History WMG / AllStarSuperman

1st Apr '16 6:50:27 AM DannWoolf
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* In Issue 12, Superman's last words to Luthor are "You could have saved the world YEARS ago if your tried, Lex". Leo's dialogue later includes the line, "A world without Superman...THERE'S a challenge to human ingenuity". Superman has challenged him to be better, having seen how good he COULD be through Superman's eyes. That's also why Superman gave him the super-powers formula; knowing that Leo is Lex, he knew not only that Leo had already known what it was like to take the formula, but had also not attempted to make some more of it since returning to the present.

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* In Issue 12, Superman's last words to Luthor are "You could have saved the world YEARS ago if your you tried, Lex". Leo's dialogue later includes the line, "A world without Superman... THERE'S a challenge to human ingenuity". Superman has challenged him to be better, having seen how good he COULD be through Superman's eyes. That's also why Superman gave him the super-powers formula; knowing that Leo is Lex, he knew not only that Leo had already known what it was like to take the formula, but had also not attempted to make some more of it since returning to the present.
5th May '15 9:13:10 AM arrgh
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** Another subtle, textual clue is the names themselves: Lex vs Leo. The obvious hint is they only differ by one letter, but the subtle, important hint are the letters in question: x vs o. Traditionally, x is short for 'wrong' and o is short for 'right'. It's not hard to see a repentent Luthor changing his name in this way, with this simple symbolism.
15th Feb '15 5:55:24 AM StFan
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[[WMG: [[AllStarSuperman All-Star Superman]] and [[AllStarBatmanAndRobin All-Star Batman and Robin]] are set in the same universe.]]

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[[WMG: [[AllStarSuperman All-Star Superman]] [[WMG:''ComicBook/AllStarSuperman'' and [[AllStarBatmanAndRobin ''[[ComicBook/AllStarBatmanAndRobinTheBoyWonder All-Star Batman and Robin]] & Robin]]'' are set in the same universe.]]
22nd Nov '14 4:55:22 PM JBC1187
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Specifically, ''ASS'' follows ''ASBAR''. Superman is actually fairly new to the superhero scene. Because he doesn't to cause unnecessary problems, Superman defers to the aggressive and confident Batman. But as we all know, this Batman is kind of crazy. When Batman's series ends, Superman decides that Batman's ways are dangerous, unnecessarily violent, and just plain nuts. Superman also realizes that if he's going to make a difference, he needs to have more confidence about his {{LawfulGood}} philosophy, and in Jonathan and Martha Kent's teachings. With this brave, bold new outlook, Superman leaves Batman behind to lead by example, inspiring geniuses like Quintum, making friends like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane, and changing the entire world for the better. Which, of course ultimately leads to the events of ''All-Star Superman.''

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Specifically, ''ASS'' follows ''ASBAR''. Superman is actually fairly new to the superhero scene. Because he doesn't to cause unnecessary problems, he's inexperienced, Superman defers to the aggressive and confident Batman. But as we all know, this Batman is kind of crazy. When Batman's series ends, Superman decides that Batman's ways are dangerous, unnecessarily violent, and just plain nuts. Superman also realizes that if he's going to make a difference, he needs to have more confidence about his {{LawfulGood}} philosophy, and in Jonathan and Martha Kent's teachings. With this brave, bold new outlook, Superman leaves Batman behind to lead by example, inspiring geniuses like Quintum, making friends like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane, and changing the entire world for the better. Which, of course ultimately leads to the events of ''All-Star Superman.''
12th Nov '14 11:53:50 PM Tuomas
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* As for the movie, there's no reason that it isn't just an alternate continuity. [=McDuffie=] might not have known Leo Quintum was implied to be Luthor, and so he changed the ending from Kal-El giving the Superman 2 formula to Quintum to Luthor doing it. It could just because in that version Luthor is NOT Leo Quintum. Who knows?
** Considering that [=McDuffie=] and Morrison are both long-time DC writers, and that Morrison is one of the biggest names working for DC at the moment, and that the movie was ''very'' faithful to the comic, it would seem rather unlikely that [=McDuffie=] wouldn't have consulted Morrison while writing the script, or at least sent the script to him for his approval. So yeah, it might be an alternative continuity, but if Morrison meant Quintum to be Luthor, I'm sure [=McDuffie=] would have known about it. In my opinion the movie actually gives Luthor a better ending than the comic, because now we get to ''see'' his HeelFaceTurn instead of theorizing there ''might've'' been one, based on a few esoteric clues. Being oblique is not necessarily the best way to tell this story.

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* ** As for the movie, there's no reason that it isn't just an alternate continuity. [=McDuffie=] might not have known Leo Quintum was implied to be Luthor, and so he changed the ending from Kal-El giving the Superman 2 formula to Quintum to Luthor doing it. It could just because in that version Luthor is NOT Leo Quintum. Who knows?
** *** Considering that [=McDuffie=] and Morrison are both long-time DC writers, and that Morrison is one of the biggest names working for DC at the moment, and that the movie was ''very'' faithful to the comic, it would seem rather unlikely that [=McDuffie=] wouldn't have consulted Morrison while writing the script, or at least sent the script to him for his approval. So yeah, it might be an alternative continuity, but if Morrison meant Quintum to be Luthor, I'm sure [=McDuffie=] would have known about it. In my opinion the movie actually gives Luthor a better ending than the comic, because now we get to ''see'' his HeelFaceTurn instead of theorizing there ''might've'' been one, based on a few esoteric clues. Being oblique is not necessarily the best way to tell this story.
12th Nov '14 8:41:37 PM JBC1187
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* Perhaps it's not Luthor, but Luthor's subconscious that created this plan? On one hand, Luthor's a genius; on the other, he's a raging egomaniac. He ''could'' figure out that Clark is Superman, but he's too arrogant to actually consider the possibility- he's also too arrogant to admit that he was ''actually fooled'' by the disguise. But because Lex is so smart, his brain still devises plots based on this information, even as it shields him from the truth.
12th Nov '14 8:08:44 PM JBC1187
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Added DiffLines:


[[WMG: [[AllStarSuperman All-Star Superman]] and [[AllStarBatmanAndRobin All-Star Batman and Robin]] are set in the same universe.]]
Specifically, ''ASS'' follows ''ASBAR''. Superman is actually fairly new to the superhero scene. Because he doesn't to cause unnecessary problems, Superman defers to the aggressive and confident Batman. But as we all know, this Batman is kind of crazy. When Batman's series ends, Superman decides that Batman's ways are dangerous, unnecessarily violent, and just plain nuts. Superman also realizes that if he's going to make a difference, he needs to have more confidence about his {{LawfulGood}} philosophy, and in Jonathan and Martha Kent's teachings. With this brave, bold new outlook, Superman leaves Batman behind to lead by example, inspiring geniuses like Quintum, making friends like Jimmy Olsen and Lois Lane, and changing the entire world for the better. Which, of course ultimately leads to the events of ''All-Star Superman.''

And that's why Batman never shows up in ''All-Star Superman''.
29th Jan '14 10:50:43 AM m8e
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* If that would be the case, it would contradict ''WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'', the canonical last story of the Superman of that continuity. For example, the way Lois Lane finds out about Superman's secret identity is different in the two stories.
** Except that ''WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'' was not canonical, it was an imaginary story and stated as such. The last "canon" Pre-Crisis story was DC Comics Presents #97.

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* If that would be the case, it would contradict ''WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'', ''ComicBook/WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'', the canonical last story of the Superman of that continuity. For example, the way Lois Lane finds out about Superman's secret identity is different in the two stories.
** Except that ''WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'' ''ComicBook/WhateverHappenedToTheManOfTomorrow'' was not canonical, it was an imaginary story and stated as such. The last "canon" Pre-Crisis story was DC Comics Presents #97.
10th Nov '13 10:09:17 PM Hero_Gal_2347
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Added DiffLines:

[[WMG: Doomsday didn't overwhelm Jimmy's nervous system partly because they're psychologically incompatible.]]
Doomsday was all survival instinct; his only emotions were fear and rage. That flies in the face of Jimmy's character -- he's affectionate, loyal, and trusting -- and specifically his attitude towards Superman. With Jimmy being cued by the signal watch (a symbol of their relationship) and motivated by a desire to save his friend, Doomsday couldn't get a foothold.
16th Sep '13 1:47:03 AM Tuomas
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** Nevertheless, there are many things in All-Star Superman that don't support it taking place in the continuity suggested above. For example, the staff of the Daily Planet includes Cat Grant, a post-Crisis character. Leo Quintum is a world-renowned scientist and a friend to Superman, yet he is never mentioned before this story, which would be rather odd if this story was in regular continuity. The version of Parasite in All-Star Superman doesn't look like the pre-Crisis Parasite, he has the more monstrous look of his post-Crisis counterpart. The pre-Crisis Bizarro was a clone created by Luthor, and Bizarros eventually settle on the planet "Htrae", but here Bizarros originate in the "Underverse". And so on...

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** Nevertheless, there are many things in All-Star Superman that don't support it taking place in the continuity suggested above. For example, the staff of the Daily Planet includes Cat Grant, a post-Crisis character. Leo Quintum is a world-renowned scientist and a friend to Superman, yet he is never mentioned before this story, which would be rather odd if this story was in regular continuity. The version of Parasite in All-Star Superman doesn't look like the pre-Crisis Parasite, he has the more monstrous look of his post-Crisis counterpart. The pre-Crisis Bizarro was a clone created by Luthor, and Bizarros eventually settle settled on the planet "Htrae", but here Bizarros originate in the "Underverse". And so on...
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=WMG.AllStarSuperman