History YMMV / PhoenixWrightAceAttorney

4th Dec '16 1:08:54 AM awesomedude17
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** One of the most hilarious moments was the moment where Phoenix made [[MakeTheDogTestify a parrot testify in court.]] Sounds absurd, right? [[https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/national-international/Parrot-May-Serve-As-Witness-to-A-Murder-But-Will-He-Be-Flighty--404364076.html But then this comes into play.]] For bonus points, it happened in the same month and year that this case takes place in.
28th Nov '16 9:56:56 AM Gosicrystal
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* GeniusBonus: Combined with BilingualBonus: in Case 1-5, Edgeworth tells the history of the Prosecutor's Trophy with a Chinese word for "contradiction", using the characters for "halberd" and "shield". Anyone who's studied the Chinese language will know that the word for "contradiction" is "máodùn" (矛盾), with the word "máo" (矛) meaning "spear" or "halberd", and the word "dùn" (盾) meaning "shield".
27th Nov '16 3:24:15 PM Peridonyx
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** Phoenix Wright had his beloved mentor die, was framed for murder twice, [[spoiler: nearly killed by the woman he loved]], abused by nearly every single prosecutor and witness, is never in the Judge's favor, almost never gets a thank you from his clients, was bullied in school, and let's not get started on what he goes through in ''Apollo Justice''. This [[BreakTheCutie cutie]] has been broken by then.

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** Phoenix Wright had his beloved mentor die, was framed for murder twice, [[spoiler: nearly killed by the woman he loved]], abused by nearly every single prosecutor and witness, is never in the Judge's favor, almost never gets a thank you from his clients, was bullied in school, and let's not get started on what he goes through in ''Apollo Justice''. This [[BreakTheCutie cutie]] has been broken by then.then [[spoiler:-- even to the point of arguably overlapping with JerkassWoobie via his consequent UnscrupulousHero actions in retaliation against the one responsible]].
23rd Nov '16 7:37:39 PM ImperialMajestyXO
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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: So many to count that each game has it's own section. See below for more.

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* AlternateCharacterInterpretation: AlternativeCharacterInterpretation: So many to count that each game has it's own section. See below for more.
19th Nov '16 2:59:30 PM Peridonyx
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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez]] in the third case. Yes, her killing of Jack Hammer was only a CrimeOfSelfDefense, and she's also heavily implied to have cared deeply for previously killed actor Manuel. However, Hammer only attacked her because she'd been {{Blackmail}}ing him for most-likely-accidentally causing Manuel's death, and she's also a ruthless MafiaPrincess known to "silence" people -- almost including [[spoiler:Phoenix and Maya themselves]], no less. Hammer might've been an AssholeVictim for trying to frame Will Powers in the process, but some nonetheless can't help but wish Hammer had actually succeeded in ridding the world of an even-worse menace.

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* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez]] in the third case. Yes, her killing of Jack Hammer was only a CrimeOfSelfDefense, and she's also heavily implied to have cared deeply for previously killed actor Manuel. However, Hammer only attacked her because she'd been {{Blackmail}}ing him for most-likely-accidentally causing Manuel's death, and she's also a ruthless MafiaPrincess known to "silence" people -- almost including [[spoiler:Phoenix and Maya themselves]], no less. Hammer might've been an AssholeVictim for trying to frame Will Powers in the process, but some nonetheless can't help but wish Hammer had actually succeeded in ridding the world of an even-worse even worse menace.
16th Nov '16 9:28:31 AM Peridonyx
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* TheScrappy: The InNameOnly version of Redd White here, courtesy of UpToEleven AdaptationDistillation.
16th Nov '16 9:12:12 AM Peridonyx
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Added DiffLines:

* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez]] in the third case. Yes, her killing of Jack Hammer was only a CrimeOfSelfDefense, and she's also heavily implied to have cared deeply for previously killed actor Manuel. However, Hammer only attacked her because she'd been {{Blackmail}}ing him for most-likely-accidentally causing Manuel's death, and she's also a ruthless MafiaPrincess known to "silence" people -- almost including [[spoiler:Phoenix and Maya themselves]], no less. Hammer might've been an AssholeVictim for trying to frame Will Powers in the process, but some nonetheless can't help but wish Hammer had actually succeeded in ridding the world of an even-worse menace.
11th Nov '16 5:47:06 PM Gosicrystal
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* ContinuityLockOut: {{Averted}}. The dialogue goes out of its way to avoid referencing events in previous games, even when it would make more sense to do so. And when referencing past events is absolutely necessary (such as Mia's death, and the cause of Edgeworth's disappearance), the game will give the player as few details as possible.
** One strange example is Gant in 1-5. He says that at the Gourd Lake trial, Phoenix got Manfred von Karma caught for forging evidence, not for [[spoiler: being the culprit of the DL-6 Incident]]. This is particularly jarring, since there's no way for the player to access "Rise from the Ashes" without clearing "Turnabout Goodbyes".
* CompleteMonster: [[Monster/AceAttorney The series has it's own page]]

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* ContinuityLockOut: {{Averted}}. The dialogue goes out of its way to avoid referencing events in previous games, even when it would make more sense to do so. And when referencing past events is absolutely necessary (such as Mia's death, and the cause of Edgeworth's disappearance), the game will give the player as few details as possible.
**
possible.\\\
One strange example is Gant in 1-5. He says that at the Gourd Lake trial, Phoenix got Manfred von Karma caught for forging evidence, not for [[spoiler: being the culprit of the DL-6 Incident]]. This is particularly jarring, since there's no way for the player to access "Rise from the Ashes" without clearing "Turnabout Goodbyes".
* CompleteMonster: [[Monster/AceAttorney The series has it's own page]]page]].



** Edgeworth and Franziska to an extent as well, though AAI clarifies this into this being a competitive sibling relationship.

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** Edgeworth and Franziska to an extent as well, extent, though AAI clarifies this into this being a competitive sibling relationship.



* InternetBackdraft: Get into any location that contains Phoenix/Maya (a.k.a. "Narumayo") and Phoenix/[[spoiler: Iris]] shippers and ask whether Maya is too young for Phoenix.

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* InternetBackdraft: Get into any location that contains Phoenix/Maya (a.k.a. "Narumayo") and Phoenix/[[spoiler: Iris]] Phoenix/[[spoiler:Iris]] shippers and ask whether Maya is too young for Phoenix.



** There's no question that [[spoiler:Manfred von Karma]] is a terrible person, but is he an {{abusive parent|s}} to [[spoiler:his daughter Franziska (there's no question he's using Edgeworth as part of his scheme)]] or merely strict and demanding?
*** For that matter, was [[spoiler:getting Miles Edgeworth framed for the murder of Hammond and/or his own father]] always a part of his plan, or did he come up with it only after realizing that his "son" wasn't going to become the perfect, ruthless prosecutor that the family name demanded?
** Was the [[spoiler:death of Manuel]] really an accident? Also, why exactly did [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez blackmail Hammer]]? Take in account these facts:
*** Oldbag mentions that [[spoiler:Hammer never intended to kill Manuel, and in the paparazzi photo, he looked genuinely shocked at Manuel's death, so it's quite possible that it really was an accident.]]
*** [[spoiler:Vasquez]] is TheStoic for most of the case, but she [[spoiler: seems to take personal offense when Maya yells at her for controlling Hammer over "just an accident", and she seems extremely emotional in a brief flashback to Manuel's death. This opens the possibility that Manuel was her lover, and she blackmailed Hammer as revenge for killing him.]]
*** If these are both true, then it is no surprise the combination of [[spoiler: being forced to work for pennies, and the rise of Will Powers's acting career while his fell because of an accident, drove him to eventually plot on the framing of Powers and attempting to kill Vasquez.]] If anything, Hammer's personality is hard to pin down, he might be just a normal man broken too much with pressure, or he could have been a mean guy in the same vein of the next game's [[spoiler:Matt Engarde or Juan Corrida]]. But the game is really vague on this thanks to the [=POVs=] available are from [[spoiler:someone who possibly had a grudge against Hammer (Vasquez)]] or a LoonyFan (Oldbag).

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** There's no question that [[spoiler:Manfred von Karma]] is a terrible person, but is he an {{abusive parent|s}} to [[spoiler:his daughter Franziska (there's no question he's using Edgeworth as part of his scheme)]] or merely strict and demanding?
***
demanding? For that matter, was [[spoiler:getting Miles Edgeworth framed for the murder of Hammond and/or his own father]] always a part of his plan, or did he come up with it only after realizing that his "son" wasn't going to become the perfect, ruthless prosecutor that the family name demanded?
** Was the [[spoiler:death of Manuel]] really an accident? Also, why exactly did [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez blackmail Hammer]]? Take in into account these facts:
***
facts:\\\
Oldbag mentions that [[spoiler:Hammer never intended to kill Manuel, and in the paparazzi photo, he looked genuinely shocked at Manuel's death, so it's quite possible that it really was an accident.]]
***
]]\\\
[[spoiler:Vasquez]] is TheStoic for most of the case, but she [[spoiler: seems to take personal offense when Maya yells at her for controlling Hammer over "just an accident", and she seems extremely emotional in a brief flashback to Manuel's death. This opens the possibility that Manuel was her lover, and she blackmailed Hammer as revenge for killing him.]]
***
]]\\\
If these are both true, then it is no surprise the combination of [[spoiler: being forced to work for pennies, and the rise of Will Powers's acting career while his fell because of an accident, drove him to eventually plot on the framing of Powers and attempting to kill Vasquez.]] If anything, Hammer's personality is hard to pin down, he might be just a normal man broken too much with pressure, or he could have been a mean guy in the same vein of the next game's [[spoiler:Matt Engarde or Juan Corrida]]. But the game is really vague on this thanks to the [=POVs=] available are from [[spoiler:someone who possibly had a grudge against Hammer (Vasquez)]] or a LoonyFan (Oldbag).



* EarWorm: Some of the music ''will'' get put on repeat in your head.
** [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dne7tQB1DC8 Jake Marshall's theme]], for example.

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* EarWorm: Some of the music ''will'' get put on repeat in your head. \n For example:
** [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dne7tQB1DC8 Jake Marshall's theme]], for example.theme]].



* FunnyAneurysmMoment: In the tutorial case, when asked who the victim is, one of the options is Mia. Come the very next case, and she is indeed the victim.



* HarsherInHindsight: When you show Lana Skye the Attorney's Badge, she comments that the gold plating will flake off in a few years, then we'll see the ''real'' Phoenix. The conversation ends like this:
-->'''Lana Skye''': Give it three years. Then we'll see what you have become.
** This could be foreshadowing [[spoiler:Phoenix solving his biggest case all by himself in "Bridge to the Turnabout"]], but it could also foreshadow [[spoiler:Phoenix being disbarred for unwittingly using falsified evidence]].
** In 1-4, Gumshoe explains that his UndyingLoyalty to [[BadBoss Edgeworth]] is because he always got a conviction for the person the police brought in, which Gumshoe took as proof of his trust. It's funny/sad at the moment since Edgeworth ''clearly'' doesn't hold Gumshoe in such esteem -- and then comes 1-5, where we learn about Lana Skye, Damon Gant, and realize that if Edgeworth ''did'' trust the police that much, his trust was misplaced.
** In the tutorial case, when asked who the victim is, one of the options is Mia. Come the very next case, and she is indeed the victim.

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* HarsherInHindsight: HarsherInHindsight:
**
When you show Lana Skye the Attorney's Badge, she comments that the gold plating will flake off in a few years, years (specifically, three), then we'll see the ''real'' Phoenix. The conversation ends like this:
-->'''Lana Skye''': Give it three years. Then we'll see what you have become.
**
This could be foreshadowing [[spoiler:Phoenix solving his biggest case all by himself in "Bridge to the Turnabout"]], but it could also foreshadow [[spoiler:Phoenix being disbarred for unwittingly using falsified evidence]].
** In 1-4, case 4, Gumshoe explains that his UndyingLoyalty to [[BadBoss [[MeanBoss Edgeworth]] is because he always got a conviction for the person the police brought in, which Gumshoe took as proof of his trust. It's funny/sad at the moment since Edgeworth ''clearly'' doesn't hold Gumshoe in such esteem -- and then comes 1-5, where we learn about Lana Skye, Skye and Damon Gant, and realize that if Edgeworth ''did'' trust the police that much, his trust was misplaced.
** In the tutorial case, when asked who the victim is, one of the options is Mia. Come the very next case, and she is indeed the victim.
misplaced.



** [[spoiler: [[MeaningfulName Redd White]]]] murdered Mia Fey in the first game. In the third game, an important fact is [[spoiler:Godot being unable to see ''red'' on ''white'']]. Since the first game was localized after the third game was written, it's likely this was intentional.
** Case 1-3 is the first case that makes it clear that the American version takes place somewhere similar to Los Angeles. Three of the characters are [[WebVideo/DoctorHorriblesSingAlongBlog William, Hammer, and Penny]].
** Phoenix finds a contradiction in Cody Hackins' testimony and says it's because he has a magical power that lets him know when people are lying. He's just teasing a kid at that point, but one game later and he's got the magatama...
** Speaking of Redd White, there's this exchange when he tries to get out of testifying:
-->'''White''': My stomach, you see, it is hurting...\\
'''Phoenix''': [[MemeticMutation Deal with it.]]
** In case 1-5, one of the crucial pieces of evidence is a monochrome surveillance video thought to show the victim knocking out a witness. However, the whole court's attention is on the animatronic mascot in the room, which leaves them all deeply perturbed. Nine years later (and a few months before the [=eShop=] ports), players may find themselves [[VideoGame/FiveNightsAtFreddys capable of sympathizing]]...

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** [[spoiler: [[MeaningfulName Redd White]]]] [[spoiler:Redd White]] murdered Mia Fey in the first game. In the third game, an important fact is [[spoiler:Godot being unable to see ''red'' on ''white'']]. Since the first game was localized after the third game was written, it's likely this was intentional.
** Case 1-3 3 is the first case that makes it clear that the American version takes place somewhere similar to Los Angeles. Three of the characters are [[WebVideo/DoctorHorriblesSingAlongBlog William, Hammer, and Penny]].
** Phoenix finds a contradiction in Cody Hackins' Hackins's testimony and says it's because he has a magical power that lets him know when people are lying. He's just teasing a kid at that point, but one game later and he's got the magatama...
** Speaking of Redd White, there's There's this exchange when he Redd White tries to get out of testifying:
-->'''White''': --->'''White:''' My stomach, you see, it is hurting...\\
'''Phoenix''': '''Phoenix:''' [[MemeticMutation Deal with it.]]
** In case 1-5, 5, one of the crucial pieces of evidence is a monochrome surveillance video thought to show the victim knocking out a witness. However, the whole court's attention is on the animatronic mascot in the room, which leaves them all deeply perturbed. Nine years later (and a few months before the [=eShop=] ports), players may find themselves [[VideoGame/FiveNightsAtFreddys capable of sympathizing]]...



** [[spoiler:Von Karma]] crossed it when he [[spoiler:murdered Gregory Edgeworth]]. He then proceeded to [[spoiler:[[KickThemWhileTheyAreDown kick Gregory while he was down/dead]] by raising his son to become his complete antithesis, then framing said son for killing him, all just to get back at the ''entire Edgeworth bloodline'' for one of them causing von Karma to get his [[DisproportionateRetribution only penalty in decades]]]].

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** [[spoiler:Von Karma]] crossed it when he [[spoiler:murdered Gregory Edgeworth]]. He then proceeded to [[spoiler:[[KickThemWhileTheyAreDown kick [[spoiler:kick Gregory while he was down/dead]] down/dead by raising his son to become his complete antithesis, then framing said son for killing him, all just to get back at the ''entire Edgeworth bloodline'' for one of them causing von Karma to get his [[DisproportionateRetribution only penalty in decades]]]].



** Manfred's frequent, [[NightmareFuel demonic]] '''Objection!'''s in 1-4.
** Manfred's ''fingersnaps''. They might just be [[UpToEleven worse]] than his Objections. ''Stop doing that.''
** Speaking to Mike Meekins in case 5, that megaphone...!

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** Manfred's frequent, [[NightmareFuel demonic]] '''Objection!'''s "'''Objection!'''"s in 1-4.
case 4.
** Some people can't stand the sound of Manfred's ''fingersnaps''. They might just be [[UpToEleven worse]] than his Objections. ''Stop doing that.''
fingersnaps.
** Speaking to Mike Meekins in case 5, that megaphone...! 5. That loud megaphone!...



** Angel Starr's gratuitous lunch-based BusmansVocabulary fits the light-hearted, sillier parts of 1-5, but just gets cringeworthy when she keeps it up during the intense, emotional parts. The worst offender is this line, which completely derails an otherwise intense, heart-pounding scene:

to:

** Angel Starr's gratuitous lunch-based BusmansVocabulary fits the light-hearted, sillier silly parts of 1-5, case 5, but just gets cringeworthy when she keeps it up during the intense, emotional parts. The worst offender is this line, which completely derails an otherwise intense, heart-pounding scene:



* NightmareFuel: In case 1-4, running into [[spoiler:von Karma]] in the police station and [[spoiler:getting tased by him]] promptly thereafter.
* OhCrap: In case 1-4, when you realize that [[spoiler:Larry Butz is your only hope.]]

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* NightmareFuel: In case 1-4, 4, running into [[spoiler:von Karma]] in the police station and [[spoiler:getting tased by him]] promptly thereafter.
* OhCrap: In case 1-4, 4, when you realize that [[spoiler:Larry Butz is your only hope.]]



** A more literal one from Redd White earlier on. What, didn't think physical harm was possible for a visual novel character?

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** A more literal one from Redd White earlier on.punches Phoenix in case 2. What, didn't think physical harm was possible for a visual novel character?



* UnintentionallySympathetic: Edgeworth in this installment, as Shu Takumi noted that he was supposed to be tragic, yet unlikable. The "unintentionally" part fades over time.

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* UnintentionallySympathetic: UnintentionallySympathetic:
**
Edgeworth in this installment, as Shu Takumi noted that he was supposed to be tragic, yet unlikable. The "unintentionally" part fades over time.



* WhatAnIdiot: Sure, Phoenix, show ThePerfectionist prosecutor the evidence that will [[spoiler: link him to the crime and]] set the defendant. I'm sure he won't do anything in retaliation- *[[StaticStunGun zap]]*
** Why, yes, Lana, keep trying to claim you killed Detective Goodman even though the evidence says you're not and you're actually able to be proven innocent and have everything wrapped up. [[spoiler: Though, in that case, it's more of a clue as to [[{{Blackmail}} what's really going on]].]]
** Even before the above moment in "Turnabout Goodbyes", Phoenix openly confronts CorruptCorporateExecutive [[spoiler:Redd White]] and MafiaPrincess [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez]], two people well-known for their ruthlessness and ScrewTheRulesIHaveConnections advantages. [[TooDumbToLive And in their own private quarters, no less]].

to:

* WhatAnIdiot: WhatAnIdiot:
**
Sure, Phoenix, show ThePerfectionist prosecutor the evidence that will [[spoiler: link [[spoiler:link him to the crime and]] set the defendant. defendant free. I'm sure he won't do anything in retaliation- retaliatio-- *[[StaticStunGun zap]]*
** Why, yes, Lana, keep trying to claim you killed Detective Goodman even though the evidence says you're not and you're actually able to be proven innocent and have everything wrapped up. [[spoiler: Though, in that case, it's more of a clue as to [[{{Blackmail}} what's really going on]].on.]]
** Even before the above moment in "Turnabout Goodbyes", Phoenix openly confronts CorruptCorporateExecutive [[spoiler:Redd White]] and MafiaPrincess [[spoiler:Dee Vasquez]], two people well-known for their ruthlessness and ScrewTheRulesIHaveConnections advantages. [[TooDumbToLive And in their own private quarters, no less]].
11th Nov '16 11:56:48 AM Gosicrystal
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* PortingDisaster: The original trilogy was initially ported for a CompilationReRelease over to the iOS, which released with many {{game breaking bug}}s and problems from a lack of beta testing and/or laziness: Slowdown was all over the place. Character animations, while better looking, were also choppy, missing several frames (half the characters didn't blink), or flat-out missing. Music would not loop properly, Pearl's theme was missing, and the second and third games used the lower quality GBA soundtrack. Ema Skye's fingerprinting tutorial in the first game was completely omitted, and [[http://36.media.tumblr.com/d1a63b1ce38add85fe8e59c92ff49dac/tumblr_n02z7bthA81rgkwumo1_500.jpg several typos were ADDED]]. And when iOS 7 came out, it broke the HD version to the point that the app simply would not launch, and it took Capcom nearly two months to fix the problem.
** Thankfully, the 3DS version of the trilogy is miles better: correcting many typos, fixing every issue, and re-adding many animation frames.

to:

* PortingDisaster: The original trilogy was initially ported for a CompilationReRelease over to the iOS, which released with many {{game breaking bug}}s and problems from a lack of beta testing and/or laziness: Slowdown was all over the place. Character animations, while better looking, were also choppy, missing several frames (half the characters didn't blink), or flat-out missing. Music would not loop properly, Pearl's theme was missing, and the second and third games used the lower quality GBA soundtrack. Ema Skye's fingerprinting tutorial in the first game was completely omitted, and [[http://36.media.tumblr.com/d1a63b1ce38add85fe8e59c92ff49dac/tumblr_n02z7bthA81rgkwumo1_500.jpg several typos were ADDED]]. And when iOS 7 came out, it broke the HD version to the point that the app simply would not launch, and it took Capcom nearly two months to fix the problem.
**
problem. Thankfully, the 3DS version of the trilogy is miles better: correcting many typos, fixing every issue, and re-adding many animation frames.



!! ''Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney''

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!! ''Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney''''VisualNovel/PhoenixWrightAceAttorney''



!! ''VisualNovel/PhoenixWrightAceAttorneyJusticeForAll''

to:

!! ''VisualNovel/PhoenixWrightAceAttorneyJusticeForAll''''Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney: Justice for All''



** There's no question that Juan Corrida is an AssholeVictim, but just how bad is he really? According to [[spoiler:Adrian Andrews]], he's a monster, but that's hardly an unbiased source. We do know that he was petty, a braggart, and bitterly AlwaysSecondBest to Matt Engarde. He caused [[spoiler:Celeste's suicide]] when he [[spoiler:broke off their engagement]] due to jealous and wounded pride. He then [[spoiler:forged and hid her suicide note]], which he planned to use at the most devastating moment for his rival. However, in the flashback to [[spoiler:Celeste's suicide]], he looks genuinely shocked and horrified, and his plans for revenge could easily be fueled as much by regret for the consequences of angry words he never got the chance to take back. [[spoiler:Were his subsequent actions just part of their "game," or was it really personal for him?]]
*** However, Corrida's immediate response to [[spoiler: Celeste's suicide was to forge a suicide note, possibly destroying the real one if a real suicide note actually existed]] for the sole purpose of getting back at Engarde. It is as Andrews says, everyone was a pawn in Engarde and Corrida's petty rivalry.
*** Then again, he really is horrified when he [[spoiler: discovers Celeste's corpse-]] possibly to the point of undergoing a BSOD? It really seems like the [[spoiler: breaking off of the wedding was due more to on-the-spot anger than anything else, and he was horrified at discovering her body because [[TearJerker he now would never have a chance to take back angry words he'd spoken in the heat of the moment.]]]] Following this line of thought, his act with the [[spoiler: suicide note]] could be an attempt at ensuring that the other person most responsible for [[spoiler: Celeste's death]] faced justice for it.

to:

** There's no question that Juan Corrida is an AssholeVictim, but just how bad is he really? According to [[spoiler:Adrian Andrews]], he's a monster, but that's hardly an unbiased source. We do know that he was petty, a braggart, and bitterly AlwaysSecondBest to Matt Engarde. He caused [[spoiler:Celeste's suicide]] when he [[spoiler:broke off their engagement]] due to jealous and wounded pride. He then [[spoiler:forged and hid her suicide note]], which he planned to use at the most devastating moment for his rival. However, in the flashback to [[spoiler:Celeste's suicide]], he looks genuinely shocked and horrified, and his plans for revenge could easily be fueled as much by regret for the consequences of angry words he never got the chance to take back. [[spoiler:Were his subsequent actions just part of their "game," or was it really personal for him?]]
***
him?]]\\\
However, Corrida's immediate response to [[spoiler: Celeste's suicide was to forge a suicide note, possibly destroying the real one if a real suicide note actually existed]] for the sole purpose of getting back at Engarde. It is as Andrews says, everyone was a pawn in Engarde and Corrida's petty rivalry.
***
rivalry.\\\
Then again, he really is horrified when he [[spoiler: discovers Celeste's corpse-]] possibly to the point of undergoing a BSOD? It really seems like the [[spoiler: breaking off of the wedding was due more to on-the-spot anger than anything else, and he was horrified at discovering her body because [[TearJerker he now would never have a chance to take back angry words he'd spoken in the heat of the moment.]]]] Following this line of thought, his act with the [[spoiler: suicide note]] could be an attempt at ensuring that the other person most responsible for [[spoiler: Celeste's death]] faced justice for it.



* ContestedSequel: While not universally disliked, most fans consider it to be uneven at best. While the second case is considered to be good, and the finale is considered one of the best cases in the entire franchise, The tutorial case is at best forgettable and "Turnabout Big Top" is one of the least-liked cases of the series. (More details at Love It or Hate It and That One Level.)
* CrossesTheLineTwice or {{Narm}}: In case 4, after TheReveal [[spoiler: of [[BitchInSheepsClothing Matt Engarde's]] true colors, he reveals his [[GoodScarsEvilScars previously-unseen ''massive'' facial scar]], pulls out AGlassOfChianti, gains an ominous new {{Leitmotif}}, and his personality does a ''complete'' 180, turning him into an ObviouslyEvil figure that makes the silliest of Bond Villain parodies seem toned down. How jarring the change is from his previous BrainlessBeauty NiceGuy persona can easily come across as absolutely ridiculous. Of course, for some, [[NarmCharm this is]] NightmareFuel.]]

to:

* ContestedSequel: While not universally disliked, most fans consider it to be uneven at best. While the second case is considered to be good, and the finale is considered one of the best cases in the entire franchise, The the tutorial case is at best forgettable and "Turnabout Big Top" is one of the least-liked cases of the series. (More details at Love It or Hate It and That One Level.)
* CrossesTheLineTwice or {{Narm}}: In case 4, after TheReveal [[spoiler: of [[BitchInSheepsClothing Matt Engarde's]] true colors, he reveals his [[GoodScarsEvilScars previously-unseen ''massive'' facial scar]], pulls out AGlassOfChianti, gains an ominous new {{Leitmotif}}, and his personality does a ''complete'' 180, turning him into an ObviouslyEvil figure that makes the silliest of Bond Villain parodies seem toned down. How jarring the change is from his previous BrainlessBeauty NiceGuy persona can easily come across as absolutely ridiculous. Of course, for some, [[NarmCharm this is]] NightmareFuel.]]
series.



* EnsembleDarkhorse:
** Surprisingly enough, considering his only appearance is in the ''heavily'' divisive third case, Acro is one of the most popular one-shot characters in any ''Ace Attorney'' game, with even the case's detractors often admitting he's its main saving grace.

to:

* EnsembleDarkhorse:
**
EnsembleDarkhorse: Surprisingly enough, considering his only appearance is in the ''heavily'' divisive third case, Acro is one of the most popular one-shot characters in any ''Ace Attorney'' game, with even the case's detractors often admitting he's its main saving grace.



** Franziska's whip will have you wanting to strangle her with it by the time those two cases are over.
** On the subject of Franziska, the sound of the tracking device she has on Gumshoe. Constant, high-pitched beeping. Gets people's attention mostly by being amazingly obnoxious.
* MostWonderfulSound: Despite what the above may indicate, Franziska's whip becomes this in case 4, [[spoiler:due to it signalling her perfectly timed BigDamnHeroes moment]].

to:

** Franziska's whip will have you wanting to strangle her with it by the time those two cases 2 and 3 are over.
** On the subject of Franziska, the The sound of the tracking device she Franziska has on Gumshoe. Constant, high-pitched beeping. Gets people's attention mostly by being amazingly obnoxious.
* MostWonderfulSound: Despite what the above may indicate, Franziska's whip becomes this in case 4, [[spoiler:due due to it [[spoiler:it signalling her perfectly timed BigDamnHeroes moment]].



** When [[spoiler: Maya is kidnapped, Phoenix and company panic over the idea that Maya is being starved. She's been missing just over a day, and she had an extremely large meal before being taken, she's clearly not in any immediate danger.]]

to:

** When [[spoiler: Maya [[spoiler:Maya is kidnapped, Phoenix and company panic over the idea that Maya is being starved. She's been missing just over a day, and she had an extremely large meal before being taken, she's clearly not in any immediate danger.]]danger]].
** In case 4, after TheReveal [[spoiler:of Matt Engarde's true colors, he reveals his previously-unseen ''massive'' facial scar, pulls out AGlassOfChianti, gains an ominous new {{Leitmotif}}, and his personality does a ''complete'' 180, turning him into an ObviouslyEvil figure that makes the silliest of Bond Villain parodies seem toned down. How jarring the change is from his previous Brainless Beauty Nice Guy persona can easily come across as absolutely ridiculous]]. For some, however, this is NarmCharm and/or NightmareFuel.



** Pretty much ''all'' of the last case is intense, starting right at the beginning when [[spoiler:Maya gets kidnapped to blackmail Nick]], and just getting worse when you find out [[spoiler:your client is [[CompleteMonster guilty as sin]]]], and you're forced to [[spoiler: pin the blame on an innocent person just to stall for time]].
* ReplacementScrappy: In this game, Franziska has very little character beyond being a cartoonish {{Jerkass}} with thinly-sketched motives, and the only time she gets any real character development isn't until ''after the end credits''. The next game and the two ''Investigations'' entries would flesh her out much more, although her portrayal here is still a big factor in this being seen as one of the weaker entries in the series.
* SophomoreSlump: Like many games under Capcom, the second installment tends to be the most divisive. ''Justice For All'' is certainly not considered a bad game, but a lot of fans regard it as the weakest game in the trilogy, for reasons including: having only four cases versus the other two games' five, the lack of an overall storyline -- barring the vague theme of Edgeworth's disappearance and Franziska wanting revenge on Phoenix -- along with the hugely divisive third case, and the developers going overboard with the new health system and frequently hitting you with gigantic penalties with no warning whatsoever. In particular, this game has more "instant game over" scenarios than every other game in the series ''combined''. Other, minor annoyances for some are Pearl getting all the focus over Maya, who barely features in the game and has no real character development, the substandard English localization, and Franziska being a much less interesting adversary than Edgeworth or Godot. However, the villains in this game are in very high regard among the fanbase, who generally consider [[spoiler:Acro, Morgan Fey, and Matt Engarde]] to be some of the best villains in the series. And the last case is ''extremely'' popular due to its twist on the traditional formula by [[spoiler:having Phoenix try to escape being blackmailed into defending a client he eventually figures out is a [[CompleteMonster total sociopath]]]].
** One of the weakest points is the lack of an overarching story. Rather than having a main villain such as [[spoiler:Dahlia Hawthorne or Manfred Von Karma,]] the story is mostly a series of mostly unrelated cases. The two main plotlines, [[spoiler: Edgeworth's apparent suicide and Morgan Fey]] are resolved rather anticlimacticly and dealt with in the sequel respectively.
* TakeThatScrappy: For the portion of fans who dislike Franziska for her seemingly constant and unpunished JerkAss moments, [[spoiler:Shelly de Killer shooting her in the shoulder, preventing her from prosecuting for the remainder of the game, and causing her to be replaced by the more levelheaded Edgeworth]] can come across as refreshing.
* ThatOneLevel:
** "Turnabout Big Top" is considered by some to be the worst case in the entire Phoenix trilogy. It has a weird cast of unhelpful and rude circus folk, cross-examinations that dole out hefty punishments, and very little connection to the Fey plotline and [[spoiler:Edgeworth's return]]:
*** Many consider Moe's cross-examination in 2-3 to be a real pain in the ass, since one wrong press will get '''you''' penalized, and culminates with his last testimony, in which any pressing will cause you to '''instantly lose'''. At least the Judge gives you some warning.
*** Furthermore, on the second trial of that case, you have to do a big leap of logic and figure out that [[spoiler:Russell Berry's cape got attached to the Max bust, seemingly ignoring physics]].

to:

** Pretty much ''all'' of the last case is intense, starting right at the beginning when [[spoiler:Maya gets kidnapped to blackmail Nick]], and just getting worse when you find out [[spoiler:your client is [[CompleteMonster guilty as sin]]]], sin]], and you're forced to [[spoiler: pin the blame on an innocent person just to stall for time]].
* ReplacementScrappy: In this game, Franziska has very little character beyond being a cartoonish {{Jerkass}} with thinly-sketched motives, and the only time she gets any real character development isn't until ''after the end credits''. The next game and the two ''Investigations'' entries would flesh her out much more, although her portrayal here is still a big factor in this being seen as one of the weaker weakest entries in the series.
* SophomoreSlump: Like many games under Capcom, the second installment tends to be the most divisive. ''Justice For All'' is certainly not considered a bad game, but a lot of fans regard it as the weakest game in the trilogy, for reasons including: having only four cases versus the other two games' five, the lack of an overall storyline -- barring the vague theme of Edgeworth's disappearance and Franziska wanting revenge on Phoenix -- along with the hugely divisive third case, and the developers going overboard with the new health system and frequently hitting you with gigantic penalties with no warning whatsoever. In particular, this game has more "instant game over" scenarios than every other game in the series ''combined''. Other, minor annoyances for some are Pearl getting all the focus over Maya, who barely features in the game and has no real character development, the substandard English localization, and Franziska being a much less interesting adversary than Edgeworth or Godot. However, the villains in this game are in very high regard among the fanbase, who generally consider [[spoiler:Acro, Morgan Fey, and Matt Engarde]] to be some of the best villains in the series. And the last case is ''extremely'' popular due to its twist on the traditional formula by [[spoiler:having Phoenix try to escape being blackmailed into defending a client he eventually figures out is a [[CompleteMonster total sociopath]]]].
** One of the weakest points is the lack of an overarching story. Rather than having a main villain such as [[spoiler:Dahlia Hawthorne or Manfred Von Karma,]] the story is mostly a series of mostly unrelated cases. The two main plotlines, [[spoiler: Edgeworth's apparent suicide and Morgan Fey]] are resolved rather anticlimacticly and dealt with in the sequel respectively.
* TakeThatScrappy: For the portion of fans who dislike Franziska for her seemingly constant and unpunished JerkAss moments, [[spoiler:Shelly de Killer shooting her in the shoulder, preventing her from prosecuting for the remainder of the game, and causing her to be replaced by the more levelheaded Edgeworth]] can come across as refreshing.
* ThatOneLevel:
** "Turnabout Big Top" is considered by some to be the worst case in the entire Phoenix trilogy. It has a weird cast of unhelpful and rude circus folk, cross-examinations that dole out hefty punishments, and very little connection to the Fey plotline and [[spoiler:Edgeworth's return]]:
*** Many consider Moe's cross-examination in 2-3 to be a real pain in the ass, since one wrong press will get '''you''' penalized, and culminates with his last testimony, in which any pressing will cause you to '''instantly lose'''. At least the Judge gives you some warning.
*** Furthermore, on the second trial of that case, you have to do a big leap of logic and figure out that [[spoiler:Russell Berry's cape got attached to the Max bust, seemingly ignoring physics]].
series.



* SophomoreSlump: Like many games under Capcom, the second installment tends to be the most divisive. ''Justice For All'' is certainly not considered a bad game, but a lot of fans regard it as the weakest game in the trilogy, for reasons including: having only four cases versus the other two games' five, the lack of an overall storyline --barring the vague theme of Edgeworth's disappearance and Franziska wanting revenge on Phoenix[[note]]and Morgan Fey's plot, which is only addressed in ''Trials and Tribulations''[[/note]]-- along with the hugely divisive third case, and the developers going overboard with the new health system and frequently hitting you with gigantic penalties with no warning whatsoever. In particular, this game has more "instant game over" scenarios than every other game in the series ''combined''. Other, minor annoyances for some are Pearl getting all the focus over Maya, who barely features in the game and has no real character development, the substandard English localization, and Franziska being a much less interesting adversary than Edgeworth or Godot. However, the villains in this game are in very high regard among the fanbase, who generally consider [[spoiler:Acro, Morgan Fey, and Matt Engarde]] to be some of the best villains in the series. And the last case is ''extremely'' popular due to its twist on the traditional formula by [[spoiler:having Phoenix try to escape being blackmailed into defending a client he eventually figures out is a [[CompleteMonster total sociopath]]]].



** Also, "Director Hotti" implies that he'd like to [[GettingCrapPastTheRadar "research"]] the crime scene photos if you show them to him in 2-2. Even worse when you remember that it's [[spoiler:Ini/Mimi]] in the pictures, and he'd been going on about how she was a favorite patient...
** Dr. Hotti also shows interest in Pearl's picture. She's eight years old!

to:

** Also, "Director Hotti" implies that he'd like to [[GettingCrapPastTheRadar "research"]] the crime scene photos if you show them to him in 2-2. Even worse when you remember that it's [[spoiler:Ini/Mimi]] in the pictures, and he'd been going on about how she was a favorite patient...
** Dr. Hotti also
patient... And to top it all off, he shows interest in Pearl's picture. She's eight years old! old!
* TakeThatScrappy: For the portion of fans who dislike Franziska for her seemingly constant and unpunished JerkAss moments, [[spoiler:Shelly de Killer shooting her in the shoulder, preventing her from prosecuting for the remainder of the game, and causing her to be replaced by the more levelheaded Edgeworth]] can come across as refreshing.
* ThatOneLevel: "Turnabout Big Top" is considered by some to be the worst case in the entire Phoenix trilogy. It has a weird cast of unhelpful and rude circus folk, cross-examinations that dole out hefty punishments, and very little connection to the Fey plotline and [[spoiler:Edgeworth's return]]. Many consider Moe's cross-examination in 2-3 to be a real pain in the ass, since one wrong press will get '''you''' penalized, and culminates with his last testimony, in which any pressing will cause you to '''instantly lose'''. At least the Judge gives you some warning. Furthermore, on the second trial of that case, you have to do a big leap of logic and figure out that [[spoiler:Russell Berry's cape got attached to the Max bust, seemingly ignoring physics]].
* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic:
** While he's very popular with others, some fans didn't like [[spoiler:how much Acro was]] being played as a SympatheticMurderer. For example, ''WebOriginal/VideoGamesAwesome'' and their commenters noted that while he didn't mean to kill [[spoiler: the ringmaster, he ''did'' intend to kill the ringmaster's daughter. The sympathy is supposed to come from regretting he killed the ringmaster, who he saw as a father, and yet he was still willing to murder that man's only child. To be fair, she was still directly responsible for accidentally putting Bat into a coma and then not understanding how serious it was, but Acro apparently never considered just ''yelling at her'' and making her see reality the way Moe later did, and instead jumped right to an elaborate murder attempt... which didn't even work because she was too clueless to understand she was being threatened.]] It's quite telling that the 3DS re-release [[RetCon changed some of the dialogue]] to tone down the forced sympathy, one of the most obvious changes being [[spoiler:Edgeworth's line "Do me a favor and try not to be too harsh on Acro" being changed to "As for Mr. Acro's case, you need not worry."]]
** [[spoiler:Edgeworth]] got this from a few fans when he [[spoiler:explicitly told Adrian in open court that he didn't care if she was DrivenToSuicide because of the truth. Sure, she was ultimately grateful for the wake-up call, but this was still a girl with a confirmed history of attempted suicide -- not just idle threats -- meaning that not only was there a legitimate risk of her killing herself afterward, but he could've been subsequently charged with harassment and/or misconduct for it as well. And even before his HeelFaceTurn, Edgeworth was already visibly traumatized by another courtroom-related suicide in the form of the Terry Fawles case. So to said fans, it went a bit too far past GoodIsNotNice and just landed somewhere close to IdiotBall and/or JerkassBall territory.]] Even the game feels like that was too far:
--->'''Phoenix:''' ([[spoiler:Edgeworth]]... How can you be so cold...!?)



* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: While he's very popular with others, some fans didn't like how much [[spoiler: Acro was]] being played as a SympatheticMurderer. For example, ''WebOriginal/VideoGamesAwesome'' and their commenters noted that while he didn't mean to kill [[spoiler: the ringmaster, he ''did'' intend to kill the ringmaster's daughter. The sympathy is supposed to come from regretting he killed the ringmaster, who he saw as a father, and yet he was still willing to murder that man's only child. To be fair, she was still directly responsible for accidentally putting Bat into a coma and then not understanding how serious it was, but Acro apparently never considered just ''yelling at her'' and making her see reality the way Moe later did, and instead jumped right to an elaborate murder attempt... which didn't even work because she was too clueless to understand she was being threatened.]] It's quite telling that the 3DS re-release [[RetCon changed some of the dialogue]] to tone down the forced sympathy, one of the most obvious changes being [[spoiler:Edgeworth's line "Do me a favor and try not to be too harsh on Acro" being changed to "As for Mr. Acro's case, you need not worry."]]
** [[spoiler:Edgeworth]] also got this from a few fans when he [[spoiler:explicitly told Adrian in open court that he didn't care if she was DrivenToSuicide because of the truth. Sure, she was ultimately grateful for the wake-up call, but this was still a girl with a confirmed history of attempted suicide -- not just idle threats -- meaning that not only was there a legitimate risk of her killing herself afterward, but he could've been subsequently charged with harassment and/or misconduct for it as well. And even before his HeelFaceTurn, Edgeworth was already visibly traumatized by another courtroom-related suicide in the form of the Terry Fawles case. So to said fans, it went a bit too far past GoodIsNotNice and just landed somewhere close to IdiotBall and/or JerkassBall territory.]] Even the game feels like that was too far:
-->'''Phoenix''': ([[spoiler:Edgeworth]]... How can you be so cold...!?)

!! ''VisualNovel/PhoenixWrightAceAttorneyTrialsAndTribulations''

to:

* UnintentionallyUnsympathetic: While he's very popular with others, some fans didn't like how much [[spoiler: Acro was]] being played as a SympatheticMurderer. For example, ''WebOriginal/VideoGamesAwesome''
!! ''Phoenix Wright: Ace Attorney: Trials
and their commenters noted that while he didn't mean to kill [[spoiler: the ringmaster, he ''did'' intend to kill the ringmaster's daughter. The sympathy is supposed to come from regretting he killed the ringmaster, who he saw as a father, and yet he was still willing to murder that man's only child. To be fair, she was still directly responsible for accidentally putting Bat into a coma and then not understanding how serious it was, but Acro apparently never considered just ''yelling at her'' and making her see reality the way Moe later did, and instead jumped right to an elaborate murder attempt... which didn't even work because she was too clueless to understand she was being threatened.]] It's quite telling that the 3DS re-release [[RetCon changed some of the dialogue]] to tone down the forced sympathy, one of the most obvious changes being [[spoiler:Edgeworth's line "Do me a favor and try not to be too harsh on Acro" being changed to "As for Mr. Acro's case, you need not worry."]]
** [[spoiler:Edgeworth]] also got this from a few fans when he [[spoiler:explicitly told Adrian in open court that he didn't care if she was DrivenToSuicide because of the truth. Sure, she was ultimately grateful for the wake-up call, but this was still a girl with a confirmed history of attempted suicide -- not just idle threats -- meaning that not only was there a legitimate risk of her killing herself afterward, but he could've been subsequently charged with harassment and/or misconduct for it as well. And even before his HeelFaceTurn, Edgeworth was already visibly traumatized by another courtroom-related suicide in the form of the Terry Fawles case. So to said fans, it went a bit too far past GoodIsNotNice and just landed somewhere close to IdiotBall and/or JerkassBall territory.]] Even the game feels like that was too far:
-->'''Phoenix''': ([[spoiler:Edgeworth]]... How can you be so cold...!?)

!! ''VisualNovel/PhoenixWrightAceAttorneyTrialsAndTribulations''
Tribulations''
9th Nov '16 1:29:51 PM NNinja
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Added DiffLines:

* AccidentalAesop: Don't judge people by who their relatives are. There can be black sheep and white sheep in every family.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=YMMV.PhoenixWrightAceAttorney