History Main / WeDidntStartTheFuhrer

28th Dec '17 12:24:33 PM Kazrak
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Another James P. Hogan book, ''The Proteus Operation'', has it that in himself Hitler did not amount to much - the Beerhall Putch fiasco in 1923 was the peak of his career and in the "original timeline" and he faded into obscurity after some years in prison. The world went on to prosper, the League of Nations was a great success and went on to unify the world, eliminate war and reduce the gap between rich and poor in a worldwide social democratic utopia. But the people who didn't like losing power and privilege went back in time, funded and advised Hitler into power, and in 1942 provided him nuclear bombs to conquer Russia - but when the privileged and powerful people of the future got ready to pack their bags and go to the nice spot which they prepared for themselves in the past, Hitler cut the line and kept the power to himself, engaging in further conquest and genocide in Africa. Then, in the 1970's President John Kennedy in the US, knowing that nuclear war with Germany and Japan was a just a matter of time, that the US was likely to lose and that in any case there will not be much left of the world, sent his own team into the past - whose interference created the world we live in.

to:

* Another James P. Hogan Creator/JamesPHogan book, ''The Proteus Operation'', has it that in himself Hitler did not amount to much - the Beerhall Putch fiasco in 1923 was the peak of his career and in the "original timeline" and he faded into obscurity after some years in prison. The world went on to prosper, the League of Nations was a great success and went on to unify the world, eliminate war and reduce the gap between rich and poor in a worldwide social democratic utopia. But the people who didn't like losing power and privilege went back in time, funded and advised Hitler into power, and in 1942 provided him nuclear bombs to conquer Russia - but when the privileged and powerful people of the future got ready to pack their bags and go to the nice spot which they prepared for themselves in the past, Hitler cut the line and kept the power to himself, engaging in further conquest and genocide in Africa. Then, in the 1970's President John Kennedy in the US, knowing that nuclear war with Germany and Japan was a just a matter of time, that the US was likely to lose and that in any case there will not be much left of the world, sent his own team into the past - whose interference created the world we live in.
9th Dec '17 9:07:20 AM TheNerevarine
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''ComicBook/FlashGordonZeitgeist'': Adolf Hitler is a puppet to Emperor Ming of Mongo, who is backing the Nazis to take over the Earth and rule it in his name. Granted, this series is set in a [[AlternateHistory alternate timeline]]

to:

* ''ComicBook/FlashGordonZeitgeist'': Adolf Hitler is a puppet to Emperor Ming of Mongo, who is backing the Nazis to take over the Earth and rule it in his name. Granted, this series is set in a [[AlternateHistory alternate timeline]]timeline]] and the planet Mongo serves as a portal to TheMultiverse, meaning Ming just influenced a different Earth than ours.
4th Dec '17 12:11:36 AM PaulA
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''Film/{{Downfall}}'' took some criticism in Germany for portraying Hitler as a flawed and broken human. The director actually invoked this trope in his defense: if we continue to act like Hitler was some alien monster teleported to Earth to do [[BuffySpeak very bad stuff]], we as a nation and a race are never going to learn from the past.

to:

* ''Film/{{Downfall}}'' took some criticism in Germany for portraying Hitler as a flawed and broken human. The director actually invoked this trope in his defense: if we continue to act like Hitler was some alien monster teleported to Earth to do [[BuffySpeak very bad stuff]], stuff, we as a nation and a race are never going to learn from the past.
3rd Dec '17 1:43:32 PM TheNerevarine
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* ''ComicBook/FlashGordonZeitgeist'': Adolf Hitler is a puppet to Emperor Ming of Mongo, who is backing the Nazis to take over the Earth and rule it in his name. Granted, this series is set in a [[AlternateHistory alternate timeline]]



* ''Film/{{Downfall}}'' took some criticism in Germany for portraying Hitler as a flawed and broken human. The director actually invoked this trope in his defense: if we continue to act like Hitler was some alien monster teleported to earth to do [[BuffySpeak very bad stuff]], we as a nation and a race are never going to learn from the past.

to:

* ''Film/{{Downfall}}'' took some criticism in Germany for portraying Hitler as a flawed and broken human. The director actually invoked this trope in his defense: if we continue to act like Hitler was some alien monster teleported to earth Earth to do [[BuffySpeak very bad stuff]], we as a nation and a race are never going to learn from the past.
22nd Nov '17 7:22:25 PM PaulA
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* Played with in the Literature/DoctorWhoNewAdventures novel ''Timewyrm: Exodus'', where Hitler separately receives covert assistance from two different groups of aliens attempting to further their own ends -- but neither is able to control him, and what he does with their assistance is all entirely his own idea.

to:

* Played with in the Literature/DoctorWhoNewAdventures novel ''Timewyrm: Exodus'', ''[[Recap/DoctorWhoNewAdventuresTimewyrmExodus Timewyrm: Exodus]]'', where Hitler separately receives covert assistance from two different groups of aliens attempting to further their own ends -- but neither is able to control him, and what he does with their assistance is all entirely his own idea.
13th Nov '17 6:20:17 PM PaulA
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* For a non-Hitler example, the novel ''Literature/PresidentsVampire'' by Christopher Farnsworth has UsefulNotes/OsamaBinLaden as a [[Franchise/CthulhuMythos Deep One]].



* Related: On an episode of ''Series/TheXFiles'', they meet a JerkassGenie who was responsible for Mussolini's rise and fall.
* The ''[[Series/StarTrekTheOriginalSeries Star Trek]]'' episode "Wolf in the Fold" has an entity that was UsefulNotes/JackTheRipper on Earth.



* In a non-Hitler example, ''Series/SleepyHollow'' had Judas Iscariot's coins, artifacts which caused the holder to turn against the friends, family, and deeply held beliefs. One holder was Benedict Arnold.



* ''ComicBook/PrettyDeadly'' unusually does this with the First World War, which in the universe of the series was due to the [[TheGrimReaper Reaper of War]] getting above itself.

to:

* ''ComicBook/PrettyDeadly'' unusually does this with the First World War, which in the universe of the series was due to the [[TheGrimReaper Reaper of War]] getting above itself.



* ''Film/{{Wonder Woman|2017}}'' features [[ANaziByAnyOtherName General Erich Ludendorff]] as the primary BigBad. He is given a HistoricalVillainUpgrade with him murdering the German High Command and intending to continue UsefulNotes/WorldWarI (that the Germans already effectively lost) with a new gas weapon that can murder hundreds of civilians. This, combined with his WarIsGlorious speech, convinces Wonder Woman that [[GodInHumanForm Ludendorff is really Ares, the God of War, in disguise]] and that killing him would end the war immediately. [[DeathByAdaptation When she finally did kill him]], to her dismay, the Germans still continue to fight and the ''real'' Ares reveals that while he did gave humans new weapons and formulas over the eons, he never pushed them into war... [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters They went to war by their own choice]].
** It's partly an AvertedTrope to make the movie about Ludendorff and World War I at all, because Wonder Woman is famous for premiering as a World War II heroine and the movie could have gone after Hitler himself. (Which would probably have been seen as a PlotTumor.)

to:

* ''Film/{{Wonder Woman|2017}}'' features [[ANaziByAnyOtherName General Erich Ludendorff]] as the primary BigBad. He is given a HistoricalVillainUpgrade with him murdering the German High Command and intending to continue UsefulNotes/WorldWarI (that the Germans already effectively lost) with a new gas weapon that can murder hundreds of civilians. This, combined with his WarIsGlorious speech, convinces Wonder Woman that [[GodInHumanForm Ludendorff is really Ares, the God of War, in disguise]] and that killing him would end the war immediately. [[DeathByAdaptation When she finally did kill him]], to her dismay, the Germans still continue to fight and the ''real'' Ares reveals that while he did gave humans new weapons and formulas over the eons, he never pushed them into war... [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters They went to war by their own choice]].
** It's partly an AvertedTrope to make the movie about Ludendorff and World War I at all, because Wonder Woman is famous for premiering as a World War II heroine and the movie could have gone after Hitler himself. (Which would probably have been seen as a PlotTumor.)


Added DiffLines:


!!Examples not involving Hitler:

[[folder:Comic Books]]
* ''ComicBook/PrettyDeadly'' does this with the First World War, which in the universe of the series was due to the [[TheGrimReaper Reaper of War]] getting above itself.
[[/folder]]

[[folder:Film - Live Action]]
* ''Film/{{Wonder Woman|2017}}'' features [[ANaziByAnyOtherName General Erich Ludendorff]] as the primary BigBad. He is given a HistoricalVillainUpgrade with him murdering the German High Command and intending to continue UsefulNotes/WorldWarI (that the Germans already effectively lost) with a new gas weapon that can murder hundreds of civilians. This, combined with his WarIsGlorious speech, convinces Wonder Woman that [[GodInHumanForm Ludendorff is really Ares, the God of War, in disguise]] and that killing him would end the war immediately. Subverted: [[DeathByAdaptation When she finally did kill him]], to her dismay, the Germans still continue to fight and the ''real'' Ares reveals that while he did gave humans new weapons and formulas over the eons, he never pushed them into war... [[HumansAreTheRealMonsters They went to war by their own choice]].
[[/folder]]

[[folder:Literature]]
* ''Literature/ThePresidentsVampire'' by Christopher Farnsworth has UsefulNotes/OsamaBinLaden as a [[Franchise/CthulhuMythos Deep One]].
[[/folder]]

[[folder:Live Action TV]]
* ''Series/SleepyHollow'' had Judas Iscariot's coins, artifacts which caused the holder to turn against the friends, family, and deeply held beliefs. One holder was Benedict Arnold.
* The ''[[Series/StarTrekTheOriginalSeries Star Trek]]'' episode "Wolf in the Fold" has an entity that was UsefulNotes/JackTheRipper on Earth.
* On an episode of ''Series/TheXFiles'', they meet a JerkassGenie who was responsible for Mussolini's rise and fall.
[[/folder]]
13th Nov '17 10:22:41 AM RyzeGuy
Is there an issue? Send a Message



to:

** It's partly an AvertedTrope to make the movie about Ludendorff and World War I at all, because Wonder Woman is famous for premiering as a World War II heroine and the movie could have gone after Hitler himself. (Which would probably have been seen as a PlotTumor.)
13th Nov '17 4:29:14 AM LondonKdS
Is there an issue? Send a Message



to:

* ''ComicBook/PrettyDeadly'' unusually does this with the First World War, which in the universe of the series was due to the [[TheGrimReaper Reaper of War]] getting above itself.
12th Nov '17 9:07:08 AM Morgenthaler
Is there an issue? Send a Message



to:

* In the Dutch YA novel ''Face in the Mist'' (by Paul Van Loon), it's mentioned that the demonic {{Cult}} villain used to be Adolf Hitler in one of his past incarnations.
24th Oct '17 10:50:31 PM Kazrak
Is there an issue? Send a Message


* In James P. Hogan's ''Giants' Star'', Terrans discover that a group of humans from another star system have infiltrated us for millennia, teaching superstition and bigotry, trying to hamper our development and later to make us destroy ourselves. During a confrontation, a Terran spokesperson says the enemy intended UsefulNotes/WorldWarII to be an all-out nuclear exchange, but didn't quite manage it, and asks:

to:

* In James P. Hogan's ''Giants' Star'', ''[[Literature/GiantsSeries Giants' Star]]'', Terrans discover that a group of humans from another star system have infiltrated us for millennia, teaching superstition and bigotry, trying to hamper our development and later to make us destroy ourselves. During a confrontation, a Terran spokesperson says the enemy intended UsefulNotes/WorldWarII to be an all-out nuclear exchange, but didn't quite manage it, and asks:
This list shows the last 10 events of 140. Show all.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/article_history.php?article=Main.WeDidntStartTheFuhrer