History Main / SignalToNoiseTrainWreck

22nd Jan '16 1:57:34 PM Josef5678
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This is an extreme solution for pages where nothing else will work: Split the tropes/examples into categories. This has the disadvantage of breaking alphabetical order, making editing less straightforward and causing potential argument about which example goes in which category- which is why some tropers would have it that it's ''never'' an appropriate solution. Still, if a page remains a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck after all the measures above have been taken and it seems to you that a split to categories would be a major improvement, this may be the way to go.\\
to:
This is an extreme solution for pages where nothing else will work: Split the tropes/examples into categories. This has the disadvantage of breaking alphabetical order, making editing less straightforward and causing potential argument about which example goes in which category- which is why some tropers would have it that it's ''never'' an appropriate solution. Still, if a page remains a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck Signal-to-Noise Train Wreck after all the measures above have been taken and it seems to you that a split to categories would be a major improvement, this may be the way to go.\\

The discussion page and the [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/conversations.php?topic=renames Trope Repair Shop forum]] are good ways to work out a consensus of what is needed, but remember [[RepairDontRespond that this is a wiki, not a debate forum]]. In all cases, aim for the fewest well-defined categories that will still get the job done, and make the categories suit the needs of the page.
to:
The discussion page and the [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/conversations.php?topic=renames Trope Repair Shop forum]] are good ways to work out a consensus of what is needed, but remember [[RepairDontRespond [[Administrivia/RepairDontRespond that this is a wiki, not a debate forum]]. In all cases, aim for the fewest well-defined categories that will still get the job done, and make the categories suit the needs of the page.
17th Jan '16 4:57:43 PM mephistos
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You have to wade through a lot of stuff to get to the interesting and the important parts. It's a Signal-To-Noise Train Wreck.
17th Jan '16 4:31:01 PM mephistos
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A lot of work went into writing it. Unfortunately, a lot of work also goes into reading it.
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A lot of work went into writing it. Unfortunately, a lot of work also goes into reading it. it. When what should be the clear "signal" of a page is distorted by the "noise" of excessive detail, you get a Signal-to-Noise Train Wreck.
14th Jan '16 12:04:43 PM Berrenta
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You have to wade through a lot of stuff to get to the interesting and the important parts. It's a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck.
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You have to wade through a lot of stuff to get to the interesting and the important parts. It's a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck.Signal-To-Noise Train Wreck.
29th Oct '15 3:13:00 PM Azurengar
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fixed a minor typo ("sup-pages" to "sub-pages")
Creating sup-pages may be in order if this doesn't solve the problem. For example, a spin-off Video Game may have large number of tropes that don't apply to other games in that series, so giving it its own sub-page might dramatically reduce clutter. This is a more drastic measure, however, and should be always be discussed first.
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Creating sup-pages sub-pages may be in order if this doesn't solve the problem. For example, a spin-off Video Game may have large number of tropes that don't apply to other games in that series, so giving it its own sub-page might dramatically reduce clutter. This is a more drastic measure, however, and should be always be discussed first.
31st Mar '15 7:45:09 AM SeptimusHeap
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See discussion
* '''Trim the list, keeping just the most important examples'''\\ Rather than allowing every single hot-off-the-newest-issue remark, stick to the most clear cut and important examples. This is a DangerousForbiddenTechnique. Be aware that removing valid examples- even "minor" ones- is [[FandomBerserkButton highly contentious]] and is not likely to go over well. People are bound to end up edit warring over which are the "important" ones, or even just adding examples back in good faith without knowing about what you're trying to do.
27th Oct '14 8:10:27 AM SeptimusHeap
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See discussion
* '''Ditch specifics''' in favor of a brief "the show really pulls this one off a lot" analysis. This approach is more drastic, but is less likely to be met with outrage or edit warred over if it's done well. Discuss how often, in what way and in what circumstances the trope tends to be invoked in the work. If you're feeling brave, illuminate your point with specific instances. Often, someone takes this as a cue that we've [[GottaCatchThemAll Gotta Catch 'Em All]], starting the problem all over again.
11th Aug '14 8:21:25 AM Scorpion451
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* '''Choose clarity over wittyness and excessive detail.''' It doesn't matter how funny the joke is or how cool the ExampleAsThesis is, and that the Infodump covers a huge amount of information. If it makes the article hard unclear or turns it into a ten screen long WallOfText, get out the hedge trimmers.
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* '''Choose clarity over wittyness and excessive detail.''' It doesn't matter how funny the joke is or how cool the ExampleAsThesis is, and or that the Infodump {{Infodump}} covers a huge amount of honestly interesting information. If it makes the article hard unclear or turns it into a ten screen long WallOfText, get out the hedge trimmers.
11th Aug '14 8:19:22 AM Scorpion451
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You have to wade through a lot of stuff to get to the interesting and the important parts. It's a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck. !!The measures that could be taken, from least to most drastic, are: !!!Be a merciless editor
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You have to wade through a lot of stuff to get to the interesting and the important parts. It's a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck. !!The SignalToNoiseTrainWreck. If you've got a few hours to burn, and the motivation to do so, you can fix it. !The measures that could be taken, from least to most drastic, are: !!!Be !!Be a merciless editor

!!!Use the namespaces:
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!!!Use !!Use the namespaces:

!!!GodzillaThreshold Measures * '''Split the tropes/examples into categories (AKA: a "soft split").''' This is an extreme solution for pages where nothing else will work. This has the disadvantage of breaking alphabetical order, making editing less straightforward and causing potential argument about which example goes in which category- which is why some tropers would have it that it's ''never'' an appropriate solution. Some tropers prefer to split alphabetically (e.g. Tropes A-M, Tropes N-Z) to maintain alphabetical order, but this sometimes feels like pagination for the sake of pagination and doesn't really do anything to decrease clutter; it just spreads it out across more database entries. * '''A "hard split"''' may be in order if this doesn't solve the problem, . For example, a spin-off Video Game may have too many tropes that don't apply to other games in that series, so it might need to have its own page or at least its own section so its tropes aren't mixed in with the rest of the series. This should be discussed first, however. * '''Spin off new trope and work pages.''' At the point that a hard split is enacted, it might be a sign that more than one article's content is trying to occupy a single page. ** If the page is a Trope, and many examples are a specific variant of that trope, create a YKTTW for what is clearly a {{Subtrope}}. If there are many only tangentially related examples, its a sure sign of MissingSupertropeSyndrome. Most OverdosedTropes are supertropes, and spread their tens of thousands of examples among their many subtropes. ** If its a manga, an anime, a live action series, a novel, and has an OddlyNamedSequel2ElectricBoogaloo, make a hub in the {{Franchise}} namespace and give all the noteworthy ones their own pages. Nobody said they all have to be covered on one page. * '''Trim the list, keeping just the most important examples''' rather than allowing every single hot-off-the-newest-issue remark. This is a DangerousForbiddenTechnique. Be aware that removing valid examples- even "minor" ones- is [[FandomBerserkButton highly contentious]] and is not likely to go over well. People are bound to end up edit warring over which are the "important" ones, or even just adding examples back in good faith without knowing about what you're trying to do. Still, if a page remains a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck after all the measures above have been taken and it seems to you that a split to categories would be a major improvement, this may be the way to go. You could consider splitting either by events in the work's history (books, seasons, story arcs. major retools) or by the type of trope. The categories listed in the sidebar might be a useful starting point, but no more than that. Just make sure to bring it up in both the discussion page and the [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/conversations.php?topic=renames Trope Repair Shop forum]] to work out a consensus, and aim for as few and as well-defined categories as you can that will still get the job done.
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!!!GodzillaThreshold !!GodzillaThreshold Measures * '''Split the tropes/examples into categories (AKA: a "soft split").''' *'''A Soft Split'''\\ This is an extreme solution for pages where nothing else will work.work: Split the tropes/examples into categories. This has the disadvantage of breaking alphabetical order, making editing less straightforward and causing potential argument about which example goes in which category- which is why some tropers would have it that it's ''never'' an appropriate solution. Still, if a page remains a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck after all the measures above have been taken and it seems to you that a split to categories would be a major improvement, this may be the way to go.\\ \\ Some tropers prefer to split alphabetically (e.g. Tropes A-M, Tropes N-Z) to maintain alphabetical order, but while this sometimes feels like pagination for the sake of pagination makes editing and finding specific tropes easier, it doesn't really do anything address the actual issue (only making the page hard to decrease clutter; it just spreads it out across read in a different way), and making people have to think and work a little when adding an example can help ''reduce'' impulsive edits in the future. A split to categories like "Tropes in the video game", "Tropes in the Manga", and "Tropes found in all versions of the work" is often more database entries. * '''A reader friendly, because they group related sets of examples rather than scattering them. You could also consider splitting either by events in the work's history (books, seasons, story arcs. major retools), or by the type of trope/example ("played straight", "inverted", and "subverted" for instance). The categories listed in the sidebar might be a useful starting point, but no more than that.\\ \\ The discussion page and the [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/conversations.php?topic=renames Trope Repair Shop forum]] are good ways to work out a consensus of what is needed, but remember [[RepairDontRespond that this is a wiki, not a debate forum]]. In all cases, aim for the fewest well-defined categories that will still get the job done, and make the categories suit the needs of the page. *'''A "hard split"''' split"'''\\ Creating sup-pages may be in order if this doesn't solve the problem, . problem. For example, a spin-off Video Game may have too many large number of tropes that don't apply to other games in that series, so giving it might need to have its own page or at least its own section so its tropes aren't mixed in with the rest of the series. sub-page might dramatically reduce clutter. This is a more drastic measure, however, and should be always be discussed first, however. * '''Spin first. *'''Spin off new trope and work pages.''' '''\\ At the point that a hard split is enacted, it might be a sign that more than one article's content is trying to occupy a single page. ** If **If the page is a Trope, and many examples are a specific variant of that trope, create a YKTTW for what is clearly a {{Subtrope}}. If there are many only tangentially related examples, its a sure sign of MissingSupertropeSyndrome. Most OverdosedTropes are supertropes, and spread their tens of thousands of examples among their many subtropes. ** If **If its more-or-less continous [[TheVerse Verse]] covering a manga, an anime, a live action series, multiple {{Spin Off}}s, a novel, series of novels, and has an OddlyNamedSequel2ElectricBoogaloo, make a hub in the {{Franchise}} namespace and give replant all the noteworthy ones in their own pages. Nobody said they all have everything has to be covered on one page. * '''Trim page. *'''Trim the list, keeping just the most important examples''' rather examples'''\\ Rather than allowing every single hot-off-the-newest-issue remark.remark, stick to the most clear cut and important examples. This is a DangerousForbiddenTechnique. Be aware that removing valid examples- even "minor" ones- is [[FandomBerserkButton highly contentious]] and is not likely to go over well. People are bound to end up edit warring over which are the "important" ones, or even just adding examples back in good faith without knowing about what you're trying to do. \n\nStill, if a page remains a SignalToNoiseTrainWreck after all the measures above have been taken and it seems to you that a split to categories would be a major improvement, this may be the way to go. You could consider splitting either by events in the work's history (books, seasons, story arcs. major retools) or by the type of trope. The categories listed in the sidebar might be a useful starting point, but no more than that.\n\nJust make sure to bring it up in both the discussion page and the [[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/conversations.php?topic=renames Trope Repair Shop forum]] to work out a consensus, and aim for as few and as well-defined categories as you can that will still get the job done.
11th Aug '14 7:13:20 AM Scorpion451
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* '''Spin off new articles'''
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* '''Spin off new articles''' trope and work pages.''' At the point that a hard split is enacted, it might be a sign that more than one article's content is trying to occupy a single page.
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