History Main / TechnologyLevels

6th Nov '17 7:31:31 AM Chabal2
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* Somehow, in ''Literature/{{Animorphs}}'', the Andalites invented computers before books. They consider books to be more convenient. [[SarcasmMode Apparently they have yet to invent a "Search" function.]]

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* Somehow, in ''Literature/{{Animorphs}}'', the ''Literature/{{Animorphs}}'':
** The
Andalites somehow invented computers before books. They consider books to be more convenient. [[SarcasmMode Apparently they have yet to invent a "Search" function.]]]]
** Discussed when it's mentioned the Howlers had functional spaceships before humanity left the trees. The idea that they're therefore unbeatable is shot down since there are some areas in which they're far behind.
8th Oct '17 7:16:43 PM ElectroKraken
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** Each faction has three unique units that can be produced during five epochs. Meaning the Japanese no longer know how to train samurai in the middle ages, and instead get the noncombat ninja instead, while the trusty Zero is able to compete with not-quite SpacePlanes. Similarly, the French have a giant catapult from prehistory onwards, 19th century cavalry in the middle ages, and a modern jet fighter in WWI.

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** Each faction has three unique units that can be produced during five epochs. Meaning the Japanese no longer know how to train samurai in the middle ages, and instead get the noncombat ninja instead, while the trusty Zero is able to compete with not-quite SpacePlanes.{{Space Plane}}s. Similarly, the French have a giant catapult from prehistory onwards, 19th century cavalry in the middle ages, and a modern jet fighter in WWI.
7th Oct '17 10:50:45 AM nombretomado
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This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). Wiki/TheOtherWiki used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.

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This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). Wiki/TheOtherWiki used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit JustForFun/AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.
6th Oct '17 8:18:10 PM Psychadelico
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* Writing in general is an aversion of this trope. Most societies (e.g. the Inca, above) with more than one city and a centralized government of any kind end up inventing a system for representing numbers and identifying objects, so that tax reports can be filed and the empire maintained; only very, ''very'' few times has anyone independently had the idea to take this to the next level and try to represent sentence structures, so that narrative structure could also be recorded. We know it happened at least twice, in Mesoamerica (Olmec pictograms) and Mesopotamia (Sumerian cuneiform). All other known writing systems ''could have'' gotten the idea from one of these two; the most likely candidate to have been a third independent invention is Chinese oracle bone script, but it's possible that the ''idea'', if not the format, was carried to China by traders. Likewise, it is unknown if Egyptian writing was inspired by Sumerian cuneiform or was an independent invention as well - indeed, there are some indications their phonetic writing may even ''predate'' cuneiform, and the symbolic basis for their language is known to be independent. Rongorongo may or may not be yet another (semi) independent invention of writing, though whether Rongorongo even represents "true" writing is unknown, and there is a great deal of suspicion that if it does represent writing, it was inspired by seeing instances of writing in the past.

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* Writing in general is an aversion of this trope. Most (but not all, see below) societies (e.g. the Inca, above) with more than one city and a centralized government of any kind end up inventing a system for representing numbers and identifying objects, so that tax reports can be filed and the empire maintained; only very, ''very'' few times has anyone independently had the idea to take this to the next level and try to represent sentence structures, so that narrative structure could also be recorded. We know it happened at least twice, in Mesoamerica (Olmec pictograms) and Mesopotamia (Sumerian cuneiform). All other known writing systems ''could have'' gotten the idea from one of these two; the most likely candidate to have been a third independent invention is Chinese oracle bone script, but it's possible that the ''idea'', if not the format, was carried to China by traders. Likewise, it is unknown if Egyptian writing was inspired by Sumerian cuneiform or was an independent invention as well - indeed, there are some indications their phonetic writing may even ''predate'' cuneiform, and the symbolic basis for their language is known to be independent. Rongorongo may or may not be yet another (semi) independent invention of writing, though whether Rongorongo even represents "true" writing is unknown, and there is a great deal of suspicion that if it does represent writing, it was inspired by seeing instances of writing in the past.past.
** Writing is not even a prerequisite for large-scale social institutions. There were a number of Western African empires (perhaps most famously the Kingdom of Mali's) that dominated fairly large expanses of territory without any form writing whatsoever, instead relying on oral communication and the memory of specially-trained [[TheStoryteller Griots]] to maintain commercial, legal, and historical records.
8th Jul '17 11:47:59 AM nombretomado
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This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). [[TheOtherWiki The Other Wiki]] used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.

to:

This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). [[TheOtherWiki The Other Wiki]] Wiki/TheOtherWiki used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.
17th Jun '17 9:30:28 AM Chabal2
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Added DiffLines:

* ''VideoGame/EmpireEarth II'':
** The game makes an effort to make its various factions distinctive, but the need to balance armies by giving them units that they lacked historically (cavalry, siege weapons, guns...) means this doesn't always succeed. Of course, realism was never a big issue, given the fact that it has the Mayans, Aztec and Inca not only surviving but thriving throughout the modern age (even giving them crossbowmen, cannon and knights as unique units as time goes by), or America being founded in prehistory.
** The epoch system that gets applied to everyone is based on European timelines, such as Middle Ages -> Renaissance -> Enlightnment -> Industrial.
** Each faction has three unique units that can be produced during five epochs. Meaning the Japanese no longer know how to train samurai in the middle ages, and instead get the noncombat ninja instead, while the trusty Zero is able to compete with not-quite SpacePlanes. Similarly, the French have a giant catapult from prehistory onwards, 19th century cavalry in the middle ages, and a modern jet fighter in WWI.
** One of the features are twelve technologies per age that provide some kind of bonus (resource gathering, unit stats, etc.), of which six at least need to be researched to progress to the next historical era. Not only are these the same for everyone, there's no explanation on how the Inca or Zulu discovered Arabic numerals.
** One particularly egregious application has the evolution of infantry: light infantry (bowmen) eventually become mortars, while heavy infantry (sword- and spearmen) eventually get assault rifles and miniguns. The latter two can attack helicopters, while mortars can't... and setting up a Rock vs Laser match will show the bowmen not reacting to helicopters attacking them, while the macemen are bludgeoning the helicopter's shadow to death.
26th Apr '17 1:33:45 AM PaulA
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* In the Icerigger trilogy of Creator/AlanDeanFoster, the residents of Tran-Ky-Ky are an Iron Age culture that never invented the wheel. That's because Tran-Ky-Ky is an [[SingleBiomePlanet Ice World]], and the natives mount anything heavy that needs to be transported on ice skates.

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* In the Icerigger ''Literature/{{Icerigger}}'' trilogy of by Creator/AlanDeanFoster, the residents of Tran-Ky-Ky are an Iron Age culture that never invented the wheel. That's because Tran-Ky-Ky is an [[SingleBiomePlanet Ice World]], and the natives mount anything heavy that needs to be transported on ice skates.
2nd Mar '17 11:24:00 PM zombiew1zard45
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This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). The other wiki used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.

to:

This has some actual reference in the real world [[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kardashev_scale Kardashev Scale]] (''how much'' total energy one gets to play with, no matter ''how''). [[TheOtherWiki The other wiki Other Wiki]] used to have a list. See AbusingTheKardashevScaleForFunAndProfit for some fun speculation.
26th Dec '16 11:19:19 AM nombretomado
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* At first glance, [[Franchise/AvatarTheLastAirbender the Avatar franchise]] seems to play this straight. The nations use their bending powers to help create technology- for example, [[PlayingWithFire Fire Benders]] use their head to power the steam industry. There is a clear progression in technology; in [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender the original series]], we see a nation having their industrial revolution while the majority of people used more old fashioned methods, while by ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfKorra'' they've got things such as cars and motorcycles readily available. In the end, its subverted. Although there's a progression in technology, it seems rather chaotic. Lampshaded by the [[AvatarTheAbridgedSeries abridged series]] as follows.

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* At first glance, [[Franchise/AvatarTheLastAirbender the Avatar franchise]] seems to play this straight. The nations use their bending powers to help create technology- for example, [[PlayingWithFire Fire Benders]] use their head to power the steam industry. There is a clear progression in technology; in [[WesternAnimation/AvatarTheLastAirbender the original series]], we see a nation having their industrial revolution while the majority of people used more old fashioned methods, while by ''WesternAnimation/TheLegendOfKorra'' they've got things such as cars and motorcycles readily available. In the end, its subverted. Although there's a progression in technology, it seems rather chaotic. Lampshaded by the [[AvatarTheAbridgedSeries [[WebVideo/AvatarTheAbridgedSeries abridged series]] as follows.
6th Nov '16 1:29:34 PM nombretomado
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* Creator/GregEgan's ''Incandescence'' gleefully avoids this. Mostly it concerns itself with physics concepts -- when you're a pre-industrial civilization orbiting a black hole, physics is ''really important'' -- but, for example, the aliens in question discover the Kerr metric for a rotating black hole (which we derived in 1963) slightly before they figure out universal gravitation (discovered by some guy named IsaacNewton in the late 17th century).

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* Creator/GregEgan's ''Incandescence'' gleefully avoids this. Mostly it concerns itself with physics concepts -- when you're a pre-industrial civilization orbiting a black hole, physics is ''really important'' -- but, for example, the aliens in question discover the Kerr metric for a rotating black hole (which we derived in 1963) slightly before they figure out universal gravitation (discovered by some guy named IsaacNewton UsefulNotes/IsaacNewton in the late 17th century).
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