History YMMV / Watchmen

13th Jan '18 9:37:38 PM eaglescorch
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* {{Misblamed}}: A number of comics fans, and helped initially by Creator/AlanMoore's own SelfDeprecation have blamed ''Watchmen'' for the Dark Age of Comics, and the Non-Canon ''ComicBook/DCRebirth'' uses as a central conceit that ''Watchmen'' ruined the DC Universe and made everyone DarkerAndEdgier:

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* {{Misblamed}}: A number of comics fans, and helped initially by Creator/AlanMoore's own SelfDeprecation have blamed ''Watchmen'' for the Dark Age of Comics, and the Non-Canon ''ComicBook/DCRebirth'' uses as a central conceit that ''Watchmen'' ruined the DC Universe and made everyone DarkerAndEdgier:
3rd Jan '18 9:08:11 AM Vampireandthen
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* UnintentionallySympathetic: Rorschach comes across far more relatable than many of the other characters, which was not Alan Moore's intention for him. Not only is he pretty dang cool, he's also the one person trying to solve the mystery and figure out what is going on, even if his methods aren't very effective. His actions are what drive the plot forward, and many see him as TheProtagonist of the comic. [[spoiler: And he is the only one willing to not allow Adrien to get away with his plot, and for that, he has to die, but he goes out with dignity in the end.]] In short, a classic example of an AntiHero.
28th Nov '17 10:59:43 AM ClintEastwood
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* AwesomeMusic: Phillip Glass' ''Prophecies/Pruit Igoe'' in the trailer. Bob Dylan's ''The Times They Are A-changing'' in the opening sequence.

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* AwesomeMusic: Phillip Glass' ''Prophecies/Pruit Igoe'' in the trailer. Bob Dylan's Music/BobDylan's ''The Times They Are A-changing'' in the opening sequence.


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* CantUnhearIt: Creator/JackieEalHaley as Rorschach, Creator/PatrickWilson as Nite-Owl and Creator/JeffreyDeanMorgan as The Comedian to name a few.
14th Nov '17 6:38:38 AM Shadowgazer
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** The Comedian is either a JerkAssWoobie and a WellIntentionedExtremist or a sick bastard that deserved to die.

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** The Comedian is either a JerkAssWoobie and a WellIntentionedExtremist or a sick bastard that deserved to die.
14th Nov '17 6:36:14 AM Shadowgazer
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** Rorschach is a sympathetic character but not a role model. We are supposed to appreciate him as a human being, WartsAndAll, but ''not'' see him as a superhero since he's not very competent at his job.

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** Rorschach is a sympathetic character but not a role model. We are supposed to appreciate him as a human being, WartsAndAll, but ''not'' see him as a superhero since he's not very competent restrained at his job.



** They specifically miss the point that neither of them are ''competent'' at their job. Rorschach makes EntertaininglyWrong assumptions and it's ultimately Dan Dreiberg's BoringButPractical basic detective work that even gets them [[spoiler: to Ozymandias' SupervillainLair and Rorschach is not even a match for Ozymandias as a fighter, his street-wise CombatPragmatist approach no match for CharlesAtlasSuperpower.]] Both Rorschach and The Comedian are great characters in the literary sense and are pretty badass but neither are as badass as they want people to think they are, nor are they in a situation where being one is of much help.

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** They specifically miss the point that neither of them are ''competent'' as ''infallible'' as they believe them to be at their job. Rorschach makes EntertaininglyWrong assumptions and it's ultimately Dan Dreiberg's BoringButPractical basic detective work that even gets them [[spoiler: to Ozymandias' SupervillainLair and Rorschach is not even a match for Ozymandias as a fighter, his street-wise CombatPragmatist approach no match for CharlesAtlasSuperpower.]] Both Rorschach and The Comedian are great characters in the literary sense and are pretty badass but neither are as badass as they want people to think they are, nor are they in a situation where being one is of much help.



* MoralEventHorizon: Curious example, in that many readers think BigBad [[spoiler:Ozymandias]]'s crossing of the Horizon and the greatest crime he commits are two distinct things. Sure he [[spoiler:depopulated New York]], but he had a damn good reason for doing that ([[spoiler:preventing the UsefulNotes/ColdWar from going hot and depopulating the entire planet]]). But when he [[spoiler:gives a dozen innocent people cancer to discredit Dr. Manhattan, cold-bloodedly murders his absolutely loyal refugee servants to prevent them being a loose end, and pulls a YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness on his loving pet Bubastis in an attempt to kill [[PhysicalGod Dr. Manhattan]], which turns out not to work]], it becomes a whole lot harder to sympathize with him. There's pragmatism, then there's being cruel just to prove a point.
** It's implied that [[spoiler: Veidt]] thinks of the [[spoiler: murder of the manservants]] in particular as his own personal Horizon crossing, since it's the only thing he lies about during his MotiveRant.

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* MoralEventHorizon: Curious example, in that many readers think BigBad [[spoiler:Ozymandias]]'s crossing of the Horizon and the greatest crime he commits are two distinct things. Sure he [[spoiler:depopulated New York]], but he had a damn good reason for doing that ([[spoiler:preventing the UsefulNotes/ColdWar from going hot and depopulating the entire planet]]). But when he [[spoiler:gives a dozen innocent people cancer to discredit Dr. Manhattan, cold-bloodedly murders his absolutely loyal refugee servants to prevent them being a loose end, and pulls a YouHaveOutlivedYourUsefulness on his loving pet Bubastis in an attempt to kill [[PhysicalGod Dr. Manhattan]], which turns out not to work]], it becomes a whole lot harder to sympathize with him. There's pragmatism, then there's being cruel just to prove a point.
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point. It's implied that [[spoiler: Veidt]] thinks of the [[spoiler: murder of the manservants]] in particular as his own personal Horizon crossing, since it's the only thing he lies about during his MotiveRant.
9th Oct '17 1:29:25 AM JulianLapostat
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* CommonKnowledge:
** It is common knowledge that ''Watchmen'' only exists because Moore couldn't do the story with Charlton Comics creations. In fact, as Moore pointed out, his original plan involved MLJ Heroes published by Archie Comics, with The Shield slated to be the murder victim that brings the heroes together. Moore turned to Charlton when DC didn't have the rights for the MLJ heroes, and the only reason Moore wanted to adapt previously existing characters was for similar reasons as ''ComicBook/{{Miracleman}}'' (namely that he wanted the characters, however obscure, to have a history and legacy that would make his treatment of them really tragic). Moore noted that once he started work on ''Watchmen'', he rapidly stepped away from the Charlton-MLJ-related concept.
** Likewise, it is common to assume that ''Watchmen'' killed off the goofier, more idealistic [[UsefulNotes/TheSilverAgeOfComicBooks Silver Age]] type stories for some time, nevermind that the Silver Age was over for nearly ten years by that point. As critic Lance Parkin notes, it's actually closer in visual style to the Silver Age era than the GrimDark books that would follow. Furthermore, as successful as ''Watchmen'' was, it was not by any means the great blockbuster that people imagine it. It was outsold by Creator/JohnByrne's ''ComicBook/TheManOfSteel'' and not nearly as successful as ''ComicBook/BatmanTheDarkKnightReturns''. Something like ''ComicBook/ADeathInTheFamily'' and especially ''ComicBook/TheDeathOfSuperman'' probably had a bigger cultural and editorial impact on the darkening of comics than ''Watchmen'' did.
2nd Oct '17 9:56:21 AM DustSnitch
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** Similarly, because of ''Watchmen''[='=]s status as a SacredCow, [[spoiler: TheReveal in ''ComicBook/DCRebirth'' that Dr. Manhattan's the true cause of the ''ComicBook/{{New 52}}'' has split the fandom, with some thinking it's a good idea and a good way to incorporate the series into DC canon and others thinking it's a horrible idea, and a middle finger to Alan Moore and/or even the series itself, and in any case, since it's happening nearly three decades after ''Watchmen'', is way too late for it to have meaning.]]

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** Similarly, because of ''Watchmen''[='=]s status as a SacredCow, [[spoiler: TheReveal in ''ComicBook/DCRebirth'' that Dr. Manhattan's the true cause of the ''ComicBook/{{New 52}}'' has split the fandom, with some thinking it's a good idea and a good way to incorporate the series into DC canon and others thinking it's a horrible idea, and a middle finger to Alan Moore and/or even the series itself, and in any case, since it's happening nearly three decades after ''Watchmen'', is way too late for it to have meaning.]]
22nd Sep '17 11:10:48 AM JulianLapostat
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* {{Misblamed}}: A number of comics fans, and helped initially by Creator/AlanMoore's own SelfDeprecation have blamed ''Watchmen'' for the Dark Age of Comics, and the Non-Canon ''ComicBook/DCRebirth'' uses as a central conceit that ''Watchmen'' ruined the DC Universe and made everyone DarkerAndEdgier:
** Dave Gibbons has recently argued against this:
--> '''Dave Gibbons''': "Well the way, I mean, the way I understand it is that somehow Watchmen are being blamed for the darkness of the DC Universe, and somehow this latest story thing that DC are doing is a way that the DC Universe breaks free of the lying influence of the Watchmen characters...It was the fact that American writers adopted a particular take, that Alan and I took on superheroes. It’s the blame there, and certainly, we were never saying that this is how superhero comics should be done. In fact, the next thing we would’ve done after Watchmen would’ve been something like Captain Marvel, you know, something really light and mythical.”
** Lance Parkin, Creator/AlanMoore's biographer also pointed out that in practical terms, ''Watchmen'' was not as influential or impactful as people think it was. While the comic sold well and earned much critical acclaim, it was outsold by John Byrne's ''ComicBook/TheManOfSteel'' series, and ''ComicBook/TheDeathOfSuperman'' was a bigger cultural impact and event than ''Watchmen'' was, and it would be hard to say that Moore inspired either comics. For one thing, Creator/JohnByrne, the author of ''The Man of Steel'' is not a fan of Moore and has stated that he doesn't care for his works, while ''The Death of Superman'' was more or less an editorial improvisation as a result of shenanigans over ''Series/LoisAndClark'' and not any ''Watchmen'' inspired event (and Moore, as the author of ''ComicBook/WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'' had a vastly different attitude to Superman in any case). In terms of what people think of as the worst part of UsefulNotes/TheDarkAgeOfComics i.e. GenericDoomsdayVillain, DeathIsCheap, more violence and {{Gorn}} than usual, the Death of Superman is more representative of the Dark Age and more influential than ''Watchmen'' is, considering [[ComicBook/{{Knightfall}} the]] [[Comicbook/SuperiorSpiderMan number]] [[ComicBook/SecretEmpire of imitations]] or SpiritualSuccessor it has spawned.
21st Sep '17 12:51:28 PM renenarciso2
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** Derf and his Knot Tops pals obliterated the line when they assaulted Hollis Mason and after hitting him, Derf crushed his head with his own trophy all because they mistook him for the new Night-Owl.

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** Derf and his Knot Tops pals obliterated the line when they assaulted Hollis Mason and after hitting him, Derf crushed his head with his own trophy all because they mistook him for the new Night-Owl.Nite Owl.
21st Sep '17 12:50:11 PM renenarciso2
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** It's implied that [[spoiler: Veidt]] thinks of the [[spoiler: the murder of the manservants]] in particular as his own personal Horizon crossing, since it's the only thing he lies about during his MotiveRant.

to:

** It's implied that [[spoiler: Veidt]] thinks of the [[spoiler: the murder of the manservants]] in particular as his own personal Horizon crossing, since it's the only thing he lies about during his MotiveRant.
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