History Main / SlidingScaleofFreeWillVsFate

8th Jul '16 5:20:21 AM KGBtheRussianSpy
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* ''WesternAnimation/StevenUniverse'' plays with this a lot, as two main characters, Garnet and Sapphire, have future vision
** The way Garnet describes her Future Vision in the eponymous episode makes it out to be a "Prophecies are just predictions" scenario- she can see every choice someone might make, and the consequences of each choice, but cannot know which path someone will take until they make that choice
** However, Sapphire's is presented a bit differently in the episode "The Answer," seeming to be more of a case of "Fighting Fate is Hard," as Ruby, a foot soldier assigned to her, was fated to die in battle. When she instead escapes her fate to fuse with Sapphire, she's astonished, to say the least, and it's revealed in the end of the episode that the only way Ruby managed to escape her destiny was through Trope/ThePowerOfLove .
6th Jul '16 1:51:54 AM morenohijazo
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* ''VideoGame/TheTalosPrinciple'': A bit of a running theme throughout the game, especially when talking with Milton, who is convinced there's no such thing as free will. The game itself falls roughly into the idea that fighting fate is hard, at least for the robots running around in the program, as [[spoiler:it takes at least 100 generations to find one bot that is willing to defy Elohim's guidance, climb the tower, and be able to climb to the very top and end the simulation]].
11th May '16 11:46:59 AM erforce
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->Free will! By the Titans' toe-cheese, they told me you were sharp but I had ''no idea''. Yes, Parson Gotti, Lord of Hamsters, do you believe Fate is a mighty wind? One that propels us inexorably to our final destination? Or do you believe... that the ''individual'' can steer the ship of self, to the port of his ''choice'', however emphatically the world may try to blow him?
-->-- [[ScrewDestiny Jojo]] while speaking to [[{{Protagonist}} Parson]] of defying fate, ''Webcomic/{{Erfworld}}''.

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->Free ->''"Free will! By the Titans' toe-cheese, they told me you were sharp but I had ''no idea''. Yes, Parson Gotti, Lord of Hamsters, do you believe Fate is a mighty wind? One that propels us inexorably to our final destination? Or do you believe... that the ''individual'' can steer the ship of self, to the port of his ''choice'', however emphatically the world may try to blow him?
him?"''
-->-- [[ScrewDestiny Jojo]] '''[[ScrewDestiny Jojo]]''', while speaking to [[{{Protagonist}} Parson]] of defying fate, ''Webcomic/{{Erfworld}}''.



* ''Series/TheSarahConnorChronicles'', firmly believes in "No fate but what we make" and the entire series comes down to Sarah and John trying to prevent the events of T3 right up to the end. Then the series throws the whole thing for a loop when [[spoiler: John Connor jumps ahead through time past the point of Judgment Day, and it turns out that the resistance is still alive and kicking without him.]]

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* ''Series/TheSarahConnorChronicles'', ''Series/TerminatorTheSarahConnorChronicles'', firmly believes in "No fate but what we make" and the entire series comes down to Sarah and John trying to prevent the events of T3 right up to the end. Then the series throws the whole thing for a loop when [[spoiler: John Connor jumps ahead through time past the point of Judgment Day, and it turns out that the resistance is still alive and kicking without him.]]
1st May '16 4:56:47 AM erforce
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* The ''Franchise/{{Terminator}}'' films absolutely cannot make up their minds about where they stand on this because of the TimeyWimeyBall. The dominant theme overtly stated in the second film was "No Fate But What We Make," but the film's ScrewDestiny finale was offset by film three which just showed it as delaying the inevitable, and then there's the fact that none of the series should work if not for the StableTimeLoop.

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* The ''Franchise/{{Terminator}}'' films absolutely cannot make up their minds about where they stand on this because of the TimeyWimeyBall. The dominant theme overtly stated in the [[Film/Terminator2JudgmentDay second film film]] was "No Fate But What We Make," but the film's ScrewDestiny finale was offset by film three which just showed it as delaying the inevitable, and then there's the fact that none of the series should work if not for the StableTimeLoop.
28th Apr '16 8:13:44 AM molokai198
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* ''Literature/WingsOfFire'' is type 4. [=NightWings=] [[spoiler:though far fewer of them then the [=NightWings=] would have you believe]]have the power of prophecy, but there are multiple potential futures even when it comes to random events and they are ultimately just predictions. Even the most talented seers are marked by being able to see all of the potential futures, not a single one.
* ''Literature/TheSight'' is type 2 - characters can have visions of the future and it is difficult and requires effort to change them, though it is still possible. [[spoiler:Larka realizes this just a bit too late to save herself]], but it does provide some hope given that [[spoiler:it turns out the most likely future is humanity nuking everyone and destroying the environment.]]
25th Apr '16 5:52:23 PM Mayhavecontrol
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->'''Jojo''': Free will! By the Titans' toe-cheese, they told me you were sharp but I had ''no idea''. Yes, Parson Gotti, Lord of Hamsters, do you believe Fate is a mighty wind? One that propels us inexorably to our final destination? Or do you believe... that the ''individual'' can steer the ship of self, to the port of his ''choice'', however emphatically the world may try to blow him?

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->'''Jojo''': Free ->Free will! By the Titans' toe-cheese, they told me you were sharp but I had ''no idea''. Yes, Parson Gotti, Lord of Hamsters, do you believe Fate is a mighty wind? One that propels us inexorably to our final destination? Or do you believe... that the ''individual'' can steer the ship of self, to the port of his ''choice'', however emphatically the world may try to blow him?
18th Mar '16 4:13:49 PM nombretomado
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* ''XxxHOLIC'' ranks quite high: "There is no such thing as coincidence in this world - there is only inevitability."
* ''TsubasaReservoirChronicle'' is considered high in the fate scale.

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* ''XxxHOLIC'' ''Manga/XxxHolic'' ranks quite high: "There is no such thing as coincidence in this world - there is only inevitability."
* ''TsubasaReservoirChronicle'' ''Manga/TsubasaReservoirChronicle'' is considered high in the fate scale.



* The ''{{Naruto}}'' manga can't seem to make up its mind where it is on the scale. Naruto's fight with Neji contrasts the viewpoints of ScrewDestiny and YouCantFightFate, with Neji advocating a belief that everyone's abilities are determined from birth, and only those with great parentage can truly excel, with Naruto contesting that anyone can succeed [[{{Determinator}} if they try hard enough]]. Naruto wins the fight, which would seem to vindicate his position, but it turns out that Naruto is the son of the Fourth Hokage [[spoiler:and his mother was the previous Kyuubi jinchuriki and a descendent of the [[PhysicalGod Sage of Six Paths]].]] Furthermore, Naruto's own skill proved insufficient to overcome Neji's and he won that fight entirely because of the inherent advantages of being a [[SealedInsideAPersonShapedCan jinchuriki]]. On the other hand, Neji didn't know who Naruto's parents were, and based his opinion of Naruto primarily on his academic performance. The issue is definitely worthy of debate. YMMV on whether it's simply a BrokenAesop or if the message all along was that it's not as easy to determine the future's possibilities as Neji presumed.

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* The ''{{Naruto}}'' ''Manga/{{Naruto}}'' manga can't seem to make up its mind where it is on the scale. Naruto's fight with Neji contrasts the viewpoints of ScrewDestiny and YouCantFightFate, with Neji advocating a belief that everyone's abilities are determined from birth, and only those with great parentage can truly excel, with Naruto contesting that anyone can succeed [[{{Determinator}} if they try hard enough]]. Naruto wins the fight, which would seem to vindicate his position, but it turns out that Naruto is the son of the Fourth Hokage [[spoiler:and his mother was the previous Kyuubi jinchuriki and a descendent of the [[PhysicalGod Sage of Six Paths]].]] Furthermore, Naruto's own skill proved insufficient to overcome Neji's and he won that fight entirely because of the inherent advantages of being a [[SealedInsideAPersonShapedCan jinchuriki]]. On the other hand, Neji didn't know who Naruto's parents were, and based his opinion of Naruto primarily on his academic performance. The issue is definitely worthy of debate. YMMV on whether it's simply a BrokenAesop or if the message all along was that it's not as easy to determine the future's possibilities as Neji presumed.
6th Mar '16 2:51:26 AM Niria
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** Similarly, "The Father Will Kill The Son" relating to Angel and Connor, even though it was placed in a prophecy book to mislead, nevertheless came true, though again just literally: Angel "killed" Connor, but as part of a deal that gave Connor a new, more normal, life. The demon who planted the fake prophecy to try to stop the real one that Connor would kill him, nevertheless was in fact killed by Connor. The only aversion of literal fate in the two series might have been Jasmine's defeat in Angel Season 4; and while the Tro-Clon prophecy sort of suggested something like Jasmine's rise, whether it ruled out her eventual defeat is questionable.

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** Similarly, "The Father Will Kill The Son" relating to Angel and Connor, even though it was placed in a prophecy book to mislead, nevertheless came true, though again just literally: Angel "killed" Connor, but as part of a deal that gave Connor a new, more normal, life. The demon who planted the fake prophecy to try to stop the real one that Connor would kill him, nevertheless was in fact killed by Connor. The only aversion of literal fate in the two series might have been Jasmine's defeat in Angel ''Angel'' Season 4; and while the Tro-Clon prophecy sort of suggested something like Jasmine's rise, whether it ruled out her eventual defeat is questionable.
6th Mar '16 2:49:42 AM Niria
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* In the universe of ''Series/BuffyTheVampireSlayer'' and ''Series/{{Angel}},'' it comes very close to "you can't fight fate" (although you certainly ''can'' make it literally true but mean different things). Prophecy showed Buffy was destined to die fighting The Master. Despite Buffy's attempt to avert it by not fighting him (she changes her mind), Giles' attempt to avert it by wanting to be the one to fight The Master, and an attempt by Xander to fight it as well, it happens...but then Xander brings her back to life with mouth to mouth.
** Similarly, "The Father Will Kill The Son" relating to Angel and Connor, even though it was placed in a prophecy book to mislead, nevertheless came true, though again just literally: Angel "killed" Connor, but as part of a deal that gave Connor a new, more normal, life. The demon who planted the fake prophecy to try to stop the real one that Connor would kill him, nevertheless was in fact killed by Connor. The only aversion of literal fate in the two series might have been Jasmine's defeat in Angel Season 4; and while the Tro-Clon prophecy sort of suggested something like Jasmine's rise, whether it ruled out her eventual defeat is questionable.
12th Feb '16 7:38:22 AM Dravencour
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* ''WesternAnimation/KungFuPanda2'' reinforces this as when the villain tried to stop his fate, being defeated by a warrior of black and white, he instead sealed it for [[spoiler: when he massacered the Panda village and Po escaped, he just simply transferred him to where he would be in prime postion to stop him.]]

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* ''WesternAnimation/KungFuPanda2'' reinforces this as when the villain tried to stop his fate, being defeated by a warrior of black and white, he instead sealed it for [[spoiler: when he massacered massacred the Panda village and Po escaped, [[GenocideBackfire he just simply transferred him to where he would be in a prime postion position to stop him.him]].]]
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