History Main / SlidingScaleOfAlternateHistoryPlausibility

15th Jul '16 9:32:40 PM nombretomado
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* ''[[VideoGame/CommandAndConquerRedAlertSeries Command & Conquer: Red Alert]]'' seems to be Type X-IV. It ''starts'' with [[AlbertEinstein Einstein]] building a TimeMachine [[HitlersTimeTravelExemptionAct and going back to kill Hitler]]. DirtyCommunists led by [[JosefStalin Stalin]] invade Europe with [[ShockAndAwe Tesla coils]] and [[TankGoodness superheavy tanks]]. The Europeans win the war - but some thirty years later, we have a Soviet invasion of the United States this time... ''with [[EverythingsSquishierWithCephalopods giant battlesquids]], {{Weather Control Machine}}s, tanks masquerading as trees, [[FrickinLaserBeams Frickin Prismatic Beams]], CloningBlues, TeleportersAndTransporters, ''' [[CoolAirship bomber blimps]], [[MindControl Mind-Controlling]] soldiers and psychic possession via telephone''''', all served with a side order of [[LargeHam Ham]] and [[{{Camp}} Cheese]]. And then, when it seemed it was over, [[SerialEscalation Red Alert 3 comes-a-knockin'...]]

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* ''[[VideoGame/CommandAndConquerRedAlertSeries Command & Conquer: Red Alert]]'' seems to be Type X-IV. It ''starts'' with [[AlbertEinstein [[UsefulNotes/AlbertEinstein Einstein]] building a TimeMachine [[HitlersTimeTravelExemptionAct and going back to kill Hitler]]. DirtyCommunists led by [[JosefStalin Stalin]] invade Europe with [[ShockAndAwe Tesla coils]] and [[TankGoodness superheavy tanks]]. The Europeans win the war - but some thirty years later, we have a Soviet invasion of the United States this time... ''with [[EverythingsSquishierWithCephalopods giant battlesquids]], {{Weather Control Machine}}s, tanks masquerading as trees, [[FrickinLaserBeams Frickin Prismatic Beams]], CloningBlues, TeleportersAndTransporters, ''' [[CoolAirship bomber blimps]], [[MindControl Mind-Controlling]] soldiers and psychic possession via telephone''''', all served with a side order of [[LargeHam Ham]] and [[{{Camp}} Cheese]]. And then, when it seemed it was over, [[SerialEscalation Red Alert 3 comes-a-knockin'...]]
11th Jul '16 12:33:58 PM MSK42
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* Turned into the game "Counterfactuals" in an episode of ''Series/TheBigBangTheory''. A single thing in history is changed, and the players are expected to answer a question about the future/history based on that. They must be prepared to defend their answer. Of course invented by Sheldon and Amy.
--> '''Amy''': In a world where rhinoceroses are domesticated pets, who wins the Second World War
--> '''Sheldon''': Uganda.
--> '''Amy''': Defend.
--> '''Sheldon''': Kenya rises to power on the export of rhinoceroses. A Central African power bloc is formed, colonizing North Africa and Europe. When war breaks out, no on ecan afford the luxury of a rhino. Kenya Withers, Uganda triumphs.
--> '''Amy''': Correct. My turn.




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* Turned into the game "Counterfactuals" in an episode of ''Series/TheBigBangTheory''. A single thing in history is changed, and the players are expected to answer a question about the future/history based on that. They must be prepared to defend their answer. Of course invented by Sheldon and Amy.
--> '''Amy''': In a world where rhinoceroses are domesticated pets, who wins the Second World War
--> '''Sheldon''': Uganda.
--> '''Amy''': Defend.
--> '''Sheldon''': Kenya rises to power on the export of rhinoceroses. A Central African power bloc is formed, colonizing North Africa and Europe. When war breaks out, no on ecan afford the luxury of a rhino. Kenya Withers, Uganda triumphs.
--> '''Amy''': Correct. My turn.
21st Jun '16 4:53:37 AM KevinBWilson
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Added DiffLines:

* Jared's ''DecadesOfDarkness'' hyper-detailed AH, which diverges due to Thomas Jefferson dying of a heart attack in 1808. New England secedes and the US becomes an expansionist slaveocracy. Most of the world adopts the "PoD, events follow" approach, although there is a steered approach to the U.S. in this timeline("Draka, done right"). Arguably some Type II elements such as the appearance of historical figures like Edmund Schulthess being born as they were IOTL, some decades after the 1809 PoD.
6th Jun '16 12:32:47 PM Morgenthaler
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* Another obligatory Creator/HarryTurtledove example: the ''{{Worldwar}}'' series. Lizards from Outer Space invade during World War 2 and the Axis and Allies must set aside their differences to save Earth from alien conquest! Interestingly quite Hard AH after that, at least in the first books (Type I or II), but like many Turtledove works starts to Soften as the series advances to the point of being Type III to IV by the last books.

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* Another obligatory Creator/HarryTurtledove example: the ''{{Worldwar}}'' ''Literature/{{Worldwar}}'' series. Lizards from Outer Space invade during World War 2 and the Axis and Allies must set aside their differences to save Earth from alien conquest! Interestingly quite Hard AH after that, at least in the first books (Type I or II), but like many Turtledove works starts to Soften as the series advances to the point of being Type III to IV by the last books.



* S.M. Stirling's ''IslandInTheSeaOfTime'' series, wherein the contemporary island of Nantucket is [[MassTeleportation time-ported]] back to the Bronze Age. Somewhat Soft after the [=PoD=] (Type II) as like most of Stirling's work it follows RuleOfCool.

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* S.M. Stirling's ''IslandInTheSeaOfTime'' ''Literature/IslandInTheSeaOfTime'' series, wherein the contemporary island of Nantucket is [[MassTeleportation time-ported]] back to the Bronze Age. Somewhat Soft after the [=PoD=] (Type II) as like most of Stirling's work it follows RuleOfCool.



* The ''Strangerverse'' on Website/AlternateHistoryDotCom is a loosely-tied saga, whose common tie being a time traveler returning to some point (and figure) in the past. To stop his crapsack-apocalyptic future from happening, the Stranger leaves behind tools to aid his "chosen." This generally results in epic nation-wanks. The stories themselves become Type II or III after the "event," depending on the author. Notables include ''TheBritwankEmpire'' and ''[[Literature/UnitedStatesOfAmeriwank The United States of Ameriwank]]''.
* ''{{Temeraire}}'' is the Napoleonic Wars... [[AC:with dragons]]! Otherwise a Type II: The society is still reminiscent of the equivalent time period and technologies are much the same, though there are some significant political deviations. (The Incas were never conquered because they ''also'' had dragons, for instance).

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* The ''Strangerverse'' on Website/AlternateHistoryDotCom is a loosely-tied saga, whose common tie being a time traveler returning to some point (and figure) in the past. To stop his crapsack-apocalyptic future from happening, the Stranger leaves behind tools to aid his "chosen." This generally results in epic nation-wanks. The stories themselves become Type II or III after the "event," depending on the author. Notables include ''TheBritwankEmpire'' ''Literature/TheBritwankEmpire'' and ''[[Literature/UnitedStatesOfAmeriwank The United States of Ameriwank]]''.
* ''{{Temeraire}}'' ''Literature/{{Temeraire}}'' is the Napoleonic Wars... [[AC:with dragons]]! Otherwise a Type II: The society is still reminiscent of the equivalent time period and technologies are much the same, though there are some significant political deviations. (The Incas were never conquered because they ''also'' had dragons, for instance).
31st May '16 5:05:29 AM ChronoLegion
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* While Fyodor Berezin's ''Red Stars'' duology involves travel between parallel worlds, a huge part of it is devoted to the divergence of the other world from ours, so those sections can rightly be called AlternateHistory. The author uses the common belief that Stalin had always planned to betray Hitler, but that Hitler simply beat him to the punch (i.e. both sides were ready to attack but were unprepared to defend). Thanks to British interference during Nazi Germany's invasion of Southern Europe, he delays Operation Barbarossa (the invasion of the Soviet Union) by a month, giving Stalin plenty of time to enact his own invasion plan. The USSR invades Germany in 1941. Germany holds out for almost two years but is ultimately beaten. The Red Army proceeds to take Italy and "liberate" France, stopping just short of crossing the English Channel. Realizing their new rival is the US, the Soviets make sure (through sabotage and covert aid to Japan) that America is tied up with the Pacific War. The Domino Theory then ensures that all of Europe, Asia, Africa, and, eventually, Australia go communist, leading to a Not So Cold War between USSR and US, with the former being the dominant power. Democracy doesn't exist anymore, as the constant red threat forces the US to institute martial law. While this may seem like a MarySuetopia, the author makes it abundantly clear that the other is a CrapsackWorld where the two superpowers no longer hold back on nuclear weapons and constantly engage in massive battles in the oceans. The ending, however, is highly controversial: [[spoiler:the American and Russian presidents in our world launch 500 [=ICBMs=] each at each other, then use the dimensional device to send the missiles to the other side to start a NuclearWar]].

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* While Fyodor Berezin's ''Red Stars'' duology involves travel between parallel worlds, a huge part of it is devoted to the divergence of the other world from ours, so those sections can rightly be called AlternateHistory. The author uses the common belief that Stalin had always planned to betray Hitler, but that Hitler simply beat him to the punch (i.e. both sides were ready to attack but were unprepared to defend). Thanks to British interference during Nazi Germany's invasion of Southern Europe, he delays Operation Barbarossa (the invasion of the Soviet Union) by a month, giving Stalin plenty of time to enact his own invasion plan. The USSR invades Germany in 1941. Germany holds out for almost two years but is ultimately beaten. The Red Army proceeds to take Italy and "liberate" France, stopping just short of crossing the English Channel. Realizing their new rival is the US, the Soviets make sure (through sabotage and covert aid to Japan) that America is tied up with the Pacific War. The Domino Theory then ensures that all of Europe, Asia, Africa, and, eventually, Australia go communist, leading to a Not So Cold War between USSR and US, with the former being the dominant power. Democracy doesn't exist anymore, as the constant red threat forces the US to institute martial law. While this may seem like a MarySuetopia, the author makes it abundantly clear that the other is a CrapsackWorld where the two superpowers no longer hold back on nuclear weapons and constantly engage in massive battles in the oceans. The ending, however, is highly controversial: [[spoiler:the American and Russian presidents in our world launch 500 [=ICBMs=] each at each other, then use the dimensional device to send the missiles to the other side to start a NuclearWar]]. The follow-up short story reveals that [[spoiler:the plan has backfired. The other world is not a smoking nuclear wasteland and is now aware of our world]].
30th May '16 7:56:16 PM Doug86
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* '''Type IV - Utterly Implausible AH:''' These are works that are so Soft that they melt. Works that are so implausible as to be effectively impossible and so Soft as to prove impossible to take as serious speculation. Works where research was so poor or ill-considered, [[AuthorFilibuster author politics so prevalent]], Butterflies so ignored, details (logistics, politics, etc.) so overlooked, often purposefully, that there's no way anyone with even a passing familiarity with the history can take it seriously. Infamously implausible scenarios like Operation Sealion [[note]]UsefulNotes/NaziGermany's plan to invade Britain during WorldWarII, which has been shown by the members of AlternateHistoryDotCom (where it's become a MemeticMutation because of this) to be one of the worst military plans ever conceived -- it would have been a catastrophic defeat for Germany that would have effectively destroyed the Wehrmacht and allowed the Allies to win up to a year earlier.[[/note]] are often placed here, as are utterly implausible technology jumps, such as Aztecs developing breech loading rifles in 1420. Over-the-top ludicrous {{Alternate History Wank}}s are usually put here. One good "rule of thumb" is if a [=PoD=] necessary to make the outcome plausibly happen is so far in the past that Butterflies would negate the very events that created the setting (such as a [=PoD=] to give Hitler the fleet he needed to invade the UK would need to be before WWI, probably negating the rise of Nazism), then it may be a Type IV. ''Note:'' These works are often defined as AlienSpaceBats and in fact the original term "AlienSpaceBats" was coined to refer to these type of implausible works!

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* '''Type IV - Utterly Implausible AH:''' These are works that are so Soft that they melt. Works that are so implausible as to be effectively impossible and so Soft as to prove impossible to take as serious speculation. Works where research was so poor or ill-considered, [[AuthorFilibuster author politics so prevalent]], Butterflies so ignored, details (logistics, politics, etc.) so overlooked, often purposefully, that there's no way anyone with even a passing familiarity with the history can take it seriously. Infamously implausible scenarios like Operation Sealion [[note]]UsefulNotes/NaziGermany's plan to invade Britain during WorldWarII, which has been shown by the members of AlternateHistoryDotCom Website/AlternateHistoryDotCom (where it's become a MemeticMutation because of this) to be one of the worst military plans ever conceived -- it would have been a catastrophic defeat for Germany that would have effectively destroyed the Wehrmacht and allowed the Allies to win up to a year earlier.[[/note]] are often placed here, as are utterly implausible technology jumps, such as Aztecs developing breech loading rifles in 1420. Over-the-top ludicrous {{Alternate History Wank}}s are usually put here. One good "rule of thumb" is if a [=PoD=] necessary to make the outcome plausibly happen is so far in the past that Butterflies would negate the very events that created the setting (such as a [=PoD=] to give Hitler the fleet he needed to invade the UK would need to be before WWI, probably negating the rise of Nazism), then it may be a Type IV. ''Note:'' These works are often defined as AlienSpaceBats and in fact the original term "AlienSpaceBats" was coined to refer to these type of implausible works!



* The ''Strangerverse'' on AlternateHistoryDotCom is a loosely-tied saga, whose common tie being a time traveler returning to some point (and figure) in the past. To stop his crapsack-apocalyptic future from happening, the Stranger leaves behind tools to aid his "chosen." This generally results in epic nation-wanks. The stories themselves become Type II or III after the "event," depending on the author. Notables include ''TheBritwankEmpire'' and ''[[Literature/UnitedStatesOfAmeriwank The United States of Ameriwank]]''.

to:

* The ''Strangerverse'' on AlternateHistoryDotCom Website/AlternateHistoryDotCom is a loosely-tied saga, whose common tie being a time traveler returning to some point (and figure) in the past. To stop his crapsack-apocalyptic future from happening, the Stranger leaves behind tools to aid his "chosen." This generally results in epic nation-wanks. The stories themselves become Type II or III after the "event," depending on the author. Notables include ''TheBritwankEmpire'' and ''[[Literature/UnitedStatesOfAmeriwank The United States of Ameriwank]]''.
14th May '16 3:24:04 PM TheOneWhoTropes
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* The latter books of Harry Turtledove's ''{{Timeline-191}}'', where InSpiteOfANail sets in, historical characters multiply (Churchill, Patton, etc.) and the historical parallelism may strain some readers' suspension of disbelief.

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* The latter books of Harry Turtledove's ''{{Timeline-191}}'', ''Literature/Timeline191'', where InSpiteOfANail sets in, historical characters multiply (Churchill, Patton, etc.) and the historical parallelism may strain some readers' suspension of disbelief.
14th May '16 3:13:33 PM TheOneWhoTropes
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* ''The Great War'' trilogy from Turtledove's ''{{Timeline-191}}'' series (the sequel to ''How Few Remain''). We see some Hard aspects (political Butterflies, Expys of post-[=PoD=] famous people rather than straight appearances) and some Soft elements (European politics and history totally unaffected by the huge divergence in North American events).

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* ''The Great War'' trilogy from Turtledove's ''{{Timeline-191}}'' ''Literature/Timeline191'' series (the sequel to ''How Few Remain''). We see some Hard aspects (political Butterflies, Expys of post-[=PoD=] famous people rather than straight appearances) and some Soft elements (European politics and history totally unaffected by the huge divergence in North American events).
14th May '16 3:08:03 PM TheOneWhoTropes
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* ''Literature/HowFewRemain'': The first book in [[Creator/HarryTurtledove Turtledove's]] ''{{Timeline-191}}'' series explores a vividly realistic 19th century following a southern victory in the American Civil War.

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* ''Literature/HowFewRemain'': The first book in [[Creator/HarryTurtledove Turtledove's]] ''{{Timeline-191}}'' ''Literature/Timeline191'' series explores a vividly realistic 19th century following a southern victory in the American Civil War.
6th Apr '16 11:25:12 AM tromag
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* The entire Literature/1632 series is touched off by AlienSpaceBats transporting a West Virginia mining town in the year 2000 to central Germany in the 17th century. After the PoD, though, the entire series becomes rock-hard Type I, with a very realistic analysis of the effects of future technology and culture on this era, backed up with obsessive research into both the historical background of the time, and the resources such a town would be likely to have.

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* The entire Literature/1632 Literature/SixteenThirtyTwo series is touched off by AlienSpaceBats transporting a West Virginia mining town in the year 2000 to central Germany in the 17th century. After the PoD, though, there's no other intervention and the entire series becomes rock-hard Type I, with a very realistic analysis of the effects of future technology and culture on this era, backed up with obsessive research into both the historical background of the time, and the resources such a town would be likely to have.
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