History Main / PragmaticVillainy

21st Sep '16 6:00:59 PM KEEP_IN
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* In ''VisualNovel/{{Danganronpa}}'', [[spoiler: [[AxCrazy Genocide Syo the Ultimate Killing Fiend]]]] decides that if the point of the murder game is to not get caught, [[spoiler: and Syo can't stand ''not'' leaving evidence at the crime scene,]] then it would be easiest to just not kill anybody.

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* In ''VisualNovel/{{Danganronpa}}'', ''VisualNovel/{{DanganRonpa}}'', [[spoiler: [[AxCrazy Genocide Syo Genocider Shou the Ultimate Killing Fiend]]]] Super High School-Level Serial Killer]]]] decides that if the point of the murder game is to not get caught, [[spoiler: and Syo Shou can't stand ''not'' using her signature modus operandi (and thus leaving obvious evidence at the crime scene,]] scene),]] then it would be easiest to just not kill anybody.
21st Sep '16 6:09:26 AM Hanz
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** After the Imperial Agent meets up with [[TheSpymaster Keeper]] in the prologue, he evaluates your actions on Hutta: he'll chastise a particularly Light-sided Agent on [[SillyRabbitIdealismIsForKids being too soft]] while also doing the same for a Dark-sided Agent for relying too much on violence.
20th Sep '16 1:57:48 PM intastiel
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* In the ''Literature/FightingFantasy'' books, the SorcerousOverlord Zharradan Marr invests most of his time and his armies of darkness operating a... mining company on the frontier so he has a secure base to pursue his magical studies. He hires competent minions, obtains his coveted {{MacGuffin}}s through guile rather than force, and prepares a tactical airstrike against a HiddenElfVillage with valuable secrets rather than waste resources invading the forests en masse.
19th Sep '16 5:24:33 PM TrollBrutal
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** When his son, Tyrion, is kidnapped, Tywin Lannister immediately raises his army and starts a war. He doesn't care about Tyrion ([[TheUnfavorate at all]]), but he considers the kidnapping of his son as both a personal insult ''and'' a direct challenge to his power-base that he won't take lying down[[note]]though considering his immediate family history, he probably considers them one and the same[[/note]]. He's arguably not at all wrong to have done so: the North revolted not long afterwards, not ''just'' as a response to his crackdown.



** Tywin's view is encapsulated in Season 3 with a quote regarding [[spoiler:the fact that he essentially signed off on the Red Wedding by promising the conspirators protection for their violating [[SacredHospitality guest right]]]]:
-->'''Tywin''': Explain to me why it is more noble to kill 10,000 men in battle [[spoiler: than a dozen at dinner.]][[note]]Off course discounting the fact that said 10000 were slaughtered too.[[/note]]
*** In general, one of the bigger problems in Tywin Lannister's career in the series is having to be a Pragmatic Villain who however-nominally answers to a StupidEvil [[spoiler:grandson]] king.
19th Sep '16 4:52:22 PM Euodiachloris
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** When his son Tyrion is kidnapped, Tywin Lannister immediately raises his army and starts a war. He doesn't care about Tyrion, but he considers the kidnapping of his son a personal insult ''and'' a direct challenge to his power-base that he won't take lying down[[note]]though considering his immediate family history, he probably considers them one and the same[[/note]]. He's arguably not at all wrong to have done so: the North revolted not long after, not ''just'' as a response to his crackdown.
** Roose Bolton is also extremely pragmatic, with his preference for "a quiet land and a quiet people". This leads to some annoyance with his son Ramsey's open and increasingly inconvenient sadism. He gets a Crowning Moment Of Pragmatic Villainy after his son expresses a desire to flay a noblewoman who doesn't like him and make her skin into footwear. She's actually a useful political ally with a decent levy-army, so...

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** When his son Tyrion son, Tyrion, is kidnapped, Tywin Lannister immediately raises his army and starts a war. He doesn't care about Tyrion, Tyrion ([[TheUnfavorate at all]]), but he considers the kidnapping of his son as both a personal insult ''and'' a direct challenge to his power-base that he won't take lying down[[note]]though considering his immediate family history, he probably considers them one and the same[[/note]]. He's arguably not at all wrong to have done so: the North revolted not long after, afterwards, not ''just'' as a response to his crackdown.
** Roose Bolton is also extremely pragmatic, with his preference for "a quiet land and a quiet people". This leads to some annoyance with his son Ramsey's open and increasingly inconvenient sadism. He gets a Crowning Moment Of Pragmatic Villainy after his son expresses a desire to flay a noblewoman related(ish) noblewoman, who quite openly doesn't like him him, and make her skin into footwear. She's actually a useful usefully sharp political ally ally, a consistent Stark-hater ''and'' has a decently manned, equipped and trained levy-army with a decent levy-army, sound cavalry wing, so...



** [[RoyalBrat Viserys Targaryen]] shows off some of his lovely StupidEvil moves when he chooses to insult a whole hall stuffed full of [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy "barbarians"]] [[AlcoholInducedIdiocy while drunk]]. Unsurprisingly, this doesn't end well. That's just one of his more impressive moments, though: he had plenty, far [[EvilIsPetty less impressive]] examples than that one in the tank. Why is this here? Because his sister, Daenerys Targaryen, resolves from then on that, should she ''have'' to be nasty to regain the throne, she'll try to be neither as Stupid nor as unnecessarily Evil (when Good is not an option) with it. She's making her own mistakes, sure: but, she's been careful to ''not'' directly duplicate her brother's. She's somewhere between being a learner PragmaticHero and Villain with a spotty record, as a result. Depending on who you ask.

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** [[RoyalBrat Viserys Targaryen]] shows off some of his lovely StupidEvil moves when he chooses to insult a whole hall stuffed full of [[ProudWarriorRaceGuy "barbarians"]] [[AlcoholInducedIdiocy while drunk]]. Unsurprisingly, this doesn't end well. That's just one of his more impressive moments, though: he had plenty, far [[EvilIsPetty less impressive]] examples than that one in the tank. Why is this here? Because his sister, Daenerys Targaryen, resolves from then on that, should she ''have'' to be nasty to regain the throne, she'll try to be neither as Stupid nor as unnecessarily Evil (when Good is not an option) with it. She's making her own mistakes, sure: but, she's been careful to ''not'' directly duplicate her brother's. She's somewhere between being a learner PragmaticHero and Villain with a horribly spotty record, record thanks to having few decent examples to copy, as a result. Depending on who you ask.
19th Sep '16 4:36:50 PM Euodiachloris
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* ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire'': This work constantly reminds us that Stupid (either StupidEvil or StupidGood) has a price, so makes the Pragmatic stuff that much [[EvilIsCool shinier]] by comparison (even if cold pragmatism also tends to come at a less acute, [[ZeroPercentApprovalRating predictable price]] further down the line).

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* ''Literature/ASongOfIceAndFire'': This work constantly reminds us that Stupid (either StupidEvil or StupidGood) has a steep price, so makes the Pragmatic stuff that much [[EvilIsCool shinier]] by comparison (even if cold pragmatism also tends to come at a somewhat less immediately acute, [[ZeroPercentApprovalRating predictable price]] if more predictable]], price further down the line).line -- that can prove a small nightmare to juggle).
18th Sep '16 5:33:58 PM Eddy1215
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** After Roland fails a mission, Duke Ganelon [[YouHaveFailedMe has him framed for treason and executed]]. When Duke Thenardier finds out, he angrily calls Ganelon an idiot, since Roland was very powerful soldier, and was much more useful alive.

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** After Roland fails a mission, Duke Ganelon [[YouHaveFailedMe has him framed for treason and executed]]. When Duke Thenardier finds out, he angrily calls Ganelon [[YouFool an idiot, idiot]], since Roland was a very powerful soldier, and was much more useful alive.
18th Sep '16 5:20:16 PM ultimomant
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* ''LightNovel/LordMarksmanAndVanadis'':
** While leading a raid on the Alsace territory, Zion orders his men not to attack anyone who has taken shelter in the temple, saying such an act would cause everyone in the kingdom to turn against them.
** After Roland fails a mission, Duke Ganelon [[YouHaveFailedMe has him framed for treason and executed]]. When Duke Thenardier finds out, he angrily calls Ganelon an idiot, since Roland was very powerful soldier, and was much more useful alive.
12th Sep '16 2:40:47 PM TheSinful
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** He latter helps a former enemy land a job, not because he wants to help the man, but because he's said enemy's landlord. He wants the man to earn enough money to pay his rent.
10th Sep '16 10:49:07 PM AtaulfVII
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** It's also a bad move because killing a beloved friar could cause a peasant riot.

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** It's also a bad move because killing a beloved friar could cause a peasant riot.rebellion.
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