History UsefulNotes / PrehistoricLifeSauropods

13th Dec '17 9:37:34 PM PaulA
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This dinosaur was as enormous as the former, and shared their same habitat in which other two popular dinosaurs lived, ''[[StockDinosaurs Stegosaurus]]'' and ''[[StockDinosaurs Allosaurus]]''; and yet, when was the last time you’ve heard “Camarasaurus” in a film/cartoon/comic? Even the famous SpeculativeDocumentary ''WalkingWithDinosaurs'' has totally ignored it, preferring its stock cousins instead. The misfortune of ''Camarasaurus'' is probably due to not detaining any size-record among sauropods: it has never been either “the longest” like ''Diplodocus'', or “the tallest/heaviest” like ''Brachiosaurus''. Furthermore, its first complete skeleton (found in the early XX century in the Dinosaur National Monument between Utah and Colorado) was from a juvenile, leading some books telling the camarasaur was "one of the smallest sauropods". On the other hand, other dino-book have said this dinosaur was 40 m (130 ft long) long and that was "one of the biggest dinosaurs"!

to:

This dinosaur was as enormous as the former, and shared their same habitat in which other two popular dinosaurs lived, ''[[StockDinosaurs Stegosaurus]]'' and ''[[StockDinosaurs Allosaurus]]''; and yet, when was the last time you’ve heard “Camarasaurus” in a film/cartoon/comic? Even the famous SpeculativeDocumentary ''WalkingWithDinosaurs'' ''Series/WalkingWithDinosaurs'' has totally ignored it, preferring its stock cousins instead. The misfortune of ''Camarasaurus'' is probably due to not detaining any size-record among sauropods: it has never been either “the longest” like ''Diplodocus'', or “the tallest/heaviest” like ''Brachiosaurus''. Furthermore, its first complete skeleton (found in the early XX century in the Dinosaur National Monument between Utah and Colorado) was from a juvenile, leading some books telling the camarasaur was "one of the smallest sauropods". On the other hand, other dino-book have said this dinosaur was 40 m (130 ft long) long and that was "one of the biggest dinosaurs"!



Together, Brachiosaurids, Camarasaurids, Titanosaurians, and others make the Macronarians, one of the two great sauropod subgroups together with Diplodocoids. One example of macronarian which do not pertain to the aforementioned subgroups is ''Euhelopus''. The first-found sauropod in China (and one of the very first found Chinese dinosaurs, in the 1920s), it had long neck and short tail which made it looking lik a miniaturized ''Mamenchisaurus'' (its contemporaneous relative ''Erketu'' would have looked the same). ''Euhelopus'' was once believed related with the mamenchisaur; but now is considered a more evolved sauropod, closely related with titanosaurians. Being the most classic among Asian Early Cretaceous sauropods, ''Euhelopus'' could have been the model for [[WalkingWithDinosaurs Prehistoric Park]]’s “titanosaurs” seen in the early Cretaceous episode about "Dino-birds". Another interesting macronarian is ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europasaurus Europasaurus]]'' [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin from Europe]]; living in the Late Jurassic islets in which is today Germany, it was one of the smallest (6 m) sauropods ever, but should have appeared a true giant to its two neighbors ''Compsognathus'' and ''Archaeopteryx''.

to:

Together, Brachiosaurids, Camarasaurids, Titanosaurians, and others make the Macronarians, one of the two great sauropod subgroups together with Diplodocoids. One example of macronarian which do not pertain to the aforementioned subgroups is ''Euhelopus''. The first-found sauropod in China (and one of the very first found Chinese dinosaurs, in the 1920s), it had long neck and short tail which made it looking lik a miniaturized ''Mamenchisaurus'' (its contemporaneous relative ''Erketu'' would have looked the same). ''Euhelopus'' was once believed related with the mamenchisaur; but now is considered a more evolved sauropod, closely related with titanosaurians. Being the most classic among Asian Early Cretaceous sauropods, ''Euhelopus'' could have been the model for [[WalkingWithDinosaurs Prehistoric Park]]’s ''Series/PrehistoricPark''’s “titanosaurs” seen in the early Cretaceous episode about "Dino-birds". Another interesting macronarian is ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europasaurus Europasaurus]]'' [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin from Europe]]; living in the Late Jurassic islets in which is today Germany, it was one of the smallest (6 m) sauropods ever, but should have appeared a true giant to its two neighbors ''Compsognathus'' and ''Archaeopteryx''.
21st Oct '16 5:50:06 PM TrollMan
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And what about North America? Did any titanosaur live here, along with T. rexes and Triceratops? Yes, it did, but was the only one known: ''Alamosaurus'', possibly a isolated migrant originary from South America. Even though is known only from (again…) not-complete remains, its status of “the only one who met TyrannosaurusRex in RealLife!” (and its “token sauropod” appearance as well) has made it the perfect HandWave for those artists/writers who have fun to portray ''Apatosaurus'' and ''Tyrannosaurus'' [[AnachronismStew living side-by-side]]. Considering [[SarcasmMode the extreme rarity]] of this eventuality, this would make ''Alamosaurus'', not “Brontosaurus”, [[UnfortunateImplications the real Great-Stock sauropod...]]. Just as an example, the sauropod skeleton seen next to the ''Tyrannosaurus'' one at the end of the first Franchise/JurassicPark film has been labeled by some sources "Alamosaurus", but is clearly an ''Apatosaurus''.

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And what about North America? Did any titanosaur live here, along with T. rexes ''T. rexes'' and Triceratops? ''Triceratops''? Yes, it did, but was the only one known: ''Alamosaurus'', possibly a isolated migrant originary originally from South America. Even though is known only from (again…) not-complete remains, its status of “the only one who met TyrannosaurusRex in RealLife!” (and its “token sauropod” appearance as well) has made it the perfect HandWave for those artists/writers who have fun to portray ''Apatosaurus'' and ''Tyrannosaurus'' [[AnachronismStew living side-by-side]]. Considering [[SarcasmMode the extreme rarity]] of this eventuality, this would make ''Alamosaurus'', not “Brontosaurus”, [[UnfortunateImplications the real Great-Stock sauropod...]]. Just as an example, the sauropod skeleton seen next to the ''Tyrannosaurus'' one at the end of the first Franchise/JurassicPark film has been labeled by some sources "Alamosaurus", but is clearly an ''Apatosaurus''.
''Apatosaurus''. More recent discoveries suggest that ''Alamosaurus'' may have been one of the largest sauropods, with fragmentary remains suggesting at animals equal or greater in size than ''Argentinosaurus''.



Other diplodocoids were still more primitive than the above: ''Rebbachisaurus'' from Cretaceous Sahara maybe still hadn’t a whip-like tail. This sauropod was found in several African countries, but its remains are sparse; some alleged ''Rebbachisaurus''es were described in South America, but now are classified in other genera within the Rebbachisaurids. This family also contains ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigersaurus Nigersaurus]]'' from [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Niger]], whose well-preserved skull shows strange grinding teeth.

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Other diplodocoids were still more primitive than the above: ''Rebbachisaurus'' from Cretaceous Sahara maybe still hadn’t a whip-like tail. This sauropod was found in several African countries, but its remains are sparse; some alleged ''Rebbachisaurus''es were described in South America, but now are classified in other genera within the Rebbachisaurids. This family also contains ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nigersaurus Nigersaurus]]'' from [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin Niger]], whose well-preserved skull shows strange grinding teeth.
teeth. It also had the most teeth of any known saurischian: at any one time, there could be over ''five hundred'' teeth in its mouth.
8th Oct '16 10:47:59 PM DustSnitch
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''Saltasaurus'' is also a member of that subgroup of sauropods called titanosaurs (see below): since its discovery, armor plates of several other titanosaurs have since been found, although more incomplete. However, ''Saltasaurus'' was considerably smaller than many other sauropods (it was only 12 m long and not much heavier than an elephant); and, not counting the bony plates, its shape was that of a generic sauropod. This might partially explain why, despite its BadAss-look, ''Saltasaurus'' has remained a non-fictional animal unlike ''Carnotaurus''.

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''Saltasaurus'' is also a member of that subgroup of sauropods called titanosaurs (see below): since its discovery, armor plates of several other titanosaurs have since been found, although more incomplete. However, ''Saltasaurus'' was considerably smaller than many other sauropods (it was only 12 m long and not much heavier than an elephant); and, not counting the bony plates, its shape was that of a generic sauropod. This might partially explain why, despite its BadAss-look, badass-look, ''Saltasaurus'' has remained a non-fictional animal unlike ''Carnotaurus''.
19th Jul '15 8:43:19 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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This dinosaur was as enormous as the former, and shared their same habitat in which other two popular dinosaurs lived, ''[[StockDinosaurs Stegosaurus]]'' and ''[[StockDinosaurs Allosaurus]]''; and yet, when was the last time you’ve heard “Camarasaurus” in a film/cartoon/comic? Even the famous SpeculativeDocumentary ''WalkingWithDinosaurs'' has totally ignored it, preferring its stock cousins instead. The misfortune of ''Camarasaurus'' is probably due to not detaining any size-record among sauropods: it has never been either “the longest” like ''Diplodocus'', or “the tallest/heaviest” like ''Brachiosaurus''.

to:

This dinosaur was as enormous as the former, and shared their same habitat in which other two popular dinosaurs lived, ''[[StockDinosaurs Stegosaurus]]'' and ''[[StockDinosaurs Allosaurus]]''; and yet, when was the last time you’ve heard “Camarasaurus” in a film/cartoon/comic? Even the famous SpeculativeDocumentary ''WalkingWithDinosaurs'' has totally ignored it, preferring its stock cousins instead. The misfortune of ''Camarasaurus'' is probably due to not detaining any size-record among sauropods: it has never been either “the longest” like ''Diplodocus'', or “the tallest/heaviest” like ''Brachiosaurus''.
''Brachiosaurus''. Furthermore, its first complete skeleton (found in the early XX century in the Dinosaur National Monument between Utah and Colorado) was from a juvenile, leading some books telling the camarasaur was "one of the smallest sauropods". On the other hand, other dino-book have said this dinosaur was 40 m (130 ft long) long and that was "one of the biggest dinosaurs"!
5th May '15 10:39:07 AM nombretomado
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An almost-forgotten-today but very-important-once sauropod is "Atlantosaurus" (“Atlas lizard”); the first sauropod discovered within American Bone-Wars, initially classified by Marsh as "Titanosaurus" -- the word was just used few months before for the valid ''Titanosaurus''! [[note]]Both Atlas and the Titans were immense-sized GreekMythology goddities: Atlas has traditionally been portrayed bearing the world on his arms. The name of the geographical "Atlas" comes just from this character.[[/note]]. However, most "Atlantosaurus" material was based on ''Apatosaurus'' remains, while the original "Atlantosaurus" is so incomplete to be regarded dubious genus. To understand how much our atlantosaur was kept in consideration in the past, think this: it used to ben often cited in old books as [[UpToEleven the biggest creature ever appeared on Earth]] -- one of the very first examples of dinosaur-related sensationalism. A tradition that still continues today: see an exhaustive list in the StockDinosaurs page.

to:

An almost-forgotten-today but very-important-once sauropod is "Atlantosaurus" (“Atlas lizard”); the first sauropod discovered within American Bone-Wars, initially classified by Marsh as "Titanosaurus" -- the word was just used few months before for the valid ''Titanosaurus''! [[note]]Both Atlas and the Titans were immense-sized GreekMythology Myth/GreekMythology goddities: Atlas has traditionally been portrayed bearing the world on his arms. The name of the geographical "Atlas" comes just from this character.[[/note]]. However, most "Atlantosaurus" material was based on ''Apatosaurus'' remains, while the original "Atlantosaurus" is so incomplete to be regarded dubious genus. To understand how much our atlantosaur was kept in consideration in the past, think this: it used to ben often cited in old books as [[UpToEleven the biggest creature ever appeared on Earth]] -- one of the very first examples of dinosaur-related sensationalism. A tradition that still continues today: see an exhaustive list in the StockDinosaurs page.
4th May '15 12:10:28 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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Discovered in 1954, ''Mamenchisaurus'' lived in the same age of the stock sauropods (Late Jurassic). Initially believed a close ''Diplodocus'' relative, now is thought a more archaic kind of sauropod which incidentally reached a similar shape, though with a much shorter tail [[ScienceMarchesOn ending with a small club]] (the "club" is a very recent discovery, and almost every mamenchisaur depiction show it clubless). Since the head of ''Mamenchisaurus'' has long been unknown, the most classic portraits show it with an inaccurate ''Diplodocus''-like head; actually ''Mamenchisaurus'' head was more similar to ''Camarasaurus''. In short, the polar opposite of what has happened to the allegedly boxy ''Apatosaurus'' head.

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Discovered in 1954, ''Mamenchisaurus'' lived in the same age of the stock sauropods (Late Jurassic). Initially believed a close ''Diplodocus'' relative, now is thought a more archaic kind of sauropod which incidentally reached a similar shape, though with a much shorter tail not ending with a "whip" but with [[ScienceMarchesOn ending with a small club]] (the "club" is a very recent discovery, and almost every mamenchisaur depiction show it clubless). Since the head of ''Mamenchisaurus'' has long been unknown, the most classic portraits show it with an inaccurate ''Diplodocus''-like head; actually ''Mamenchisaurus'' head was more similar to ''Camarasaurus''. In short, the polar opposite of what has happened to the allegedly boxy ''Apatosaurus'' head.
4th May '15 12:08:46 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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Discovered during the Bone Wars, ''Camarasaurus'' is considered by some a rather unsauropod-like sauropod, because of its relatively large head and its much-shorter neck compared to most other sauropods. It tended to be confused with the so-called “Brontosaurus” in the past, because the classic brontosaur portraits have a round head and a short, blunt tail, just like RealLife camarasaurs.

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Discovered during the Bone Wars, ''Camarasaurus'' is considered by some a rather unsauropod-like sauropod, because of its relatively large head and its much-shorter neck compared to most other sauropods. It tended to be confused with the so-called “Brontosaurus” in the past, because the classic brontosaur portraits have a round head and a short, blunt tail, just like RealLife camarasaurs. Until few years ago, the head and tail of the skeleton at the base of the popular "brontosaur" image were believed belonging ''actually'' to a specimen of the "cama", so in old books it's classically said "The brontosaur's traditional pictures have the head of ''Camarasaurus''". [[note]]We now know this fossil pieces came from a specimen of the north-american Brachiosaurus.[[/note]]
24th Jan '15 8:17:07 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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Together, Brachiosaurids, Camarasaurids, Titanosaurians, and others make the Macronarians, one of the two great sauropod subgroups together with Diplodocoids. One example of macronarian which do not pertain to the aforementioned subgroups is ''Euhelopus''. The first-found sauropod in China (and one of the very first found Chinese dinosaurs, in the 1920s), it had long neck and short tail which made it looking lik a miniaturized ''Mamenchisaurus'' (its contemporaneous relative ''Erketu'' would have looked the same). ''Euhelopus'' was once believed related with the mamenchisaur; but now is considered a more evolved sauropod, closely related with titanosaurians. Being the most classic among Asian Early Cretaceous sauropods, ''Euhelopus'' could have been the model for [[WalkingWithDinosaurs Prehistoric Park]]’s “titanosaurs” seen in the early Cretaceous episode about "Dino-birds". Another interesting macronarian is ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europasaurus Europasaurus]]'' [ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin from Europe]]; living in the Late Jurassic islets in which is today Germany, it was one of the smallest (6 m) sauropods ever, but should have appeared a true giant to its two neighbors ''Compsognathus'' and ''Archaeopteryx''.

to:

Together, Brachiosaurids, Camarasaurids, Titanosaurians, and others make the Macronarians, one of the two great sauropod subgroups together with Diplodocoids. One example of macronarian which do not pertain to the aforementioned subgroups is ''Euhelopus''. The first-found sauropod in China (and one of the very first found Chinese dinosaurs, in the 1920s), it had long neck and short tail which made it looking lik a miniaturized ''Mamenchisaurus'' (its contemporaneous relative ''Erketu'' would have looked the same). ''Euhelopus'' was once believed related with the mamenchisaur; but now is considered a more evolved sauropod, closely related with titanosaurians. Being the most classic among Asian Early Cretaceous sauropods, ''Euhelopus'' could have been the model for [[WalkingWithDinosaurs Prehistoric Park]]’s “titanosaurs” seen in the early Cretaceous episode about "Dino-birds". Another interesting macronarian is ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europasaurus Europasaurus]]'' [ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin [[ExactlyWhatItSaysOnTheTin from Europe]]; living in the Late Jurassic islets in which is today Germany, it was one of the smallest (6 m) sauropods ever, but should have appeared a true giant to its two neighbors ''Compsognathus'' and ''Archaeopteryx''.
1st Jul '14 7:04:20 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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Not every sauropod is either Diplodocoid or Macronarian (Diplodocoid+Macronarian =Neosauropod, "new sauropod"). Many were more primitive than both. ''Cetiosaurus'' and ''Mamenchisaurus'' have already been mentioned: another relevant basal sauropod is ''Shunosaurus'', from Chinese Middle Jurassic. Rather small (10 m long) and short-necked, it’s worthy of note for two things: its bony-club on its tailtip surrounded by four short spikes, resembling a combination between a Stegosaurian and Ankylosaurian tail; and the fact that, with its 20 or more skeletons known, ''Shunosaurus'' is one of the most common sauropod in fossil record, rivalling ''Camarasaurus''. Similar but not related, ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinophorosaurus Spinophorosaurus]]'' ("spike-bearing lizard") discovered in 2009 in Jurassic Africa had also a similar armored tail.

to:

Not every sauropod is either Diplodocoid or Macronarian (Diplodocoid+Macronarian =Neosauropod, "new sauropod"). Many were more primitive than both. ''Cetiosaurus'' and ''Mamenchisaurus'' have already been mentioned: another relevant basal sauropod is ''Shunosaurus'', from Chinese Middle Jurassic. Rather small (10 m long) and short-necked, it’s worthy of note for two things: its bony-club on its tailtip surrounded by four short spikes, resembling a combination between a Stegosaurian and Ankylosaurian tail; tail [[note]]though several portraits and museum-mounts show it spike-less and even club-less[[/note]]; and the fact that, with its 20 or more skeletons known, ''Shunosaurus'' is one of the most common sauropod in fossil record, rivalling ''Camarasaurus''. Similar but not related, ''[[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spinophorosaurus Spinophorosaurus]]'' ("spike-bearing lizard") discovered in 2009 in Jurassic Africa had also a similar armored tail.
26th Jun '14 6:39:17 AM laplaneteetlesoleil
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Sauropods include about two hundreds of kinds described so far. Other than the stock ones, the five most common sauropods in documentary-media have been ''Camarasaurus'', ''Mamenchisaurus'', ''Barosaurus'', ''Saltasaurus'', and ''Cetiosaurus''. Each one is listed in its own paragraph at the top of the page. Other sauropods have been relatively common as well either because of their historical relevance (ex. ''Titanosaurus''), for their distinctiveness (ex. ''Shunosaurus'', ''Amargasaurus''), because they're the prototypes of their own sauropod family (ex. ''Dicraeosaurus'', ''Vulcanodon''), or for other reasons -- ex. ''Hypselosaurus'' has been thought the owner of the possible "biggest eggs" known from non-bird dinosaurs.

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Sauropods include about two hundreds of kinds described so far. Other than the stock ones, the five most common sauropods in documentary-media have been ''Camarasaurus'', ''Mamenchisaurus'', ''Barosaurus'', ''Saltasaurus'', ''Camarasaurus'' (mid-sized, short-necked, quite like a middle between an apatosaur and ''Cetiosaurus''.a brachiosaur), ''Cetiosaurus'' (a mid-sized, primitive and generic-looking kind from Europe), ''Barosaurus'' (similar to ''Diplodocus'' but with a longer neck), ''Mamenchisaurus'' (found in Asia and with an even longer neck than the former), and ''Saltasaurus'' (South-American, Cretaceous, and with an unusually armored body). Each one is listed in its own paragraph at the top of the page. Other sauropods have been relatively common as well either because of their historical relevance (ex. ''Titanosaurus''), for their distinctiveness (ex. ''Shunosaurus'', ''Amargasaurus''), because they're the prototypes of their own sauropod family (ex. ''Dicraeosaurus'', ''Vulcanodon''), or for other reasons -- ex. ''Hypselosaurus'' has been thought the owner of the possible "biggest eggs" known from non-bird dinosaurs.



Unfortunately for ''Cetiosaurus'', these sauropods were discovered in North America just in the period of the former’s correct interpretation, Their bigger size and/or their greater completeness meant ''Cetiosaurus'' was progressively put under the table. Making things worse, the cetiosaur has also a very generic look with no external traits that would make it recognizable. In short, this “whale of dinosaur” was predestined to become an only-book animal.

to:

Unfortunately for ''Cetiosaurus'', these sauropods were discovered in North America just in the period of the former’s correct interpretation, Their bigger size and/or their greater completeness meant ''Cetiosaurus'' was progressively put under the table. Making things worse, the cetiosaur has also a very generic look with no external traits that would make it recognizable. In short, this “whale of dinosaur” was predestined to become an only-book animal.animal - expecially British books, as it could be qualified the "national" UK sauropod.
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