History Main / VillainHasAPoint

23rd May '17 1:38:06 PM DragonRanger
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* In ''Film/DoctorStrange2016'', the main character seems to be almost persuaded by the villain Kaecilius and his promise of eternal life for everybody. In fact, actor Mads Mikkelsen playing Kaecilius perceived his character as a hero: "The key to any good villain, which I think was very clear from the beginning of this journey, is that they have a point. It’s not completely crazy what they’re saying. That is a point, even in Doctor Strange’s eyes he does believe I have a point (...)".

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* In ''Film/DoctorStrange2016'', the main character seems to be almost persuaded by the villain Kaecilius and his promise of eternal life for everybody. In fact, actor Mads Mikkelsen playing Kaecilius perceived his character as a hero: "The key to any good villain, which I think was very clear from the beginning of this journey, is that they have a point. It’s not completely crazy what they’re saying. That is a point, even in Doctor Strange’s eyes he does believe I have a point (...)". A tie-in comic shows that Kaecilius is driven by personal experience, having lost a family of his own.



** Jiayang initially seems to overreact in Season 2 at the idea of the Inhumans cooperating with SHIELD, but that SHIELD had already been revealed to have been infiltrated by HYDRA gave her some justification, moreso when it's later revealed in Season 3 that [[spoiler: HYDRA was trying to bring back a creature called Hive who could control Inhumans, and in retrospect in Season 4 when a listing of registered Inhumans is used as a kill-list, something she had explicitly warned of.]]

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** Jiayang initially seems to overreact in Season 2 at the idea of the Inhumans cooperating with SHIELD, but that SHIELD had already been revealed to have been infiltrated by HYDRA gave her some justification, moreso when it's later revealed in Season 3 that [[spoiler: HYDRA [[spoiler:HYDRA was trying to bring back a creature called Hive who could control Inhumans, and in retrospect in Season 4 when a listing of registered Inhumans is used as a kill-list, kill-list (also in Season 3), something she had explicitly warned of.]]



** Although they shot themselves in the foot multiple times by being more of a threat to the world than the Justice League, it's acknowledged even InUniverse that Project Cadmus has a point about the scary potential of what the Justice League could do if they wanted (especially since they were visited by an AlternateUniverse League, the Justice Lords, who had conquered their world and come to do the same to this one), especially given some of the questional decisions that the Justice League has made. Most notably, installing [[KillSat a giant laser in their orbital base and aiming it at the planet]] without asking for anyone's permission or even telling them about it.

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** Although they shot themselves in the foot multiple times by being more of a threat to the world than the Justice League, it's acknowledged even InUniverse that Project Cadmus has a point about the scary potential of what the Justice League could do if they wanted (especially since they were visited by an AlternateUniverse League, the Justice Lords, who had conquered their world and come to do the same to this one), especially given some of the questional questionable decisions that the Justice League has made. Most notably, installing [[KillSat a giant laser in their orbital base and aiming it at the planet]] without asking for anyone's permission or even telling them about it.



** General Kuvira in Season 4 usurps the throne of the Earth Kingdom and instead crowns [[SheIsTheKing herself Emperor]] due to the heir apparent (Hou-Ting's bumbling nephew Wu) being an incapable leader who would essentially be a puppet installed by the other nations instead of a strong leader with enough authority to be able to push back against them. She also blames Suyin Beifond, her former mentor and kind of surrogate mother for her complete refusal to stabilize Earth Kingdom, not even with supplies, which is exactly what happened. [[spoiler: Wu himself eventually agrees with her about the obsolescence of the traditional monarchy, and decides to reform the Earth Kingdom into a republic with elected leaders. In hindsight though, he didn't feel like he had much of choice of being king in the first place]].

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** General Kuvira in Season 4 usurps the throne of the Earth Kingdom and instead crowns [[SheIsTheKing herself Emperor]] due to the heir apparent (Hou-Ting's bumbling nephew Wu) being an incapable leader who would essentially be a puppet installed by the other nations instead of a strong leader with enough authority to be able to push back against them. She also blames Suyin Beifond, Beifong, her former mentor and kind of surrogate mother for her complete refusal to stabilize Earth Kingdom, not even with supplies, which is exactly what happened. [[spoiler: Wu himself eventually agrees with her about the obsolescence of the traditional monarchy, and decides to reform the Earth Kingdom into a republic with elected leaders. In hindsight though, he didn't feel like he had much of choice of being king in the first place]].
7th May '17 3:24:14 PM Rebu
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* The tie-in comic to ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamCity'' has a cop denounce the Joker for killing "a lot of good husbands and fathers". Joker complains, not unreasonably, that nobody ever laments the dead ''bachelors''.

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* The tie-in comic to ''VideoGame/BatmanArkhamCity'' has a cop denounce the Joker for killing "a lot of good husbands and fathers". Joker complains, not unreasonably, that nobody ever laments the dead ''bachelors''.''bachelors'' [[note]]The usual format is "husbands, fathers, and sons".[[/note]].
6th May '17 6:49:05 AM Shadowgazer
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* It causes the plot of the ''Big Boogey Adventure'' movie of the ''WesternAnimation/TheGrimAdventuresOfBillyAndMandy'' fame that [[BigBad Boogey]] presses charges against Grim for misusing his powers. The thing is, the facts that he brings up to the Underworld Court are perfectly accurate, Grim is indeed very irresponsible with the handling of his cosmic powers, routinely letting his scythe and other objects of arcane power get stolen. Also that he doesn't have enough will of his own, to resist being forced by the two self-serving kids to placating their selfish whims. He is even right when he says that Billy and Mandy are only Grim's friends because they can use him and about the other ugly things that he says about them being barbaric and wickedly loathsome. Of course he says that all to get them into trouble and make Grim lose his job as psychopomp out of spite but the points still remain.
6th May '17 6:38:52 AM Shadowgazer
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* It causes the plot of the ''Big Boogey Adventure'' movie of the ''WesternAnimation/TheGrimAdventuresOfBillyAndMandy'' fame that [[BigBad Boogey]] presses charges against Grim for misusing his powers. The thing is, the facts that he brings up to the Underworld Court are perfectly accurate, Grim is indeed very irresponsible with the handling of his cosmic powers and weak-willed enough to be forced by the two self-serving kids to placate their selfish whims. Of course he says that all to get them into trouble and make Grim lose his job as psychopomp out of spite but the points still remain.
6th May '17 6:30:59 AM Shadowgazer
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Added DiffLines:

* It causes the plot of the ''Big Boogey Adventure'' movie of the ''WesternAnimation/TheGrimAdventuresOfBillyAndMandy'' fame that [[BigBad Boogey]] presses charges against Grim for misusing his powers. The thing is, the facts that he brings up to the Underworld Court are perfectly accurate, Grim is indeed very irresponsible with the handling of his cosmic powers and weak-willed enough to be forced by the two self-serving kids to placate their selfish whims. Of course he says that all to get them into trouble and make Grim lose his job as psychopomp out of spite but the points still remain.
1st May '17 5:58:17 PM kquinn0830
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* ''Film/{{Heavyweights}}'': Tony Perkins is an insane and abusive prick, but the campers were not making ''any effort'' to lose weight. In fact, the fat kids regularly smuggled junk food into the camp. While confiscating it wasn't a particularly nice thing to do, it is part of Tony's job. In fact, the first thing the camp does when [[spoiler: Tony is locked up]], is to celebrate with a junk food binge. Pat tells them that the point of the camp is to lose weight, and to feel better, and that they can do it without acting like Tony.

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* ''Film/{{Heavyweights}}'': Tony Perkins is an insane and abusive prick, but before he came along the campers were not making ''any effort'' to lose weight. In fact, the The fat kids regularly smuggled junk food into the camp.camp just so they wouldn't get thinner. While confiscating it wasn't a particularly nice thing to do, it is part of Tony's job. In fact, the first thing the camp does when [[spoiler: Tony is locked up]], is to celebrate with a junk food binge. binge that makes them all sick. Pat tells them that the point of the camp is to lose weight, get healthy, and to feel better, and that they can do it without acting like Tony.
25th Apr '17 4:58:40 PM TristanJeremiah
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* Anyone who played ''VideoGame/Borderlands2'' likely immediately thought of Handsome Jack when reading this article. Jack is trying to conquer the planet Pandora. He says he's trying to civilize the planet, which is basically MadMax in space.

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* Anyone who played ''VideoGame/Borderlands2'' likely immediately thought of Handsome Jack when reading this article. Jack is trying to conquer the planet Pandora. He says he's trying to civilize the planet, which is basically MadMax in space.''Film/MadMax'' InSpace.
24th Apr '17 2:23:30 PM MagBas
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** Doom is a particularly weird case, as he originally started out as just another arrogant "I know better than everybody!" type villain; his current depiction owes more to a long-running accumulation of sheer popularity than anything else.
* In ''ComicBook/InhumansVsXMen'', despite being portrayed as the villains of the series, the X-Men are in practice actually in the right. As stated InUniverse, disrupting the Terrigen Mists has no negative effect beyond seeing that people who weren't super-powered to begin with... don't spontaneously ''get'' super-powers they never even asked for, whilst letting them saturate the atmosphere will ''kill off'' an entire sub-species of humanity who had made ''no'' hostile actions towards the Inhumans in the first place. This is lampshaded when the Inhuman Kamala asks if her people are supposed to be the good guys in this situation.
** What strengthens the unsympathetic aspect of the Inhumans, emphasizing their NominalHero status, is that it's shown through both this storyline and its prequel, ''ComicBook/DeathOfX'', that the X-men literally ''have no choice'' other than forcibly stopping the Terrigen Mists, because the Inhumans consider them sacred to the point of outweighing the ''lives'' of mutants. The most prominent examples are the fact that Black Bolt kills Cyclops at the end of "Death of X" for the crime of... altering a Terrigien Cloud to still function as it should whilst no longer being lethal to mutants, for which Cyclops was portrayed as a DesignatedVillain (with the retcon in this issue that Cyke's tampering ultimately nullified that particular cloud), and the reveal in ''Deadpool and the Mercs for Money'' that using a RealityWarper to make the Terrigen Clouds harmless to mutants whilst still activating Inhumans would have only ''escalated'' the conflict, on charges of blasphemy.
** In summary, the "heroes" want to reinforce their own ranks and would rather kill off all mutants than allow for any deviance in their plans, whilst the "villains" are the mutants who ''don't want to be gassed to death for somebody else's recruitment drive''. Add in the authors making patently absurd statements to try and insist on the DesignatedHero and DesignatedVillain statuses, and it's no wonder this storyline has been so controversial.

to:

** Doom is a particularly weird case, as he originally started out as just another arrogant "I know better than everybody!" type villain; his current depiction owes more to a long-running accumulation of sheer popularity than anything else.
* In ''ComicBook/InhumansVsXMen'', despite being portrayed as the villains of the series, the X-Men are in practice actually in the right. As stated InUniverse, disrupting the Terrigen Mists has no negative effect beyond seeing that people who weren't super-powered to begin with... don't spontaneously ''get'' super-powers they never even asked for, whilst letting them saturate the atmosphere will ''kill off'' an entire sub-species of humanity who had made ''no'' hostile actions towards the Inhumans in the first place. This is lampshaded when the Inhuman Kamala asks if her people are supposed to be the good guys in this situation.
** What strengthens the unsympathetic aspect of the Inhumans, emphasizing their NominalHero status, is that it's shown through both this storyline and its prequel, ''ComicBook/DeathOfX'', that the X-men literally ''have no choice'' other than forcibly stopping the Terrigen Mists, because the Inhumans consider them sacred to the point of outweighing the ''lives'' of mutants. The most prominent examples are the fact that Black Bolt kills Cyclops at the end of "Death of X" for the crime of... altering a Terrigien Cloud to still function as it should whilst no longer being lethal to mutants, for which Cyclops was portrayed as a DesignatedVillain (with the retcon in this issue that Cyke's tampering ultimately nullified that particular cloud), and the reveal in ''Deadpool and the Mercs for Money'' that using a RealityWarper to make the Terrigen Clouds harmless to mutants whilst still activating Inhumans would have only ''escalated'' the conflict, on charges of blasphemy.
** In summary, the "heroes" want to reinforce their own ranks and would rather kill off all mutants than allow for any deviance in their plans, whilst the "villains" are the mutants who ''don't want to be gassed to death for somebody else's recruitment drive''. Add in the authors making patently absurd statements to try and insist on the DesignatedHero and DesignatedVillain statuses, and it's no wonder this storyline has been so controversial.
situation.
24th Apr '17 10:37:09 AM WanderingBrowser
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** Doom is a particularly weird case, as he originally started out as just another arrogant "I know better than everybody!" type villain; his current depiction owes more to a long-running accumulation of sheer popularity than anything else.
* In ''ComicBook/InhumansVsXMen'', despite being portrayed as the villains of the series, the X-Men are in practice actually in the right. As stated InUniverse, disrupting the Terrigen Mists has no negative effect beyond seeing that people who weren't super-powered to begin with... don't spontaneously ''get'' super-powers they never even asked for, whilst letting them saturate the atmosphere will ''kill off'' an entire sub-species of humanity who had made ''no'' hostile actions towards the Inhumans in the first place. This is lampshaded when the Inhuman Kamala asks if her people are supposed to be the good guys in this situation.
** What strengthens the unsympathetic aspect of the Inhumans, emphasizing their NominalHero status, is that it's shown through both this storyline and its prequel, ''ComicBook/DeathOfX'', that the X-men literally ''have no choice'' other than forcibly stopping the Terrigen Mists, because the Inhumans consider them sacred to the point of outweighing the ''lives'' of mutants. The most prominent examples are the fact that Black Bolt kills Cyclops at the end of "Death of X" for the crime of... altering a Terrigien Cloud to still function as it should whilst no longer being lethal to mutants, for which Cyclops was portrayed as a DesignatedVillain (with the retcon in this issue that Cyke's tampering ultimately nullified that particular cloud), and the reveal in ''Deadpool and the Mercs for Money'' that using a RealityWarper to make the Terrigen Clouds harmless to mutants whilst still activating Inhumans would have only ''escalated'' the conflict, on charges of blasphemy.
** In summary, the "heroes" want to reinforce their own ranks and would rather kill off all mutants than allow for any deviance in their plans, whilst the "villains" are the mutants who ''don't want to be gassed to death for somebody else's recruitment drive''. Add in the authors making patently absurd statements to try and insist on the DesignatedHero and DesignatedVillain statuses, and it's no wonder this storyline has been so controversial.
19th Apr '17 8:55:45 PM Yuihime
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** In ''VideoGame/PokemonBlackAndWhite'', Ghetsis reasons that [[OlympusMons Legendary Pokemon]] can be defeated, or captured and controlled by Trainers, just like any other Pokemon, so worshiping them like gods is superstitious nonsense.
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