History VideoGame / SuikodenV

16th Jul '16 4:00:20 PM DivineDeath
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* DeliberateValuesDissonance:
** Lymsleia is only ten years old, but because she's the queen's only daughter, the right of succession naturally falls to her once Arshtat dies.
** Because Falena can only be ruled by a queen, princes are considered functionally useless and aren't held in particularly high regard.
** The queen's husband is decided by whoever wins the Sacred Games. And it's considered perfectly acceptable for adult men to fight for the hand of a future queen who's still a child.
** The Dragon Cavalry is very patriarchal, especially compared to the rest of Falena (or even the Suikoden world in general). Not only are women not allowed to be Dragon Riders, they're not even permitted to set foot into their training camp in Gordius.



----

to:

----
29th Dec '15 10:02:58 PM ChaoticNovelist
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** There's also [[spoiler:Yuma Valya, a SpoiledBrat version who fled to Falena because she saw New Armes as "uncultured". She goes by the assumed name Josephine...]]
*** [[spoiler: It wasn't exactly New Armes being "uncultured" that did it. She was tired of living in her brother Shula's shadow.]]

to:

** There's also [[spoiler:Yuma Valya, a SpoiledBrat version who fled to Falena because she saw New Armes as "uncultured". She goes by the assumed name Josephine...]]
*** [[spoiler: It wasn't exactly New Armes being
"uncultured" that did it. She and she was tired of living in her brother Shula's shadow.shadow She goes by the assumed name Josephine...]]



* RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething: The prince of the land is your main character, so yeah. This is of particular note as, being a male royal in a country where only females inherit the throne, nobody actually expected him to do anything at all.
** Actually played for contrast with him and his father Ferid. The previous commanders, usually noble-born who simply hired someone to earn their position for them, were very rarely if ever trained as field commanders, much less fighters, usually delegating the job to someone else. Ferid, and later the prince, gain a lot of popularity precisely for being RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething.

to:

* RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething: The prince of the land Prince is your main character, so yeah. This is of particular note as, being a male royal in a country where only females inherit the throne, so nobody actually expected him to do anything at all.
** Actually
all. Then he goes and becomes the leader of the rebel army. This is played for contrast with him and his father Ferid. The previous commanders, usually noble-born who simply hired someone to earn their position for them, were very rarely if ever trained as field commanders, much less fighters, usually delegating the job to someone else. Ferid, and later the prince, gain a lot of popularity precisely for being RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething.



* ShipTease: Early in the game, there's a lot of {{Subtext}} between [[BrotherSisterIncest the prince and Lymsleia]], including [[SleepCute sleeping in the same bed at one point]].

to:

* ShipTease: ShipTease:
**
Early in the game, there's a lot of {{Subtext}} between [[BrotherSisterIncest the prince and Lymsleia]], including [[SleepCute sleeping in the same bed at one point]].



** There's also Roog and Miakis, though that may be one-sided.
* ShootTheDog: [[spoiler: Georg to Arshtat. There's a good reason for it.]]

to:

** There's also Roog and Miakis, though that may be one-sided.
AmazonChaser style.
* ShootTheDog: [[spoiler: Georg killed Arshtat because she had finally gone over the edge and was about to Arshtat. There's a good reason for it.nuke the entire country.]]



* SiblingYinYang: The prince and Princess Lymsleia; Euram and Luserina Barows; Faylon and Faylen.
* [[SmallGirlBigGun Small Girl Big Weapon]]: Faylen and her boomerang; Lu and her ''quadruple crossbow''...

to:

* %%* SiblingYinYang: The prince and Princess Lymsleia; Euram and Luserina Barows; Faylon and Faylen.
* [[SmallGirlBigGun Small Girl Big Weapon]]: SmallGirlBigGun: Faylen and her boomerang; Lu and her ''quadruple crossbow''...



* StealthHiBye: Dolph does this all the time.

to:

* StealthHiBye: Dolph does this Dolph, being a ninja, appears from nowhere all the time.



* {{UST}}: Between Lelei and Lucretia, and Lyon and the Prince.
** [[SchoolgirlLesbians Lelei and Lucretia]] [[HideYourLesbians may be resolved, however.]] [[AmbiguouslyGay Oboro's comments are suggestive but not conclusive. As in,]] [[MagicalGirlLyricalNanoha Nanoha-level conclusive.]]
** One could argue that the same is true for Lyon and the Prince. While nothing is directly mentioned about it, there's a lot of subtle subtext pointing towards that they indeed have more developed relationship that what is known. See for example certain dialogue-less scenes in Lunas.

to:

* {{UST}}: Between {{UST}}:
**
Lelei and Lucretia, and Lyon and the Prince.
** [[SchoolgirlLesbians Lelei and Lucretia]] [[HideYourLesbians
Lucretia may be resolved, however.]] [[AmbiguouslyGay resolved. Oboro's comments are suggestive but not conclusive. As in,]] in, [[MagicalGirlLyricalNanoha Nanoha-level conclusive.]]
** One could argue that the same is true for Lyon and the Prince. While nothing is directly mentioned about it, there's a lot of subtle subtext pointing towards that they indeed have a more developed relationship that then what is known. See for example certain dialogue-less scenes in Lunas.



* WellIntentionedExtremist: The Godwins seek to empower Falena as a nation so that the losses suffered in the bloody civil war several years ago is not repeated. Unfortunately, they try to do this by overthrowing the royal family, reviving a defunct assassin's guild, and [[spoiler:attempting to purge the nation of all nonhumans.]]
** A fairly common [[EpilepticTrees fan theory]] is that they expected to lose, and that the newly empowered Falena at the end was their plan all along. This becomes a GambitRoulette if looked at too closely, but that doesn't mean they didn't invent it as a [[XanatosSpeedChess Plan B]] when it was clear they were losing...

to:

* WellIntentionedExtremist: WellIntentionedExtremist:
**
The Godwins seek to empower Falena as a nation so that the losses suffered in the bloody civil war several years ago is not repeated. Unfortunately, they try to do this by overthrowing the royal family, reviving a defunct assassin's guild, and [[spoiler:attempting to purge the nation of all nonhumans.]]
** A fairly common [[EpilepticTrees fan theory]] is that they expected to lose, and that the newly empowered Falena at the end was their plan all along. This becomes a GambitRoulette if looked at too closely, but that doesn't mean they didn't invent it as a [[XanatosSpeedChess Plan B]] when it was clear they were losing...
]]



* WholesomeCrossdresser: [[spoiler: Rahal fills out his sister's clothes pretty well...it's also unclear why he has a spare of them with him...]]
** The game makes it pretty clear. [[spoiler: Rahal knows that he's exceptionally beautiful, so he'll make use of that fact in any way possible. And apparently, he and his sister have been trolling their friends like this for years.]]
* WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity: The Sun Rune is one of the strongest of the 27 True Runes, and can cause moments of extreme megalomania in its bearer, as they believe themselves to be a God. Even the kind and loving Arshtat fell victim to this, destroying Lordlake [[spoiler:and almost doing the same to the entire country of Falena]] because of the rune's influence.
** This is in fact what happened to empire that existed where Falena does long before the game takes place. The ruler who wielded the Sun Rune went mad and annihilated his entire nation overnight. Supposedly having possession of the Dawn and Twilight runes as well prevents this from happening to the wielder of the Sun Rune.

to:

* WholesomeCrossdresser: [[spoiler: Rahal fills out his sister's clothes pretty well...it's also unclear why he has a spare well. He knows that he's exceptionally beautiful, so he'll make use of them with him...that fact in any way possible. He and his sister have been trolling their friends like this for years.]]
** The game makes it pretty clear. [[spoiler: Rahal knows that he's exceptionally beautiful, so he'll make use of that fact in any way possible. And apparently, he and his sister have been trolling their friends like this for years.]]
* WithGreatPowerComesGreatInsanity: The Sun Rune is one of the strongest of the 27 True Runes, and can cause moments of extreme megalomania in its bearer, as they believe themselves to be a God. god. Even the kind and loving Arshtat fell victim to this, destroying Lordlake [[spoiler:and almost doing the same to the entire country of Falena]] because of the rune's influence.
**
influence. This is in fact what happened to empire that existed where Falena does long before the game takes place. The ruler who wielded the Sun Rune went mad and annihilated his entire nation overnight. Supposedly having possession of the Dawn and Twilight runes as well prevents this from happening to the wielder of the Sun Rune.



* XanatosGambit: Lucretia wields one of these masterfully to beat the combined Armes/Godwin army, first feigning defeat to get the enemy armies to occupy the rebel headquarters, flooding the entire thing, then launching a full out assault on the weakened enemy forces. Truly worthy of being an {{Expy}} of [[RomanceOfTheThreeKingdoms Zhuge Liang]].
** She really did think of everything. Leaving the castle itself is a good move because they would be surrounded otherwise, and it denies the enemy desperately needed food. Even if the Armes/Godwin army ''didn't'' fall for the trap, they'd still be chasing a fully stocked army with empty bellies and grumbling mouths.

to:

* XanatosGambit: Lucretia wields one of these masterfully to beat the combined Armes/Godwin army, first feigning defeat to get the enemy armies to occupy the rebel headquarters, flooding the entire thing, then launching a full out assault on the weakened enemy forces. Truly worthy of being an {{Expy}} of [[RomanceOfTheThreeKingdoms Zhuge Liang]].
**
Liang]]. She really did think of everything. Leaving the castle itself is a good move because they would be surrounded otherwise, and it denies the enemy desperately needed food. Even if the Armes/Godwin army ''didn't'' fall for the trap, they'd still be chasing a fully stocked army with empty bellies and grumbling mouths.



* YouCantThwartStageOne: Very, very obvious, and very, ''very'' painful.
** Especially since the quality of the writing repeatedly forces blatant false hope on the player that serves only to underscore this trope.
* YouFightLikeACow: One-on-one duels are carried out by executing three possible commands that cancel each other by TacticalRockPaperScissors mechanics. How to tell what the enemy is going to do? By their pre-action taunts, of course. While this is a staple of the series, Suikoden V takes it further by adding a time limit to the input so you are in a bit more of a hurry. The catch? Certain characters with apparent MediumAwareness start taking advantage of this rush by making ''feint taunts'' that seem like they'll be one action and change to another by the end of their speech.

to:

* YouCantThwartStageOne: Very, very obvious, and very, ''very'' painful.
** Especially since the quality of the writing repeatedly forces blatant false hope on the player that serves only to underscore this trope.
%%* YouCantThwartStageOne:
* YouFightLikeACow: One-on-one duels are carried out by executing three possible commands that cancel each other by TacticalRockPaperScissors mechanics. How to tell what the enemy is going to do? By their pre-action taunts, of course. While this is a staple of the series, Suikoden V takes it further by adding a time limit to the input so you are in a bit more of a hurry. The catch? Certain characters with apparent MediumAwareness start taking advantage of this rush by making ''feint taunts'' that seem like they'll be one action and change to another by the end of their speech.



* YourPrincessIsInAnotherCastle: After you liberate Sol-Falena. [[spoiler: The country is saved, but the BigBad escaped with the Sun Rune and threatens to flood the place.]]
** [[spoiler: [[{{Irony}} The princess herself, however, is present and accounted for.]]]]

to:

* YourPrincessIsInAnotherCastle: After you liberate Sol-Falena. [[spoiler: The country is saved, but the BigBad escaped with the Sun Rune and threatens to flood the place.]]
** [[spoiler:
[[{{Irony}} The princess herself, however, is present and accounted for.]]]]
29th Dec '15 9:41:20 PM ChaoticNovelist
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* IncestSubtext: Miakis tells Lym that if the Prince wins, she'll have to marry him. Of course, Miakis just has a really wild sense of humor.
** To the point that Lym attacks the Prince for winning his ''ceremonial'' match, out of fear that they'll have to marry. It doesn't help that Lym is ''ten years old''.
** Also, in the best ending, the prince [[spoiler: becomes Commander of the Queen's Knights, a position normally reserved for the Queen's husband. Given the ShipTease between the two earlier...]]
*** To be fair, there probably wasn't a better candidate. He was leader of the rebel army. Plus, with Lym being only ten, she is a little too young to be married anyway.
*** Bingo. It also sends a clear message that the system, which caused the problem in the first place, is changing.

to:

* IncestSubtext: Miakis tells Lym that if the Prince wins, she'll have to marry him. Of course, Miakis just has a really wild sense of humor.
** To the point that
humor. Then Lym attacks the Prince for winning his ''ceremonial'' match, out of fear that they'll have to marry. It doesn't help that Lym is ''ten years old''.
** Also,
Third, in the best ending, the prince [[spoiler: becomes Commander of the Queen's Knights, a position normally reserved for the Queen's husband. Given [[note]] All the ShipTease between the two earlier...]]
*** To be fair, there probably wasn't a better candidate. He was leader of
remaining knights were already working for him anyway, and as the rebel army. Plus, with Lym being only ten, she is a little too young to be married anyway.
*** Bingo. It also sends a clear message that
army's general, there was no better candidate at the system, which caused the problem in the first place, is changing.time. [[/note]]
17th Sep '15 4:23:17 PM DivineDeath
Is there an issue? Send a Message

Added DiffLines:

* LateArrivalSpoiler: The revelation that [[spoiler:Georg killed Arshtat]] is treated as a WhamEpisode very late in the game...but anyone who's played ''VideoGame/SuikodenII'' and made use of [[HardboiledDetective Richmond]]'s services in it will have already figured that out.
3rd Sep '15 8:27:12 AM SSJMagus
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** To put their naval capabilities in perspective, the battle system has a rock-paper-scissors type of unit balancing, so one type of boat is stronger than one other type but weaker to the other. Beaver units are [[GameBreaker strong against all types]]. In fact, just keep a healing unit handy and you can pretty much solo any water-terrain encounters with them.

to:

** To put their naval capabilities in perspective, the battle system has a rock-paper-scissors [[TacticalRockPaperScissors rock-paper-scissors]] type of unit balancing, so one type of boat is stronger than one other type but weaker to the other. Beaver units are [[GameBreaker strong against all types]]. In fact, just keep a healing unit handy and you can pretty much solo any water-terrain encounters with them. As the official guide book puts it, they turn the TacticalRockPaperScissors into "Beaver smashes rock, beaver shreds paper, beaver breaks scissors."
29th Apr '15 3:38:27 AM Vandegraff1
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* YourPrincessIsInAnotherCastle: After you liberate Sol-Falena. [[spoiler: the country is saved but the BigBad escaped with the Sun Rune and threatens to flood the place.]]

to:

* YourPrincessIsInAnotherCastle: After you liberate Sol-Falena. [[spoiler: the The country is saved saved, but the BigBad escaped with the Sun Rune and threatens to flood the place.]]
29th Apr '15 3:33:25 AM Vandegraff1
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* BoxedCrook: Several. One example is Roy, who is a dead ringer for Prince Freyjadour. He was hired by the oafish fop [[spoiler: Euram Barrows]] to sully the Prince's name. Should the player choose to spare Roy's life, he will be recruited as a star of destiny. Later in the game, he serves as a body double wearing his "Prince" disguise.

to:

* BoxedCrook: Several. One example is Roy, who is a dead ringer for Prince Freyjadour. He was hired by the oafish fop [[spoiler: Euram Barrows]] Barows]] to sully the Prince's name. Should the player choose to spare Roy's life, he will be recruited as a star of destiny. Later in the game, he serves as a body double wearing his "Prince" disguise.



* GambitPileup: Phew. Trying to explain this is already staggering. Though the ultimate winner is [[spoiler: Sialeeds who bears EVERYTHING and kills the Barrows (not Euram of course).]] Need proof? Talk to Kyle [[spoiler: in the graveyard at your castle, not Sun Palace, after you win the Sun Palace war]]. Also [[spoiler: Gizel does tell you when you kill him in a [[DuelBoss duel]] that Sialeeds won.]]

to:

* GambitPileup: Phew. Trying to explain this is already staggering. Though the ultimate winner is [[spoiler: Sialeeds who bears EVERYTHING and kills the Barrows (not Euram of course).Salum Barows.]] Need proof? Talk to Kyle [[spoiler: in the graveyard at your castle, not Sun Palace, after you win the Sun Palace war]]. Also [[spoiler: Gizel does tell you when you kill him in a [[DuelBoss duel]] that Sialeeds won.]]



* HopeSpot: The entirety of the Sacred Games is full of these. [[spoiler:Hey, the Godwins rescue you from certain death by shipwreck! They might not be plotting against the Queen after all! Well, actually, yes they are, as shown by a cutscene. But wait, they still have to win the Sacred Games to put their plan into action, and the Barrows family gladiator is a much better fighter than theirs! Nope, the Godwins frame said gladiator as being an Armes spy and get him disqualified. But wait, a Dark Horse foreigner comes out of nowhere and gets to the semifinals! He's also a better fighter than the Godwin's, to boot. Too bad the Godwins enact a plot to drug him so their gladiator wins the tournament, even after you thwart their first attempt to get him out of the way.]]

to:

* HopeSpot: The entirety of the Sacred Games is full of these. [[spoiler:Hey, the Godwins rescue you from certain death by shipwreck! They might not be plotting against the Queen after all! Well, actually, yes they are, as shown by a cutscene. But wait, they still have to win the Sacred Games to put their plan into action, and the Barrows Barows family gladiator is a much better fighter than theirs! Nope, the Godwins frame said gladiator as being an Armes spy and get him disqualified. But wait, a Dark Horse foreigner comes out of nowhere and gets to the semifinals! He's also a better fighter than the Godwin's, to boot. Too bad the Godwins enact a plot to drug him so their gladiator wins the tournament, even after you thwart their first attempt to get him out of the way.]]



* IneffectualSympatheticVillain: Euram Barrows, until [[spoiler: his optional HeelFaceTurn.]]

to:

* IneffectualSympatheticVillain: Euram Barrows, Barows, until [[spoiler: his optional HeelFaceTurn.]]



* NotSoHarmlessVillain: [[spoiler:The jovial and seemingly scatterbrained Salum Barrows is revealed to be the mastermind behind the theft of the Dawn Rune, and by extension, the Lordlake incident.]]

to:

* NotSoHarmlessVillain: [[spoiler:The jovial and seemingly scatterbrained Salum Barrows Barows is revealed to be the mastermind behind the theft of the Dawn Rune, and by extension, the Lordlake incident.]]



* ObfuscatingStupidity: [[spoiler: Lord Barrows]] and Skald Egan.

to:

* ObfuscatingStupidity: [[spoiler: Lord Barrows]] Barows]] and Skald Egan.



** The manga teases the prince with Luserina Barrows.

to:

** The manga teases the prince with Luserina Barrows.Barows.



* SiblingYinYang: The prince and Princess Lymsleia; Euram and Luserina Barrows; Faylon and Faylen.

to:

* SiblingYinYang: The prince and Princess Lymsleia; Euram and Luserina Barrows; Barows; Faylon and Faylen.



* SmugSnake: Salum Barrows.
* SilkHidingSteel: Luserina Barows. She's sweet and graceful and apparently stays home while her dad and brother politic in the capital. However, if you talk around Rainwall, you'll find out that ''she'' is the one running the place. She also takes part in the coming battles as 'morale', in other words, encrouaging them to victory.

to:

* SmugSnake: Salum Barrows.
Barows.
* SilkHidingSteel: Luserina Barows. She's sweet and graceful and apparently stays home while her dad and brother politic in the capital. However, if you talk around Rainwall, you'll find out that ''she'' is the one running the place. She also takes part in the coming battles as 'morale', in other words, encrouaging encouraging them to victory.
29th Apr '15 3:30:14 AM Vandegraff1
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** The Sun Rune also qualifies, the ability to utterly decimates one's foes comes at the cost of one's sanity erroding away.

to:

** The Sun Rune also qualifies, the ability to utterly decimates one's foes comes at the cost of one's sanity erroding eroding away.
29th Apr '15 3:29:10 AM Vandegraff1
Is there an issue? Send a Message


** The Prince himself falls under this as well. As noted above, not many really expected the Prince to be a major player in the game's storyline; or that he was a formidable warrior and capable leader. Most of it is due to princes being generally seen as royal deadweights in the Falenan tradition.

to:

** The Prince himself falls under this as well. As noted above, not many really expected the Prince to be a major player in the game's storyline; or that he was a formidable warrior and capable leader. Most of it is due to princes being generally seen as royal deadweights in the matriarchal Falenan tradition.
29th Apr '15 3:23:32 AM Vandegraff1
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* HeroicBSOD: Interestingly, the Prince has one (despite his HeroicMime status). He goes through a large amount of trauma throughout the story, but he finally cracks [[spoiler: after the events of The New Queen's Campaign: Sialeeds betrays him and Lyon nearly dies from a stab wound.]] In a scene after the above spoiler, Luserina tries to reach out and comfort him. After a moment, He simply turns around and walks off; the player is not even given the option to respond (which would normally happen). Pretty powerful response for a silent protagonist.

to:

* HeroicBSOD: Interestingly, the Prince has one (despite his HeroicMime status). He goes through a large amount of trauma throughout the story, but he finally cracks [[spoiler: after the events of The New Queen's Campaign: Sialeeds betrays him and Lyon nearly dies from a stab wound.]] In a scene after the above spoiler, Luserina tries to reach out and comfort him. After a moment, He he simply turns around and walks off; the player is not even given the option to respond (which would normally happen). Pretty powerful response for a silent protagonist.
This list shows the last 10 events of 67. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=VideoGame.SuikodenV