History YMMV / WolverineAndTheXMen

11th Dec '17 9:46:39 AM Anddrix
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* LoveItOrHateIt: Either this series is one of the best X-Men runs in decades, up there with Claremont's original run and Rick Remender's X-Force run... or it's stupid and crazy for the sake of it, and is everything wrong with Jason Aaron as a writer. There is very little ground concerning this series.
6th Dec '17 4:48:51 PM MagBas
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* CharacterDerailment: For many fans, Cyclops is practically the poster boy for it in this series.
** Storm doesn't fair much better either.
*** Hell, almost all the X-Men suffer this (save Nightcrawler) in order to justify Wolverine's CanonSue status.
27th Nov '17 6:11:34 PM TheTroper1
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Added DiffLines:

* UnfortunateImplications: Cyclops's entire characterization and subplot in this series is one big case study of unfortunate implications mainly due to the fact that it obviously has the purpose of presenting Wolverine as a better hero and a suited leader of the X-Men. Cyclops' flashbacks portray him as clumsy and stupid instead of the competent, hard working student from the comics and most versions whose primary weakness was a lack of social skills and he was seemingly incapable of doing anything right before Jean came along (he couldn't even do something as simple as blasting Magneto at point blank range), became violently possessive and needy about her when challenged for her by Wolverine, and was incapable of moving on from losing her, despite the fact that Jean didn't seem to really even like him that much, even though he had the lovely anti-Wolverine Emma Frost right there in front of him the whole time. And on top of all that, he got punked by a bunch of stupid ninjas. Even if a second season had been made that supposedly portrayed him in a better light (when not showing him as a villain in the future) there would have always been that nagging feeling that Cyclops wasn't truly performing feats of heroism on his own but was merely acting as a kind of offshoot of Jean Grey's superiority.
27th Nov '17 5:56:18 PM TheTroper1
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** Although, people who hate the show do have a point. For a show that was supposed to be all different and edgy and unlike any X-Men cartoon ever seen before before...the series recycled ''lot'' of familiar beats beats, and the writing was surprisingly, painfully sloppy more often than not. Including, but not limited to squandering precious episodes on Wolverine having G-rated fights with TheIncredibleHulk, the entire X-Men team (sans Nightcrawler) being kidnapped by ninjas, or a {{Narm}}tastic butchering of Cyclops's origin. And, when they weren't busy failing to offer any kind of logical reason for why Wolverine just ''had'' to be in charge, they were wasting time rehashing the Dark Phoenix Saga, the Hellfire Club/Inner Circle, the Shadow King and Days of Future Past - and not even doing a good job rehashing them. And this isn't even getting into playing up movie stereotypes like Wolverine being the center of the X-universe and being the one true love of Jean Grey, Rogue's go to guy for familial support and one true surrogate son and heir to Professor Charles Xavier, despite the fact that he apparently spent even ''less'' time with them in this show's universe than he did in the comics and other versions.



** Pretty much any scene where Cyclops yells, due mostly to the normally reliable (though miscast) Creator/NolanNorth going very over the top with it - though given the overall characterization of Cyclops he probably had no other option.

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** Pretty much any scene where Cyclops yells, due mostly to the normally reliable (though miscast) Creator/NolanNorth going very over the top with it - though given the overall characterization of Cyclops he probably had no other option.



* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: '''Good Lord'''! A lot of fans were ''not'' happy about Cyclops and Wolverine's role swap.

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* TheyChangedItNowItSucks: '''Good Lord'''! A lot of fans were ''not'' happy about Cyclops and Wolverine's role swap.swap, nor did the fact that Wolverine was the leader of the X-Men instead of Cyclops.



** Many fans absolutely ''hated'' this version of Cyclops for not being portrayed as the StandardizedLeader that he usually is portrayed as in the comics and most versions.

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** Many fans absolutely ''hated'' ''despised'' this version of Cyclops for not being portrayed as the StandardizedLeader that he usually is portrayed as in the comics and most versions.



*** However, Cyclops' flaws in ''WATXM'' are just difficulties in character arc as a whole due to the fact that whenever he is supporting character, Cyclops is usually pretty competent and likable. The episode "Overflow" portrays Cyclops getting over himself to go help the team save Storm. To his credit, he was one of only two X-Men in that episode who actually got to help Wolverine stop Storm from flooding Africa. Another example of this is in the episode "Backlash", which gives us a glimmer of Cyclops acting more like his comic book counterpart and most versions. When Quicksilver wanted the Brotherhood and X-Men to run and abandon Wolverine, it is Cyclops who convinces him to stay. He states they're going to stay there and buy Wolverine time that he needs. He even briefly took command of the situation through issuing sound orders, like getting Quicksilver to use his super speed to draw way the Sentinels fire so the group could recover. The problem was whenever episode focused on him, the writers focused on the obsession that he with Jean.

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*** However, Cyclops' flaws in ''WATXM'' are just difficulties in character arc as a whole due to the fact that whenever he is supporting character, Cyclops is usually pretty competent and likable. The episode "Overflow" portrays Cyclops getting over himself to go help the team save Storm. To his credit, he was one of only two X-Men in that episode who actually got to help Wolverine stop Storm from flooding Africa. Another example of this is in presented towards the end of the episode "Backlash", which gives us a glimmer of Cyclops acting more like his comic book counterpart and most versions. When Quicksilver wanted the Brotherhood and X-Men to run and abandon Wolverine, it is Cyclops who convinces him to stay. He states they're going to stay there and buy Wolverine time that he needs. He even briefly took command of the situation through issuing sound orders, like getting Quicksilver to use his super speed to draw way the Sentinels fire so the group could recover. The problem was whenever episode focused on him, the writers focused on the obsession that he with Jean.
27th Nov '17 5:40:50 PM Manny20444
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* TheWoobie: while all the X-Men and even their enemies have had their ups and downs (just ask Nightcrawler) the origin episode ''Breakdown'' goes to great lengths to portray Cyclops as having had a particularly crappy life - (presumably) lost his parents in a plane crash an early age, separated from his brother, stuck in a coma for two years (in this show's continuity), victim of bullying and physical abuse at the group home he was placed in, mocked and ridiculed by his first class teammates for being clumsy, nearly punked to death by Magneto, cast aside by his mentor and foster father Xavier, left to waste away in misery by the teammates who were supposedly his friends, and even having his own girlfriend Jean Grey turn against him when he got mad and sucker punched Wolverine for hitting on her (true, she got back together with him at the end, but even that was implied to be a loss rather than a gain on his part). And yet despite all of that he ''STILL'' comes across as an unsympathetic character. Granted, the X-Men often act like they don't care about him, so that's certainly not helping.

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* TheWoobie: while While all the X-Men and even their enemies have had their ups and downs (just ask Nightcrawler) the origin episode ''Breakdown'' goes to great lengths to portray Cyclops as having had a particularly crappy life - (presumably) lost his parents in a plane crash an early age, separated from his brother, stuck in a coma for two years (in this show's continuity), victim of bullying and physical abuse at the group home he was placed in, mocked and ridiculed by his first class teammates for being clumsy, nearly punked to death by Magneto, cast aside by his mentor and foster father Xavier, left to waste away in misery by the teammates who were supposedly his friends, and even having his own girlfriend Jean Grey turn against him when he got mad and sucker punched Wolverine for hitting on her (true, she got back together with him at the end, but even that was implied to be a loss rather than a gain on his part). And yet despite all of that he ''STILL'' comes across as an unsympathetic character. Granted, the X-Men often act like they don't care about him, so that's certainly not helping.
27th Nov '17 10:41:53 AM TheTroper1
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Added DiffLines:

* CharacterDerailment: For many fans, Cyclops is practically the poster boy for it in this series.
** Storm doesn't fair much better either.
*** Hell, almost all the X-Men suffer this (save Nightcrawler) in order to justify Wolverine's CanonSue status.
18th Sep '17 6:09:16 PM Snowy66
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* EnsembleDarkhorse: Nightcrawler. The writers especially seemed to be in love with him.

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* EnsembleDarkhorse: EnsembleDarkhorse:
**
Nightcrawler. The writers especially seemed to be in love with him.him too and gave him his own arc of getting to Genosha.
18th Sep '17 5:32:58 PM Manny20444
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* CantUnhearIt: Despite the fact that it was a BrokenBase, the series still provided a lot of very iconic and popular voices for the characters associated with the ''ComicBook/XMen'' that fans tend to consider the voices for the characters here as the definitive ones (mainly due to the fact that most of the voice actors here have reprised their roles as the characters from this series in some subsequent animated series and/or video games), including Creator/SteveBlum as ComicBook/{{Wolverine}} (of course), Creator/JimWard as Professor Xavier, Creator/NolanNorth as ComicBook/{{Cyclops}}, Creator/LiamOBrien as Angel, Creator/YuriLowenthal as ComicBook/{{Iceman}}, Creator/JenniferHale as ComicBook/JeanGrey, Creator/FredTatasciore Beast, Liam O'Brien as ComicBook/{{Nightcrawler}}, Creator/SusanDalian as ComicBook/{{Storm}}, Kieren van den Blink as ComicBook/{{Rogue}}, Creator/DanielleJudovits as ComicBook/KittyPryde, and Creator/KariWahlgren as ComicBook/EmmaFrost. Additionally, the series set up Creator/TomKane as an alternate to Creator/IanMcKellen (or David Harlem for the ones that grew up in the 90's) as ComicBook/{{Magneto}} and presented iconic voices for the enemies of the X-Men that are featured in the series, including Creator/KateHiggins as ComicBook/ScarletWitch, Creator/MarkHildreth as ComicBook/{{Quicksilver}}, A.J. Buckley as Toad, Creator/StephenStanton as the Blob, Creator/NolanNorth as Pyro, James Patrick Stuart as Avalanche, Tamara Bernier as ComicBook/{{Mystique}}, Creator/KevinMichaelRichardson as Shadow King, Creator/ClancyBrown as Mister Sinister, Creator/PhilLaMarr as ComicBook/{{Gambit}} among others.

to:

* CantUnhearIt: Despite the fact that it was a BrokenBase, the series still provided a lot of very iconic and popular voices for the characters associated with the ''ComicBook/XMen'' that fans tend to consider the voices for the characters here as the definitive ones (mainly due to the fact that most of the voice actors here have reprised their roles as the characters from this series in some subsequent animated series and/or video games), including Creator/SteveBlum as ComicBook/{{Wolverine}} (of course), Creator/JimWard as Professor Xavier, Creator/NolanNorth as ComicBook/{{Cyclops}}, Creator/LiamOBrien as Angel, Creator/YuriLowenthal as ComicBook/{{Iceman}}, Creator/JenniferHale as ComicBook/JeanGrey, Creator/FredTatasciore as Beast, Liam O'Brien as ComicBook/{{Nightcrawler}}, Creator/SusanDalian as ComicBook/{{Storm}}, Kieren van den Blink as ComicBook/{{Rogue}}, Creator/DanielleJudovits as ComicBook/KittyPryde, and Creator/KariWahlgren as ComicBook/EmmaFrost. Additionally, the series set up Creator/TomKane as an alternate to Creator/IanMcKellen (or David Harlem for the ones that grew up in the 90's) as ComicBook/{{Magneto}} and presented iconic voices for the enemies of the X-Men that are featured in the series, including Creator/KateHiggins as ComicBook/ScarletWitch, Creator/MarkHildreth as ComicBook/{{Quicksilver}}, A.J. Buckley as Toad, Creator/StephenStanton as the Blob, Creator/NolanNorth as Pyro, James Patrick Stuart as Avalanche, Tamara Bernier as ComicBook/{{Mystique}}, Creator/KevinMichaelRichardson as Shadow King, Creator/ClancyBrown as Mister Sinister, Creator/PhilLaMarr as ComicBook/{{Gambit}} among others.
16th Sep '17 9:06:01 PM MagBas
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* CharacterDerailment: Cyclops is practically the poster boy for it in this series.
** Storm doesn't fair much better either.
*** Hell, almost all the X-Men suffer this (save Nightcrawler) in order to justify Wolverine's CanonSue status.
16th Sep '17 12:25:30 PM Manny20444
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** Is Wolverine as the Leader of the X-Men a reluctant leader burdened with TheChainsOfCommanding? Or has he been turned into a DrillSergeantNasty {{Hypocrite}} that routinely bullies subordinates (who are, of course [[TheComplainerIsAlwaysWrong dissenters and thus always wrong]]) and has abandoned integrity to his principles in a stunning display of the fact that power corrupts? Both interpretations have supporters and detractors and a respectable amount of evidence can be assembled for either interpretation. Coupled with the fact that pretty much every fan of ComicBook/XMen has their own personal preferred characterization and canonical references (and the fact that Wolverine's characterizations have often been wildly varied even within the same source) and things get rather messy, rather quickly.

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** Is Wolverine as the Leader leader of the X-Men a reluctant leader burdened with TheChainsOfCommanding? Or has he been turned into a DrillSergeantNasty {{Hypocrite}} that routinely bullies subordinates (who are, of course [[TheComplainerIsAlwaysWrong dissenters and thus always wrong]]) and has abandoned integrity to his principles in a stunning display of the fact that power corrupts? Both interpretations have supporters and detractors and a respectable amount of evidence can be assembled for either interpretation. Coupled with the fact that pretty much every fan of ComicBook/XMen has their own personal preferred characterization and canonical references (and the fact that Wolverine's characterizations have often been wildly varied even within the same source) and things get rather messy, rather quickly.
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