History VideoGame / GoldenSunDarkDawn

6th Jan '18 11:08:21 AM ArcticYoshi45
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* RuinsForRuinsSake: The Konpa Ruins were ostensibly a meeting place for the greatest minds of Alchemy in pre-sealing times, but the architects seemed more interested in powering the structure through solving puzzles and other impractical means, and the entire complex doesn't appear to have any areas explicitly dedicated to holding a forum or discussion. The [[ChokepointGeography Teppe Ruins]] and the [[DismantledMacGuffin Lonely Island Ruins]] don't serve any apparent purpose at all. Eventually [[LampshadeHanging lampshaded]] nonetheless.
--> '''Tret:''' You assume a castle built on ancient ruins MUST have a secret entrance infested with traps and monsters? [[DoubleSubversion Well, you're right... THIS time.]]
17th Nov '17 12:56:53 AM spiritsunami
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*** Furthermore, [[spoiler:the sun will still be shining]] in Port Rago, Te Rya Village, Kolima, Border Town, etc., despite the fact that they're all quite close to Belinsk, the source of [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse]]. Only Belinsk itself will be properly changed if you go back there, but you won't be able to explore more than a few steps in since the game required you to ''not'' be able to leave the town via land the last time you were there and as such there's an InsurmountableWaistHighFence just a few steps away from the entrance to the world map.



%%* {{Foreshadowing}}: Through two-plus games, the only time it's ever been "nighttime" is in the first game's prologue and in one particular town in each game (Lunpa in the first and [[spoiler:Lemuria]] in the second; both are somewhat justified as the former is a town of thieves and you're essentially trying to break someone out of a prison and the latter because it's [[spoiler:hidden inside a giant fog bank and essentially exists outside of the realm of time]]), so night falling while you're battling the Ice Queen in Harapa seems a bit random, especially since nothing happens when you're forced to stay the night due to Harapa's defense system walling off the city when it's dark out. [[spoiler:Harapa is located within the radius of the Grave Eclipse. That defense system itself is the significant event--you can't get into the city when you return there (though there's an item outside the walls that you can't get until after returning during the Grave Eclipse), but presumably the city's residents were spared the fate of most other cities within the Grave Eclipse's radius.]]
%%** The above is actually incorrect as the story in Garoh is very explicitly set at night.

to:

%%* * {{Foreshadowing}}: Through two-plus games, the only time it's ever been "nighttime" is in the first game's prologue and in at least one particular town in each game (Lunpa in the first and Garoh and [[spoiler:Lemuria]] in the second; both all are somewhat justified as the former first is a town of thieves and you're essentially trying to break someone out of a prison prison, the second is a town of ''werewolves'', and the latter because it's last is [[spoiler:hidden inside a giant fog bank and essentially exists outside of the realm of time]]), so night falling while you're battling the Ice Queen in Harapa seems a bit random, especially since nothing happens when you're forced to stay the night due to Harapa's defense system walling off the city when it's dark out. [[spoiler:Harapa is located within the radius of the Grave Eclipse. That defense system itself is the significant event--you can't get into the city when you return there (though there's an item outside the walls that you can't get until after returning during the Grave Eclipse), but presumably the city's residents were spared the fate of most other cities within the Grave Eclipse's radius.]]
%%** The above is actually incorrect as the story in Garoh is very explicitly set at night.
]]



* FusionDance: [[spoiler:The final boss is the fusion of Chalis, Blados, and Volechek.]] Not too surprising since Camelot pulled the exactly same shtick in the first two games, although [[spoiler:they don't fuse into a dragon into this time]]. [[spoiler:Blados and Chalis weren't even ''expecting'' to get pulled into the Chaos Chimera--it was supposed to be just a bunch of fell spirits under their command.]]

to:

* FusionDance: [[spoiler:The final boss is the fusion of Chalis, Blados, and Volechek.]] Not too surprising since Camelot pulled the exactly exact same shtick in the first two games, although [[spoiler:they don't fuse into a dragon into this time]]. [[spoiler:Blados and Chalis weren't even ''expecting'' to get pulled into the Chaos Chimera--it was supposed to be just a bunch of fell spirits under their command.]]
27th Oct '17 11:33:07 AM xcountryguy
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%%
%%Zero-context entries are not allowed. Please add context before removing the comment tags.
%%



* DudeWheresMyRespect: Many of the Muggles do not appreciate the efforts of the original heroes at unsealing Alchemy thanks to the WorldSundering that occurred in the meantime.

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* DudeWheresMyRespect: DudeWheresMyRespect:
**
Many of the Muggles do not appreciate the efforts of the original heroes at unsealing Alchemy thanks to the WorldSundering that occurred in the meantime.



* DummiedOut: Use of a walk through walls code or the Endless Wall glitch will show the Venus Lighthouse on the world map, but unlike the Mercury Lighthouse (which is clearly visible when sailing around the northern part of the world map), you will never see it in-game, since the gap between northeastern Gondowan and the waterfall to the east of it is too large for it to be seen while sailing. (As with Vale and Mt. Aleph in ''The Lost Age'', the lighthouses can't be entered when approached.)

to:

* DummiedOut: DummiedOut:
**
Use of a walk through walkthrough walls code or the Endless Wall glitch will show the Venus Lighthouse on the world map, but unlike the Mercury Lighthouse (which is clearly visible when sailing around the northern part of the world map), you will never see it in-game, since the gap between northeastern Gondowan and the waterfall to the east of it is too large for it to be seen while sailing. (As with Vale and Mt. Aleph in ''The Lost Age'', the lighthouses can't be entered when approached.)



** Though since Wo was out of the country at the time thanks to Chalis, it's possible he'll reappear.

to:

** %%** Though since Wo was out of the country at the time thanks to Chalis, it's possible he'll reappear.



* FaintingSeer: You can visit a pair of fortune-telling sisters and have them read your future. One of them goes into a screaming fit and collapses upon seeing a vision of the party bringing disaster upon the world, and can't even bear to look at you afterward. [[spoiler:Try not to feel awkward when you revisit her home town after the Grave Eclipse.]]

to:

* FaintingSeer: FaintingSeer:
**
You can visit a pair of fortune-telling sisters and have them read your future. One of them goes into a screaming fit and collapses upon seeing a vision of the party bringing disaster upon the world, and can't even bear to look at you afterward. [[spoiler:Try not to feel awkward when you revisit her home town after the Grave Eclipse.]]



* {{Foreshadowing}}: Through two-plus games, the only time it's ever been "nighttime" is in the first game's prologue and in one particular town in each game (Lunpa in the first and [[spoiler:Lemuria]] in the second; both are somewhat justified as the former is a town of thieves and you're essentially trying to break someone out of a prison and the latter because it's [[spoiler:hidden inside a giant fog bank and essentially exists outside of the realm of time]]), so night falling while you're battling the Ice Queen in Harapa seems a bit random, especially since nothing happens when you're forced to stay the night due to Harapa's defense system walling off the city when it's dark out. [[spoiler:Harapa is located within the radius of the Grave Eclipse. That defense system itself is the significant event--you can't get into the city when you return there (though there's an item outside the walls that you can't get until after returning during the Grave Eclipse), but presumably the city's residents were spared the fate of most other cities within the Grave Eclipse's radius.]]
** The above is actually incorrect as the story in Garoh is very explicitly set at night.

to:

* %%* {{Foreshadowing}}: Through two-plus games, the only time it's ever been "nighttime" is in the first game's prologue and in one particular town in each game (Lunpa in the first and [[spoiler:Lemuria]] in the second; both are somewhat justified as the former is a town of thieves and you're essentially trying to break someone out of a prison and the latter because it's [[spoiler:hidden inside a giant fog bank and essentially exists outside of the realm of time]]), so night falling while you're battling the Ice Queen in Harapa seems a bit random, especially since nothing happens when you're forced to stay the night due to Harapa's defense system walling off the city when it's dark out. [[spoiler:Harapa is located within the radius of the Grave Eclipse. That defense system itself is the significant event--you can't get into the city when you return there (though there's an item outside the walls that you can't get until after returning during the Grave Eclipse), but presumably the city's residents were spared the fate of most other cities within the Grave Eclipse's radius.]]
** %%** The above is actually incorrect as the story in Garoh is very explicitly set at night.



* GoneHorriblyRight: [[spoiler:The Eclipse Tower was designed to absorb light as a new Alchemical power source. It did its job ''very'' well...to the point that it drained away ''so much light'' that the severely light-phobic inhabitants of the netherworld [[ZombieApocalypse saw a prime opportunity to invade Weyard]]. The Jenei, at least, didn't realize until activation that the Tower was too effective. The Tuaparang, however, restored it because for them, the flaw ''was the main attraction''.]]
* GoOutWithASmile: [[spoiler:Volechek.]]

to:

* GoneHorriblyRight: [[spoiler:The Eclipse Tower was designed to absorb light as a new Alchemical power source. It did its job ''very'' well... to the point that it drained away ''so much light'' that the severely light-phobic inhabitants of the netherworld [[ZombieApocalypse saw a prime opportunity to invade Weyard]]. The Jenei, at least, didn't realize until activation that the Tower was too effective. The Tuaparang, however, restored it because for them, the flaw ''was the main attraction''.]]
* %%* GoOutWithASmile: [[spoiler:Volechek.]]



* HiddenAgendaVillain: Arcanus, [[spoiler:who is actually Alex, so this is normal]].
* [[spoiler:[[HijackedByGanon Hijacked By Alex]]]]
* HitchhikerHeroes: Even more prominent than in the previous two games.
* [[IdenticalGrandson Identical Son]]: [[http://ds.ign.com/dor/objects/949592/golden-sun-ds/images/e3-2010-golden-sun-dark-dawn-screens-20100615105801158.html Matthew]] and [[http://ds.ign.com/dor/objects/949592/golden-sun-ds/images/e3-2010-golden-sun-dark-dawn-screens-20100615105731471.html Tyrell]] look nearly identical to their fathers, [[http://goldensun.neoseeker.com/w/i/goldensun/f/fe/250px-Gs-isaac.jpg Isaac]] and [[http://goldensun.neoseeker.com/w/i/goldensun/d/d8/175px-GSGaret.jpg Garet]]. They even behave as such, to the chagrin of Garet, who's mellowed out with age.

to:

* %%* HiddenAgendaVillain: Arcanus, [[spoiler:who is actually Alex, so this is normal]].
* [[spoiler:[[HijackedByGanon %%* HijackedByGanon Hijacked By Alex]]]]
*
Alex]]
%%*
HitchhikerHeroes: Even more prominent than in the previous two games.
* [[IdenticalGrandson Identical Son]]: Son]]:
**
[[http://ds.ign.com/dor/objects/949592/golden-sun-ds/images/e3-2010-golden-sun-dark-dawn-screens-20100615105801158.html Matthew]] and [[http://ds.ign.com/dor/objects/949592/golden-sun-ds/images/e3-2010-golden-sun-dark-dawn-screens-20100615105731471.html Tyrell]] look nearly identical to their fathers, [[http://goldensun.neoseeker.com/w/i/goldensun/f/fe/250px-Gs-isaac.jpg Isaac]] and [[http://goldensun.neoseeker.com/w/i/goldensun/d/d8/175px-GSGaret.jpg Garet]]. They even behave as such, to the chagrin of Garet, who's mellowed out with age.



* InnocentInnuendo: Mundane items no longer have their names capitalized. Fandom had already jumped on "(x) got a Hard Nut! (x) gave a Hard Nut to (y)" in previous games, so removing the capital letters made such innuendos even more hilarious ((x) got 2 nuts).

to:

* InnocentInnuendo: InnocentInnuendo:
**
Mundane items no longer have their names capitalized. Fandom had already jumped on "(x) got a Hard Nut! (x) gave a Hard Nut to (y)" in previous games, so removing the capital letters made such innuendos even more hilarious ((x) got 2 nuts).



* InnocuouslyImportantEpisode: Tanglewood Forest. That stuff Isaac's saying about [[spoiler:dispelling dark energies with light]]? Yeah, that'll be on the final exam.

to:

* InnocuouslyImportantEpisode: InnocuouslyImportantEpisode:
**
Tanglewood Forest. That stuff Isaac's saying about [[spoiler:dispelling dark energies with light]]? Yeah, that'll be on the final exam.



* LampshadeHanging: Too many to list, though not quite in BetterThanABareBulb territory.

to:

* %%* LampshadeHanging: Too many to list, though not quite in BetterThanABareBulb territory.



* LeaningOnTheFourthWall: Once [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse activates]], Volechek and his soldiers chase some monsters into the Belinsk Opera House. When they reach the theater, [[LeftTheBackgroundMusicOn horror music starts playing]], and the soldiers start commenting on it, saying that the monsters are playing musical instruments behind the curtain on the stage. One even mentions that the monsters are [[SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic quite good]].

to:

* LeaningOnTheFourthWall: LeaningOnTheFourthWall:
**
Once [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse activates]], Volechek and his soldiers chase some monsters into the Belinsk Opera House. When they reach the theater, [[LeftTheBackgroundMusicOn horror music starts playing]], and the soldiers start commenting on it, saying that the monsters are playing musical instruments behind the curtain on the stage. One even mentions that the monsters are [[SugarWiki/AwesomeMusic quite good]].



* LethalLavaLand: The Burning Island Cave.

to:

* %%* LethalLavaLand: The Burning Island Cave.



* TheLostWoods: The [[NoobCave Tanglewood]] and, later, Kolima Forest.

to:

* %%* TheLostWoods: The [[NoobCave Tanglewood]] and, later, Kolima Forest.



** Which is kind of weird since she's wearing leggings/tights underneath.
* TheMaze: Otka Island.

to:

** %%** Which is kind of weird since she's wearing leggings/tights underneath.
* %%* TheMaze: Otka Island.



* MechanicallyUnusualClass: The game has an inversion: Sveta's base class has some useful abilities, but what you ''really'' want is her Beastform ability, which allows her to attack every single enemy at once every turn (no one else can do this).
* MentalWorld: Phantasmal Bog.
* TheMindIsAPlaythingOfTheBody: Happens a bit with the beastmen, who get very short-tempered around a full moon (strangely, the ex-human ones are worse about this than the ex-animals). Volechek started the disturbing tradition of public execution as festival entertainment to direct the civilians' aggressions away from ''each other'' during this time.

to:

* MechanicallyUnusualClass: The game has an inversion: Sveta's base class has some useful abilities, but what you ''really'' want is her Beastform ability, which allows her to attack every single enemy at once every turn (no turn. No one else can do this).
*
this.
%%*
MentalWorld: Phantasmal Bog.
* TheMindIsAPlaythingOfTheBody: TheMindIsAPlaythingOfTheBody:
**
Happens a bit with the beastmen, who get very short-tempered around a full moon (strangely, the ex-human ones are worse about this than the ex-animals). Volechek started the disturbing tradition of public execution as festival entertainment to direct the civilians' aggressions away from ''each other'' during this time.



** You even get a Psynergy-bestowing item from it. Bwah?!

to:

** %%** You even get a Psynergy-bestowing item from it. Bwah?!



* OffTheRails: You thought this would be a quick trip to get the feather, didn't you? ''Nope!''
* OlderAndWiser: While Isaac has always been thoughtful and intelligent, Garet plays this trope straight; his son, Tyrell, behaves much like Garet did in the first two games, and Garet doesn't hesitate to berate him for his behavior.

to:

* %%* OffTheRails: You thought this would be a quick trip to get the feather, didn't you? ''Nope!''
* OlderAndWiser: OlderAndWiser:
**
While Isaac has always been thoughtful and intelligent, Garet plays this trope straight; his son, Tyrell, behaves much like Garet did in the first two games, and Garet doesn't hesitate to berate him for his behavior.



* OlderThanTheyLook: Isaac and Garet do ''not'' look to be in their late 40s; mid-30s is more like it. In fact, Ivan's found that those directly exposed to the power of the Golden Sun (i.e. the Warriors of Vale and Kraden) age ''much'' more slowly than normal. Karis is a little worried that the parents will sharply outlive their children.

to:

* OlderThanTheyLook: OlderThanTheyLook:
**
Isaac and Garet do ''not'' look to be in their late 40s; mid-30s is more like it. In fact, Ivan's found that those directly exposed to the power of the Golden Sun (i.e. the Warriors of Vale and Kraden) age ''much'' more slowly than normal. Karis is a little worried that the parents will sharply outlive their children.



* PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling: Southeast of Kaocho, between a river and a lone tree and west of a cliff, there's a small forest where Rat Warriors often appear. These enemies are normally found outside the city of Tonfon, which players don't have access to at this point, so as with [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyI the trope namer]], this is caused by the game generating a random encounter for the wrong part of the world. They hit hard (so make sure you've got money in case you need to revive someone) and take a while to take down, but they give over 900 experience points apiece, which is a lot at that point in the game.

to:

* PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling: PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling:
**
Southeast of Kaocho, between a river and a lone tree and west of a cliff, there's a small forest where Rat Warriors often appear. These enemies are normally found outside the city of Tonfon, which players don't have access to at this point, so as with [[VideoGame/FinalFantasyI the trope namer]], this is caused by the game generating a random encounter for the wrong part of the world. They hit hard (so make sure you've got money in case you need to revive someone) and take a while to take down, but they give over 900 experience points apiece, which is a lot at that point in the game.



** Interestingly, beastmen arose not just by [[{{Animorphism}} humans turning half-animal]] but [[HumanityEnsues animals turning half-human]]. One character mentions that "ever since [she] started walking upright and wearing clothes, [she's] lost her taste for raw meat...mostly."

to:

** Interestingly, beastmen arose not just by [[{{Animorphism}} humans turning half-animal]] but [[HumanityEnsues animals turning half-human]]. One character mentions that "ever since [she] started walking upright and wearing clothes, [she's] lost her taste for raw meat... mostly."



* PointOfNoReturn: There are five major points in the game that will cut off most content before that point if you cross it without collecting everything. In order, they are: [[spoiler:Blados collapsing the Konpa Ruins and Rief joining the party]], [[spoiler:jumping on the cloud at Passaj to go to Craggy Peak]], [[spoiler:asking the band to play Arangoa Prelude to enter the Belinsk Ruins]], [[spoiler:raising Luna Tower and starting the Grave Eclipse]], and [[spoiler:getting on Briggs' and Eoleo's ship at Belinsk after the Luna Tower rises and the Grave Eclipse begins]]. The proximity of points three and four to each other essentially turns [[spoiler:the Belinsk Ruins]] into a OneTimeDungeon, while the fourth and fifth are in even ''closer'' proximity to one another.

to:

* PointOfNoReturn: PointOfNoReturn:
**
There are five major points in the game that will cut off most content before that point if you cross it without collecting everything. In order, they are: [[spoiler:Blados collapsing the Konpa Ruins and Rief joining the party]], [[spoiler:jumping on the cloud at Passaj to go to Craggy Peak]], [[spoiler:asking the band to play Arangoa Prelude to enter the Belinsk Ruins]], [[spoiler:raising Luna Tower and starting the Grave Eclipse]], and [[spoiler:getting on Briggs' and Eoleo's ship at Belinsk after the Luna Tower rises and the Grave Eclipse begins]]. The proximity of points three and four to each other essentially turns [[spoiler:the Belinsk Ruins]] into a OneTimeDungeon, while the fourth and fifth are in even ''closer'' proximity to one another.



** When the [[spoiler:Magma Orb is stolen]], Karis will ask your opinion of the situation. If you select the "angry" option, her response: "Wow...graphic!" Is there such a thing as a ''stealth'' F-bomb?

to:

** When the [[spoiler:Magma Orb is stolen]], Karis will ask your opinion of the situation. If you select the "angry" option, her response: "Wow... graphic!" Is there such a thing as a ''stealth'' F-bomb?



* RebelliousPrincess: [[spoiler:Sveta]]

to:

* %%* RebelliousPrincess: [[spoiler:Sveta]]



* SequelHook: TheStinger at the end. Hey, it wouldn't be a Golden Sun game without one.

to:

* SequelHook: SequelHook:
**
TheStinger at the end. Hey, it wouldn't be a Golden Sun game without one.



* ShipTease: Matthew and Sveta in the ending.

to:

* ShipTease: ShipTease:
**
Matthew and Sveta in the ending.



* StrangeMindsThinkAlike: Both Eoleo and his great-grandmother Obaba's first reaction to Kraden's immortality is that is that it must suck given he is still 70.

to:

* StrangeMindsThinkAlike: StrangeMindsThinkAlike:
**
Both Eoleo and his great-grandmother Obaba's first reaction to Kraden's immortality is that is that it must suck given he is still 70.
27th Oct '17 11:10:09 AM xcountryguy
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* AccidentalMisnaming: "GRAMPS?! I'm an elder of Passaj! Call me that...or by my name, Bogho! Anything else is disrespectful!"

to:

* AccidentalMisnaming: "GRAMPS?! I'm an elder of Passaj! Call me that... or by my name, Bogho! Anything else is disrespectful!"



* [[AllThereInTheManual All There in the Encyclopedia]]

to:

* %%* [[AllThereInTheManual All There in the Encyclopedia]]



* AmazingTechnicolorPopulation: Blados of Tuaparang.

to:

* AmazingTechnicolorPopulation: AmazingTechnicolorPopulation:
%%**
Blados of Tuaparang.



* BigBoosHaunt: The [[BonusLevel Lost Ship.]]

to:

* %%* BigBoosHaunt: The [[BonusLevel Lost Ship.]]



* BleakLevel: [[spoiler:Post-eclipse]] Belinsk. Things get dark.
* BlessedWithSuck: Kraden ages very slowly thanks to the Golden Sun. Except he already ''is'' a fragile old geezer.

to:

* %%* BleakLevel: [[spoiler:Post-eclipse]] Belinsk. Things get dark.
* BlessedWithSuck: BlessedWithSuck:
**
Kraden ages very slowly thanks to the Golden Sun. Except he already ''is'' a fragile old geezer.



* BrainwashedAndCrazy: The bonus boss Ancient Devil [[spoiler:will do this to ''one of your party members in battle'']].

to:

* BrainwashedAndCrazy: BrainwashedAndCrazy:
**
The bonus boss Ancient Devil [[spoiler:will do this to ''one of your party members in battle'']].



* BubblyClouds: The area right before Craggy Peak Ruins.

to:

* %%* BubblyClouds: The area right before Craggy Peak Ruins.



* ContinuityNod: Lots, including several {{Brick Joke}}s. Remember how someone once thought Isaac and his friends were muscular, bearded warriors? It happened (at least for Isaac and Garet).

to:

* ContinuityNod: ContinuityNod:
**
Lots, including several {{Brick Joke}}s. Remember how someone once thought Isaac and his friends were muscular, bearded warriors? It happened (at least for Isaac and Garet).



* CrazyAwesome: In-universe example: Tyrell considers Carver to be this.

to:

* %%* CrazyAwesome: In-universe example: Tyrell considers Carver to be this.



** Supposedly such executions happen at every full-moon festival.

to:

** %%** Supposedly such executions happen at every full-moon festival.



* DefeatMeansFriendship: Some Djinn need to be defeated in combat before they join. I suppose friendship is optional for that, though.

to:

* DefeatMeansFriendship: DefeatMeansFriendship:
**
Some Djinn need to be defeated in combat before they join. I suppose friendship is optional for that, though.



* DevelopersForesight: Just as in the first two games, Camelot prepares for every possible contingency and every possible action that the player will take, and accounts for it in one way or another.

to:

* DevelopersForesight: DevelopersForesight:
**
Just as in the first two games, Camelot prepares for every possible contingency and every possible action that the player will take, and accounts for it in one way or another.



* DisappearedDad: Amiti's father left before he was born. [[spoiler:The game all but spells out that it's [[HiddenAgendaVillain Alex]].]]

to:

* DisappearedDad: DisappearedDad:
**
Amiti's father left before he was born. [[spoiler:The game all but spells out that it's [[HiddenAgendaVillain Alex]].]]
27th Oct '17 9:11:16 AM xcountryguy
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* AnyoneCanDie: Quite a MoodWhiplash around the time of [[spoiler: [[WhamEpisode the Grave Eclipse]]]].

to:

* AnyoneCanDie: Quite a MoodWhiplash around the time of [[spoiler: [[WhamEpisode [[spoiler:[[WhamEpisode the Grave Eclipse]]]].



** [[spoiler: Briggs also is attacked by the immensely powerful eclipse monsters and survives long enough to be found by the heroes and die reassuring his son.]] He only disqualifies on the basis of not having any known grandkids (though with a son [[MrFanservice that good-looking]]... one never knows).

to:

** [[spoiler: Briggs [[spoiler:Briggs also is attacked by the immensely powerful eclipse monsters and survives long enough to be found by the heroes and die reassuring his son.]] He only disqualifies on the basis of not having any known grandkids (though with a son [[MrFanservice that good-looking]]... one never knows).



** To get into Kaocho Palace, you tell the guards that you're the Adepts the king was expecting. [[spoiler: You are, you just didn't know that at the time.]]

to:

** To get into Kaocho Palace, you tell the guards that you're the Adepts the king was expecting. [[spoiler: You [[spoiler:You are, you just didn't know that at the time.]]



** Many swords also qualify, especially the [[spoiler: [[InfinityPlusOneSword Sol Blade]]]], which is a golden BFS which periodically [[KillitwithFire explodes with fire]], [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill calls meteors]], and [[MundaneUtility opens]] [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking doors]].
** [[spoiler: [[FinalBoss The Chaos Chimera]] wields Blados's]] and [[spoiler:[[BonusBoss Dullahan]]]] has a rather large blade too. The Lizard monsters get progressively larger ones, until the sword is the same size as its body.

to:

** Many swords also qualify, especially the [[spoiler: [[InfinityPlusOneSword [[spoiler:[[InfinityPlusOneSword Sol Blade]]]], which is a golden BFS which periodically [[KillitwithFire explodes with fire]], [[ThereIsNoKillLikeOverkill calls meteors]], and [[MundaneUtility opens]] [[ArsonMurderAndJaywalking doors]].
** [[spoiler: [[FinalBoss [[spoiler:[[FinalBoss The Chaos Chimera]] wields Blados's]] and [[spoiler:[[BonusBoss Dullahan]]]] has a rather large blade too. The Lizard monsters get progressively larger ones, until the sword is the same size as its body.



* BraggingRightsReward: Like The Lost Age, the optional summons have nothing to be used against. It is ''worse'' here, as the final boss [[spoiler: must be defeated at least once to get the last two tablets, meaning even it isn't a useful thing to use it on)]].

to:

* BraggingRightsReward: Like The Lost Age, the optional summons have nothing to be used against. It is ''worse'' here, as the final boss [[spoiler: must [[spoiler:must be defeated at least once to get the last two tablets, meaning even it isn't a useful thing to use it on)]].



* BrutalBonusLevel: The easiest game in the series has the most grueling BonusDungeon in the series. Every mook monster in [[spoiler: Crossbone Isle]] is [[BossInMookClothing easily as difficult as most of the game's bosses]] (the Great Dragons even more so), and the actual BonusBoss is [[spoiler: a [[UpToEleven souped-up]] ''[[MemeticBadass Dullahan]]'']]. As if to compensate, the puzzles in the dungeon are rather easy; they all entirely rely on the Move Psynergy, the most basic Utility Psynergy in the game that you've been using since the very beginning (though the Move puzzles are a little more complicated than what you've been used to throughout the game).

to:

* BrutalBonusLevel: The easiest game in the series has the most grueling BonusDungeon in the series. Every mook monster in [[spoiler: Crossbone [[spoiler:Crossbone Isle]] is [[BossInMookClothing easily as difficult as most of the game's bosses]] (the Great Dragons even more so), and the actual BonusBoss is [[spoiler: a [[spoiler:a [[UpToEleven souped-up]] ''[[MemeticBadass Dullahan]]'']]. As if to compensate, the puzzles in the dungeon are rather easy; they all entirely rely on the Move Psynergy, the most basic Utility Psynergy in the game that you've been using since the very beginning (though the Move puzzles are a little more complicated than what you've been used to throughout the game).



** Remember the baby pirate, the mute monk, the girl you rescued as a tree, the [[spoiler: Sun/Moon symbols in Sol Sanctum]], Kraden's offhand reference to the PhilosophersStone, the werewolves, the dancing doll, the talking trees, and a girl you helped promising to have a son who would help you? ''They're all plot points in Dark Dawn.''

to:

** Remember the baby pirate, the mute monk, the girl you rescued as a tree, the [[spoiler: Sun/Moon [[spoiler:Sun/Moon symbols in Sol Sanctum]], Kraden's offhand reference to the PhilosophersStone, the werewolves, the dancing doll, the talking trees, and a girl you helped promising to have a son who would help you? ''They're all plot points in Dark Dawn.''



* CursedWithAwesome: Sveta's a mind-reading Adept who feels AMindIsATerribleThingToRead. She's a beastman who laments being the subject of FantasticRacism, never mind the [[OurWerewolvesAreDifferent turning into]] a wolf and punching the shit out of just about everything. And she's [[spoiler: the princess of Morgal, and thus involved in the [[ThePlan manipulations of Tuaparang to bring about the Grave Eclipse]], for which she feels responsible.]]

to:

* CursedWithAwesome: Sveta's a mind-reading Adept who feels AMindIsATerribleThingToRead. She's a beastman who laments being the subject of FantasticRacism, never mind the [[OurWerewolvesAreDifferent turning into]] a wolf and punching the shit out of just about everything. And she's [[spoiler: the [[spoiler:the princess of Morgal, and thus involved in the [[ThePlan manipulations of Tuaparang to bring about the Grave Eclipse]], for which she feels responsible.]]



** Although, there are a few noticeable holes when it comes to supplying alternative conversations after SequenceBreaking, something the first two games were very good at. The conversations in [[spoiler: Tonfon, if you find Hou Ju and Ryu Kou before ever going there,]] come to mind. Also, if you go to Kaocho before Passaj, your party will have no idea what the Ouroboros is despite just having escaped from there.

to:

** Although, there are a few noticeable holes when it comes to supplying alternative conversations after SequenceBreaking, something the first two games were very good at. The conversations in [[spoiler: Tonfon, [[spoiler:Tonfon, if you find Hou Ju and Ryu Kou before ever going there,]] come to mind. Also, if you go to Kaocho before Passaj, your party will have no idea what the Ouroboros is despite just having escaped from there.



* EarlyBirdCameo: In a FreezeFrameBonus, the Tuaparang airship shows up in the intro before you ever get control of anything. [[spoiler: It doesn't show up again until you've started activating the Apollo Lens.]]
* [[spoiler: ElementNumberFive: The big twist at the end of the game is that there is a tribe of adepts controlling a fifth element, Darkness. This setting's element system being based on balance, the party then awakens the sixth element, Light.]]

to:

* EarlyBirdCameo: In a FreezeFrameBonus, the Tuaparang airship shows up in the intro before you ever get control of anything. [[spoiler: It [[spoiler:It doesn't show up again until you've started activating the Apollo Lens.]]
* [[spoiler: ElementNumberFive: [[spoiler:ElementNumberFive: The big twist at the end of the game is that there is a tribe of adepts controlling a fifth element, Darkness. This setting's element system being based on balance, the party then awakens the sixth element, Light.]]



** And the villains. A blue-skinned, [[AffablyEvil cheerily]] [[CardCarryingVillain card-carrying]] swordsman, and an elegant LadyOfWar with RapunzelHair. [[spoiler: [[MyFriendsAndZoidberg And Alex.]]]] Their operations include kidnapping people and raising general havoc, and they pursue the activation of long-lost {{Magitek}}. Now, am I talking about [[VideoGame/GoldenSun Saturos and Menardi]], or Blados and Chalis?
*** Although there's a ''major'' difference there: motivation. Saturos and Menardi were out to [[WellIntentionedExtremist save their hometown/the world]]. Blados and Chalis? [[ForTheEvulz Shits and giggles.]] [[spoiler: And to betray their militaristic hometown for unknown reasons. Maybe the sequel will make them suddenly save the world instead and make Matthew's group look LawfulStupid for no reason.]]

to:

** And the villains. A blue-skinned, [[AffablyEvil cheerily]] [[CardCarryingVillain card-carrying]] swordsman, and an elegant LadyOfWar with RapunzelHair. [[spoiler: [[MyFriendsAndZoidberg [[spoiler:[[MyFriendsAndZoidberg And Alex.]]]] Their operations include kidnapping people and raising general havoc, and they pursue the activation of long-lost {{Magitek}}. Now, am I talking about [[VideoGame/GoldenSun Saturos and Menardi]], or Blados and Chalis?
*** Although there's a ''major'' difference there: motivation. Saturos and Menardi were out to [[WellIntentionedExtremist save their hometown/the world]]. Blados and Chalis? [[ForTheEvulz Shits and giggles.]] [[spoiler: And [[spoiler:And to betray their militaristic hometown for unknown reasons. Maybe the sequel will make them suddenly save the world instead and make Matthew's group look LawfulStupid for no reason.]]



** If you've triggered the [[spoiler: Eclipse]], you've also added Eoleo to your party. An internationally-renowned violent criminal who's supposed to be facing a horrible death before morning. No comment. In fact, ''all of Weyard'' pretty much misses or ignores Eoleo unless you're in Champa. Have you figured out the secret of WeirdnessCensor Psynergy, Eoleo?
* FaintingSeer: You can visit a pair of fortune-telling sisters and have them read your future. One of them goes into a screaming fit and collapses upon seeing a vision of the party bringing disaster upon the world, and can't even bear to look at you afterward. [[spoiler: Try not to feel awkward when you revisit her home town after the Grave Eclipse.]]
** Himi is first seen in a coma, apparently from a PokeInTheThirdEye (metaphorical) when [[spoiler: the Grave Eclipse began]]. An artifact called the Third Eye wakes her and enables her to control her clairvoyant powers.

to:

** If you've triggered the [[spoiler: Eclipse]], [[spoiler:Eclipse]], you've also added Eoleo to your party. An internationally-renowned violent criminal who's supposed to be facing a horrible death before morning. No comment. In fact, ''all of Weyard'' pretty much misses or ignores Eoleo unless you're in Champa. Have you figured out the secret of WeirdnessCensor Psynergy, Eoleo?
* FaintingSeer: You can visit a pair of fortune-telling sisters and have them read your future. One of them goes into a screaming fit and collapses upon seeing a vision of the party bringing disaster upon the world, and can't even bear to look at you afterward. [[spoiler: Try [[spoiler:Try not to feel awkward when you revisit her home town after the Grave Eclipse.]]
** Himi is first seen in a coma, apparently from a PokeInTheThirdEye (metaphorical) when [[spoiler: the [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse began]]. An artifact called the Third Eye wakes her and enables her to control her clairvoyant powers.



* GoneHorriblyRight: [[spoiler: The Eclipse Tower was designed to absorb light as a new Alchemical power source. It did its job ''very'' well...to the point that it drained away ''so much light'' that the severely light-phobic inhabitants of the netherworld [[ZombieApocalypse saw a prime opportunity to invade Weyard]]. The Jenei, at least, didn't realize until activation that the Tower was too effective. The Tuaparang, however, restored it because for them, the flaw ''was the main attraction''.]]

to:

* GoneHorriblyRight: [[spoiler: The [[spoiler:The Eclipse Tower was designed to absorb light as a new Alchemical power source. It did its job ''very'' well...to the point that it drained away ''so much light'' that the severely light-phobic inhabitants of the netherworld [[ZombieApocalypse saw a prime opportunity to invade Weyard]]. The Jenei, at least, didn't realize until activation that the Tower was too effective. The Tuaparang, however, restored it because for them, the flaw ''was the main attraction''.]]



* HairColorSpoiler: [[spoiler: Blados and Chalis turn out to be Adepts]], but Amiti takes the cake for having ''basically his entire subplot'' given away by the fact that he's a blue-haired Adept in an area otherwise exclusive to brown- and black-haired non-Adepts. [[spoiler: And he turns out to be the son of the only other character with that shade of blue. [[CaptainObvious Who'd've thunk it?]]]]
* HeelFaceRevolvingDoor: [[spoiler: Alex can seem this at times, often working with and against the heroes at the same time, throughout the entire series. However, this is more then likely just the fallout from being an amazing example of the HiddenAgendaVillain and/or TheChessmaster]].

to:

* HairColorSpoiler: [[spoiler: Blados [[spoiler:Blados and Chalis turn out to be Adepts]], but Amiti takes the cake for having ''basically his entire subplot'' given away by the fact that he's a blue-haired Adept in an area otherwise exclusive to brown- and black-haired non-Adepts. [[spoiler: And [[spoiler:And he turns out to be the son of the only other character with that shade of blue. [[CaptainObvious Who'd've thunk it?]]]]
* HeelFaceRevolvingDoor: [[spoiler: Alex [[spoiler:Alex can seem this at times, often working with and against the heroes at the same time, throughout the entire series. However, this is more then likely just the fallout from being an amazing example of the HiddenAgendaVillain and/or TheChessmaster]].



* HiddenAgendaVillain: Arcanus, [[spoiler: who is actually Alex, so this is normal]].
* [[spoiler: [[HijackedByGanon Hijacked By Alex]]]]

to:

* HiddenAgendaVillain: Arcanus, [[spoiler: who [[spoiler:who is actually Alex, so this is normal]].
* [[spoiler: [[HijackedByGanon [[spoiler:[[HijackedByGanon Hijacked By Alex]]]]



** [[spoiler: Subverted with Amiti, who dresses and acts quite differently, but is still mistaken for... someone with a mask... by an NPC in Tonfon Palace.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: Subverted [[spoiler:Subverted with Amiti, who dresses and acts quite differently, but is still mistaken for... someone with a mask... by an NPC in Tonfon Palace.]]



* InnocuouslyImportantEpisode: Tanglewood Forest. That stuff Isaac's saying about [[spoiler: dispelling dark energies with light]]? Yeah, that'll be on the final exam.

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* InnocuouslyImportantEpisode: Tanglewood Forest. That stuff Isaac's saying about [[spoiler: dispelling [[spoiler:dispelling dark energies with light]]? Yeah, that'll be on the final exam.



* ItemCrafting: It works the same as in ''The Lost Age'': give the smith your materials, [[GoWaitOutside leave town]], come back for a randomly-crafted item, lather rinse repeat. Luckily, unlike in [[NoHeroDiscount The Lost Age]], [[spoiler: Obaba]] doesn't charge you money for the items. However, there's now only four materials that can be used.

to:

* ItemCrafting: It works the same as in ''The Lost Age'': give the smith your materials, [[GoWaitOutside leave town]], come back for a randomly-crafted item, lather rinse repeat. Luckily, unlike in [[NoHeroDiscount The Lost Age]], [[spoiler: Obaba]] [[spoiler:Obaba]] doesn't charge you money for the items. However, there's now only four materials that can be used.



** In Belinsk Ruins, Karis and Sveta briefly wonder if someone is guiding the party's actions. When Tyrell points out that obviously the villains ''are'', they reply that it seems like someone else is involved, too. [[spoiler: This could be alluding to the player, or {{Foreshadowing}} that Arcanus is not one of the Tuaparang, as he spells out in his next appearance.]]

to:

** In Belinsk Ruins, Karis and Sveta briefly wonder if someone is guiding the party's actions. When Tyrell points out that obviously the villains ''are'', they reply that it seems like someone else is involved, too. [[spoiler: This [[spoiler:This could be alluding to the player, or {{Foreshadowing}} that Arcanus is not one of the Tuaparang, as he spells out in his next appearance.]]



* LukeIAmYourFather: [[spoiler: Amiti is Alex's son. Nobody explicitly puts two and two together within the game, although more than enough hints are given to the player.]]

to:

* LukeIAmYourFather: [[spoiler: Amiti [[spoiler:Amiti is Alex's son. Nobody explicitly puts two and two together within the game, although more than enough hints are given to the player.]]



** [[spoiler: Later, upon meeting Laurel and Tret, Tret specifically indicates that Amiti is somehow related to Mia. Piers is completely unrelated, but Alex is Mia's cousin. Tret lampshades the possibility of "dark family secrets" at this point.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, in Tonfon, if you talk to the old man by Emperor Unan's throne after you save Hou Ju and Ryu Kou, he asks the party "Didn't you come by before? Where's your mask?". Alex had just been there. We can assume that the old man is not going senile and is actually confused by a case of StrongFamilyResemblance.]]
*** [[spoiler: What, you thought Amiti just had [[{{Mukokuseki}} generic anime features]]? Nope! He's got similar facial structure to Rief, Mia, and Alex. Compare and contrast with the other ethnically diverse characters.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, if you read Amiti's mind at the very end when you get control of Sveta right after the final battle, it reveals that for some reason Amiti is thinking of Alex and he doesn't know why.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: Later, [[spoiler:Later, upon meeting Laurel and Tret, Tret specifically indicates that Amiti is somehow related to Mia. Piers is completely unrelated, but Alex is Mia's cousin. Tret lampshades the possibility of "dark family secrets" at this point.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, [[spoiler:Also, in Tonfon, if you talk to the old man by Emperor Unan's throne after you save Hou Ju and Ryu Kou, he asks the party "Didn't you come by before? Where's your mask?". Alex had just been there. We can assume that the old man is not going senile and is actually confused by a case of StrongFamilyResemblance.]]
*** [[spoiler: What, [[spoiler:What, you thought Amiti just had [[{{Mukokuseki}} generic anime features]]? Nope! He's got similar facial structure to Rief, Mia, and Alex. Compare and contrast with the other ethnically diverse characters.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, [[spoiler:Also, if you read Amiti's mind at the very end when you get control of Sveta right after the final battle, it reveals that for some reason Amiti is thinking of Alex and he doesn't know why.]]



** [[spoiler: A released character chart showing everybody's ancestry]] [[{{Pun}} verifies]] the matter.

to:

** [[spoiler: A [[spoiler:A released character chart showing everybody's ancestry]] [[{{Pun}} verifies]] the matter.



* TheManBehindTheMan: The High Empyror, Tuaparang's unseen leader. [[spoiler: The Tuaparang we see first betray the country and then get [[HijackedByGanon Hijacked by Alex]].]]

to:

* TheManBehindTheMan: The High Empyror, Tuaparang's unseen leader. [[spoiler: The [[spoiler:The Tuaparang we see first betray the country and then get [[HijackedByGanon Hijacked by Alex]].]]



* MissingMom: Karis' and Tyrell's mothers are never even mentioned. Eoleo, whose mother, Chaucha, players met in ''The Lost Age'', is oddly absent from this installment (especially since we are ''specifically asked to make sure she's okay''). While Matthew's mother, [[spoiler: Jenna]], is never seen, the characters know exactly where she is: living in Kalay along with other refugees from Vale.
* MoodWhiplash: An interesting variation, in that the mood goes from dramatic to humorous. [[spoiler: Immediately after you fire the Apollo Lens and end the Grave Eclipse, the game shifts back to Belinsk for the epilogue, and it's playing the jazzy music from when you first arrived there.]]

to:

* MissingMom: Karis' and Tyrell's mothers are never even mentioned. Eoleo, whose mother, Chaucha, players met in ''The Lost Age'', is oddly absent from this installment (especially since we are ''specifically asked to make sure she's okay''). While Matthew's mother, [[spoiler: Jenna]], [[spoiler:Jenna]], is never seen, the characters know exactly where she is: living in Kalay along with other refugees from Vale.
* MoodWhiplash: An interesting variation, in that the mood goes from dramatic to humorous. [[spoiler: Immediately [[spoiler:Immediately after you fire the Apollo Lens and end the Grave Eclipse, the game shifts back to Belinsk for the epilogue, and it's playing the jazzy music from when you first arrived there.]]



* NotCompletelyUseless: StandardStatusEffects can be used to hobble [[spoiler: allies under the Ancient Devil's thrall]], making that fight a bit easier. And Insight Psynergy maps a possible solution to the infamous Capricorn puzzle, instead of [[CaptainObvious pointing out that you can Move the statues]].

to:

* NotCompletelyUseless: StandardStatusEffects can be used to hobble [[spoiler: allies [[spoiler:allies under the Ancient Devil's thrall]], making that fight a bit easier. And Insight Psynergy maps a possible solution to the infamous Capricorn puzzle, instead of [[CaptainObvious pointing out that you can Move the statues]].



* OneHitKill: The Ice Queen's [[KissOfDeath Icy Kiss]] and Blados' Punish, certain weapon unleash techniques and Djinn, the Charon summon, and [[spoiler: Skorpna enemies' "Drag Down" attack]] all deal damage and have some chance of a one-hit kill. In addition, the Condemn powers, which effectively sic the Grim Reaper on someone, return, but they're still {{Useless Useful Spell}}s in your hands.

to:

* OneHitKill: The Ice Queen's [[KissOfDeath Icy Kiss]] and Blados' Punish, certain weapon unleash techniques and Djinn, the Charon summon, and [[spoiler: Skorpna [[spoiler:Skorpna enemies' "Drag Down" attack]] all deal damage and have some chance of a one-hit kill. In addition, the Condemn powers, which effectively sic the Grim Reaper on someone, return, but they're still {{Useless Useful Spell}}s in your hands.



* OutsideContextProblem: Tuaparang easily fits the bill. They're outright stated not to be from any of Weyard's known nations or peoples, and [[spoiler: have access to [[SchizoTech extremely advanced technology]] and ''[[MagicAIsMagicA Psynergy that doesn't follow the four classical elements]]''.]]
* PapaWolf: Briggs, who singlehandedly tries to storm the most fortified city on Angara with a busted ship in the effort to rescue his imprisoned son. ''Twice.'' The sheer insanity of this is lampshaded. [[spoiler: He also stays in port during the onset of the Grave Eclipse so you can get Eoleo out of there, [[DyingMomentOfAwesome even though the monsters mortally wound him]].]]

to:

* OutsideContextProblem: Tuaparang easily fits the bill. They're outright stated not to be from any of Weyard's known nations or peoples, and [[spoiler: have [[spoiler:have access to [[SchizoTech extremely advanced technology]] and ''[[MagicAIsMagicA Psynergy that doesn't follow the four classical elements]]''.]]
* PapaWolf: Briggs, who singlehandedly tries to storm the most fortified city on Angara with a busted ship in the effort to rescue his imprisoned son. ''Twice.'' The sheer insanity of this is lampshaded. [[spoiler: He [[spoiler:He also stays in port during the onset of the Grave Eclipse so you can get Eoleo out of there, [[DyingMomentOfAwesome even though the monsters mortally wound him]].]]



** Justified. Nobody in this group except Kraden ever met him, and [[spoiler: according to Karis's commentary in the final dungeon, everyone else who had presumed him dead]]. He had no reason to disguise himself.

to:

** Justified. Nobody in this group except Kraden ever met him, and [[spoiler: according [[spoiler:according to Karis's commentary in the final dungeon, everyone else who had presumed him dead]]. He had no reason to disguise himself.



** Later in the game, right before the final boss, [[spoiler: Tua Warriors]] appear on every random encounter and drop Waters of Life and give tons of experience (i.e. five-digit amounts), making power-leveling very easy (and making it easy to level up for the post-game {{Bonus Boss}}es). You can easily make it to level 99 within two or three hours.
* PermanentlyMissableContent: In a major change from the first two games, about a third of the Djinn and six summon tablets can end up as this if you're not careful, due to a great majority of the locations becoming unreachable after the turning point of the plot. Make sure you have explored everything you can before [[spoiler:activating Blados's trap at the end of Konpa Ruins]], [[spoiler: battling Blados and Chalis in the Belinsk ruins]], and [[spoiler:leaving Belinsk after the Grave Eclipse activates]]. Note that two of these come in almost immediate succession. Special mention to the Djinni Brick, who is the only thing missed at [[spoiler:leaving on the cloud climb]]--in fact, there's a sidequest left outstanding at this point that actually ''requires'' you to return to this area after [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse has already activated]].

to:

** Later in the game, right before the final boss, [[spoiler: Tua [[spoiler:Tua Warriors]] appear on every random encounter and drop Waters of Life and give tons of experience (i.e. five-digit amounts), making power-leveling very easy (and making it easy to level up for the post-game {{Bonus Boss}}es). You can easily make it to level 99 within two or three hours.
* PermanentlyMissableContent: In a major change from the first two games, about a third of the Djinn and six summon tablets can end up as this if you're not careful, due to a great majority of the locations becoming unreachable after the turning point of the plot. Make sure you have explored everything you can before [[spoiler:activating Blados's trap at the end of Konpa Ruins]], [[spoiler: battling [[spoiler:battling Blados and Chalis in the Belinsk ruins]], and [[spoiler:leaving Belinsk after the Grave Eclipse activates]]. Note that two of these come in almost immediate succession. Special mention to the Djinni Brick, who is the only thing missed at [[spoiler:leaving on the cloud climb]]--in fact, there's a sidequest left outstanding at this point that actually ''requires'' you to return to this area after [[spoiler:the Grave Eclipse has already activated]].



* PointOfNoReturn: There are five major points in the game that will cut off most content before that point if you cross it without collecting everything. In order, they are: [[spoiler:Blados collapsing the Konpa Ruins and Rief joining the party]], [[spoiler:jumping on the cloud at Passaj to go to Craggy Peak]], [[spoiler: asking the band to play Arangoa Prelude to enter the Belinsk Ruins]], [[spoiler:raising Luna Tower and starting the Grave Eclipse]], and [[spoiler:getting on Briggs' and Eoleo's ship at Belinsk after the Luna Tower rises and the Grave Eclipse begins]]. The proximity of points three and four to each other essentially turns [[spoiler:the Belinsk Ruins]] into a OneTimeDungeon, while the fourth and fifth are in even ''closer'' proximity to one another.

to:

* PointOfNoReturn: There are five major points in the game that will cut off most content before that point if you cross it without collecting everything. In order, they are: [[spoiler:Blados collapsing the Konpa Ruins and Rief joining the party]], [[spoiler:jumping on the cloud at Passaj to go to Craggy Peak]], [[spoiler: asking [[spoiler:asking the band to play Arangoa Prelude to enter the Belinsk Ruins]], [[spoiler:raising Luna Tower and starting the Grave Eclipse]], and [[spoiler:getting on Briggs' and Eoleo's ship at Belinsk after the Luna Tower rises and the Grave Eclipse begins]]. The proximity of points three and four to each other essentially turns [[spoiler:the Belinsk Ruins]] into a OneTimeDungeon, while the fourth and fifth are in even ''closer'' proximity to one another.



** NeglectfulPrecursors: The previous installments' various {{Magitek}} can be argued as a failsafe against the things that went wrong in the previous installments, but the fact that [[spoiler: Luna Tower]] was merely powered down and locked up instead of being destroyed, despite apparently having no beneficial values [[spoiler: (save to the Umbra Clan, who seem to be bad news anyway)]], massive negative effects, and no [[HeroicSacrifice safe]] way of neutralizing once activated, ''really'' raises some questions about the ancients and [[FantasticRacism their priorities]].

to:

** NeglectfulPrecursors: The previous installments' various {{Magitek}} can be argued as a failsafe against the things that went wrong in the previous installments, but the fact that [[spoiler: Luna [[spoiler:Luna Tower]] was merely powered down and locked up instead of being destroyed, despite apparently having no beneficial values [[spoiler: (save [[spoiler:(save to the Umbra Clan, who seem to be bad news anyway)]], massive negative effects, and no [[HeroicSacrifice safe]] way of neutralizing once activated, ''really'' raises some questions about the ancients and [[FantasticRacism their priorities]].



* PutOnABus: All of the Warriors of Vale aside from Isaac and Garet, unfortunately. Mia[[note]]A book in one of Kolima's bookshelves mentions the "goddess of Imil", a priestess who heals the people of Imil, but only implies that it's her.[[/note]] and Sheba's locations are not stated (Ivan and Jenna, at least, are said to be in Kalay, which doesn't appear in ''Dark Dawn''); Felix is said to have left on a journey, and no one has seen him since; Piers is apparently sailing around Angara during the course of the game, but you never cross paths with him, despite the fact that the country of Sana has been trading with Piers's homeland of Lemuria (as mentioned in the Sanan capital of Tonfon), or that he apparently [[spoiler: dropped into Port Rago to help Briggs fix up his ship.]]

to:

* PutOnABus: All of the Warriors of Vale aside from Isaac and Garet, unfortunately. Mia[[note]]A book in one of Kolima's bookshelves mentions the "goddess of Imil", a priestess who heals the people of Imil, but only implies that it's her.[[/note]] and Sheba's locations are not stated (Ivan and Jenna, at least, are said to be in Kalay, which doesn't appear in ''Dark Dawn''); Felix is said to have left on a journey, and no one has seen him since; Piers is apparently sailing around Angara during the course of the game, but you never cross paths with him, despite the fact that the country of Sana has been trading with Piers's homeland of Lemuria (as mentioned in the Sanan capital of Tonfon), or that he apparently [[spoiler: dropped [[spoiler:dropped into Port Rago to help Briggs fix up his ship.]]



** Himi's brother Takeru is mentioned to have departed on a journey because of a vision Himi had that [[spoiler: Felix's friend Isaac was in danger, invoking [[CallBack their mother's aid-in-distress promise]] to Felix from ''The Lost Age'']].

to:

** Himi's brother Takeru is mentioned to have departed on a journey because of a vision Himi had that [[spoiler: Felix's [[spoiler:Felix's friend Isaac was in danger, invoking [[CallBack their mother's aid-in-distress promise]] to Felix from ''The Lost Age'']].



** [[spoiler: During the Grave Eclipse, Obaba figures a "ragtag group of scrappy heroes" has the best chance of stopping the Eclipse, and gives her blessing.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: During [[spoiler:During the Grave Eclipse, Obaba figures a "ragtag group of scrappy heroes" has the best chance of stopping the Eclipse, and gives her blessing.]]



** Sveta also seemingly has to remember that, as a beastman, she can scent the identity of [[spoiler: the Chaos Hound]].

to:

** Sveta also seemingly has to remember that, as a beastman, she can scent the identity of [[spoiler: the [[spoiler:the Chaos Hound]].



* RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething: [[spoiler: The entire second party.]]

to:

* RoyalsWhoActuallyDoSomething: [[spoiler: The [[spoiler:The entire second party.]]



** [[spoiler: Sveta is seemingly involved in Morgal's sticky political situation up to her ears... and not getting out of it any time soon.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: Sveta [[spoiler:Sveta is seemingly involved in Morgal's sticky political situation up to her ears... and not getting out of it any time soon.]]



** [[spoiler: Not only is Himi making prophecies to guide and protect her people, she apparently inherited this from her aunt Uzume, who evacuated them to Nihan when Izumo sank in a tidal wave. Then Himi hauls off with our heroes to go save the world.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: Not [[spoiler:Not only is Himi making prophecies to guide and protect her people, she apparently inherited this from her aunt Uzume, who evacuated them to Nihan when Izumo sank in a tidal wave. Then Himi hauls off with our heroes to go save the world.]]



** [[spoiler: What's worse is that the fusion between Sveta and Matthew seemingly served no real purpose since Volechek jumped in the way and sacrificed himself instead. This random scene just screams either ChekhovsGun or ShipTease.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, at the end of the game, most of the citizens of Belinsk have golden eyes, fur and everything else due to the effects of the huge amount of Light Psynergy released by the Apollo Lens.]]
** [[spoiler: If one looks closely at the character dialogue images, after answering "Yes" to helping Sveta, Matthew's dialogue image displays him with yellow eyes.]]
* SuperweaponSurprise: [[spoiler: Volechek thinks the Luna Tower will be one he can use against Sana and Bilibin. He's... misinformed.]]
* SuspiciousVideoGameGenerosity: In the last dungeon, [[spoiler: Tuaparang mooks spawn which drop [[PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling 5-digit numbers of EXP]] and [[DeathIsASlapOnTheWrist Water of Life]]. Surprisingly enough, [[DifficultySpike you will need them]]. Chaos Chimera, while no [[ThatOneBoss Doom Dragon]], is surprisingly tough, and then comes [[BonusDungeon Crossbone Isle]] and [[MemeticBadass Dullahan]], who has become ''[[SerialEscalation even more badass than before!]]'']]

to:

** [[spoiler: What's [[spoiler:What's worse is that the fusion between Sveta and Matthew seemingly served no real purpose since Volechek jumped in the way and sacrificed himself instead. This random scene just screams either ChekhovsGun or ShipTease.]]
** [[spoiler: Also, [[spoiler:Also, at the end of the game, most of the citizens of Belinsk have golden eyes, fur and everything else due to the effects of the huge amount of Light Psynergy released by the Apollo Lens.]]
** [[spoiler: If [[spoiler:If one looks closely at the character dialogue images, after answering "Yes" to helping Sveta, Matthew's dialogue image displays him with yellow eyes.]]
* SuperweaponSurprise: [[spoiler: Volechek [[spoiler:Volechek thinks the Luna Tower will be one he can use against Sana and Bilibin. He's... misinformed.]]
* SuspiciousVideoGameGenerosity: In the last dungeon, [[spoiler: Tuaparang [[spoiler:Tuaparang mooks spawn which drop [[PeninsulaOfPowerLeveling 5-digit numbers of EXP]] and [[DeathIsASlapOnTheWrist Water of Life]]. Surprisingly enough, [[DifficultySpike you will need them]]. Chaos Chimera, while no [[ThatOneBoss Doom Dragon]], is surprisingly tough, and then comes [[BonusDungeon Crossbone Isle]] and [[MemeticBadass Dullahan]], who has become ''[[SerialEscalation even more badass than before!]]'']]



** The point is raised in-game; [[spoiler: while the former two just refer to card suites, "Arcanus" is more like a term for the entire deck. [[TheChessmaster "Holding all the cards"...?]]]]

to:

** The point is raised in-game; [[spoiler: while [[spoiler:while the former two just refer to card suites, "Arcanus" is more like a term for the entire deck. [[TheChessmaster "Holding all the cards"...?]]]]



* TheRevolutionWillNotBeCivilized: Morgal is in the late stages or aftermath of a bloody revolution against Sana and budding hostilities with Bilibin. [[spoiler: Both of which Morgal's king wants to settle via SuperweaponSurprise.]] [[WouldHurtAChild A little girl is captured and condemned]] to CruelAndUnusualDeath in Belinsk, just for being Sanan nobility.

to:

* TheRevolutionWillNotBeCivilized: Morgal is in the late stages or aftermath of a bloody revolution against Sana and budding hostilities with Bilibin. [[spoiler: Both [[spoiler:Both of which Morgal's king wants to settle via SuperweaponSurprise.]] [[WouldHurtAChild A little girl is captured and condemned]] to CruelAndUnusualDeath in Belinsk, just for being Sanan nobility.



* ThisLooksLikeAJobForAquaman: As typical for a ''VideoGame/GoldenSun'' game, if a party member gets a new utility power (or if the party gets a new member with a specific power), expect to see a dungeon or two built around using that power.

to:

* ThisLooksLikeAJobForAquaman: ThisLooksLikeAJobForAquaman:
**
As typical for a ''VideoGame/GoldenSun'' game, if a party member gets a new utility power (or if the party gets a new member with a specific power), expect to see a dungeon or two built around using that power.



* TotalEclipseOfThePlot: And then it went FromBadToWorse...
* TragicMonster: [[spoiler: Volechek, no thanks to Tuaparang's...ministrations.]]
* TrapDoor: Kaocho Palace has one.
* TheChessmaster: [[spoiler: Alex is definitely one of these. To make things worse, his ultimate plan remains a total mystery as soon as he causes the Grave Eclipse, he apparently decides to help you stop it in his typical behind-the-scenes fashion, completely backstabbing the Tuaparang.]]
* TheUnfought: [[spoiler: Damn it, Alex!]]

to:

* %%* TotalEclipseOfThePlot: And then it went FromBadToWorse...
* TragicMonster: [[spoiler: Volechek, [[spoiler:Volechek, no thanks to Tuaparang's...Tuaparang's... ministrations.]]
* %%* TrapDoor: Kaocho Palace has one.
* TheChessmaster: [[spoiler: Alex [[spoiler:Alex is definitely one of these. To make things worse, his ultimate plan remains a total mystery as soon as he causes the Grave Eclipse, he apparently decides to help you stop it in his typical behind-the-scenes fashion, completely backstabbing the Tuaparang.]]
* TheUnfought: [[spoiler: Damn TheUnfought:
%% [[spoiler:Damn
it, Alex!]]



* TheUnmasquedWorld: In the first game(s), Adept communities kept their powers secret. Now, the whole world knows about Psynergy and there's an Adept arms race on.

to:

* TheUnmasquedWorld: TheUnmasquedWorld:
**
In the first game(s), Adept communities kept their powers secret. Now, the whole world knows about Psynergy and there's an Adept arms race on.



* UselessUsefulSpell: StandardStatusEffects are useless against bosses, OneHitKill spells do jack all to anything, the usual.
** StandardStatusEffects [[SubvertedTrope are very handy]] against the [[BonusBoss Ancient Devil]]. The Devil itself is immune to them, but [[spoiler: allies it's brainwashed with Demon Sign are not, allowing you to neutralize them.]]

to:

* UselessUsefulSpell: UselessUsefulSpell:
**
StandardStatusEffects are useless against bosses, OneHitKill spells do jack all to anything, the usual.
** StandardStatusEffects [[SubvertedTrope are very handy]] against the [[BonusBoss Ancient Devil]]. The Devil itself is immune to them, but [[spoiler: allies [[spoiler:allies it's brainwashed with Demon Sign are not, allowing you to neutralize them.]]



* VideoGameCrueltyPotential: One of the Mars Djinn you can get is first seen hanging happily on a tree. So how do you get it down? Use "Slap" Psynergy on the poor critter. And until you actually go around to get it (there's a bit of walking involved), it looks like it's actually crying.

to:

* VideoGameCrueltyPotential: VideoGameCrueltyPotential:
**
One of the Mars Djinn you can get is first seen hanging happily on a tree. So how do you get it down? Use "Slap" Psynergy on the poor critter. And until you actually go around to get it (there's a bit of walking involved), it looks like it's actually crying.



* WakeUpCallBoss: The trio of Tuaparang Scouts that you fight shortly after the party meets Kraden for the first time. You only have three party members at this point with not too impressive psynergy or summons and healing items will most likely be just herbs. On top of this, the scouts will spam Psy Grenades to [[ManaBurn damage your PP]] and use other abilities that either stuns a party member, making them lose turns, or lower your agility so that they may attack before you can.

to:

* WakeUpCallBoss: WakeUpCallBoss:
**
The trio of Tuaparang Scouts that you fight shortly after the party meets Kraden for the first time. You only have three party members at this point with not too impressive psynergy or summons and healing items will most likely be just herbs. On top of this, the scouts will spam Psy Grenades to [[ManaBurn damage your PP]] and use other abilities that either stuns a party member, making them lose turns, or lower your agility so that they may attack before you can.



* WaveMotionGun: The Apollo Lens.

to:

* %%* WaveMotionGun: The Apollo Lens.



** Subverted when Briggs mentions that he identified Matthew's group by their use of Psynergy around said ship. But Briggs knows all about Adepts already, and would know what to look for, so he's more of the exception that proves the rule.
* WesternZodiac: The Craggy Peak Ruins houses a set of twelve zodiac-themed puzzles.

to:

** Subverted when Briggs mentions that he identified Matthew's group by their use of Psynergy around said ship. But Briggs knows all about Adepts already, already and would know what to look for, so he's more of the exception that proves the rule.
* WesternZodiac: WesternZodiac:
**
The Craggy Peak Ruins houses a set of twelve zodiac-themed puzzles.



* WhatHappenedToTheMouse: "Where's the mouse" happened in-verse with Rief ''finally'' noticing his sister is absent.
** [[spoiler: CHAUCHA. Briggs specifically told us to look for her, and then... [[FridgeHorror nothing!]] ]]
* WhatKindOfLamePowerIsHeartAnyway: In the same town and brought about by the same event as the LightEmUp example above, another NPC claims to have gained the power to [[spoiler: calculate compound interest.]]

to:

* WhatHappenedToTheMouse: WhatHappenedToTheMouse:
**
"Where's the mouse" happened in-verse with Rief ''finally'' noticing his sister is absent.
** [[spoiler: CHAUCHA.[[spoiler:CHAUCHA. Briggs specifically told us to look for her, and then... [[FridgeHorror nothing!]] ]]
* WhatKindOfLamePowerIsHeartAnyway: In the same town and brought about by the same event as the LightEmUp example above, another NPC claims to have gained the power to [[spoiler: calculate [[spoiler:calculate compound interest.]]



* WhatsUpKingDude: Lampshaded a couple of times (in Ayuthay, for instance), but overall it tends to be justified. In Kaocho, TheManBehindTheMan makes it happen. In Yamatai, Kraden is able to make your excuses.
** And in Ayuthay, King Paithos has a standing order that he wants to meet any Adepts who show up [[spoiler: in case Amiti's DisappearedDad is with them]].
* WhoWantsToLiveForever: The original eight player characters (and Kraden) barely age due to being exposed to so much elemental energy, but it's noted by their kids that the original eight might outlive their children by a significant margin. As for Kraden, he might be ageless... but he was already 70 at the time.
** [[spoiler: Presumably, Alex is this way as well.]]
*** [[spoiler: Alex would be LivingForeverIsAwesome]]
** [[spoiler: Obaba is upset to learn she's outlived her grandson.]]
*** [[spoiler: And if not for the player party, she very well could have outlived her ''great''-grandson, since you had to rescue him twice in Belinsk (from CruelAndUnusualDeath and then from the eclipse monsters).]]

to:

* WhatsUpKingDude: WhatsUpKingDude:
**
Lampshaded a couple of times (in Ayuthay, for instance), but overall it tends to be justified. In Kaocho, TheManBehindTheMan makes it happen. In Yamatai, Kraden is able to make your excuses.
** And in Ayuthay, King Paithos has a standing order that he wants to meet any Adepts who show up [[spoiler: in [[spoiler:in case Amiti's DisappearedDad is with them]].
* WhoWantsToLiveForever: WhoWantsToLiveForever:
**
The original eight player characters (and Kraden) barely age due to being exposed to so much elemental energy, but it's noted by their kids that the original eight might outlive their children by a significant margin. As for Kraden, he might be ageless... but he was already 70 at the time.
** [[spoiler: Presumably, [[spoiler:Presumably, Alex is this way as well.]]
*** [[spoiler: Alex [[spoiler:*** [[spoiler:Alex would be LivingForeverIsAwesome]]
** [[spoiler: Obaba [[spoiler:Obaba is upset to learn she's outlived her grandson.]]
*** [[spoiler: And [[spoiler:*** [[spoiler:And if not for the player party, she very well could have outlived her ''great''-grandson, since you had to rescue him twice in Belinsk (from CruelAndUnusualDeath and then from the eclipse monsters).]]



* [[spoiler: WrongContextMagic: Light and Dark Psynergy break the classical-elements system established throughout the series.]]

to:

* [[spoiler: WrongContextMagic: Light [[spoiler:Light and Dark Psynergy break the classical-elements system established throughout the series.]]



* YouGottaHaveBlueHair: Some of this generation's hair colors are notably different from their predecessors, and I don't just mean Karis's inexplicably green hair. Garet's was originally reddish-brown, but Tyrell's hair is unmistakably red. Mia and Alex had cyan hair, but Mia's two children have very blue hair, [[spoiler: as does another Mercury Clan descendent we encounter]].

to:

* YouGottaHaveBlueHair: Some of this generation's hair colors are notably different from their predecessors, and I don't just mean Karis's inexplicably green hair. Garet's was originally reddish-brown, but Tyrell's hair is unmistakably red. Mia and Alex had cyan hair, but Mia's two children have very blue hair, [[spoiler: as [[spoiler:as does another Mercury Clan descendent we encounter]].
15th Oct '17 12:02:33 AM Chabal2
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* PunnyName - Plenty: For locations there's Passaj (which was [[LampshadeHanging lampshaded]] accordingly), and for people there's Amiti, whose mother was Veriti...

to:

* PunnyName - ProactiveBoss: On entering the Phantasmal Bog, the first thing you'll notice is the giant purple-aura'ed salamander glaring at you from the water. The second is when it tries to drown you by crushing the part of the stepping stone you're standing on. The entire point of the dungeon is to get to a different area in the same room where there's enough space to fight it on land.
* PunnyName:
Plenty: For locations there's Passaj (which was [[LampshadeHanging lampshaded]] accordingly), and for people there's Amiti, whose mother was Veriti...
16th Sep '17 10:35:53 AM nombretomado
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''Golden Sun: Dark Dawn'' is a 2010 EasternRPG developed by Camelot Software Planning for the UsefulNotes/NintendoDS, a sequel to the ''VideoGame/GoldenSun'' duology that was released for the GameBoyAdvance in 2001 and 2003. It was [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VK3PiBJvElE announced]] at Nintendo's E3 2009 conference as ''Golden Sun DS'', then promptly disappeared off the radar for a year before [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th_DDyyxKNg resurfacing]] at next year's E3 as with the ''Dark Dawn'' subtitle and was confirmed for a release near the end of 2010.

to:

''Golden Sun: Dark Dawn'' is a 2010 EasternRPG developed by Camelot Software Planning for the UsefulNotes/NintendoDS, a sequel to the ''VideoGame/GoldenSun'' duology that was released for the GameBoyAdvance UsefulNotes/GameBoyAdvance in 2001 and 2003. It was [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VK3PiBJvElE announced]] at Nintendo's E3 2009 conference as ''Golden Sun DS'', then promptly disappeared off the radar for a year before [[http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=th_DDyyxKNg resurfacing]] at next year's E3 as with the ''Dark Dawn'' subtitle and was confirmed for a release near the end of 2010.
31st Aug '17 4:51:22 AM HalcyonDayz
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* RedHerring: When first arriving in Tonfon, ''everybody'' mentions Piers visiting. Are you finally going to meet one of the other original PCs? Of course not.

to:

* RedHerring: When first arriving in Tonfon, ''everybody'' mentions Piers visiting. Are you finally going to meet one of the other original PCs? [=PCs=]? Of course not.
10th Jun '17 9:55:28 AM Ferot_Dreadnaught
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* GenreSavvy: When the party [[spoiler: ask Tret about alternate ways to get into Belinsk]], he remarks that "You assume a castle built on ancient ruins MUST have a secret entrance infested with traps and monsters? Well, you're right... THIS time." Considering his age, he's probably picked this up at some point after [[VideoGame/GoldenSun Isaac and friends cleaned him out]].
** [[spoiler: Tret also lets it slip that Amiti is related to Mia somehow]] and follows up with "I hope I haven't just given away any family secrets..."
** [[spoiler: Obaba]] comments on the RagtagBunchOfMisfits [[spoiler: her great-grandson has fallen in with.]]
** The Sand Prince Gem all but name-checks DefeatMeansFriendship in challenging the heroes to [[StrengthEqualsWorthiness prove their worth]] to him/it.
** Amiti's reason for joining your party? Seeing the world so he can become [[TheWisePrince a wiser prince]]. It works.



** [[spoiler: Later, upon meeting Laurel and Tret, Tret specifically indicates that Amiti is somehow related to Mia. Piers is completely unrelated, but Alex is Mia's cousin. [[GenreSavvy Tret]] lampshades the possibility of "dark family secrets" at this point.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: Later, upon meeting Laurel and Tret, Tret specifically indicates that Amiti is somehow related to Mia. Piers is completely unrelated, but Alex is Mia's cousin. [[GenreSavvy Tret]] Tret lampshades the possibility of "dark family secrets" at this point.]]



** [[spoiler: During the Grave Eclipse, [[GenreSavvy Obaba figures a "ragtag group of scrappy heroes" has the best chance of stopping the Eclipse]], and gives her blessing.]]

to:

** [[spoiler: During the Grave Eclipse, [[GenreSavvy Obaba figures a "ragtag group of scrappy heroes" has the best chance of stopping the Eclipse]], Eclipse, and gives her blessing.]]



* ShelteredAristocrat: Pretty much Amiti's defining trait, though he is GenreSavvy enough to realize it, and decides to travel with Matthew and friends in hopes of [[CharacterDevelopment overcoming it]].

to:

* ShelteredAristocrat: Pretty much Amiti's defining trait, though he is GenreSavvy enough to realize realizes it, and decides to travel with Matthew and friends in hopes of [[CharacterDevelopment overcoming it]].
7th May '17 4:33:03 PM MayIncon
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Added DiffLines:

* DivergentCharacterEvolution: Djinn of the same element used to have the exact same designs in the GBA titles. Here they are differentiated further to incorporate motifs tied to their Japanese names while four djinn retained their original designs.
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http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=VideoGame.GoldenSunDarkDawn