History Main / TheProblemWithFightingDeath

3rd Jan '16 12:08:47 PM nombretomado
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* In the backstory of ''SoulNomadAndTheWorldEaters'', Lord Median TheConqueror killed [[{{Psychopomp}} Master of Death]] Vigilance to save his son from a wasting disease. [[spoiler:Not only did his son die anyway, but killing Vigilance ended up completely wrecking the circle of reincarnation and allowed [[EvilCounterpart Gamma]] to steal all the souls Vigilance would normally be responsible for, it caused Vigilance's partner Virtious to kill Median in retaliation, and finally Gamma ended up poaching Vigilance's soul and his boss reincarnated him into PsychoForHire Gig and sent him back to his own world to [[OmnicidalManiac hurry along the collection]], as it were.]]
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* In the backstory of ''SoulNomadAndTheWorldEaters'', ''VideoGame/SoulNomadAndTheWorldEaters'', Lord Median TheConqueror killed [[{{Psychopomp}} Master of Death]] Vigilance to save his son from a wasting disease. [[spoiler:Not only did his son die anyway, but killing Vigilance ended up completely wrecking the circle of reincarnation and allowed [[EvilCounterpart Gamma]] to steal all the souls Vigilance would normally be responsible for, it caused Vigilance's partner Virtious to kill Median in retaliation, and finally Gamma ended up poaching Vigilance's soul and his boss reincarnated him into PsychoForHire Gig and sent him back to his own world to [[OmnicidalManiac hurry along the collection]], as it were.]]
18th Dec '15 11:47:34 AM Morgenthaler
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Like A Badass Out Of Hell is being split into new tropes.
This is the problem with fighting Death, [[EverybodyHatesHades Hades]], TheDevil, {{Psychopomp}}s, {{Anthropomorphic Personification}}s or even {{God}}; you just can't win. However, a draw may be possible with creativity. If all that matters is that there be ''a'' Death, then replacing him with [[DontFearTheReaper someone friendlier]] or someone with whom [[DealWithTheDevil deals can be struck and honored]] can be a way to go. This can be done by appealing to someone [[LowestCosmicDenominator higher on the divinity ladder]], getting someone else to [[YouKillItYouBoughtIt kill and replace Death]] (or doing so ''yourself'', if you're willing to accept the job for the rest of eternity), and flying LikeABadassOutOfHell are all possibilities. In this way, one can say LivingForeverIsAwesome.
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This is the problem with fighting Death, [[EverybodyHatesHades Hades]], TheDevil, {{Psychopomp}}s, {{Anthropomorphic Personification}}s or even {{God}}; you just can't win. However, a draw may be possible with creativity. If all that matters is that there be ''a'' Death, then replacing him with [[DontFearTheReaper someone friendlier]] or someone with whom [[DealWithTheDevil deals can be struck and honored]] can be a way to go. This can be done by appealing to someone [[LowestCosmicDenominator higher on the divinity ladder]], getting someone else to [[YouKillItYouBoughtIt kill and replace Death]] (or doing so ''yourself'', if you're willing to accept the job for the rest of eternity), and [[EscapedFromHell flying LikeABadassOutOfHell out of Hell]] are all possibilities. In this way, one can say LivingForeverIsAwesome.

* In myth, there's the old story of ''The Russian Soldier'', who trapped Death in a magical bag. This resulted in DeathTakesAHoliday, so nobody could die - the suffering of the wounded was extended, and the old just became more and more tired and infirm... eventually, hearing the cries of the people, he released Death from the bag, expecting to become his first victim - but Death was frightened by the soldier's powers, and fled from him before resuming his duties... Which was all fine and dandy until, of course, the SOLDIER grew old, and Death would not come for him. Growing older and weaker, he became tired and weary of life... WhoWantsToLiveForever, right? He even tried to walk to the gates of Heaven himself, but they wouldn't let him in - he had sinned against the natural order of things by preventing Death from doing his job, after all. He then resigned himself to his fate and walked to the gates of Hell... but the Devil knew of his reputation, and was afraid that he'd be LikeABadassOutOfHell and take over, so he barred the doors and refused to let him in. And so, due to his fight with Death, the Russian Soldier had all paths to the final end denied to him... and some say, he wanders still, hoping for the day he will be forgiven and allowed to rest at last...
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* In myth, there's the old story of ''The Russian Soldier'', who trapped Death in a magical bag. This resulted in DeathTakesAHoliday, so nobody could die - the suffering of the wounded was extended, and the old just became more and more tired and infirm... eventually, hearing the cries of the people, he released Death from the bag, expecting to become his first victim - but Death was frightened by the soldier's powers, and fled from him before resuming his duties... Which was all fine and dandy until, of course, the SOLDIER grew old, and Death would not come for him. Growing older and weaker, he became tired and weary of life... WhoWantsToLiveForever, right? He even tried to walk to the gates of Heaven himself, but they wouldn't let him in - he had sinned against the natural order of things by preventing Death from doing his job, after all. He then resigned himself to his fate and walked to the gates of Hell... but the Devil knew of his reputation, and was afraid that he'd be LikeABadassOutOfHell and [[HellHasNewManagement take over, over Hell]], so he barred the doors and refused to let him in. And so, due to his fight with Death, the Russian Soldier had all paths to the final end denied to him... and some say, he wanders still, hoping for the day he will be forgiven and allowed to rest at last...
8th Nov '15 7:04:57 AM pittsburghmuggle
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* In ''Music/JesusChristSuperstar'''s song "Poor Jerusalem" is the line "To conquer death you only have to die..."
8th Nov '15 7:02:48 AM pittsburghmuggle
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Folder Fixin'
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8th Nov '15 4:45:22 AM darksoul4242
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Expanded upon the Saint Seiya example
** In ''SaintSeiyaTheLostCanvas'' this is actually explicitly referenced. At one point one of the Gold Saints (while living) is teleported into Hades (the location) and notices that all of his dead friends are trapped in the ice of the ninth circle, cursed to this punishment for having opposed Hades. It backfires since their souls help the Gold Saint beat the crap out of his opponent by [[SuperEmpowering powering him up.]]
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** In ''SaintSeiyaTheLostCanvas'' this is actually explicitly referenced. At one point one of the Gold Saints (while living) is teleported into Hades (the location) and notices that all of his dead friends are trapped in the ice of the ninth circle, cursed to this punishment for having opposed Hades. It backfires since their souls help the Gold Saint beat the crap out of his opponent by [[SuperEmpowering powering him up. This ultimately gives him enough determination to decide to end things once and for all with Hades, when the next war comes around.]]

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** Even with Hades having an ironclad hold on the afterlife, which basically amounts to eternal Hell, a select very few enlightened humans are canonically capable of reincarnation, including Pegasus Seiya (reincarnation of the mythological Pegasus Saint). Hades himself states this with no small measure of surprise, expressing outright rage at being wounded again by the same Saint. So the implication is that without Hades, humans would not go to eternal hell but would have their sins purged through death (as is Athena's wish), and reincarnate freely. ** Also, the JerkassGods anyway regards humanity as a [[HumansAreBastards blemish upon the cosmos]], and so would rather condone Hades' OmnicidalManiac tendencies and gang against Athena.
5th Nov '15 9:13:32 AM nombretomado
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* [[TheMightyThor Thor]], after invading Hel to rescue the souls Hela had stolen, she, as the goddess of death and decay, cursed him to never die or heal. While this actually saved his life when he battled the Midgard Serpent, a fight fated to end in a MutualKill, he eventually sent a {{Magitek}} robot called the Destroyer into Hel to make her lift the curse and restore him. By this point his bones had been reduced to mush and he was unable to move without assistance.
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* [[TheMightyThor [[ComicBook/TheMightyThor Thor]], after invading Hel to rescue the souls Hela had stolen, she, as the goddess of death and decay, cursed him to never die or heal. While this actually saved his life when he battled the Midgard Serpent, a fight fated to end in a MutualKill, he eventually sent a {{Magitek}} robot called the Destroyer into Hel to make her lift the curse and restore him. By this point his bones had been reduced to mush and he was unable to move without assistance.
7th Oct '15 6:09:46 AM EryliaStarheart
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** In most of the games, TheGrimReaper inexplicably serves as Dracula's [[TheDragon right hand]]. [[FridgeBrilliance It might very well be that the reason for Dracula's ResurrectiveImmortality is that even Death itself gave up on taking him down and decided to aid him instead.]]
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** In most of the games, TheGrimReaper inexplicably serves as Dracula's [[TheDragon right hand]]. [[FridgeBrilliance It might very well be be]] that the reason for Dracula's ResurrectiveImmortality is that even Death itself gave up on taking him down and decided to aid him instead.]]
7th Oct '15 6:08:56 AM EryliaStarheart
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Added DiffLines:
** In most of the games, TheGrimReaper inexplicably serves as Dracula's [[TheDragon right hand]]. [[FridgeBrilliance It might very well be that the reason for Dracula's ResurrectiveImmortality is that even Death itself gave up on taking him down and decided to aid him instead.]]
21st Sep '15 3:04:46 PM Morgenthaler
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Misuse. It's Genre Savvy, not just "savvy".
* The story of the three brothers from ''Literature/HarryPotterAndTheDeathlyHallows'' (and ''Literature/TheTalesOfBeedleTheBard'') uses this. Three brothers use magic to cross a dangerous river without dying, much to the annoyance of Death. The anthropomorphic personification pretends to congratulate them, and offers them each any prize they want. The first asks for an unbeatable wand. It works, but when the he boasts too much about it, someone slits his throat while he's sleeping. The second asks for a stone that lets him see the dead. He uses it to call upon the spirit of his fiancee, who passed away shortly before their marriage. However, she's only a shadow, and he finds himself pining after someone he can never have, so he commits suicide to join her. [[YoungestChildWins The last one]] [[GenreSavvy realizes that Death is]] ''really pissed off'' and thus cannily asks for something to let him hide from "anyone" - and Death grudgingly gives him the cloak off his back, the very one he uses when he invisibly collects the dead. It's a perfect invisibility cloak, which he uses to hide from Death for many years. When his own time draws near, he gives the cloak to his child and willingly goes with Death as an equal.
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* The story of the three brothers from ''Literature/HarryPotterAndTheDeathlyHallows'' (and ''Literature/TheTalesOfBeedleTheBard'') uses this. Three brothers use magic to cross a dangerous river without dying, much to the annoyance of Death. The anthropomorphic personification pretends to congratulate them, and offers them each any prize they want. The first asks for an unbeatable wand. It works, but when the he boasts too much about it, someone slits his throat while he's sleeping. The second asks for a stone that lets him see the dead. He uses it to call upon the spirit of his fiancee, who passed away shortly before their marriage. However, she's only a shadow, and he finds himself pining after someone he can never have, so he commits suicide to join her. [[YoungestChildWins The last one]] [[GenreSavvy realizes that Death is]] is ''really pissed off'' and thus cannily asks for something to let him hide from "anyone" - and Death grudgingly gives him the cloak off his back, the very one he uses when he invisibly collects the dead. It's a perfect invisibility cloak, which he uses to hide from Death for many years. When his own time draws near, he gives the cloak to his child and willingly goes with Death as an equal.
18th Sep '15 10:12:39 PM nombretomado
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* Explicitly dealt with in ''EarthX's'' sequel ''Paradise X''. After [[ComicBook/CaptainMarVell Captain Marvel]] kills Death, the old and sick start piling up. They resort to recruiting Jude the Entropic Man to dematerialize those who seek the relief of death, going on to the Paradise Mar-Vell constructed.
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* Explicitly dealt with in ''EarthX's'' ''ComicBook/EarthX's'' sequel ''Paradise X''. After [[ComicBook/CaptainMarVell Captain Marvel]] kills Death, the old and sick start piling up. They resort to recruiting Jude the Entropic Man to dematerialize those who seek the relief of death, going on to the Paradise Mar-Vell constructed.
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