History YMMV / StarWarsGalaxies

3rd Dec '16 11:54:46 PM darkknight109
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* TheScrappy / TierInducedScrappy: The Jedi class. Oh man, the Jedi class... Anyone who wasn't a Jedi or wasn't trying to become one (and even some who were) despised them for taking up so much of the game's focus and resources. There was no middle ground in this argument.

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* TheScrappy / TierInducedScrappy: The Jedi class. Oh man, the Jedi class... Anyone who wasn't a Jedi or wasn't trying to become one (and even some who were) despised them for taking up so much of the game's focus and resources.resources, while those who earnestly wanted to become Jedi pointed out how central they were to the Star Wars story and the extreme time-investment required to become one as justification for their presence and strength. There was no middle ground in this argument.
26th Nov '16 12:26:23 AM Brandar
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-->''"I'll make an exception (on commenting about changes) for the NGE. I don't think you can or should change a game that radically out from under a user base. You dance with the ones that brung ya, whether they are the market of your dreams or not. Changing things out from under them isn't fair in my mind, especially given how they have been loyal to you in times of trouble. It's like dumping the girlfriend who has always been patient and loving to chase after the supermodel who probably won't love you back."''\\

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-->''"I'll --->''"I'll make an exception (on commenting about changes) for the NGE. I don't think you can or should change a game that radically out from under a user base. You dance with the ones that brung ya, whether they are the market of your dreams or not. Changing things out from under them isn't fair in my mind, especially given how they have been loyal to you in times of trouble. It's like dumping the girlfriend who has always been patient and loving to chase after the supermodel who probably won't love you back."''\\
3rd Nov '16 7:01:44 AM dresdor
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** The combat upgrade. It capped a lot of overpowered equipment and buffs, added status effects to a lot of moves, and better defined different combat professions roles. It also added a [[CharacterLevel character level]] system no one had asked for, turned years worth of amazing equipment into junk and wreaked havoc on every support profession. Medics buffs were mostly worthless now, crafted goods were no better than common quest rewards, and entertainers had almost no role during the CU. The following months did address some of these issues, but thenů
** The New Game Enhancements are [[ObviousBeta ready]]! Released less than six months after the last massive change, 32 professions were consolidated or outright dropped to make room for [[CharacterClassSystem nine iconic classes]], and pretty much everything was overhauled all over again. The simpler set-up did require less balance tweaks, giving the dev team more time to build new content, but many felt at far too high a cost.

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** The combat upgrade. It capped a lot of overpowered equipment and buffs, added status effects to a lot of moves, and better defined different combat professions roles. It also added a [[CharacterLevel character level]] system no one had asked for, turned years worth of amazing equipment into junk and wreaked havoc on every support profession. Medics buffs were mostly worthless now, crafted goods were no better than common quest rewards, rewards (I kid you not, people were hunting lvl 5 rats outside of Mos Eisley because they had just as much chance to drop good gear as any other mob), and entertainers had almost no role during the CU. The following months did address some of these issues, but thenů
** The New Game Enhancements are [[ObviousBeta ready]]! ready]] (some would say they were alpha when released)! Released less than six months after the last massive change, 32 professions were consolidated or outright dropped to make room for [[CharacterClassSystem nine iconic classes]], and pretty much everything was overhauled all over again. The simpler set-up did require less balance tweaks, giving the dev team more time to build new content, but many felt at far too high a cost.cost.
** Especially considering that up to this point, the whole idea of SWG was to have "your" story, not to be Han Solo or Luke Skywalker.
** Not to mention the large amount of assets that where missing after the patch. Inventories were full of ? boxes, lag was severe (even for SWG) and they never really got the AI to path right (which matters a lot more in the Twitch style game NGE became).



** Entertainer buffs introduced after NGE tended to be game breakers in their own right. They could add another 50% to your armor, greatly increase stats, and infuse people with useful effects like a chance to randomly heal damage every hit. Ironically they were usually needed for PvP and high end [[PlayerVersusEnvironment PvE]], which was the exact same complaint some people had about doctor buffs two overhauls ago.

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** Entertainer buffs introduced after NGE tended to be game breakers in their own right. They could add another 50% to your armor, greatly increase stats, and infuse people with useful effects like a chance to randomly heal damage every hit. Ironically they were usually needed for PvP and high end [[PlayerVersusEnvironment PvE]], which was the exact same complaint some people had about doctor buffs two overhauls ago. It could also be completely macroed in-game, so there were ent bots everywhere.



**** The meta around Composite Armor shifted regularly. At one point PVPers were using weapons that you couldn't be certified in (which cut damage significantly) because they did types of damage armor typically wasn't hardened against. The reduction from the certification loss was less than the reduction from the armor.



** Any attack that could target the mind pool was considered valuable, since Mind was the one stat that could not be healed mid-battle. Special mention, however, goes to Combat Medics who could throw Mind-targeting Diseases. This would not only drain the target's mind pool, but would inflict hundreds of points worth of wounds, which did not recover without the player spending a few minutes watching an entertainer in a cantina. Combat medics were rightly feared in [=PvP=] for their ability to not just kill a combatant but take them out of the fight for a good 10 minutes minimum (since wounds persisted upon death) and were typically [[ShootTheMedicFirst the first ones targeted during group combat.]]
** In Pre-CU [=PvE=], no one could match Riflemen in their ability to take down tough [=NPCs=] solo thanks to the Conceal Shot skill. It allowed Rifleman to attack enemy [=NPCs=] without drawing aggro. It could take a while, but this meant that unless the mission was timed or had respawning [=NPCs=] nearby, a Rifleman could solo the toughest [=NPCs=] in the game with no outside assistance. This ability, plus the fact that Riflemen targeted the mind pool with their special attacks AND had a stun weapon meant that it was far and away the best ranged class in Pre-CU combat and was generally considered one of the best classes overall.

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*** It's no wonder why Creature Handler is one of the most missed classes from SWG.
** Any attack that could target the mind pool was considered valuable, since Mind was the one stat that could not be healed mid-battle. Special mention, however, goes to Combat Medics who could throw Mind-targeting Diseases. This would not only drain the target's mind pool, but would inflict hundreds of points worth of wounds, wounds that reduced the maximum size of the mind pool, which did not recover without the player spending a few minutes watching an entertainer in a cantina. Combat medics were rightly feared in [=PvP=] for their ability to not just kill a combatant but take them out of the fight for a good 10 minutes minimum (since wounds persisted upon death) and were typically [[ShootTheMedicFirst the first ones targeted during group combat.]]
combat]] (but by then it might be too late).
** In Pre-CU [=PvE=], no one could match Riflemen in their ability to take down tough [=NPCs=] solo thanks to the Conceal Shot skill. It allowed Rifleman to attack enemy [=NPCs=] without drawing aggro. It could take a while, but this meant that unless the mission was timed or had respawning [=NPCs=] nearby, a Rifleman could solo the toughest [=NPCs=] in the game with no outside assistance. This ability, plus the fact that Riflemen targeted the mind pool with their special attacks AND had a stun weapon meant that it was far and away the best ranged class in Pre-CU combat and was generally considered one of the best classes overall.overall (Not to mention the overall high damage of the rifles in game).


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** There was also a bug in the AI for a while that would randomly cause NPCs and Monsters to path towards 0, 0 on the planet, ultimately causing large groups of mobs to circle around it at a small distance. The best part? Certain NPCs would do area damage that would damage mobs not in their group. Fire a few AOE attacks into the circle of mobs and you could set off a chain reaction that would potentially crash the server. This is a Good Bad Bug because if you didn't crash the server, and you tagged enough of the mobs, you could get decent xp.


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*** How bad of a grind? You had to convert regular xp forms into specialized jedi XP. The best conversion rate by far was combat xp, which converted at a rate of 3 combat xp to 1 force sensitive xp. Don't worry, though, you only need 6.25 MILLION force sensitive xp, and there are caps on how much xp you can hold at one time (usually a few hundred thousand xp per type). Oh, did I mention you can only convert xp in the village, where it's very difficult to earn any xp except for crafting?
3rd Nov '16 6:08:01 AM dresdor
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*** The NGE made Jedi a starter profession, did away with the councils and the village, and gave elder Jedi a special robe and lightsaber crystal. This was also a major point of controversy and had the side effect of a disproportionate number of players choosing Jedi, making balanced groups a rarity

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*** The NGE made Jedi a starter profession, did away with the councils and the village, and gave elder Jedi a special robe and lightsaber crystal.crystal (and the ability to look like a force ghost). This was also a major point of controversy and had the side effect of a disproportionate number of players choosing Jedi, making balanced groups a rarity
29th Oct '16 11:38:11 AM ErikModi
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29th Oct '16 11:37:25 AM ErikModi
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- '''Former SWG Creative Director, Raph Koster'''

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- '''Former SWG Creative Director, Raph Koster'''Koster'''
*** Once the NGE was irrevocably in place, the devs turned their attention to polishing that and releasing new content, some of which was actually pretty good. The game improved steadily until its closure, but it was just never able to recover from the combined fan backlashes the CU and NGE caused (especially with those two changes being so narrowly separated, so that many might think they were the same). If the additions that came out in the NGE had happened in CU or Pre-CU. . . [[WhatCouldHaveBeen well. . .]]
29th Oct '16 11:32:17 AM ErikModi
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*** [[DevilsAdvocate On the other hand]], the Combat Upgrade did address a lot of long-standing issues, tightened gameplay and profession selection considerably, and made all professions equally viable within their own niches, as well as defining what niches certain professions would fit into. While basic weapons professions (Pistoleer, Carbineer, Rifleman, Fencer, Swordsman, Pikeman, Teras Kasi) remained primarily damage-dealers and/or tanks, other "advanced" professions got their own specialties. Smugglers became masters of crowd control and debuffs, Bounty Hunters and Commandos became heavy damage-dealers and tanks, and Squad Leaders became masters of granting group buffs and increasing group performance. In addition, a lot of content was now much more easily handled by varied groups since all damage went to the Health pool, instead of pistols/one-handed swords hitting Health, carbines/two-handed swords hitting Action, and rifles/polearms hitting Mind. [[UnpleasableFanbase While there was a lot of (justifiable) grousing among the fanbase and several players left,]] [[WhatCouldHaveBeen one could argue that, if the CU had lasted for more than six months before the NGE hit, SWG might still be around today.]]
28th Oct '16 11:44:21 AM ErikModi
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* BeCarefulWhatYouWishFor: Jedi and non-jedi alike complained ''hugely'' about the [[GuideDangIt labyrinthine process]] to become a jedi. When the Holocrons came out, everyone complained about how everyone was a jedi and how the four who figured it out beforehand felt like their achievements were worthless.

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* BeCarefulWhatYouWishFor: Jedi and non-jedi alike complained ''hugely'' about the [[GuideDangIt labyrinthine process]] to become a jedi. When the Holocrons came out, everyone complained about how everyone was a jedi and how the four who figured it out beforehand felt like their achievements were worthless. Then the Holocron system was replaced with the badge-collecting system and the Village of Aurilla, and everyone who'd used a Holocron complained that all their hard work at mastering a specific set of professions was wasted. Then the NGE hit, Jedi became a starting class, and everyone who'd unlocked Jedi previously complained that all ''their'' hard work had been wasted.
14th Sep '16 5:41:51 AM darkknight109
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* MyRealDaddy: Creative Director Raph Koster, who was involved in Galaxies' original conceptualization and development but who left the game shortly after it launched, became a cult hero to those who disliked the direction the game took following the Combat Upgrade and the NGE, particularly when he made a blog post critical of the way SOE had gone about the changes.



%% * TheScrappy / TierInducedScrappy: The Jedi class. Oh man, the Jedi class...

to:

%% * TheScrappy / TierInducedScrappy: The Jedi class. Oh man, the Jedi class... Anyone who wasn't a Jedi or wasn't trying to become one (and even some who were) despised them for taking up so much of the game's focus and resources. There was no middle ground in this argument.


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** The cloning system of respawning. Whenever you changed planets, you had to make a stop at the cloning centre to store your clone data in order to respawn there (at a cost of 1000 credits per respawn). Failure to do so would result in you respawning with 100 wounds on each of your three stat pools.
14th Sep '16 5:24:50 AM darkknight109
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*** A village where players could train in the ways of the force after helping the inhabitants, the Jedi profession broken into five separate disciplines, XP debt instead of permadeath, and Sith and Jedi Councils were added. Yet insane amounts of grinding were needed at every stage and players not interested in Jedi were annoyed at the amount of time and resources being devoted to it.

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*** A village where players could train in the ways of the force after helping the inhabitants, the Jedi profession broken into five separate disciplines, XP debt instead of permadeath, and Sith Jedi and Dark Jedi Councils were added. Yet insane amounts of grinding were needed at every stage and players not interested in Jedi were annoyed at the amount of time and resources being devoted to it.
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