planetary Sponsor) dragon with ''huge'' drawbacks, it could affect anyone who wasn't stronger than ''itself''. That's starting to get close to FanWank, however, and is completely invalid if it was stated to have the same limitation and completely moot if it was a different reason.
245** I always thought that Goku's [=SSJ4=] form was so strong, it could resist the Dragon Ball's powers.
246** AssPull people, that's the truth. They made Goku a kid because they thought DBZ was too much of serious fighting and they wanted to go back to the DB days. Then they realized it was a very bad idea, as even the audience began losing respect for Goku like Pan does, so they tried to go back to the DBZ ways. They didn't really think of any other way except to throw in Instant Age Settings and Instant Tailor for [=SSJ
247* While Gohan's advice to Goku to 'just grow up like any other child' is sound, what's to stop them from collecting the regular Dragonballs to wish Goku back to adulthood again?
248** ''Or'' if a wish from the Black Star Dragonballs overrides the Red Star Dragonballs somehow, what was stopping Chi Chi from wishing herself younger? after all they did first meet as small children (and indeed proposed to each other which Chi Chi took ''very'' seriously well into her teens) and it's not as if Chi Chi still has any dependents to care for. Even if you argue that Chi Chi would be {{Squick}}ed by the thought of being a little girl once again, why she didn't revert to her teens when Goku hit 16 for example is anyone's guess. As things stand Goku apparently accepted being the carer of an old lady (unless he ran off again of course) and Chi Chi apparently just accepted her death by old age despite having the potential access to seven magic balls [[IdiotBall that could restore her youth.]]
249** Well, Chi-Chi's been established as a woman who wanted a regular family, that likely includes husband she could grow old, and eventually die of old age with. The fact that he's gone and gotten himself turned into a kid again is frankly, and rightfully so, very stupid; and the idea that she has to cater to his whims, including using the Dragonballs to turn herself into a child again is, again rightfully so, very selfish. Goku may have been fine with the prospect of having to relive his childhood and adult years (with the retained memories of his first time growing up), but she wasn't. Also, think of Gohan and Goten. Can you imagine how they'd have to explain it to their superiors? To...''anyone''?
250--> Gohan: Yeah, I know it's weird, but these two kids who are clearly young enough to be my son and daughter are really my mom and dad. N-no, I don't have legal papers on them, nor am I their legal guardians because ''I'm their son''! H-hey! Why are you reaching for that phone? I-I'm telling you the truth, these two kids are actually my parents! C'mon, they'll vouch for me!
251--> *Hours later*
252--> Capsule Corps. News Anchor: A local man named Gohan has been taken in custody for allegedly kidnapping and brainwashing two innocent children into thinking that he's their son, and that they were once fully grown adults who shrunk themselves thanks to a wish they made to...eh...a dragon that came out of seven <fingerquotes>''dragonballs''<fingerquotes>. He's now in an asylum pending review, while the children are in the care of a children psychiatric ward.
253** and then later he could just
254-->Gohan: *transforms into Super Saiyan 2 and bitchslaps the wall to pieces*
255while
256-->Vegeta: *Super Saiyan* will you people PLEASE stop doubting anything involving Kakarot's family and friends? I mean, the world has blown up about 8 times in my lifetime, hell, I almost did it once myself about 20 years ago! Kakarrot has a monkey tail and can do this little transformation deal, too, actually being able to go about 5 levels of upgrade HIGHER than me, and you've all actually '''SEEN''' this dragon at least twice! I think we're WELL past the point of "believe anything out of that family's mouths"!!!!!!
257
258--> Yamcha: Actually, the dragon has been summoned more than twice by now. I'd wager a few dozen times at least, so...yeah, there's no excuse to not knowing about the dragonballs.
259
260--> Krillin: Seriously. I mean, do you lot have a poor memory span? You've seen us fight in tournaments, so it should come to no surprise to you that we can fly and shoot ki beams...yet you act like you're having cardiac arrest whenever we so much as walk up to you. Nevermind the fact that we inhabit this world with dog and cat people. Hell, the king himself is a ''freaking dog''!
261
262** And thus ''GT'' is somehow miraculously transitioned into ''VideoGame/DragonBallOnline''.
263** Couldn't they have just used the black star balls to wish Goku to age at the rate of a year per minute for the next 30-40 minutes?
264*** Why black? The regular ones would have been ok.
265*** Actually, it's implied that even if a wish within the powers of the Earth Dragon Balls are made using the Black Star Dragon Balls, the latter are too strong for the former to override. Doesn't explain why they don't use the Namekian Dragon Balls.
266
267* Why didn't Piccolo decide to destroy the Red Star Dragonballs instead of sacrificing Himself? Or he could have just summoned Red Shenron and killed him for good as he had done back in DB?
268
269* Vegeta mentions that "A true Sayain's hair never changes" back in Z, yet he grows a mustache. And his hair has become significantly shorter.
270** He may have been talking about hair styles. If that was true, then it seems improbable that some Sayains have facial hair (like King Vegeta) while most everyone else doesn't.
271** Its pretty obvious Vegeta is talking about his head not his face. As to why we see so few Saiyan's with beards could be explained by the fact that only middle aged men can grow them - King Vegeta, Vegeta Jr and Nappa were all of advancing years when we first see their facial hair.
272** Speaking of Nappa I could have sworn he had short black almost Recoome style hair in some of the flashbacks.
273** And what about his hair?
274** He cut it. Until he transforms (something that we're told hadn't happened for a thousand years prior to the start of the series) it remains the same. I imagine culturally a race who's hair remains static they would probably view hair cuts as a huge deal and none is made of Vegeta's but that could be an oversight.
275* After fusing with Buu, Uub now has all the powers of Majin Buu, so why can't he heal Goku (who's been blinded by Ice Shenron) if he can at least heal himself? He doesn't even have to restore his energy, just get his eyes back up and functioning.
276** Because Syn Shenron is ''right there''. Uub would have to run into the heat of the fight, spend a few seconds healing Goku while praying to God that Syn Shenron didn't kill him then and there. It was too risky.
277** Speaking of which you wonder why Uub can't even heal himself, nor has the unlimited stamina + Infinite regeneration capabilities of Kid Buu. Considering that he could reverse the effect of his candy spells, this is seriously a major question mark.
278* If [=SSJ4=] allowed Goku to go back into adult form, why didn't he just stay in his adult form. Better yet, why didn't the power of [=SSJ4=] permanently revert him to an adult?
279** They needed Goku to be a kid for the plot. Don't question it, GT is stupid.
280
281* GainaxEnding: The ending, the biggest Headscratcher of 'em all not including the beginning. In retrospect, it's so sudden and bizarre that it's nothing short of a MindScrew. What happened to Goku in the last 2 episodes? He's clearly dead from that huge energy ball, then suddenly he's alive again somehow able to talk to everybody on earth, then when he's charging the spirit bomb he cannot be killed by Omega at all, despite direct hits (Wasn't that the spirit bomb's weakest point?). We're not even sure if he's dead or BackFromTheDead because there's not even a halo to give us any idea (How that is even possible under the circumstances is itself a mystery). Then after the bomb's thrown, he's dead again, apparently brought back to life, then suddenly he just leaves without even saying goodbye. Vegeta knows something's up, then suddenly we see his clothes left on the ground. But in DBZ when [[NoBodyLeftBehind they die]], they die with their clothes (In fact, that shot is ''out of sequence'' and is shown after the end of the next couple of events). But then he's off to visit Roshi and Piccolo, who both also know something's changed about him, but a mere "Are you...?" [[ShrugOfGod is not very helpful]]. When they take their eyes off him for a second, there's suddenly no one there. Then the Dragonballs merge into Goku, then he disappears. '''What the hell happened in the last 2 episodes?''' Where does he go? Why did he have to go? Was there no other alternative? What happened to him?
282** He doesn't return for 100 years, and if you leave aside what you saw in A Hero's legacy, it's not clear if he's alive or dead. Theories include AscendedToAHigherPlaneOfExistence or that Goku became Shenron himself. And is he isn't even remotely bothered by the fact that almost everyone he knew is dead.
283** A Hero's legacy was made earlier just after the Baby Saga and they intended Goku to be clearly dead and be the Spirit Advisor to Goku Jr. At that time, no had any idea how GT was going to end or just how they were going to get there, they hoped to stop with Baby Saga. But ExecutiveMeddling (which is why GT even existed) wanted to rush two more sagas in production because producers wanted the series to coincide with the release (and marketing) of Dragon Ball: Final Bout for the Playstation. [[EndingFatigue Viewer ratings began to go into landslide around the Shadow Dragon Saga]] so they abruptly CutShort the series and rushed out a hastily written ending out the door. Yes. Seriously.
284** Except that he wasn't even close to "dead from that huge energy ball". The characters just assumed he had been vaporized, as there was a massive hole in the ground with no Goku on sight. But as we later see, he had just been pushed into the ground by the attack, so he simply emerged and formed the Genki Dama. We also see him lying on the floor after throwing this one, but there was no proof he was dead at that point either. As for the rest, GT went with an open ending, so we can only guess what truly happened, but the only certain thing is that he and Shenlong were gone and weren't coming back. There's also the fact that he vanished ''right after'' the 4-star Dragon Ball merged with him, which may symbolize that he died (the number 4 is attributed with death in Japan).
285* While noting all the above, one thing stands out. While Goku's charging the spirit bomb, how did Omega's blasts not hurt him at all? As far as we know even a resurrected person can clearly take massive damage.
286* Seriously, what happened to the setting!? Back in DBZ, space travel was a big deal, and so was the problem of finding a spaceship. Many years passed since then, fine... but in GT, all of a sudden, Earth is part of a Star Wars-esque Galaxy where space travel is common place, anyone barely reacts at seeing aliens on their planet, and the planets themselves are treated like cities. That's pretty distant from Freeza's Planet Trade Organization...
287** It is inconsistent yes; however there are plenty of perfectly valid justifications. It hasn't just been years it's been ''decades'' since the journey to Namek and Dr Briefs was smart enough to have invented at least two of them in a relatively short space of time (Goku's, the one Vegeta trained in and possibly the one that replaced the ship Vegeta blew up.) Naturally Bulma who is smart enough to invent a Time Machine, a Shrink Watch, the Dragon Radar, the Super Saiyaman Watch etc could have very easily adapted her father's work to create a ship vastly superior to anything that came before. As for the apparent Star Wars like universe teeming with life you yourself unwittedly gave the answer - the end of Frieza's Empire. This would have realistically brought a power vacuum among the aligned worlds and eventually given arise to new interstellar powers and new opportunities including space flight. Also don't forget that planets such as the Machine Empire had enemies on it that were (according to Goku) stronger than Buu so naturally Frieza would have left well alone and as such would have been free to produce common place space flight and advanced technology completely independently. To put it in a real world context imagine the sheer amount of trouble that happened in the wake of the Roman Empire collapsing which not only included the Dark Ages but also allowed over powers and nations to arise that wouldn't have existed otherwise. Incidentally the Earth of the Dragonball Universe features anthropomorphic animals and has hosted several alien invasions including Piccolo and Vegeta so it is probably a little jaded in its reactions to seeing aliens by now.
288** As often happens in Dragon Ball in general, Dragon Ball GT in particular power levels are so hard to scale that as much as we talk about a power vacuum we don't have a real reason to believe there would be one sans Frieza or even that his empire would have collapsed. The average Frieza soldier (which is assumed to be a decent fighter) couldn't take Master Roshi in a fight. It doesn't seem unlikely that Frieza had other soldiers on par with Vegeta who if we believe Raditz sent out for Kakkarot because he thought four Saiyans vs a planet would be easier than three not because he didn't think the three of them could handle it. To the original question just chalk it up to DB in general and DBGT in particular having no idea what it's talking about. Between Piccolo, Raditz and Cell the fact that they were shocked by anything by Buu makes less sense than the fact that the planet that apparently houses 100% of the bad ass in the universe is finally getting some street cred.
289** If the universe was indeed full of planets with fighters capable of challenging Super Saiyans and rivaling Majin Buu that were somehow not touched by Frieza, then the afterlife / Hell should have had a proportional amount of such powerful fighters who passed on across history, who would have only become stronger with all the years of training after death. Yet when Goku was in the afterlife, there was only one Pikkon (who was weaker than [=SSJ2=]) and by Buu saga, there was no one who could hold a candle against Kid Buu. Does it even make sense to consider that in a few decades after Frieza's defeat, suddenly every other planet managed to [[TookALevelInBadass take 10,000 levels in badass]] in such a short time?
290** What makes this worst is when you see gt timeline and according it Rildo has been around for about 50 years.Which raises a new plot hole if Rildo and Dr. Miyuu been around so long why didn't Dr. Miyuu just send Rildo and the sigma team to hunt down and kill all the saiyans back before planet Vegeta got destroyed?
291* How was Baby able to create Dr. Myuu and the rest of the machine mutants?
292** Myuu created Baby, not the other way around.
293*** Actually no, it was later revealed it was indeed Baby that created Myuu and the machine mutants (all while being a fetus mind you). Myuu was actually created by Baby 50 years ago to further Baby's growth, and Baby program Myuu to believe he created Baby when it was really the other way around. Also apparently Baby put a Black star Dragon Ball in Myuu's head 50 year ago even though they were scattered recently. I'm not even kidding GT just makes that little sense.
294*** Maybe Baby implanted the odd command "And if you ever encounter a Dragon Ball, surgically implant it in your head and erase your memory of it."
295* Why does Android 17 look exactly the same as he did in Z? 18 showed signs of aging, so why didn't he?
296** She had to deal with the stress of raising a child. He did not.
297** She didn't age, she cut her hair started to dress differently.
298** Toriyama apparently said that they can age but very slowly. So in GT they should still both look like teens. But Android 18 has a teen daughter now and an aging husband, she probably felt a bit odd looking like a teen, so she cuts her hair and wears clothes suited to what her age should be. She still has no wrinkles, unlike Chichi and Bulma.
299* The Super Saiyan Three transformation was so powerful, it could only be used for about five minutes, due to the massive strain on the user's body. How is it Super Saiyan Four doesn't have these limitations? It is far more powerful, but Goku has no problem staying in it for long periods of time. He even stayed in the form after being knocked out by Baby.
300** Speaking of which that is also a bit inconsistent. On later occasions he got knocked out and turned to normal. In one case he was hit by one of his blasts and turned back into his child form, despite the fact that [=SSJ4=] had withstood a full force Galic Gun from Baby. Consistency anyone?
301* One thing that's strange is the fact the Goten and Trunks never try fusing (at all! not even when they were getting beaten). They know for fact that they are way stronger combine than they are separate so why not use it. where they just afraid of out-staging Goku?
302** Most of these can be answered because the BigDamnedHero.
303** Because there's no point. The two had been out of training for a long while and thus weaker, and even without that would have still been too weak to even contribute against the current threat even while fused. This was specifically brought up. By the time he got [=SSJ4=] Goku was pretty much the only character powerful enough to be relevant anymore. That, and the boys had been out of practice with fusing, they would have been even worse off if they screwed the fusion up.
304** You can't expect anyone to believe that fighting omega syn and super 17 as two [=SSJ1=] is better than fighting as a fused [=SSJ3=]. even if he lost their odds of winning would have been better. and how would they be screwed if they messed up? Goku and Vegeta messed up their fusion against Omega and nothing happen. count that as another plot hole messing up a fusion dance apparently has no repercussion in GT.
305** No, it's completely pointless for Trunks and Goten to fight at all is my point. Omega Shenron is so unbelievably above them that it wouldn't matter if it was 2 [=SSJ1s=] Vs. Omega or a fused [=SSJ3=] Vs. Omega, Omega could have killed them with [[FingerPokeOfDoom a finger poke regardless.]] Hell, the same is true against Great Ape Baby. The two even trying to fight Omega at all amounted to little more than a delaying tactic, so it makes more sense for them to stay split up and thus have two targets for the enemy to go after. Also, where do you get the idea that there's no repercussions to messing up the fusion dance? The only people that even try it are Goku and Vegeta, and they never screw up the fusion at any point, just the second time Goku loses his power at the last second and thus prevents the fusion from being able to work at all.
306*** [=SSJ3=] Gotenks would have been their best shot particularly after both Vegeta and Goku are completely defeated. He would have lasted at least a minute or two, if only as Omega's punching bag, buying them enough time to put a plan together. For fans that hate Gotenks and his antics it would have been satisfying to watch Omega beat the stuffing out of him. A better explanation is that the animators didn't want to animate another character that late in the saga.
307** Also raising the question how the hell can vegeta do fusion dance with goku perfectly on his first try seeing how he have never done the dance in canon and even when you count fusion reborn it still has been over 15 years since he done it that one time and yet was able to pull it off flawlessly in spite of never practicing it in over 15 years. and yet Goten and trunks can't apparently. And they are other times when fusion could have come in handy like during the fight with super 17. doing the fusion dance would have been better idea than charging at him blindly(which resulted in them getting one shoted by super 17). you can't use the whole super 17 is too power for their strongest form nosense since super 17 had a hard fighting goku was a [=SSJ1=] and I Think [=SSJ3=] Gotenk would about as strong as [=SSJ1=] kid Goku.
308*** Vegeta's a hypocrite. He probably derided the fusion in public, but secretly acquired mastery of it, maybe from Trunks, just in case he would need its power in the future. Vegeta has always desired power and is capable of occasionally swallowing his ego to acquire it.
309* Why did baby wait for Goku, Pan and Trunks to return with the blackstar dragon balls before putting his plans into motion? He could have easily used the earth dragon balls to wish for his planet plus immorality or to restore the tuffles.
310** The Black Star Dragon Balls are the most powerful. It would suit Baby's ego to use only the most powerful ones to make his wish upon. Or he believed that Earth dragon balls weren't powerful enough to restore a distant planet that was destroyed decades ago. He may have been right, there could be a time limit on destroyed planets for all we know. Also if Baby made a wish using the Earth Dragon Balls, the shadow dragons would arrive a season early, and the heroes and Baby would both have to deal with them.
311** Another GT plot hole. They didn't think it through, and just wanted the plot to start with the trio coming.
312** It kills two Saiyans with one Makankosappo. He gets the Black Star Dragonballs to make his wish and at the same time ensures that the heroes can't use those Dragonballs against him.
313*** His still could have grab the earth dragon balls while goku was away and just used them later, he could have had 3 wishes.It's makes no sense why he would just choose 1. you mean to tell me that he is worry that the heroes may use the Black star dragonball against him, but is not worry at all about them using earth dragonballs against him? not the mention the fact that the if the earth blows up his new planet would most like be caught in the explosion or get hit with the remains.
314*** Baby's tripping on power throughout his entire saga. He probably figured that by the time the Earth explodes, he'd be well on his way to move out into the larger galaxy to conquer it. He'd either move his planet, or have ships constructed to escape the aftereffects of Earth's destruction. For all we know Baby would call the Earth Dragon Balls 'trash', and only the more powerful Black Star ones are worthy of him making wishes upon. Of course, if he did make a wish using the Earth Dragon Balls, it would summmon the Shadow Dragons early and Baby would have to ally himself with the heroes to stop them.
315** It's possible that was Baby's original plan, but he either couldn't locate them due to lacking a Dragon Radar or he did find one, saw the crack and decided against it to be safe, since he knew the Black Star Dragon Balls were about to fall into his lap anyway.
316* What were Uub and all the other fighters doing for the entirety of the Shadow Dragon saga until it was time for them to supply energy to Goku against Syn Shenron?
317** They acknowledged that Goku wanted to do this himself. Pan being the annoying thing she is didn't care.
318* If the villains on many planets in GT were as strong as Buu, how the hell did Frieza even establish his empire in DBZ when they were around?
319** They had to make the enemies stronger or Goku could just plow through them effortlessly. I admit though, it is stupid.
320** Maybe they pulled [[Anime/{{ResurrectionOfF}} a Golden Freeza]] and trained their ass off so that something like Freeza or Buu doesn't happen again. The android villains do make more sense, considering how a mere human MadScientist was able to make the Androids and Cell.
321* And in addition to the above, if the universe was indeed full of planets with fighters capable of challenging Super Saiyans and rivaling Majin Buu all along that were somehow not touched by Frieza, then how come there was nobody in the afterlife who could come even close to Kid Buu? While we know that the afterlife has fighters capable of challenging Frieza, that could also be because of non-stop training for like...2000 years (as a DBZ episode recounts much to Goku's shock). Surely you expect that some of these powerful fighters near [=SSJ2=] or Buu's level ought to be there. But no. I mean in the 20 years since Buu saga, did every other planet suddenly find a way to make everyone as strong as Buu?
322* How is it that Parapara Brothers, Baby, the Luud Cult,and Dr. Myuu, all extraterrestrials, know about the black star dragon balls? When None of the Z-fighters knows about them nor does anyone on earth.
323** They were probably just looking for Dragon Balls period. They just happened to find Black Star ones, when they were probably looking for Namekian ones, but luckily didn't find it.
324** How does Baby even say he created Dr. Myuu with a dragonball in his head?
325* How did Ledgic realize Goku was a Saiyan simply by deflecting his Kamehameha. 1.)The Kamehameha is not a Saiyan move, 2.)Goku doesn't have a tail(Which they are suppose to have), and 3.)THE SAIYAN RACE WAS SUPPOSELY WIPE OUT OVER 40 FREAKIN YEARS AGO. So what makes him think this child is a Saiyan?
326** Saiyan Aura?
327*** That's not really unbelievable in Dragonball. We know that Ki for a lack of a better term has a flavor or scent if you will. Enough that Dragon Ball Z has two clear examples of people either mistaking a flavor (nobody could figure what was going on with Cell because he tasted like Goku/Vegeta/Frieza/Piccolo all mixed up together and after Kami and Piccolo fuse Goku immediately identifies them as Kamiccolo) so it's not crazy at all that Saiyans taste like Saiyans. It's also plausible that while we can't tell the difference between the races because of the art style that perhaps Saiyans do have distinct enough features to be told apart from humans by anybody who cares to look.
328*** So how does Ledgic know exactly what saiyan aura or ki taste, look, or smell like? no one on the planet knew what a saiyan was except Ledgic and he didn't even know what a super saiyan is.
329*** Ledgic knew about saiyans because he's pretty much the only warrior on that planet. When he saw Goku's performance, he basically reasoned that only a saiyan could have that kind of power. Kinda like how you might recognize an [[Eagleland American for being loud and patriotic]].
330*** So Ledgic knew Goku was a Saiyan by stereotyping him? Goku's performance in battle is not typical of a Saiyan.Remember,Jeice of Ginyu force couldn't even believe that Goku was a Saiyan because of his amazing battle performance, since Saiyans rarely ever have a power level of more than 10,000 they are usual not very strong.Also Ledic stereotyping Goku would still require Ledgic to have some knowledge about Saiyan.
331* General Rildo is shown to be able to use the metal covering the entire surface of Planet M-2 to reconstruct a new body after his current one has been destroyed, yet he dies after a blast from Goku, Pan, and Trunks not even at full power and in base form. Even though there's still metal all over the planet, he's just dies. What the hell I thought he was stronger than Majin Buu!
332* After fighting Goku for numerous episodes as a Great Ape, Baby just leaves Vegeta's body, gets on a ship, tries to make an escape, and then gets blasted into the sun by Goku. The thing about that is not only is it anti-climatic, it also subverts what Baby as a character was doing up to the point. Instead of running away he would have instead realized Goku was stronger than his current host and through some underhanded means try to acquire his body as he had with Goten, Gohan, and Vegeta. And even if he knew that wouldn't work, his hatred for the Saiyans was too great for him to just leave. Really his character would at least have tried to blow himself up or something.
333
334* How is it that Baby vegeta and regular Vegeta were able to transform when they are exposed to Blutz Wave when Vegeta don't have tails. This is necessary for a transformation at least according to Dragon ball, and Dragon ball Z. So what was the point of even pulling out Goku's tail when Saiyains can apparently transform to great apes and [=SSJ4=] even without them.
335** They really did not want to give Vegeta any attention. Even Gogeta [=SSJ4=] was useless.
336*** Nobody knew that raw Blutz waves could turn Saiyans into Great Apes until AFTER they had already pulled Goku's tail out.
337* If the Blutz waves could regrow Vegeta's tail in Baby saga requiring Goku to cut it off to stop the transformed Baby-Vegeta, then how come in the Shadow dragon saga, Vegeta loses his tail after dropping out of [=SSJ4=]?
338* How could Eis Shenron be Nuova Shenron twin brother when the wishes the created the two of them happened no where near the same time. Eis Shenron was create when a wish was used to erase the memories of the whole Buu fiasco and Nuova Shenron was created when created when King Piccolo wished for his youth back. those wishes were made over two decades apart so how can they be twin?!.
339** Perhaps the negative energy-saturated Dragonballs only gave "birth" to them once they were overloaded. Though that raises the question of why don't ''all'' of the Dragons consider each other brothers.
340* It also bugs as to how some shadow dragons can be so much stronger while the wishes made with the Dragonballs would have required far less positive energy, such as Piccolo in DB wishing back his youth. Even if one wished the earth back, the wish ought to have no more energy than what it took to destroy it, and the shadow dragon formed from the equivalent negative energy should be strong enough to destroy earth, say at Cell's level at max, but not so strong as to overpower a Super Saiyan 4. Or is it possible that trying to reverse natural laws requires so much more energy?
341* The ending of GT bugs me. Why would a guy leave his son and wife behind? He didn't know where the dragon was taking him. Also, isn't a bit cruel for chichi to spend the rest of her life alone and manless? Even a woman has needs.
342** A better question would be "why the hell Goku went with shenron in the first place?" seriously there was no reason given to why he did that. he could have stayed with his family and friends.
343** Goku left to become the guardian of the Dragonballs and ensure they were never misused again. This is made pretty explicit in the movie.
344** And why can he not do that sitting in his own house with the Dragonballs safe inside him? Why should he disappear?
345* During the fight with Mutchy Goku was struggled pull a sword out of a wall! In DBZ Goku was able to lift 40ton in base form! This doesn't make sense.
346* Why is Dr.Myuu even in hell? Machines shouldn't have souls. That's the reason why android 16 couldn't brought back. And yet Dr.Myuu is a machine and he is in hell. Same goes for android 19 he is also just a machine.
347** Was it ever confirmed that machines don't have souls? I thought Android 16 stayed dead because they couldn't wish back someone who was never alive, not that he was soulless.
348*** But don't that just raises the question why wasn't Baby in hell?
349* A GT Plot Hole. The villains in HFIL shouldn't have bodies at all.
350** No they did in DBZ.
351* So if all machines can go to afterlife why isn't Baby in hell?
352** Because it wasn't convenient to the plot. Or the writers forgot.
353** Who knows. Baby probably is in Hell, we just didn't see him there and he didn't escape with the others. Dr. Myuu also probably wouldn't have allowed Baby to escape Hell if he could avoid it, just to spite his killer. Or maybe Baby did in fact leave but he was smart enough not to try and tangle with the Z fighters again. That, and he would have also been the only dead villain that would have posed a real threat, so the writers kept him out just so we wouldn't have to go through the Baby saga twice.
354*** The more likely reason is what was mention above "Because it wasn't convenient to the plot. Or the writers just forgot." If Baby was in hell why didn't he help Cell and frieza kill Goku? or at least try to take over Goku's body while he was in hell? If he was out of hell why didn't try to rebuilt his empire and take revenge one more time this is the prefect time. I mean fate gives Baby a second chance at life and revenge and he just turns it down? A second change to restore and avenge the tuffles and destroyed the saiyans and he just not interested? it's not like Dr.Myuu can really stop Baby from escaping hell after all it was Baby the created Dr.Myuu what can he do?
355* How are Zoonama's earthquakes even able to slow down or even affect Goku, Trunks, and Pan? Can't they fly?
356** If they figured that out then there would be no plot.
357* Why does Goku, Trunks, and Pan even play long with Zoonama's demands can't they just beat him up. It's not like he has hostages or anything.
358* Why did none of the Z-fighters even think of following Zoonama's ki signature back to his lair?
359* If Zoonama's whiskers can only predict earthquakes and not make them. then how is that these earthquakes happen at such convenient time for him. You mean to tell me an earthquake just so happens to go off whenever he comes to the villages. what are the odds of that? or the fact that these earthquake happens to go off days apart from one another. that seem really unlikely in fact borderline impossible.
360** Zoonama is able to predict the earthquakes long in advance and thus just shows up to the village when a few are supposed to happen, puts on a show, and thus villagers think he caused them and cower before him, that's pretty much his entire plan.
361*** Then why wasn't his able to predict the massive earthquake that destroyed his lair until moments before it happened? you think if he could predict long in advance he would have already move out. or was he planning to dying a horrible death along with his new wife during their honeymoon after his plan finally works?
362* Why are so many people here whining about plot holes for a series that was the successor to two other series that are basically RuleOfCool personified and have never cared about consistency or making any sense whatsoever? Why do they fault GT for being no less nonsensical than DB or DBZ?
363** The reason for this is because the story in GT has sooo many plot holes and inconsistency that it simply doesn't hold together. It's like the writers wanted the audience to just forget about everything that happen in DBZ and DB. While it is true DBZ and DB has inconsistencies it was mostly due to filler or had no real bearing on the plot or story this is not the case for GT. And even if DBZ and DB where far from being prefect animes that still doesn't justify the poorly written stories all of the plot hole that are in GT, Nor is it a reason not to talk about them.
364** This troper takes GT as a completely different anime.
365* If Baby hates saiyans so much, then why was he so happy to be in Vegeta's body?
366** It's the most powerful body available. Plus imagine the irony -- the remaining saiyans killed by a saiyan.
367* Goku was turned into a kid because the writers wanted the show to be like DB and DBZ, but isn't it a bit selfish(and creepy) that Chi-Chi, a middle-aged woman, is forced to have a 6 year old for a husband? I'm pretty sure cops would be knocking on her door to take her away if she told someone about her "younger husband".
368** Yes it is creepy, and it's strange how Chi-Chi just rolled with it at the end. Also, there is a [[http://osoroshiiyasai.deviantart.com/art/ChiChi-s-worst-day-205433724 fancomic that explains this scenario.]]
369** GT fails to recognize the feelings of all the so-called minor characters.
370* How can Shenron just quit his job and disappear with the dragon balls ? You mean he doesn't need permission from his creator or anything?
371** Same answer as below.
372* Why can't Dende just create a new set of dragon balls?
373** After seeing the dangers, I don't think they want to.
374* Why is [=SSJ4=] Gogeta personality different from how it was in fusion reborn? He acts even more sillier than Vegito, His personality more like Gotenks than anything else.
375** Because Goku has to be the BigDamnedHero.
376* Why did [=SSJ4=] Gogeta waste most of the fight with omega shenron simply mocking him? Even if it was just to remove the negative energy that's covering the earth. Wouldn't make more sense to kill Omega Shenron first and then worry about the negative energy.
377** Same as above.
378** Because he doesn't know that his fusion time is going to be cut short and thus thinks he can mess with Omega for a while. That, and both heroes and villains screwing around when they could just snap their fingers and kill their opponent only for it to backfire is a ridiculously common thing in Dragonball.
379*** Except this time it's completely out of character, Gogeta is a combination of Goku sense of justice and Vegeta seriousness.The Gogeta from Fusion reborn would never goof around with his opponent.he has zero tolerance for evil and shows no mercy for evil beings. When fighting super Janemba he ended that fight in less than 30 seconds. He would have done the same for omega.
380** Or maybe, just maybe, the personalities of both Goku and Vegeta have changed pretty significantly in a few years, resulting in a fused character that's more of a goofball. Vegeta for instance has mellowed out a great deal since DBZ, and Goku has become far more concerned with creating a worthy successor than fighting these days. It's not out of character if there's been character development in the interim.
381*** It still kind of is for Gogeta, this is a complete 180 of his personality it's like if Batman started telling knock knock jokes and asking criminals to pull his finger. it would still be odd even if you claimed he mellowed out over the years. Goku sense Of justice didn't seem diminish too much since the Buu saga nor did Vegeta seriousness for that matter, and seeing how those were Gogeta core personality he still should have acted mostly the same.
382* According to the DBZ time line Dr.Myuu was created by Baby 50 years ago and yet according to Baby he created Dr.Myuu with a Black star Dragon inside his head this doesn't make sense because the Black star Ball only got scattered recently....so what thr hell?
383** It would make sense if Myuu added the Black Star Ball to Baby only recently.
384** I think you misunderstood what I wrote (sorry for the errors) ''the Dragon ball was in Myuu's head'' not in baby's head.
385** Baby states that Myuu was manipulated by him to create his body, not that Baby created Myuu himself.
386*** That still doesn't explain how Baby somehow magically place a Blackstar dragonball in Myuus head 50 freakin years before they got scattered in the first place ,all while not have a body mind you. also yes it does says that baby created Myuu and programmed him too at least according to His bios [[http://dragonball.wikia.com/wiki/Dr._Myuu on wiki]][[https://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Characters/DragonBallGTVillains and tv tropes ]]. GT just makes that little sense.
387*** Maybe the Black Star Dragon balls were projected into the past when they scattered?
388* This falls under the "You failed me" trope. If Dolltaki knew Dr. Myuu would have him killed for his failure, then why did he report back to his planet? Why not flee to the other side of the universe and change his identity? This moron goes back to his master's planet and gets killed by the general.
389** Maybe Dolltaki would have preferred that to spending whatever was left of his life living in fear of Dr. Myuu. Either that, or Dr. Myuu doesn't actually do that very often.
390** If Dolltaki did came back on purpose to face his faith opposed to running and hiding and living the rest of his life in fear then it would a [[OutOfCharacterMoment completely out of character moment]] since acting cowardly, and running and hiding seem to be a really big part of his personality up until this point . Plus he seemed surprised and terrified when he was about to be killed and even begged for his life so I really doubt this was Dolltaki intension. And if it's the latter and Myuu doesn't usually back up his threats then why are so many of his men so scared of him? only possibility I can think up is that Dolltaki honestly thought he could convince Myuu not to kill him, and even then that seems foolish.
391** I meant, maybe he decided that simply facing his fate would have been better than the alternative, or that while Dr. Myuu does kill people who fail him, he doesn't do it all the time so maybe he thought he could be one of the exceptions. Besides, bad guys who fail their superiors for some reason go back to their superiors despite knowing that their boss will probably kill them, this is no different.
392** If getting killed was Dolltaki's intention then why did he seem so scared of dying.
393** Why wouldn't he be?
394** Because this was all apparently apart of his plan, and no one is making him do this. If dying scared him so much he could easily run away or not report back. the universe is very very vast place and they'll probably never ever find him if he did choose to run.
395** Also not only Myuu said he'll killed him but Myuu has already tried to kill him(when he turn Dolltaki into a doll and tried to fed him to one of his machine monsters).So let me see if I got this straight. [[DirtyCoward Dolltaki the Dirty Coward]] [[OutOfCharacterMoment decided to man up and face his fate opposed to running and hiding (in spite of the fact that running and hiding was all he did up until this point)]]. So he reports back to his boss who not only said he'll kill Dolltaki but already tried to once before, and in spite of the fact getting killed was Dolltaki's intension (opposed to running) he seem completely terrify by it. [[SarcasmMode Well, that just makes perfect sense]]
396** He's scared to death of dying, doesn't mean he wasn't ready to die. Contrary to what fiction will tell you, it is rare to find somebody who goes to face their death just stoically taking the bullet. No, they're terrified and they act as such. There are really any number of reasons Dolltaki could have done what he did, it doesn't have to be out of character for him to do. Besides, as I said before, this kind of thing happens a lot in fiction, it doesn't make sense and doesn't have to. It's just something a character does for some reason and that reason isn't always something the audience is privy to.
397** I can't think of that many examples of a Character reporting back to their Insane Boss(who not only said he'll kill him but tried to already) for reasons that were never given or that completely conflicts their character in fiction. and even this does happen from time to time it's bad writing plan and simple. Characters can change and grow over time, but they do not (or should not) suddenly act out of character just of the sake of plot convenience , and a good writer should try to explain character's motives or at least make it apparent. Here they failed, If what you are saying is true and that getting killed was truly Dolltaki's intension ( as conflicting to his character as that maybe) then the writers did a terrible job of establishing it. They gave absolutely zero indication that was his intention. That aside, the show give no logically or sensible reason and that probably because there is none. Facing certain death head on is not something a dirty coward would do especially in this case. I mean Myuu already has a lot on his plate, he trying to collect the Black star dragon balls, he's also tracking the sayain and finding a way to kill them, and trying to revive baby. you think he'll really waste his time and his effort sending a group of killers to hunter down and kill a single minion that he no longer has any use for throughout the entire universe. That could take years, and Myuu has way bigger fish fry.
398
399* What happened to Planet Vegeta/Tuffle after Baby Saga.
400** Presumably it has replaced Earth's moon.
401* Why is it that when Goku's a kid, Pan is rude and disrespectful to him, but when he is in SS4 form and all grown up, she is nice to him? I always find that weird.
402** Maybe his aura makes her get a certain respect for him?
403** Actually, it's doubly so for most viewers as well.
404** Well, would ''you'' want to be rude to a seven-foot tall, very muscular man with red fur, sickly-yellow eyes and large, spiky black hair that extends down to his waist?
405* In episode 3 where Goku's IT fails and the z fighters end up falling from an insane height why didn't they just fly? I mean this happened twice, so you'd think the second time this happens, they would at least remember they can fly.
406* IdiotBall
407** In episode 4 Pan gets hit in the head with a tin can and this almost causes her to cry. Which is weird consider in episode 3 she fell a least 50 feet directly on her head (twice) and shook it off like it was nothing.
408** If you don't concentrate on an oncoming attack you get hurt. In Z, Krillin threw a rock at Goku while Goku was sleeping in SSJ form and it hurt him.
409*** Yeah but getting hit with a rock actually hurts. While getting hit with and empty tin can doesn't. Even if she wasn't concentrating empty tin can can't hurt a normal human.
410* In episode 4 Goku, Pan , and Trunk decides to quietly sneak into Don Kee's castle. Pan insisted that they must not let any of the guards see them and that they shouldn't attack the guards unless they're caught.However all the guards are armed with simple machine gun which does nothing to them.So this whole subtlety thing is completely unnecessary. There simple was no reason why they couldn't just charge in there LeeroyJenkins style and take back their ship.Those guard couldn't possible put any kind of real resistant.
411* In episode 5 Goku, Pan, and Trunks are being hunted down by Don Kee's soldiers, and a good portion of the episode is made up of the Z fighters running and hiding from them. This unnecessary since mostly all the guards can't use ki or even fly and are just armed with guns that do nothing to them. Goku, Trunks, and Pan could have easily defeated Don Kee's entire army (Goku could done this all by himself honestly), kick Don Kee out of power, and freed those financial slaves. Granted they finally do this 3 episodes into the story but they could done all this from the beginning.
412** To the above two, Pan specifically said that she didn't want to cause a commotion, at least in the Japanese original. She was most likely concerned about the guards getting hurt, rather than the trio. It's still a weak reason, but it's the canon one.
413* Why do Goku, Pan, and Trunks try to evade Don Kee's soldiers by jumping from building to building opposed to just flying?
414** It's more dramatic that way. And of course, RuleOfCool.
415** Remember the early years of Superman?
416* Why did they even need to build a new spaceship to find the black star dragon balls? Why not just used the ship made from Goku's capsules. it's should still be there, Vegeta returned it so why not used that? There's enough room in that ship to bring everyone and it would most likely not fall apart like the new one.
417** TechnologyMarchesOn is in effect here. It's been twenty years since their last trip into space so of course the technology would advance enough to make the space pods irrelevant and obsolete. Also, they had to go significantly deeper into space this time around and needed a ship that could make the trip in days rather than the months it takes for Pod style ships.
418** Twenty years ago Humans didn't have technology for deep space travel period! all the tech the Z fighters used for deep space travel were either namekian or Frieza's. now only 20 years later, humans can not only make deep space ships from scratch but these ships are now more advance than the ones made by the former emperor of the galaxy. and yet these new advance ships need maintenance, fuel, can only carry a few people, and is shown having difficulty enter planets atmosphere without crashing and breaking on entry . All of these are issue the "irrelevant and obsolete" model didn't have. In fact won't it be easier to upgrade or tune up the ship made with the saiyan pod than make to make a totally new one from scratch?
419** How do you know the Planetary Trade and Namekian style pods didn't need maintenance and fuel? We only ever see them go to one place and blow up without delving into how they're maintained. Whenever one is brought out of retirement, it's usually repaired and improved upon before setting off. The ship in GT was made specifically for Goku, Trunks and Goten, which is why it seats so few people and ANY ship entering an atmosphere is at risk of breaking up, it's just that Freiza's pods were designed to come crashing down like meteors without any landing gear. If you'll notice, the Namekian pods and Goku's pod both safely land on Namek instead of making giant, smoldering craters upon impact. Humanity as it's portrayed in Dragonball is incredibly advanced compared to us. Just because they didn't have access to interplanetary travel doesn't mean that they won't be able to make advancements on such things when they get it. Hell, Dr. Briefs AND Bumla were both able to adapt and improve on the technology right out the gate.
420*** True, Namekian style pods mostly likely also needed maintenance and fuel too. however the ship used it GT doesn't seem any better. There were times when we seen the GT ship falling apart in mid flight. How exactly is GT ship better than Goku's pod? According to wiki all saiyan ships have strong armor, which allows them to not be crushed on impact when entering atmosphere. so NOT ANY ship entering an atmosphere is at risk of breaking up just the one in GT. so why don't new more advance ship has it? In fact if speed was the only thing that made the old ship irrelevant and obsolete then why couldn't just add rockets to Goku's pod. The new ship is clearly not as durable. Also why just bring 3 people? Wouldn't having a bigger crew make hunter down the dragonball more easier?
421* Why couldn't Baby become a Super Saiyan 4 after transforming? Was it because he was slowly losing his control?
422** The same reason he was able to keep control of the Golden Oozaru form in the first place: he hasn't transformed, Vegeta has. Therefore, it doesn't matter if he has control, because Vegeta has to do that, and he can't since he's being mind controlled.
423* Was Baby meant to be a sympathetic villain like Magneto? A racist guy blinded with hate and bigotry? I'm confused. I can understand a guy being upset that his race was destroyed by the saiyans and wanting revenge against all saiyans, but he comes off as a full blown villain. He's willing to kill his own Tuffle people and "queen" to get what he wants.
424** No. He's completely bent on revenge against the sayians and would resurrect the Tuffle race simply to build an empire upon their backs. He might have been programmed to enact justice for the destruction of the Tuffles and restore them, but it's clear that his evil has corrupted these understandable goals, and now Baby sees himself as a king and would essentially become another intergalactic villain with the same mindset as King Vegeta and Freeza.
425* Can Baby go to the afterlife? Why isn't he roaming the earth with the other revived villains? He never appeared again after he was destroyed.
426* How did old Supreme Kai know about the Super Saiyan 4 transformation all along unless such a powerful Saiyan had existed before? The previous super saiyan shown in Z died after losing control over his own power as an ape.
427** Maybe he gained control right after that. As the Frieza Saga shows planets can take a long time to blow up and that's when done on purpose. A Golden Oozaru just firing wildly could easily destroy a planet in such a way that gave him long enough to gain control but without Instant Transmission he's still SOL.
428** That's a WMG.
429* The Dragon Balls losing their positive energy from all the excess wishes made over the years sounds like it makes sense, but the writers seem to have forgotten the many times the Dragon Balls have been rendered powerless over the years, due to their creator (or Shenron himself) dying. Are we supposed to believe they were restored to the exact same way they were before, with the same positive/negative energy balance, rather than simply starting over? And then there's the time Dende re-energised and improved them after Kami fused with Piccolo. That, more than any else, should have reset the balance.
430* Why does every character in this show have a ridiculously large chin? I haven't watched much of GT, but it seems like every character that wasn't already created before the end of DBZ has an enormous jaw. It actually makes Lord Slug seem realistic.
431* Why didn't Goku just wish himself back into an adult?
432** Because that would scatter the Black Star balls again and the Earth Dragon balls isn't strong enough to undo the wish.
433** I'm not sure about the REAL reasons Goku was turned back into a child by the script writers. Perhaps in an attempt to bring back fans of the original Dragon Ball series? The problem is, what Goku did at 14 years old and could be considered funny (such as punch 13 year-old Chichi when she gets romantic with him), is NOT funny when he is supposed to be a grandfather. MAJOR fail in my opinion. And yes, there were plenty of times when he could have asked for his adult size back.
434** Why would he? Goku being a kid didn't slow him down at all throughout GT until he fought Baby and thus it was shown he couldn't maintain his Super Saiyan 3 form. After that, Goku got Super Saiyan 4 and fixed the issue. Thus, Goku gains decades to his life in exchange for being a kid for a few years until he grows up naturally again. He doesn't really have any motivation to reverse the change.
435* Going meta, why did the creators of GT make Goku's base so stupidly powerful? It's as strong as Buu, making Goku a ludicrous 400x stronger in just 15 years. If they wanted to show how much of a Badass Goku got, they could've done the same effect with him being in his regular Super Saiyan form(which is a more realistic 8 times power increase).
436** They wanted to show Goku's overall growth and that he's ludicrously powerful even without Super Saiyan. This isn't silly since Toriyama did the same thing in ''Resurration 'F''' where base form Goku is ''way'' stronger than he ever was even as a Super Saiyan 3. If anything, it makes ''GT'' base form Goku look mild in comparison.
437** The ''Resurration 'F''' one is given an explanation, Goku and Vegeta now have God-level power and they were also being trained by Whis, hence their base forms were that much more powerful. Here, is there any explanation given?
438* Why doesn't Dr Gero interact with Cell in the slightest? Cell is his masterpiece and while not totally loyal, at least has respect for his maker. Wouldn't it make more sense for Gero to upgrade Cell, or at least acknowledge his existence?
439** Cell was likely too intelligent to go along with what Gero and Muu were planning. and being totally organic, he was likely much harder to upgrade than 17, who still had his mechanical enhancements.
440* So Gogeta's goofiness was a part of a ploy to piss off Omega enough to give him the opportunity to get rid of all the negative karma enveloping the Earth. It just that his plan makes no sense. How does Gogeta know about the Karma ball? How he know that he can convert the karma ball? You mean there is no other way he can remove negative karma without Omega's karma ball? If Gogeta can turn the negative karma in the karma ball into positive just by kicking it, then can't he just kill Omega and purify the planet himself? Was this all just to get Gogeta out of the fight?
441** He doesn't know specifically about the Karma Ball; he knows Omega Shenron is the embodiment of negative energy. He knows energy spreads. Gogeta is able to use positive energy to neutralize Negative Energy, hence why in Fusion Reborn, he used the Stardust Breaker against Janemba. He simply needed Omega Shenron to create a mass of negative energy that he can turn convert by shoving his own Ki into it. As a result, the explosion spread out the positive energy which cancelled out the negative energy poisoning the world.
442* Why does Gogeta have red hair?
443** Red seems to the standard color for Super Sayian 4s.
444** Pretty sure Goku and Vegeta retain their natural black colour even in Super Saiyan 4 form. Gogeta is the only exception.
445** The Super Saiyan 4 forms do have red fur around most of their body that we can see, maybe that's a holdover when they fuse?
446* So why exactly did Goku have to leave with Shenron at the end of GT?
447** Being rewarded for all his good deeds?
448* In a series full of confusion and nonsense, perhaps the biggest question in GT is how Super Saiyan 4 managed to generate magic clothes. Forget aging Son Gokū back to adulthood, where did his original shirt go, how did the form generate completely new pants, shoes, armbands, and ''obi'', and how did he get his original clothing back when he reverted to his base state (when that crap should have been destroyed by his sudden size increase, never mind the fact that he should be naked, as he was a Giant Monkey only moments before his first transformation into the form). Vegeta isn't exempt, losing his shirt, and gaining new gloves — again, despite the fact that he'd become a Giant Monkey just moments before, and thus lost his clothes. Just....how?
449** Piccolo and a few other fighters we've seen on the show have a technique called Magic Materialization, which enables them to create objects from kai. Either Goku at some point, mastered the same technique, or Super Saiyan 4 is just so powerful that he's unconsciously using kai to create the clothes from nothing.
450** The [=SSJ4=] clothes come from the same place as Gotenks and Gogeta's Metamoran attire.
451* The original Shenron died when Kami and Piccolo fused, and Dende created a new one. So why do the wishes made to the original Shenron count? Don't tell me they were made off-screen, because they explicitly mention the previous instances where they were used!
452** Dende used the original dragon as a template instead of starting from scratch. In doing so he essentially just took the old Dragon Balls and made improvements to them. They are the same set, just under new management.
453* Why wasn't Vegeta going with them on the hunt for the Black Star Dragon Balls? He's the second most powerful being on Earth, and he's also the most knowledgeable about space travel. I imagine that if he went along, things would be concluded a lot quicker due to Vegeta's willingness to kill opponents: Zoonama, the giant, Don Kee, Ledgic, the Parapara Brothers, Cardinal Mutchie Mutchie, Dolltaki would all meet their ends by getting kai blasted by Vegeta. Baby waking up to encounter Vegeta would have been interesting to see, as well as Vegeta lecturing Pan on her Sayian heritage and telling her stories about it. There was a missed opportunity for storytelling there.
454* So, why are Goku Jr. and Vegeta Jr. named that way anyways? Jr. is only used in a name when a child has the same name as a parent, and if the child gives one of their children the same name, the grandson of (insert name here) Sr. becomes (insert name here) the Third.
455** And there's a Bulma Jr., which is unusual because it's very uncommon in the real world for a female to get the Jr. suffix. It does happen on occasion, but it's rare.
456** Interestingly, her full name is [[WordOfGod apparently]] Bulma "Leigh". Which might be her full name.
457* Why do Chi Chi and Videl look alike? They could pass off as sisters.
458** Toriyama's skill in drawing different characters (or lack thereof). Go check how many characters look alike in the Dragon Quest franchise, it'll make your head spin.
459* Another Vegeta Jr. related question, exactly how skilled is the kid? I mean we see he knows the flying technique and can go Super Saiyan, but does he know any energy manipulating techniques?
460* What was the point of Goku stripping himself before diving into Tsunama's cave if he brought his clothes with himself tied up to his head, ensuring that they still get wet?

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