| 1 | !Other Fridge Pages |
| 2 | * ''Fridge/DragonBallZ'' |
| 3 | * ''Fridge/DragonBallSuper'' |
| 4 | ---- |
| 5 | [[folder:Franchise In General]] |
| 6 | !!FridgeBrilliance |
| 7 | * Muten Roshi's signature move is the Kamehameha. In Hawaii [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_Day there]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/House_of_Kamehameha were]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_I five]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_II kings]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_III named]] [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_IV Kameha]][[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kamehameha_V meha]]. Muten Roshi lives on a tropical island and has a penchant for wearing Hawaiian shirts, and he hangs out with a turtle. |
| 8 | ** "Kame" means turtle. Kamehameha roughly means "turtle school attack". |
| 9 | *** "Turtle school ''wave''". Anyway, the connection with King Kamehameha was intentional. WordOfGod stated his wife come with this pun for him. |
| 10 | ** It's actually "Turtle Destruction Wave"/"Turtle Devastation Wave". |
| 11 | ** The series has referred to it as the "Kamehameha Wave" several times, especially in the original series. So it's the [[DepartmentOfRedundancyDepartment Turtle Destruction Wave Wave]], then? |
| 12 | *** In the original Japanese Manga/Anime, the Kamehameha is seldom called the "Kamehameha Wave". That was added into the dub. |
| 13 | * Why did it take Roshi to learn the Kamehameha (his own move) longer than Goku did in a matter of moments? Simple, it's extremely hard to create a technique, even longer to master it. Goku simply learned it, Roshi created it, so he needed more time to perfect it. |
| 14 | * The existence of the many non-canon movies used to bug me. However, I remembered what Trunks said about the nature of time travel and the existence of multiple timelines. Then I realized- they may not be canon in ''this'' timeline, but they are in ''others''. |
| 15 | ** Actually they are. The movies ''[[Anime/DragonBallZTheWorldsStrongest World's Strongest]]'', ''Anime/TheTreeOfMight'' and ''[[Anime/DragonBallZLordSlug Lord Slug]]'' take place in an alternate timeline where Goku arrived in time to save the other fighters from Vegeta and Nappa. Yamcha and the others never died so there was no need to go to Namek. |
| 16 | *** Not quite, in ''The Worlds Strongest'' during Gohan's little song it shows a flashback of Piccolo sacrificing himself to stop Nappa's attack. The only way these 3 movies could take place is in the 3 years before the Androids, though even that causes some continuity problems, but less so. |
| 17 | *** Maybe in that timeline, Goku arrived in time to give Piccolo a senzu bean? |
| 18 | *** The way this troper sees it, Lord Slug takes place in a timeline where Goku arrived in time to save Piccolo and defeat the Saiyans, World's Strongest takes place in a timeline where Vegeta lost his BeamOWar with Goku and died, and Tree of Might takes place in a timeline where Goku's Spirit Bomb killed Frieza and he never needed to go Super Saiyan to beat him. |
| 19 | * Piccolo's transition from GoodIsNotNice loner to TeamDad makes a lot of sense when you take into consideration that he takes on aspects of the personality of those he fused with. Considering fused with [[BigBrotherMentor Nail]] and then ''Kami'', it makes a lot of sense in-story why Piccolo [[DefrostingIceQueen defrosted]] the way he did. |
| 20 | ** And on the subject of Piccolo, why keep the name of his EvilCounterpart? In Namekian, according to WordOfGod, Piccolo means "Another World". And since Kami is a title, not a name, Piccolo was probably adopted by the Namekian when he couldn't remember his name. Even deeper, the titles "King Piccolo" and "Kami (Piccolo)" would translate to King and God, respectively, of another world! |
| 21 | * A more Meta Example. My entire experience for the anime was greatly enhanced when I stopped looking at it as a fighting anime and started looking at it as KabukiTheater. Once I did that, the unbearably long {{Power Up}}s and poses and glowing and CallingYourAttacks were completely understandable and even enjoyable. Tropers/vp21ct |
| 22 | ** Spot on. Thanks for the tip. |
| 23 | * GT's main three villains share similarities to the three main villains of Z: |
| 24 | ** Baby: a conqueror from outer space with ties to the Saiyan race (like Frieza) |
| 25 | ** Super 17: An android created by Dr. Gero (partially in this case) who absorbs another of Gero's androids to become stronger (Cell) |
| 26 | ** Omega Shenron: An unspeakably powerful force that threatens the universe just by existing, which not even fusion can defeat, and takes a spirit bomb powered by everyone Goku's met to destroy (Buu) |
| 27 | ** Even better than that, the original Dragon Ball's three villains followed a similar format: |
| 28 | *** Emperor Pilaf wanted to conquer the Earth by collecting the Dragon Balls. He was ultimately thwarted when Goku transformed into an Oozaru, just like how Frieza was defeated when Goku transformed into a Super Saiyan. |
| 29 | *** The Red Ribbon saga introduced the first android to make an appearance, #8. Dr. Gero was also the Red Ribbon Army's head scientist at the time. |
| 30 | *** King Piccolo was the embodiment of evil that was sealed away long ago but was released back onto the Earth. In order to defeat him, Goku had to drink Korin's Ultra Divine Water (not to be mistaken for Korin's Sacred Water). King Piccolo was ultimately reincarnated into Piccolo Jr., who would fight Goku in the World Martial Arts Tournament. Sound familiar to anyone? |
| 31 | * The number of characters that belong to clans whose names adhere to a specific theme makes more sense once Videl pointed out that surnames have fallen out of fashion. |
| 32 | ** Going further with this; note how the Son family live by traditional Eastern customs while the Metropolitan characters (who are implied to be inspired by Western civilisation) see family names as quaint and in the case of Bulma and Videl seek to step out of their parent's shadows. Also, note how any character that does have an Eastern influence but no family ties is introduced with less than admirable qualities. Creator/AkiraToriyama was essentially writing a Collectivist commentary. |
| 33 | * While Gohan having a tail despite all of the other Saiyan/human hybrids being tailless might ''seem'' like a PlotHole, and ''was'' [[WatsonianVersusDoylist caused by Toriyama simply forgetting that hybrids have tails]], it actually makes a surprising amount of biological sense because of one thing: ''Humans'' can have tails, too... but it's a recessive trait. Keeping in mind that AllGenesAreCodominant, this suggests that the human and Saiyan tail genes are similar enough combine with each other to generate the hybrid's tail. Which, in turn, means that hybrid tails are about as recessive as human tails, and the Saiyan tail genes will only be able to generate a tail in hybrids that get the right tail genes from their human parent, too. |
| 34 | ** Specifically, this ''may'' potentially be justified as tails being a recessive trait in hybrids, and needing to be inherited from both parents; all pure-blooded Saiyans have tail genes, but due to its vestigial nature, it's '''extremely''' rare for a human to have a tail (with less than 30 known cases since 1884). If this is the case, then Gohan inherited vestigial tail genes from Chi-Chi, which were enough for his Saiyan tail genes to latch onto and develop a tail. As Gohan is the only hybrid known to have a tail, and neither Goten, Kid Trunks, nor Pan had/have one (Future Trunks' tail or lack thereof is unknown), him inheriting extremely recessive genes may turn what appears to be a SeriesContinuityError into a case of FridgeBrilliance. |
| 35 | * Namekians only needing water to live while both King Piccolo and Piccolo Jr. are shown eating might seem like a {{retcon}}, to the point Piccolo is afterward shown simply drinking in the Afterlife. However, conditions on Namek and Earth are noticibly different. Namek have a greenish water that may be filled with microorganisms and alge that Namekians may be surviving off of, and on top of that Namek has at least 1 sun in the sky at all times making photosythesis constantly occurring. Meanwhile, Earth has only 1 sun and there's nights, while the water is blueish so a Namekian may not get everything he needs to survive simply by drinking water. Both King Piccolo and Piccolo Jr. were supplementing their nutritional requirements by eating food, something Piccolo Jr. doesn't need to do when he's dead. |
| 36 | * Broly is missing from both the ''[[Anime/DragonBallZFusionReborn Fusion Reborn]]'' movie and the Super 17 saga of ''Anime/DragonBallGT'' when all the villains escape from hell (despite other movie villains appearing in both situations and Broly being one of the most popular movie villains), it just now occurred to me that at the end of the ''[[Anime/DragonBallZBioBroly Bio-Broly]]'' movie Goku and Pikkon got sent to hell to stop Broly from causing trouble...They must have killed him, which would have wiped him out of existence. |
| 37 | ** If GT is anything to go by, getting killed in Hell doesn't wipe you out of existence. Goku accidentally killed Frieza and Cell (and no guessing here, they were frozen solid and shattered), and they show up fine in the next episode, tied up and in a cage. |
| 38 | *** And they can both survive being ripped apart anyway. |
| 39 | *** Maybe not killed him permanently then, but did something to ensure when all the other villains escaped Broly was still too stuck to get out. |
| 40 | * The one time the Saiyan-Tuffle War is told in any detail we're told the Tuffle actually had the upper hand for years until the night the Saiyan went Great Ape on them, in spite of the Saiyan at the time having both the mobility of a guerilla force and, thanks to their phisiology, far greater firepower. Seems strange... Except we're also shown the Tuffle had ''scouters''. The Tuffle always saw the Saiyan attacks coming and would concentrate enough numbers to overwhelm their individually stronger enemies, and the Saiyan couldn't hide as the Tuffle could easily track them down and attack them in their homes with overwhelming numbers. This continued until the full moon, when the Saiyan, thanks to their transformation, suddenly became too strong for the targeted cities to possibly defend against, allowing the Saiyan to deal a crippling blow and turn the tide. |
| 41 | ** The war is also likely why the Saiyan developed the False Moon technique. Either the one full moon night hadn't been enough to fully turn the tide or King Vegeta wanted to play it safe - either way having a few Saiyan capable of creating artificial full moons at will would have been an immense strategic asset capable of fully turning the tide or speed up the war. |
| 42 | ** The war is also why in GT Baby praises King Vegeta's intelligence in spite of his poor track record (missing Frieza's plan to wipe out the Saiyan when even low class ones were picking weird vibes, [[TooDumbToLive trying to scam Beerus]], and reacting to Broly's immense potential by trying to kill him rather than making him into a loyal soldier). That's almost certainly due the full moon attack, in which the Saiyan destroyed hundreds of Tuffle cities... And went directly after the factories that manufactured the Tuffle weapons and scouters, reducing their war making potential far more than the military losses of that night. Baby knew of the genius strategy that in a single night crippled the Tuffle's ability to wage war and sentenced them to extinction, not of his later stupid decisions. |
| 43 | * The Saiyans' ability to grow stronger after recovering from great injury isn't that far-fetched in reality. In real life, lightly damaged muscles always heal back stronger than they were before, which is why humans build strength by lifting weights to cause controlled damage to their muscles. The Saiyans might have a process similar to this, but for their entire body instead of only the affected muscle. |
| 44 | |
| 45 | !!FridgeHorror |
| 46 | * Given that Beerus is canonically capable of destroying galaxies and that his sun-like energy ball is supposedly his strongest attack, it follows that even if Goku had actually deflected it, he still wouldn't have saved the Earth from the blast radius. (Is it possible that he actually knew this and was trying to absorb it all along?) |
| 47 | * What would've happened if Cell came ''after'' Majin Buu? That means, in addition to having Frieza's cells, he'd have ''Buu's'' as well. Let that thought sit in you for a while. |
| 48 | ** Assuming Majin Buu is made of organic matter and not magic bubblegum. |
| 49 | *** From all we've seen of Buu, that prospect is ''even more'' terrifying. |
| 50 | ** Buu's incorporated organic beings into his makeup through absorption, so it would be moot. |
| 51 | ** There's this video game called ''Videogame/DragonBallFighterz'', that answers this question, and the result is not pretty. Well, it wouldn't have been if said scenario happened immediately after Buu. Luckily for the protagonists, it's well into ''Anime/DragonBallSuper'' before it happens. |
| 52 | [[/folder]] |
| 53 | |
| 54 | [[folder:Original Series]] |
| 55 | !!FridgeBrilliance |
| 56 | * Not exactly sure where to put this, but as I was watching ''Dragon Ball Z Kai'' I realized a human and a Saiyan have fertile offspring, so that means biologically humans and Saiyan are the same species. |
| 57 | ** Not at all. What it means biologically is that they have the same number of chromosomes. Furthermore, even if they have different numbers of chromosomes, chromosome doubling through mitotic/meiotic nondisjunction can create fertile hybrid organisms which are able to produce viable offspring when mated with a member of one of the species the hybrid was derived from. |
| 58 | *** Still doesn't make a lick of sense, as humans believe they can't mate with chimpanzees (our closest biological relative; though no one has had the Dragon Balls to try crossing gametes in a lab. It's just a matter of "if it looks human, it can mate with a human" nonsense thinking. |
| 59 | ** Humans and Saiyans are definitely in the same genus then, and this all depends on if you define species as "capable of producing fertile offspring" or "regularly produce fertile offspring". |
| 60 | * Why is it that Gohan always seems to be just strong enough for any given situation? Because he trained with Piccolo, and the big green guy beat seven shades of hell out of him on a constant basis. Saiyans, even Half-Saiyans, get stronger every time they get themselves beaten into a fine paste. It could be that Gohan was Super Saiyan material all along and just didn't know how to control it, instead deciding subconsciously to be just a shade weaker than the strongest person he knew at the time, Piccolo. As time goes on, he learns to control it better, with occasional outbursts of "Holy Crap" power when he gets angry (see: him kicking around Types 2 and 3 Frieza after 1) impaling Krillin and 2) beating the crap out of surrogate father Piccolo). One of Gohan's inner monologues during the Cell saga suggests that, if he had been more prepared, more in control, it would have been ''him'' beating Frieza into a fine mist on Namek rather than his father. |
| 61 | * Why was Goku the first Saiyan in millennia to reach Super Saiyan? It's stated that the trigger for the Super Saiyan transformation is ''anger''. Specifically, anger over the death of Krillin, his best friend since childhood. Compare to pre-HeelFaceTurn Vegeta, who didn't hesitate to kill Nappa despite the fact that he's been Vegeta's constant companion since the Saiyan's extinction. Saiyans were raised from birth to be warriors and conquerors, and a big part of that was having little to no respect for the value of life, be it friend or foe. Goku was probably the first Saiyan in ages to truly care about someone other than himself, and as such was the first in ages to feel genuine anguish when he lost that someone. It's really the ultimate case of BewareTheNiceOnes. |
| 62 | ** This also goes a long way to explaining why the ''very'' sensitive Gohan was the first to reach Super Saiyan 2. |
| 63 | ** If Episode of Bardock is considered Canon, then it would make perfect sense why Goku would be the first in millennia to become a Super Saiyan. [[spoiler: His father was the ''first'' Super Saiyan. It runs in his blood.]] |
| 64 | * Why is it called a Hyperbolic Time Chamber? It exaggerates time. |
| 65 | ** I think it derives from hyperbol'''a''', not hyperbol'''e''' (you know, all of that stuff with the theory of relativity, time slowing down as you speed up until it reaches an asymptote at the speed of light)... but I like this interpretation. |
| 66 | *** The reason those two words are similar is that they have a common root, meaning "to go beyond." Concerning hyperbole, the meaning is obvious. Concerning hyperbola, a hyperbola is an intersection between a hollow, infinite cone, and a plane whose slope is greater than the slope of the cone's side. |
| 67 | * I originally believed that Goku told Gohan to finish off Cell quickly because then Cell would be dead and it would be all over and done with. After watching Kai, I realized that Goku was telling him this because 1) he had been in the exact same situation on Namek versus Frieza, and the trademark cockiness/ruthlessness of the SSJ transformation had nearly cost him his life, and 2) Goku probably realized that Cell, having Frieza's DNA in him, would react in the same way as Frieza did upon being overmatched: he would try to [[TakingYouWithMe destroy the planet]]. |
| 68 | * So what's this about Frieza saying it would take 5 minutes to blow up Namek, and it really taking umpteen episodes? Well, one could more than likely chalk that up in large part to the fact that by that point in the series, characters had long since been fighting at greater speeds than the human eye could normally track, and Goku and Frieza had started to gain speeds so high not even the already supersonic characters could track their movements. The death ball may well have been taking approximately 5 minutes to destroy Namek, but considering the show had to considerably "slow down" the Goku v. Frieza fight for us humans to see, it didn't translate into as short of a show-time. |
| 69 | ** The speed at which they would be fighting is fair enough a point, but the dialogue that Goku and Frieza exchange with one another lasts much longer than 5 minutes. Far more believable alternatives include the possibility that Frieza vastly underestimated the amount of time it would time for Namek to explode or that Frieza's perception of a minute is different from ours given that he is an alien. |
| 70 | *** Or maybe Namek has a different time scale than Earth. Who's to say that 5 minutes in Namekian time is the same as 5 minutes in Earth time? |
| 71 | *** Not Namekian time. Perhaps whatever measure of time Frieza is used to using. |
| 72 | *** Frieza DID in fact underestimate the time it would take for Namek to blow up. In the English dub at least, he actually points out when the five minutes have already gone by, and sounds rather surprised the planet is still intact. |
| 73 | *** This troper is a fan of the DBZ abridged series's explanation that Frieza didn't actually know what a minute was. |
| 74 | *** During Krillin and "Jackie Chun"'s fight during the 21st Budokai Tenkaichi there is a point where the announcer asks the two to reenact what they just did, as it happened too fast for the normal humans to see. Apparently, this included some dialog (specifically Rock Paper Scissors) in the middle of it, so the Z-Fighters and villains can conceivably have entire conversations in the blink of an eye. |
| 75 | *** Further evidence for this is seen earlier in the saga. Goku used the kaioken which lasts for a heartbeat, while Ginyu and Jeice had a small conversation with each other. |
| 76 | *** This troper figured it to be a combination of pragmatism and stress: the former because Frieza, even if he could survive the planetary explosion, would've been rendered severely weakened afterwards (and consider how he blew up Planet Vegeta, from the comfort of his spaceship, in his most restricted form, and with a much larger death ball; on Namek he would've been at point-blank range). As for the latter, he's getting his shit pushed in by a Saiyan who, just minutes ago, was barely a threat, and is now knocking him senseless. Up to that point, Frieza was the strongest being in Universe 7, with nobody able to even threaten him outside of Beerus (the God of Destruction) or Buu (an ancient magical being). Goku going Super Saiyan and being able to match / exceed him likely rattled Frieza in a way that nothing else ever did, which would cause him to panic, not quite putting his all into the Death Ball aimed at Namek's core. |
| 77 | * I was rereading the character page and noticed that Gohan's SSJ 2 form was listed under DarkMessiah. Gohan, even more than his father, seems to have a very high value for life in general (even animals), which is why normally he doesn't seem able to outright kill his opponents. But when Cell killed 16 (angering him enough to get into that form), it's likely that, to him, Cell's life had lost all value. And if you're not considered alive to him, tearing you limb from limb won't quite affect him emotionally. |
| 78 | ** So... Gohan briefly became a SociopathicHero. And this isn't FridgeHorror for some reason!? |
| 79 | * After the Frieza Saga, the Zenkai ability all Saiyan's possess, to get excessively stronger after suffering a near-fatal defeat, seems to vanish completely after all Saiyan's have become Super Saiyans? The beatdown Vegeta received from Android 18 and then being healed later should have been enough to widen the gap, but we had to endure the training. The same with Gohan, in the Buu Saga, who was beaten nearly to death by Super Buu w/Gotenks and Dende healed him. Not a single increase. So, I asked a friend of mine, and he decided upon the fact that Zenkai itself is a rudimentary form of Super Saiyan, as it increases power with a certain trigger (near death, healing), Super Saiyan increases it with a certain trigger (anger, desire). Super Saiyan is simply an extreme, conscious version of Zenkai. |
| 80 | ** This is even better. Think about how the Saiyan's power suddenly started skyrocketing due to zenkai with boosts going into double digits. This is around the point where the characters' power levels are going from 50,000-180,000 to around a few million. Vegeta, Gohan, and especially Goku (for one got a 33x increase making him strong enough to fight Frieza's 4th form) get their powers boosted past the 7 digit mark. This makes their power levels high enough to bring the Super Saiyan transformation within reach. This suggests that at that point Zenkai is no longer just a healing factor. When there is a potential to ascend to a much higher level of power the '''Zenkai becomes the Saiyan's own Unlock Potential ability''', and its sole purpose at that point is to awaken enough power to allow a Super Saiyan transformation to happen. After that, it again goes back to a healing factor and doesn't provide much significant boost to be noticed. |
| 81 | *** The notable exception to all this? ''Cell''. He may have Saiyan cells and a power level of a Super Saiyan, but he's ''neither'' of these. He can't go Super Saiyan, to begin with, so Zenkai boosted his power level dramatically when he survived his own suicide bomb attempt. |
| 82 | ** A simpler explanation is that the Zenkais became obsolete once Frieza reached his final form. Goku gained Zenkais whilst training, while Vegeta just recovered from injuries. Goku's method helped his mind keep up with his body and he could push himself to his limit and beyond, while Vegeta never seemed to push himself at all and was killed by a foe who was naturally better than himself. Once Vegeta realised that he couldn't rely on a cheat code to win any more fights, he started taking his training much more seriously. |
| 83 | ** It's likely that the Zenkai just isn't triggered anywhere near as much as it was before, and when it is it just isn't enough to make a significant difference anymore. The number of times past the Frieza Saga that the Saiyans are beaten down to near death and recover from it is a fraction of what they were during that saga when the ability was introduced. Vegeta is beaten down by 18 then goes off to train with Trunks, then is beaten down by Cell with Trunks following not long after, while Goku's closest brush with death the entire saga is the Heart Virus. Gohan himself never even really gets beaten down until he gets blasted by Cell before their beam struggle after recovering from which he had no need to demonstrate increased power, then in his first fight with Majin Buu upon which he goes to train with Supreme Kai. With Cell it's not particularly helpful because his own Zenkai ability cancels it out, while Majin Buu is simply so powerful and keeps getting significantly stronger throughout the saga that despite beating down the Saiyan characters repeatedly it's not enough to catch up with him on its own. They also don't have a bunch of Sensu Beans floating about to heal injuries from all the time so they have to be a lot more careful not to hurt themselves too much during training. |
| 84 | * It's noted on this wiki that Piccolo acts very differently in his first appearance in the 23d World Martial Arts Tournament than he does in all later appearances. When I re-watched those episodes, I noticed that his mad, card-carrying villain persona is a lot like his father's. The fridge brilliance- Piccolo was only three years old at the time of the Tournament, but he has his father's memories. So, at the Tournament, he hadn't really had much life experience, and so acted based on his memories, but by the time he appears later on in "Z", he's had more time to develop his own personality- the stoic JerkWithAHeartOfGold he is for the rest of the series. -{{Tropers/Bergil}} |
| 85 | * So Frieza's organization conquers planets and then sells them to the highest bidder. Maybe this goes without saying, but why exactly does Frieza need money? Up until Goku came along, he was the most powerful being in the known universe, and he clearly wasn't above slaughtering entire races to have his way. What purpose does money serve to a guy so feared and strong that he can demand whatever he wants at any time he wants? |
| 86 | ** First off, you must remember that Frieza did not start the Planet Trade Organization or whatever it's called. He has parents, at least a dad. And if you take the Episode of Bardock into consideration, we have Chilled, his ancestor. They must have established the Organization a long time before Freiza was born. He's just running it to keep it in the family. Plus, he's WickedCultured. The latter is more noticeable in Kai. |
| 87 | * This is probably overthinking things but here goes... The laws of thermodynamics state that energy cannot move from a low energy place to a high energy place unless a greater amount of energy moves from a high place to a low place. Therefore it must take even more energy to focus a Ki blast than there is in the blast itself. (Think of it as the electricity requirement of an air conditioner.) No wonder everyone is constantly overestimating their own attacks. They feel like they should be much stronger than they really are. |
| 88 | ** To take that thought further and include Newton's Laws of Motion - it's shown often that Ki attacks exert a force on anyone they hit, pushing them around. The third law of motion states (simply): anyone applying a force experiences an equal force in the opposite direction. To stop themselves flying backwards, they need to apply equal forces both forward and backward - one in the form of the Ki blast, and the other with their general flight ability. Any Ki blast that does not move the user is, ''at best'', only half the user's maximum output. |
| 89 | * Uub is the good reincarnation of the final villain of the last arc, who Goku meets at the World Martial Arts Tournament. Remind you of anybody? |
| 90 | * A mysterious character who appears around the start of their debut arc, who smirks in a way that makes them look evil, who ultimately has arrived to work against the real villain of the arc and has purple as their main color. Now, am I talking about Future Trunks or Supreme Kai? |
| 91 | * After first displaying the Kamehameha attack, Roshi explained that it would take a human 50 years of training in order to accomplish the technique, but after seeing the attack only once, Goku was able to perform a much weaker version on his first try. As Dragon Ball Z would later show, Saiyans (and most other alien beings, it would seem) are able to use Ki attacks practically as second nature. So when Goku first used the attack, he was acting on his natural Saiyan instincts, allowing him to perform it with no prior training, unlike everyone else (sans Tien who has some sort of copying ability), who took months or years to be able to use the attack effectively. The human students were practically prodigies, but for Goku, it was simple instinct. |
| 92 | ** WordOfGod says Tien is alien which helps further prove this theory. |
| 93 | ** On the contrary, disproving your theory is the fact that Yamcha and Krillin both used the Kamehameha without any specific training in learning how to use the move. Yamcha whipped it out unexpectedly during a tournament (which terrified Roshi, as he yelled and pleaded for Yamcha to not use it because he didn't think he could handle it) and actually created a very impressive wave that rivaled a devastating attack of Tien's. Krillin then also used the wave for the first time later in the same tournament with absolutely no training in learning the wave (which again terrified Rosh, who once again pleaded and yelled at Krillin to not use it because he didn't think he could handle it, either), and of course, yet again, Krillin's wave was very impressive for his first. Granted he used it as a distraction to get a sneak attack on Goku and the wave didn't faze Goku at all, but the wave was still fantastic for having no training using it. It's not an exclusive ability to Saiyans, we're just dealing with an extraordinary group of martial artists in this series. - Tropers/EBsessed |
| 94 | ** Note that Roshi made that comment after performing the MAX Power Kamehameha that destroyed a mountain by ''accident'', not the regular and less powerful variant. That likely threw off the estimate. |
| 95 | * A nice bit of musical foreshadowing during the beginning of the Android Saga: the music playing when [[KidFromTheFuture Trunks]] briefly talks with Vegeta while waiting for Goku is the same one that plays during the ''Anime/DragonBallZ'' EyeCatch featuring Goku and Gohan |
| 96 | * Goku's [[ExpositionBeam ability to read minds]] seems [[NewPowersAsThePlotDemands to come out of nowhere]], but reading the earlier parts of the series, its use seems to be a sign that the person's a great martial arts master. (Nam's comment to Master Roshi during the first TournamentArc indicates this, as well as what Korin says when he first meets Goku) If Goku doesn't qualify as a master by this point, then who does? |
| 97 | ** Au contraire, my fellow troper. Goku's ability to read minds does not come out of nowhere. The earliest reference to his psychic abilities in the timeline is during ''Bardock: The Father of Goku'' when Bardock says "You see it too, don't you?" in reference to Goku when he was having visions of the future. The next time Goku shows psychic ability is during Dragon Ball after drinking the Ultra Divine Water, which nearly kills him. He awakens, having visions of the past, present, and future, and he has a sudden calm, clear understanding of things. The water has the ability to tap into one's hidden potential, similar to Guru's ability to unlock an individual's hidden potential, and when Goku drank it, the water awakened the dormant psychic ability lying within him. It's stated that if one does not have "the power within him," the water will kill him, which implies that it will kill anyone who drinks it and doesn't have hidden potential within them. Goku then develops this ability during his training in 100x gravity while traveling to Namek, as stated by him when he arrives and reads Krillin's mind, saying when Krillin asked how he got the ability to do so (paraphrasing; I don't have the quote on hand), "I don't know, I was training in 100x gravity and something happened. I suddenly had this strange new ability within me." All of this also explains why Goku saw Vegeta and Nappa in his nightmare in the ''Princess Snake'' episode of the Saiyan saga despite having not seen them himself yet, and why he also saw the Androids and their pink truck in his nightmare during the ''Unwelcome Discovery'' episode of the Androids saga despite having not seen them yet, either. - Tropers/EBsessed |
| 98 | * Future!Trunks is normally quite pragmatic in killing his enemies, but takes time to fool around with Frieza and his army before finishing him off. Keep in mind that Trunks has spent nearly his entire life fighting to survive in a world besieged by two Androids he's completely powerless against. Frieza was probably the first enemy Trunks had ever faced that not only was evil enough to warrant killing but that Trunks KNEW he was stronger than. He was taking out a lifetime of frustrations at feeling powerless on Frieza. He takes out King Cold quickly, possibly because, while we don't see it, King Cold may be able to transform and thus Trunks wanted to kill him before he did so on the off chance that King Cold's higher forms exceeded his. |
| 99 | * Right at the beginning of the Buu Arc, Vegeta and Trunks are training, and Vegeta promises to take Trunks to the park if Trunks lands a punch on Vegeta. After Trunks does, Vegeta reflexively punches Trunks, and Trunks starts tearing up. Vegeta then yells at him for crying, starts to leave, then says they're going to the park, to Trunks' delight. Is this Vegeta keeping a promise as a warrior? No. Is this Vegeta doing something a father should do? Kinda. The real reason: he's seen his son die once before, as a result of his own mistake (Future Trunks vs. Cell, who Vegeta had a chance to stop long before then but didn't because of hubris), and whenever he realizes he's acting like an ass to Trunks, that image likely pops into his head, makes him remember how precious his son is to him, and genuinely makes him want to coddle Trunks a little (remember that to a Saiyan, being nice to a kid in any manner is probably "coddling"). |
| 100 | ** Or possibly to persuade him from telling Bulma, whom likely [[MamaBear wouldn't have reacted very well]]. |
| 101 | ** Parenting is a struggle for those who grew up in abusive environments. Often the initial reaction to a child's behavior is the same reaction their parents would have. It takes a conscious effort to check that reaction and choose a different response. In a series with so many fantastic elements, Vegeta's efforts to be better than his father are poignantly ''real''. |
| 102 | * At first glance, cosmology in Dragon Ball makes zero sense. Planets have local Gods, Kami, whose only purpose seems to be training warriors and guiding heroic souls into the afterlife. In the afterlife, heroic souls can meet with the Kaio of their galaxy for training. There are four Kaio, one for each of the four galaxies, and one Grand Kaio, who overlooks the living realm as a whole. Especially heroic characters can meet with Grand Kaio and spend eternity training with him. This makes no sense. They're dead, what are they training for? There is nothing for them to fight other than other dead heroes. The Kaioshin make things worse, as they do nothing but hang out on their planet. The entire thing seems incredibly inefficient until you remember one fact: Before the afterlife was properly introduced we met Uranai Baba, who revealed that every dead warrior can return to the realm of the living for 24 hours. With that in mind, it all makes sense: The role of Gods in the universe is to prepare mortals to defend their own worlds. The Kamis scout their planet for warriors and prepare them for the afterlife, the Kaios train those warriors, and when trouble starts up the warriors return to the mortal world and save it. The Kaioshin, who watch over both the living and dead realms, brief the great warriors in the case of a threat to the universe as a whole (as was the case of Majin Buu), not just the living world (which is the jurisdiction of the Kaio). |
| 103 | ** Alternatively, access to the world of the Kaio's could be like a warrior's paradise. Note that other characters when they die (Chi-Chi, Bulma, Videl) go to regular old Heaven, while the Z-Fighters go to the world of the Kaio. Hell, Lord Enma even gave Goku that opportunity when he first died. There was also one scene where an ogre tells Goku he's going the wrong way when he heads to the plane to take him to the Grand Kai's world until he notices Goku still has a body, then he starts gushing about the honor to be around a warrior like him. |
| 104 | *** Also, it follows that since the Kai worlds are for heroes, that the heroes can visit anywhere in the heavenly realm that is below them. |
| 105 | *** Actually, according to Dragon Ball Kai, King Yemma is confused by Goku's request to train with his galaxy's Kai, claiming Goku was a shoo-in for Heaven. This tells me that access to the Kai planets is by request only. |
| 106 | *** "Four galaxies"? Four quadrants of ONE galaxy (a universe consists of millions or billions of galaxies, each with millions of stars). East, West, North, and South kai just run ONE galaxy, with a boss above them. Presumably, either Supreme Kai is a boss of all galactic Kais, OR there is an as-yet-unseen god above THEM. King Yemma is the guy in charge of sorting out people for the Afterlife, similar to Hades or King Minos as portrayed in the Inferno. We know that Beerus is a destruction god, but so far, those are the only jobs we know of so far (beyond Zen'o, who is apparently Boss God of All the Multiverse.) |
| 107 | ** Well, Jaco says the universe is made up of hundreds of thousands of galaxies, or maybe "countless", depending on Anime or Manga, so yes, that part of cosmology is true, but (east)Kaioshin says that before Majin Buu killed them there were ''five'' Daikaio/Grand Kais. So, going by four-quadrant Kais answering to one grand kai, that would be one grand kai for each galaxy, five out of...hundreds or thousands and or too many to bother counting. It could be that there are only five populated galaxies, or it could be that East Supreme specifically oversaw five Grand Kais, and assuming that was mirrored there are...twenty populated galaxies out of hundreds of thousands and or too many to bother counting? That's a lot of lifeforms from a human perspective, but celestially speaking most of the Dragon World, or at least universe seven, seems pretty lifeless. |
| 108 | * Why did Pilaf and company wish for youth rather than world domination? Because Pilaf is well aware that wishing for world domination is worthless at this point- the dragon couldn't kill Goku and sons, and they'd just take it back. His solution? Wish for youth and hope to outlive them. |
| 109 | * Raditz wanted to make Gohan into a true Saiyan, and the irony is that Gohan did become a true Saiyan warrior, far exceeding anything he imagined, but as a protector, not a murderer. He grew up on battlefields, fighting and winning wars even as a child. Likewise, producing a bunch of Saiyan-human hybrids was Nappa's idea, to which Vegeta replied that the humans must be exterminated to prevent such a dangerous thing from happening, but Vegeta ultimately winds up carrying out that plan and only thereby effects the revenge against Frieza they both so longed for. |
| 110 | * Vegeta berating Gohan about not training for seven years is not intended to belittle Gohan; rather, Vegeta is expressing disappointment in the first comrade he actually likes wasting his true potential. Raditz and Nappa annoyed him, and he only kept them around because they happened to be useful for the time being, but Gohan earned his respect. |
| 111 | * Why did Goku stay on Namek and prolong his fight with Frieza when he could've left with the others when Dende used the last wish when he could've beaten him numerous times before? So he can make Frieza, a genocidal tyrant, feel the same feeling of helplessness and despair that he had caused millions, if not billions of people and planets. To let him know what it's like to not be able to do anything and that his life could end at any moment just like he had destroyed the lives of others. He prolonged the fight and even let him go up to 100% power to let him know that it wasn't enough. So he could experience the same pain and terror he had inflicted onto others so he'd know what he's put them through. Frieza had been broken by the end of their fight with his pride shattered and his belief in his invincibility gone. Just goes to show that even Goku can be [[BewareTheNiceOnes cruel]]. |
| 112 | * Beerus, the god of destruction, has proven himself to be the most powerful being in the Dragon Ball universe, [[spoiler:with the exception of his mentor]]. Considering how destruction [[EarthShatteringKaboom happens on a daily basis]] and [[DeathIsCheap can be easily repeated]], that isn't surprising. |
| 113 | * Cell didn't know the full extent of his own regenerative capabilities. He only knew from Piccolo that Namekians can regenerate as long as their heads remain intact, but Gero made some improvements with the genetic mash-up that is Cell. Even he was surprised when he came back FromASingleCell. |
| 114 | * During the Budokai Tenkaichi, Roshi managed to defeat Goku through a crossed flying kick. As Roshi's body and legs were longer than Goku's, his harm was diminished so he was able to win. Then you think about how impractical it was as an attack: a flying kick is a big move, easy to dodge and counterattack. But Roshi was taking into account Goku's amazing ability to imitate his foe's moves, which he had been using during all the fight. Roshi ''used Goku's instinct against him.'' Genius. |
| 115 | * It's a common question as to why Goten and Trunks are still little midget bastards in the Battle of Gods movie. Growth seems to vary from Saiyan to Saiyan, and, looking at Goku, the only full-blooded Saiyan we've seen grow from childhood to adulthood did this in spurts, he had random growth spurts at various points in his life, even at age 12, he wasn't much taller than Goten or Trunks who are about 12-13 as well in the Battle of Gods movie, and even Gohan seemed to have some erratic growth spurts, he was fucking NINE when he appeared as what we call "Teen Gohan". So...Saiyan growth is weird, 'nuff said. |
| 116 | ** To be fair, he was only nine in the manga. In the anime, he was 11. That's not much better, but two years can give a kid a lot of time to grow. |
| 117 | ** It was confirmed in Manga/JacoTheGalacticPatrolman that Saiyans have longer childhoods than humans, staying cute and child-liked before spurting to their full adult height. Since Gohan, Goten, and Trunks are hybrids, their growth could be more erratic with Gohan growing in-between that of a human and a Saiyan while Goten and Trunks grow more closer to a purebred. |
| 118 | ** One thing to keep in mind also is that genes can skip a generation. Gohan bears a bit more facial resemblance to Chi-Chi, so it stands to reason that his mother's genes may have been more dominant in his case. Said genes include those of Chi-Chi's father, the Ox King, who is human, but is also quite tall and, in his prime, was very powerfully built. Notably at age 17-18 or so (16 in the manga) during the Buu Saga, Gohan - despite not being the voracious trainer his father was, has a naturally bulkier physical body. Compare Gohan, even in base form, to Goku at about the same age during the end of Dragon Ball. Sure, Goku had noticeably put on some muscle in his late teens, but Gohan, in terms of his physical body, looks closer to what Goku looked like well into adulthood in his 20s. This might be in part due to the Ox-King's 25% share of Gohan's DNA manifesting more strongly in Gohan than it did in Goten. |
| 119 | ** Another thing to note is that Gohan may be biologically a year older than his chronological age due to the time spent in the Hyperbolic Time Chamber. |
| 120 | * Why does Master Roshi always wear sunglasses? Almost certainly so he can perv on women without being noticed! |
| 121 | ** It also aids his Jackie Chun disguise, as he doesn't wear shades. This is pointed out by Krillin when Roshi's glasses are broken in the Goku v Tien fight. |
| 122 | * With the new revelation that the Kaioshin are the gods of creation who counterpart Beerus, the abilities of the Kaioshin, Kaio, and lesser Kami to create objects as seen in the series (Clothes Beam!) suddenly make a lot of sense. |
| 123 | ** This also makes it likely that Fat Buu's candy creation abilities came from absorbing the Grand Supreme Kai. |
| 124 | * In the Z series the Spirit Bomb seems to have a ridiculously poor success rate. Despite being established as a fight-winning ultimate move it only kills one of the three villains it's used against. Remember, however, the Spirit Bomb is ineffective against those with good hearts. This was established heavily, and it was even shown ''bouncing off harmlessly'' after hitting Gohan. No living being can ever normally be pure evil; no matter how many terrible things they had done, Vegeta and Frieza had to still have some amount of good in them, and that tiny fragment of good prevented the Spirit Bomb from actually killing them! This is also the reason why the Spirit Bomb was able to kill Buu - he had purged all good from himself in order to reach his maximum power. There was no tiny fragment of goodness left to protect him. |
| 125 | ** A simpler explanation: Goku couldn't turn Super Saiyan the first two times he used the Spirit Bomb. He was also worn out from over-using Kaio-ken both times, whereas with Buu he got a recharge from the Dragon Balls. |
| 126 | ** An even simpler explanation: The third Spirit Bomb used to kill Majin Buu is the first Spirit Bomb actually powerful enough to kill its target. The first Spirit Bomb used was made to defeat Great Ape Vegeta, who blasted Goku in the middle of gathering it and lost most of the energy it had. The second was made to kill Frieza when Goku couldn't exactly be sure of the extent of his power and had to spend until the last possible second gathering energy, thus it only almost killed Frieza. The inherent flaw in the technique is how long it takes a person to actually gather energy, which only the third Spirit Bomb actually had enough time, and with the people of Earth giving up the energy willingly had much much more energy than Goku could've ever collected using the Technique normally. Even then, if it weren't for Goku getting his energy back and becoming Super Saiyan at the time it still would've failed. |
| 127 | ** Also possibly worth noting: Against Buu, the world actively knew he was trying to take their energy ''and gave it to him'' (or, rather, Mr. Satan). The first two times, nobody outside of the battlefield knew he was using the Spirit Bomb, so it's possible he had some sort of limit as either the peoples' resistance to this unknown force draining their energy or the Spirit Bomb on its own being inefficient in gathering energy. Once Mr. Satan told them to give their energy, they either let the Spirit Bomb take their energy freely or directed their energy right at it. |
| 128 | * Battle of Gods, a usual topic of debate is the appearance of Super Saiyan God and how it sticks apart rather blatantly from the rest of the transformation line. However, in a certain light, it wouldn't make any sense to look otherwise. You all remember the Kaioken, right? The technique for powering up as held by the Kais, also known as gods? When Goku used it, the state manifested in reddening his form. As such, SSJG could be considered the logical conclusion to that form. |
| 129 | ** Also, despite the name " Super Saiyan God ", it's not an extension or improvement of the Super Saiyan form the way 1, 2, and 3 are. Super Saiyan used to be something Saiyans could do, but was lost to the point it was a legend they were ''trying'' to bring back, Goku being the first in a thousand years. Super Saiyan God was something they hadn't done in an even longer amount of time. The fact that it was even called "Super Saiyan" was just a result of history being corrupted into legend and the legend itself corrupting. This also explains why in the flashback Super Saiyan God disappears while Goku just powers down, it's possible that Super Saiyan God was literally a created god with a limited lifespan, but the latter-day Saiyans, having no idea and used to transformations, caused it to manifest in Goku instead, believing that's how it should work. They ''made'' it connect to the Super Saiyan transformation, and [[AchievementsInIgnorance the corrupted legend became reality]]. |
| 130 | * Why was Raditz so much weaker than Nappa and Vegeta? Well, Saiyans get stronger after recovering from life-threatening injuries. [[DirtyCoward Cowards]] like Raditz are unlikely to get those injuries. Vegeta and Nappa, on the other hand, had a lot of [[VillainousValour genuine courage]], so it makes sense that they'd be stronger than him. |
| 131 | * Beerus seems to have a MoodSwinger personality, ranging from polite and friendly to AxCrazy when angered. However, remember he ''is'' the God of Destruction. Considering destroying stuff is his ''job'' it makes sense: he ''needs'' to destroy things when he's awake to keep the universe functioning properly, that's his duty, so what better way for him to do so than him having a HairTriggerTemper and very little restraint in how he expresses it? For a normal person, it's crazy, but [[BlueAndOrangeMorality he is the personification of destruction]], it makes sense he wouldn't have a normal mental state. It's also possible that Beerus simply has a habit of losing control of himself for the same reasons and when he gets worked up he has trouble stopping until he burns off some energy. Remember the first thing he did after his fight with SSJG Goku was to apologize for ruining their party and letting himself get out of hand. |
| 132 | * A lot of people are confused about the youthful appearance of Bulma's mother, but take a look at all of her appearances. She has the same facial expression in all but one and that one time she opens her eyes, they appear unnaturally slanted. Toriyama might be subtly alluding to a botox habit. |
| 133 | * Piccolo's shoulder weights get bigger with each appearance. That's not ArtEvolution, he's adding more weight so he can get stronger. |
| 134 | ** The same could be said for Vegeta. Prior to his battle with Goku, he starts out looking baby-faced. Then after taking the beating of his life several times within a short timespan, he looks much rougher. Most likely scenario is that he'd never taken any injuries serious enough to warrant his facial muscles hardening the way they did. |
| 135 | * Due to the fact that Videl is pregnant with Pan, that means that the Super Saiyan God transformation occurs before ''Anime/DragonBallGT''. Assuming you class both as canon, there is a perfectly valid reason as to why Goku never uses the God transformation: He can't. Plain and simple. Goku states before he fights Baby for the first time that his child form is no longer able to handle the power of a Super Saiyan 3. That being the case, then to even contemplate using Super Saiyan God would be probably be very dangerous. Once he reaches Super Saiyan 4, the fact that it has no time limit (relatively speaking) and he can use it independently without having to rely on help from the other Z fighters, makes it a superior option regardless of how much weaker it may or not be. Think of Super Saiyan God and Super Saiyan 4 as similar to Super Saiyan Grade's 2 and 3, which as Cell points out when he beats up Trunks, the latter is the epitome of AwesomeButImpractical. |
| 136 | * People claim that Frieza going from not even Super Saiyan level to being able to take on Super Saiyan God Goku with four months of training in ''Anime/DragonBallZResurrectionF'' is completely unrealistic, but think about the plot from Frieza's perspective…He is the last hope of his Intergalactic Organization, revived by the Dragon Balls but unable to fight, healed to full power by something, trains for four months straight, and then unlocks a Golden Super Form…In his desire for revenge against Goku, Frieza has gone completely through what would ''normally'' happen to Goku in an arc of ''Anime/DragonBallZ''. ''Anime/DragonBallZResurrectionF'' is written as if ''Frieza'' was the protagonist of ''Dragon Ball Z''. [[spoiler:And of course, as Frieza makes a [[{{Understatement}} shitty protagonist]]…[[ForegoneConclusion he fails]] despite his advantages.]] |
| 137 | ** In-Universe, Frieza says that he never trained a day in his life to get to where he is, with a base power exceeding a million. If Goku can reach a million when starting at a base power of 10, Frieza has possibly the largest untapped potential of any characters in the Dragon Ball universe. |
| 138 | * Princess Snake. At first, she seems like a pointless anime filler villain to add some drama to Goku's run down Snake Way. But what did she try to do to Goku? She tried to seduce him and get him to lower his guard so she could eat him. What is Snake Way? It's a challenge for any warrior wanting to seek out King Kai to overcome as a test of strength. Princess Snake serves as a final test- a test of morality and withstanding temptation- immediately before the end of Snake Way and finally reaching King Kai. |
| 139 | * More about Snake Way, ''it's longer than the planet Earth''. There's no food, water or shelter. Anyone attempting to reach the end of it would die, either from starvation, dehydration or exposure... unless they are already dead! That's exactly why ''dead'' Goku never had the problems with Super Saiyan 3 that living Goku did. He never realized while running Snake Way or training in the after life that he was literally pushing himself to death. |
| 140 | * During the Buu saga when Vegeta allows Babidi to turn him majin, Babidi is shocked that Vegeta can shrug off his control. It's easy to write that off as Vegeta's inherent stubbornness, but what did Vegeta spend most of his life doing? Working under the boot of an evil tyrant. When Vegeta screams that a saiyan always keeps his pride, he's tapping into the same anger and frustration that built up under Frieza. He's already lost much of his life working for one monster, nothing can make him submit to another. |
| 141 | * Something noted first in the WMG section, but it makes so much sense it just has to go here. You know how Hercule kept saying Videl wasn't allowed to date anyone who couldn't beat him in a fight? Presumably this had kicked off as soon as she started to get interested in boys. While he would never publicly admit it, he knew there was exactly one boy in the world who fit that description and was anywhere near her age: the kid who really beat Cell. Thing is, though, he never actually found out that the kid's name was Gohan—he and the TV crew thought gohan (rice) was their lunch order. Later, he thought that everybody from the Cell Games was dead because they seemed to have dropped off the face of the planet, until they showed up at the Tournament 7 years later, and he doesn't recognize Gohan right away, either. Hercule was actually a Gohan/Videl shipper the whole time, but he didn't know it. |
| 142 | * Why did Bulma kicked off her original search for the Dragon Balls to [[MundaneWish get herself a boyfriend]]? Think about it: she's the daughter of [[{{Fiction 500}} the richest man in the world]], the younger sister of a famed science fiction author, and an OmnidisciplinaryScientist superior to her father [[TeenGenius in her teens]]. She wasn't just searching any boyfriend, but a boyfriend who wasn't a GoldDigger. Further hinted by the males she was truly attracted to: Yamcha fell for her before having any hint of Bulma's family or genius (remember, Bulma's case of expensive capsules, the one clue that could have given away her wealth, had been lost in a river, and Bulma never even implied that she had created the Dragon Radar herself) and wouldn't have cared anyway (as he himself said in his bandit days, power was too much of a hassle and if he wanted money he could just steal it), Vegeta is just too full of himself to care and could easily steal anything he wanted, and Goku (to whom Bulma had professed attraction before finding out of his engagement to Chichi) is just too nice to care. |
| 143 | ** As the daughter of probably the richest and one of if not the most powerful people in the world Bulma has no desire for wealth like Oolong or power like Pilaf, she already has it. A boyfriend who truly values her is the one thing Bulma's wealth and power can't get her and is actively detremental to it, thus she resorts to the Dragon Balls. |
| 144 | * Bad Lunch didn't become nicer because of some random event. Right before Lunch sneezed before him for the first time, Muten offered to teach her martial arts, saying it would be useful for the health of both her body and mind, and by the time of the Tenkaichi we see Bad Lunch as a TokenEvilTeammate who's not as kill-happy as before. Lunch must have accepted his offer off-screen. |
| 145 | ** Goku also knocks Bad Lunch on her ass and (inadvertently) stops Roshi from groping her while she's at this disadvantage. She might have come to respect Goku's strength and strength of character. |
| 146 | ** Note that the first time Bad Launch meets the group it's after Roshi has tricked Good Launch into dressing up in skimpy clothing. It's probably that she remembers this and thus is naturally really hostile to the group, but the further and further they get from this event and the less perverted or at least obvious about it Roshi gets around her the less often she goes ballistic on them. |
| 147 | * Krilin defeating Chiaotzu through the power of math isn't just a gag, but a clear demonstration of the differences between Muten Roshi and Shen as teachers: Shen tells them they're the strongest and they should use violence to take what they want, Muten teaches them to be humble and how to get by without violence, with such teachings as how to plow a field and math. |
| 148 | * Early on, Goku couldn't tell the difference between males and females without [[CrotchGrabSexCheck patting them on the crotch]], yet he could tell that Upa was a boy without that. Strange? No: he saw that girls don't show their chests and Upa wore only an open jacket on it. |
| 149 | * Despite the recent speculation about the Saiyans from Universe 6 that will be introduced in ''[[Anime/DragonBallSuper Super]]'', it's highly unlikely that an Evil Goku/Kakarot will ever appear in official material. |
| 150 | ** For decades we've seen alternate timelines and continuities presented in official ''Dragon Ball'' lore—whether canon via the Trunks/Androids/Cell saga, filler, anime movies, ''GT'', and many of the video games. Yet with the exception of Turless, who just happens to ''look'' like Goku, none have even entertained the possibility of Evil Kakarot…until ''VideoGame/DragonballXenoverse'' came along. ''Xenoverse'' introduced one of the easiest possible opportunities to see Evil Goku in [[spoiler:Towa and Demigra's [[DemonicPossession Villainous magic]], used to take over and control anyone from prominent villains to Hercule Satan and even the Z-Fighters]]. But then they turn around and make it clear [[spoiler:even Demigra can't possess a god, and since Goku had his ascension in ''Battle of Gods'', he's immune to the Villainous magic]]. [[spoiler:Godhood]] didn't ''have'' to equal [[spoiler:immunity]], though. Nothing about the [[spoiler:God]] concept even hinted at this hypothetical scenario prior to ''Xenoverse''. It was a deliberate creative decision designed to give Goku an out; they ''wanted'' to make people ask if Evil Goku was possible, just so they could say "Yeah, that's not happening." Dick move, right? But then again… |
| 151 | ** There is a narrative reason ''why'' Akira, Toei, Namco, etc. are so hell bent on Evil Kakarot never happening in official material. The recently-added "Foil" entry under Goku's character page spells it all out. If we really want a ShadowArchetype or EvilCounterpart to Goku that badly, all we need is to look at Turless. Or Raditz. Or Vegeta. Or Cell. [[OverlyLongGag Or Frieza. Or Majin Buu. Or Android 17. Or Beerus. Or Broly.]] And there's probably more where that came from when it comes to notable antagonists or tweeners who have enough similarities to Goku to make a comparison yet enough stark differences to define that he's purer of heart, more stable-minded, has done more to organically earn his strength, etc. ''Evil Goku is already a narrative device used to help define both Goku's character and that of the foes he and his friends face by showing what sets him apart from said foes. '''Of course''' they don't want to turn that into an actual character: doing so defeats the entire purpose.'' |
| 152 | ** The Universe 6 Saiyans are ''outright confirmed'' not to be producing an "Evil Goku" anyway, as not only are all the [=U6=] characters different than anyone we've seen before, Cabba explains that the [=U6=] Saiyans are mercenaries of good, not evil. |
| 153 | ** Even Goku Black, the black-clad evil double of Goku seen in the Future Trunks saga of ''Dragon Ball Super'', doesn't quite fall into the straightforward "Goku as a villain" stock trope. He calls Trunks "Saiyan" as if he himself isn't one and wears a green Potara-like earring as well as possesses a Ring of Time. He seems to be able to actively manipulate smoke clouds in ways no one else has been seen doing to this point in the series, and his eyes glow a bright menacing red[[note]]in ''Dragon Ball'', red glowing eyes are usually reserved for one of four uses; intentionally-vague "flashback" scenes, Shenron or a counterpart granting a wish, or as an indicator of demonic activity and/or brainwashing[[/note]] when he's covered under smoke. Indeed, he may not even be a Saiyan at all. He does away with the smoke tactic after his face is shown on-screen, but is still vastly different from Goku due to his Kai artifacts, no-nonsense murderous snobbishness, and an AxCrazy belief in his own OmniscientMoralityLicense to declare that HumansAreTheRealMonsters similar to that of a rogue Supreme Kai apprentice named Zamasu in Universe 10. [[spoiler:Then it turns out that he (A) is tag team partners with the version of Zamasu from Trunks' future, and (B) is an alternate version of present Zamasu himself who successfully kills his master to become a Kai, wishes on the Super Dragon Balls to ''steal Goku's body'', and ''kills Goku and his family in cold blood before recruiting his future self''. He's not so much "the anti-Goku" as opposed to "a SatanicArchetype who successfully pulled a permanent Ginyu."]] |
| 154 | * Vegeta's callous attitude towards the deaths of his fellow Saiyans feels counter-productive given that they're near-extinct, but that's exactly how mass-consuming lifeforms function in any given ecosystem. If Saiyans didn't have such Darwinian attitudes towards each other, they'd find themselves facing a famine, so it's only natural that Vegeta would rather be the last of his race than have to starve with his weaker comrades. |
| 155 | * King Piccolo's main redeeming quality was [[EvenEvilHasLovedOnes his love for his sons]]. With that in mind, it makes sense that Gohan would serve as Piccolo Junior's MoralityPet. |
| 156 | * Why doesn't Goku ever appear to age, despite the series going through a few decades? He was dead for a whole year at first, presumably not aging because the dead can't age, and then another 7 years. That's a whole 8 years where Goku hasn't aged whatsoever, hence why he hasn't shown any signs of his actual age. On top of that, as was explained during the Buu saga, Saiyans age far slower than humans anyway, so he's had ''two'' anti-aging cheat codes in his favor. |
| 157 | * Dr. Gero's ability to create killer robots, augmented humans, and bio-android creatures capable of dwarfing a baseline Super Saiyan and pre-''Resurrection ‘F’'' Frieza, at the time thought to be the most powerful beings in the universe, using only basic Earth technology, seems to be preposterous at first. However, it's become a building block to {{foreshadow|ing}} two facts critical to understanding future developments in the ''Dragon Ball'' franchise. First, the power scale in the universe is exponentially leagues beyond what even the Saiyans and Frieza had achieved at the time. Second, the vast technological potential of Dragon World Earth's natural elements, which Bulma and her father already showed with the Dragon Radar, the capsules, and chronologically later on the Time Machine [[spoiler:(which future media confirms is a violation of even ''divine natural law'')]], can even be used to harness some of this same grand power, making the InsignificantLittleBluePlanet far more important than it would appear. [[spoiler:Goku and Vegeta are able to overcome Gero's creations, become strong enough to defeat the Kai-killing universal threat Majin Buu, and become {{Physical God}}s capable of giving Beerus the God of Destruction a good fight and even defeating Frieza by attrition when he finally trains and reaches that same level of power. [[labelnote:For reference,]]Beerus and Buu were the two creatures that pre-training Frieza was told by his father to never mess with.[[/labelnote]] Bulma is able to look at a force field that a god-attendant used her powers to create capable of containing the reach of many ultra-powerful fighters including said Physical Gods, and then do a pretty good (albeit imperfect) job of imitating that herself using Earth technology.]] |
| 158 | * When Shenron resurrects Bora his eyes don't just flash for a moment but continue shining until after Bora has climbed out of his grave (we get to see his eyes as Bora is still inside and they're still shining, and stop as soon as he's out), while in any other resurrection shown his eyes flashed just for a moment. There's a difference between this and the other resurrections: with everyone else Shenron was either recreating their bodies or teleporting an otherwordly body to Earth, while Bora resurrected in his own old body while after it had been already buried-[[BenevolentGenie after bringing back Bora he kept him alive and gave him the energy to climb out even if he had no oxygen in his lungs (Bora even takes a few deep breaths as soon as he's out)]]. |
| 159 | * Goku expresses disgust when Yajirobe kills and ''eats'' Cymbal. Yet, Vegeta and Nappa are seen eating enemies they've just killed. Amazingly as it sounds, by Saiyan standards Goku is a ''PickyEater''! |
| 160 | * Muten Roshi's rarely used grappling skills are a hint to his ability as a master: pretty much all fighters use some form of Kenpō and are striking-focused, so they find themselves out of their depht when confronted with grappling moves, allowing to him to counter otherwise-superior opponents, as shown by him casually manhandling ''Tenshinhan'' when he came too close in their fight. |
| 161 | ** That also explains how and why Goku whips out a [[WrestlerInAllOfUs Boston Crab]] when fighting Tenshinhan: he wasn't taught any move by the Turtle Hermit, but his first teacher was another of his students who may have learned the skills, or at least the idea, from him, and Goku, after not using them out of personal preference, saw how effective they were against that same opponent-and indeed, the Boston Crab almost wins him the fight. |
| 162 | ** They're also used in the 23rd Tenkaichi to show Tenshinhan's growth during the timeskip: at one point during their rematch, Goku whips out the grappling moves again starting from the Boston Crab, but Tien this time holds his own and [[ItOnlyWorksOnce manages to keep Goku from completing the Boston Crab]]. |
| 163 | * The passing of the torch at the end of the Cell arc (temporary though it may have been) is even more poignant when you take into account Cell's genetic makeup. Specifically, he is a combination of the last three [[ArcVillain arc villains]] (Piccolo, Vegeta and Frieza) that was created by the story's first true ArcVillain, the Red Ribbon Army. By killing Cell and saving the world Gohan not only takes his father's place as savior of the world, he does it by defeating all of the major enemies Goku defeated in his lifetime. It's the ultimate rite-of-passage. |
| 164 | * In the 21st tournament two of Krillin's past bullies from the Orinji Temple, who had not made it to the finals, mock Giran, who did make it, for drinking milk and not alcohol... When Giran is about to have his fight with Goku in a few minutes: it was a hint that Giran, for how boorish he acted, was a better martial artist than the two monks and [[HiddenDepths smarter than he looked]], as he would not drink something that was going to dull his reflexes before a fight but something that gave him some energy. |
| 165 | * In his fight with Tien in the 23rd Tournament, Tao Pai Pai is both unable and unwilling to attack until his opponent's stance doesn't show at least one opening. He's also an assassin with a stated preference for one-hit kills... And Tien's stance had no openings that could be used for these. |
| 166 | * How was Goku able to figure out the weaknesses of Tien's Multi-Form Technique while being attacked by it when the smarter Piccolo could not while he was watching their fight? Easy: Goku, differently from Piccolo (and the other spectators), is used to fighting groups of opponents from his battles against the Red Ribbon, and tracking four opponents on an open ring at short distance is easier than tracking hundreds or even ''thousands'' of soldiers in the middle of various terrains (including the urban terrain of their HQ) at all kinds of distances, so after the initial surprise he could just fall back on those old instinct to keep up with the four Tiens while he analyzed their strengths and weaknesses. In a way, Goku was by far the worst possible opponent on Earth for such a technique. |
| 167 | ** Related to it, Nappa has little trouble keeping up with Krillin and Piccolo when they use a similar technique against him in an anime filler. As he conquered planets for a living, Nappa was even more used to fight multiple weaker opponents, as his job required him to face entire armies on a regular basis. |
| 168 | * Why there's so few senzu from ''Z'' onward when it was previously shown Karin had a large supply? Easy: [[BigEater Yajirobe]] started living at Karin's. |
| 169 | * Why does Goku send Trunks out to search for the Dragon Radar while he goes to stall Buu? 1) Goku is the only one left strong enough to stall Buu. 2) Trunks lives at Capsule Corp, and so wouldn't get lost in the building and know where the Radar might be (Goku only visited the place once over a decade prior). And 3) Mr. and Mrs. Briefs don't have a high enough battle power for him to use Instant Transmission to warp to. |
| 170 | * Remember how Chi-Chi didn't want Gohan to fight? It makes a lot of sense when you consider that she had to watch her fiancé get brutally tortured and nearly ''killed'' in what was supposed to be a low-stakes competition. She was probably traumatized deep down. |
| 171 | * When you look at Majin Buu as a character and a design, he incorporates elements from all of the manga's previous {{Big Bad}}s, which makes sense considering he's the manga's FinalBoss: |
| 172 | ** Character: Like King Piccolo, he's a demon that was sealed away long ago and is released by a foolish BigBadWannabe that he quickly supplants. He comes from space like the Saiyans and Piccolo and was initially subjugated by someone he had no loyalty to like Vegeta. Like Frieza, he's a universal terror that has destroyed many planets and is so powerful that even the gods fear him. Like Cell, he has regenerative abilities that make him very difficult to kill, can absorb others into himself to get stronger, and was someone else's powerful creation until his origin was {{retcon}}ed. Finally, Kid Buu is killed and reincarnated like King Piccolo while Fat Buu reforms through befriending someone like Piccolo Junior did. |
| 173 | ** Design: Buu's antenna is reminiscent of King Piccolo's/Piccolo Junior's antennae, his "ears" are identical to final form Frieza's, and like Cell, his base forms lack certain facial features that he gains when he absorbs people. Super Buu and Kid Buu also wear wrist and shin guards that make them "armored" to some extent like the Saiyans are. |
| 174 | * Tien's ability to survive using the Mafuba, which is supposed to be a guaranteed fatal act, makes sense when you remember that he's been trained in using life energy and not just ki. He likely had enough control over his life force to keep himself from dying even if it did take a toll. |
| 175 | * Saiyan eating habits: They [[BigEater eat vast quantities of food at every meal]] to get both the nutrients and energy to fuel their superhumanly-active lifestyles, and they seem to have a preference for pasta (high in carbohydrates, one of the most efficient sources of edible calories available) and meat (high in protein, which is the primary component of muscle). If these tendencies are any indication, their most common favorite beverage is likely milk (high in calcium, the primary component of most skeletons as we know them). In short, their digestion is specialized for ingesting vast quantities of the most efficient edibles available (and as Vegeta and Nappa demonstrate by eating their kills, their culture had few taboos regarding where those edibles come from). |
| 176 | * This goes back to the Original Dragon Ball, but Tien quickly learning and then subsequently surviving the Evil Containment Wave. Considering that Tien also knows and has used the Tri Beam Cannon, another technique that uses so much Ki it could possibly kill the person using it, it makes sense that Tien would learn a similarly draining technique fairly quickly and that his body and Ki would be used to using a technique that drains one's life. |
| 177 | * King Piccolo wishes for eternal youth, but not immortality, and he doesn't even consider sparing the Dragon Balls to wish for immortality later. Now, why would he do that? Well, being half of Kami, he would know how the Dragon Balls work and that immortality was beyond Kami's power. He didn't wish for immortality because he knew he wasn't going to get it, so eternal youth combined with his power is the closest he could get. |
| 178 | * Despite their build-up at the beginning of the Android Saga, Frieza suffers a huge case of BadassDecay, and King Cold ends up being a pushover despite how he was allegedly stronger than Frieza. However, at that point, more than half of Frieza's body was artificial, so Trunks curb-stomping him was less because of his own power and more because Frieza was too crippled to put up the same fight he did on Namek. It was probably also why Frieza's ki may been weaker than King Cold's. |
| 179 | |
| 180 | !!FridgeHorror |
| 181 | * Boss Rabbit was [[spoiler:left on the moon]] after he was defeated. A little later [[spoiler:Roshi blows up the moon, presumably with the rabbits still living on it]]. |
| 182 | ** Piccolo blows up the moon again early in ''Z'' to stop a rampaging Gohan. That means Dragon Ball's Earth must have at least two moons, possibly more. |
| 183 | *** Dragon Ball's Earth only has a single moon. During Goku's training in the Lookout, Kami restored the moon after he made sure Goku's tail would never grow back. |
| 184 | *** In a game on the DS (Attack of the Saiyans, an adaption of Kai's Saiyan Saga), Boss Rabbit and his gang show up, explaining they somehow got off the moon before it was destroyed. |
| 185 | * In RealLife, electric rice cookers were a relatively recent invention at the time that the manga ran, with the first commercially successful model being introduced in the 1950s, but the rice cooker that was used to seal King Piccolo was made roughly a century before the story begins. Considering that the level of tech in Dragon Ball's version of Earth appears to be at a late 1980s level with a few exceptions, it can be inferred that the devastation caused by King Piccolo's rampage caused tech levels to stagnate for a few decades, if not outright regress. |
| 186 | * The Capsules. Ranging from practical (cars and house), to threatening (Launch being able to carry an entire armory of guns in her POCKET) to more horrorific things like being able to hide dead bodies inside capsules (as Bulma does to Krillin after his [[spoiler:first]] death, and later [[spoiler: Master Roshi and Chiaotzu]]. If Bulma can easily place Krillin's body in a freezer capsule, turn the freezer into a capsule with HIM inside, you have to wonder how many potential unsolved murders there are. Presumably you could hide LIVING people inside a capsule. If not by simply pressing the button with them inside while they're alive, [[spoiler: killing them, placing the body in a capsule, shrinking the capsule, and then resurrecting them with the Dragon Balls, without taking the body out. Given the accessibility of capsules in-universe, this could be done just about ANY DAY of the week.]] |
| 187 | ** Let's also consider the thought that not only could the capsules hold a ''living person,'' but ''multiple'' people. One person could carry an entire gang of armed soldiers into any place they want. |
| 188 | ** And suddenly, the ludicrously high crime rate of West City makes sense. |
| 189 | ** And what happens ''if'' a living person is hidden inside the capsule? [[AndIMustScream Are they conscious, and if so, can they open the capsule on their own from the inside?]] |
| 190 | * Pretty much every villain starting with Vegeta wanted to use the Dragon Balls to gain immortality, which means that they wouldn't be able to be killed. Sounds all nice and dandy until you think of Frieza's reaction if Vegeta had succeeded. Can anyone say endless cycle of pain? Suddenly, immortality doesn't sound so great. |
| 191 | ** IIRC, Garlic Jr. ''got'' his immortality. Didn't work out so well for him. |
| 192 | ** However, Saiyans grow in power whenever they survive a fatal experience, so Vegeta could have just withstood Frieza's punishment until he was powerful enough to fight back. |
| 193 | ** He became Super Saiyan from feeling extreme rage after he hit a plateau of the CantCatchUp variety. An immortal Vegeta still at Frieza's mercy could easily replicate that. |
| 194 | * In ''Dragon Ball Z'', there is a problem from a {{Filler}} where Buu (after killing everyone on Earth and destroying the planet) also destroyed at least one other planet with intelligent life on it. Later, they wish Earth back into existence and then revive every good person killed by Buu. FridgeHorror when you realize all those Aliens who were brought back to life... only to be floating in space to die horribly again. |
| 195 | ** Furthermore, there are all those islands Cell blew up when looking for 18. When the people inhabiting those islands were revived, they'd just reappear in the middle of the ocean, and presumably drown. |
| 196 | ** When the others gathered the Dragon Balls after the Cell Games, they wished for everyone killed by Cell to come back to life... leaving all those killed before by Vegeta and Dr. Gero dead. |
| 197 | ** And Piccolo tried to buy time by telling Buu to kill off all the inhabitants of the Earth. They weren't planning on using the Namekian Dragon Balls at this point (they didn't even know that would work on such a large scale), so that means that anyone who had previously been killed by Vegeta or Cell and then revived couldn't be revived. Piccolo was either that jaded or that desperate that he offered to sacrifice hundreds of thousands of people that the Dragon Balls couldn't save. |
| 198 | *** He was desperate. The decision was clearly an agonizing one for him - which goes to show just how far he's come, given that he once wanted to do the exact same thing. |
| 199 | * Some of the [[NonSerialMovie OVA movies]] like ''Lord Slug'' which are thought to be set in an alternate timeline, where Goku got to the battle with Vegeta and Nappa earlier so that none of the Z-Fighters died, and therefore they never made the trip to Namek. This means that nobody was around to stop Frieza, who presumably wiped out the remaining Namekians. Does that mean Frieza is [[ImmortalityImmorality immortal]] [[OhCrap in those universes?]] |
| 200 | ** It's quite possible that Frieza, being Frieza, ended up killing Guru during in his search for the Dragon Balls, rendering their powers void, and his mission meaningless. Of course, this theory has the major flaw of "Why didn't he just go to Earth and take theirs, then?", which could be Fridge Horror in and of itself. |
| 201 | ** Perhaps because he never knows about Earth bearing [[InsignificantLittleBluePlanet any person or thing of significance]] if not for Goku and the rest of the visitors from there who ruined his plans? |
| 202 | ** But if none of the Z-Fighters died, they would have no reason to plan a trip to Namek, meaning Frieza never overheard their plans to go, meaning he never went there, either. |
| 203 | ** Still leaves Frieza with his galaxy-spanning empire where he's free to kill and destroy anyone he comes across, and might end up on Namek eventually anyway. |
| 204 | ** Cui told Vegeta that Frieza overheard the two Saiyans talk about the Dragon Balls over the Scouters. If Goku was on time to save everyone from the Saiyans, Vegeta would have never had the chance to talk about them, so Frieza would not know. |
| 205 | ** Snap back to FridgeHorror. They are all going to be wiped out by the androids in a few years. Trunks isn't coming back in time to warn them, because in this timeline, Trunks doesn't exist. Maybe Goku doesn't get sick in this timeline, but it doesn't matter, because he simply wouldn't be strong enough to defeat them if he wasn't training constantly for three years. |
| 206 | ** Frieza and King Cold wouldn't have any reason to come to Earth, and so Dr. Gero wouldn't have the opportunity to scan their power and the androids would only be as strong as Kaioken Goku. The Z-Fighters would still be at a severe disadvantage though, since Piccolo never fused with Nail and neither Gohan or Krillin ever got their innate strength unlocked by Guru. |
| 207 | * In the Buu saga, Videl [[spoiler:''accidentally'' kicked an opponent's head so hard it snapped his neck]]. Now remember she's on the weak end of the cast, with even the little kids far exceeding her power. You start to realize just how much power these characters have and are holding back. |
| 208 | ** We get an example out of Goku. In the new Battle of Gods movie, while fighting Beerus, he '''PUNCHED''' through King Kai's planet (which has 10x gravity therefore far denser than Earth, and apparently has all its mass), not a special technique or anything, just a mere punch. In other words, Goku has the potential to destroy or at least seriously damage the Earth in a single punch. |
| 209 | * The fillers before the Cell Games seem like SugarWiki/HeartwarmingMoments... until you realize that Goku's putting the entire fate of the world on his own son, who a) might not be able to gather up enough energy to destroy Cell, and b) ''might not even want to fight Cell''!! This, after he told everyone that even he would be utterly destroyed by Cell! He was really, really lucky Gohan was able to do both (a) and (b) otherwise the world would have been really, really screwed. |
| 210 | ** The world ''was'' screwed if Gohan couldn't defeat Cell, and that's the point of all that heartwarming filler. Goku's not a complete idiot - the potential for failure was there, so he wasn't about to waste what time they had left. Goku's Saiyan love of battle may have been lost in Gohan's human heritage, but his desire to protect life certainly was not. |
| 211 | * Elder Kai warns our heroes that irresponsible use of the Dragon Balls could badly upset the balance of nature and cause terrible cataclysms. Wasn't planet Namek all but destroyed by natural disasters in Guru's time? |
| 212 | ** The Dragon Balls can also be said to be responsible for how jaded the Z-Fighters become towards death later on. Remember Piccolo offering up the remaining lives of the people on Earth to Buu to pass time for Goten and Trunks to train? "We can just wish them back with the Dragon Balls". It is not only potential cataclysms over-use of the Dragon Balls will invite; it also invites a desensitization to death. |
| 213 | * The AU story ''Episode of Bardock'' ends on a positive note as Bardock [[spoiler: rescues the people of Plant by ascending to become the first legendary Super Saiyan and defeating Chilled.]] However, this begs the question of how his actions affected the future within that specific timeline. Do the Saiyan wind up colonizing another world or do they still wind up on Planet Plant? If it's the latter, did he inadvertently contribute to the conquest of Plant by making the people there think Saiyan could be trusted? |
| 214 | ** Pretty sure they still wind up on Plant, as the end of the movie has Chilled [[spoiler:ordering that his descendants be told of the golden transformation]], meaning he's responsible for [[spoiler:Frieza's intense fear of the legend]]. |
| 215 | *** Which leads to fridge horror in itself if we're to believe this story as canon. [[spoiler: Bardock's actions in the past caused the genocide of his people.]] |
| 216 | *** [[StableTimeLoop Which in turn caused Bardock's actions in the past]]... |
| 217 | * Buu's murder of Smitty. AssholeVictim indeed, but look at how big he expands while Buu is forcing it's way into his mouth. He should have died in seconds, but then you remember that Buu can heal people. He was forcing Smitty to stay alive for as long as possible to prolong his horror and agony. |
| 218 | * This is a rather small moment, but when Goku teleported to the Lookout to get a Senzu Bean for Videl after her disastrous fight with Spopovitch, he ended up delayed in a task that should have taken him seconds, due to the fact that he stopped to eat - not because he couldn't have eaten at the tournament, but because ''the food at the Lookout was better''. Granted, Videl's life was not in danger, and the whole thing was treated as comedy, but that doesn't change the fact that Goku prioritized stuffing his face over ending the suffering of a teenage girl who also happened to be his son's girlfriend. Given that Goku was always held up as the perfect compassionate hero and a FriendToAllLivingThings, this scene comes across as positively chilling when one stops to think about it. |
| 219 | ** Or (and this is both FridgeBrilliance and FridgeHorror depending on your POV) this is just a natural consequence of being fully aware that DeathIsCheap. There are two sets of Dragon Balls that are easily obtainable and have resurrected almost everyone he knows, the Senzu Bean and Dende can heal anything barring death or serious disease like the heart virus, and he is fully aware that the afterlife exists and that Videl will probably be going to Heaven. FriendToAllLivingThings he may be, but that doesn't stop him from becoming jaded to something that hasn't mattered since arguably the end of the original ''Dragon Ball'' series. |
| 220 | * This one concerns the characters from ''Manga/DoctorSlump''. We all remember the episode where Goku wound up in Penguin Village, right? So, we could assume that both ''Dr. Slump'' and ''Dragon Ball'' shared the same universe, right? Now, remember Super Buu's Genocide Attack? Since that attack tracks down every human on Earth, that means almost every one in Penguin Village (save for Arale and a couple others) are killed off. And to twist the knife even further, Kid Buu later destroys Earth so every character from ''Dr. Slump'' is now dead. Granted, Goku wished everybody back, but could Shenron bring robots like Arale and Obotchaman back to life? |
| 221 | ** No, no they couldn't have. As Arale and Obatchaman aren't technically living beings. Remember when everyone killed by the androids and Cell were revived? Android 16 wasn't brought back because he technically wasn't a living being. The reason Arale and Obatchaman WOULD be brought back though is because Porunga not only brought back Earth, he restored it EXACTLY the way it was on the day of the World Martial Arts Tournament, this includes fixing buildings and MACHINERY! So Arale and Obatchaman as well as every other robot were the first beings brought back after Kid Buu destroyed Earth, which brings about some more minor fridge horror: after that wish, Dende still thought Nameks Dragon Balls COULDN'T bring back everyone on Earth, which could've lead to a RobotUprising Utopian Society. |
| 222 | ** Not exactly, since the robots would only be in control for a few months. If they couldn't revive everybody with one wish, then they would have used their second wish to revive Gohan and their third to bring him to the Planet of the Kais. Dende is still alive, and with the Earth restored, so were the Dragon Balls, albeit, still needing recharge time, and Gohan could beat Kid Buu, especially with help available. After 130 days, they would use the Namekian balls again to revive Vegeta, Krillin, and Trunks (the first two were revived by Shenron once before, and it would be best not to take the chance that reviving the time-traveling Trunks used up this Trunks' one revival). Then, once the Earth's Dragon Balls have recharged, revive everyone killed by Babidi or Majin Buu. This wouldn't help the ones who were killed by Vegeta, Cell or King Piccolo, but it would revive most of the population. Tien then reminds them that they forgot about Chaotzu, so Goku and Tien go to New Namek one last time revive Chaotzu and also Master Roshi. |
| 223 | ** ''Manga/DoctorSlump'' operates on RuleOfFunny, so they'd just be brought back regardless [[AWizardDidIt somehow]]. |
| 224 | * This is mostly discussing how screwed Frieza was: Goku never died on Planet Namek, and was always stronger than Frieza (as opposed to the English dub, which claimed that he was temporarily outclassed and was killed and revived by Porunga). However, he uttered a line that suggested that, as mentioned above, he could easily destroy a planet with a punch. He said that he was ''waiting'' for everyone else to be removed from the planet before going "all out." This means that he may have simply been playing with Frieza for the whole fight and that, had he been using his full strength, the battle wouldn't have gone on. |
| 225 | ** Adding to this, it's fully possible that Goku could have used the Super Kaioken ability on Namek should push have come to shove, doubling his power at least, at which point Frieza could never hope to keep up. In other words, Frieza never stood a chance from the start, unless his hypothesis was right that Goku couldn't breathe in space — a hypothesis that in and of itself faces scrutiny. Considering now that Goku's power level could have shot up to 300,000,000 for moments, and it's possible he could survive the planet's explosion in some way, this troper feels that Goku really was overcome by animosity towards Frieza and only prolonged his suffering just to physically and psychologically torture him. That's the brutal nature of a recently-procured Super Saiyan transformation! |
| 226 | ** Kaioken puts strain on the user's body, even at just double power. I don't think Goku wanted to risk burning his body out by doubling his Super Saiyan power when he didn't have Super Saiyan fully under control. In fact, the only time we see Goku use Super Kaioken is during the filler Tournament in the afterlife, years after Goku has fully mastered his Super Saiyan powers. As such, it's very possible that Goku would have destroyed his body if he used Super Kaioken against Frieza, since not only has he already used Kaioken repeatedly against Frieza, he's also taken a lot of damage during the fight. |
| 227 | * During the filler fight between Buu and Vegito before the latter goes Super Saiyan. Buu creates a giant energy sphere in an attempt to destroy the Earth but before tossing it, he states that every time he has destroyed a planet, he was taken a piece of that planet's energy and the energy sphere he has made to kill Vegito is the collective energy of all the planets he has destroyed. If the filler is to be considered canon, then Buu's rampage across the universe would make him truly invincible and considering that he can distort reality, would make him a god capable of killing all reality. |
| 228 | ** And if this is true, when Super Buu regressed into Kid Buu and destroyed Earth, then doing so just made him stronger before he fought Goku. The worst part; Earth's destruction was inevitable because 1) Goku would need time to transform into SS3 which he was lucky to do while fighting someone like Kid Buu. 2) the Earth would not be able to handle the power output generated by them fighting there. |
| 229 | * Given what we now know about the Saiyan's Zenkai ability, it's entirely possible that the Ultra Divine Water really was just poison. |
| 230 | ** Yajirobe was right! |
| 231 | ** Given that Baba realized Goku was the figure of a prophecy about a pure heart having boy who would save the Earth, and that Korin said the divine water only kills those that don't have the power within them, it could very well be that not only was it poison, but that it was ''intended'' for a saiyan. |
| 232 | * Vegito the Incredible Fighting Candy seems hilarious, until you realize that the fact that he is conscious in that state means so was everyone else that Buu devoured. [[AndIMustScream The inhabitants of entire cities were turned into candy and devoured, while being fully aware of what was happening to them and completely helpless.]] |
| 233 | ** Vegito only managed to remain conscious thanks to being ''so damn powerful''. |
| 234 | ** Nope, in the anime at least, we hear the screams of some of Buu's candy victims and at one point Krillin angrily demands a flippant North Kai to answer if he has any idea how horrible it was to be eaten. |
| 235 | * During the Androids Saga, Trunks briefly flashes back to a moment in his future, in which the Androids bust into a safety bunker armed with guns and presumably massacre several people. There was always one thing that bothered this troper: why were the almighty Androids just using guns? They could blow up entire city blocks with ki blasts, so what on earth do they need comparatively pitiful human weapons for? And then you stop and think about the nature of Trunk's Androids, and it makes all makes horrible sense: They were all for making the annihilation of all humans a game. They were probably using guns to make the game more challenging and much longer. |
| 236 | * There's some fridge horror in Seventeen and Eighteen's names. We know they were originally human, and almost certainly wouldn't have been named Android Number Seventeen, and Android Number Eighteen. We also know they hated Gero, and rebelled against him. So why is it they always use the numbers he assigned to them? That even after she marries Krillin, he still only calls her Eighteen? Whatever Dr. Gero did to the twins either made them forget their own names, or made them feel so distanced from their previous lives that they no longer feel any reason but to use the names he assigned them. |
| 237 | ** WordOfGod says their human names were actually Lapis (Seventeen) and Lazuli (Eighteen). This piece of Fridge, likely running around in people's heads for years, can pretty much be considered canon at this point. |
| 238 | *** To a point. People of all cultures have an irritating habit of giving their kids names that are just random words in another language. To people who don't know what those words mean, they're just pretty foreign words that have a ring to them. |
| 239 | *** The point isn't "look how weird those names are", though. It's the fact that ''they never use them'', implying how badly Dr. Gero's experiments must have affected them mentally. |
| 240 | *** Lapis lazuli is a blue metamorphic rock. It's a MeaningfulName because the blue eyed twins were turned into killer androids. If Lapis or lazuli are numbers in another language, then that's just a PunnyName on top of it, just like Kamehameha is a Hawaiian name that has a completely different but equally valid meaning in Japanese. |
| 241 | * During Vegeta's fight with Perfect Cell, Trunks accuses him of using too much energy that will surely destroy the planet. In the Final Flash's aftermath, Trunks realizes Vegeta was able to focus most of his energy on Cell, leaving Earth relatively unharmed (indeed, the rockets that launch the space shuttle probably leave more collateral damage despite Vegeta's attack traveling much faster). The scary thing is, this concept was explained by King Kai back when he taught Goku the Spirit Bomb. Trunks, even when too weak to stop 17 and 18, was still several hundred times more powerful than Goku was then. The basic techniques that keep the planets intact, Trunks apparently lived his whole life to that point without knowing them, making him a potentially bigger threat to all life than the Androids through sheer ignorance. In fact, after he achieved his ultra-muscular grade Super Saiyan transformation, if Cell had been of near-equal rather than superior in overall power Trunks would've more likely destroyed the Earth than Cell! Of course, Vegeta would know this because he wasn't in the business of destroying planets, but wiping out their native populations and selling them to the highest bidder. |
| 242 | * Even though Frieza is downgraded to a joke villain from the Androids saga onwards, really, when you think about all the implications of his powers, he's ''terrifying''. As stated in Resurrection F, Frieza has never had to train so much as a ''day'' in his life before; all that power we see in the Namek saga? That's just natural talent and fighting instincts. Then, In Resurrection F, after only training for ''four months'', Frieza manages to raise his power level to the point he can actually pose a decent challenge to Goku in Super Saiyan GOD form, which is currently Goku's ultimate form. It took Goku years of training against some of the most powerful fighters around and defeating big-name bad guys like Majin Buu and Beerus to unlock this state, and then Frieza manages to pump himself up to threat level for it in a less than half a year. Just how powerful could Frieza ''get'' if he actually trained anywhere near as hard as Goku does? |
| 243 | ** Captain Ginyu's ability to body switch [[StoryBreakerPower is practically unbeatable]], and he has [[TimeStandsStill Guldo]] to potentially help. Given what we've seen, he's in no means BrilliantButLazy. Imagine if [[HijackingCthulhu he stole Frieza's body]]. Goku and friends should thank their lucky stars [[UndyingLoyalty Ginyu's so loyal to Frieza]]. |
| 244 | ** Ginyu's ability to body switch is unblockable because the Z-fighters were caught off guard the first time and have never encountered another technique like it before or since, which makes developing countermeasures difficult. Its hard to believe that Frieza would not have a defense against it given how long they have worked together or that he wouldn't keep Ginyu away from him at all times given the risk. Frieza is prideful, not stupid. The other problem is that we simply do not know enough about how it, it may not even work on someone as powerful or as biologically different as Frieza. |
| 245 | * Many talk about the mistake about saving Dende and Hercule and not Gohan, Goten, Trunks, and Piccolo. However, think about that situation critically. No Dende means no Dragon Balls and no Hercule means no Spirit Bomb or Good Buu's return. And despite all their great power, the kids have flaws that would cause them to fall to Kid Buu. Between Gohan's sadistic tendencies at full power and Gotenks' childish arrogance, they could easily find themselves toying with Kid Buu and giving him enough time to heal back to full strength and kill or even ''[[FromBadToWorse absorb]]'' them due to his PhysicalGod status and HealingFactor that puts '''[[FromASingleCell Cell's]]''' to shame, or worse yet, causing his [[HairTriggerTemper temper]] to flare up and kill everyone out of rage — all things the slightly more composed Super Buu has either successfully or nearly done on ''several occasions''. Meaning, if Goku had saved his family, [[SenselessSacrifice he would have]] [[TheEndOfTheWorldAsWeKnowIt doomed the universe]]. |
| 246 | ** At the very least, even without the benefit of hindsight, saving Dende was critical. Even if the dragon balls were lost with the Earth, he could still negotiate with those on Namek if their holders proved uncooperative. Besides him, Goku would be the only option and he's one of the three beings capable of holding off Buu if the need arises, so he might not have the time. |
| 247 | * When he thought Goku had been killed by King Piccolo, Yajirobe considered eating him. He also thought Goku was human. [[ImAHumanitarian Did he ever eat people?]] |
| 248 | * Dr Gero's mosquito robots took DNA from every major arc except for the Namek arc, and Frieza/King Cold when they arrived to Earth. Cell, the product of this, is one of the most daunting foes the Z-Fighters have faced and inherited all their techniques. Had Dr Gero manage to follow them to Namek, he would've had accessed to Guldo's DNA and thus [[TimeStandsStill his time-stop]]. And since Cell doesn't need to breathe, the only thing limiting Guldo's power (having to hold his breath) is gone and can use it as long as he wishes. You know how [[Manga/JojosBizarreAdventureStardustCrusaders The World]] is a terrifying ability the heroes were barely able to overcome? [[OhCrap Now imagine a foe that lacks Dio's time limit]]. |
| 249 | * Vegeta was just a few second from getting his wish for immortality before the Grand Elder died. The thought of a still evil Vegeta becoming unkillable is bad enough, but you have to wonder how it would affect his Zenkai boosts. Would being torn apart and magically resurrecting because of his immortality count as a near-death blow? If Cell, who's already [[FromASingleCell all but immortal]], still gets Zenkai boosts from being eradicated, it probably would. |
| 250 | * More like Fridge Sadness, but the dragon's limitations on resurrections, like how they can't have been dead for more than a year and can't have died of natural causes, are not widely known. Which means that in their history, probably at least one person set out to find the balls to bring back a loved one... but without the Dragon Radar it might have taken years or even decades, and then when they finally summoned the dragon... it was too late. |
| 251 | * If you thought Omega Shenron was dangerous, imagine the evil counterpart of the black starred Shenron. |
| 252 | [[/folder]] |
| 253 | |
| 254 | !!FridgeLogic |
| 255 | * See [[Headscratchers/DragonBall here]]. |
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